PDA

View Full Version : Report: Peyton Manning preparing for Broncos return



Denver Native (Carol)
02-09-2015, 10:54 PM
The Brock Osweiler era will have to wait another year.

Denver Broncos quarterback Peyton Manning is expected to begin working with renowned strength and conditioning coach Mackie Shilstone this week in preparation for an 18th NFL season, Jeff Duncan of The Times-Picayune reports.

Shilstone is a specialist in career longevity, most famous for his work with boxers Roy Jones Jr. and Bernard Hopkins.

Manning wants to speak with general manager John Elway before publicly announcing his intentions, per Duncan. That discussion could happen as soon as the next couple of days.

rest - http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000469677/article/report-peyton-manning-preparing-for-broncos-return

Denver Native (Carol)
02-09-2015, 10:56 PM
Another article on this, with more information
http://www.nola.com/saints/index.ssf/2015/02/source_peyton_manning_training.html

Simple Jaded
02-09-2015, 11:07 PM
I'm willing the bet Oswieler isn't the biggest Peyton Manning fan. Somebody should post that gif of him going to get his helmet and turning to see Manning in the huddle. That's fitting here.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 12:17 AM
I'm willing the bet Oswieler isn't the biggest Peyton Manning fan. Somebody should post that gif of him going to get his helmet and turning to see Manning in the huddle. That's fitting here.

That's why I said in the other thread that Brock should ask to be traded; Cleveland, Buffalo, New York, Washington, Tennessee, St. Louis, Houston and Tampa Bay are in need, Fox may want to move on from Cutler, he's knows Brock as does Gase, that could be another team that could be interested.

Simple Jaded
02-10-2015, 12:25 AM
That's why I said in the other thread that Brock should ask to be traded; Cleveland, Buffalo, New York, Washington, Tennessee, St. Louis, Houston and Tampa Bay are in need, Fox may want to move on from Cutler, he's knows Brock as does Gase, that could be another team that could be interested.

I wanna see Osweiler hit the ground running in Denver, whenever that time is.

If you like Osweiler why would you want him to go to another team? **** those other teams, keep Osweiler as long as possible.

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 12:28 AM
So...Peyton Manning. That dude is pretty good.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 12:36 AM
I wanna see Osweiler hit the ground running in Denver, whenever that time is.

If you like Osweiler why would you want him to go to another team? **** those other teams, keep Osweiler as long as possible.

Because I love the game and respect competitors and I don't believe a quarterback of his pedigree or any player period should be kept on the bench until year five; if we drafted Holliman in the second round would you be okay with him sitting four or five years? I was okay with the three year championship run...and despite the likelihood of this going on I had hopes it would not, but eventually you can hurt these players just as much by holding them back, if Elway likes the kid then he'll allow him to go if he asks and if he doesn't I'd have to wonder about his competitive nature. As much as I love the Broncos I don't think I could have waited half a decade to see the field, even if it meant leaving.

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 12:39 AM
Because I love the game and respect competitors and I don't believe a quarterback of his pedigree or any player period should be kept on the bench until year five; if we drafted Holliman in the second round would you be okay with him sitting four or five years? I was okay with the three year championship run...and despite the likelihood of this going on I had hopes it would not, but eventually you can hurt these players just as much by holding them back, if Elway likes the kid then he'll allow him to go if he asks and if he doesn't I'd have to wonder about his competitive nature. As much as I love the Broncos I don't think I could have waited half a decade to see the field, even if it meant leaving.

I, personally, would like to see the winning continue. Can't win a championship if you're not in the dance. Peyton Manning gives this team the best chance to be in the dance.

Simple Jaded
02-10-2015, 12:43 AM
Because I love the game and respect competitors and I don't believe a quarterback of his pedigree or any player period should be kept on the bench until year five; if we drafted Holliman in the second round would you be okay with him sitting four or five years? I was okay with the three year championship run...and despite the likelihood of this going on I had hopes it would not, but eventually you can hurt these players just as much by holding them back, if Elway likes the kid then he'll allow him to go if he asks and if he doesn't I'd have to wonder about his competitive nature. As much as I love the Broncos I don't think I could have waited half a decade to see the field, even if it meant leaving.
Not me, I'm super selfish, I wanna see Osweiler become the next Big Ben in a Broncos uniform. I'm like that college HC back in the day who had 3rd stringers that could start for most teams, I couldn't possibly care less if Holliman got his feelings hurt..

Lancane
02-10-2015, 12:53 AM
I, personally, would like to see the winning continue. Can't win a championship if you're not in the dance. Peyton Manning gives this team the best chance to be in the dance.

Maybe for the season, but not long-term. The winning has to end, it always does but it's how you handle everything that allows you to bounce back, by shirking young players that is a good way to become a very unpopular franchise no matter the wins and losses. Elway wouldn't do that to a running back, defensive lineman, linebacker, etc. This is not the 80's, using 80's tactics just don't work in this day and age and you want a competitor at as many positions as possible. Kids don't want to be drafted to be a backup quarterback, especially those taken early, they want to feel accomplished, they want to be the next to lead teams and of course there will be bumps along the way, that is the nature of the sport. And I hope Elway knows that and gives Brock the option, we'll be in the mix for the dance one more time but maybe at the cost of our future...but that happens.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 12:55 AM
Not me, I'm super selfish, I wanna see Osweiler become the next Big Ben in a Broncos uniform. I'm like that college HC back in the day who had 3rd stringers that could start for most teams, I couldn't possibly care less if Holliman got his feelings hurt..

Key term was back in the day, those coaches don't last long in this day and age, I should know.

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 12:56 AM
Maybe for the season, but not long-term. The winning has to end, it always does but it's how you handle everything that allows you to bounce back, by shirking young players that is a good way to become a very unpopular franchise no matter the wins and losses. Elway wouldn't do that to a running back, defensive lineman, linebacker, etc. This is not the 80's, using 80's tactics just don't work in this day and age and you want a competitor at as many positions as possible. Kids don't want to be drafted to be a backup quarterback, especially those taken early, they want to feel accomplished, they want to be the next to lead teams and of course there will be bumps along the way, that is the nature of the sport. And I hope Elway knows that and gives Brock the option, we'll be in the mix for the dance one more time but maybe at the cost of our future...but that happens.

Good for them.

If Elway wants Osweiler, he'll keep him.

Personally, I wanted to be a basketball player. Life didn't grant me that

Lancane
02-10-2015, 01:04 AM
Good for them.

If Elway wants Osweiler, he'll keep him.

Personally, I wanted to be a basketball player. Life didn't grant me that

Yeah, but that is because you didn't have the physical ability, etc. Not because you lacked the desire. This isn't about not getting to be one thing in the future, it's about how you treat players and what it can do. As I pointed out in the other thread, keep him and then tag him and then what? He leaves anyways, is that smart business?

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 01:06 AM
Yeah, but that is because you didn't have the physical ability, etc. Not because you lacked the desire. This isn't about not getting to be one thing in the future, it's about how you treat players and what it can do. As I pointed out in the other thread, keep him and then tag him and then what? He leaves anyways, is that smart business?

Whatever, man. I highly doubt Elway is too worried about or will do the wrong thing. This thread is about Manning coming back, anyway. Take your Brock Osweiler pity party somewhere else.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 01:22 AM
Whatever, man. I highly doubt Elway is too worried about or will do the wrong thing. This thread is about Manning coming back, anyway. Take your Brock Osweiler pity party somewhere else.

I am sure Elway is not worried about it, did I say he was? And getting bent out of shape does nothing for you or myself, we all have our own opinions I just stated what I think is wrong with the situation and how it could play out. Let me ask you this Mo, do you want someone who doesn't want to compete to even get a shot at the position or any position on this team? I wouldn't, but if he asks and Elway talks him in to staying that is one thing, but if he wants to go...then I simply think you let him if nothing can deter that.

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 01:31 AM
I am sure Elway is not worried about it, did I say he was? And getting bent out of shape does nothing for you or myself, we all have our own opinions I just stated what I think is wrong with the situation and how it could play out. Let me ask you this Mo, do you want someone who doesn't want to compete to even get a shot at the position or any position on this team? I wouldn't, but if he asks and Elway talks him in to staying that is one thing, but if he wants to go...then I simply think you let him if nothing can deter that.

No. I don't.

So what's your solution? No backup quarterback? No young quarterbacks at all? That's a terrible solution if you're thinking about the future, which is what you claim to be doing.

But like I said. This ain't the place to be whining that Osweiler isn't getting a shot.

dogfish
02-10-2015, 01:46 AM
lol!! osweiler can pound sand if he doesn't like it-- he's one dude out of 53, and elway quite rightfully ain't concerned about his tender feelings. . . he's paid plenty well to do a job-- the contract didn't come with any guarantee of getting his ego fluffed as well, that's not how good teams operate. . . Q smith would probably like some PT too, should we send von packing so that can happen? if oz's competitive fire is stronger than his desire to earn an NFL check, i'm sure there are other opportunities out there. . .

i just hope manning's stretch run collapse WAS due to the quad, not some precipitous decline in ability. . . if an off-season's rest can bring him back as the guy he was in october, ****in' awesome. . . if not, it'll be a long season. . . won't be the first one, and i'm fine with taking the chance to find out given that we were in the super bowl a year ago. . .

Lancane
02-10-2015, 01:51 AM
No. I don't.

So what's your solution? No backup quarterback? No young quarterbacks at all? That's a terrible solution if you're thinking about the future, which is what you claim to be doing.

But like I said. This ain't the place to be whining that Osweiler isn't getting a shot.

Not whining about **** Mo., and the team has options such as Bradford, Hoyer or Sanchez, but first and second, even third round picks do not expect to sit for four or five years to get a shot, if he wants then Elway should do right and let him. Denver will just have to move on, simple as that - they wanted Manning then they have to ride Manning till he decides, and Elway wanted him back. Elway can draft someone this or next year to try and compete, a year or two years is different then three of four.

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 02:01 AM
Not whining about **** Mo., and the team has options such as Bradford, Hoyer or Sanchez, but first and second, even third round picks do not expect to sit for four or five years to get a shot, if he wants then Elway should do right and let him. Denver will just have to move on, simple as that - they wanted Manning then they have to ride Manning till he decides, and Elway wanted him back. Elway can draft someone this or next year to try and compete, a year or two years is different then three of four.

It sounds like whining to me.

Bronco9798
02-10-2015, 02:06 AM
I, personally, would like to see the winning continue. Can't win a championship if you're not in the dance. Peyton Manning gives this team the best chance to be in the dance.

Thank you for the logic.

NightTerror218
02-10-2015, 02:09 AM
So...Peyton Manning. That dude is pretty good.

Was good. Will he play like he did at end of season. His arm was obviously spent by seasons end. I think his tank is shot. Emergence of a ground game over shadowed his poor play since St. Louis.

