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Denver Native (Carol)
01-13-2015, 03:37 PM
Offensive coordinator Gary Kubiak's previously announced plans to remain with the Ravens haven't changed, coach John Harbaugh said during a news conference Tuesday afternoon.

Harbaugh indicated that "as far as he knows," Kubiak hasn't changed his mind even with the Denver Broncos' head-coaching vacancy and will return for next season.

"I'm planning on Gary being back," Harbaugh said. "I'm not anticipating that changing at this time. He's told me he's planning on being here. Denver hasn't reached out in any way at this time."

rest - http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/ravens-insider/bal-harbaugh-says-he-knows-of-no-change-on-gary-kubiaks-plans-spagnuolo-to-interview-with-giants-20150113-story.html

Al Wilson 4 Mayor
01-13-2015, 03:51 PM
Right, because the Broncos haven't called. That would likely change if Elway called.

shank
01-13-2015, 04:11 PM
I thought it was being reported that we had requested an interview with Kubes.

Buff
01-13-2015, 04:28 PM
I thought it was being reported that we had requested an interview with Kubes.

Just semantics. Schefter said that we "will" request permission to interview Kubiak. Elway said during his presser that we hadn't reached out to anyone for interviews yet, but that he'd get started immediately after the press conference.

If I were laying odds, Kubiak would be the favorite to get the job.

Ravage!!!
01-13-2015, 04:35 PM
All that statment means is "as of right now, I haven't seen Kubiak agree to be a HC." Nothing more.

BroncoWave
01-13-2015, 04:41 PM
Still don't get the fascination with bringing in Kubes. We get rid of Fox because of his teams failures in the playoffs and the answer is to bring in a guy who was let go from his last team due to several poor performances in the playoffs?

Slick
01-13-2015, 04:48 PM
Still don't get the fascination with bringing in Kubes. We get rid of Fox because of his teams failures in the playoffs and the answer is to bring in a guy who was let go from his last team due to several poor performances in the playoffs?

Agreed. I hope Kubiak isn't the next Denver coach. Especially if manning sticks around. Could you imagine Manning trying to run a bootleg?

Ravage!!!
01-13-2015, 04:50 PM
Still don't get the fascination with bringing in Kubes. We get rid of Fox because of his teams failures in the playoffs and the answer is to bring in a guy who was let go from his last team due to several poor performances in the playoffs?

I'm with you. I think Kubiak showed that he can't seem to elevate a team.

But... considering he was Elways back-up and friend. Considering he was the OC in Denver when Elway won the Championships, and considering he's done a great job as the OC in Baltimore..... its hard not to see him as the front runner.

The ONLY positive I can see on the idea of Kubiak is that sometimes a coach does better after leaving his first coaching gig. Belicheck, Coughlin, Gruden, Carroll, are all examples of recent coaches that have won Super Bowls after leaving or getting fired from their first HC gigs.

Joel
01-13-2015, 04:52 PM
The same guy said Flacco's the NFLs best QB *couRodgersgh*. "As far as I know" is a huge qualifier for anyone not omniscient, and it's not even true here: He "knows" what he's got, and that Elway "knows" it better than anyone. He's succeeded with all three teams he coached, first as OC for our champs, then taking a cellar-dwelling 6-year-old expansion team to its first winning season, division title and playoff wins EVER, now with resurrecting a Ravens offense that has Flacco at QB, lost its best WR a year ago and has its starting RB suspended indefinitely.

Just for the record: No, Schaub having a season-ending injury so rookie last round pick TJ Yates won a playoff game, then having a season-long career-ending flameout of Plummereque proportions doesn't change any of that. Schaub was an awful QB who played himself and Kubiak out of a job, but even HE managed a few decent looking seasons first thanks to Kubiaks system.

It should also be noted Dennison's been an equally good OC, STs, offensive line and QB coach everywhere HE went, which was everywhere Kubes went, and Elway remembers that experience, too. Kubes would be an awesome BOGO, regaining nearly all the assets that transformed Elway from All Time Best REGULAR Season QB to 11th hour champion, without all the awkwardness of giving orders to the former boss who manipulated him into getting Reeves fired before getting him over the SB hump. Balancing Kubes' ego with Elways and Mannings would be far easier than balancing Shannys.

Buff
01-13-2015, 04:52 PM
Still don't get the fascination with bringing in Kubes. We get rid of Fox because of his teams failures in the playoffs and the answer is to bring in a guy who was let go from his last team due to several poor performances in the playoffs?

If I put myself in Elway's shoes - he probably credits Kubiak for a lot of the success we had during out championship years. He wasn't available as a candidate during our first search. He has head coaching experience. He's probably someone that Manning would be comfortable with (not some Johnny Come Lately). He has ties to the organization and a personal relationship with Elway...

I'm not saying we should hire him - I'm just saying there are a lot of reasons why Elway might want to.

VonDoom
01-13-2015, 04:53 PM
Still don't get the fascination with bringing in Kubes. We get rid of Fox because of his teams failures in the playoffs and the answer is to bring in a guy who was let go from his last team due to several poor performances in the playoffs?

He'd be better at game planning, that's for sure. I worry about the perception that our team is "soft" though. Does Kubiak really change that?

Joel
01-13-2015, 05:15 PM
Still don't get the fascination with bringing in Kubes. We get rid of Fox because of his teams failures in the playoffs and the answer is to bring in a guy who was let go from his last team due to several poor performances in the playoffs?
Several poor performances in the playoffs? The first time Houston EVER made the playoffs they beat Cincy with rookie QB TJ Freakin' Yates starting after Schaub went on IR and Leinart joined him 1˝ games later. It's Kubiaks fault a rookie last round QB in his 8th career start couldn't beat the #2 seeded Ravens' elite D on the road? They lost by 7, not 70; what do ya'll want from the guy? Then they lost on the road against the defending Conference Champ Pats; who hasn't? Give Kubes a QB who doesn't combine Kyle Ortons scrambling with Jake Plummers ball protection and I guarantee he does better.

