Broncos 2015 Defense- Best Ever?

[Ziggy]

The Broncos 2015 defense looks to be the best in franchise history. I mean no disrespect to the Orange Crush. I loved watching those guys lead a beleaguered doormat of a franchise to respectability. They set the standard for all of Denver's future defenses and thus far none have come close to living up to it. Enter the 2015 defense. Here's a breakdown of the current squad.

Defensive Line
The starting lineup looks to be NT Sly Williams, DE Derrick Wolfe, and DE Malik Jackson. These 3 have been asked to do nothing in the last 2 seasons outside of holding the gap on both sides of their position, and let the linebackers react. In Wade's defense, they'll be shooting their assigned one gap and heading upfield on the snap. For pocket QB's, their worst nightmare is pressure up the middle. These 3 now will be turned loose on every play. Depth comes in the form the impressive rookie NT Darius Kilgo, DE Kenny Aninuke, DE Antonio Smith, and DE Vance Walker. That's a nice mix of talented youth and veteran experience.

ILBers
Brandon Marshall and Danny Trevathan bring speed, coverage ability, and tackling prowess to the middle of the defense. These two are critical to the success of the base defense. Both can cover the middle of the field on passing downs, and that's what will make the base defense special. Very few teams can excel against both the run and the pass on first and second down. These two give the Broncos the unique ability to do that. Wade Phillips has stated that this team boasts more depth at the middle linebacker position than he has ever had before. That depth comes in the form of Todd Davis, Steven Johnson, and Corey Nelson. All 3 can step in and play both the run and the pass efficiently.

OLBers
The Broncos boast the best set of OLBers in the NFL. Demarcus Ware is a future hall of famer who started the season with 10 sacks over the first 12 games last year. He wore down as the season went on, and was largely ineffective in the stretch run. Enter rookie Shane Ray. There's a reason that Wade has him backing up Ware on the right side. He can get to the passer, and looks to be the heir apparent to DeMarcus. In the meantime, he can contribute right away on passing downs and bring the Broncos an elite 3rd outside pass rusher. Von looks like a keg of dynamite waiting to explode. His injuries are healed, his maturity looks to have finally developed, and is conditioning and diet is better than it has ever been. He has the best first step in the NFL and is grossly underrated against the run. If he stays healthy, look for Von to challenge the NFL sack record. More depth comes in the form of Shaq Barrett. He's healthy and it looks like he had the doctors strap an ACME jet pack to his butt during his offseason rehab. He's been the most impressive defensive sub in the preseason. If he continues his growth, the Broncos may end up with 4 star pass rushers on the outside.

Cornerbacks
The Broncos will return 3 pro bowlers in the 4 secondary spots. At corner, Chris Harris has gone from undrafted free agent to one of the top cover corners in the NFL. He can play the outside or the slot position at a pro bowl level. Aquib Talib brings the physicality that few other corners can. Wade will allow him to play the game the way he did in New England when he became elite. Don't expect to see him playing 10 yards off of the ball much if at all this season. He's an in your face, physical corner who makes WR's work for every yard. Bradley Roby may be the best third corner in the NFL. His speed and instincts would land him as the #1 corner on more than a few NFL teams. The Broncos 3 starting corners bring elite coverage ability in both man and zone alignments. Kayvon Webster provides a physical, talented dime cover man. He can play in both man and zone alignments as well. The next two games of the preseason will determine who the fifth corner is.

Safeties
TJ Ward made the pro bowl despite being used out of position over and over last season. He shared time playing linebacker in some nickel and dime sets, and was used continually as a cover corner. Wade will allow him to play more of a pure strong safety role this season. Look for the big hits to return. He'll get back to doing what he does best. Darian Stewart brings veteran savvy and solid tackling to the free safety position. He's a smart, steady player and a solid tackler. David Bruton proved that he could be counted on last season to fill in for injury. He did it so well that the Broncos went to 3 safety sets more and more often as the season wore on. He can play either safety spot and brings solid depth. The rest of the safety depth will be sorted out over the next two preseason games.

Wade Phillips
Wade may be the biggest addition to this team in the offseason. He brings the attack mentality that many of us have been looking for over the past few decades. Every defensive coordinator talks about being aggressive. Wade actually does it. He brings an attack mentality to a team full of talent. He has proven over and over that he can get the most out of the talent he has. Add that in to the fact that he now has more talent than he has ever had. Wade will put these guys in positions that maximize their talent. Von is not going to be spending half of his time in pass coverage. He's going to be destroying QB's. If your not excited about this defense, you might want to check your pulse to see if you still have one.

This defense will not only be elite, it will be the best in franchise history.

[BroncoWave]

Certainly could be on paper. You never know with injuries though. They definitely have the talent, though.

[SR]

And don't forget Wolfe is out for the first four games.

[chazoe60]

Awesome write-up. My favorite part about it was that I didn't see the name Rahim Moore anywhere in it.

[SR]

Awesome write-up. My favorite part about it was that I didn't see the name Rahim Moore anywhere in it.

Moore looked very good for Houston on Saturday.

[chazoe60]

And don't forget Wolfe is out for the first four games.

Malik Jackson will step up just fine in that spot I believe.

[chazoe60]

Moore looked very good for Houston on Saturday.

Once in four years, good for him.

[SR]

Once in four years, good for him.

Malik and Wolfe would be the starting DEs. Who's going to be the starting DE for the first four games while Wolfe is out? Nike if he's healthy?

I'm not terribly concerned regardless...just making conversation.

[chazoe60]

Malik and Wolfe would be the starting DEs. Who's going to be the starting DE for the first four games while Wolfe is out? Nike if he's healthy?

I'm not terribly concerned regardless...just making conversation.
I was thinking Kenny Anunike and my fingers typed Malik Jackson.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Antoine Smith likely start on Wolfe's place.

[Northman]

To early to say. One thing that made the 85' Bears, 00' Ravens, and 02' Bucs stand out was their ability to take care of the ball too on offense. The Broncos defense has the talent to do some special things but if the offense doesnt take care of the ball than that just puts more pressure on the defense than necessary. The other thing is those teams were able to finish the season as champions so we have a long way to go before we know where this team stands in greatness.

[G_Money]

I feel like we're still thin up front. The Marvin Austi ninjury hurts, but Kilgo is playing GREAT for a rookie nose tackle. If the front can hold together, especially once Wolfe gets back, then we're basically loaded. I don't think Del Rio took full advantage of his talent on that side of the ball last year, and I think Wade will do better.

I don't know that we'll be the best D in the league. It's hard to put up stats when you're rolling people on the scoreboard - guys tend to let up a little, it's just human nature. But I'm expecting us to come in around #5 or so, and best in team history is an achievable goal. How we're rated statistically doesn't really matter to me, because I want to put a hurting on people in the playoffs and it looks like we're putting together the sort of defense that can do that.

If so, then please bring me Indy, oh please...

Let's hope we finally see the defense we've been thinking we'll see for the last couple years. I want to crumple some teams up like old newspaper and then use them for kindling.

[TXBRONC]

Antoine Smith likely start on Wolfe's place.

Smith might but I think there is just as good of a chance that if Kenny Aninuke is healthy I think he'll start.

[VonDoom]

Thanks, Ziggy. Now you jinxed us ;)

[Shazam!]

Statements like this has been said before, then the wheels fell off...

Teams will adjust and the more film they have to cut up. Things will be different in the reg season.

[Dzone]

Big Al said this years Broncos might have the best pass rushing defense in the history of football. Yep, Big Al is the best broadcaster in the history of TV

[tomjonesrocks]

Awesome write-up. My favorite part about it was that I didn't see the name Rahim Moore anywhere in it.

Lol...awesome. Agreed. Way to work that in.

[G_Money]

Statements like this has been said before, then the wheels fell off...

Teams will adjust and the more film they have to cut up. Things will be different in the reg season.

Wade doesn't run a very complicated scheme. This isn't like when the Niners exposed the weaknesses of the 46 defense. Do simple things, execute them better than the man across from you is executing, and disrupt the timing of the offense. Simple.

When you have a buncha Pro-Bowlers and future HOFers to do that, you don't need complicated. We'll see what we do in the regular season, obviously, but the Seahawks don't run a complicated scheme either. They just have big, fast athletes who are allowed to make plays.

That can definitely work.

[Jsteve01]

Ziggy, I completely agree with this post. You combine a very fine backfield with the deepest stable of pass rushers we've ever seen along with some interesting one gap potential from Wolfe, Williams and Jackson and I would say that barring injury, your projections are very realistic. This is definitely the most athletic defense we've ever fielded.

[broncofaninfla]

I'm as excited about this defense as I've ever been and I go back to the Orange Crush days. This group has the depth to last the season and boasts multiple pro bowl caliber players. Add Phillips to the mix and I think this group has a chance to do something special.

[Ziggy]

Statements like this has been said before, then the wheels fell off...

Teams will adjust and the more film they have to cut up. Things will be different in the reg season.

Yes, before Wade was the defensive coordinator and the Broncos had this much talent. We'll see during the regular season. You can expect the worst all you want. My gut tells me that this defense is special.

[TXBRONC]

Yes, before Wade was the defensive coordinator and the Broncos had this much talent. We'll see during the regular season. You can expect the worst all you want. My gut tells me that this defense is special.

If the defense can stay reasonably healthy then absolutely this defense can be special.

[Shazam!]

I'm not being negative Nancy. Just people have brought beyond sky high expectations. This unit will be good, but there's a whole lot more than 2 preseason games, then there's injuries.

[Denver Native (Carol)]

Work vs. SF gives Phillips, defense different look
Defensive coordinator Wade Phillips talks to the press after Thursday's practice.

http://www.denverbroncos.com/multimedia/videos/Work-vs-SF-gives-Phillips-defense-different-look/5a68a00e-933c-4b66-a049-a56144d72567

[TXBRONC]

I'm not being negative Nancy. Just people have brought beyond sky high expectations. This unit will be good, but there's a whole lot more than 2 preseason games, then there's injuries.

I think everyone understands that injuries could hamper the defense but barring that this defense is going to be pretty good.

[Ziggy]

I'm not being negative Nancy. Just people have brought beyond sky high expectations. This unit will be good, but there's a whole lot more than 2 preseason games, then there's injuries.