Bronco9798
02-10-2015, 02:09 AM
The NFL is a one year adventure. Screw the back up QB. Worry about next year, next year.

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 02:12 AM
Was good. Will he play like he did at end of season. His arm was obviously spent by seasons end. I think his tank is shot. Emergence of a ground game over shadowed his poor play since St. Louis.

Yeah. Sure.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 02:13 AM
It sounds like whining to me.

Well, do I believe the Broncos did right by him? No. But I am not whining, I think they need to let him go so he can compete, because that is the nature of the league. There are too many teams who need a quarterback. As for Denver, they can find a solid backup and draft someone this year and next, not to mention Dysert is still on the books. I just believe allowing kids to sit too long is detrimental to their career, the only other quarterback to have done so in recent memory is Steve Young, do you remember how long his career as a starter lasted? Only 9 seasons. It will play out as it will play out, Manning will get his chance, but all in all I think this will go nowhere and could bite them in the backside, JMO.

NightTerror218
02-10-2015, 02:14 AM
Yeah. Sure.

You if all people should know stats don't lie and neither does the eye test. Manning struggled down the stretch.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 02:15 AM
The NFL is a one year adventure. Screw the back up QB. Worry about next year, next year.

That is great and dandy 9er, till you can not compete which will happen, sooner then you think.

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 02:17 AM
Well, do I believe the Broncos did right by him? No. But I am not whining, I think they need to let him go so he can compete, because that is the nature of the league. There are too many teams who need a quarterback. As for Denver, they can find a solid backup and draft someone this year and next, not to mention Dysert is still on the books. I just believe allowing kids to sit too long is detrimental to their career, the only other quarterback to have done so in recent memory is Steve Young, do you remember how long his career as a starter lasted? Only 9 seasons. It will play out as it will play out, Manning will get his chance, but all in all I think this will go nowhere and could bite them in the backside, JMO.

You've hijacked two threads about Manning coming back with Osweiler junk. It's whining.

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 02:18 AM
You if all people should know stats don't lie and neither does the eye test. Manning struggled down the stretch.

Me, of all people? What the **** does that mean? I hope you're not referring to Akili Smith vs. Peyton Manning.

Manning was a top 5 quarterback this year.

Simple Jaded
02-10-2015, 02:23 AM
That's not the nature of the NFL, teams never trade a player or let him out of a contract so he can compete, if someone did the research and told us that that has literally never happened I would believe that that's literally never happened. They don't even let players walk in college.

NightTerror218
02-10-2015, 02:29 AM
Me, of all people? What the **** does that mean? I hope you're not referring to Akili Smith vs. Peyton Manning.

Manning was a top 5 quarterback this year.

Talking about football IQ.

He starting off amazing, on track of last year stats. Then...fell flat for the level of play for Manning.

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 02:33 AM
Talking about football IQ.

He starting off amazing, on track of last year stats. Then...fell flat for the level of play for Manning.

You mean the completely new playbook instituted halfway through the season?

Running wins championships, or so I'm told.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 02:37 AM
Talking about football IQ.

He starting off amazing, on track of last year stats. Then...fell flat for the level of play for Manning.

I do think the ZBS and run first offense that Kubiak will put in place will help, I may not agree with crap going on with Osweiler, but Manning can still play and in a limited offense he'll likely be able to complete the season uninjured.

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 03:01 AM
Of the quarterbacks who played all six games from Week 12 (The week after the Rams game when the offense changed to the team's ultimate detriment) to Week 17, Manning was 13th in Rating.


Rk Age Year Lg Tm G W L T Cmp Att Cmp% Yds TD Int Rate Y/A AY/A
1 Tony Romo 34 2014 NFL DAL 6 5 1 0 119 166 71.69 1461 16 3 123.1 8.8 9.92
2 Eli Manning 33 2014 NFL NYG 6 3 3 0 155 235 65.96 1915 12 3 102.7 8.15 8.6
3 Russell Wilson 26 2014 NFL SEA 6 6 0 0 103 161 63.98 1456 7 2 102.4 9.04 9.35
4 Aaron Rodgers 31 2014 NFL GNB 6 5 1 0 132 207 63.77 1633 10 2 100.2 7.89 8.42
5 Drew Brees 35 2014 NFL NOR 6 3 3 0 166 242 68.6 1881 14 7 98.9 7.77 7.63
6 Geno Smith 24 2014 NFL NYJ 6 2 4 0 88 134 65.67 1155 6 3 98.3 8.62 8.51
7 Teddy Bridgewater 22 2014 NFL MIN 6 3 3 0 122 177 68.93 1440 10 6 98.1 8.14 7.74
8 Matt Ryan 29 2014 NFL ATL 6 2 4 0 166 247 67.21 1901 11 6 94.9 7.7 7.49
9 Ryan Tannehill 26 2014 NFL MIA 6 2 4 0 161 237 67.93 1691 10 5 93.7 7.14 7.03
10 Joe Flacco 29 2014 NFL RAV 6 4 2 0 125 204 61.27 1465 10 4 91.2 7.18 7.28
11 Andrew Luck 25 2014 NFL CLT 6 5 1 0 107 184 58.15 1373 12 6 89.8 7.46 7.3
12 Tom Brady 37 2014 NFL NWE 6 4 2 0 140 218 64.22 1460 9 4 89.6 6.7 6.7
13 Peyton Manning 38 2014 NFL DEN 6 5 1 0 122 190 64.21 1426 9 6 89.5 7.51 7.03
14 Mark Sanchez 28 2014 NFL PHI 6 3 3 0 137 206 66.5 1538 8 7 87.4 7.47 6.71
15 Matthew Stafford 26 2014 NFL DET 6 4 2 0 137 233 58.8 1578 9 3 86.8 6.77 6.97
16 Andy Dalton 27 2014 NFL CIN 6 4 2 0 122 178 68.54 1218 8 8 84 6.84 5.72
17 Philip Rivers 33 2014 NFL SDG 6 3 3 0 160 242 66.12 1742 10 10 83.7 7.2 6.17
18 Shaun Hill 34 2014 NFL RAM 6 2 4 0 117 187 62.57 1356 7 6 83.5 7.25 6.56
19 Kyle Orton 32 2014 NFL BUF 6 4 2 0 141 219 64.38 1438 8 7 82 6.57 5.86
20 Derek Carr 23 2014 NFL RAI 6 3 3 0 126 228 55.26 1195 8 3 76.2 5.24 5.35
21 Colin Kaepernick 27 2014 NFL SFO 6 2 4 0 95 160 59.38 1010 5 5 75.3 6.31 5.53
22 Blake Bortles 22 2014 NFL JAX 6 2 4 0 104 197 52.79 987 3 3 65.7 5.01 4.63
23 Josh McCown 35 2014 NFL TAM 6 0 6 0 99 193 51.3 1197 5 8 62 6.2 4.85

No. 12 won the Super Bowl.

Davii
02-10-2015, 03:32 AM
Of the quarterbacks who played all six games from Week 12 (The week after the Rams game when the offense changed to the team's ultimate detriment) to Week 17, Manning was 13th in Rating.


Rk Age Year Lg Tm G W L T Cmp Att Cmp% Yds TD Int Rate Y/A AY/A
1 Tony Romo 34 2014 NFL DAL 6 5 1 0 119 166 71.69 1461 16 3 123.1 8.8 9.92
2 Eli Manning 33 2014 NFL NYG 6 3 3 0 155 235 65.96 1915 12 3 102.7 8.15 8.6
3 Russell Wilson 26 2014 NFL SEA 6 6 0 0 103 161 63.98 1456 7 2 102.4 9.04 9.35
4 Aaron Rodgers 31 2014 NFL GNB 6 5 1 0 132 207 63.77 1633 10 2 100.2 7.89 8.42
5 Drew Brees 35 2014 NFL NOR 6 3 3 0 166 242 68.6 1881 14 7 98.9 7.77 7.63
6 Geno Smith 24 2014 NFL NYJ 6 2 4 0 88 134 65.67 1155 6 3 98.3 8.62 8.51
7 Teddy Bridgewater 22 2014 NFL MIN 6 3 3 0 122 177 68.93 1440 10 6 98.1 8.14 7.74
8 Matt Ryan 29 2014 NFL ATL 6 2 4 0 166 247 67.21 1901 11 6 94.9 7.7 7.49
9 Ryan Tannehill 26 2014 NFL MIA 6 2 4 0 161 237 67.93 1691 10 5 93.7 7.14 7.03
10 Joe Flacco 29 2014 NFL RAV 6 4 2 0 125 204 61.27 1465 10 4 91.2 7.18 7.28
11 Andrew Luck 25 2014 NFL CLT 6 5 1 0 107 184 58.15 1373 12 6 89.8 7.46 7.3
12 Tom Brady 37 2014 NFL NWE 6 4 2 0 140 218 64.22 1460 9 4 89.6 6.7 6.7
13 Peyton Manning 38 2014 NFL DEN 6 5 1 0 122 190 64.21 1426 9 6 89.5 7.51 7.03
14 Mark Sanchez 28 2014 NFL PHI 6 3 3 0 137 206 66.5 1538 8 7 87.4 7.47 6.71
15 Matthew Stafford 26 2014 NFL DET 6 4 2 0 137 233 58.8 1578 9 3 86.8 6.77 6.97
16 Andy Dalton 27 2014 NFL CIN 6 4 2 0 122 178 68.54 1218 8 8 84 6.84 5.72
17 Philip Rivers 33 2014 NFL SDG 6 3 3 0 160 242 66.12 1742 10 10 83.7 7.2 6.17
18 Shaun Hill 34 2014 NFL RAM 6 2 4 0 117 187 62.57 1356 7 6 83.5 7.25 6.56
19 Kyle Orton 32 2014 NFL BUF 6 4 2 0 141 219 64.38 1438 8 7 82 6.57 5.86
20 Derek Carr 23 2014 NFL RAI 6 3 3 0 126 228 55.26 1195 8 3 76.2 5.24 5.35
21 Colin Kaepernick 27 2014 NFL SFO 6 2 4 0 95 160 59.38 1010 5 5 75.3 6.31 5.53
22 Blake Bortles 22 2014 NFL JAX 6 2 4 0 104 197 52.79 987 3 3 65.7 5.01 4.63
23 Josh McCown 35 2014 NFL TAM 6 0 6 0 99 193 51.3 1197 5 8 62 6.2 4.85

No. 12 won the Super Bowl.