NightTrainLayne
01-13-2015, 05:22 PM
Belicheck, Coughlin, Gruden, Carroll, are all examples of recent coaches that have won Super Bowls after leaving or getting fired from their first HC gigs.

Belicheck, Coughlin, Gruden, Carroll. . . Shanahan.

GEM
01-13-2015, 05:39 PM
Head coaching a long standing franchise is a whole lot different than coaching a start up like Houston. In all honesty, he did a damn good job with what he had in front of him.

I'd take Kubiak....get some Mile High Magic goin....welcome back revenge tour activated.

aberdien
01-13-2015, 05:39 PM
I would be fine with Kubiak. In terms of temperament he doesn't seem like much of an upgrade from Fox, but he seems more...innovative? Maybe that's the right word.

BroncoWave
01-13-2015, 05:43 PM
To me, it seems like the biggest problem with this team was motivation. We saw it in the Super Bowl and we saw it this week. We have the talent in place. Now we just need someone who can get the guys more fired up to play. I'm just not sure Kubes fits that bill. Now maybe I'm wrong and he is some master motivator, but I just don't see it. If that's Elway's guy though I will support him and hope like hell that I am wrong. As Rav said, there is hope in that some of the greatest SB winning coaches struggled and were let go at their first gig.

wayninja
01-13-2015, 05:46 PM
John Harbaugh says he knows of no change in Gary Kubiak's plan to return

Exactly. We have him right where we want him.

BroncoJoe
01-13-2015, 05:52 PM
To me, it seems like the biggest problem with this team was motivation. We saw it in the Super Bowl and we saw it this week. We have the talent in place. Now we just need someone who can get the guys more fired up to play. I'm just not sure Kubes fits that bill. Now maybe I'm wrong and he is some master motivator, but I just don't see it. If that's Elway's guy though I will support him and hope like hell that I am wrong. As Rav said, there is hope in that some of the greatest SB winning coaches struggled and were let go at their first gig.

After some thought, I'm not sure I agree anymore. There are a lot of successful coaches that are polar opposites of Pete Carroll. Belichick is a corpse, or Tomlinson who rarely shows emotion. Mike McCarthy, Chuck Pagano, or Andy Reid. Maybe it's more about getting the most out of your players, calling the right plays and not being their "friend".

BroncoWave
01-13-2015, 05:55 PM
After some thought, I'm not sure I agree anymore. There are a lot of successful coaches that are polar opposites of Pete Carroll. Belichick is a corpse, or Tomlinson who rarely shows emotion. Mike McCarthy, Chuck Pagano, or Andy Reid. Maybe it's more about getting the most out of your players, calling the right plays and not being their "friend".

I wasn't really referring to being their friend. I was more referring to someone who will give them a kick in the pants and motivate them to play up to their potential. Belchick and Tomlin are definitely good at doing that. I hope Kubes is too if that's our guy.

silkamilkamonico
01-13-2015, 05:57 PM
I'm not sure how I feel about the coaches motivating thing. Like what the analyst said, if you have to motive the players to play, especially the playoffs, you have the wrong players. Not saying that we have the wrong players, but I don't know how much stock I would put into a motivator.

Runamok
01-13-2015, 06:01 PM
After some thought, I'm not sure I agree anymore. There are a lot of successful coaches that are polar opposites of Pete Carroll. Belichick is a corpse, or Tomlinson who rarely shows emotion. Mike McCarthy, Chuck Pagano, or Andy Reid. Maybe it's more about getting the most out of your players, calling the right plays and not being their "friend".


Not being their friend is cardinal Rule #1.

Runamok
01-13-2015, 06:04 PM
I'm not sure how I feel about the coaches motivating thing. Like what the analyst said, if you have to motive the players to play, especially the playoffs, you have the wrong players. Not saying that we have the wrong players, but I don't know how much stock I would put into a motivator.

Rah Rah motivation, no good. 'Do you want to keep your job' motivation, that's the attitude you need in pro football.

Joel
01-13-2015, 06:07 PM
Kubiak's always struck me as quietly intense. Maybe it was all the times I saw him hunched over on the Houston sideline, chin in hand, glaring at the field as if trying to get one of Schaubs air balls to Andre Johnson telekinetically. Maybe it was the similarity between that pose and the one Shanny so often adopts during games. Just because he's not expressive onfield doesn't mean he's no motivator; Fox hopped around the field like a rabid rabbit, clapping at players and yelling at refs, but was everybodys favorite uncle to the team. Manning yelled at guys for poor execution more than Fox ever did.

One thing I'm pretty sure of though is that luring Manning back to chase that championship carrot on a stick across "the frozen tundra of Mile High Stadium" would be far easier with a QB-friendly coach and staff.

vettesplus
01-13-2015, 06:10 PM
I thought it was being reported that we had requested an interview with Kubes.

that's all the media goons reporting false reports

Simple Jaded
01-14-2015, 03:53 AM
Still don't get the fascination with bringing in Kubes. We get rid of Fox because of his teams failures in the playoffs and the answer is to bring in a guy who was let go from his last team due to several poor performances in the playoffs?

Well, he's no Josh McDaniels but at least he got a team to the PO's.

DenBronx
01-14-2015, 04:08 AM
I want to know why fans think Kubiak, who didn't get it done in Houston, would be any better than Fox?

Simple Jaded
01-14-2015, 04:15 AM
I want to know why fans think Kubiak, who didn't get it done in Houston, would be any better than Fox?

