Is it time to get rid of Fox for Gruden, Cowher, Dungy?

[TimHippo]

Ultimately he did not have the Broncos prepared to play in the Super Bowl after two weeks of preparation. And was unable to make any adjustments during the game.
Fox has shown the ability to only get so far with the Broncos and with Carolina before that.

Assuming Manning comes back and there is a 1 year window with him do you stick with Fox or do you try to upgrade with Gruden, Cowher, Dungy for one last shot at a World Title. This team is still really close to winning it all but Fox seems like the captain of the Titanic or Custard leading his troops to slaughter at the Little Big Horn in the big games. It would be a tough decision to remove him but it may be necessary to get to the next level with the window closing.

[Tned]

Ok, Broncos not only go to the playoffs three years in a row, but win multiple playoff games and go to the super bowl, compared to one playoff win in 12 years before Fox came to Denver.

I'm sure Elway and Bowlen are ready to replace him.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Forum Runner

[chazoe60]

Tell me more about this Custard fellow.

[aberdien]

I think we need to stick with Fox at least as long as we have Manning. Also make sure he doesn't have control of the red flag.

After that though, pick some younger up and coming, not Josh McDaniels kind of guy. Getting Gruden/Cowher/Dungy is looking towards the past. Their best years are behind them.

[chazoe60]

I think we need to stick with Fox at least as long as we have Manning. Also make sure he doesn't have control of the red flag.

After that though, pick some younger up and coming, not Josh McDaniels kind of guy. Getting Gruden/Cowher/Dungy is looking towards the past. Their best years are behind them.
Adam Gase?

[TimHippo]

I think we need to stick with Fox at least as long as we have Manning. Also make sure he doesn't have control of the red flag.

After that though, pick some younger up and coming, not Josh McDaniels kind of guy. Getting Gruden/Cowher/Dungy is looking towards the past. Their best years are behind them.

Dungy could fix the defense and already has a great relationship with Manning.

[silkamilkamonico]

Dungy could fix the defense and already has a great relationship with Manning.


Dungy couldn't fix the defense in 6 years at Indianapolis or whatever.

[TimHippo]

Tell me more about this Custard fellow.

Custard came into the big game with a high powered offense with superior weapons but fell into Sitting Bull & Crazy's Horse's trap. The lack of communication between Reno, Benteen and Custard further complicated things and snow balled into a complete route by the Indians who enjoyed a size and speed advantage.

[weazel]

I think everyone needs to just step back and take a deep breath for a few days...

[TimHippo]

Dungy couldn't fix the defense in 6 years at Indianapolis or whatever.

That's a myth that keeps getting recycled by fanbois. His defenses were quite good and him and Manning won a Super Bowl.

[aberdien]

Adam Gase?
Hellz yeah.


Dungy could fix the defense and already has a great relationship with Manning.
Lol no. The defense didn't lose the game for us. Fox already has a great relationship with Manning. No need to live in the past.

[chazoe60]

The weird thing about that game was that our defense actually played fairly well. The Seahawks could have won that game without their offense ever having the ball. I remember thinking at one point after we punted "Thank God our defense is coming on the field, we may have a chance to get back in this thing" :sad: but :laugh:

[dogfish]

stupid thread is stupid. . .

[Mike]

No, let Fox ride on his contract. Re-evaluate next season when it is up.

[TimHippo]

stupid thread is stupid. . .

Not sure why Fox is off limits while people keep trash Manning. It's like an ostrich sticking it's head in the sand with comments like that.

The team was not prepared yesterday and failed to make any adjustments to what Seattle was doing. That's on Fox.

[elsid13]

Fox is not going anywhere. He just got his team to the Superbowl and Denver would be behaving like the Al Davis Raiders if they fired him.

[Dreadnought]

Fox is not going anywhere. He just got his team to the Superbowl and Denver would be behaving like the Al Davis Raiders if they fired him.


Fox is not going anywhere. He just got his team to the Superbowl and Denver would be behaving like the Al Davis Raiders if they fired him.

QFT. Twice.