6630

Northman
02-10-2015, 05:08 AM
My thoughts:

Awesome that Manning appears to want to play again. If he can physically do it than Denver is in a good position to help him continue to succeed. As for Oz, keep him. There is no rush to put him out there so as long as Manning is here and no team is going to give you a lot for a QB who hasnt taken any meaningful snaps. Denver loses more by letting Oz go rather than keeping him because no team will give up anything meaningful for him at this time.

pedrohmlima
02-10-2015, 06:34 AM
Awesome, but pls Peyt, i love u but 19 MI is to ***ing much. Restructure salary and let's make some noise

TXBRONC
02-10-2015, 07:50 AM
Was good. Will he play like he did at end of season. His arm was obviously spent by seasons end. I think his tank is shot. Emergence of a ground game over shadowed his poor play since St. Louis.

The quad injury could have been the culprit not actual arm strength.

BroncoJoe
02-10-2015, 07:57 AM
I'll be honest - I'm not sure how I feel about this.

Rick
02-10-2015, 08:13 AM
If I am Elway, I deny Oz a trade if he were to ask.

We wouldn't get back anywhere near the value we spent, and he is a FA next year anyway.

Give him the chance to leave next year or hopefully sign him long term at that point if Peyton steps away then.

BroncoWave
02-10-2015, 08:16 AM
Manning was a top 5 quarterback this year.

Yes, until his body broke down at the end of the season. I'm not exactly holding my breath for his 39 year old body to hold up for 19-20 games this time around, but I guess we will see.

TXBRONC
02-10-2015, 08:29 AM
Yes, until his body broke down at the end of the season. I'm not exactly holding my breath for his 39 year old body to hold up for 19-20 games this time around, but I guess we will see.

You'll live longer if you don't hold your breath.

Rick
02-10-2015, 08:34 AM
My main concerns are still:

I fear him turning into a Schaub and teams force him to throw it to the sidelines because he physically can't get it down field, he loses confidence, and picks are the result.

I fear when he does hang it up, we become the Colts with no QB sitting around ready to take over as Oz might not want to wait, and there is no other high pick. We may take another guy this year, who knows, but we may end up with no one with any potential to take over. I believe in winning but I also believe in long term strategy, what is the long term plan when Manning steps away? We can't guarantee a plan based on a guy who is a FA next year.

TXBRONC
02-10-2015, 08:41 AM
My main concerns are still:

I fear him turning into a Schaub and teams force him to throw it to the sidelines because he physically can't get it down field, he loses confidence, and picks are the result.

I fear when he does hang it up, we become the Colts with no QB sitting around ready to take over as Oz might not want to wait, and there is no other high pick. We may take another guy this year, who knows, but we may end up with no one with any potential to take over. I believe in winning but I also believe in long term strategy, what is the long term plan when Manning steps away? We can't guarantee a plan based on a guy who is a FA next year.

Elway says he looks at the quarterbacks every year. In five years he's drafted two and once he brought one in as a UDFA. It's unlikely Elway will just sit back and do nothing.

Rick
02-10-2015, 08:45 AM
We drafted another besides Oz, but Zack was a 7th round pick. I think he looked descent in pre season and his playing style suits the Kubiak QB but who knows, he was a 7th rounder.

Does that mean we use a high pick this year when we need to revamp the OL?

If we use a high pick this year, that is what we do, we have the long term plan at QB, but we have sacrificed maybe fixing the OL and potentially wasted a 2nd rounder in developing Brock.

TXBRONC
02-10-2015, 09:00 AM
We drafted another besides Oz, but Zack was a 7th round pick. I think he looked descent in pre season and his playing style suits the Kubiak QB but who knows, he was a 7th rounder.

Does that mean we use a high pick this year when we need to revamp the OL?

If we use a high pick this year, that is what we do, we have the long term plan at QB, but we have sacrificed maybe fixing the OL and potentially wasted a 2nd rounder in developing Brock.

Yes Denver got Dysert in the 7th round but he had graded out as a 4th rounder. If Denver drafts another quarterback this year I doubt it's early.

tomjonesrocks
02-10-2015, 09:55 AM
I'm ok with whatever Manning decides at this point but admit I'm on pins and needles with the decision. Manning must really be on the fence as has been reported.

Denver Native (Carol)
02-10-2015, 11:02 AM
from article:


For clarity, Manning is working out to make sure he is physically fit to continue if he does decide to keep playing, according to a Broncos source. Manning also intends to meet personally with Broncos general manager John Elway and president Joe Ellis before making a final determination about whether to play for an 18th NFL season, fourth with the Broncos.

full article - http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_27494566/update-broncos-peyton-manning-begins-working-personal-trainer

Denver Native (Carol)
02-10-2015, 11:05 AM
http://kdvr.com/2012/04/27/new-broncos-qb-brock-osweiler-best-friends-with-john-elways-son/

I posted this in regards to some stating that OZ should ask to be traded, etc. Unlike most drafted college players, Elway personally knew OZ. I am guessing that Elway has had conversations with OZ in regards to when Peyton retires, etc. I can not imagine Elway just leaving OZ hanging in regards to his future with the Broncos.

GEM
02-10-2015, 12:26 PM
Because I love the game and respect competitors and I don't believe a quarterback of his pedigree or any player period should be kept on the bench until year five; if we drafted Holliman in the second round would you be okay with him sitting four or five years? I was okay with the three year championship run...and despite the likelihood of this going on I had hopes it would not, but eventually you can hurt these players just as much by holding them back, if Elway likes the kid then he'll allow him to go if he asks and if he doesn't I'd have to wonder about his competitive nature. As much as I love the Broncos I don't think I could have waited half a decade to see the field, even if it meant leaving.

Pedigree? Osweiller was always a project taken because of a personal relationship with Elway and his family. Not much of a pedigree?

Lancane
02-10-2015, 12:34 PM
http://kdvr.com/2012/04/27/new-broncos-qb-brock-osweiler-best-friends-with-john-elways-son/

I posted this in regards to some stating that OZ should ask to be traded, etc. Unlike most drafted college players, Elway personally knew OZ. I am guessing that Elway has had conversations with OZ in regards to when Peyton retires, etc. I can not imagine Elway just leaving OZ hanging in regards to his future with the Broncos.

Carol, I've read the same...the way I look at it, is that John has hired his best friend to coach knowing that one day he may be forced to fire him, he has fired close friends before. I think this is more then that, I do not believe for a second that Osweiler being his son's best friend will change their plans, Elway has such a savvy business sense that he is focused on the end goal no matter, I think he cares to a degree but won't let things get in the way of his overall outlook. Second, people believe that rushing kids into the lineup is detrimental, but so is sitting on the bench for too long. Behind a great quarterback at first it's okay, but then these kids start questioning their own worth, can they play or in this instance feel snubbed maybe by that same said quarterback or the team itself. As Mo so candidly pointed out that he is the backup quarterback, but he wasn't drafted to be a backup, he was drafted to be the future and few if any expected a fourth year out of Manning, even his contract makes it look that way...but it is likely to happen barring that something happens at the meeting with Denver's brass. I can only think of one quarterback since the 90's to sit that long and succeed at a high level, that would be Steve Young but he still had a shorter career. And I am sure Brock wants to prove himself capable, he's watching kids drafted the same year as he already starting and finding success but he'll be asked to sit yet again?

Oh well, this is about Manning not Osweiler.

NightTerror218
02-10-2015, 12:45 PM
Manning has to pass his physical in order to get paid anyways right? He may be working out of to see if he can pass it.

IMO, I think if Manning decides to stay he need to be sat more during the season if we are up by a lot. Give Oz a chance. You I vested a lot into him. See what he can do in the system. You do not want to bring a guy also g for years and they dump him and have to start all over again.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 12:48 PM
Pedigree? Osweiller was always a project taken because of a personal relationship with Elway and his family. Not much of a pedigree?

No he was not GEM, he was considered a borderline 1st-2nd round talent which means some believe including Mike Mayock (Mayock stated that he had first round talent, and had he stayed in school that he'd be vying to be the top quarterback in the next draft) but in the year he came out Mayock said that he could go as high as the first round. A second round pick or first round pick, even third round picks are all expected to start eventually otherwise he'd have slid down the boards, where project picks usually do give those few who wow at the combine. Yes, he is friends with Elway's son and coached by Elway's mentor, you don't draft a kid in the second to be a project, that is more like Zac Dysert, Gary Kubiak, Matt Mauck, Bradlee Van Pelt, Buddy Funck, Jarious Jackson and Jeff Lewis. Griese who was Elway's heir apparent was a third round pick, he was more a project pick.

GEM
02-10-2015, 12:49 PM
No he was not GEM, he was considered a borderline 1st-2nd round talent which means some believe including Mike Mayock (Mayock stated that he had first round talent, and had he stayed in school that he'd be vying to be the top quarterback in the next draft) but in the year he came out Mayock said that he could go as high as the first round. A second round pick or first round pick, even third round picks are all expected to start eventually otherwise he'd have slid down the boards, where project picks usually do give those few who wow at the combine. Yes, he is friends with Elway's son and coached by Elway's mentor, you don't draft a kid in the second to be a project, that is more like Zac Dysert, Gary Kubiak, Matt Mauck, Bradlee Van Pelt, Buddy Funck, Jarious Jackson and Jeff Lewis. Griese who was Elway's heir apparent was a third round pick, he was more a project pick.

So it wasn't a complete shock when he was taken in the 2nd round? :lol: Ok.

Head back to the threads from that draft....that was a major jaw drop pick.

Northman
02-10-2015, 12:53 PM
Brock was already slated to be a 2nd round grade before the draft but im sure it didnt hurt that Elway was already familiar with Oz due to his son.

GEM
02-10-2015, 12:56 PM
You guys know more about draft spots than I do, but I remember all the talk around here was that it was a surprising pick and that it had a lot to do with the family association rather than talent. I just don't have the confidence in the kid some of you do, but I hope he works out because he is a great guy.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 12:56 PM
So it wasn't a complete shock when he was taken in the 2nd round? :lol: Ok.

Head back to the threads from that draft....that was a major jaw drop pick.

Really? Several of us believed that Brock Osweiler would be taken in the second round by Denver if he slid that far, go back and read the mock drafts and discussions before the draft. And no, the only one's shocked were those who thought Denver would not take a quarterback or liked other kids more.

Slick
02-10-2015, 12:59 PM
I think picking Oz was a surprise in that many felt like John should have tried to get a starter at another position since he went all in when he signed Manning.

As far as Manning coming back to play next season?

Go Broncos!

Northman
02-10-2015, 01:01 PM
You guys know more about draft spots than I do, but I remember all the talk around here was that it was a surprising pick and that it had a lot to do with the family association rather than talent. I just don't have the confidence in the kid some of you do, but I hope he works out because he is a great guy.

As to what Slick said, i think the general shock was because no one really thought we would take a QB in that particular draft. Well, except me when i had us taking him in my mock draft. lmao

Lancane
02-10-2015, 01:03 PM
Manning has to pass his physical in order to get paid anyways right? He may be working out of to see if he can pass it.