I don't know that he is but I don't think coaches should be One-and-done either. Hell, McDaniels is going to get another shot at it and if there's one HC who "didn't get it done" better than Doogie I'd like to hear about it.

Lancane
01-14-2015, 04:16 AM
I don't know that he is but I don't think coaches should be One-and-done either. Hell, McDaniels is going to get another shot at it and if there's one HC who "didn't get it done" better than Doogie I'd like to hear about it.

At the rate this looks to be going for Denver, Doogie might get another look in Denver! :shocked:

Simple Jaded
01-14-2015, 04:36 AM
At the rate this looks to be going for Denver, Doogie might get another look in Denver! :shocked:

Didn't you just say you were pessimistic about the teams coaching during the season? Cause it sounds like you're basically making Elway and Manning the Posterboy for everything holding this team back.

Lancane
01-14-2015, 04:55 AM
Didn't you just say you were pessimistic about the teams coaching during the season? Cause it sounds like you're basically making Elway and Manning the Posterboy for everything holding this team back.

It was a joke Jaded, quite overreacting to every comment. I don't believe that Elway is holding the team back, but I believe that he will be viewed outside the fan base as someone who is because he does not have a friend running a P.R. campaign on his behalf as Fox does with Jay Glazier and despite what I believe, being tight lipped and politically correct as he is, he is therein allowing crap to coat his own shoes while Fox looks to be the victim. Some outlets are reporting that Elway outright fired Fox for not being good enough right now! The jackass wasn't fired though, but the view outside the fandom will be effected by such reports. As for Manning, it's much the same, right now people are hearing he has all this input, that the Broncos want him to return, that in around about way any candidate is tied to Manning, but not all coaches will have the G.O.A.T opinion of Manning as some of the fans do, they see the issues that he's struggled with in the post-season for years and years. As I said in the other thread, fans do not always see everything because of our loyalty to an organization as fans.

DenBronx
01-14-2015, 06:20 AM
I want to know why fans think Kubiak, who didn't get it done in Houston, would be any better than Fox?

I don't know that he is but I don't think coaches should be One-and-done either. Hell, McDaniels is going to get another shot at it and if there's one HC who "didn't get it done" better than Doogie I'd like to hear about it.

He's 2 and done. McDoosh already got a 2nd chance. Kubes hasn't. Id put more faith in Kubes doing better his 2nd time around than McDummy ever getting it right.

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 10:52 AM
He's 2 and done. McDoosh already got a 2nd chance. Kubes hasn't. Id put more faith in Kubes doing better his 2nd time around than McDummy ever getting it right.

McDoosh hasn't had a 2nd HC job. He just went to another team to be the OC. Seems that when he isn't sucking the nipple of Belicheck and Brady, things don't go very well for him, so he ran home. He'll get another shot, but I'm bettting he fails because he just thinks WAYYYY too much of himself and can't get along with people.

capt. Jack
01-14-2015, 11:35 AM
A couple years ago, under Kubes the Texans were the favorite to win the Super Bowl, then they had injuries, and the wheels fell off!
He deserves a shot at running the team, HE was a big part of the Broncos winning 2 Super Bowls!

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 11:47 AM
A couple years ago, under Kubes the Texans were the favorite to win the Super Bowl, then they had injuries, and the wheels fell off!
He deserves a shot at running the team, HE was a big part of the Broncos winning 2 Super Bowls!

Yeah, but Kubes continued to fail in Houston. Always having this "high ratings" as far as where they should go. Having just 3 winning seasons while in Houston for 7 years, and being 1-n-done in the two playoff appearances.

So although he was a big part of our Super Bowl success, doesn't mean he can be a good HC. Besides, from what I'm hearing, if you were coaching back then, the game has passed you by!

chazoe60
01-14-2015, 11:49 AM
Yeah, but Kubes continued to fail in Houston. Always having this "high ratings" as far as where they should go. Having just 3 winning seasons while in Houston for 7 years, and being 1-n-done in the two playoff appearances.

So although he was a big part of our Super Bowl success, doesn't mean he can be a good HC. Besides, from what I'm hearing, if you were coaching back then, the game has passed you by!
Was not one and done Rav. He won 2 playoff games while with Houston, the first and only playoff victories in their history.

Bronco9798
01-14-2015, 11:52 AM
Yeah, but Kubes continued to fail in Houston. Always having this "high ratings" as far as where they should go. Having just 3 winning seasons while in Houston for 7 years, and being 1-n-done in the two playoff appearances.

So although he was a big part of our Super Bowl success, doesn't mean he can be a good HC. Besides, from what I'm hearing, if you were coaching back then, the game has passed you by!

Kubiak has never left the game. The game hasn't passed him by. He knows what's going on. You be smoking too much catnip with that statement.

CoachChaz
01-14-2015, 11:53 AM
Kubiak has never left the game. The game hasn't passed him by. He knows what's going on. You be smoking too much catnip with that statement.

I think the success of the Baltimore offense this year is verifiable proof of this.

silkamilkamonico
01-14-2015, 11:54 AM
Serious concerns about Kubes health and ability to be a head coach with the stress, which is speculated why he has come out and stated he isn't leaving Baltimore. I guess the guy had a heart attack couple years ago.

Vic is talking about it on his show - says Gase and Elway didn't even discuss the job and there's a reason for that, and he is all but signed, sealed, and delivered in SF. Says Kubes is ELways far and away #1 but things would have to be discussed between the 2 - and that's if Kubes even has any interest. Says if Kubes isn't the guy there is no known 2nd option and with slim pickings it could get very interesting and become a bad situation quickly.

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 12:05 PM
Seems like a LOT of speculations by Vic.

