DRAFT Day Possibilities

[WARHORSE]

Last year the Cowboys traded down from 18 to 31. They got a third rounder thrown to them in the move which according to the draft day trade chart would be a steel for the 49ers who pulled off the trade.

This year everyone is saying its a deep draft which would lead most to think trading down would be every teams first preference. Somehow I wouldnt be surprised to see The Duke go up the board.

At the same time, I wouldnt be surprised for the same reasons if we moved down.

Would we take a first rounder next year in exchange for a drop into the second round?

I think this is the first time in a while where I believe there are a number of real possibilitiies that seem plausible for Denver.

Can we go up and get Anthony Barr at around the 10 to 12 range?

What about Evans?

When Atlanta went up to get Julio, can we be on the table for something like that?

If the OTs and the QBs go on a run I can easily see Watkins dropping down to around 8 if one or two teams make some DUMB picks. We all know it happens every year.

Anthony Barr intrigues me as a WSLBer. If we moved Tre to the middle, where I think he would be just as effective, then we get yet another killer stand up LBer who can come off the edge.

The man has just begun to learn the position.

MAN that would be killer.

Denver has enough right now to truly take whoever they want imo.

Im looking forward to draft day.

[DenBronx]

I keep saying that if there is a year to trade UP then it's this year. The past few drafts those who have been trading up at the end of the 1st about 10-12 slots or so have been getting a steal! If there is a player that we feel is going to make an impact RIGHT NOW and is a for sure homerun then lets do it! Not sure who that is or how far Elway would be willing to go but if the price is right and he has someone in mind then I could fully see us going up in the draft.



I really doubt this is the year we trade down and out of the 1st.

[Ziggy]

This is the year NOT to trade up in the first round. There is too much talent in this draft. At 31, the Broncos can get a guy that might go between 12-20 in some other drafts. One of the positions that the Broncos need some depth at is the deepest position in this draft- CB. There's going to be a mid first round corner talent at 31. If none of those guys drop as expected, another position will. This is the draft to stand pat or move down and grab a first round talent in the mid second along with picking up another third.

[WARHORSE]

This is the year NOT to trade up in the first round. There is too much talent in this draft. At 31, the Broncos can get a guy that might go between 12-20 in some other drafts. One of the positions that the Broncos need some depth at is the deepest position in this draft- CB. There's going to be a mid first round corner talent at 31. If none of those guys drop as expected, another position will. This is the draft to stand pat or move down and grab a first round talent in the mid second along with picking up another third.

I cant say as I disagree, but to your point there will also be guys in the 12-20 area that might go 5-11 in others as well.

I just see a lot of possibles in this draft for us.....including picking at 31.

[Traveler]

Unless someone unexpected falls to us at #31, I can just as easily see them trading out of round one for more picks. Especially if some teams picking early in the 2nd round want to move back into the 1st round for a QB they like.

[NightTerror218]

Unless someone unexpected falls to us at #31, I can just as easily see them trading out of round one for more picks. Especially if some teams picking early in the 2nd round want to move back into the 1st round for a QB they like.

This is my guess. Deep draft. Get more picks .

[Simple Jaded]

Unless you can get one of the elite players trading up in this draft seems counterintuitive to me, usually I'm all for trading up and completely disgusted by trading back. Can't say it'd bother me if they did trade up tho.

[Dapper Dan]

I think there will be one of the 1st round players the FO likes at 31. I don't know who it will be, but there are always like 60+ players with a first round grade and 30 or so players with a top 20 grade. There will be someone there.

[tomjonesrocks]

I don't know how this year's supposed "depth" is helpful for the Broncos. Denver desperately needs to fill that gaping hole at LB and I'm not sure how they're going to get one. Mosley will be gone before their pick in the first and Borland (who's small, and if Denver wanted that they could have kept Woodyard) will be gone before their pick in the second.

Below that am not sure what their options are really--but it doesn't seem like they're going to get a top guy at their biggest need. Missing on that in FA looks like a problem to me.

It seems like most mocks have Denver taking a guard in the first which to me kind of sucks. They need one but Manning makes his lines look good, so I'd rather have an early round LB than an early round guard.

[wcben]

Broncos need another cornerback that can actually play- Talib, Harris, and Webster are excellent but you need four good corners in today's NFL (is sticky man still on roster?) ...Second and Third would be for adding depth to Oline and LB.

I like Irving at MLB

[tomjonesrocks]

Broncos need another cornerback that can actually play- Talib, Harris, and Webster are excellent but you need four good corners in today's NFL (is sticky man still on roster?) ...Second and Third would be for adding depth to Oline and LB.

I like Irving at MLB

Carter was tendered--can't verify the round though. Haven't heard much about that since but I assumed he'd be pretty much locked up with that.

[Ziggy]

Broncos need another cornerback that can actually play- Talib, Harris, and Webster are excellent but you need four good corners in today's NFL (is sticky man still on roster?) ...Second and Third would be for adding depth to Oline and LB.

I like Irving at MLB

Which teams in the NFL have 4 good corners?

[Simple Jaded]

The Broncos have basically the same CB core they had last year, though DRC-Talib is a downgrade imo, I wouldn't blame them at all if they drafted another.

[NightTerror218]

The Broncos have basically the same CB core they had last year, though DRC-Talib is a downgrade imo, I wouldn't blame them at all if they drafted another.

Talib is coming g off a pro bowl season. DRC is not just a really good season to show he still has gas in tank. Talib is what 4 years younger as well. He took the deal DRC turned down.

[pipes]

Talib is a couple of months older than DRC...

[Jsteve01]

Signing Verner to the deal he got in tb would have made this a perfect haul. Talib is better than drc but he has yet to play a whole season

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Signing Verner to the deal he got in tb would have made this a perfect haul. Talib is better than drc but he has yet to play a whole season

He played as many games as DRC did this year.

[Ziggy]

Signing Verner to the deal he got in tb would have made this a perfect haul. Talib is better than drc but he has yet to play a whole season

Verner is a very good zone corner. He doesn't fit what Del Rio does when he has a healthy D.

[Simple Jaded]

Talib is coming g off a pro bowl season. DRC is not just a really good season to show he still has gas in tank. Talib is what 4 years younger as well. He took the deal DRC turned down.

I just don't think Talib is on same level, I could be wrong.

[NightTerror218]

Talib is a couple of months older than DRC...

For so e reason I was thinking DRC was 30.

[DenBronx]

We wont trade down this year. Sorry just have a feeling thats not happening. Plus the benifit of drafting in the 1st vs the 2nd is the 5th year option.

[Cugel]

This is my guess. Deep draft. Get more picks .

Except that everybody else is thinking the same thing. In that case you actually lose draft position to make the trade and move down -- i.e. you don't get as much as your pick is worth in draft points.

Probably the best thing to do is just sit tight and take whoever is available as you pick. A deep draft means someone at #31 will be there who will fit your needs and be an impact player.

It's only when it's a bad draft class outside the top 10-15 and you're drafting 2nd round talent in the 1st round (and paying them 1st round money) that you need to move down. Unless you're Josh McDaniels of course and then you just jump around like an idiot for no good reason at all, which is why they don't let him near a draft board in NE.

[Cugel]

Talib is coming g off a pro bowl season. DRC is not just a really good season to show he still has gas in tank. Talib is what 4 years younger as well. He took the deal DRC turned down.

Talib is getting a lot more money. 6 years, $57M, including $27M guaranteed. Talib is a better run defender, more sure tackler, and is younger. DRC got 5 years, $39M, with the Giants. No way the Broncos were ever going to offer him $57M.

[VonDoom]

Talib is getting a lot more money. 6 years, $57M, including $27M guaranteed. Talib is a better run defender, more sure tackler, and is younger. DRC got 5 years, $39M, with the Giants. No way the Broncos were ever going to offer him $57M.

Except they did. Well, it was $54 million, and obviously the guaranteed part is the only important part, but the Broncos valued DRC as a top corner in the same way they valued Talib. I think that Talib, if healthy, will ultimately be better and he's clearly more physical, but let's not re-write history as far as DRC is concerned:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/03/13/before-landing-talib-broncos-made-a-run-at-revis/

As the source explains it, DRC declined to accept a deal believed to be worth $54 million over six years.

[VonDoom]

Except that everybody else is thinking the same thing. In that case you actually lose draft position to make the trade and move down -- i.e. you don't get as much as your pick is worth in draft points.

Probably the best thing to do is just sit tight and take whoever is available as you pick. A deep draft means someone at #31 will be there who will fit your needs and be an impact player.

It's only when it's a bad draft class outside the top 10-15 and you're drafting 2nd round talent in the 1st round (and paying them 1st round money) that you need to move down. Unless you're Josh McDaniels of course and then you just jump around like an idiot for no good reason at all, which is why they don't let him near a draft board in NE.

This I agree with. Trading down sounds like a fine idea unless everyone else has the same idea. Then the value isn't there. Someone will be there at 31 that we want, but there are too many factors to really guess who that is at this point. I say they stand pat unless there's no one they think is worth a first round pick left at 31, in which case I could see them at least attempting to trade down. But it's not a given, not this year.

[underrated29]

i have a feeling we trade up

[CoachChaz]

Stay at 31...best DB available

[VonDoom]

Stay at 31...best DB available

This is pretty much what I'm thinking at this point, especially after the Franklin to LG move. A lot of good CB and S in the early part of this draft, and someone we like should be there.

[OrangeHoof]

I have no real idea what is on the Broncos draft board (I'm sure they like it that way), but I have tried to mock with a few of the mock simulation boards and each time, I can see situations where we could trade down into the upper second and still get a guy we'd want. If we can parlay 1-31 into a mid-second (8-12) and a mid-to-low 3rd, how would you feel about that? Two guys in the second and two guys in the 3rd can fill some holes.

[HORSEPOWER 56]

If someone like Mosely slips to the 20s (which isn't unheard of with MLBs being more undervalued in a passing league) I can see is trying to trade up to get him.

[NightTerror218]

Except that everybody else is thinking the same thing. In that case you actually lose draft position to make the trade and move down -- i.e. you don't get as much as your pick is worth in draft points.

Probably the best thing to do is just sit tight and take whoever is available as you pick. A deep draft means someone at #31 will be there who will fit your needs and be an impact player.

It's only when it's a bad draft class outside the top 10-15 and you're drafting 2nd round talent in the 1st round (and paying them 1st round money) that you need to move down. Unless you're Josh McDaniels of course and then you just jump around like an idiot for no good reason at all, which is why they don't let him near a draft board in NE.