[silkamilkamonico]

That's a myth that keeps getting recycled by fanbois. His defenses were quite good and him and Manning won a Super Bowl.

If quite good equals

2002 = 25th
2003 = 22nd
2004 = 4th
2005 = 22nd
2006 = 12th
2007 = 30th
2008 = 22nd

If that's somehow fixed and quite good, then Denver's right on track with what they already have. Dungy did nothing to turn the mentality of that defense around. He had 1 good year, 1 average to above average year, and 5 bad to terrible defenses.

[tomjonesrocks]

I don't think it's stupid at all. I don't see Cowher and the rest of the ultra-high-dollar names as something that makes sense, but the way this team lost last night should result in at the very least bring Elway to look at the options available.

If Denver fired Fox after this I'd understand it.

[Lancane]

First off, there is a reason that the NFL's silent mantra is 'Not For Long' and no coach or any one player is above that slight fact. Fox led us to the playoffs three times in three years, so Allen had nothing to do with it nor did McCoy? Since Allen has left the Broncos defense has steadily gotten worse and what the hell did Fox do that helped Tebow lead this team anywhere? Sorry, but McCoy had more to do with that and I think that is obvious with what he's done in San Diego. "Fox this" and "Fox that", yeah, because this team was so prepared that they made a game of the Super Bowl, right? He is accountable in the end as well. Dan Reeves was a far better coach and he was expendable, Shanahan won two Super Bowls and he's expendable. I don't give a **** that you did this or that, this is a sport based on winning and in three years the offense has gotten better while the defense, his forte by the way has gotten worse and worse. The Broncos were not prepared mentally or physically and he is responsible in that aspect. Fox is riding the coattails of Manning, Gase and McCoy, and without Manning we'd likely find out that this is all thanks to him and him alone. I get that some fans are loyal, but that was the worst *** kicking in a Super Bowl of the modern era and he looked and acted subdued, he was happy just getting to play in the game? Yeah, great coaching skills.

Look, I know some might think I am being driven by emotions but nothing could be further from the truth. I just don't believe Fox is the answer, I believe he's proven that and I also believe now is the time to switch because of his health concerns and because a new regime will want to draft his own quarterback, Oz hasn't played so belongs to no one and the transition will be easier with Manning and Gase on the offensive side of the ball then coming in after Manning is gone and completely rebuilding.

[Dzone]

Custard came into the big game with a high powered offense with superior weapons but fell into Sitting Bull & Crazy's Horse's trap. The lack of communication between Reno, Benteen and Custard further complicated things and snow balled into a complete route by the Indians who enjoyed a size and speed advantage.
General George Armstrong Custard would have made a terrible quarterback. You must be a big history buff to know so much about Custard

[MOtorboat]

Not sure why Fox is off limits while people keep trash Manning. It's like an ostrich sticking it's head in the sand with comments like that.

The team was not prepared yesterday and failed to make any adjustments to what Seattle was doing. That's on Fox.

How about we do neither?

The team is 28-5 in the last two seasons.

[G_Money]

Wow, people seem to forget what happened when we fired our last decent coach and took on a newfangled replacement. Fox and Manning are riding this one out together, barring Foxy deciding he needs to retire for medical reasons. He seems awfully spry after that heart surgery, so that's unlikely.

I would have loved to get Jim Schwartz in here instead of Del Rio, honestly, but I certainly don't expect a change on the head coaching front this offseason.

Am I angry at our coaches for taking the wrong approach with the players this week? Yep. But that doesn't mean I fire them. I don't fire Manning either. It's up to them to get this right between them.

~G

[chazoe60]

How about we do neither?

The team is 28-5 in the last two seasons.

You suck at math.

[MOtorboat]

You suck at math.

I do suck at math.

28-8

That's still tops in the league.

[sneakers]

Take away his challenge flag

[RebelRocker]

No, let Fox ride on his contract. Re-evaluate next season when it is up.