Lancane
01-14-2015, 12:09 PM
Denver has officially asked to speak to Austin according to the NFLN, it is so far their only official request. I have to wonder if Elway is hoping this covers the Rooney Rule, but at the same time might make Atlanta jump and sign him before they can meet with Quinn.

Krugan
01-14-2015, 12:11 PM
I dont think Kubiak is wanting to head coach, and im guessing we will find out before the week is out just that.

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 12:12 PM
Kubiak has never left the game. The game hasn't passed him by. He knows what's going on. You be smoking too much catnip with that statement.

It was a stab at those suggesting the "game" has passed any of the coaches by. It's a ridiculous statement for many reasons. Which is why I typed "from what I hear..."

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 12:13 PM
Was not one and done Rav. He won 2 playoff games while with Houston, the first and only playoff victories in their history.

You're right Chaz...I remembered them losing the division playoff game, but forgot he won the wildcard games. My bad.

chazoe60
01-14-2015, 12:14 PM
You're right Chaz...I remembered them losing the division playoff game, but forgot he won the wildcard games. My bad.

Just don't let it happen again. ;)

silkamilkamonico
01-14-2015, 12:20 PM
Seems like a LOT of speculations by Vic.

Why is that? Not that he's been wrong before but the guy did have a heart attack/stroke, or something of that nature, during a football game and was carted off.

VonDoom
01-14-2015, 12:26 PM
Serious concerns about Kubes health and ability to be a head coach with the stress, which is speculated why he has come out and stated he isn't leaving Baltimore. I guess the guy had a heart attack couple years ago.


His health issue happened right around the same time as Fox's last year.

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 12:27 PM
Why is that? Not that he's been wrong before but the guy did have a heart attack/stroke, or something of that nature, during a football game and was carted off.

I just mean he's speculating that Kubiak doesn't want another HC job,and that is why. And, he's speculating that Kubiak is the ONLY prospect we have, and that we haven't talked with him at all, and that we don't even have a #2 prospect. ALLLL of that is nothing but speculation.

Joel
01-14-2015, 01:18 PM
Yeah, but Kubes continued to fail in Houston. Always having this "high ratings" as far as where they should go. Having just 3 winning seasons while in Houston for 7 years, and being 1-n-done in the two playoff appearances.
Kubiaks Texans were NEVER one-and-done, and won the franchises first playoff game EVER with a rookie 7th round QB starting the last half of the season because Schaub went on IR Week 6 and Leinart followed Week 8. However much he may or may not have lost, Peyton Manning's WAY better than a rookie TJ Yates, especially if he has a Kubiak-Dennison offensive line protecting him and providing run support.

"Continued to fail"? He had all of ONE losing season after his first year, and that was because Schaub started the season with a RECORD-BREAKING string of games throwing pick-sixes, then (as capt. Jack noted) Arian Foster, Owen Daniels and Brian Cushing all went to IR. What's he supposed to do when his QB's goes China Syndrome and practically the whole offense is out for the year? Ride Ben Tate and have an aging Andre Johnson throw himself passes? Remember, that was a 5-year-old 2-14 expansion team when he got there, and Kubiaks record went

6-10 (4 win improvement)
8-8 (francises first non-losing season EVER)
8-8
9-7 (franchises first winning season EVER)
10-6 (franchise first playoff, division title and playoff win EVER, despite playing the last half of the season with Ryan Lindley 1.0 after they lost Schaub and Leinart)
12-4
2-14 as Schaub played himself and his coach out of a job while three Pro Bowlers watched on crutches.


So although he was a big part of our Super Bowl success, doesn't mean he can be a good HC. Besides, from what I'm hearing, if you were coaching back then, the game has passed you by!
He wasn't JUST a big part of our SB success, he's succeeded with ALL THREE TEAMS he ever coached; we were just the first. Given how he resurrected Houston and now Baltimores offense after helping Elway get over the SB hump, while Shanny fell flat on his face in his first post-Denver coaching job, it's fair to ask which one of them was the real difference in our only championships.

Many people understimate just how BAD NFL expansion teams are, and for how long. Sure, the Jags and Panthers got within a game of the SB their second season, but within just three years of that both came crashing back to earth and got their inaugural coaches fired (one of whom has since won SBs against the Pats TWICE with an established franchise, so I don't think he's the reason Jax has sucked ever since.)

That's despite the '96 expansion teams benefiting from an "expansive" expansion draft because the NFL didn't want to create two more eternal dumpster fires as they had with Atlanta, New Orleans, Seattle and Tampa. It took 30 years for ANY of those teams to stop being laughing stocks long enough to win a SB, but the NFL overcompensated with Jax and Carolina, realized it, and didn't give Houston or Cleveland nearly as many starting advantages.

Yet Kubiak's a "continued failure" because he ENDED a 5-year-old teams "continued" losing seasons, then got them two straight division titles and playoff wins with TJ Yates and Matt Schaub as his QB?

Al Wilson 4 Mayor
01-14-2015, 01:20 PM
Elway better be careful. There's no way he's had time to interview any minority candidates.

On another note, I sure hope we can retain Studesville

BroncoWave
01-14-2015, 01:28 PM
Elway better be careful. There's no way he's had time to interview any minority candidates.

On another note, I sure hope we can retain Studesville

Teryl Austin from Detroit is the minority candidate we will be interviewing.

TXBRONC
01-14-2015, 01:38 PM
Yeah, but Kubes continued to fail in Houston. Always having this "high ratings" as far as where they should go. Having just 3 winning seasons while in Houston for 7 years, and being 1-n-done in the two playoff appearances.

So although he was a big part of our Super Bowl success, doesn't mean he can be a good HC. Besides, from what I'm hearing, if you were coaching back then, the game has passed you by!