IMO, I think if Manning decides to stay he need to be sat more during the season if we are up by a lot. Give Oz a chance. You I vested a lot into him. See what he can do in the system. You do not want to bring a guy also g for years and they dump him and have to start all over again.

Problem is Terror that once you commit to a certain plan or in this instance in a certain goal then you have to ride with it to the final outcome, whether that is a world championship or another one and done doesn't matter. Shanahan could no more move on from Elway as Elway can move on from Manning at this point, his declaration at the end of season presser sort of made him arm-locked with Manning. They have to ride the horse they chose to the finish line until one side or the other decides to put the horse in question out to pasture. They may give Osweiler more reps with the starters in practice and OTA's, but in the end I don't see Manning or the team allowing much more then clean-up barring a major injury. But as I said, with the ZBS and Run game instilled I think Manning will be able to be relatively untouched for the most part.

GEM
02-10-2015, 01:11 PM
I think picking Oz was a surprise in that many felt like John should have tried to get a starter at another position since he went all in when he signed Manning.

As far as Manning coming back to play next season?

Go Broncos!

Maybe that was it. :laugh:

Slick
02-10-2015, 01:14 PM
Maybe that was it. :laugh:

We bitch a lot so sometimes it gets confusing as to what exactly we were bitching about at certain times.

GEM
02-10-2015, 01:25 PM
We bitch a lot so sometimes it gets confusing as to what exactly we were bitching about at certain times.

I bitch to bitch because apparently it's my M.O. :D Get carried away over piddly shit just for the hell of it.

There's so much bitching around here you'd think it was the water tank around the ladies room in an office. :laugh:

Lancane
02-10-2015, 01:26 PM
We bitch a lot so sometimes it gets confusing as to what exactly we were bitching about at certain times.

I think that is just how boards are, especially when you got such distinctly drawn lines in this case the Pro-Manning and those simply ready to move on.

It's the same on almost any discussion apparatus from Facebook to Disqus, those both disheartened by his return and those heartened by it. Remember the boards during the Plummer years and then when Cutler came, or even later with Tebow, Orton, etc.?

Northman
02-10-2015, 01:26 PM
I bitch to bitch because apparently it's my M.O. :D Get carried away over piddly shit just for the hell of it.



Oh, MO is definitely like that.

dogfish
02-10-2015, 01:34 PM
As far as Manning coming back to play next season?

Go Broncos!

tell 'em babypops! train's leaving the station, get your asses onboard. . .


:defense:

GEM
02-10-2015, 01:48 PM
tell 'em babypops! train's leaving the station, get your asses onboard. . .


:defense:

Kick it over here baby pop
And let all the fly skimmies, feel the beat...mmm drop!

:D

Traveler
02-10-2015, 02:58 PM
Little apprehensive on Manning possibly returning. The guy is in seriously decline physically (read Champ Bailey) IMO. Truth be told, I don't think he makes it through the entire season if he does decide to return.

Which brings us the Oseweiler. The team must do all they can to get Oz ready to step in. He is under contract for this season so he goes nowhere. If Manning does go down with an injury, they have to keep Oz here to proctect themselves. Hell, OZ might even get a contract extention during the season if Manning goes down or his decline continues.

On a side note, did anyone else see this:


There’s a chance (albeit very slim) that Peyton will ask for a raise. There’s also a chance (albeit very slim) that he’ll ask to be traded or released.

Regardless, his desire to meet with Elway and Ellis before making a final decision seems a bit unusual. And it could mean that, at a minimum, there are certain things he needs to say and/or certain things he needs to hear before he decides to come back for a fourth year with the franchise.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/02/10/manning-wants-to-meet-with-elway-ellis-before-making-decision/


Why would they even suggest the bold and underlined sentence? Rampant speculation and piss poor journalism, if you can call it that.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 03:17 PM
Little apprehensive on Manning possibly returning. The guy is in seriously decline physically (read Champ Bailey) IMO. Truth be told, I don't think he makes it through the entire season if he does decide to return.

Which brings us the Oseweiler. The team must do all they can to get Oz ready to step in. He is under contract for this season so he goes nowhere. If Manning does go down with an injury, they have to keep Oz here to proctect themselves. Hell, OZ might even get a contract extention during the season if Manning goes down or his decline continues.

On a side note, did anyone else see this:




Why would they even suggest the bold and underlined sentence? Rampant speculation and piss poor journalism, if you can call it that.

Well, I believe he's simply guessing Trav - not sure anyone believes that is good journalism. But if Manning did ask to be released or traded, I wouldn't be surprised if he wants to go to Chicago with Fox and Gase.

Slick
02-10-2015, 03:24 PM
tell 'em babypops! train's leaving the station, get your asses onboard. . .


:defense:

That train is heading for individual career achievements during the regular season with nothing to show for it in Jan/Feb.

Yay! We're division champs again! Not too shabby!

:fart:

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 03:32 PM
That train is heading for individual career achievements during the regular season with nothing to show for it in Jan/Feb.

Yay! We're division champs again! Not too shabby!

:fart:

Be careful what you wish for.

Traveler
02-10-2015, 03:36 PM
Well, I believe he's simply guessing Trav - not sure anyone believes that is good journalism. But if Manning did ask to be released or traded, I wouldn't be surprised if he wants to go to Chicago with Fox and Gase.

If he did do something like that, he'd be cut soon as the request was made. Don't let the door hit you on the way out. $19+ million in cap space to use elsewhere.

Northman
02-10-2015, 03:44 PM
That train is heading for individual career achievements during the regular season with nothing to show for it in Jan/Feb.

Yay! We're division champs again! Not too shabby!

:fart:

Lmao

Slick bringing the tude.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 03:45 PM
If he did do something like that, he'd be cut soon as the request was made. Don't let the door hit you on the way out. $19+ million in cap space to use elsewhere.

I think he simply has questions as to how the offense will be ran, how much of it will be the offense he knows and how much Kubiak's WCO, make sure the team is on board with him in all aspects. However, there is a chance that they won't see eye to eye, or whatnot. You never know in these situations.

TXBRONC
02-10-2015, 05:05 PM
We bitch a lot so sometimes it gets confusing as to what exactly we were bitching about at certain times.

Yeah I noticed you bitch a lot. :D

Ravage!!!
02-10-2015, 05:14 PM
If I am Elway, I deny Oz a trade if he were to ask.

We wouldn't get back anywhere near the value we spent, and he is a FA next year anyway.

Give him the chance to leave next year or hopefully sign him long term at that point if Peyton steps away then.

That's the point that Lan is making, though. If you know that your YOUNG QB is going to walk next year, then the only thing you are doing is keeping him from having the chance to compete, going into his 4th season.

Oz was a contengency plan on Manning not being able to play after his surgeries. Keeping him on the roster and not allowing him a CHANCE to compete with the "you can leave next year".... is pretty bad mojo, imo. If you aren't getting anything for him this year worth his "value"..then what are you getting for him next year when he leaves?

Ravage!!!
02-10-2015, 05:14 PM
Something crawled up Mo's rear-end. He's cranky as hell.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 05:26 PM
Something crawled up Mo's rear-end. He's cranky as hell.

According to Mo, I am at fault Rav. So blame me and my opinions...I ruined the celebration of Mannings joyous return...I am such an ***hat! :lol:

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 05:36 PM
Something crawled up Mo's rear-end. He's cranky as hell.

I bet you were wishing for Not Too Shabby when McDaniels was here.

That's all I'm trying to say.

Only 7 teams in the history of the NFL have won 12 games three straight years with three straight division titles. Only 2 have done it four or more years. I think people should have a healthier respect for what's happened the last three years.

Slick
02-10-2015, 05:40 PM
Be careful what you wish for.

Thank you for sparing me the 1500 word essay on how hard it's going to be to replace a player of Peyton's calibur.



Lmao

Slick bringing the tude.

Heh! I promised I wasn't going to spam the board with negativity but that doesn't mean I'm not going to post at all in a Manning thread.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 05:52 PM
I bet you were wishing for Not Too Shabby when McDaniels was here.

That's all I'm trying to say.

Only 7 teams in the history of the NFL have won 12 games three straight years with three straight division titles. Only 2 have done it four or more years. I think people should have a healthier respect for what's happened the last three years.

Mo...we all respect what the Broncos accomplished from that mess. You were mad that someone didn't see eye to eye on the backup/future situation...and that is okay.

But seriously, do we want a future quarterback that simply accepts sitting? I want Brock to go to Elway demand a trade and threaten to shove the ball down his throat whenever he plays against Denver. Or to go to Manning's house, punch him, kiss his wife and steal his MVP trophy streaking down the street singing "I am the Champion". I just want some fire from him. I wouldn't be like okay, this is a good situation, I'd want to compete. Maybe he doesn't, but if that is the case, do we want him?

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 06:00 PM
Mo...we all respect what the Broncos accomplished from that mess. You were mad that someone didn't see eye to eye on the backup/future situation...and that is okay.

But seriously, do we want a future quarterback that simply accepts sitting? I want Brock to go to Elway demand a trade and threaten to shove the ball down his throat whenever he plays against Denver. Or to go to Manning's house, punch him, kiss his wife and steal his MVP trophy streaking down the street singing "I am the Champion". I just want some fire from him. I wouldn't be like okay, this is a good situation, I'd want to compete. Maybe he doesn't, but if that is the case, do we want him?

I really don't give a shit how Brock feels at this point.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 06:04 PM
I really don't give a shit how Brock feels at this point.

You should bro, because Manning has one year left...if he does return. You talk about being a ****hole before Elway, Fox and Manning. Having a bad situation or none in place could make us slip back down the slope. But hey, to each their own.

:beer:

Rick
02-10-2015, 06:14 PM
Reason being if we keep him we keep the chance that he doesn't leave.

He may just decide to leave next year and he may not, I wouldn't trade him now, if Peyton retires next year we still have a shot to resign Brock if we keep him for this season.

If we trade him, we probably get no chance to bring him back.

For what we invested in him I would rather some chance on a return than no chance.

Ravage!!!
02-10-2015, 06:21 PM
Reason being if we keep him we keep the chance that he doesn't leave.

He may just decide to leave next year and he may not, I wouldn't trade him now, if Peyton retires next year we still have a shot to resign Brock if we keep him for this season.

If we trade him, we probably get no chance to bring him back.

For what we invested in him I would rather some chance on a return than no chance.

I guess it depends on if he ASKS to be traded...for that will tell us all we need to know. If he asks to be traded, and we refuse...that's not going to sit well with anyone, and most probably wouldn't be the starting point of having him around when he hits FA.

Ravage!!!
02-10-2015, 06:22 PM
I bet you were wishing for Not Too Shabby when McDaniels was here.

That's all I'm trying to say.