Bingo. Next year will have the same mantra as this year, Super Bowl or bust. If we don't make the super bowl next year, I say we part ways with Manning/Fox and reboot with a new coach and a new QB. This team needs to get TOUGHER and YOUNGER. Although it was great to land Manning as a FA, I think that led us back to building this team through free agency instead of the draft like we should be doing. We simply need to put our focus on the draft and cultivating our young players. Having good, young depth will give us plenty of competition. Didn't we see an example of that last night in Seattle? DRAFT WELL, bring in the occasional FA for depth and go forward that way. Elway has done a good job of acquiring productive veterans for reasonable prices, but when you have half of your salary cap being taken up by a few players, that's a big problem.

[Nomad]

Fox just needs to start playing rap music at practices.

[Npba900]

Ultimately he did not have the Broncos prepared to play in the Super Bowl after two weeks of preparation. And was unable to make any adjustments during the game.
Fox has shown the ability to only get so far with the Broncos and with Carolina before that.

Assuming Manning comes back and there is a 1 year window with him do you stick with Fox or do you try to upgrade with Gruden, Cowher, Dungy for one last shot at a World Title. This team is still really close to winning it all but Fox seems like the captain of the Titanic or Custard leading his troops to slaughter at the Little Big Horn in the big games. It would be a tough decision to remove him but it may be necessary to get to the next level with the window closing.

Fox and Manning would both greatly benefit from a robust zone blocking scheme/attack. After all, Elway won two consecutive SB's due a zone blocking attack to complement his steady passing ability.

[Tned]

Fox and Manning would both greatly benefit from a robust zone blocking scheme/attack. After all, Elway won two consecutive SB's due a zone blocking attack to complement his steady passing ability.

Yea, and we can get Manning running bootleg play actions and completing to TE's dragging across behind the boots....

They brought Alex Gibbs back to work with the offensive line this season, I'm pretty sure that coaching staff is smarter than us when it comes to knowing what types of schemes fit our personnel best.

[Nomad]

I think Bowlen should clean house and fire everyone, then come here to BF and hire his next regime.:)

[spikerman]

I think Bowlen should clean house and fire everyone, then come here to BF and hire his next regime.:)

Sigh, alright, I'll do it.

[Nomad]

Sigh, alright, I'll do it.


You can be the all time Head Ref for all the BRONCO games.:D

[Npba900]

Yea, and we can get Manning running bootleg play actions and completing to TE's dragging across behind the boots....

They brought Alex Gibbs back to work with the offensive line this season, I'm pretty sure that coaching staff is smarter than us when it comes to knowing what types of schemes fit our personnel best.
Well it looks to me that the OL needs more work to perfect the zone blocking scheme and actually use it! It doesn't look like Manning, Elway and Fox are going to win a SB anytime soon otherwise. In fact, Manning after the SB has probably realize he needs to put up Elway type stats over Johns last 3 years. Manning has comparable WR's now that Elway had in 96-97 and 98, however, what's missing is an effective vaunted zone blocking attack with OL suited to run and RB/FB who can execute the zone blocking scheme.

[Npba900]

I think Bowlen should clean house and fire everyone, then come here to BF and hire his next regime.:)

Mike Shanahan is available!!!! Who knows Elway and Shanahan will throw away the egos and realize they need one another. After neither have won a SB since 1998.:beer:

[Joel]

Mike Shanahan is available!!!! Who knows Elway and Shanahan will throw away the egos and realize they need one another. After neither have won a SB since 1998.:beer:
That would be as awesome as it is unlikely. I doubt Elway and Shanny egos would clash, but SERIOUSLY doubt Shanny will ever work for Bowlen again, and not just because Bowlen won't ask (though I think that's a pretty safe bet, too.)

[Lancane]

This is a copycat league, the Broncos would be wiser to start stealing coaches from the Seahawks and 49ers coaching staffs.

[igoe4broncos]

No.

[tomjonesrocks]

No.

Perhaps.

But not with those guys.

[zbeg]

That would be as awesome as it is unlikely. I doubt Elway and Shanny egos would clash, but SERIOUSLY doubt Shanny will ever work for Bowlen again, and not just because Bowlen won't ask (though I think that's a pretty safe bet, too.)