There is a big difference in having a Peyton Manning as your starting quarterback and Matt Schaub.

Joel
01-14-2015, 01:49 PM
There is a big difference in having a Peyton Manning as your starting quarterback and Matt Schaub.
A difference so big I really wanted Manning to go to Houston, because they had a championship roster to put around him, stacked everywhere EXCEPT QB, while we had far more holes than I thought we could fill in 2-3 yrs. I give Elway full and high marks for coming closer than I ever dreamed possible, but lacking a line anywhere near as good as Schaub wasted doomed us. Maybe not too late to correct though.

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 01:58 PM
Yet Kubiak's a "continued failure" because he ENDED a 5-year-old teams "continued" losing seasons, then got them two straight division titles and playoff wins with TJ Yates and Matt Schaub as his QB?

I'm not going to get into this debate with you on who was/is better Kubiak or Shanahan as HC. Shanahan had MUCH more success in the ten years after Elway (and sharpe, and Davis) than Kubiak had in Houston. Please, don't give me the comparisons of the Houston expansion to those of Atlanta, New Orleans, Seattle and Tampa when those were the days BEFORE Freen Agency and BEFORE Salary Cap. Its not even a fair comparison. The Expansion teams today have had MUCH more benefits and have every reason to be competiing by the time Kubiak took over.

You might be impressed by his 8-8 seasons early, or his 2 playoff appearances..... You think he was fired because the Texans were THRILLED with what he was doing with the TALENT he had on their team? No. It's because he continued to fail with the talent he had on his team. Same reason Dungy was fired in Tampa. Same reason many coaches are fired in the NFL. He continued to fail despite having a roster that is felt to have done better.

Now I know, none of the GMs on the Texans were nearly as good as you are.... but apparently they weren't anamored with what he had done. Perhaps you can write your "but but but" post to them.

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 02:00 PM
There is a big difference in having a Peyton Manning as your starting quarterback and Matt Schaub.

Ok... but what's that have to do with our team? Do we have Manning, and WILL we have Manning? Would we be hiring Kubiak for just one year if we DO have Manning? I don't know what your point is, really.

TXBRONC
01-14-2015, 02:04 PM
Ok... but what's that have to do with our team? Do we have Manning, and WILL we have Manning? Would we be hiring Kubiak for just one year if we DO have Manning? I don't know what your point is, really.

Right now why would anyone assume Manning won't be here he's under contract for two more years iirc? That doesn't mean things can change in hurry but as right he's still the starting quarterback of the Denver Broncos.

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 02:09 PM
Right now why would anyone assume Manning won't be here he's under contract for two more years iirc? That doesn't mean things can change in hurry but as right he's still the starting quarterback of the Denver Broncos.

Why would anyone assume? Because Manning himself hasn't stated he will be back. If it was a foregone conclusion that he would, I think he would say "Yes, I'm coming back"...but there are a LOT of questions around that. One, Manning and his injury. It could be something that could keep him out. The fact that he's 38 and knows it takes just that muchMORE work to get it done could keep him out. The fact that we were right there for 3 years, and it didn't happen. Players eventually come to the realization that they had their last shot.

I certainly don't feel confident that Manning will be back. Certainly not confident enough that I would put money on it...which is what anyone would be doing if they simply assumed that to be the case when coaching or hiring. Being under contract doesn't really mean much, just means he can't go play for someone else.

TXBRONC
01-14-2015, 02:29 PM
Why would anyone assume? Because Manning himself hasn't stated he will be back. If it was a foregone conclusion that he would, I think he would say "Yes, I'm coming back"...but there are a LOT of questions around that. One, Manning and his injury. It could be something that could keep him out. The fact that he's 38 and knows it takes just that muchMORE work to get it done could keep him out. The fact that we were right there for 3 years, and it didn't happen. Players eventually come to the realization that they had their last shot.

I certainly don't feel confident that Manning will be back. Certainly not confident enough that I would put money on it...which is what anyone would be doing if they simply assumed that to be the case when coaching or hiring. Being under contract doesn't really mean much, just means he can't go play for someone else.

If I'm not mistaken it wasn't but a month or so ago it was reported was unequivocal in saying he was going to come back. Granted the most statement from Manning was noncommittal at best but until actually says he's not and the fact he still has a contract I think he'll back.

Bronco9798
01-14-2015, 02:35 PM
If I'm not mistaken it wasn't but a month or so ago it was reported was unequivocal in saying he was going to come back. Granted the most statement from Manning was noncommittal at best but until actually says he's not and the fact he still has a contract I think he'll back.

Manning was asked during his weekly news conference Wednesday if there were a set of circumstances that would lead him to retire after the playoffs.

"I have not thought about those circumstances at all," Manning replied. "So, I certainly plan on being back, if the Broncos will have me. But at this point, I'm kind of thinking about Oakland."


Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20141225_NFL___Peyton_Manning__I_ll_be_back_in__15 .html#kYLsYQ1teLjLpejI.99

Bronco9798
01-14-2015, 02:36 PM
However, things change.

TXBRONC
01-14-2015, 02:51 PM
Manning was asked during his weekly news conference Wednesday if there were a set of circumstances that would lead him to retire after the playoffs.

"I have not thought about those circumstances at all," Manning replied. "So, I certainly plan on being back, if the Broncos will have me. But at this point, I'm kind of thinking about Oakland."


Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20141225_NFL___Peyton_Manning__I_ll_be_back_in__15 .html#kYLsYQ1teLjLpejI.99

That's it.

CoachChaz
01-14-2015, 02:56 PM
The NFL would be a much different place if EVERY coach that had a less than stellar first run as a Head Coach wasnt ever given a 2nd opportunity.