The thing is a there are QBs who are rising and falling. Any player could drop and someone trade up for. Bridgewater and Carr are QBs who could be there end of first.

[TXBRONC]

Unless someone unexpected falls to us at #31, I can just as easily see them trading out of round one for more picks. Especially if some teams picking early in the 2nd round want to move back into the 1st round for a QB they like.

If it wasn't such deep draft I would agree. When Elway traded out the first round a couple of years ago the pool was a lot shallower.

[TXBRONC]

Stay at 31...best DB available

I agree I think they should stay at 31.

[NightTerror218]

I agree I think they should stay at 31.

I agree unless some special drops. Like teams keep snags all the QBs and a player falls, I think they can move up a few spots but not 10 spots.

[TXBRONC]

I agree unless some special drops. Like teams keep snags all the QBs and a player falls, I think they can move up a few spots but not 10 spots.

Who would drop that would be that special?

[NightTerror218]

Who would drop that would be that special?

Mosley, or a top rated CB.

I could see elway moving up a few spots and giving up a late round pick. Nothing big and no second day picks either.

[TXBRONC]

Mosley, or a top rated CB.

I could see elway moving up a few spots and giving up a late round pick. Nothing big and no second day picks either.

Mosley sounds like he could be pretty but I'm not hearing that he's quite as good of prospect as Luke Kuechly was two years ago.

Elway hasn't moved up in the first round of a draft yet but there is always a first time.

[CoachChaz]

Mosley, or a top rated CB.

I could see elway moving up a few spots and giving up a late round pick. Nothing big and no second day picks either.

Moving up ANY spots in the 1st round will cost more than a late round pick. Even moving up 3 or 4 spots would cost us our 3rd round pick. Unless we give up something from next year, we're either staying out or moving back.

[BroncoJoe]

What is Elway's record on moving around in the draft? I don't recall him doing anything but standing pat, but I could be wrong.

[Dapper Dan]

What is Elway's record on moving around in the draft? I don't recall him doing anything but standing pat, but I could be wrong.

He traded out of the first when he got Wolfe. I think Tampa used our pick to get Doug Martin. It pissed a lot of people off.

[underrated29]

last year the niners burned a 4th and moved all the way up to 18

[underrated29]

More and more I think we move trev to mike and draft shazier.

I personally am not super high on shazier but it just seems that way.

[pipes]

I've heard a lot of analysts saying that Shazier is a MLB?...if Denver likes him and feels this way, they can leave Danny alone.

Moving LB's around can greatly reduce their impact. I'll give 3 examples: Ian Gold, DJ Williams, and Wesley Woodyard.

[pipes]

Btw does Kentucky have a draft eligible LB in this draft?
If so, hopefully Denver gets him...
Keep going to the well

[NightTerror218]

Moving up ANY spots in the 1st round will cost more than a late round pick. Even moving up 3 or 4 spots would cost us our 3rd round pick. Unless we give up something from next year, we're either staying out or moving back.

I doubt it. Look at what broncos did 2 years ago traded down with Pats and got a 4th. Then traded down out of spot 31 and switched picks in later round

[Dapper Dan]

Btw does Kentucky have a draft eligible LB in this draft?
If so, hopefully Denver gets him...
Keep going to the well

Yup. Several posters have been talking about him already.

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/avery-williamson?id=2543597

[underrated29]

I've heard a lot of analysts saying that Shazier is a MLB?...if Denver likes him and feels this way, they can leave Danny alone.

Moving LB's around can greatly reduce their impact. I'll give 3 examples: Ian Gold, DJ Williams, and Wesley Woodyard.


I cannot see him as a mike. I know he is the same size and speed as mosely but to me, this guy gets DESTROYED on blocks. He has no ability to shed them at all. And I think mosley is not much better at it. I do not see Shaz as a mike. Maybe he can be. They know more than I, but I just cant for the life of me see him plugging the run. He is to me a sideline to sideline player, who would be great with his speed on the outside.



Btw does Kentucky have a draft eligible LB in this draft?
If so, hopefully Denver gets him...
Keep going to the well


Yes, Avery Williamson. He should go in the 5th-ish range. I like him, quite a bit in fact.

[Dapper Dan]

The LB coach (Chuck Smith) who coached those guys that came at Kentucky is now gone. He's going back to coaching Boyle County. The football juggernaut where Jacob Tamme played. New Kentucky Head Coach Mark Stoops brought in his own guys.

[tomjonesrocks]

Maybe this has been posted already, but MHR put up a summary of mock-drafter's predictions:
MHR Mock Draft Database (http://www.milehighreport.com/2014/4/28/5658724/2014-nfl-draft-denver-broncos-mock-draft-database-4-28-14)

A good bit of Shazier--and some of Borland (who makes no sense whatsoever to me as he's small--why would you let Woodyard go if you were OK with small?)

[Simple Jaded]

Maybe this has been posted already, but MHR put up a summary of mock-drafter's predictions:
MHR Mock Draft Database (http://www.milehighreport.com/2014/4/28/5658724/2014-nfl-draft-denver-broncos-mock-draft-database-4-28-14)

A good bit of Shazier--and some of Borland (who makes no sense whatsoever to me as he's small--why would you let Woodyard go if you were OK with small?)

Yeah but he lacks in size he makes up for in a lack of speed.

[TXBRONC]

last year the niners burned a 4th and moved all the way up to 18

Yes that was last year also last year's draft isn't as deep as this year's so it's going cost more.

[Simple Jaded]

The LB coach (Chuck Smith) who coached those guys that came at Kentucky is now gone. He's going back to coaching Boyle County. The football juggernaut where Jacob Tamme played. New Kentucky Head Coach Mark Stoops brought in his own guys.

Is that the Chuck Smith, DE from Tenn?

[Dapper Dan]

Is that the Chuck Smith, DE from Tenn?

Nope. I ran into that one while looking up the other one. The LB coach from Kentucky is white. He played at Kentucky.

[Simple Jaded]

Nope. I ran into that one while looking up the other one. The LB coach from Kentucky is white. He played at Kentucky.

Stoops ****** up.

[Dapper Dan]

Stoops ****** up.

The dude must know what he's doing. By dude, I mean Chuck. While he was at Boyle County, they were nothing but a powerhouse(5 straight state titles). While at Kentucky, he produced NFL talent. I'm thinking he's just being overlooked. He will probably stay at Boyle County for a while again.

Still, it could have been Coach Rich Brooks who helped turn those guys into NFL players.

[VonDoom]

Maybe this has been posted already, but MHR put up a summary of mock-drafter's predictions:
MHR Mock Draft Database (http://www.milehighreport.com/2014/4/28/5658724/2014-nfl-draft-denver-broncos-mock-draft-database-4-28-14)

A good bit of Shazier--and some of Borland (who makes no sense whatsoever to me as he's small--why would you let Woodyard go if you were OK with small?)

I didn't know there was such a resource. I've been poking around the web in my spare time looking at all sorts of mocks (Yahoo, CBS, Fox, NFL.com, etc, etc) and most of the picks I've seen have either been Su'a-Filo or Shazier.

[CoachChaz]

That article references a guy I would be all over if we decided to move Danny to MLB. Telvin Smith. That kid is tenacious and is EVERYWHERE on the field. A little light, but it never seems to stop him.

[Dapper Dan]

That article references a guy I would be all over if we decided to move Danny to MLB. Telvin Smith. That kid is tenacious and is EVERYWHERE on the field. A little light, but it never seems to stop him.

Didn't the FO bring him in for a workout?

[tomjonesrocks]

Yeah but he lacks in size he makes up for in a lack of speed.

Won't be happy if they draft Borland -- at all. I'll be stunned if they take him though--I can't imagine benching then showing a leader like Woodyard the door so unceremoniously unless JDR simply wanted a bigger body at the position.

From the "poll" on MHR it appears I'm not alone in that view...

[NightTerror218]

Borland is 6' 248lb and considered one of the more instinctive ILB 2.83s 40. Woodyard is 6' 233lb. So I would say 15lbs is quite a bit heavier. I would take Borland in 2nd round. Avery Williams may be nice as well.

CBS says this about him:
STRENGTHS:*Heady, passionate player. Consistently diagnoses action correctly, attacking seams to make plays near the line of scrimmage and showing better than advertised speed and change of direction while dropping into coverage. He is a no-nonsense LB, showing impressive pop and determination to get to the ball. Borland is disciplined in space and is rarely fooled, showing good body positioning and timing in coverage.WEAKNESSES:*Despite stellar production, Borland's pedestrian size and athleticism hurt, but there is some validity to the Zach Thomas comparisons. He lacks elite speed and range to consistently play sideline-to-sideline, but effort and motor aren't questions - his body and mind are always at full-go.*

Skov 6'2 245lb
Mosley 6'2 234lb 4.63s 40
Avery Williams 6'1 243lb 4.66s 40

[Dapper Dan]

So far (4/29/14)

http://www.milehighreport.com/2014/3/1/5453418/denver-broncos-2014-nfl-draft-interests-tracker


C Tyler Larsen Utah St 5th-6th
SS Ahmad Dixon Baylor 4th
G Austin Wentworth Fresno St. Late/FA
ILB Avery Williamson Kentucky Late/FA
WR Brandin Cooks Oregon St. 1st
QB Brett Smith Wyoming 5th-6th
QB Bryn Renner UNC Late/FA
OG/OT Dakota Dozier Furman 3rd
SS Deone Bucannon Washington St. 2nd-3rd
WR Devin Street Pittsburgh 4th-5th
WR Isaiah Burse Fresno State Late/FA
WR Jeff Janis Saginaw Valley 6th-7th
SS Jimmie Ward Northern Illinois 2nd
OT/OG Joel Bitonio Nevada 3rd-4th
OLB Jordan Tripp Montana 3rd-4th
RB Kapri Bibbs Colorado St. Late/FA
FS Marqueston Huff Wyoming 5th-6th
WR Matt Hazel Coastal Carolina 7th
CB Ross Cockrell Duke 4th
DT Shamar Stephen Connecticut 6th
QB Tajh Boyd Clemson. Late/FA
QB Stephen Morris Miami Late/FA
CB Kyle Fuller Virginia Tech 1st
G William Poehls Montana Late/FA
WR/TE Erik Swoope Miami Late/FA
WR Dante Moncrief Ole Miss 3rd
C Matthew Paradis Boise St. Late/FA
DE Scott Crichton Oregon St. 1st/2nd
LB Ryan Shazier Ohio St. 1st
DE Chris Schaudt Minnesota State Late/FA
CB Justin Gilbert Oklahoma State 1st
C Weston Richburg Colorado State 2nd
LB C.J. Mosley Alabama 1st
RB Alfred Blue LSU Late/FA
LB Telvin Smith Florida St. 2nd/3rd
LB Preston Brown Louisville 4th/5th


The team has looked at several MLBs. I would be surprised if we didn't get one.