I'm not basing this on 2 preseason games. I'm basing this on the talent level of this defense, Wade's track record, and a new mentality at Dove Valley. Every coordinator that has come through has talked about being aggressive. Wade's is the only one who has actually done it over the course of his career. Outside of the Seahawks, name the defense that can match the talent on the Broncos defensive roster.

[Shazam!]

I'm not being negative Nancy. Just people have brought beyond sky high expectations. This unit will be good, but there's a whole lot more than 2 preseason games, then there's injuries.

I think everyone understands that injuries could hamper the defense but barring that this defense is going to be pretty good.

Pretty good, I can take and understand. Best Broncos defense ever?? Cmon. Even the best Broncos offense ever didn't yield a Championship.

Forget stats. Until this team wins a Super Bowl with a different unit, best Broncos offense was 1998. Best Broncos Defense was 1997 due to key stops that were made IMO.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Pretty good, I can take and understand. Best Broncos defense ever?? Cmon. Even the best Broncos offense ever didn't yield a Championship.

Forget stats. Until this team wins a Super Bowl with a different unit, best Broncos offense was 1998. Best Broncos Defense was 1997 due to key stops that were made IMO.

The best defense was late 70's.

I agree about the offense in 97 and 98. That was far and away the best offense Denver has ever had, and probably one if the 5 best in NFL history.

[Shazam!]

Pretty good, I can take and understand. Best Broncos defense ever?? Cmon. Even the best Broncos offense ever didn't yield a Championship.

Forget stats. Until this team wins a Super Bowl with a different unit, best Broncos offense was 1998. Best Broncos Defense was 1997 due to key stops that were made IMO.

The best defense was late 70's.

I agree about the offense in 97 and 98. That was far and away the best offense Denver has ever had, and probably one if the 5 best in NFL history.

They cannot be the 'best' because they weren't. Best equates to championships. Stats or not.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

They cannot be the 'best' because they weren't. Best equates to championships. Stats or not.

Well, you can use the barometer that suits you best, but the Broncos lost the 78 SB because their offense couldn't do squat in that game. That team rode the D that year.

[Shazam!]

They cannot be the 'best' because they weren't. Best equates to championships. Stats or not.

Well, you can use the barometer that suits you best, but the Broncos lost the 78 SB because their offense couldn't do squat in that game. That team rode the D that year.

Absolutely agree. But, it comes down to championships to be at the top. 1997.

[TXBRONC]

Pretty good, I can take and understand. Best Broncos defense ever?? Cmon. Even the best Broncos offense ever didn't yield a Championship.

Forget stats. Until this team wins a Super Bowl with a different unit, best Broncos offense was 1998. Best Broncos Defense was 1997 due to key stops that were made IMO.

Statistically two of greatess to ever hit the field did win a champion.

[MOtorboat]

Have all 11 starters even been on the field together yet?

A little early to start saying things like this.

[Shazam!]

Have all 11 starters even been on the field together yet?

A little early to start saying things like this.

We actually agree on something?

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Absolutely agree. But, it comes down to championships to be at the top. 1997.

I'm more inclined go give credit to possibly the most balanced offense in the history of the NFL.

[Shazam!]

Absolutely agree. But, it comes down to championships to be at the top. 1997.

I'm more inclined go give credit to possibly the most balanced offense in the history of the NFL.

Best OLine in years and an attacking defense that caused opponents to make many mistakes.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Best OLine in years and an attacking defense that caused opponents to make many mistakes.

That D definitely had some good players and the scheme led to a lot of turnovers, but realistically they only had 3 players that would start on this D.

[Shazam!]

Best OLine in years and an attacking defense that caused opponents to make many mistakes.

That D definitely had some good players and the scheme led to a lot of turnovers, but realistically they only had 3 players that would start on this D.

Other than in DLine I doubt that. Had some great players spattered all over. Romo, Smith, Traylor, Mobley and Atwater could've def played.

[iLands]

Ziggy and all - What do you think about DE depth? Wolfe will be out four games. Our backups, Nike and Smith, have been continually banged up.

If I see a hole, that's where I see one. I suppose it's a luxury to be discussing DE depth, but that's the most glaring weakness I see.

We're stacked at OLB.

We're stacked at CB.

We have injury prone, but stellar ILB starters with very good depth.

Safety seems good, but I'll really need to see Stew more with the 1s. Omar, Bruton, and even Roby are serviceable depth, but I really wouldn't want Ward to miss significant time. I think he's the glue of that unit - for the moment anyway.

Our starting DE unit seems good. I'm exceedingly high on Malik. I think he'll be a star after this year that we won't be able to afford. I'm concerned about Wolfe missing the time he will be - especially with an injury history as bizarre as his. The depth has been pretty dinged up in the past with this unit.

I feel like we're average at best at the NT position. We need Sly to take that next step - I really hope he does. I do like Kilgo for the future and in rotation for the present.

Just my take.

[TXBRONC]

Williams and Kilgo both had very good camps. I'm not sure they just average but only time will tell for sure.

[Ziggy]

Ziggy and all - What do you think about DE depth? Wolfe will be out four games. Our backups, Nike and Smith, have been continually banged up.

If I see a hole, that's where I see one. I suppose it's a luxury to be discussing DE depth, but that's the most glaring weakness I see.

We're stacked at OLB.

We're stacked at CB.

We have injury prone, but stellar ILB starters with very good depth.

Safety seems good, but I'll really need to see Stew more with the 1s. Omar, Bruton, and even Roby are serviceable depth, but I really wouldn't want Ward to miss significant time. I think he's the glue of that unit - for the moment anyway.

Our starting DE unit seems good. I'm exceedingly high on Malik. I think he'll be a star after this year that we won't be able to afford. I'm concerned about Wolfe missing the time he will be - especially with an injury history as bizarre as his. The depth has been pretty dinged up in the past with this unit.

I feel like we're average at best at the NT position. We need Sly to take that next step - I really hope he does. I do like Kilgo for the future and in rotation for the present.

Just my take.

Wolfe and Malik are solid starters. Malik might have a breakout season. Kenny Anninuke is going to make some noise if he can get healthy. Antonio Smith and Vance Walker are solid NFL vets. Nothing flashy, but serviceable backups.

[Ziggy]

Have all 11 starters even been on the field together yet?

A little early to start saying things like this.

Hey Mo. This is an internet forum board. Talking about things that may or may not happen is what goes on here. Part of the talk is about what is actually happening, but look around. Speculation, opinions, and predictions are what we do. It's never too early to start talking about greatness.

[MOtorboat]

Hey Mo. This is an internet forum board. Talking about things that may or may not happen is what goes on here. Part of the talk is about what is actually happening, but look around. Speculation, opinions, and predictions are what we do. It's never too early to start talking about greatness.

Hey Ziggy, it's a message board. Look around. Part of the talk is about what's actually happening. Speculation, opinions and predictions are what we do.

Since the 11 greatest players assembled haven't played a down together in a game, even if it's preseason, it's my opinion that it's a little early to call them such.

Works both ways dude. Just my opinion, you know, what the message board is for.

[Ziggy]

It's not too late to jump on this train before it leaves the station folks. Mo, swallow your pride and jump on board little man.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

It's not too late to jump on this train before it leaves the station folks. Mo, swallow your pride and jump on board little man.

I love it man....we physically dominated a team that has always physically dominated us.

We might have the nastiest D inthe AFC.

[MOtorboat]

It's not too late to jump on this train before it leaves the station folks. Mo, swallow your pride and jump on board little man.

Week 1, and you want me to declare this defense better than the 2000 Ravens and the 1985 Bears?

[Shazam!]

It's not too late to jump on this train before it leaves the station folks. Mo, swallow your pride and jump on board little man.

Week 1, and you want me to declare this defense better than the 2000 Ravens and the 1985 Bears?

...not even the 2002 Bucs.

[Ziggy]

Week 1, and you want me to declare this defense better than the 2000 Ravens and the 1985 Bears?

Read the original post. Best defense in Broncos history.

[MOtorboat]

Read the original post. Best defense in Broncos history.

I still won't do it in Week 1. It's just a little early.

[Ziggy]

I still won't do it in Week 1. It's just a little early.

OK buddy. You're forgiven. I still love ya.

[The Glue Factory]

OK buddy. You're forgiven. I still love ya.

Spike his beer with some Bronco Kool-Aid.

[CrazyHorse]

On paper and on the field it looks like the best defensive unit this team has ever had since I've been a fan.

[Shazam!]

Guess this thread is scrapped. They can get to the QB and cause turnovers but I think they've been exposed.

[Dapper Dan]

This Defense has given up 2 TDs and scored 2 TDs.

[wayninja]

More turnovers than pepperidge farm.

[CrazyHorse]

This D takes lots of risks which can result in big plays but will got lets of sacks and turnovers which have a higher correlation to winning.

[Ravage!!!]

Guess this thread is scrapped. They can get to the QB and cause turnovers but I think they've been exposed.

exposed? You mean if the defense gives up ANY points, its exposed? I th ought the other NFL teams were hired to do their jobs, too. Aren't they professionals on the the offensive side of the ball? Isn't Charles the highest ypc rusher in NFL history?

[silkamilkamonico]

Guess this thread is scrapped. They can get to the QB and cause turnovers but I think they've been exposed.

Lol you have got to be kidding

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Guess this thread is scrapped. They can get to the QB and cause turnovers but I think they've been exposed.

Have you been eating paint chips?

[wayninja]

Heath Evans on Total Access questioning the Denver defense because of 5ypc against the chiefs.

Really dude? Really? The thing you want to highlight is the 5ypc? Not the 5 turnovers? Not the COMPLETE SHUTOUT on 3rd down conversions? Not the game capping fumble recovery?

Wow. 2 weeks, and 2 near TOTAL defensive performances and this guy wants to hem and haw? Wow.

[MOtorboat]

He also defends the Patriots cheating, so well, you know...he's a ******* idiot.

[Dapper Dan]

We play at Detroit and every fantasy team I have seems to have Stafford and/or Johnson.

[Shazam!]