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 03:16 PM
The NFL would be a much different place if EVERY coach that had a less than stellar first run as a Head Coach wasnt ever given a 2nd opportunity.

Agreed. As I've said, the nice positive about the possibility of Kubiak to Denver is that many of our better coaches are those that are on their second, or more, teams. .. Belicheck, Carrol, Dungy, Gruden, Shanahan, Coughlin, and even Vermeil were all coaches that have 1 more Super Bowls recently that were coaching at their 2nd or so teams.

capt. Jack
01-14-2015, 03:37 PM
I know this sounds a little crazy but here goes, Kubiak Head Coach, Mike Shanahan O/C and assistant head coach, and Shanahan's buddy from San Fran that D/C they are talking about?
Peyton and Shanny game planning and scheming it would be Nuts!!!

Jsteve01
01-14-2015, 03:40 PM
I know this sounds a little crazy but here goes, Kubiak Head Coach, Mike Shanahan O/C and assistant head coach, and Shanahan's buddy from San Fran that D/C they are talking about?
Peyton and Shanny game planning and scheming it would be Nuts!!!. You remember how power hungry he was right? He will never settle for that type of position at this point

Bronco9798
01-14-2015, 03:41 PM
I know this sounds a little crazy but here goes, Kubiak Head Coach, Mike Shanahan O/C and assistant head coach, and Shanahan's buddy from San Fran that D/C they are talking about?
Peyton and Shanny game planning and scheming it would be Nuts!!!

Mike Shanahan will never accept a OC position. His ego wold not come close to allowing it. I love Shanny, too.

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 03:44 PM
I don't think SHanahan comes the OC for the guy that was once his OC and the role reversal. I don't know if I've EVER seen that. It would be pretty weird.

Buff
01-14-2015, 03:50 PM
I know this sounds a little crazy but here goes, Kubiak Head Coach, Mike Shanahan O/C and assistant head coach, and Shanahan's buddy from San Fran that D/C they are talking about?
Peyton and Shanny game planning and scheming it would be Nuts!!!

It sounds more than a little crazy, bub.

NightTrainLayne
01-14-2015, 03:54 PM
It sounds more than a little crazy, bub.

Wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. I think he's onto something.

HC: Cowher
OC: Shanahan
DC: Wade Phillips
QB Coach: Kyle Shanahan
OL Coach: Dennison
...

and so on. It would be nuts!

Joel
01-14-2015, 04:11 PM
The NFL would be a much different place if EVERY coach that had a less than stellar first run as a Head Coach wasnt ever given a 2nd opportunity.
Kubiaks Houston run wasn't even "less than stellar;" I don't know where people get that. IF we accept the argument he never reached the SB with a "SB contender" (and, even if generous, the Texans were contenders all of TWO seasons at MOST) that just means he built an 2-14 infant laughing stock into a title contender in 5-6 seasons. He got the franchise its first division title and playoff appearance EVER—with his 3rd string 7th round rookie QB when the starter AND backup went on IR by Week 8—but he's a failure because they "only" won the first postseason game they ever played?

It's nuts; he took over a 5-year-old 2-14 team and only had 2 losing seasons in 6 campaigns, improved their win percentage 4/6 years and only regressed ONCE: When Schaub melted down so badly it ended his career and three Pro Bowlers went on IR by mid-season. Made an UDFA NFL rushing champion; coached Schaub up enough he managed to impersonate a franchise QB for 2-3 seasons (kinda like Plummer.) All those things in his first HC job, but he's a failure; I just don't get it. He took over a new franchise still trying to get off the ground, not a team like ours; he'd be scary with ours.

silkamilkamonico
01-14-2015, 04:13 PM
Awfully quiet on the Kubiak front

Joel
01-14-2015, 04:18 PM
I know this sounds a little crazy but here goes, Kubiak Head Coach, Mike Shanahan O/C and assistant head coach, and Shanahan's buddy from San Fran that D/C they are talking about?
Peyton and Shanny game planning and scheming it would be Nuts!!!
There's not a stadium big enough to fit the egos of Elway, Shanahan AND Manning all at once. You can just see how that goes: Shanny comes in demanding GM control, his old employee Elway reminds him we already HAVE a GM, and it goes downhill from there. Kyle Shanahan as OC, maybe but not Mike Shanahan as coach, much as I like the idea in principle. It's another argument for Kubiak: We'd get all or most benefits of our SB-winning offense (especially since Dennison goes everywhere Kubiak goes) without all the infamous poltical personality conflicts.

Everyone here remembers Shanny manipulating Elway into getting Bowlen to fire Reeves; anyone think Elway's forgotten? I love Shanny to death, and his return might make sense if his old QB WEREN'T running the team, but actually makes a lot LESS since he is. Plus Kubiak's succeeded with every team since Denver (whatever anyone says) and Shanny... hasn't. Maybe that's on Snyder, maybe not, but I'd rather have an unbroken string of success than an megalomaniacal maybe.

aberdien
01-14-2015, 04:19 PM
Kubiaks Houston run wasn't even "less than stellar;" I don't know where people get that. IF we accept the argument he never reached the SB with a "SB contender" (and, even if generous, the Texans were contenders all of TWO seasons at MOST) that just means he built an 2-14 infant laughing stock into a title contender in 5-6 seasons. He got the franchise its first division title and playoff appearance EVER—with his 3rd string 7th round rookie QB when the starter AND backup went on IR by Week 8—but he's a failure because they "only" won the first postseason game they ever played?