[Simple Jaded]

Borland is 6' 248lb and considered one of the more instinctive ILB 2.83s 40. Woodyard is 6' 233lb. So I would say 15lbs is quite a bit heavier. I would take Borland in 2nd round. Avery Williams may be nice as well.

CBS says this about him:
STRENGTHS:*Heady, passionate player. Consistently diagnoses action correctly, attacking seams to make plays near the line of scrimmage and showing better than advertised speed and change of direction while dropping into coverage. He is a no-nonsense LB, showing impressive pop and determination to get to the ball. Borland is disciplined in space and is rarely fooled, showing good body positioning and timing in coverage.WEAKNESSES:*Despite stellar production, Borland's pedestrian size and athleticism hurt, but there is some validity to the Zach Thomas comparisons. He lacks elite speed and range to consistently play sideline-to-sideline, but effort and motor aren't questions - his body and mind are always at full-go.*

Skov 6'2 245lb
Mosley 6'2 234lb 4.63s 40
Avery Williams 6'1 243lb 4.66s 40

Wouldn't mind Borland at all if he wasn't projected where he is, same with Westin Richburg.

[LTC Pain]

Having no idea what the Broncos board looks like or who will still be on the board when pick #31 is up, I will SWAG (Stupid Wild Assed Guess) the Broncos selecting this guy:

Joel Bitonio, OG, Nevada http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1754724/joel-bitonio

[underrated29]

Having no idea what the Broncos board looks like or who will still be on the board when pick #31 is up, I will SWAG (Stupid Wild Assed Guess) the Broncos selecting this guy:

Joel Bitonio, OG, Nevada http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1754724/joel-bitonio



I've heard we like him a lot, but I think he might be there in rd 2....he is graded higher but the draft is so deep he should make it.

I haven't changed my sig yet but I have us taking him at 2.

[Cugel]

The thing is a there are QBs who are rising and falling. Any player could drop and someone trade up for. Bridgewater and Carr are QBs who could be there end of first.

Your thinking is that Teddy Bridgewater is going to be available at #31 and some team desperate for a QB will want to trade back up into the 1st to get him. That's barely possible, but the problem is that everybody knows the Broncos won't draft a QB (probably at all and certainly not with their #1 pick), so the team that wants Bridgewater can target the Seahawks pick.

My guess is that some desperate team will take Bridgewater somewhere ahead of #31 because if you don't have a franchise QB you have to get one NOW, even if no really good QB is available.

NFL logic goes like this:

You have 2 or 3 years as an NFL GM or coach to prove yourself or you're probably going to be fired. If you get the wrong QB you're not going to win and will have to start over from scratch with a new QB -- and usually a new head coach and GM. It's rare for a guy, like Rex Ryan, to survive getting the wrong franchise QB and still have time to try and get it right.

So, you'd better draft a QB NOW and hope for the best. Maybe even if he's not the answer he can do well enough to buy you an extra year or two (see Mark Sanchez).

[Cugel]

Having no idea what the Broncos board looks like or who will still be on the board when pick #31 is up, I will SWAG (Stupid Wild Assed Guess) the Broncos selecting this guy:

Joel Bitonio, OG, Nevada http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1754724/joel-bitonio

Here's what the sports crew at CBS picked for Denver:


Rob Rang: Joel Bitonio,OG | Nevada
Dave Bungler: Ryan Shazier, OLB | Ohio State
Peter Prisco: Kyle Van Noy OLB | Brigham Young
Pat Kirwan: Kyle Fuller, CB Virginia Tech

Not that they know anything, but still. . . .

[artie_dale]

Imo, Drafts are a crap shoot no matter what. So, with that in mind, I wouldn't mind the team making a splash to move up and grab one of those top LBers, because what are the chances of any of the rest being as productive? Crapshoots! I vote make a splash. Since the dratf is apparently deep, we might still get lucky in the later rounds to get talent.

[underrated29]

Here's what the sports crew at CBS picked for Denver:


Not that they know anything, but still. . . .



If shazier or fuller are there I will jump for joy.

[Cugel]

I doubt it. Look at what broncos did 2 years ago traded down with Pats and got a 4th. Then traded down out of spot 31 and switched picks in later round

Denver got screwed with that trade in terms of draft value. They actually found (sayeth Elway) that teams were not all that anxious to trade up, so they had to lose some value to do it. But, considering the players they wanted to draft it made sense to take them later and get an extra pick, even though it wasn't really equivalent value.

[LTC Pain]

I've heard we like him a lot, but I think he might be there in rd 2....he is graded higher but the draft is so deep he should make it.

I haven't changed my sig yet but I have us taking him at 2.

Okay, Shazier in the 1st round and Bitonio in the 2nd :listen: :beer: :salute:

[underrated29]

Okay, Shazier in the 1st round and Bitonio in the 2nd :listen: :beer: :salute:

Thats my hope, but it seems like Joel will not make it to our 2nd rd pick. Word is washington likes him a lot with their 2nd.


mosley
shazier
fuller
denard
verrett
ward
bitonio

One of them will likely be our first rd pick.- id be fine with any of them as well. Some more than others but hey....

[CoachChaz]

I dont know that Bitonio makes is to pick 63. Which is interesting to me because he's projected to be a guard in the NFL and has never played the position...yet he's considered a top 50 pick everywhere I look.

I dont know...he's just one of those guys I cant get really excited about before round 3 or 4

[CoachChaz]

...and I really dont see how Shazier fits our defense unless Danny is moved to the middle. Even then, I think we have enough LB talent to fill the weakside without spending a 1st round pick on another.

[TXBRONC]

I hope Denver takes a top tier pass rusher or an offensive lineman if either is available.

[CoachChaz]

CB would be my focus. If there is a spot where we severely lack depth...it's there.

[VonDoom]

Thats my hope, but it seems like Joel will not make it to our 2nd rd pick. Word is washington likes him a lot with their 2nd.


mosley
shazier
fuller
denard
verrett
ward
bitonio

One of them will likely be our first rd pick.- id be fine with any of them as well. Some more than others but hey....

Man if Dennard is there when we pick, I'll be doing backflips. Fuller is also unlikely but would also be a no brainer.

[NightTerror218]

Denver got screwed with that trade in terms of draft value. They actually found (sayeth Elway) that teams were not all that anxious to trade up, so they had to lose some value to do it. But, considering the players they wanted to draft it made sense to take them later and get an extra pick, even though it wasn't really equivalent value.

There was no value set before that draft really. 2nd year of the rookie scale.

[underrated29]

...and I really dont see how Shazier fits our defense unless Danny is moved to the middle. Even then, I think we have enough LB talent to fill the weakside without spending a 1st round pick on another.

That was my initial thought as well. Leading all the way up to about this past sat night. I watched as much of Shazier as I could. I compared all his numbers and what not to other LBs past and present. I think he struggles to get off blocks still but the rest I really like from him. I think at 232 (same weight as mosley is listed) that he could add an easy 10lbs of muscle- shaz to me is pretty rail thin- and still keep his 4.3 or 4.4 speed. Another 5lbs- total of 15 and he would be at a hair under 250lbs....That is great size for a MIKE and he should still be able to be several steps faster than most RB and be able to drop in coverage just fine with WR and TE as well as blitz and hold up against the run. I like him more than mosley. (I dont really like mosley all that much but I like Shaz a lot)....He essentially can be a Von miller in the middle. Stud against the run and drop in coverage or blitz.

Im not sure shazier even makes it to 15 though.




CB would be my focus. If there is a spot where we severely lack depth...it's there.

I agree with this also though. But there are some good later round CBs- like Gaines, Colvin, Mcgill and SJB that we could grab..I realize same could be said for MLB with christian jones, preston brown, jordan tripp (i dont see what everyone sees in this kid) or Avery Williamson.


Who do you think would be at 31? Roby? Verrett?

[VonDoom]

Who do you think would be at 31? Roby? Verrett?

I'm assuming that ONE of them will be there, but it's no guarantee. I actually did that NFL.com mock thing where you can win a trip or something. I had all of the CBs going before Denver picked (Shazier and Mosley too - I ended up with Ealy, FWIW) but the actual draft tends to go differently than most people expect, and especially by the time we get to 31, anything is possible.

If it's between those two, though, my gut says Verrett is the better call. The only thing Verrett seems to lack is size but he's tenacious, and we could use someone who could start or at least compete to start. I can't wait till next week - these extra two weeks have been a real drag.

[wcben]

Does anyone think Sly Williams is going to take the next step and be a little more like Jamal Williams?

[CoachChaz]

I think Verrett could be there and quite honestly...I like him more than Roby. The 5'9" thing doesnt scare me and I think he'd eventually be a great asset to the secondary

[wcben]

Oh and I'm still banging the table for that DB out of VT. Lets have our own legion, a Legion of DOOM in Denver.

[VonDoom]

Coach (or anyone else) ... what do you think of Jimmie Ward? I've been watching some tape of his today and I'm really impressed by what I see. He's listed as a SS, but I see him as a FS on tape and in our system. I saw him make an athletic interception and lay the wood over the middle in the same game. His stock seems to be rising, but he's generally listed around the early-mid 2nd round. Would he be a reach at 31? If there's a run on CB's, I wouldn't mind seeing this guy brought in.

[CoachChaz]

Coach (or anyone else) ... what do you think of Jimmie Ward? I've been watching some tape of his today and I'm really impressed by what I see. He's listed as a SS, but I see him as a FS on tape and in our system. I saw him make an athletic interception and lay the wood over the middle in the same game. His stock seems to be rising, but he's generally listed around the early-mid 2nd round. Would he be a reach at 31? If there's a run on CB's, I wouldn't mind seeing this guy brought in.