I'm thrilled with the defenses performance and the attack mentality that has been missing since Greg Robinson was the DC. The D Vs rush is a concern, allowing lots of yards yesterday.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Heath Evans on Total Access questioning the Denver defense because of 5ypc against the chiefs.

Really dude? Really? The thing you want to highlight is the 5ypc? Not the 5 turnovers? Not the COMPLETE SHUTOUT on 3rd down conversions? Not the game capping fumble recovery?

Wow. 2 weeks, and 2 near TOTAL defensive performances and this guy wants to hem and haw? Wow.

He is a huge Patriots homer. His takes usually annoy me.

[TXBRONC]

Guess this thread is scrapped. They can get to the QB and cause turnovers but I think they've been exposed.

Exposed? I don't think so.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Exposed? I don't think so.

Exposed for the ass-kickers they are.

[GEM]

He is a huge Patriots homer. His takes usually annoy me.

Run defense is a bit suspect, but they have enough other stuff to make up for it.

[G_Money]

Run defense is a bit suspect, but they have enough other stuff to make up for it.

I don't even know how suspect it is, not once Wolfe is back. Yes, they were gashing us in the ground game, but the long rushing touchdown was a containment issue, and most of the other good runs were because we were coming up-field so quickly. The kind of pressure we were putting on Alex Smith comes at a price. Most of it looked to me to be a trade-off issue, not necessarily a deficiency. When we got caught in a blitz and they handed the ball off we got hurt, but one of Wade's philosophies is to put pressure at the weak points of an offense. Alex Smith is the weak point, and trading some ground yards to make him uncomfortable (4 sacks, 2 picks, no TDs) was okay with him apparently.

And with me too. If people want to get into the red zone and then smash themselves against the cliffs of the defense, fine. In the meantime we'll be making your QB wish he was somewhere else. Like a Siberian gulag, maybe. The defense has given up 2 touchdowns in 2 games, one of them on a busted play, while getting 7 turnovers and winning both games.

I think it's philosophy, not deficiency. :cool: When we face the Vikings I expect to see a lot of run blitzing. We'll see how many yards Peterson can eke out.

~G

[Ravage!!!]

I'm thrilled with the defenses performance and the attack mentality that has been missing since Greg Robinson was the DC. The D Vs rush is a concern, allowing lots of yards yesterday.

That litttle runner on the other side of the field, that suits up for the Chiefs... has this "habit" of averaging 5 yrd per carry against everyehone he plays against. It's why he has the highest apc of any RB to ever play in the NFL. He averages 5ypc, against everyone. It's what he does, its who he is, he's one of the top RBs in the NFL because of that. I don't think they were "exposed" at all. All teams will gain yards with their best player....whether thats a WR, TE, or RB. It's why that player is the best player.

[Ziggy]

Through the first 3 games the Broncos defense is giving up 11.7 points/game. Since we have to add the 14 points that Manning has given the other teams, the official number is 16.3. This D is nasty, aggressive, fast, and intimidating. Is anyone not having fun watching it so far?

[TXBRONC]

Through the first 3 games the Broncos defense is giving up 11.7 points/game. Since we have to add the 14 points that Manning has given the other teams, the official number is 16.3. This D is nasty, aggressive, fast, and intimidating. Is anyone not having fun watching it so far?

I'm not a Ray Lewis fan but once told the rest of defensive unit "Lets play fast, loose, and pissed off." I think that's fitting.

[CrazyHorse]

Through the first 3 games the Broncos defense is giving up 11.7 points/game. Since we have to add the 14 points that Manning has given the other teams, the official number is 16.3. This D is nasty, aggressive, fast, and intimidating. Is anyone not having fun watching it so far?

Number 1 in yards per game and turnover differential.

[Ziggy]

Number 1 in yards per game and turnover differential.

.....and passing yards allowed per game, and defensive TD's, and opponents 3rd down %.

[TXBRONC]

.....and passing yards allowed per game, and defensive TD's, and opponents 3rd down %.

If the offense can get it's act together Denver then there are only two or three games where the opponent could possibly be favored to beat the Broncos.

[Northman]

Through the first 3 games the Broncos defense is giving up 11.7 points/game. Since we have to add the 14 points that Manning has given the other teams, the official number is 16.3. This D is nasty, aggressive, fast, and intimidating. Is anyone not having fun watching it so far?

Dont know about you, but that is WAY better than giving up 25-30 pts a game. Ill take it. :lol:

[NightTerror218]

Glad to see beginning of season has no juggernaut offenses.

[wayninja]

Glad to see beginning of season has no juggernaut offenses.

Say what? As much as I'm loath to admit it, the Patriots have set a team record for most points in the first 3 games.

The Packers are no slouches either, averaging 32 points per game.

I'd say both of those teams are offensive juggernauts.

[VonDoom]

Say what? As much as I'm loath to admit it, the Patriots have set a team record for most points in the first 3 games.

The Packers are no slouches either, averaging 32 points per game.

I'd say both of those teams are offensive juggernauts.

He might have meant "we haven't played any juggernaut offenses" but I'm not sure. I did a double take the same way you did at first.

[VonDoom]

Pro Football Focus ‏@PFF 15m15 minutes ago

Teams targeting #Broncos CB Bradley Roby have a passer rating of 16.7 so far this year. That's pretty good coverage.

[Ravage!!!]

Say what? As much as I'm loath to admit it, the Patriots have set a team record for most points in the first 3 games.

The Packers are no slouches either, averaging 32 points per game.

I'd say both of those teams are offensive juggernauts.

Yeah.. I think he's suggesting that our defense is nothing more than a fasad.

[Slick]

Yeah.. I think he's suggesting that our defense is nothing more than a fasad.

Facade.

[MOtorboat]

Say what? As much as I'm loath to admit it, the Patriots have set a team record for most points in the first 3 games.

The Packers are no slouches either, averaging 32 points per game.

I'd say both of those teams are offensive juggernauts.

Points, schmoints!

[Cugel]

Say what? As much as I'm loath to admit it, the Patriots have set a team record for most points in the first 3 games.

The Packers are no slouches either, averaging 32 points per game.

I'd say both of those teams are offensive juggernauts.

Yes, well the Patriots have been juggernauts before, right?

In 2007 they went into the Super Bowl at 18-0, after scoring 589 points, and Tom Brady threw for 50 TDs and 8 Ints with a QBR of 117. This was the 2nd best offense of all time next to the Broncos 2013 offense that scored 608 points.

Of course they lost 16-13 to the 10-6 Giants.

In fact their two super bowl losers in the 2007 and 2011 seasons in total won 44 games and lost 2, while the Giant teams that beat them won 25 and lost 13 games.

If the Seahawks weren't proof enough that great defense wins championships consider that those Giants teams barely won their division. The Ravens and Packers were both #6 seed wild cards that won 10 games those seasons.

Think that the Packers just won because of Aaron Rogers? Their scoring defense in 2010 was #2 in the NFL, and the 2nd best all time Packers defense.

Three of the last 5 SB champions were 10-6 or 9-7. And of course, last year, the Seahawks really won that game - except for Pete Carroll's monumental brain fart at the end of the game to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. So, defense really won again, as it did in 2013 over the greatest offensive juggernaut of all time in "the game that shall not be mentioned."

Of course, it's early yet, but the Broncos defense has surrendered 6, 17 and 12 points in three games = 35 total points, or a total average of 11.66 points per game. If they could do that over the course of an entire season they would give up 186 points, which would equal the 1985 Bears!

Of course, they are playing teams like the Packers and Patriots so that average is going to go up, possibly quite a bit up. But, right now they are on pace to have one of the top 5 scoring defenses of the last 30 years, alongside such all-time greats as the '85-'86 Bears, the 2000 Ravens, the 2002 Bucs and the 2013 Seahawks.

If this offense is even mediocre at rushing the ball by January and they can win 11 games and get into the playoffs - LOOK OUT in the playoffs. Because the Broncos are going to be one team nobody wants to play.

[SR]

https://twitter.com/PFF/status/649255126054531072?s=01

[BroncoJoe]

https://twitter.com/PFF/status/649255126054531072?s=01

I love Von, but not thrilled about that "celebration".

[Slick]

I love Von, but not thrilled about that "celebration".

He looks like a dumbass. Not his best effort.

[SR]

I thought it was great.

[weazel]

Best defense ever?? WTF?

I will reserve judgement until we play more than 3 games against opponents with a combined record of 1-8. LMFAO

[wayninja]

I love Von, but not thrilled about that "celebration".

can't...stop...watching...

[BroncoJoe]

can't...stop...watching...

Homo.

[TXBRONC]

Best defense ever?? WTF?

I will reserve judgement until we play more than 3 games against opponents with a combined record of 1-8. LMFAO

Fwiw Ziggy was asking the question "Is this best defense in Denver's history?"

[BroncoJoe]

Best defense ever?? WTF?

I will reserve judgement until we play more than 3 games against opponents with a combined record of 1-8. LMFAO

This has already been discussed, but your 1-8 comment is beyond idiotic after 3 games.

[wayninja]

Homo.

It's cool. I'm totally gay for the broncos.

http://tucsonbroncos.com/von.gif

You know you can't stop watching.

[Valar Morghulis]

He looks like a dumbass. Not his best effort.

I love celebrations like that, there should be more taunting and outrageous goading!

[SR]

It's cool. I'm totally gay for the broncos. You know you can't stop watching.

Can you PM me the link to that GIF?

[Ziggy]

Best defense ever?? WTF?

I will reserve judgement until we play more than 3 games against opponents with a combined record of 1-8. LMFAO

Reading is fundamental.

[weazel]

This has already been discussed, but your 1-8 comment is beyond idiotic after 3 games.

yeah... like saying this is the best defense ever... after 3 games.

[BroncoJoe]

yeah... like saying this is the best defense ever... after 3 games.


Broncos 2015 Defense- Best Ever?

Please note the ? at the end of the sentence. It's not a statement.

[weazel]

its a leading title...

[SR]

its a leading title...

Maybe even misleading.

[weazel]

Reading is fundamental.

I admit, I didn't read the post. I just thought the title was a very premature statement and was making a joke. I looked at the post and apologize to ziggy for being a smartass, but I still think it's a funny title.