It's nuts; he took over a 5-year-old 2-14 team and only had 2 losing seasons in 6 campaigns, improved their win percentage 4/6 years and only regressed ONCE: When Schaub melted down so badly it ended his career and three Pro Bowlers went on IR by mid-season. Made an UDFA NFL rushing champion; coached Schaub up enough he managed to impersonate a franchise QB for 2-3 seasons (kinda like Plummer.) All those things in his first HC job, but he's a failure; I just don't get it. He took over a new franchise still trying to get off the ground, not a team like ours; he'd be scary with ours.

We get it.

But Kubiak's time in Houston was less than stellar. He brought them up only to bring disappointment and failure his last season. So it goes.

Al Wilson 4 Mayor
01-14-2015, 04:20 PM
There's not a stadium big enough to fit the egos of Elway, Shanahan AND Manning all at once. You can just see how that goes: Shanny comes in demanding GM control, his old employee Elway reminds him we already HAVE a GM, and it goes downhill from there. Kyle Shanahan as OC, maybe but not Mike Shanahan as coach, much as I like the idea in principle. It's another argument for Kubiak: We'd get all or most benefits of our SB-winning offense (especially since Dennison goes everywhere Kubiak goes) without all the infamous poltical personality conflicts.

Everyone here remembers Shanny manipulating Elway into getting Bowlen to fire Reeves; anyone think Elway's forgotten? I love Shanny to death, and his return might make sense if his old QB WEREN'T running the team, but actually makes a lot LESS since he is. Plus Kubiak's succeeded with every team since Denver (whatever anyone says) and Shanny... hasn't. Maybe that's on Snyder, maybe not, but I'd rather have an unbroken string of success than an megalomaniacal maybe.

Shanny wouldn't demand anything. He wouldn't take the job if he couldn't accept not having control over personnel. That would all be up front.

silkamilkamonico
01-14-2015, 04:23 PM
Kubiak's resume looks less impressive than John Fox when he got the job, and that was a "meh" hire. If Kubiak was hired, he could do well, but that is why is would be a "below meh" hire, until otherwise seen with the benefit of hindsight.

Joel
01-14-2015, 04:23 PM
Awfully quiet on the Kubiak front
IF it happens there may not be much poblicly announced till it's a done deal. The Broncos may need the Ravens permission to formally interview an OC face to face, but Elway doesn't need anyones permission but Kubiaks to call his cell, and has probably had it since before they HAD cells.

NightTrainLayne
01-14-2015, 04:27 PM
IF it happens there may not be much poblicly announced till it's a done deal. The Broncos may need the Ravens permission to formally interview an OC face to face, but Elway doesn't need anyones permission but Kubiaks to call his cell, and has probably had it since before they HAD cells.

Elway may have Kubiak's cell, but he's a super dumbass if he calls Kubiak for any reason before he has the Raven's permission to interview Kubiak.

Joel
01-14-2015, 04:27 PM
We get it.

But Kubiak's time in Houston was less than stellar. He brought them up only to bring disappointment and failure his last season. So it goes.
He didn't bring that ONE season: Schaub and a host of key season-ending injuries did. So far, Elway's shown better judgement than McNair in acquiring QBs from other teams.


Shanny wouldn't demand anything. He wouldn't take the job if he couldn't accept not having control over personnel. That would all be up front.
You're right, all that would be resolved up front: And it would go exactly as described, because neither Elway nor Shanny is willing to play second fiddle to anyone. I agree he wouldn't take the job on the terms Elway would certainly dictate, and a good thing, because grudgingly accepting the terms only to realize over a season or two that he couldn't abide by them would just leave us coach-hunting again.

silkamilkamonico
01-14-2015, 04:29 PM
IF it happens there may not be much poblicly announced till it's a done deal. The Broncos may need the Ravens permission to formally interview an OC face to face, but Elway doesn't need anyones permission but Kubiaks to call his cell, and has probably had it since before they HAD cells.


Nah, we would know by now. Not even a peep other than Denver request to interview him yesterday.

Joel
01-14-2015, 04:30 PM
Elway may have Kubiak's cell, but he's a super dumbass if he calls Kubiak for any reason before he has the Raven's permission to interview Kubiak.
NFL rules ban personal calls? Would Goodell go to court and subpoena phone records? It's hard to buy the NFL requiring Elway get Harbaughs permission for ALL contact; Kubiak's an employee, not property.


Nah, we would know by now. Not even a peep other than Denver request to interview him yesterday.
No peep except the peep then? ;) It's not like Elway will hire anyone overnight, and Kubiak's not going to announce the hire FOR him before even being interviewed anyway. Saw Legwold in an ESPN video suggest Dennisons a possibility, noting he aced his interview when Denver was looking for McDumbass' successor. I still think Kubes is a BOGO on Dennison if he's interested, and the argument Kubiak just wants to be an OC forever sounds strange, too.

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 04:37 PM
Its against the rules if they found out. Tampering is tampering. Could Elway simply deny? Of course. But since we are offering Kubiak a promotion in job title, it's not like we are trying to steal an OC to becme our OC...why break the rules for no reason? Elway can talk with Kubiak's agent.

aberdien
01-14-2015, 04:46 PM
He didn't bring that ONE season: Schaub and a host of key season-ending injuries did. So far, Elway's shown better judgement than McNair in acquiring QBs from other teams.

He's the head coach. He's responsible for adapting to what happens any given year. You don't get to shrug it off just because things happened that weren't expected.

silkamilkamonico
01-14-2015, 04:46 PM
NFL rules ban personal calls? Would Goodell go to court and subpoena phone records? It's hard to buy the NFL requiring Elway get Harbaughs permission for ALL contact; Kubiak's an employee, not property.




A personal call becomes a business call the minute Elway even brings up the head coaching vacancy and throws feelers out there. Elway is a little smarter than that.