Only 7 teams in the history of the NFL have won 12 games three straight years with three straight division titles. Only 2 have done it four or more years. I think people should have a healthier respect for what's happened the last three years.

I understand your point.... but that doesn't take away from the cranky-ass, and rude, way from which you expressed it. I think you need some sleep or something.

Slick
02-10-2015, 06:33 PM
I bet you were wishing for Not Too Shabby when McDaniels was here.

That's all I'm trying to say.

Only 7 teams in the history of the NFL have won 12 games three straight years with three straight division titles. Only 2 have done it four or more years. I think people should have a healthier respect for what's happened the last three years.

I think you can have a healthy respect for what the team has accomplished over that time span and still be critical of what the future holds.

MOtorboat
02-10-2015, 06:35 PM
You should bro, because Manning has one year left...if he does return. You talk about being a ****hole before Elway, Fox and Manning. Having a bad situation or none in place could make us slip back down the slope. But hey, to each their own.

:beer:

OK. We got it.

Northman
02-10-2015, 06:47 PM
I think you can have a healthy respect for what the team has accomplished over that time span and still be critical of what the future holds.

^This

I enjoy Denver's success as much as anybody but there is also a reason John Fox is gone. If things were all peaches and sunshine Elway would have no reason to fire a HC with a winning record in Denver. The ultimate goal is still to win the championship no matter how many great regular seasons we have and i honestly am glad we have a GM who is constantly striving to reach that goal.

BroncoWave
02-10-2015, 06:48 PM
I think you can have a healthy respect for what the team has accomplished over that time span and still be critical of what the future holds.

Nope, if you are skeptical about Manning retuning, then clearly you have no respect for what he's done here!

dogfish
02-10-2015, 06:48 PM
That train is heading for individual career achievements during the regular season with nothing to show for it in Jan/Feb.

Yay! We're division champs again! Not too shabby!

:fart:

gawd damn it, slick!! :tsk:



:lol:

Rick
02-10-2015, 06:53 PM
If I am Brock, unless we draft another QB with a high pick, I would consider myself an idiot to want to be traded THIS year. I would wait it out to see if Manning comes back again after this season.

Unless we draft another guy HIGH he is all but guaranteed to take over next season and he would inherit a top flight team, as opposed to competing for a job with maybe a shitty team.

Now if we take a QB high, like maybe that CSU kid, well that is a different matter and maybe I ask for a trade then.

Northman
02-10-2015, 06:54 PM
I dont see Brock asking for a trade nor do i think we will cut him loose after this year.

Northman
02-10-2015, 06:55 PM
gawd damn it, slick!! :tsk:



:lol:

He ******* Pwned you.

NightTerror218
02-10-2015, 06:59 PM
I Brock doubt he gets traded and next year he will probably get a tender put on him to stay another year.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 07:07 PM
I Brock doubt he gets traded and next year he will probably get a tender put on him to stay another year.

He's not going to be an unrestricted free agent where you can tender him, and by tagging him Denver will have to pay him (if the cap in 2016 goes over 150 mil. as projected) about 20.5 million that season.

Slick
02-10-2015, 07:08 PM
gawd damn it, slick!! :tsk:



:lol:

I'm sorry buddy. The Go Broncos! was me trying not to be negative.

If Manning is back next year, I'll fiercely root as hard for him as the day he became a Bronco. Us doubters will be just as excited as the rest of you once the season gets cranked up again.

NightTerror218
02-10-2015, 10:26 PM
He's not going to be an unrestricted free agent where you can tender him, and by tagging him Denver will have to pay him (if the cap in 2016 goes over 150 mil. as projected) about 20.5 million that season.

Restricted free agents can have tenders placed on them. I think you are confusing it with franchise tag. Denver can place a 2ns round tender o n Brock just like they did Harris this year or even a 1st round tender but pay more.

Lancane
02-10-2015, 10:28 PM
Restricted free agents can have tenders placed on them. I think you are confusing it with franchise tag. Denver can place a 2ns round tender o n Brock just like they did Harris this year or even a 1st round tender but pay more.

He's not going to be restricted Terror, he'll be an unrestricted free agent according to Spotrac.

dogfish
02-10-2015, 10:33 PM
He ******* Pwned you.

shouldn't you be off somewhere slurping tom brady?


:coffee:

Rick
02-10-2015, 10:33 PM
I am confused on how tenders work. How did we get to put a tender on an undrafted but not our second round pick?

dogfish
02-10-2015, 10:35 PM
I'm sorry buddy. The Go Broncos! was me trying not to be negative.

If Manning is back next year, I'll fiercely root as hard for him as the day he became a Bronco. Us doubters will be just as excited as the rest of you once the season gets cranked up again.

no worries, i'm a doubter too. . .

it's not like we were gonna win it all with brock either, though, so i'm not sweatin' it. . .

dogfish
02-10-2015, 10:36 PM
I am confused on how tenders work. How did we get to put a tender on an undrafted but not our second round pick?

it's based off of how many years they have in the league. . . look it up, but i believe only players who had three years on their rookie deal go to RFA-- or maybe it's four. . .

Simple Jaded
02-11-2015, 12:25 AM
I honestly can't think of a single example of a team trading a player so "he can compete", show me an example and I'll show you the exception not the rule. They trade Osweiler and Montee Ball is knocking on the door. This isn't a Disney movie, teams don't give a shit about players feelings.

Simple Jaded
02-11-2015, 12:30 AM
it's based off of how many years they have in the league. . . look it up, but i believe only players who had three years on their rookie deal go to RFA-- or maybe it's four. . .

It's 3, and I don't think 3-year deals are a part of the new CBA, except for maybe UDFA's.

Northman
02-11-2015, 12:47 AM
shouldn't you be off somewhere slurping tom brady?


:coffee:


http://images.ftw.usatoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/bradyhighv.gif

dogfish
02-11-2015, 12:57 AM
http://images.ftw.usatoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/bradyhighv.gif

i could never high five that shit, but i actually laughed out loud. . . you're such a dick!


:lol:

dogfish
02-11-2015, 12:59 AM
They trade Osweiler and Montee Ball is knocking on the door.

perfect-- what can we get for him?

can we package him with oz to get a better pick?

Bronco9798
02-11-2015, 08:24 AM
No he was not GEM, he was considered a borderline 1st-2nd round talent which means some believe including Mike Mayock (Mayock stated that he had first round talent, and had he stayed in school that he'd be vying to be the top quarterback in the next draft) but in the year he came out Mayock said that he could go as high as the first round. A second round pick or first round pick, even third round picks are all expected to start eventually otherwise he'd have slid down the boards, where project picks usually do give those few who wow at the combine. Yes, he is friends with Elway's son and coached by Elway's mentor, you don't draft a kid in the second to be a project, that is more like Zac Dysert, Gary Kubiak, Matt Mauck, Bradlee Van Pelt, Buddy Funck, Jarious Jackson and Jeff Lewis. Griese who was Elway's heir apparent was a third round pick, he was more a project pick.

Oz didn't even make Mayock's top five. Here's Mayock's final top 5.

Quarterback

1. Andrew Luck, Stanford
2. Robert Griffin III, Baylor
3. Ryan Tannehill, Texas A&M
4. Brandon Weeden, Oklahoma State
5. Kirk Cousins, Michigan State

http://www.fieldgulls.com/2012/4/26/2974699/nfl-draft-2012-mike-mayocks-final-positional-rankings-notes

TXBRONC
02-11-2015, 08:57 AM
Oz didn't even make Mayock's top five. Here's Mayock's final top 5.

Quarterback

1. Andrew Luck, Stanford
2. Robert Griffin III, Baylor
3. Ryan Tannehill, Texas A&M
4. Brandon Weeden, Oklahoma State
5. Kirk Cousins, Michigan State

http://www.fieldgulls.com/2012/4/26/2974699/nfl-draft-2012-mike-mayocks-final-positional-rankings-notes

Mayock thought that if Osweiler had stayed for his senior year he would have graded out as a first round prospect.

Northman
02-11-2015, 10:28 AM
And granted only TWO out of the top 5 have even remained starters. Draft is a crapshoot no matter where a player is ranked.

Lancane
02-11-2015, 11:12 AM
Oz didn't even make Mayock's top five. Here's Mayock's final top 5.

Quarterback

1. Andrew Luck, Stanford (Stud)
2. Robert Griffin III, Baylor (Bust)
3. Ryan Tannehill, Texas A&M (Stud)
4. Brandon Weeden, Oklahoma State (Bust)
5. Kirk Cousins, Michigan State (Bust)

http://www.fieldgulls.com/2012/4/26/2974699/nfl-draft-2012-mike-mayocks-final-positional-rankings-notes

Keep blowing smoke 9er, fact is that more then one person has heard what Mayock said. He also ranked them in order of Pro Readiness, and don't forget that a Pro-Bowl Quarterback and a Super Bowl winning Quarterback were drafted later and are not on that list.

:coffee:

Bronco9798
02-11-2015, 11:15 AM
Keep blowing smoke 9er, fact is that more then one person has heard what Mayock said. He also ranked them in order of Pro Readiness, and don't forget that a Pro-Bowl Quarterback and a Super Bowl winning Quarterback were drafted later and are not on that list.

:coffee:

Just pointing out what I found to be interesting.

Lancane
02-11-2015, 11:33 AM
Just pointing out what I found to be interesting.

9er, your so Anti-Osweiler that if the kid farted wrong you would be all over his ***! LOL. It's okay, there is no guarantee and he could be a complete bust or another Griese or even the next Flacco. We have no clue till he get's his chance, hell who thought Brees would turn into a HOF Quarterback? Who thought that Couch would be a bust? Or that Brady would go on to become maybe the GOAT? Whether or not he is or is not he deserves a chance to play, and if he is crap as you believe then you can tout that you were right and that so many were wrong.

Bronco9798
02-11-2015, 11:35 AM
9er, your so Anti-Osweiler that if the kid farted wrong you would be all over his ***! LOL. It's okay, there is no guarantee and he could be a complete bust or another Griese. We have no clue till he get's his chance, hell who thought Brees would turn into a HOF Quarterback? Who thought that Couch would be a bust? Or that Brady would go on to become maybe the GOAT? Whether or not he is or is not he deserves a chance to play, and if he is crap as you believe then you can tout that you were right and that so many were wrong.

Why is it ok if you slobknob all over him and I'm anti-OZ. You're stance is ok and mine isn't? Yes I think he is nothing more than a journeyman QB. That's my opinion. You think otherwise. OK, cool. I'm good with that.

Bronco9798
02-11-2015, 11:39 AM
9er, your so Anti-Osweiler that if the kid farted wrong you would be all over his ***! LOL. It's okay, there is no guarantee and he could be a complete bust or another Griese or even the next Flacco. We have no clue till he get's his chance, hell who thought Brees would turn into a HOF Quarterback? Who thought that Couch would be a bust? Or that Brady would go on to become maybe the GOAT? Whether or not he is or is not he deserves a chance to play, and if he is crap as you believe then you can tout that you were right and that so many were wrong.