[wayninja]

Works on commission. No money down.

Works on commission? No, money down!

[weazel]

Works on commission. No money down.

Works on commission? No, money down!

yes I understand grammar... I understand there was a question mark. I just think its funny to ask if a defense is the best ever after watching them play 3 games against 3 of the worst teams in the league, impossible to answer.

[wayninja]

Since this is a thread on a forum, I'm betting this is meant to be discussed over the course of the season rather than instantaneously on the spot right now. If they keep up this level of play, there's no doubt at all that this will be the best defense the Broncos have ever fielded. Pretty big if though.

[Ziggy]

I admit, I didn't read the post. I just thought the title was a very premature statement and was making a joke. I looked at the post and apologize to ziggy for being a smartass, but I still think it's a funny title.

No worries. If you look closer you'll see that I started this thread before the season ever started. It wasn't a joke, just a gut feeling.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

At least he's not twerking

[Ziggy]

Hey Mo, you coming around yet?

[MOtorboat]

Not yet.

[Ziggy]

Not yet.

OK, let me know when the medication wears off.

[MOtorboat]

OK, let me know when the medication wears off.

My confidence is not that the defense can't be the best in team history. It's that the offense isn't good enough to give them a chance to do it.

[Yashahla17]

This defense could be the best ever if the offense coukd atleast score and give them nice breaks to rest. Being on the field 3 and out repeatedly isn't sustainable imo.

[weazel]

This defense could be the best ever if the offense coukd atleast score and give them nice breaks to rest. Being on the field 3 and out repeatedly isn't sustainable imo.

garrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr rrr!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[VonDoom]

Let's bring this thread back, shall we?


The Broncos defense it turns out is much, much better than I gave it credit for, and I was already giving it credit for being the best in the league by some margin.

Now we need to start thinking of it in all-time great terms.

Think that’s premature? The 2013 Seahawks defense was one of the best the league has ever seen. It was an all-time great defense that absolutely suffocated offenses, leading them to a Super Bowl and ultimately destroying Manning’s Broncos to win the ring.

Manning was at the helm of an all-time great offense that year and managed to score eight points in the Super Bowl against that Seahawks team, failing to get on the board until the game was 36-0.

That Seattle defense in 2013 allowed an average of 4.4 yards per play, and 273.6 yards per game over the regular season. This year’s Denver defense is allowing just 4.1 yards per play and 261.1 yards per game.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2015/11/02/broncos-defense-has-a-chance-to-be-one-of-best-ever/

[Hawgdriver]

They nullified the most statistically efficient and productive qb in nfl history at his peak. It speaks for itself.

[Ziggy]

My confidence is not that the defense can't be the best in team history. It's that the offense isn't good enough to give them a chance to do it.

This defense is great enough that it doesn't matter what the offense does. That's what defines a great defense. When you set your pride aside, you know deep down that this D is far better than the Orange Crush ever was.

[Yashahla17]

This defense is great enough that it doesn't matter what the offense does. That's what defines a great defense. When you set your pride aside, you know deep down that this D is far better than the Orange Crush ever was.

Not really. A defense cant be on the field 98% of the game and sustain it for the entire season. The only reason we were able to shut down Rodgers is because the offense and run game actually showed up. If we had been the same ole 3&out offense Rodgers would have figured it out.

[Bronco4ever]

Not really. A defense cant be on the field 98% of the game and sustain it for the entire season. The only reason we were able to shut down Rodgers is because the offense and run game actually showed up. If we had been the same ole 3&out offense Rodgers would have figured it out.

This is a ridiculous response. 98% of the game? Our offense is averaging 31:21 TOP per game this season, 11th best in the league. And Rodgers had no pocket and no where to throw all game. I think the only thing Rodgers figured out was that he wasn't going to do jack all game.

[MOtorboat]

This defense is great enough that it doesn't matter what the offense does. That's what defines a great defense. When you set your pride aside, you know deep down that this D is far better than the Orange Crush ever was.

The team that went to the Super Bowl in 89 finished 1st in points and 3rd in yards in the league. This defense is damn good, we'll see if they're that good. Halfway through the season, the answer is yes. But there's eight games to play.

So, no, again, I'm not going to call them the best defense ever until they are.

[BroncoJoe]

The team that went to the Super Bowl in 89 finished 1st in points and 3rd in yards in the league. This defense is damn good, we'll see if they're that good. Halfway through the season, the answer is yes. But there's eight games to play.

So, no, again, I'm not going to call them the best defense ever until they are.

9 games to play.

[MOtorboat]

9 games to play.

Math isn't my strong suit.

[Ziggy]

9 games to play.

12 games to play. ;)

[BroncoJoe]

Math isn't my strong suit.

Solicit Joel's help. He can crunch numbers like no one else!

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

The team that went to the Super Bowl in 89 finished 1st in points and 3rd in yards in the league. This defense is damn good, we'll see if they're that good. Halfway through the season, the answer is yes. But there's eight games to play.

So, no, again, I'm not going to call them the best defense ever until they are.

That defense was a lot of smoke and mirrors. The talent on this defense is much better and more balanced.

[MOtorboat]

That defense was a lot of smoke and mirrors. The talent on this defense is much better and more balanced.

My childhood memory doesn't remember scheme, but you finish first and third, respectively, in the NFL over 16 games it's not usually smoke and mirrors.

[tripp]

Barring any injuries, it's going to be tough to put up numbers against us. Defense also has to STAY hungry, have to keep that desire to be the best. Wade Phillips should get all the credit in the world.

[Yashahla17]

Wade phillips is top 3 defensive coordinators ever. And i doubt we have to worry about him bailing out because at this point the entire league knows he's not a good HC. Hopefully he sticks around another 3-4 years.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

My childhood memory doesn't remember scheme, but you finish first and third, respectively, in the NFL over 16 games it's not usually smoke and mirrors.

I remember it well. The front 4 was undersized and the secondary was Slow..

[MOtorboat]

I remember it well. The front 4 was undersized and the secondary was Slow..

The fronts in those defenses were always small. It was a Wade Phillips defense in the 80s, more on attacking than today's traditional behemoth 3-4s.

And don't disparage Dennis Smith and Steve Atwater like that. I don't care if they were slower than other secondaries, they were the best in the game.

[7DnBrnc53]

That defense was a lot of smoke and mirrors. The talent on this defense is much better and more balanced.

I agree with you. The 89 defense isn't as good as this defense. Heck, it wasn't as good as the 91 and 92 defenses either (those were deeper and more talented. They went up to Buffalo in 91 and basically shut the K-Gun down).

[Cugel]

Greatest Defenses of All Time? You can't really compare teams from different eras because of all the rule changes to favor the offense, but greatest defenses in the SB Era:

Team___________Points Allowed__PPG___Record___Result
1. 1977 Falcons__ 129___________9.21___ 7-7____Missed Playoffs

That is pretty much all you have to say about teams from the 60's & 70's and early 80's. Gave up less than 10 points per game and won only 7 games. So, not listing those teams.

9. 2000 Ravens___165___________10.31__12-4___Won SB

Greatest team of the modern era.

12. 1977 Broncos__148__________10.57___12-2___Lost SB

15. 1986 Bears____187__________11.69___14-2___Lost div. playoff

16. 2000 Titans_____191_________11.94___13-3___Lost div. playoff

21. 2002 Bucs______196_________12.25___12-4___Won SB

After this they changed the rules again to favor the offense: can't hit the QB in the head or below thigh. Can't hit the defenseless receiver, can't hit the receiver in the head, enforce the 5 yards pass-interference rules more strictly, etc. The type of play John Lynch specialized in during that 2002 SB run, terrify the WR so he won't dare to run across the middle, you can't play any more. It would lead to a flag, a fine and a suspension in today's NFL. As a result, no team since 2002 has given up fewer than 200 points.

22. 1985 Bears_____198_________12.37___15-1___Won SB

Notice that the 2013 Seahawks didn't make this list.

___2013 Seahawks__231_________14.44___13-3___Won SB

Denver 2015 through 7 games*

___2015 Broncos____91__________13.00___7-0____????

* Unlike official statistics I am not counting 21 points off Peyton's 3 pick sixes, because the defense wasn't even on the field when those plays happened and cannot be blamed on the defense!

Officially, the Broncos are giving up 16 ppg. But only 13 of that is due to the defense.

If Peyton doesn't throw any more pick-sixes this season, the team will probably give up fewer points than the 2013 Seahawks, but more than the 1985-86 Bears, the 2002 Bucs, the 2006 Ravens (202 points) and maybe about the same as the 2011 Steelers who surrendered 227 points, but failed to get to the SB, (the Patriots won the AFC but lost to the Giants).

Can you win a SB with that? Yup.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

The fronts in those defenses were always small. It was a Wade Phillips defense in the 80s, more on attacking than today's traditional behemoth 3-4s.

And don't disparage Dennis Smith and Steve Atwater like that. I don't care if they were slower than other secondaries, they were the best in the game.

I was referring to the corners....

The SB results from those teams prove my point

[Joel]

Stumbled upon this (http://espn.go.com/fantasy/football/story/_/id/14046546/denver-broncos-d-st-historical-point-pace-fantasy-football) just now. Mostly fantasy stats, so I normally couldn't care less, but it compares our Ds apples to the best historical ones. Very favorably.

[Hawgdriver]

The fronts in those defenses were always small. It was a Wade Phillips defense in the 80s, more on attacking than today's traditional behemoth 3-4s.

And don't disparage Dennis Smith and Steve Atwater like that. I don't care if they were slower than other secondaries, they were the best in the game.

They said Jerry Rice was slow.

[TimHippo]

They said Jerry Rice was slow.

Jerry Rice used to outrun horse and ride them when he was a child.

[Northman]

I think that question was cleared up last night with a resounding no.

[Nomad]

1972 Miami Dolphins No-Name Defense. They never lost a game. ;) Yeah, we can throw all kinds of stats out there, but in the end, the W is the only thing that matters.

[Ziggy]

I think that question was cleared up last night with a resounding no.

Because of one bad week on the road in Indy? The great Seahawks defense of two years ago gave up 34 points to Luck in Indy. There are bad games no matter how good your defense is.