I listed him and Bucannon as guys I was really interested in before we signed TJ. Ward seems a bit small for SS, but his coverage skills are really good. I think FS is in his future...but then again, the lines are really skewed anymore when it comes to defining a SS and a FS.

Nevertheless...I can see him coming off the board by the mid-second round

[Cugel]

Does anyone think Sly Williams is going to take the next step and be a little more like Jamal Williams?

How can we know when we've only seen one season? What we know: he came on late in the year, which you would hope for a rookie. But, Will he ever be a real impact player? He's not there yet. That's all we can tell.

We'll have to watch him in the pre-season and see if he starts making more plays. He'll certainly get some chances to play. Denver is going to want more DL depth than they have and if he plays up to expectations he'll move up in the rotation.

[Cugel]

Coach (or anyone else) ... what do you think of Jimmie Ward? I've been watching some tape of his today and I'm really impressed by what I see. He's listed as a SS, but I see him as a FS on tape and in our system. I saw him make an athletic interception and lay the wood over the middle in the same game. His stock seems to be rising, but he's generally listed around the early-mid 2nd round. Would he be a reach at 31? If there's a run on CB's, I wouldn't mind seeing this guy brought in.

One thing is for sure, with all the uncertainty in the secondary the Broncos (even with Ward & Talib) will be looking for more depth and better play. I think they think their DL depth is finally OK, with the addition of DeMarcus, but the secondary remains a question mark, especially at CB.

Look at their situation:

Chris Harris is coming off serious knee injury and who knows when he'll be 100% and they lost DRC to FA. But, who's their Nickel CB? Kayvon Webster? Really? Hopefully, but to count on him is a stretch. Tony Carter, who was injured? Serious lack of depth there.

And at S? Rahim Moore? Omar Bolden who hasn't done much. Quinton Carter who has taken big steps back due to injury. Duke Ihenacho shows some promise of course. But, once again, after Ward there's not a ton of elite talent evident.

So, I'm betting either a S or CB is their pick at #31. I suppose it could be a G or LB, but there should be somebody there at #31 at CB or S they like.


So, yeah, they'd like a shot at a top CB. S if none they like falls.

[underrated29]

Coach (or anyone else) ... what do you think of Jimmie Ward? I've been watching some tape of his today and I'm really impressed by what I see. He's listed as a SS, but I see him as a FS on tape and in our system. I saw him make an athletic interception and lay the wood over the middle in the same game. His stock seems to be rising, but he's generally listed around the early-mid 2nd round. Would he be a reach at 31? If there's a run on CB's, I wouldn't mind seeing this guy brought in.



I love ward. I have us taking him in what I think the broncos do. He is a great FS and he can play NCB as well. I have heard from a few people that he will play as good as Jon Cyprien did last year. (he was a first rd pick I believe and one of the top S).....I also know the broncos seem to like ward quite a bit.
Thats why I think they will trade back and go Ward and Bitonio....but bitonio likely wont make it to our 2nd and neither would ward so its a bit far fetched..I wouldnt mind him at 31, imo.

[CoachChaz]

I've been seeing Ward projected in the first round a few places lately...so if we nabbed him at 31, I wouldnt be upset...but I think we need corners first.

[VonDoom]

I love ward. I have us taking him in what I think the broncos do. He is a great FS and he can play NCB as well. I have heard from a few people that he will play as good as Jon Cyprien did last year. (he was a first rd pick I believe and one of the top S).....I also know the broncos seem to like ward quite a bit.
Thats why I think they will trade back and go Ward and Bitonio....but bitonio likely wont make it to our 2nd and neither would ward so its a bit far fetched..I wouldnt mind him at 31, imo.

I just looked at your list of possible first round picks again, UR, and I wouldn't mind any of them except Bitonio. I think that's a bit of a reach in the first. I'm on board with any of those DB's, though, which I think is mostly assuming that Shazier and Mosley are gone. Trading back slightly to get Ward might work best, but either way, if we're talking both CB and S, SOMEONE has to be there. I'm not that sold on Roby so far, and I see he wasn't on your list.

You also mentioned Gaines as a CB we could pick up later. I've heard people talking about him lately, but I didn't see anything spectacular on tape so far. What am I missing?


I listed him and Bucannon as guys I was really interested in before we signed TJ. Ward seems a bit small for SS, but his coverage skills are really good. I think FS is in his future...but then again, the lines are really skewed anymore when it comes to defining a SS and a FS.

Nevertheless...I can see him coming off the board by the mid-second round

I've been on the Bucannon train for a while, though I agree about your point on TJ. That's more the role I would see Bucannon playing for us, while J. Ward seems better in coverage to me. That's the reason I jumped to Ward at this point.

[underrated29]

I have heard gaines could be a top 50 pick now and perhaps has jumped some of the other corners that were late first rd like Roby and maybe verrett...I just started looking at him, but the guy did have a ton of pass break ups- like 27- in two years time. What I saw was even though he may let the wr get the ball he would almost always knock it out. I have only seen a little bit of this guy and I am by no means as good at this as coach and G and some of the others but knocking that ball free and or being able to turn his head for the ball in the NFL means no PI and lots of incompletes.

I still need to see more on him, but those skills are hard to come by. They remind me of champ. He was always, imo one of the best at knocking the ball from the WR hands...not just mirroring them along the way.

[VonDoom]

I have heard gaines could be a top 50 pick now and perhaps has jumped some of the other corners that were late first rd like Roby and maybe verrett...I just started looking at him, but the guy did have a ton of pass break ups- like 27- in two years time. What I saw was even though he may let the wr get the ball he would almost always knock it out. I have only seen a little bit of this guy and I am by no means as good at this as coach and G and some of the others but knocking that ball free and or being able to turn his head for the ball in the NFL means no PI and lots of incompletes.

I still need to see more on him, but those skills are hard to come by. They remind me of champ. He was always, imo one of the best at knocking the ball from the WR hands...not just mirroring them along the way.

I didn't see much of that on the two tapes I watched, but I did hear that was his big selling point. I'd be happy if that translated to the NFL. You know, if he's on my team. Like I said, I'm kind of down on Roby, but Verrett might hit that sweet spot of being there at 31 and I'd be happy with him there.

[underrated29]

I didn't see much of that on the two tapes I watched, but I did hear that was his big selling point. I'd be happy if that translated to the NFL. You know, if he's on my team. Like I said, I'm kind of down on Roby, but Verrett might hit that sweet spot of being there at 31 and I'd be happy with him there.



Ya, I hear ya about roby...I had for us at 31 just a few weeks ago and the guy scares the piss out of me. All the skills and speed and tenacity but he sucked balls his senior year. I hate players like that. One year wonders...Rahim moore was that way. Jarvis moss too. Not saying roby will be, he could be just like a DRC if coached up, but when I pick in the first round I want a Proven player with years of play to back it up. Roby does not do that and thats why I am right there with you on him. Most likely a boom or bust. I bet he actually turns out ok if he goes to the right team. But why chance it with a first rd pick? Guys like Aaron Colvin who are that good but got hurt are worth that mid rd pick.

I also agree with you on Verrett. Like him a lot. He could be the best cover corner in the draft. As everyone says, if he was 2 inches taller he probably would be lock for the top spot. I love his game, love it! Not as much as xavier rhodes from last year, but those are two totally different types of players. I just wonder if Verrett is off our radar because of our size and Elways want to get bigger. Remember, he was wanted big CBs the last few years- missed out on kirpatrick to bengals. Last year Minnesota effed us royally when they took Rhodes right before us. All big guys- so I wonder if the FO likes him or not. I would not mind one bit! Instantly better than small tony carter thats for sure.

The wait is killing me!

[VonDoom]

I also agree with you on Verrett. Like him a lot. He could be the best cover corner in the draft. As everyone says, if he was 2 inches taller he probably would be lock for the top spot. I love his game, love it! Not as much as xavier rhodes from last year, but those are two totally different types of players. I just wonder if Verrett is off our radar because of our size and Elways want to get bigger. Remember, he was wanted big CBs the last few years- missed out on kirpatrick to bengals. Last year Minnesota effed us royally when they took Rhodes right before us. All big guys- so I wonder if the FO likes him or not. I would not mind one bit! Instantly better than small tony carter thats for sure.

The wait is killing me!

Same here, man.

I like the idea (generally) of getting bigger and meaner, but Verrett looks so good to me that I'm not going to knock his size. I remember wanting Rhodes last year. Do you think we would have taken him if he had been there? I remember Sly not really being on my radar at the time but all I heard from Elway afterwards was how lucky we were that he was still there at 28. I don't know if they would have passed him up for Rhodes, but I know he was one of my wants from last draft.

[underrated29]

Oh ya. It is known that we wanted Rhodes. He was our man all the way. He still imo is the best Cb from that draft class and there were some good ones. Oaklands Dj hayden being one of them.

[Simple Jaded]

No more gottdamned safeties!

[underrated29]

No more gottdamned safeties!



We need at least one fs...

We have a hurt rahim at fs..we have tj at SS. We have bruton as st/s..we have always injured carter at SS. Duke at SS and rahim will also be a fa this year.

So rahim and carter are the only 2 fs...Omar boldin blows and will not make the roster.

We need a as. Specifically a fs

[silkamilkamonico]

We need at least one fs...

We have a hurt rahim at fs..we have tj at SS. We have bruton as st/s..we have always injured carter at SS. Duke at SS and rahim will also be a fa this year.

So rahim and carter are the only 2 fs...Omar boldin blows and will not make the roster.

We need a as. Specifically a fs

Later in the draft. A lotmore pressing needs that S. If we do grab a safety it better be Round 4 or after.

[underrated29]

Later in the draft. A lotmore pressing needs that S. If we do grab a safety it better be Round 4 or after.



I disagree. We have rahim Moore who is coming off a weird ass injury and we have no clue how he will come back. He is also a fa this year. After him we have qui ton carter as the only other fs on the roster. Carter has never played a full season to my knowledge. We desperately need a fs.

IMO it's fs, cb, mlb, Ol, de as our needs. I don't really care which round or where we get them but there is a bigger drop off on cbs and DBS then Ol, de and mlb (which is pretty weak overall). So to me we need to look early at cb and fs..

Ooh, I forgot wr as a need too.

[VonDoom]

I disagree. We have rahim Moore who is coming off a weird ass injury and we have no clue how he will come back. He is also a fa this year. After him we have qui ton carter as the only other fs on the roster. Carter has never played a full season to my knowledge. We desperately need a fs.