And actually I'm not anti any Bronco really as long as they wear the uniform. If he does start, I'll be his biggest fan and want him to succeed. He's a Bronco, I pull for all Broncos. I don't care about being wrong or right either. I want a Super Bowl. And if OZ starts I'll pull for him to get us there. I'm not in a right or wrong contest here. I just want a Super Bowl and I think Peyton gives us a better chance this year than a QB who has never played a complete game in the NFL. And when he does play, I don't think he will be an elite or above average QB. However, I want him to succeed if he does play.

Lancane
02-11-2015, 11:55 AM
And actually I'm not anti any Bronco really as long as they wear the uniform. If he does start, I'll be his biggest fan and want him to succeed. He's a Bronco, I pull for all Broncos. I don't care about being wrong or right either. I want a Super Bowl. And if OZ starts I'll pull for him to get us there. I'm not in a right or wrong contest here. I just want a Super Bowl and I think Peyton gives us a better chance this year than a QB who has never played a complete game in the NFL. And when he does play, I don't think he will be an elite or above average QB. However, I want him to succeed if he does play.

9er when have I ever accused someone of being Anti-Bronco? Let alone someone I respect and talk football with, Broncos' football especially so much? Dude really? I would never. As for your take on him...as I said you could be right, he could be nothing special, but that doesn't mean that Manning is the answer either. Let's be honest; did Favre lead either team he was on after Green Bay to a Championship? Did Montana lead Kansas City to one? The only other to get as close as Manning is Werner in Arizona and then the bottom fell out. Denver is going to instill a new blocking scheme, parts at least of a whole new offense and an entirely new defense, chances are Manning will not see the Super Bowl again, actually the odds Denver goes this year are more 25/1 despite the odds makers so called 12/1 odds. I like Manning, I respect Manning but he has a tendency to turn invisible in some of his most important games and now on a team with a whole new regime in place? Maybe in 2016 but I think that if not now that Elway will be forced to move on, because there are plenty who are ready to move on from Manning already another year and there will be more - we saw this with Plummer too.

Cugel
02-11-2015, 11:55 AM
That's why I said in the other thread that Brock should ask to be traded; Cleveland, Buffalo, New York, Washington, Tennessee, St. Louis, Houston and Tampa Bay are in need, Fox may want to move on from Cutler, he's knows Brock as does Gase, that could be another team that could be interested.

All the different ways this is wrong:

#1 - Brock is under contract for 1 more year. He can't "demand to be traded" and force the Broncos to trade him. They don't have to do anything. He has zero leverage.

#2 - If Peyton retires after this season, Brock will get the best chance he will ever have to succeed in this league. They're going to hand him the starting job and see if he can fill Peyton's shoes. He'll never have a better opportunity than he'll have here.

#3 - There is currently no trade market for him because he is completely untested. NO team is going to give up either players or draft picks for Brock Osweiler.

#4 - At the end of his contract this year he becomes an unrestricted FA. At THAT point, some teams will be interested in him. But not now. Why should they pay a price now for a guy with ZERO proven ability, when he will become a FA at the end of the season?

#5 - If Peyton returns for the 2016 season Brock will go elsewhere, but at this point it doesn't look like Peyton will play out his contract, unless he has more success this season than last.

#6 - Brock Osweiler is in all probability a scrub. He's the #57 pick of the draft. There have been 118 QBs taken at #57 or later since Tom Brady was selected in the 6th round in 2000. Only ONE of them has ever been any good - Russell Wilson (3rd round). So, the chances that Osweiler is a franchise QB who can take a team to the SB are about 1 in 118. (Dishonorable mention late round drafted QBs - Andy Dalton, Kyle Orton, Matt Schaub and Nick Foles - and the others are all worse than that).

So, if Brock walks, big deal. It's as if Brian Griese wanted out of his contract in 2001 and was forcing the Broncos to sign another QB. So what's the downside? The chance that Brian Griese was going to become some kind of star and win the SB? :coffee:

Brock is going to sit there and damn well wait. And then hope he has a good investment adviser to save all the money he's going to earn during in the 2 or 3 seasons he will be the Broncos starting QB.

Cugel
02-11-2015, 12:03 PM
Originally Posted by Lancane View Post
9er, your so Anti-Osweiler that if the kid farted wrong you would be all over his ***! LOL. It's okay, there is no guarantee and he could be a complete bust or another Griese or even the next Flacco. We have no clue till he get's his chance, hell who thought Brees would turn into a HOF Quarterback? Who thought that Couch would be a bust? Or that Brady would go on to become maybe the GOAT? Whether or not he is or is not he deserves a chance to play, and if he is crap as you believe then you can tout that you were right and that so many were wrong.

That's where statistics comes in Lancane. You can look at the odds just like Vegas does. And the odds say "not very damn likely." That's why Dove Valley is hoping that Mackie Shilstone can help rejuvenate Peyton's career:


The Denver Broncos' quarterback has been evaluated by renowned fitness trainer Mackie Shilstone and is expected to begin training with Shilstone this week as he starts offseason preparations for his 18th NFL season, two sources close to Manning said Monday.

Shilstone specializes in career extension. He's worked with hundreds of professional athletes over the years, including boxers Roy Jones Jr. and Bernard Hopkins and most notably tennis superstar Serena Williams. Baseball Hall-of-Famer Ozzie Smith acknowledged Shilstone in his induction speech and credited the trainer with adding 11 years to his career.

I'd give that rehab a better shot than rolling with Brock Osweiler. That would be hilarious if Peyton tries to come back for another 11 years - until he's 50! :laugh:

Bronco9798
02-11-2015, 12:05 PM
9er when have I ever accused someone of being Anti-Bronco? Let alone someone I respect and talk football with, Broncos' football especially so much? Dude really? I would never. As for your take on him...as I said you could be right, he could be nothing special, but that doesn't mean that Manning is the answer either. Let's be honest; did Favre lead either team he was on after Green Bay to a Championship? Did Montana lead Kansas City to one? The only other to get as close as Manning is Werner in Arizona and then the bottom fell out. Denver is going to instill a new blocking scheme, parts at least of a whole new offense and an entirely new defense, chances are Manning will not see the Super Bowl again, actually the odds Denver goes this year are more 25/1 despite the odds makers so called 12/1 odds. I like Manning, I respect Manning but he has a tendency to turn invisible in some of his most important games and now on a team with a whole new regime in place? Maybe in 2016 but I think that if not now that Elway will be forced to move on, because there are plenty who are ready to move on from Manning already another year and there will be more - we saw this with Plummer too.

Peyton has taken us to the Super Bowl. Did we win? No. But, he can get us there again with the talent on this team. Kubiak and Peyton together can implement a system to work for one year. They both know how to adjust and come to something that can work and be successful. And, maybe Elway and Kubiak don't want Peyton back. I doubt that. John went looking for Peyton. Peyton wasn't crawling up the stairs of Dove Valley looking for a job. I could see a mutual ending, I guess. I don't see John telling him you have to go now Peyton, we are done with you. I can't see that. I'll never believe that.

I just don't see a separation from the Broncos and Manning at this point. And, I don't see Peyton playing for anybody except the Broncos. To move somewhere for one year is just stupid, in my opinion. Especially, Chicago. I'm not buying that one at all. Fox don't want a one year rental.

Lancane
02-11-2015, 12:19 PM
All the different ways this is wrong:

#1 - Brock is under contract for 1 more year. He can't "demand to be traded" and force the Broncos to trade him. They don't have to do anything. He has zero leverage.

He can demand a trade, Denver doesn’t have to trade him...then again your supposed future quarterback wants away from the organization by forcing him to stay it causes bad blood. Then again to keep him the next year you’d have to tag him and pay him 20.5 million (which is the expected tag price for quarterbacks in 2016).


#2 - If Peyton retires after this season, Brock will get the best chance he will ever have to succeed in this league. They're going to hand him the starting job and see if he can fill Peyton's shoes. He'll never have a better opportunity than he'll have here.

Brock can walk away after the season, he actually doesn’t have to play a down in Denver afterwards. He’ll get his best chance to succeed? Funny, quarterbacks succeed in a lot of places, he may not have a better opportunity in your opinion.


#3 - There is currently no trade market for him because he is completely untested. NO team is going to give up either players or draft picks for Brock Osweiler.

Bull****, this is a quarterback starved league in which teams look for a franchise quarterback from anywhere. Mallet in Houston? Flynn in Seattle? Keep touting that crap if you believe it.


#4 - At the end of his contract this year he becomes an unrestricted FA. At THAT point, some teams will be interested in him. But not now. Why should they pay a price now for a guy with ZERO proven ability, when he will become a FA at the end of the season?

Because they need a quarterback now and this class is one of the worst in recent memory, it’s pretty fundamental.


#5 - If Peyton returns for the 2016 season Brock will go elsewhere, but at this point it doesn't look like Peyton will play out his contract, unless he has more success this season than last.

True, but then again anything is possible, one way or another Manning is eventually done.


#6 - Brock Osweiler is in all probability a scrub. He's the #57 pick of the draft. There have been 118 QBs taken at #57 or later since Tom Brady was selected in the 6th round in 2000. Only ONE of them has ever been any good - Russell Wilson (3rd round). So, the chances that Osweiler is a franchise QB who can take a team to the SB are about 1 in 118. (Dishonorable mention late round drafted QBs - Andy Dalton, Kyle Orton, Matt Schaub and Nick Foles - and the others are all worse than that).

Cugel, two of those in contention as GOAT, one was a third round pick the other a sixth. Your argument is piss poor. Drew Brees, Brett Favre, Russell Wilson, Kurt Warner, Tom Brady and Joe Montana? Count the number of Super Bowl Championships between them. Yeah, you’re absolutely right, no one outside the first round has a freaking shot.


So, if Brock walks, big deal. It's as if Brian Griese wanted out of his contract in 2001 and was forcing the Broncos to sign another QB. So what's the downside? The chance that Brian Griese was going to become some kind of star and win the SB? :coffee:

So then again as I pointed out above, it’s all a gamble - but thus far you have little ground to stand on. Do you see either top quarterback in this class succeeding? But Osweiler has none? Okay...if you say so.


Brock is going to sit there and damn well wait. And then hope he has a good investment adviser to save all the money he's going to earn during in the 2 or 3 seasons he will be the Broncos starting QB.

He may or he may not, if he does so be it.