[Northman]

Because of one bad week on the road in Indy? The great Seahawks defense of two years ago gave up 34 points to Luck in Indy. There are bad games no matter how good your defense is.

I dont consider the Seahawks defense the greatest so i wasnt really measuring ours vs theirs.

[Ziggy]

I dont consider the Seahawks defense the greatest so i wasnt really measuring ours vs theirs.

Even with this bad game, I still say this Broncos D is the greatest in Broncos history. Opinions vary.

[BroncoJoe]

Even with this bad game, I still say this Broncos D is the greatest in Broncos history. Opinions vary.

I'll wait until the season is over before discounting the '77 Orange Crush.

[Ziggy]

I'll wait until the season is over before discounting the '77 Orange Crush.

The Orange Crush defense was in a different era. It's going to be hard to compare, but that's the whole point of this thread I guess. The rules have been changed to help offenses. Back in 77, if you could stop the run you could be a great D. Now, not so much. Defensive backs could straight up mug receivers all down the field back then. The highest scoring team in 77 was the Raiders. They scored 351 points on the season. Last year, half of the teams in the NFL scored more than that. Granted, there were 2 more games in the regular season, but you get the point.

Even with the old rules, the Orange Crush D was ranked 27th out of 28 teams against the pass. They couldn't compete in today's NFL. I believe the current D could compete in any era. The season is only half over. Let's see how the next 8 games go.

[TimHippo]

The Orange Crush defense was in a different era. It's going to be hard to compare, but that's the whole point of this thread I guess. The rules have been changed to help offenses. Back in 77, if you could stop the run you could be a great D. Now, not so much. Defensive backs could straight up mug receivers all down the field back then. The highest scoring team in 77 was the Raiders. They scored 351 points on the season. Last year, half of the teams in the NFL scored more than that. Granted, there were 2 more games in the regular season, but you get the point.

Even with the old rules, the Orange Crush D was ranked 27th out of 28 teams against the pass. They couldn't compete in today's NFL. I believe the current D could compete in any era. The season is only half over. Let's see how the next 8 games go.

No they couldn't. You can't use the different era/rules as a constant excuse to ignore legitimate statistics.

Also the modern player doesn't know how to hit or play physical like the old school guys like Steve Atwater, Ronnie Lot, Lester Hayes, Lawrence Taylor etc, etc. Now what you see are players with more finesse and speed because of the rules but if they were transported back in time they would not thrive because they aren't physical and don't know how to hit/wreck people.

[Ziggy]

The regular season is over and the numbers are in-

1st in overall defense.
1st in passing defense.
3rd in rushing defense.
4th in scoring defense.
1st in sacks.
T-1st in forced fumbles.
T-1st in pick 6's.

The Broncos D only allowed one 100 yard rusher all season.
The Broncos D only allowed one 300 yard passer all season.

The Broncos D had to defend the 29th worst starting field position this season.
The Broncos D allowed a league best 1.43 points per drive.
The Broncos had the 8th best DVOA ranking of all time.


Plagued with injuries, the Broncos defense only had 4 starters play every game this season. Not only was this defense the best in the NFL this season, they were one of the best of all time in the NFL statistically. My original post questioned whether or not this defense would be the best defense in Broncos history. While that will always be subjective, I say yes. It also gives this team a puncher's chance to win the Super Bowl.

It's been a great season to watch this defense. I can't wait for the playoffs to begin.

[Hawgdriver]

For whatever reason, no one will remember the '15 Broncos as an all-time defense, but this unit has been as exception as I've seen in years.

[Northman]

For whatever reason, no one will remember the '15 Broncos as an all-time defense, but this unit has been as exception as I've seen in years.

Agreed.

I can see Ziggy's point about it being the best defense Denver has had but when talking about the best in the NFL they still fall way short in my opinion to a team like the 2000 Ravens. I think one of my concerns going into the playoffs is whether or not the defense can generate more scoring opportunities and force more turnovers like they did earlier in the season. I have a feeling we are going to need that kind of play again if we want to win the SB this year.

[Dapper Dan]

I think they should be labeled as one of the top 10 defenses of all time. I guess it will depend on if they win the Super Bowl.

[Dapper Dan]

I looked back at the 02 Bucs defense and it's simply amazing what they did. Just in the playoffs alone.

Divisional Round versus San Francisco
228 total yards
2 fumble recoveries
4 sacks
2 interceptions
6 points

Conference Championship versus Philadelphia
312 total yards
2 fumble recoveries
2 sacks
1 interception (for a touchdown)
10 points

Super Bowl versus Oakland
269 total yards
5 sacks
5 interceptions (3 touchdowns)
19 rushing yards

So in those 3 playoffs games
809 yards
4 fumbles recovered
11 sacks
8 interceptions
Their defense made 24 points. That's 8 ppg. Just from your defense. That stuff blows my mind.

[Dapper Dan]

PATs were automatic in those days so you could say the defense had 9.3 ypg. That's nearly double digits.

And it's not just points, but also point swings. That pick 6 Ronde Barber had against Philly was over 90 yards.

I'm surprised some of those players aren't more involved in coaching. Derrick Brooks spoke to the Tennessee Volunteers before their bowl game and they won 45-6. Maybe he'll come speak to the Broncos :lol:

[Ravage!!!]

No they couldn't. You can't use the different era/rules as a constant excuse to ignore legitimate statistics.

Also the modern player doesn't know how to hit or play physical like the old school guys like Steve Atwater, Ronnie Lot, Lester Hayes, Lawrence Taylor etc, etc. Now what you see are players with more finesse and speed because of the rules but if they were transported back in time they would not thrive because they aren't physical and don't know how to hit/wreck people.

yeah.. that sounds good, but the players today are also a lot bigger today than they were back then. How many 240lb QBs were in the NFL back in the 70s? How many 300 lb lineman? How many 250 lb Line backers?

The rules and era's are absolutely relevant when talking about teams. QBs threw the ball around 15 times a game, then. Now, you can easily have that in 1/4 of a game...depending on the game. The players today know how to be physical... it's so physical that the NFL has had to make rules to try and keep them from getting soooo physical.

I would absolutely believe that this defense could compete in any era.

[TimHippo]

yeah.. that sounds good, but the players today are also a lot bigger today than they were back then. How many 240lb QBs were in the NFL back in the 70s? How many 300 lb lineman? How many 250 lb Line backers?

The rules and era's are absolutely relevant when talking about teams. QBs threw the ball around 15 times a game, then. Now, you can easily have that in 1/4 of a game...depending on the game. The players today know how to be physical... it's so physical that the NFL has had to make rules to try and keep them from getting soooo physical.

I would absolutely believe that this defense could compete in any era.

No they are playing two hand touch ballet thanks to the rules by the NFL. NFL just wants scoring. You can't hit high and once they ban hitting the legs it will basically be flag football.

[Ravage!!!]

No they are playing two hand touch ballet thanks to the rules by the NFL. NFL just wants scoring. You can't hit high and once they ban hitting the legs it will basically be flag football.

That doesn't mean the players aren't physical.

[aberdien]

Dunno about all-time, but the defense is big time. Hopefully a SB win will validate their greatness in NFL history. Hate to see this group of guys be forgotten.

[Dapper Dan]

I know players don't care much about awards and stuff, but I hope that All Pro voting lights a fire under their ass. ONE All Pro on the best Defense in the NFL!

[Canmore]

I know players don't care much about awards and stuff, but I hope that All Pro voting lights a fire under their ass. ONE All Pro on the best Defense in the NFL!

Isn't that a fact?

[Ravage!!!]

Yeah.. but what other player on the defense can we REALLY say is one of the top two at their position in the NFL?

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Yeah.. but what other player on the defense can we REALLY say is one of the top two at their position in the NFL?

I would say that Ware and Talib are definitely one of the four best at their position, and Wolfe and Jackson should also be considered in that discussion.

[Joel]

I'll just leave this right here; it's even got the same title (Ok, "Denver Broncos Defense 2015 Best Ever NFL (http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/14723383/denver-broncos-defense-2015-best-ever-nfl)" isn't PRECISELY the same as "Broncos 2015 Defense Best Ever" but it's close enough.) I maintain this (http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=14696345) is a big part of it: Peyton may be the Sheriff, but Ware became "DeMarshal" of our D in a remarkably short time. Hopefully his mentoring of Miller includes valuable tips like "I waited my whole career to become part of a SB contender: Don't blow your chance to REMAIN one."

[aberdien]

One more badass game away from maybe being the best ever.

[Joel]

One more badass game away from maybe being the best ever.
Lewis asked him about nicknames and he basically responded that winning championships earns nicknames: Until/unless you win a SB you're just "very good." As I believe was earlier noted in this thread, the ideal nickname would be "World Champion." Best of all, no one could dispute nor mock it.

[aberdien]

Best defense ever.

[MOtorboat]

I'll submit.

Ziggy. You called it.

[wayninja]

Yes. Ever. End thread.

[MileHighCrew]

Hell yes best ever!!!!

[VonDoom]

Alright, sign me up. I don't care what the numbers say. That was dominance like we've rarely seen in this league. How about this for just one random fact? I believe the three teams we played in the playoffs were 7-43 on 3rd down. Insane.

[Edmonton Bronco Fan]

Top 3 of all time. It's not even debatable.

Von's performances back to back in the AFC CG and SB, greatest two game stretch by a defensive player in history?

[Northman]

Um yea.

And how bout that Madden Sim i posted earlier in the week? Denver won that 27-10. :)

[VonDoom]

Top 3 of all time. It's not even debatable.

Von's performances back to back in the AFC CG and SB, greatest two game stretch by a defensive player in history?

Maybe it's recency bias or my great mood, but I can't think of anything. That's what he's here for and he earned every dollar he will get going forward.

[VonDoom]

Um yea.

And how bout that Madden Sim i posted earlier in the week? Denver won that 27-10. :)

A lot of turnovers in that game, if I remember correctly. Pretty accurate, "official" or not :D

[VonDoom]

Top 3 of all time. It's not even debatable.

Von's performances back to back in the AFC CG and SB, greatest two game stretch by a defensive player in history?