Krugan
01-14-2015, 04:47 PM
Kubiak, my gut says (and I think he did), isnt going to move.

Dont care about the connections and everything else along with it. My gut says he stays put in his gig right now.

DenBronx
01-14-2015, 04:49 PM
McDoosh hasn't had a 2nd HC job. He just went to another team to be the OC. Seems that when he isn't sucking the nipple of Belicheck and Brady, things don't go very well for him, so he ran home. He'll get another shot, but I'm bettting he fails because he just thinks WAYYYY too much of himself and can't get along with people.


I was thinking he was the Rams HC. Guess I hated him so much at the time it is has become a blur now.

Joel
01-14-2015, 04:55 PM
Its against the rules if they found out. Tampering is tampering. Could Elway simply deny? Of course. But since we are offering Kubiak a promotion in job title, it's not like we are trying to steal an OC to becme our OC...why break the rules for no reason? Elway can talk with Kubiak's agent.
Nigh impossible to prove, but completly unnecessary: Good point, and fair enough.


He's the head coach. He's responsible for adapting to what happens any given year. You don't get to shrug it off just because things happened that weren't expected.
Ryan Lindley agrees; Bruce Arians thinks you're a heartless SOB. ;) Explains why Caldwell got fired when Indy lost Manning for the whole season: You're the coach; find ways to win with Curtis Painter.

CoachChaz
01-14-2015, 04:56 PM
Kubiak's resume looks less impressive than John Fox when he got the job, and that was a "meh" hire. If Kubiak was hired, he could do well, but that is why is would be a "below meh" hire, until otherwise seen with the benefit of hindsight.

Better options? With better pedigrees? Better records as a HC? Any experience as a HC?

silkamilkamonico
01-14-2015, 05:06 PM
Better options? With better pedigrees? Better records as a HC? Any experience as a HC?

Well, with the rate of available candidates becoming unavailable, it will be interesting to see which one of the above categories you stated will the new guy actually fit into.

Joel
01-14-2015, 05:31 PM
Just to play Devils Advocate on Kubes, I can see why he may not feel ready for another HC gig yet, especially after last years health scare. He also might want a chance to mold a team to his liking rather than inheriting a roster full of Pro Bowlers set in their ways, and trying to get a HoF QB pushing 40 over the SB hump when he's VERY set in his ways. Kubiak helped do the second part before, of course, and it was the high point of his career so far, but I wouldn't be surprised if he's been dying his hair ever since. Whoever succeeds Fox will immediately be under diamond-grade pressure, ESPECIALLY if Manning returns.

Ravage!!!
01-14-2015, 05:54 PM
Just to play Devils Advocate on Kubes, I can see why he may not feel ready for another HC gig yet, especially after last years health scare. He also might want a chance to mold a team to his liking rather than inheriting a roster full of Pro Bowlers set in their ways, and trying to get a HoF QB pushing 40 over the SB hump when he's VERY set in his ways. Kubiak helped do the second part before, of course, and it was the high point of his career so far, but I wouldn't be surprised if he's been dying his hair ever since. Whoever succeeds Fox will immediately be under diamond-grade pressure, ESPECIALLY if Manning returns.

It would seem, to me, that having the pressure to win with the best roster you've had as an HC is the kind of pressure you want if you want a HC job in the NFL, not avoid. Seems its the both of best worlds. YOu have a good offense now, and have the ability to groom a new QB once the HoFer leaves/

However, Kubes has passed on chances before. He passed on NCAA HC jobs while a OC in Denver.

Bronco9798
01-14-2015, 05:57 PM
Kubiak is also in the process of building a new house in Baltimore. I just read that a few minutes ago.

Poet
01-14-2015, 06:39 PM
After some thought, I'm not sure I agree anymore. There are a lot of successful coaches that are polar opposites of Pete Carroll. Belichick is a corpse, or Tomlinson who rarely shows emotion. Mike McCarthy, Chuck Pagano, or Andy Reid. Maybe it's more about getting the most out of your players, calling the right plays and not being their "friend".

Andy Reid literally runs down to his players and celebrates with them. McCarthy is animated on the sidelines. Pagano is a shining example of an emotional leader. Coughlin, even for being an old man who looks like he is a corpse, did change his coaching methodology and mannerisms to be less rigid and be more approachable to his players.

You poor ******** are trying to convince yourself Kubiak is a good head coach. God bless you all.

Joel
01-14-2015, 06:40 PM
It would seem, to me, that having the pressure to win with the best roster you've had as an HC is the kind of pressure you want if you want a HC job in the NFL, not avoid. Seems its the both of best worlds. YOu have a good offense now, and have the ability to groom a new QB once the HoFer leaves/
Half-full/empty; you've also got the pressure to get tha aging HoFer over the hump AND to find someone like Luck to replace him. Do both and you're a genius, sure, but fail to do either (and neither's easy) and you could be mailing out resumes again in just a year or two. I agree the greatest in any field seek rather than flee pressure, and Kubiak wouldn't have been a good enough college QB to get drafted if he didn't do the same, but it's a high risk/reward scenario, especially with a club that just reiterated it's never satisified with second best.


However, Kubes has passed on chances before. He passed on NCAA HC jobs while a OC in Denver.
Maybe that just means he doesn't want to coach amateur football. :tongue: Going from the NCAA to NFL is one thing, but going from the NFL to NCAA is like being relegated from Champions League to Premiere: However successful a guy is, he's only doing it because he couldn't hack it at the highest level.

capt. Jack
01-14-2015, 08:06 PM
It sounds more than a little crazy, bub.

Shanny would make a great O/C at his age, and he would love to coach Peyton. And maybe Pat Bowlen wouldn't mind getting the old band back together for one more run? That's all.

Uh, bub.

:)