Lancane
02-11-2015, 12:21 PM
That's where statistics comes in Lancane. You can look at the odds just like Vegas does. And the odds say "not very damn likely." That's why Dove Valley is hoping that Mackie Shilstone can help rejuvenate Peyton's career:

I'd give that rehab a better shot than rolling with Brock Osweiler. That would be hilarious if Peyton tries to come back for another 11 years - until he's 50! :laugh:

Uh huh...yeah, okay...LMAO.

Lancane
02-11-2015, 12:24 PM
Peyton has taken us to the Super Bowl. Did we win? No. But, he can get us there again with the talent on this team. Kubiak and Peyton together can implement a system to work for one year. They both know how to adjust and come to something that can work and be successful. And, maybe Elway and Kubiak don't want Peyton back. I doubt that. John went looking for Peyton. Peyton wasn't crawling up the stairs of Dove Valley looking for a job. I could see a mutual ending, I guess. I don't see John telling him you have to go now Peyton, we are done with you. I can't see that. I'll never believe that.

I just don't see a separation from the Broncos and Manning at this point. And, I don't see Peyton playing for anybody except the Broncos. To move somewhere for one year is just stupid, in my opinion. Especially, Chicago. I'm not buying that one at all. Fox don't want a one year rental.

Fair argument, I still do not see it happening. But we can agree to disagree, and I am cool with that. I don't see him playing elsewhere to be honest, I was just stating that none of us have a clue of how this will play out.

Lancane
02-11-2015, 12:52 PM
In all honesty the reason I am so against Manning is not simply because I think he falls apart in big games. I truly believe that but I also admit he is a great quarterback and will likely always be overall better then Osweiler. The reason I am ready to move on to Osweiler is because I think Denver's best chances will be 2016 and 2017. Denver will have 60 plus million in open cap space? Imagine that for a minute, Oz will likely have some bumps and kinks that need ironed out, but Denver could literally place him squarely within rosters that make our current roster look more like Miami's, especially given Elway's history in free agency. Denver could literally be during those next few years the team to beat, prolonging the transition could cost Denver in more then one way, others will believe otherwise. But as I've long said to each their own, we all have things we believe that differ.

silkamilkamonico
02-11-2015, 12:57 PM
I used to love Osweiler - now i don' believe he will be Denver's future. That's probably the only reason I'm not ready to say goodbye to Manning yet.

Lancane
02-11-2015, 01:06 PM
I used to love Osweiler - now i don' believe he will be Denver's future. That's probably the only reason I'm not ready to say goodbye to Manning yet.

That is a pretty serious switch Silk, not sure what brought that about. But even so, I don't see Manning as the answer either. I have one former colleague that believes completely that Denver will take Garrett Grayson with the 28th Pick and trade Osweiler to Cleveland for a mid round pick this year and another next. So maybe you and him are on similar wave lengths that despite the so-called positive hoopla that Denver doesn't see him as the answer either. Who knows, but I think Elway needs to hitch himself to a different wagon because if he can not then Manning becomes his legacy which taints his own in some ways.

Traveler
02-11-2015, 01:12 PM
In all honesty the reason I am so against Manning is not simply because I think he falls apart in big games. I truly believe that but I also admit he is a great quarterback and will likely always be overall better then Osweiler. The reason I am ready to move on to Osweiler is because I think Denver's best chances will be 2016 and 2017. Denver will have 60 plus million in open cap space? Imagine that for a minute, Oz will likely have some bumps and kinks that need ironed out, but Denver could literally place him squarely within rosters that make our current roster look more like Miami's, especially given Elway's history in free agency. Denver could literally be during those next few years the team to beat, prolonging the transition could cost Denver in more then one way, others will believe otherwise. But as I've long said to each their own, we all have things we believe that differ.

This stigma has followed Manning since he was in college. Look what happened when he left Tennessee. Tee Martin wins a championship. If Manning does come back, my hope is that during his annoucement, he says this will be his last year. That way, the League can rig things so he can go out on top similar to Ray Lewis.

;) Just kidding on the last part! :D

Cugel
02-11-2015, 01:15 PM
He can demand a trade, Denver doesn’t have to trade him...
He has zero leverage. What other team is going to pay for a guy who's never seen the field? They might give him a contract if he's a FA. But, they're not going to give up a draft pick for him. That's just nuts. And it's totally academic because he's NOT going to demand a trade and Denver is NOT going to trade him and he has no trade value anyway.


Brock can walk away after the season, he actually doesn’t have to play a down in Denver afterwards. He’ll get his best chance to succeed? Funny, quarterbacks succeed in a lot of places, he may not have a better opportunity in your opinion.


That's not "my opinion." What other team is going to hand Brock the job, sight unseen? Nobody. Some other team may sign him and bring him in as a FA, but they're going to want him to compete and prove himself. Denver is the team that drafted him and John Elway is the guy who believes in him. Nobody else has a dime invested in Brock Osweiler.


Bull****, this is a quarterback starved league in which teams look for a franchise quarterback from anywhere. Mallet in Houston? Flynn in Seattle? Keep touting that crap if you believe it.

The guys you quote prove you're wrong. They were veterans with starting experience when they got those opportunities. And Matt Flynn obviously didn't get any guarantees in Seattle did he? He got out-competed by Russell Wilson and lost his job before the season even started.


Because they need a quarterback now and this class is one of the worst in recent memory, it’s pretty fundamental.


They need a PROVEN QB if they're going for a veteran. Not a guy who has never started a game. Again, you might take a flyer on a Brock as a FA, and design the contract so that you don't have to pay that much if he flames out and doesn't start for you, but you're not going to pay anything for him in trade.


Cugel, two of those in contention as GOAT, one was a third round pick the other a sixth. Your argument is piss poor. Drew Brees, Brett Favre, Russell Wilson, Kurt Warner, Tom Brady and Joe Montana? Count the number of Super Bowl Championships between them. Yeah, you’re absolutely right, no one outside the first round has a freaking shot.

Are you seriously going to go back to 1980 draft and Joe Montana? :laugh: Think how many QBs have been drafted since then?

Drew Brees was the #32 pick not #57. Big difference. Tom Brady was 15 years ago. Kurt Warner wasn't drafted at all. That's a completely different story. How many undrafted QBs are picked up for a look before training camp, are around long enough for a cup of coffee , and then released and you never hear from them again? Probably at least 10 guys every season. So, the chances there are substantially WORSE than drafting a QB after the 1st round. (10/year x 15 years = 150 and ONE guy succeeded).

If you want to argue that the odds are better than 1% you're flat wrong. :coffee:

I see Peyton Manning succeeding. Vegas agrees. They give the Broncos a 1 in 10 chance of winning the SB, as good or better odds than any other team in the NFL except New England and Seattle. With Osweiler? 1 in 50.

Cugel
02-11-2015, 01:22 PM
Quote Originally Posted by silkamilkamonico View Post
I used to love Osweiler - now i don' believe he will be Denver's future. That's probably the only reason I'm not ready to say goodbye to Manning yet.

Much shorter than my post and direct to the point. Peyton gives the Broncos the only chance they will have in probably the next 10 years. We've seen the history and we've been through all these arguments before: "Mike Shanahan is a great coach. The team just won a SB. They can compete for another with Brian Griese." Blah, blah, blah.

Shannon Sharpe spoke to his teammates prior to the 1999 season. He told them: "we're not that great. We just had a great Hall of Fame QB. We all need to play a lot better to make up for the fact that we don't have him any more." They didn't listen.

The fans aren't listening now.

Lancane
02-11-2015, 01:31 PM
That is all opinionative and you damn well know it Cugel, I've long agreed that first round quarterbacks have a better chance to succeed but that has changed when the first round quarterbacks are Manziel, Griffin, Weeden, Manuel, Locker, Gabbert, Ponder, Tebow, Bradford, Freeman, Sanchez, Russell, Quinn, Young, Leinart, Smith, Campbell, Boller, Leftwhich, etc., etc. Look at this years class, enough said. The only two I see as possibly being more are both likely to go early in the second round unless someone takes them late in the first. The formula has changed and has steadily been changing.

Bronco9798
02-11-2015, 01:40 PM
That is a pretty serious switch Silk, not sure what brought that about. But even so, I don't see Manning as the answer either. I have one former colleague that believes completely that Denver will take Garrett Grayson with the 28th Pick and trade Osweiler to Cleveland for a mid round pick this year and another next. So maybe you and him are on similar wave lengths that despite the so-called positive hoopla that Denver doesn't see him as the answer either. Who knows, but I think Elway needs to hitch himself to a different wagon because if he can not then Manning becomes his legacy which taints his own in some ways.

Manning won't be John's legacy. He'll be a part of it and overall it hasn't been a bad gamble. Peyton came in and gave us three AFC West titles, Sweeping division opponents year after year, and giving us hope. I'd rather sit through two 13-3 seasons, a 12-4, and a shot in the playoffs. The seasons were fun, but the post seasons have not been good. And, yes, I am not content with that in any way. I want Championships. I'm just saying it's been better than going 4-12, 3-13. 7-9 and having a miserable Sept, Oct, Nov, and Dec., I enjoy watching a good season. They come few and far in between. I've lived through them all for the last almost 40 years. I hate the ending the last 3 years, but Elway has nothing to be embarrassed about. His legacy is still in front of him as far as his current position goes. It's only started.

Northman
02-11-2015, 01:49 PM
This stigma has followed Manning since he was in college. Look what happened when he left Tennessee. Tee Martin wins a championship.

Yea, i used to laugh and root against Manning when he was at Tenn for that very fact. Watching Spurrier and the Gators basically own him during that time was a lot of fun.

Lancane
02-11-2015, 01:55 PM
Manning won't be John's legacy. He'll be a part of it and overall it hasn't been a bad gamble. Peyton came in and gave us three AFC West titles, Sweeping division opponents year after year, and giving us hope. I'd rather sit through two 13-3 seasons, a 12-4, and a shot in the playoffs. The seasons were fun, but the post seasons have not been good. And, yes, I am not content with that in any way. I want Championships. I'm just saying it's been better than going 4-12, 3-13. 7-9 and having a miserable Sept, Oct, Nov, and Dec., I enjoy watching a good season. They come few and far in between. I've lived through them all for the last almost 40 years. I hate the ending the last 3 years, but Elway has nothing to be embarrassed about. His legacy is still in front of him as far as his current position goes. It's only started.

If you never lose then you never know how to pick yourself up and battle that feeling and fight to win, winning makes you complacent and you'll accept just winning but will never strive to be greater then that. Nick Saban said that to the 1996 Michigan Spartans after losing to top ranked Nebraska.

Eventually we will have a new quarterback and will endure a .500 season or worse, maybe a tad better...but it will improve, if anything I believe Elway has shown that he is not for being complacent, but some things are inevitable.

TXBRONC
02-11-2015, 02:12 PM
Much shorter than my post and direct to the point. Peyton gives the Broncos the only chance they will have in probably the next 10 years. We've seen the history and we've been through all these arguments before: "Mike Shanahan is a great coach. The team just won a SB. They can compete for another with Brian Griese." Blah, blah, blah.