Okay, taking off my orange glasses, you've got the 85 Bears, 2000 Ravens ... who else? We're right there with anyone, as far as I'm concerned. If you don't win it all, you can't be considered, but a performance like we gave this postseason lifts them up to that top tier. Another random stat on our D - in three playoff games, we allowed three total touchdowns.

[Ziggy]

The Broncos 2015 defense looks to be the best in franchise history. I mean no disrespect to the Orange Crush. I loved watching those guys lead a beleaguered doormat of a franchise to respectability. They set the standard for all of Denver's future defenses and thus far none have come close to living up to it. Enter the 2015 defense. Here's a breakdown of the current squad.

Defensive Line
The starting lineup looks to be NT Sly Williams, DE Derrick Wolfe, and DE Malik Jackson. These 3 have been asked to do nothing in the last 2 seasons outside of holding the gap on both sides of their position, and let the linebackers react. In Wade's defense, they'll be shooting their assigned one gap and heading upfield on the snap. For pocket QB's, their worst nightmare is pressure up the middle. These 3 now will be turned loose on every play. Depth comes in the form the impressive rookie NT Darius Kilgo, DE Kenny Aninuke, DE Antonio Smith, and DE Vance Walker. That's a nice mix of talented youth and veteran experience.

ILBers
Brandon Marshall and Danny Trevathan bring speed, coverage ability, and tackling prowess to the middle of the defense. These two are critical to the success of the base defense. Both can cover the middle of the field on passing downs, and that's what will make the base defense special. Very few teams can excel against both the run and the pass on first and second down. These two give the Broncos the unique ability to do that. Wade Phillips has stated that this team boasts more depth at the middle linebacker position than he has ever had before. That depth comes in the form of Todd Davis, Steven Johnson, and Corey Nelson. All 3 can step in and play both the run and the pass efficiently.

OLBers
The Broncos boast the best set of OLBers in the NFL. Demarcus Ware is a future hall of famer who started the season with 10 sacks over the first 12 games last year. He wore down as the season went on, and was largely ineffective in the stretch run. Enter rookie Shane Ray. There's a reason that Wade has him backing up Ware on the right side. He can get to the passer, and looks to be the heir apparent to DeMarcus. In the meantime, he can contribute right away on passing downs and bring the Broncos an elite 3rd outside pass rusher. Von looks like a keg of dynamite waiting to explode. His injuries are healed, his maturity looks to have finally developed, and is conditioning and diet is better than it has ever been. He has the best first step in the NFL and is grossly underrated against the run. If he stays healthy, look for Von to challenge the NFL sack record. More depth comes in the form of Shaq Barrett. He's healthy and it looks like he had the doctors strap an ACME jet pack to his butt during his offseason rehab. He's been the most impressive defensive sub in the preseason. If he continues his growth, the Broncos may end up with 4 star pass rushers on the outside.

Cornerbacks
The Broncos will return 3 pro bowlers in the 4 secondary spots. At corner, Chris Harris has gone from undrafted free agent to one of the top cover corners in the NFL. He can play the outside or the slot position at a pro bowl level. Aquib Talib brings the physicality that few other corners can. Wade will allow him to play the game the way he did in New England when he became elite. Don't expect to see him playing 10 yards off of the ball much if at all this season. He's an in your face, physical corner who makes WR's work for every yard. Bradley Roby may be the best third corner in the NFL. His speed and instincts would land him as the #1 corner on more than a few NFL teams. The Broncos 3 starting corners bring elite coverage ability in both man and zone alignments. Kayvon Webster provides a physical, talented dime cover man. He can play in both man and zone alignments as well. The next two games of the preseason will determine who the fifth corner is.

Safeties
TJ Ward made the pro bowl despite being used out of position over and over last season. He shared time playing linebacker in some nickel and dime sets, and was used continually as a cover corner. Wade will allow him to play more of a pure strong safety role this season. Look for the big hits to return. He'll get back to doing what he does best. Darian Stewart brings veteran savvy and solid tackling to the free safety position. He's a smart, steady player and a solid tackler. David Bruton proved that he could be counted on last season to fill in for injury. He did it so well that the Broncos went to 3 safety sets more and more often as the season wore on. He can play either safety spot and brings solid depth. The rest of the safety depth will be sorted out over the next two preseason games.

Wade Phillips
Wade may be the biggest addition to this team in the offseason. He brings the attack mentality that many of us have been looking for over the past few decades. Every defensive coordinator talks about being aggressive. Wade actually does it. He brings an attack mentality to a team full of talent. He has proven over and over that he can get the most out of the talent he has. Add that in to the fact that he now has more talent than he has ever had. Wade will put these guys in positions that maximize their talent. Von is not going to be spending half of his time in pass coverage. He's going to be destroying QB's. If your not excited about this defense, you might want to check your pulse to see if you still have one.

This defense will not only be elite, it will be the best in franchise history.

https://thenypost.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/von2.jpg?quality=100&strip=all&w=225&strip=all

The DEFENSE rests it's case.

[VonDoom]

https://thenypost.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/von2.jpg?quality=100&strip=all&w=225&strip=all

The DEFENSE rests it's case.

Nosta-Ziggy

[Northman]

Okay, taking off my orange glasses, you've got the 85 Bears, 2000 Ravens ... who else? We're right there with anyone, as far as I'm concerned. If you don't win it all, you can't be considered, but a performance like we gave this postseason lifts them up to that top tier. Another random stat on our D - in three playoff games, we allowed three total touchdowns.

2002 Bucs were pretty good as well as the Seattle team the destroyed us 2 years ago.

[VonDoom]

2002 Bucs were pretty good as well as the Seattle team the destroyed us 2 years ago.

Yep, those would be the others I could think of. I'd put this team with either of those, which I think are just a hair below the first two I mentioned.

[Hawgdriver]

This defense deserves mention in this conversation.

[Joel]

Okay, taking off my orange glasses, you've got the 85 Bears, 2000 Ravens ... who else? We're right there with anyone, as far as I'm concerned. If you don't win it all, you can't be considered, but a performance like we gave this postseason lifts them up to that top tier. Another random stat on our D - in three playoff games, we allowed three total touchdowns.
No Name and Doomsday are right up there though. Or the Cowboys D that beat Miami at the start of the Dolphins mini-dynasty: They only allowed ONE playoff TD, and the opponents in their other two postseason games (including the SB) only managed 3 pts. The '71 Cowboys had the #1 offense on their side though, and the competition was different: Not only did we beat the #1 offense in the SB, we beat the #4 (Pitt) and #3 (NE*) scoring offenses GETTING there.

Put another way, the Doomsday D had the SB record for most 3rd stops in a row—until Carolinas broke it tonight: And we STILL won by 2 TDs.

I dunno, final analysis it really was a solid TEAM win. Our D did to Carolina what Carolinas did to everyone all year, and our offense DIDN'T let Carolinas D to it to them. Despite losing BOTH our starting OTs before the season was a month old.

[VonDoom]

No Name and Doomsday are right up there though. Or the Cowboys D that beat Miami at the start of the Dolphins mini-dynasty: They only allowed ONE playoff TD, and the opponents in their other two postseason games (including the SB) only managed 3 pts. The '71 Cowboys had the #1 offense on their side though, and the competition was different: Not only did we beat the #1 offense in the SB, we beat the #4 (Pitt) and #3 (NE*) scoring offenses GETTING there.

Put another way, the Doomsday D had the SB record for most 3rd stops in a row—until Carolinas broke it tonight: And we STILL won by 2 TDs.

I dunno, final analysis it really was a solid TEAM win. Our D did to Carolina what Carolinas did to everyone all year, and our offense DIDN'T let Carolinas D to it to them. Despite losing BOTH our starting OTs before the season was a month old.

You're probably right on some of those. I'm (relatively) young and I just don't remember anything before 85-86 or so. I was using the 85 Bears as the standard because of their utter dominance in the playoffs, but as always, it's difficult to compare eras.

[wayninja]

Another random stat on our D - in three playoff games, we allowed three total touchdowns.

That is ******* INSANE!

[VonDoom]

That is ******* INSANE!

I'm sorry, it was actually four. I forgot that the Pats had two in that game, though in fairness, one started in our red zone and the other was after a Gronk push off.

[Joel]

Another random stat on our D - in three playoff games, we allowed four total touchdowns.That is ******* INSANE!
It's really not though: Again, in three playoff games, the '71 Cowboys allowed only a SINGLE TD, and only a single FG in TWO of them, including a SB against the Perfect Dolphins who didn't lose again for A YEAR-AND-A-HALF. What makes our Ds playoff performance so amazing isn't that they held higher scoring modern offenses to so few points, but that they held the #4, #3 and #1 scoring offenses to so few points, with a BELOW AVERAGE offense of their own.

Understand, I've long believed the '71 Cowboys D had historys most dominant playoff run, but they did it when THEY had the #1 offense, and the AFC Champ Dolphins were the only top five offense they faced: Our D faced nothing BUT top five offenses, with pitiful offense support of their own, and STILL dominated the playoffs.

[wayninja]

It's really not though: Again, in three playoff games, the '71 Cowboys allowed only a SINGLE TD, and only a single FG in TWO of them, including a SB against the Perfect Dolphins who didn't lose again for A YEAR-AND-A-HALF. What makes our Ds playoff performance so amazing isn't that they held higher scoring modern offenses to so few points, but that they held the #4, #3 and #1 scoring offenses to so few points, with a BELOW AVERAGE offense of their own.

Understand, I've long believed the '71 Cowboys D had historys most dominant playoff run, but they did it when THEY had the #1 offense, and the AFC Champ Dolphins were the only top five offense they faced: Our D faced nothing BUT top five offenses, with pitiful offense support of their own, and STILL dominated the playoffs.

No. The difference in rules that make scoring so much easier between '71 and '16 makes this analysis apples to oranges. Sorry Joel.

It's insane. Even knowing that the stat was off, and it's 4 td's in 3 games. That's insane in 2016.

[Joel]

No. The difference in rules that make scoring so much easier between '71 and '16 makes this analysis apples to oranges. Sorry Joel.