IMO it's fs, cb, mlb, Ol, de as our needs. I don't really care which round or where we get them but there is a bigger drop off on cbs and DBS then Ol, de and mlb (which is pretty weak overall). So to me we need to look early at cb and fs..

Ooh, I forgot wr as a need too.

I pretty much agree with all of this. I'd say we could use a late round RB too, for depth. But there are essentially four safeties being talked about in this draft early - Clinton-Dix, Pryor, Ward and Bucannon. The first two may be out of our range, so it can't hurt to look at the others, especially if there's a run on CB's. I think there's a big drop off after that. With Franklin's move to LG, I think any OL drafted would only be depth anyway, so we don't necessarily need to go there early. I want a WR too, but again, I doubt they'll be a major contributor now. That leaves CB, S and LB. Elway hasn't really prioritized MLB to this point, and he'll either stick Irving there or move Trev and draft a OLB (potentially Shazier?) I just feel like DB makes the most sense early, whether it's a CB or a S.

[Simple Jaded]

If Denver felt they were in desperate need of a FS they wouldn't have spent big on a SS, imo.

I like the idea of late round sleepers like Exum or Dowling.

[underrated29]

If Denver felt they were in desperate need of a FS they wouldn't have spent big on a SS, imo.

I like the idea of late round sleepers like Exum or Dowling.




I like exum a lot!!! I'd burn a third rd pick on him just to ensure we got him. I bet he probably goes in the third anyway. His talent is too good to let slide.

I disagree about the safety thing tho. Iirc we were still rumored to be going after jarius Byrd AFTER we signed tj ward.

I bet w draft at least one safety in this draft and I also bet it happens before the 4th rd.

[DenBronx]

Ive been wanting a MLB since forever ago. But I wouldnt complain if we got a CB or DE. preferably CB if MLB is off the table on day 1.

[Simple Jaded]

I like exum a lot!!! I'd burn a third rd pick on him just to ensure we got him. I bet he probably goes in the third anyway. His talent is too good to let slide.

I disagree about the safety thing tho. Iirc we were still rumored to be going after jarius Byrd AFTER we signed tj ward.

I bet w draft at least one safety in this draft and I also bet it happens before the 4th rd.


If a top S drops I'm cool with that, I like Moore but whatever, if Clinton-Dix is there that's a different story.

The rest are just guys, that's the story with S's these days, true impact S's are as hard to find as franchise QB's. To me there's no discernible difference between Swearinger/McDonald and The Dream, Kenny Vacario is another story but I see no point in wasting 2's and 3's on something you already have.

Although, TJ Ward and Swearinger in the same backfield? Denver would have the single most chickenshit S tandem but TE's would be running scared knowing that no knee is sacred.

Btw, your mock strongly suggests that you've been reading my diary. :salute:

[Simple Jaded]

Ive been wanting a MLB since forever ago. But I wouldnt complain if we got a CB or DE. preferably CB if MLB is off the table on day 1.

I would prefer they draft an OLB and convert him to MLB, I am aware that they are different positions but their SLB is a hybrid so wtf. If you draft Shazier and move him or Trevathon and they fail you can still get a player that can contribute, if you draft some T-Rex MLB with a bad shoulder and he fails you've got nothing.

If Shazier and Borland are flawed I'll take the player with 3-down/diverse ability.

[Simple Jaded]

Btw, the '15 MLB class is looking far better than recent drafts, Denzel Perryman, AJ Johnson, Stephone Anthony and Trey DePreist. That's just the Sr's.

[TXBRONC]

I like exum a lot!!! I'd burn a third rd pick on him just to ensure we got him. I bet he probably goes in the third anyway. His talent is too good to let slide.

I disagree about the safety thing tho. Iirc we were still rumored to be going after jarius Byrd AFTER we signed tj ward.

I bet w draft at least one safety in this draft and I also bet it happens before the 4th rd.


Rumors are not always factual.

[silkamilkamonico]

Why is we a need?

[underrated29]

Why is we a need?



Wr?

Because we only have 4 on the roster right now. I'm sure someone like Greg Orton will make it this year out of camp but that's only 5. Plus, welker is a fa next year and sanders can play the slot for a lot less which means we need another #2. Caldwell is not that guy. It's unlikely anyone on the ps is either....we need a wr or two to compete.

[Denver Native (Carol)]

So much went right for the Broncos last season. Peyton Manning made history, directing an offense that crushed teams and dreams with a dizzying array of weapons.

Then on the biggest stage, Denver was numbed by the Seahawks, creating a trollapalooza on Twitter of what's wrong with the Broncos. While Manning fizzled, the Super Bowl rudely revealed a larger concern: a lack of defensive toughness.

General manager John Elway, obsessive as ever with another title, began addressing the issue in free agency with an American Express Centurion card, signing pass rusher DeMarcus Ware, cornerback Aqib Talib and safety T.J. Ward to a guaranteed $35 million.

rest - http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_25696707/denver-broncos-first-round-draft-pick-thursday-could

[silkamilkamonico]

Wr?

Because we only have 4 on the roster right now. I'm sure someone like Greg Orton will make it this year out of camp but that's only 5. Plus, welker is a fa next year and sanders can play the slot for a lot less which means we need another #2. Caldwell is not that guy. It's unlikely anyone on the ps is either....we need a wr or two to compete.

WR isn't a "need". We need depth at WR, but the hope there is they don't ever play. Between DThomas, JThomas, WWelker, and ESanders, we have arguably not only the most prolific set of receivers in the NFL at the moment, but arguably of all time, right up there with our set last year.

There isn't any player that's going to come in and beat out any of those 4 to make an immediate impact this year. This draft should be ALL ABOUT this year and maybe next. I understand we are going to have to add another WR somewhere before the season starts, but if Denver goes Big Al and takes Moncreif in the first, or any WR in the first three rounds or so, I will start questioning the direction this organization really wants to go. Are you building for the future or do you want to win now?

I would think it's quite clear after the SuperBowl debacle that there are far more pressing issues than WR.

[underrated29]

WR isn't a "need". We need depth at WR, but the hope there is they don't ever play. Between DThomas, JThomas, WWelker, and ESanders, we have arguably not only the most prolific set of receivers in the NFL at the moment, but arguably of all time, right up there with our set last year.

There isn't any player that's going to come in and beat out any of those 4 to make an immediate impact this year. This draft should be ALL ABOUT this year and maybe next. I understand we are going to have to add another WR somewhere before the season starts, but if Denver goes Big Al and takes Moncreif in the first, or any WR in the first three rounds or so, I will start questioning the direction this organization really wants to go. Are you building for the future or do you want to win now?

I would think it's quite clear after the SuperBowl debacle that there are far more pressing issues than WR.




Elway said the draft is for the future and FA is for now. To me that would mean drafting a WR at some point. While I agree a 1st is too high for moncrief, I wouldnt be shocked if we took one within the first 3 rounds....However, its more likely that we will take one or two 4th or later.

[CoachChaz]

Welker will be a FA...DT will be a FA...JT will be a FA. Right now, there are NO guarantees any of them are Broncos in 12 months. WR is definitely something we need to look at.

[silkamilkamonico]

Elway said the draft is for the future and FA is for now. To me that would mean drafting a WR at some point. While I agree a 1st is too high for moncrief, I wouldnt be shocked if we took one within the first 3 rounds....However, its more likely that we will take one or two 4th or later.

I think he needs to do everything in his power to help this team get a ring this year or next. I think they have shown through free agency that they won't be the type of front office that is going to extend its players and will gladly risk losing them via free agency, and want to build more through free agency. I don't think their drafts, other than the first with with Miller, have been particularly impressive. SuperBowl shows a great defense will always beat a great offense IMHO. We had the best offense in the history of the NFL, our defense could have pitched a shutout in the SuperBowl and we still would have lost, so I just don't see how the mentality should be something of, "we need to get more powerful on offense".

We need to continue to solidfy the defense IMHO and that's that. Draft defense, other than if they can help can a contributor to the oline. But IMHO there is not a QB/RB/WR/TE that is going to help us win a SuperBowl with the main makeup of our team. If Manning retires in the next year or 2 and we don't get a SuperBowl, it's going to be one of the biggest lost opportunities in all of sports. Just my opinion, not a failure, just a crushing lost opportunity.

[silkamilkamonico]

Welker will be a FA...DT will be a FA...JT will be a FA. Right now, there are NO guarantees any of them are Broncos in 12 months. WR is definitely something we need to look at.

If the organization doesn't do everything in it's power to retain DT and JT, I simply do not like their mentality of "always building through free agency". Good organizations draft well, develop them, and keep them. If they lose them because they choose to leave, that's one thing, but letting them test the free agency waters and set their market value is just f'n retarded. They will most definitely lose them because someone will always overpay.

[tomjonesrocks]

I think they have shown through free agency that they won't be the type of front office that is going to extend its players and will gladly risk losing them via free agency, and want to build more through free agency.

That's not entirely fair. While Denver let some big guys walk with surprisingly little effort to even keep them on the cheap, they made a legitimate run for DRC--and if he weren't as dumb as a box of rocks Talib would be playing somewhere else.

[silkamilkamonico]

That's not entirely fair. While Denver let some big guys walk with surprisingly little effort to even keep them on the cheap, they made a legitimate run for DRC--and if he weren't as dumb as a box of rocks Talib would be playing somewhere else.

He wasn't even someone they drafted. I won't hold too much thought in what happened this past free agency with letting players set market value because it's 1 term and there are too many variables.

I just saw how Seattle's defense completely controlled us (and everyone they faced). If that defense continues to build the rest of the NFL is in alot of trouble IMHO - they already are. If I wasn't so biased on that game, it would have been a thing of beauty to watch that defense completely manhandle the greatest offense in the history of the NFL. I thought what the Patriots did to the Greatest Show on Turf was outstanding, this was far even more dominating.

[Cugel]

Elway said the draft is for the future and FA is for now. To me that would mean drafting a WR at some point. While I agree a 1st is too high for moncrief, I wouldnt be shocked if we took one within the first 3 rounds....However, its more likely that we will take one or two 4th or later.

There IS NO FUTURE! Even Elway said "There is no Plan B. We're going Plan A!"

After Manning there is Brock Osweiler and 5-10 years of mediocrity or worse. No Super-Bowls, possible losing seasons, struggling to make the playoffs at 10-6.