Shannon Sharpe spoke to his teammates prior to the 1999 season. He told them: "we're not that great. We just had a great Hall of Fame QB. We all need to play a lot better to make up for the fact that we don't have him any more." They didn't listen.

The fans aren't listening now.

I don't remember Sharpe saying any such thing. Also whatever fans think has no impact on the Broncos fortunes.

Bronco9798
02-11-2015, 02:24 PM
If you never lose then you never know how to pick yourself up and battle that feeling and fight to win, winning makes you complacent and you'll accept just winning but will never strive to be greater then that. Nick Saban said that to the 1996 Michigan Spartans after losing to top ranked Nebraska.

Eventually we will have a new quarterback and will endure a .500 season or worse, maybe a tad better...but it will improve, if anything I believe Elway has shown that he is not for being complacent, but some things are inevitable.

Sure. You're making more out of what I said than really needs to be. But, ok. I really have no interest in the Nick Saban thing either. But, whatever. Sure. You lost me. I just said I like the last 3 seasons for certain reasons and not winning the SB sucks. But you take it down any road you want brother!!! lol...

Lancane
02-11-2015, 02:29 PM
Sure. You're making more out of what I said than really needs to be. But, ok. I really have no interest in the Nick Saban thing either. But, whatever. Sure. You lost me. I just said I like the last 3 seasons for certain reasons and not winning the SB sucks. But you take it down any road you want brother!!! lol...

Simply sharing something said by a very tried and true coach, his take on needing to lose to stand taller. Sheesh...lol.

I got your point 9er, I was just saying that it will come to an end sooner rather then later but that we'll bounce back.

Bronco9798
02-11-2015, 02:33 PM
Simply sharing something said by a very tried and true coach, his take on needing to lose to stand taller. Sheesh...lol.

I got your point 9er, I was just saying that it will come to an end sooner rather then later but that we'll bounce back.

OK, lol,.sorry dude, I got lost in all that. lol...keep it simple man, I'm a very simple person, lol...I just say what come out like I'm talking. I'm not good with numbers, stats, etc., just my observation and what I think. And, I'm horrible at quotes!!!!!

Northman
02-11-2015, 02:34 PM
I don't remember Sharpe saying any such thing. Also whatever fans think has no impact on the Broncos fortunes.

I cant remember if Sharpe did or did not say that, however...

Judging by Cuge's statement there he couldnt be more wrong with his insinuation. Elway was good, he was good enough to carry a subpar team to 3 SB's before the team got exposed by much better well rounded squads. In the end, it was Elway who needed the rest of the team to step up. Guys like Sharpe, Davis, Griffith, Rod, Ed, Neil Smith, Darren Gordon, Atwater, etc all had to STEP UP to win those championships. Its how you win championships, the entire team has to buy in whether you have a HOF QB or not. In the end this year, it was a rookie who helped seal the deal for the Pats. Everyone plays their part so thank you Cugel "Mr. Capt Obvious" that it takes a team to win a championship and proving everyone's point.

TXBRONC
02-11-2015, 02:41 PM
I cant remember if Sharpe did or did not say that, however...

Judging by Cuge's statement there he couldnt be more wrong with his insinuation. Elway was good, he was good enough to carry a subpar team to 3 SB's before the team got exposed by much better well rounded squads. In the end, it was Elway who needed the rest of the team to step up. Guys like Sharpe, Davis, Griffith, Rod, Ed, Neil Smith, Darren Gordon, Atwater, etc all had to STEP UP to win those championships. Its how you win championships, the entire team has to buy in whether you have a HOF QB or not. In the end this year, it was a rookie who helped seal the deal for the Pats. Everyone plays their part so thank you Cugel "Mr. Capt Obvious" that it takes a team to win a championship and proving everyone's point.

When Elway was hurt in'98 Sharpe told Brister he was being given the keys to the Ferrari just don't strip the gears and we'll be fine. That's the polar opposite of we're not that good.

Simple Jaded
02-11-2015, 10:43 PM
Garret Grayson is not a 1st round talent.

Lancane
02-13-2015, 01:43 AM
Garret Grayson is not a 1st round talent.

Most would agree with that assessment Jaded, of course neither was Tebow to be fair, or Locker, or Weeden, neither was Cutler or Flacco before their respective drafts...then again to be fair nether was Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Brett Favre or Joe Montana.

Northman
02-13-2015, 07:56 AM
Most would agree with that assessment Jaded, of course neither was Tebow to be fair, or Locker, or Weeden, neither was Cutler or Flacco before their respective drafts...then again to be fair nether was Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Brett Favre or Joe Montana.

Most i agree with but everything i had ever read about Cutler had him as a top 10 pick. It was him, Leinart, and Young going early in that draft. I dont ever remember Jay being graded outside of the first round let alone the top 10.

Ravage!!!
02-13-2015, 11:12 AM
Most i agree with but everything i had ever read about Cutler had him as a top 10 pick. It was him, Leinart, and Young going early in that draft. I dont ever remember Jay being graded outside of the first round let alone the top 10.

I believe that is why Denver moved up to get him when they did, feeling pretty confident that the team within the next two picks were going to take him.

Al Wilson 4 Mayor
02-13-2015, 11:27 AM
I've had a change of heart in the last few days. I was sort of 50\50 on how I felt about Manning returning.

Now, I want the old man to return.
I want 5000 yards passing this year.
I want 80 TD's.
I want to go to NE for the AFC championship; winning 352-0.

I don't care about his physical decline. I'm rooting for the old man to pull something for the ages off. This is why I watch football. I want to be inspired. I want to believe that people can achieve things against the odds. It's why I love Boise State so much.

Go Manning
Go Broncos
Go America

God bless

Hardwired
02-13-2015, 12:09 PM
Ross Tucker ‏@RossTuckerNFL (https://twitter.com/RossTuckerNFL)3 hours ago (https://twitter.com/RossTuckerNFL/status/566231821307101184)
League source thinks Peyton may be in talks to restructure contract to help Broncos keep the Thomases, Knighton, etc. Possible?

Ross Tucker ‏@RossTuckerNFL (https://twitter.com/RossTuckerNFL)2 hours ago (https://twitter.com/RossTuckerNFL/status/566253927327203328)
No brainer. RT: @corryjoel (https://twitter.com/corryjoel): Assuming a simple restructure (no pay cut), a max of $9.015M in cap space can be created with Peyton's deal

Bronco9798
02-13-2015, 03:40 PM
I've had a change of heart in the last few days. I was sort of 50\50 on how I felt about Manning returning.

Now, I want the old man to return.
I want 5000 yards passing this year.
I want 80 TD's.
I want to go to NE for the AFC championship; winning 352-0.

I don't care about his physical decline. I'm rooting for the old man to pull something for the ages off. This is why I watch football. I want to be inspired. I want to believe that people can achieve things against the odds. It's why I love Boise State so much.

Go Manning
Go Broncos
Go America

God bless

He gives us the best chance to win. Period!! Good for you!! Oz can wait.

Lancane
02-13-2015, 03:55 PM
Most i agree with but everything i had ever read about Cutler had him as a top 10 pick. It was him, Leinart, and Young going early in that draft. I dont ever remember Jay being graded outside of the first round let alone the top 10.

While I was just doing that to get a rise out of him, I do agree with what he said. Nor am I that upset about Osweiler (you know me, I like a good row) but the nature of the business is strangely awkward at times, kids rise and fall, people fall in love with certain players, etc. and draft accordingly.

And before the Senior Bowl and Combine Jay Cutler was a second round graded pick, Mike Mayock was the first to say he could launch himself into the first give a good Senior Bowl and Combine, and he did.

Bronco9798
02-13-2015, 04:02 PM
While I was just doing that to get a rise out of him, I do agree with what he said. Nor am I that upset about Osweiler (you know me, I like a good row) but the nature of the business is strangely awkward at times, kids rise and fall, people fall in love with certain players, etc. and draft accordingly.

And before the Senior Bowl and Combine Jay Cutler was a second round graded pick, Mike Mayock was the first to say he could launch himself into the first give a good Senior Bowl and Combine, and he did.

If I remember right, I think Shanny and Jeff fisher were talking and Fisher was very high on Cutler as well at that time. The Broncos had no contact with Cutler at all before the draft either.

Lancane
02-13-2015, 04:11 PM
If I remember right, I think Shanny and Jeff fisher were talking and Fisher was very high on Cutler as well at that time. The Broncos had no contact with Cutler at all before the draft either.

You're absolutely correct, Cutler had no idea that Denver had any interest.

Northman
02-13-2015, 04:18 PM
I've had a change of heart in the last few days. I was sort of 50\50 on how I felt about Manning returning.

Now, I want the old man to return.
I want 5000 yards passing this year.
I want 80 TD's.
I want to go to NE for the AFC championship; winning 352-0.

I don't care about his physical decline. I'm rooting for the old man to pull something for the ages off. This is why I watch football. I want to be inspired. I want to believe that people can achieve things against the odds. It's why I love Boise State so much.

Go Manning
Go Broncos
Go America

God bless

Well, technically he already pulled off something special in 2013, we just didnt finish with a championship. :D

Simple Jaded
02-14-2015, 01:56 AM
Most would agree with that assessment Jaded, of course neither was Tebow to be fair, or Locker, or Weeden, neither was Cutler or Flacco before their respective drafts...then again to be fair nether was Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Brett Favre or Joe Montana.

He picked a good year to be a thoroughly average prospect, considering the dearth of talent available in FA and draft.

Lancane
02-14-2015, 03:23 AM
He picked a good year to be a thoroughly average prospect, considering the dearth of talent available in FA and draft.

LOL... I agree, and the sad thing is that I think he and Petty might be the better pro options out of 'most' of the other quarterbacks in this class and that tells you how weak it is. Most of this class has bust written all over them, hell it's tattooed on them to be honest (skin deep). Petty looks to be the next Jake Plummer so he could be both good and bad, one thing I like about Grayson is that he leads receivers well, a lot like Aaron Rodgers does, but he reminds me more of Ryan Tannehill to be honest.

Depending on the offense Denver builds for Manning and their true outlook on Osweiler, the one quarterback that the Broncos should possibly look at is Sean Mannion. He's got a big arm and can make most NFL throws with ease, he does hold on to the ball too long and isn't very mobile but then neither is Manning. He reminds me a lot of Cutler, more mature though and with more some upside but lacks the footwork and mobility - if Denver can create a hybrid west coast offense that suits Manning then Mannion might be the ideal fit in such a scheme. Despite his draft grade I think Mannion will jump into the mid rounds amid the weak class, he's my sleeper quarterback and in the right system he might become the best of this class to be quite honest.