It's insane. Even knowing that the stat was off, and it's 4 td's in 3 games. That's insane in 2016.
The benchmark of Super Bowl Era greatness is the '72 Dolphins team that went 17-0—immediately AFTER Dallas beat them 24-3 in SB VI, on top of beating SF 14-3 the previous week and Minnesota 20-12 the week before. They not only allowed only ONE postseason TD, but NEARLY SHUT OUT ARGUABLY THE BEST TEAM EVER. That trumps modern rule changes.

HOWEVER, Dallas had the #1 scoring offense WITH them, not AGAINST, and didn't face a top five offense before the SB: We faced 3 of the top 5 offenses and smothered ALL of them, DESPITE the "help" of an offense that wasn't even AVERAGE.

The Doomsday D had the advantage of an elite offense that could and did keep them rested and healthy by extending drives both through the air and on the ground. We broke the SB record for most unconverted 3rd downs in a row (a big record: The Doomsday D inflicted it on us in SB XII) yet our D STILL won the game by 2 TDs.

THAT'S the difference: Doing it UNAIDED, against FAR better offenses (not because the rules changed, but because the offenses we faced are just flat better.) Hopefully Shulas son doesn't rattle off a perfect season and then repeat, leaving our D an elite but forgotten footnote like the '71 Cowboys.

[VonDoom]

No. The difference in rules that make scoring so much easier between '71 and '16 makes this analysis apples to oranges. Sorry Joel.

It's insane. Even knowing that the stat was off, and it's 4 td's in 3 games. That's insane in 2016.

After I thought about it last night, I believe that the defense allowed only ONE TOUCHDOWN PASS all postseason (the Steelers scored on a rushing TD, no? I'm too lazy to look it up right now). So against Roethlisberger, Brady and Newton, they passed for one touchdown. Crazy. Even the three TD runs we allowed were all at the goal line. No long, breakaway runs, no punt or kick returns, no long bombs. Just great defense all around.

[Yashahla17]

Nah Steelers scored a crazy athletic touchdown pass to martavious Bryant where he held it on his legs during a front flip. I'll never forget that catch.

[BroncoWave]

Nah Steelers scored a crazy athletic touchdown pass to martavious Bryant where he held it on his legs during a front flip. I'll never forget that catch.

Hmm, nope, not against us. They showed the stats of all the QBs we have played this postseason, and only Brady had a TD next to his name.

[Yashahla17]

You're Right that catch was vs the Bengals. My bad.

[Northman]

Nah Steelers scored a crazy athletic touchdown pass to martavious Bryant where he held it on his legs during a front flip. I'll never forget that catch.

That was against Cincy, not Denver.

[Joel]

You're Right that catch was vs the Bengals. My bad.
Wasn't a catch either: That ball moved after he left his feet, and he didn't regain control until he landed OUT OF BOUNDS. But whatever: SB Champs, baby!

[Northman]

Wasn't a catch either: That ball moved after he left his feet, and he didn't regain control until he landed OUT OF BOUNDS. But whatever: SB Champs, baby!

Disagree as the only time it moved is when Bryant went to re-adjust and put it in his arms. It didnt move because it was loose or anything. Never the less, its much ado about nothing as it didnt affect us.

[Joel]

While maybe not an authority, Dilfer says our D's the best he's "since" his 2000 Ravens (http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:14736898). In particular, he notes at the end that it wasn't JUST Von Miller nor JUST DeMarcus Ware: Every time ONE of our guys made a play, there were MULTIPLE other right behind him to finish the job if he couldn't. That's why

Von Miller's first strip-sack wasn't JUST a sack: Jackson fell on it in the end zone, and if he hadn't, Ware was about to do so.

TJ Wards stumbling Int turned fumble to inside our 10 wasn't JUST 1st and G Carolina: Danny Trevathan IMMEDIATELY hopped on the ball to secure it.

Von Millers second strip-sack wasn't JUST a sack: Cam looked SCARED to wrestle for the ball, and when it popped loose from Ware, Ward just grabbed it instead.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

We tied the Ravens for lowest TD total allowed for a season with 36. I think that definitely puts us in the discussion.

[Slick]

We tied the Ravens for lowest TD total allowed for a season with 36. I think that definitely puts us in the discussion.

I'm pretty sure that stat was 36 touchdows scored BY Denver, and was tied for the lowest with the Ravens with 36. The 2002 Bucs scored 38 TDs. Meaning those defenses had to overcome some pretty bad offenses.

[NightTrainLayne]

I was really skeptical when this thread was initially posted.

That is some tall cotton.

But I went form skeptical, to thinking a Super Bowl win might (just might) make this argument carry some weight.

But damn. I didn't expect to hold the #1 scoring offense to just 10 points. This defense's playoff run is definitely one for the story books.

Yes. This is the best Denver Broncos defense ever. No question about it.

And they are in the conversation for best NFL defense ever. Definitely.

[Joel]

I'm pretty sure that stat was 36 touchdows scored BY Denver, and was tied for the lowest with the Ravens with 36. The 2002 Bucs scored 38 TDs. Meaning those defenses had to overcome some pretty bad offenses.
That's correct: We ALLOWED 29 TDs, which isn't bad—but the 2000 Ravens only allowed 16. Then again, if we're doing that "different era" thing, the Titans also allowed <20 that year. But two teams (Cincy and Seattle) allowed less TDs than us this year: When we give up a big play, it's usually a blown assignment and VERY big (e.g. @Pitt) but we fortunately execute well enough that's rare. Our passing and rushing yds/att were #1: You either scored a walkoff on us or punted.

[Ziggy]

This defense had less help than the other great all-time defenses.

The Denver offense had 11 first downs. That is the lowest first down total for a winning team in super bowl history.
The Denver offense had 194 total yards. That is the lowest yardage total for a winning team in super bowl history.
The Denver offense scored one touchdown. That is tied for the lowest total for a winning team in super bowl history.
The Denver offense failed on 13 straight 3rd down Conversions. That is the most in for any team in Super Bowl history.
When Brandon McManus kicked a 30-yard field goal to give Denver a 16-7 lead midway through the third quarter, it marked the latest any team leading in a Super Bowl had gone without having scored an offensive touchdown.

Fun Super Bowl 50 Game Facts

The Super Bowl was the only game all season in which the Panthers never had a lead.

10 points were the fewest that the Panthers have scored all season.

Newton was blitzed 25 times in Super Bowl 50, the second-most blitzes faced in Super Bowl history.

The Panthers had minus-33 yards on 16 plays during which both Miller and DeMarcus Ware rushed the passer, including four sacks and two fumbles. They gained positive yardage on one of those 16 plays.

[Yashahla17]

Wasn't a catch either: That ball moved after he left his feet, and he didn't regain control until he landed OUT OF BOUNDS. But whatever: SB Champs, baby!

Shut up dude, it was a catch and a touchdown.

[Bronco4ever]

Shut up dude, it was a catch and a touchdown.

The NFL came out and said it should have been called an incomplete pass.

[Yashahla17]

The NFL came out and said it should have been called an incomplete pass.

Wheres the link?

Theres nothing about that catch that says incomplete.

[NightTerror218]

That's correct: We ALLOWED 29 TDs, which isn't bad&mdash;but the 2000 Ravens only allowed 16. Then again, if we're doing that "different era" thing, the Titans also allowed <20 that year. But two teams (Cincy and Seattle) allowed less TDs than us this year: When we give up a big play, it's usually a blown assignment and VERY big (e.g. @Pitt) but we fortunately execute well enough that's rare. Our passing and rushing yds/att were #1: You either scored a walkoff on us or punted.

Is that adjusted for several pick 6 passes by manning?

[Joel]

Is that adjusted for several pick 6 passes by manning?
Sure: Just like that's deducted for all OTHER teams.

Every time Dilfer threw a pick-six the refs just took the ball away from the defender, dusted it off, handed it back to Baltimore and said, "still first down." ;)

[MOtorboat]

Wheres the link?

Theres nothing about that catch that says incomplete.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/25451733/nfl-vp-of-officiating-wild-martavis-bryant-td-vs-bengals-wasnt-a-catch

[Yashahla17]

Doesn't matter anyway, it goes down as a catch.

[Davii]

Um yea.

And how bout that Madden Sim i posted earlier in the week? Denver won that 27-10. :)

And let's not forget my Madden game! :lol:

[NightTerror218]

Sure: Just like that's deducted for all OTHER teams.

Every time Dilfer threw a pick-six the refs just took the ball away from the defender, dusted it off, handed it back to Baltimore and said, "still first down." ;)

Curious on if it's adjusted or not for pick 6 or if it's the straight defensive stat of TD given up.

[VonDoom]

This seemed like an appropriate thread to put this:

https://twitter.com/FO_ScottKacsmar/status/697561099097370626

[Joel]

Curious on if it's adjusted or not for pick 6 or if it's the straight defensive stat of TD given up.
I honestly don't know, but doubt it is. Starting down that road gets very subjective very fast:


3
1:03
3
5
DEN 5
Tom Brady (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BradTo00.htm) pass incomplete intended for Troy Brown (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BrowTr00.htm) is intercepted by Champ Bailey (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BailCh00.htm) and returned for 100 yards. Champ Bailey (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BailCh00.htm) fumbles (forced by Ben Watson (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WatsBe00.htm)), ball out of bounds at NWE (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nwe/2005.htm)-1. NWE (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nwe/2005.htm) challenged the ruling, and the play was upheld.
6
10


3
0:47
1
1
NWE 1
Mike Anderson (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/A/AndeMi00.htm) left end for 1 yard, touchdown
6
16


Who's charged for that one? It wasn't a pick-six, but....

If you say, "charge it to the NE* offense or Denver D, but not the NE* D" are ALL post-turnover scores on the offense that lost the ball?

Even if it happens on the OTHER goal line, and the D just gives up a dozen plays for 99 yds and a TD?

What about FGs: If a team loses the ball at its opponents 30, its D allows 30 yds, then its opponent makes a 57 yd FG, what then? Did the offense set up the FG by giving away the ball, or did the D allow it by giving up 2-3 first downs before it finally made a stop?