Remember Shanahan after Elway? That's exactly what we can expect. If we get a Jake Plummer 5 years after Manning retires that will be lucky. So, I'd say "FA is for now and the draft is for now and everything is now."

I suppose Elway is under some delusion that by building a solid "foundation" he can avoid the horrors of post-Manning life. That's his job. But, it's a doomed effort. In the NFL you either have an elite QB or you're an also-ran. Period.

And Brock Osweiler is not ever going to be an elite QB. The chances of that are less than 1% given the number of QBs taken in the late second round or later who have been any good (out of about 130+ QBs drafted since Tom Brady in 2001, there's Nick Foles - maybe - and Russell Wilson). That's pretty much it (unless you want to count Tony Romo which none of the Dallas fans do).

[Cugel]

I just saw how Seattle's defense completely controlled us (and everyone they faced). If that defense continues to build the rest of the NFL is in alot of trouble IMHO - they already are. If I wasn't so biased on that game, it would have been a thing of beauty to watch that defense completely manhandle the greatest offense in the history of the NFL. I thought what the Patriots did to the Greatest Show on Turf was outstanding, this was far even more dominating.

Seattle isn't going to be able to keep their defense together for the long term any more than the Ravens after 2000 and the Bucs after 2003. Every team in the league wants their FAs now. As soon as their backups hit the FA market they will get big money offers from other teams, and they will be gone.

Then Russell Wilson is not going to be making less than $1 million a year in 2015. He's going to be making $20 million which is the going rate for a SB caliber QB. (Eli Manning and Aaron Rogers and Joe Flacco money). That will put a crimp in their team because they won't be able to afford to keep everybody.

But THIS year they will be formidable still because they still have virtually everybody important under contract. The even re-signed Michael Bennett. So, they get one more year to make a run at another SB before their salary cap hits the wall. After that they will have to do what every other team does -- let a bunch of guys go, like Denver let Eric Decker walk this season rather than paying him $7-8 million a year.

[underrated29]

There IS NO FUTURE! Even Elway said "There is no Plan B. We're going Plan A!"

After Manning there is Brock Osweiler and 5-10 years of mediocrity or worse. No Super-Bowls, possible losing seasons, struggling to make the playoffs at 10-6.

Remember Shanahan after Elway? That's exactly what we can expect. If we get a Jake Plummer 5 years after Manning retires that will be lucky. So, I'd say "FA is for now and the draft is for now and everything is now."

I suppose Elway is under some delusion that by building a solid "foundation" he can avoid the horrors of post-Manning life. That's his job. But, it's a doomed effort. In the NFL you either have an elite QB or you're an also-ran. Period.

And Brock Osweiler is not ever going to be an elite QB. The chances of that are less than 1% given the number of QBs taken in the late second round or later who have been any good (out of about 130+ QBs drafted since Tom Brady in 2001, there's Nick Foles - maybe - and Russell Wilson). That's pretty much it (unless you want to count Tony Romo which none of the Dallas fans do).





Thats an illogical statement. First of all it 100% contradicts the exact words from elway. Secondly, we have no clue about Brock. I dont care what the odds say. Brock is not part of that equation until he becomes part of that equation. Thirdly, I love russell wilson, but if you want to tell me he is elite or Joe Flacco is elite then you've completely lost all of your argument. Completely! And finally, who is to say that we do not draft, sign, develop an Elite QB in the next 5 years that you so eloquently described as mediocre at best? Especially when one considers, if we are as bad as you think we will be then we should be in a position to draft an Elite QB high in the first round.

[Dzone]

Xavier Su'a-Filo, lot of mocks having him go at 31

"I've worked hard to be the best guard in this draft," said Su'a-Filo, 23, who is leaving a year of eligibility on the table at UCLA but is older than most juniors because he spent two years on a Mormon mission after his freshman season. "I try to do my job, and I try to do it fast, and I try to do it violently."

http://www.latimes.com/sports/football/nfl/la-sp-nfl-draft-ucla-sua-filo-20140505,0,5241676.story#ixzz30sCZGRCZ

[Cugel]

Thats an illogical statement. First of all it 100% contradicts the exact words from elway. Secondly, we have no clue about Brock. I dont care what the odds say. Brock is not part of that equation until he becomes part of that equation. Thirdly, I love russell wilson, but if you want to tell me he is elite or Joe Flacco is elite then you've completely lost all of your argument. Completely! And finally, who is to say that we do not draft, sign, develop an Elite QB in the next 5 years that you so eloquently described as mediocre at best? Especially when one considers, if we are as bad as you think we will be then we should be in a position to draft an Elite QB high in the first round.

I'm sorry, but this is EXACTLY the same sort of blithering nonsense that I was hit with when I said the exact same thing after Elway retired. "Brian Griese can win a SB! Blah, blah, blah!" :rolleyes:

I do not insist that Russell Wilson is an "elite QB." What the hell does that mean? He won the SB, did he not? Are you going to argue that Joe Flacco, Eli Manning, and Ben Roethlisberger aren't an "elite QBs" by some esoteric criteria of your own so you can then argue that "anybody can win?"

Anybody CAN'T win. It takes an "elite QB" to win, if by elite you mean he played at an elite level in the playoffs and SB.

Maybe Eli Manning isn't an "elite QB." He played like crap the last 2 seasons. But, he outplayed Tom Brady in the SB, twice. Joe Flacco isn't good enough in YOUR eyes to be an "elite QB?" Well he outplayed Peyton Manning last year in the playoffs! So did Russell Wilson this year in the SB!

Does that mean Peyton Manning ISN'T an "elite QB"?

All these guys are franchise QBs, and all of them are being payed about $18+ million a year. I say despite the lack of regular season games we've seen from Brock Osweiler that he'll never be an elite QB.

He doesn't look anything like one from any perspective, which is not surprising in that he was drafted in the late 2nd round where few QBs who ever turn out to be any good are taken. So, despite your saying "we don't know anything" we know plenty.

I hate people who act like it's all a huge mystery when it isn't. Simple statistics indicate that the chances of Brock Osweiler becoming a "franchise QB" or an "elite QB" or even a long-term starter are virtually nil.

And I for one do not think there's a chance in hell of him being very good. We will of course have to wait for a few more years for me to be proven right though, I have no doubt of the outcome, just as I was right when I said the same thing about Kyle Orton and Tim Tebow and was flamed mercilessly for my realism. I was right on both those occasions too, and the idiots who flamed me were wrong!

[underrated29]

I'm sorry, but this is EXACTLY the same sort of blithering nonsense that I was hit with when I said the exact same thing after Elway retired. "Brian Griese can win a SB! Blah, blah, blah!" :rolleyes:

I do not insist that Russell Wilson is an "elite QB." What the hell does that mean? He won the SB, did he not? Are you going to argue that Joe Flacco, Eli Manning, and Ben Roethlisberger aren't an "elite QBs" by some esoteric criteria of your own so you can then argue that "anybody can win?"

Anybody CAN'T win. It takes an "elite QB" to win, if by elite you mean he played at an elite level in the playoffs and SB.

Maybe Eli Manning isn't an "elite QB." He played like crap the last 2 seasons. But, he outplayed Tom Brady in the SB, twice. Joe Flacco isn't good enough in YOUR eyes to be an "elite QB?" Well he outplayed Peyton Manning last year in the playoffs! So did Russell Wilson this year in the SB!

Does that mean Peyton Manning ISN'T an "elite QB"?

All these guys are franchise QBs, and all of them are being payed about $18+ million a year. I say despite the lack of regular season games we've seen from Brock Osweiler that he'll never be an elite QB.

He doesn't look anything like one from any perspective, which is not surprising in that he was drafted in the late 2nd round where few QBs who ever turn out to be any good are taken. So, despite your saying "we don't know anything" we know plenty.

I hate people who act like it's all a huge mystery when it isn't. Simple statistics indicate that the chances of Brock Osweiler becoming a "franchise QB" or an "elite QB" or even a long-term starter are virtually nil.

And I for one do not think there's a chance in hell of him being very good. We will of course have to wait for a few more years for me to be proven right though, I have no doubt of the outcome, just as I was right when I said the same thing about Kyle Orton and Tim Tebow and was flamed mercilessly for my realism. I was right on both those occasions too, and the idiots who flamed me were wrong!




What?
There's lots of contradictions here cuges. I agree elite qbs win suoerbowls. But flacco is not elite. Russel Wilson is not elite yet either. But by your argument they are. Because they were elite in the playoffs. So by the same token Brock could just as easily be elite in the playoffs and win a Super Bowl. You said it yourself. Also, flacco was not getting paid 18mil when he won. Russell Wilson did not even get paid 1 mil when he won. So, no they don't have to be paid top dollar to be elite.

While you may have been right about that it doesn't mean you we right about this. You are using the same projective guessing you did last year when you INSISTED that knowshon Moreno was not going to make the roster. You insisted and many argued and you insisted some more based on some sort of statistical formula you had run. Etc etc.


Point is, you can think he is garbage. Which is fine, stats favor this, but saying he is garbage until we actually know he is, yet insisting he is is like I said. Illogical.

[Cugel]

What?
There's lots of contradictions here cuges. I agree elite qbs win suoerbowls. But flacco is not elite.

I would say that the definition of "elite" varies. People use it to mean different things. If by "elite" you mean: Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Drew Brees, Aaron Rogers, i.e. Hall of Fame guys, then no, Joe Flacco is probably not "elite." Neither is Eli Manning or Russell Wilson or Colin Kaepernick.

But, are those guys "franchise QBs?" Yes, and they proved their worth in the playoffs and SBs.


Russel Wilson is not elite yet either. But by your argument they are. Because they were elite in the playoffs. So by the same token Brock could just as easily be elite in the playoffs and win a Super Bowl. You said it yourself.

I think "elite" means playing at an elite level during the playoffs and leading a team to a SB. By that definition, which is after all the most important one, yes, Eli Manning is an "elite" QB. So is Flacco. Can Brock Osweiler get there? Of course I can't prove he won't at this point. But, I don't see anything to indicate it so far and the statistical odds are very much stacked against it.


Also, flacco was not getting paid 18mil when he won. Russell Wilson did not even get paid 1 mil when he won. So, no they don't have to be paid top dollar to be elite.

I don't argue that you need to pay your QB $18+ million to win the SB! :laugh: In fact, the Seahawks won in large measure because they are paying Wilson about $750,000 last year and this year. That frees up their cap money to spend on other players. But, that won't last! No way they will let him enter free agency after 2015. They're going to want to get a deal done during next off-season, just like the Ravens did with Flacco after the 2013 SB. That means they will have to pay him about $20 Million a year. They could theoretically put the Franchise Tag on him but that would cost them nearly as much money and would piss off their franchise QB. No way they're doing that!

[qutoe]While you may have been right about that it doesn't mean you we right about this. You are using the same projective guessing you did last year when you INSISTED that knowshon Moreno was not going to make the roster. You insisted and many argued and you insisted some more based on some sort of statistical formula you had run. Etc etc.[/quote]

I was thrilled that Knowshon proved himself last year. I did not think the Broncos would give him a chance because for some reason they seemed down on him. And of course they didn't even make him an offer this off-season, but pushed him out the door. Several years ago, I was calling him "No-Show" like a lot of people, but I didn't think that last season.


Point is, you can think he is garbage. Which is fine, stats favor this, but saying he is garbage until we actually know he is, yet insisting he is is like I said. Illogical.

I don't think Osweiler is "garbage." He looks like another Brian Griese to me, a guy who actually played for quite a few years in the league, but never amounted to anything. Another Kyle Orton would be another example.

That is exactly what to expect from any QB drafted after the first few picks of the second round. It is of course possible that Osweiler will turn out to be another Tom Brady, but from what we've seen that just isn't remotely likely.

[CoachChaz]

Exactly what have "we seen" from Osweiler that would indicate anything at all? Pre-season games and garbage time? I wont say he'll be great or that he'll suck, but that's because I havent seen enough to indicate one way or another. NO ONE has. It's all personal speculation at this point

[G_Money]

I hated picking Oz in the 2nd round with the fiery passion of a case of habanero eye-drops, but I agree with Chaz: we haven't seen enough to say. Matt Flynn made a ton of money off of a couple of games and has been bounced out of starting jobs in every situation since. If I'd seen two games like THAT from Oz it wouldn't be enough to say. Elway likes Oz, and he may never play an important down for us anyway before he's a free agent, if Manning keeps wanting to lace em up for a few more years.

But Oz will have to show something if and when he ever gets the reins. That was the draft I wanted Wilson OR Foles if we took a QB, and we took Oz. He's got some catching up to do.

~G

[Ziggy]

The closer the draft gets, the more I think Elway stays at 31 and nabs a lineman. He's shown the intelligence to invest in the trenches since he's been here, and it's shown on the field. Jackson, Nix, Sua'Filo, Ealy, Tuitt, Easley, Hageman, Yankee, Martin and Jernigan are all guys that I'll be watching for at 31. Two more days. Can't wait to watch this draft unfold.

[Cugel]

Exactly what have "we seen" from Osweiler that would indicate anything at all? Pre-season games and garbage time? I wont say he'll be great or that he'll suck, but that's because I havent seen enough to indicate one way or another. NO ONE has. It's all personal speculation at this point

I didn't expect much from him and he hasn't shown anything so far. In fairness, Manning dominates so thoroughly that he hasn't had a chance to "show what he can do" but I'd be amazed if he ever even gets the chance with the Broncos.

I think Manning is going to be here longer than Osweiler. If Manning plays another 2 years after this one, (and are you going to bet against it?) then Osweiler would be entering his 5th season before the starting job would be free for him. No way he'll stay that long. His contract will be up before then.

If Manning retires after this season, then they'll give Osweiler a try, but I imagine they will also look for some other QB to compete with him and not just hand him the starting job sight unseen.

Either way, the statistical odds say he's a long-shot at best to become a starter in this league.

[Traveler]

Because Denver has so few holes to fill, all 7 picks won't make the team. Wouldn't it be better to use some of those picks to go after the guy they really want?

Heard some talking head today suggest that Denver give up their 1st, 2nd & next years 2nd to move up for the guy they want. Although no sure thing, losing the 2nd next year is mitigated somewhat with the compensatory picks we should get for the players lost this offseason.

Comments?

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Because Denver has so few holes to fill, all 7 picks won't make the team. Wouldn't it be better to use some of those picks to go after the guy they really want?

Heard some talking head today suggest that Denver give up their 1st, 2nd & next years 2nd to move up for the guy they want. Although no sure thing, losing the 2nd next year is mitigated somewhat with the compensatory picks we should get for the players lost this offseason.

Comments?

I'm all for trading picks on rounds 5-7, especially 6 and 7. It seems the undrafted free agents have as good of a chance as the guys drafted in those rounds.

[VonDoom]

Because Denver has so few holes to fill, all 7 picks won't make the team. Wouldn't it be better to use some of those picks to go after the guy they really want?

Heard some talking head today suggest that Denver give up their 1st, 2nd & next years 2nd to move up for the guy they want. Although no sure thing, losing the 2nd next year is mitigated somewhat with the compensatory picks we should get for the players lost this offseason.

Comments?

I generally hate the idea of trading up. I figure it's better to use all seven picks and see how things shake out. Whoever makes it, makes it. At least it's more guys that have a chance to impress.

That being said, I think the real question is "the guy they really want." If there is such a guy here, and they feel he would be worth the picks, then who am I to say otherwise? I'd have to think it would be a CB, if there is such a guy. Shazier may fall to us, but I honestly don't think they break the bank to move up for him. The more I'm looking at mocks and team needs, though, the more likely it is that all of the big CB's are gone before we get to pick. If they really love, say, Fuller, then I think Elway might make his move. We need a corner, and watching these guys disappear from the draft board is going to be tough to watch on Thursday.

[Dzone]

So Mike Klis says the broncos are going to pick Kyle Van Noy BYU OLB at #1. Ok, if you say so. smh

[Simple Jaded]

Because Denver has so few holes to fill, all 7 picks won't make the team. Wouldn't it be better to use some of those picks to go after the guy they really want?

Heard some talking head today suggest that Denver give up their 1st, 2nd & next years 2nd to move up for the guy they want. Although no sure thing, losing the 2nd next year is mitigated somewhat with the compensatory picks we should get for the players lost this offseason.

Comments?

I like the idea of moving up, however, I am not expecting much (if any) compensatory picks.

[MOtorboat]

I didn't expect much from him and he hasn't shown anything so far. In fairness, Manning dominates so thoroughly that he hasn't had a chance to "show what he can do" but I'd be amazed if he ever even gets the chance with the Broncos.

I think Manning is going to be here longer than Osweiler.

So, you're basically just wasting our time with these long diatribes about how a guy who has played, something like, 10 snaps sucks?

Got it.

[TXBRONC]

There IS NO FUTURE! Even Elway said "There is no Plan B. We're going Plan A!"

After Manning there is Brock Osweiler and 5-10 years of mediocrity or worse. No Super-Bowls, possible losing seasons, struggling to make the playoffs at 10-6.

Remember Shanahan after Elway? That's exactly what we can expect. If we get a Jake Plummer 5 years after Manning retires that will be lucky. So, I'd say "FA is for now and the draft is for now and everything is now."

I suppose Elway is under some delusion that by building a solid "foundation" he can avoid the horrors of post-Manning life. That's his job. But, it's a doomed effort. In the NFL you either have an elite QB or you're an also-ran. Period.

And Brock Osweiler is not ever going to be an elite QB. The chances of that are less than 1% given the number of QBs taken in the late second round or later who have been any good (out of about 130+ QBs drafted since Tom Brady in 2001, there's Nick Foles - maybe - and Russell Wilson). That's pretty much it (unless you want to count Tony Romo which none of the Dallas fans do).

No this a total misinterpretation of what Elway has said.

[Cugel]

I'm all for trading picks on rounds 5-7, especially 6 and 7. It seems the undrafted free agents have as good of a chance as the guys drafted in those rounds.

Normally, moving up more than a couple of places costs too much and it's better to stay put and draft smart. But what's the point of "planning for the future" when there isn't going to be one? I know Elway doesn't think like that (no NFL GM will admit "when our franchise QB retires we're just going to suck for a few years") but that's exactly what happens anyway. Just ask teams like Miami and Minnesota who have been looking for a franchise QB for decades now.

So, I would be glad if they gave away the farm to move up in the draft and get impact players now. Might as well go all in and get that SB parade before Manning sails off into the sun-set and the Broncos settle in for a decade of mediocrity! They'll have plenty of chances to "build for the long term" then, but NO chances of winning a SB! So, I say rebuild when you have to.

Will it really matter if some late round LB turns out to be great 3 or 4 years from now if we've got another Kyle Orton as QB?

[Cugel]

So, you're basically just wasting our time with these long diatribes about how a guy who has played, something like, 10 snaps sucks?

Got it.

Actually, no. Apparently you don't get anything at all. :coffee:

This is a thread about the DRAFT. What should the Broncos strategy be in the draft this year and probably next? The normal thing is for NFL teams to use the draft to draft "for the long term." But if Brock Osweiler is NOT the "QB of the future" because his contract will expire before Manning decides to retire and he simply won't be here, and because he's statistically unlikely to be a long term starter anyway, then the Broncos do not have any QB at all "for the future."

And that means there ISN'T any viable future after Manning retires until they suck for a while, get a top 10-15 draft pick and get lucky enough to draft a new Franchise QB. Even that is not guaranteed of course. (See the Mike Shanahan years after Elway retired for an idea of what it will be like, we'll be struggling to make the playoffs every year and then running into Andrew Luck and getting spanked by the Colts, or something).

Thus, go all in now and move up and grab an impact player. Do it again next year. Worry about the long term when Manning retires.

[MOtorboat]

Actually, no. Apparently you don't get anything at all. :coffee:

This is a thread about the DRAFT. What should the Broncos strategy be in the draft this year and probably next? The normal thing is for NFL teams to use the draft to draft "for the long term." But if Brock Osweiler is NOT the "QB of the future" because his contract will expire before Manning decides to retire and he simply won't be here, and because he's statistically unlikely to be a long term starter anyway, then the Broncos do not have any QB at all "for the future."

And that means there ISN'T any viable future after Manning retires until they suck for a while, get a top 10-15 draft pick and get lucky enough to draft a new Franchise QB. Even that is not guaranteed of course. (See the Mike Shanahan years after Elway retired for an idea of what it will be like, we'll be struggling to make the playoffs every year and then running into Andrew Luck and getting spanked by the Colts, or something).

Thus, go all in now and move up and grab an impact player. Do it again next year. Worry about the long term when Manning retires.