[arapaho2]

I could say they were the best, or at least one of the best ever, they were
#1 total def
#1 pass def
#1 sacks
#1 rec def
#1 total yards
#3 rush defense
#4 scoreing def

then consider they were only 1.2 ppg less then seattles #1 scoreing defense, yet seattle face some real dogs

jimmy clausen and the bears...we faced cutler
jimmy clausen and the ravens...we faced flacco
kapernick before he was benched
gabbert
keenum

when seattle played good qbs those qbs put up points

foles put up 34, 24
Rodgers 27
Dalton 27
cam 27
ben 30, yes ben put up 34 on us but we were missing ward, stewart, and ware key pieces

[VonDoom]

Some more context about how great out defense was ... and how great it NEEDED to be to win it this year:


The question we should be asking is: Are the 2015 Denver Broncos the most-important defense in NFL history? And if that’s the question, then the answer is a resounding yes. In fact, the Denver defense may be the most-important unit, offense or defense, the league has ever seen.

And the case all starts with this stat: 14 of the Denver Broncos’ 19 games were decided by seven points or less, and they went an eye-popping 11-3 in those games, an NFL record.

Of the three other defenses in question, only the ’13 Seahawks (6-3) came close to reaching double digit games decided by a touchdown or less; the ’00 Ravens (4-2) and ’85 Bears (2-0) were quite used to a comfortable lead.

Why is that? Because they had offenses that carried at least some portion of the load, if not a good deal of it.

That was not the case with the Broncos, who only had one victory all season by more than two scores; the Bears (12), the Ravens (8) and Seahawks (8), though, spent the majority of their season blowing opponents out. In fact, in their Super Bowl appearances, both the Bears and Seahawks scored 40-plus points, and the Ravens put up 34.

It may sound odd to say, but none of those three teams needed an all-time great defense; really, they just needed a good-to-great defense, because they all had competent offenses backing them up — top-10 offenses in the cases of Chicago and Seattle.

http://milehighsports.com/the-2015-denver-broncos-defense-is-the-most-important-unit-in-nfl-history/

[Cugel]

Yes, well the Patriots have been juggernauts before, right?

In 2007 they went into the Super Bowl at 18-0, after scoring 589 points, and Tom Brady threw for 50 TDs and 8 Ints with a QBR of 117. This was the 2nd best offense of all time next to the Broncos 2013 offense that scored 608 points.

Of course they lost 16-13 to the 10-6 Giants.

In fact their two super bowl losers in the 2007 and 2011 seasons in total won 44 games and lost 2, while the Giant teams that beat them won 25 and lost 13 games.

If the Seahawks weren't proof enough that great defense wins championships consider that those Giants teams barely won their division. The Ravens and Packers were both #6 seed wild cards that won 10 games those seasons.

Think that the Packers just won because of Aaron Rogers? Their scoring defense in 2010 was #2 in the NFL, and the 2nd best all time Packers defense.

Three of the last 5 SB champions were 10-6 or 9-7. And of course, last year, the Seahawks really won that game - except for Pete Carroll's monumental brain fart at the end of the game to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. So, defense really won again, as it did in 2013 over the greatest offensive juggernaut of all time in "the game that shall not be mentioned."

Of course, it's early yet, but the Broncos defense has surrendered 6, 17 and 12 points in three games = 35 total points, or a total average of 11.66 points per game. If they could do that over the course of an entire season they would give up 186 points, which would equal the 1985 Bears!

Of course, they are playing teams like the Packers and Patriots so that average is going to go up, possibly quite a bit up. But, right now they are on pace to have one of the top 5 scoring defenses of the last 30 years, alongside such all-time greats as the '85-'86 Bears, the 2000 Ravens, the 2002 Bucs and the 2013 Seahawks.

If this offense is even mediocre at rushing the ball by January and they can win 11 games and get into the playoffs - LOOK OUT in the playoffs. Because the Broncos are going to be one team nobody wants to play.

Well, looks like I was right when I wrote that back in September. Broncos defense was historically great and defense once again won the championship. Broncos got to the playoffs and all the idiot pundits kept picking the Steelers, Patriots and Panthers because of their great offenses that were going to stomp all over the Broncos defense.

They were 5 point underdogs to the Patriots and 7 points to Carolina.

Someday people are going to realize that great defense almost always beats great offense. Out of the top 16 teams in NFL history that have scored more than 500 points in a single season, only 4 won the SB - and only 1 team out of twelve since 2000 has done it.

12 teams scored 500 or more points since 2000, and only one of them - the 2009 Saints - won the SB, and they won it over Peyton Manning's Colts team that didn't have a very good defense.

[Hawgdriver]

This was an all-time defense, but it's unlikely they fall into that generally accepted bucket of all-time defenses. At least we know the truth.

[Joel]

Some more context about how great out defense was ... and how great it NEEDED to be to win it this year:

http://milehighsports.com/the-2015-denver-broncos-defense-is-the-most-important-unit-in-nfl-history/
That's misleading, because neither the '85 Bears nor '13 Seahawks had good offenses (the 2000 Ravens certainly didn't:) They had SAFE offenses. I haven't checked, but suspect most of their blowouts were due to their defense forcing turnovers and generally holding opponents to very few points: 13-3 is still "a double digit win."

Our Ds really impressive feat was winning a record number of tight games, but simply having the OPPORTUNITY to win that many close ones doesn't say many good things about our offense. The main positive is that it was SAFE, which was no easy thing given the Swiss cheese we had for run blocking and pass protection. Our offense didn't win many games; it just didn't lose many either, and that was enough for our D to secure homefield and win a SB.

If we'd swung for the fences the way people (including the NFL) love, we'd have had more blowouts, but would've GOTTEN blown out more, too. There was no reason to take those kind of risks unless we were already in a deep hole and had no choice, and our D ensured that NEVER happened.

[Cugel]

Curious on if it's adjusted or not for pick 6 or if it's the straight defensive stat of TD given up.

Joel is wrong on this. Peyton threw 3 Pick sixes so those 21 points were added to the Broncos "defensive" totals! (Go look at NFL.com and see for yourself. They don't make any adjustment for the fact that the defense wasn't even on the field!)

The 3 teams ahead of us in scoring defense, Seahawks, Bengals and Chiefs did NOT surrender any pick sixes. Broncos gave up 296 points, but subtracting 21 means they really gave up 275 - which is 2 fewer than the Seahawks.

And this doesn't even take into account that Peyton's 17 picks put the defense into bad situations and added to the defensive points given up - whereas Cam Newton for instance threw only 10 picks on the year and had ZERO pick sixes, and Andy Dalton had only 7 picks in 386 pass attempts.

[Cugel]

That's misleading, because neither the '85 Bears nor '13 Seahawks had good offenses (the 2000 Ravens certainly didn't:) They had SAFE offenses. I haven't checked, but suspect most of their blowouts were due to their defense forcing turnovers and generally holding opponents to very few points: 13-3 is still "a double digit win."

Our Ds really impressive feat was winning a record number of tight games, but simply having the OPPORTUNITY to win that many close ones doesn't say many good things about our offense. The main positive is that it was SAFE, which was no easy thing given the Swiss cheese we had for run blocking and pass protection. Our offense didn't win many games; it just didn't lose many either, and that was enough for our D to secure homefield and win a SB.

If we'd swung for the fences the way people (including the NFL) love, we'd have had more blowouts, but would've GOTTEN blown out more, too. There was no reason to take those kind of risks unless we were already in a deep hole and had no choice, and our D ensured that NEVER happened.

Those teams had really good OLs Joel. They could run the ball and protect the QB. I.e. they won similar to what Kubiak WANTED the team to look like, but couldn't do because the OL was so horrible all year. Peyton got sacked 5 times in the SB, and threw a pick and had a couple of fumbles so it didn't really play any better in the big game.

After the last SB they got rid of Zane Beadles, Manny Ramirez, Orlando Franklin and Chris Clark. I expect that Ryan Harris, Tyler Polumbus, Evan Mathis and possibly even Louis Vasquez will be gone by next September. Max Garcia and Matt Paradis should be starting alongside Ty Sambrailo, and Michael Schofield will be a backup if he's even on the team. That leaves a couple of blank spots to fill in at LT or RT and some backups to find.

But, key to the off-season is going to be strengthening the OL so they can run the Kubiak offense successfully.

[NightTerror218]

Those teams had really good OLs Joel. They could run the ball and protect the QB. I.e. they won similar to what Kubiak WANTED the team to look like, but couldn't do because the OL was so horrible all year. Peyton got sacked 5 times in the SB, and threw a pick and had a couple of fumbles so it didn't really play any better in the big game.

After the last SB they got rid of Zane Beadles, Manny Ramirez, Orlando Franklin and Chris Clark. I expect that Ryan Harris, Tyler Polumbus, Evan Mathis and possibly even Louis Vasquez will be gone by next September. Max Garcia and Matt Paradis should be starting alongside Ty Sambrailo, and Michael Schofield will be a backup if he's even on the team. That leaves a couple of blank spots to fill in at LT or RT and some backups to find.

But, key to the off-season is going to be strengthening the OL so they can run the Kubiak offense successfully.

Clady will be back. Right now based on roster OL is clady, mad max, paradis, Vasquez, and Sambrailo. I am ok with this line going I to next to year. Clady is willing to redo contract and that will keep him here. He is still better then half the starters in the league when healthy. Schofield is back up which is ok I guess since he has some experience.

I can guarentee that we will pick up an early rounder again though. Every draft 1st round has been to a guy that fell to them and they had rated very high. Von, wolfe(1st pick), sly, Roby and ray. These have all be solid picks and contributors if not starters already.

[The Glue Factory]

I can guarentee that we will pick up an early rounder again though. Every draft 1st round has been to a guy that fell to them and they had rated very high. Von, wolfe(1st pick), sly, Roby and ray. These have all be solid picks and contributors if not starters already.

Von did not exactly fall to us. We had the #2 overall pick that year for crying out loud!

[NightTerror218]

Von did not exactly fall to us. We had the #2 overall pick that year for crying out loud!

I have been reading if Carolina took he would have take newton. So von fell to us lol.

[Ziggy]

If this team can fix the Oline, this defense will be even more dominant. With time to rest, a running game, and field position help from the offense, watch out.

[BroncoJoe]

I have been reading if Carolina took he would have take newton. So von fell to us lol.

I think this sentence sums up your earlier comment.

:D