And then have to come on here and read about how they didn't use the draft picks to help win a Super Bowl and their second rounder "hasn't shown anything" because there's a good reason he's a backup?

No thanks.

[Northman]

But if Brock Osweiler is NOT the "QB of the future" because his contract will expire before Manning decides to retire and he simply won't be here, and because he's statistically unlikely to be a long term starter anyway, then the Broncos do not have any QB at all "for the future."

Based on what? Denver could easily resign Brock if they needed too. Its not like he is commanding a lot of money at this point. Its not like all backup QB's suddenly bolt from a team once their initial contracts are up.


And that means there ISN'T any viable future after Manning retires

Again, based on what? We have yet to see Brock play any meaningful games or for any length of time. We dont know what we have in Brock yet even as he sits on the bench. You are just simply continuing to talk out your ass about shit you dont understand.

[artie_dale]

Sheesh! We really worried about Brock Osweiller? I'm still confident Peyton will play at least two more seasons. Brock will resign. We definitely do not need to trade up or use an early pick on a QB in this draft. No thank you.

[chazoe60]

I think Cugel should run the draft, he's obviously smarter than everybody else, including Elway. I'd also like for him to tell me the power ball numbers since along with Draft genius he's also clairvoyant. :rolleyes:


I've never seen people get so worked up about a second round pick as they do with Osweiler. The FO and Coaching staff seem to like him, that speaks more to me than an obsessed idiot on a MB who can't stop ranting about a 2nd round back up QB.

[NightTerror218]

Part of me will not be shocked to see Elway move up for Mosley. Its a hole he really tried to fill with FA and he could not get it done. Only hole with no starter.

If Mosley falls a little I can see this more likely to happen.

[TXBRONC]

Because Denver has so few holes to fill, all 7 picks won't make the team. Wouldn't it be better to use some of those picks to go after the guy they really want?

Heard some talking head today suggest that Denver give up their 1st, 2nd & next years 2nd to move up for the guy they want. Although no sure thing, losing the 2nd next year is mitigated somewhat with the compensatory picks we should get for the players lost this offseason.

Comments?

I think there is plenty of space for seven new picks.

[Simple Jaded]

Osweiler was Manning insurance, not drafting a Plan B at that time woulda been stupid and irresponsible. Once they dumped Tebow they had nothing behind Manning. Look at the garbage coming out in the last drafts and just be glad Denver doesn't need a QB.

[underrated29]

Part of me will not be shocked to see Elway move up for Mosley. Its a hole he really tried to fill with FA and he could not get it done. Only hole with no starter.

If Mosley falls a little I can see this more likely to happen.

I predict it's shazier or a top cb like Gilbert or dez.
I also predict that shaz will go before Mosley and that greenbay will take shaz...if by chance both shaz and Mosley are there when greenbay picks they will take shaz and Mosley will fall to us.

[NightTerror218]

I predict it's shazier or a top cb like Gilbert or dez.
I also predict that shaz will go before Mosley and that greenbay will take shaz...if by chance both shaz and Mosley are there when greenbay picks they will take shaz and Mosley will fall to us.

Shaz I think is a solid WLB. Greenbay has Hawk at MLB and he runs show on defense. Shaz is rising in stock fast Mosley is losing due to health concerns.

If both are gone I see a CB or OL being first. Yankley or whatever that Standford OG is falling to like 3rd round in many drafts.

Either way I am excited for tomorrow

[Lancane]

Sorry I haven't been on guys, been hectic around here. Anyways, just wanted to throw a couple points out there that need to be rationalized before this evening and over the next few days with the draft. One of which right now there is a huge possibility that Denver plans to move up and not down in the draft, it's back channel talk of course but Denver's primary targets are all expected to be gone before Denver's pick, what we've been able to determine as official is that the Broncos have met with Brandin Cooks, Ryan Shazier, C.J. Mosley, Justin Gilbert, Deone Bucannon, Jimmie Ward, Kyle Fuller, Xavier Su'a-Filo, Joel Bitonio, Allen Robinson, Scott Crichton and Weston Richburg who could be taken in the first and not considered a poor pick, give that Denver's top four are not expected to last and that most can be had later in the second with only one or two of the offensive lineman graded to go in round one available at that pick or likely available and with Franklin confirming his move inside and the last years addition of Vasquez, Denver choosing a guard is far less likely at this point. There remains a possibility that Denver trades out, as it is plausible every draft, but the Broncos despite what some on here believe don't have a lot of room on the roster, under Elway the Broncos have cut draftees of that years' and the previous draft every off-season because they are overstocked or can not beat out those ahead of them on the depth chart. Denver has few holes and fewer depth issues then some speculate, having two second round picks and adding a mid round pick might not be worth it due to the state of the roster compared to trading up and nabbing someone they think can make an impact, Corner and Mike Linebacker are the two key positions for the Broncos in this draft, all else is gravy.

I see a number of possibilities and despite the **** that Cudgel is getting, don't discount drafting a quarterback in round one even with Osweiler on the roster, the Broncos have met with numerous quarterbacks this off-season, more then usual. However, if they do look for them to target Tom Savage or Jimmy Garoppolo at 31, maybe even Derek Carr or A.J. McCarron, someone that can play in their offense not needs an offense catered to them like Manziel, Brigdewater, etc. However, I don't see that happening, they may reach and take one of their higher ranked second round choices, trade down and nab more then one...but the mere fact that they met Gilbert who is the top corner in the draft and expected to go before the teens get underway makes me think they plan to move and up not down hoping to get him or one of their other top four which would be Mosley, Shazier or Fuller or at least that is the talk.

Right now I see Denver trying to leap frog Green Bay and Arizona for a chance at one of the four.

[underrated29]

I was just thinking about you yesterday Lan. I was thinking of the draft guys we usually see and you were one who had been missing. Glad to see you post.

[Traveler]

There remains a possibility that Denver trades out, as it is plausible every draft, but the Broncos despite what some on here believe don't have a lot of room on the roster, under Elway the Broncos have cut draftees of that years' and the previous draft every off-season because they are overstocked or can not beat out those ahead of them on the depth chart. Denver has few holes and fewer depth issues then some speculate, having two second round picks and adding a mid round pick might not be worth it due to the state of the roster compared to trading up and nabbing someone they think can make an impact, Corner and Mike Linebacker are the two key positions for the Broncos in this draft, all else is gravy.

I've said as much earlier. Unless their top 4 are all off the board before selections 10-15, I guessing Denver makes it selection in the mid teens.

[Northman]

I see a number of possibilities and despite the **** that Cudgel is getting, don't discount drafting a quarterback in round one

Not happening. :coffee:

[Ziggy]

CJ Mosely is the one player that would single handedly change the scope of this defense. Having a pure MLB with his coverage skills would allow the Broncos to be stronger in both base and nickel D. When teams go to the no huddle, the Broncos can stay in base without Von having to drop into coverage. It essentially gives us an extra pass rusher there. In nickel, it allows TJ Ward to do what he does best. Elway said that they might have to use him as a coverage LB in nickel D. Mosely would allow him to play safety and roam the middle as an enforcer the way Cam Chanceller does in the Seahawks D. As much as I hate to mortgage later draft picks by moving up, I'd be on board with going up to get CJ.

[underrated29]

CJ Mosely is the one player that would single handedly change the scope of this defense. Having a pure MLB with his coverage skills would allow the Broncos to be stronger in both base and nickel D. When teams go to the no huddle, the Broncos can stay in base without Von having to drop into coverage. It essentially gives us an extra pass rusher there. In nickel, it allows TJ Ward to do what he does best. Elway said that they might have to use him as a coverage LB in nickel D. Mosely would allow him to play safety and roam the middle as an enforcer the way Cam Chanceller does in the Seahawks D. As much as I hate to mortgage later draft picks by moving up, I'd be on board with going up to get CJ.



I think the same but for Shazier.

Shazier gives up to mosley on:
Being a full time MLB
Recognition
Shedding blocks (although both are not very good at it)

Shazier Has on mosley:
Size- or room to add more
Speed- in bundles and bundles to cover ALL TEs and most WR
Ability to Blitz and sack like Von Miller

I think a little coaching can get Shazier to shed blocks and know his assignments.

[silkamilkamonico]

Am really hoping Denver can trade down out of the first - alot of talent in that 2nd and 3rd round pool. If we could grab an additional one or so that would be excellent.

[tomjonesrocks]

Am really hoping Denver can trade down out of the first - alot of talent in that 2nd and 3rd round pool. If we could grab an additional one or so that would be excellent.

That would be really anti-climactic. I really didn't like when they did it for Wolfe (missing on Doug Martin in the process) and really wouldn't like it in "win right now or bust" mode.

Getting more players that won't make the roster to get stolen off the practice squad a la Tavarras King makes no sense to me.

[chazoe60]

That would be really anti-climactic. I really didn't like when they did it for Wolfe (missing on Doug Martin in the process) and really wouldn't like it in "win right now or bust" mode.

Getting more players that won't make the roster to get stolen off the practice squad a la Tavarras King makes no sense to me.
I agree. I don't think we have enough holes to be stockpiling a bunch of picks. This year it's quality over quantity IMHO.

[Lancane]

With Gilbert, Shazier, Fuller and Mosley all off the board, some players that Denver may target outside those they met could be looking at could be Carl Bradford of Arizona State or Kyle Van Noy of Brigham Young both are on the bigger side for being outside linebackers who they may try and convert to the inside, maybe Morgan Moses the big offensive tackle from Virginia to man the right tackle position or look at Kony Ealy from Missouri or Demarcus Lawrence from Boise St. to help at end. Right now I am leaning toward Stanley Jean-Baptiste the big corner from Nebraska who could be the Broncos' Sherman especially given the health concerns from the position.

[OB]

Ha Ha Clinton Dix. How is that a name. Why. Why would you do that to your child.

[chazoe60]

Ha Ha Clinton Dix. How is that a name. Why. Why would you do that to your child.
Pick me! Pick me! I know this one!

[Lancane]

Ha Ha Clinton Dix. How is that a name. Why. Why would you do that to your child.

Sounds like they named after a drug binge watching the Simpsons...lol. But I wouldn't have minded him coming to Denver despite the name.

[underrated29]

His name is hasean but his grandma nicknamed him ha ha

[Lancane]

His name is hasean but his grandma nicknamed him ha ha

Glad that she isn't my grandmother, what would she have called me Ca Ca? LMFAO.