Ugh, no thanks to Shanahan. I love the guy and what he did here, but he's been embroiled in non-stop QB drama ever since Elway retired. It's always X guy is getting surprise benched or they trade up to draft a QB when they just went to the AFFCG or the disaster that went down in Washington the way he handled RG3.

Manning would retire and then we'd be in permadrama because Osweiler got benched when threw a bad interception the year after a pro bowl year and then Denver takes a QB in the first round and everyone's like WTF and Shanahan just says "we took the best player we thought would win" and then that guy gets benched/released three years later...

Mike Shanahan: quarterback instability. It's kind of turned into his trademark.

[DenBronx]

Fox stays. No way we make a change at HC right now. Gase is fine too, I actually like Adam Gase agrressive style. Studesville has been pretty good too, not his fault we are primarily a passing team now. Hard to get the running game in a rythym when you don't use it as much during the season. Knowshon played his guts out this year but unfortunately he might not be here. Possibly we draft another RB late.


However, I would look at several other coaches before I even think about Fox.


DC - Del Rio: I was incredibly dissapointed from our lack luster defense as a unit. Where does the blame ultimately go to? I am on the fense here because there are times he seems to get the best out of this defense and there are other times we just give up. My theory is he doesn't have enough talent on defense to work with. Our DL looks leaps and bounds better than in times past. For year we creid give me a DT, give me a clogger ...I want beafy big fatties in the middle of our line to stuff the run. Well he took care of that! It's been really hard to run on us. Terrance Knighton, Vickerson, Sly, Wolfe and Ayers have really stepped up here. However, where is the pressure on the edges from our DEs?? DE Greg Hardy from Carolina is on line 1!! Losing Von Miller also created too much pressure on the DEs. But IMO we need better DEs and I fully expect us to draft one very high.

DB coach (Cory Undlin) and LB coach (Richard Smith) : How much blame do these guys get? How many whiffed tackles did we see? These guys are soft like down pillow!!!!! Our WRs looked soft too because they don't go up against guys like that in practice. They wernt figgin used to getting hit like that. If we can get some Cam Chancelors, Earl Thomas or Richard Shermans then I think our WRs start to learn to punch back in practice. DT is a man! He's a brick but with that size he needs to start landing some Eddie Mac shots on them back. I give Smith some slack because we had to move our LBs around all season but our secondary coach Cory Undlin has ran out of time. I could see him getting fired.....we give up huge plays. We don't hit shit!!! WRs are not scared of our secondary. Wes Welker might have laid the hardest hit all year! I fully expect our DBs and LBs to get some nasty in them.

Special Teams: Awfull....awfull....just embarrassing. All year long, even last year we saw botched special teams plays. From fumbling, to missed tackles to having the ball hit your player and then it end up being a turnover for NE type plays. I think Jeff Rogers needs to hit the bricks and move on. Just fire him and stop making excuses already because he isn't getting these guys ready at all.

[zbeg]

I thought JDR did a pretty good job, all things considered. The Broncos lost 5 starters on defense, including the guy they built their whole defense around. DRC went from being a bleh player in other places to being really good here, and he says it's because of the coaching he got when he arrived. And I'm not even counting Dumervil as one of the lost starters, which JDR had nothing to do with when it came to that whole fiasco.

I thought against the run, they played really well even after losing two of their three best run defenders (Miller, Vickerson) and I think that had a lot to do with coaching. But man, you lose half of your defense and you have to play backups, your defense is going to look bad in a lot of spots. I don't think it was a coaching issue. I thought he did pretty well with what he had, but when most of your good players are on IR, I think you have to lower your expectations.

[Tned]

This is a copycat league, the Broncos would be wiser to start stealing coaches from the Seahawks and 49ers coaching staffs.

San Fran lost in the SB? Thought that's when you started firing coaches. Why would the Broncos hire those utter failures?

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Forum Runner

[spikerman]

One thing I read that the Seahawks do that I think is very smart is that they routinely have their #1 offense and #1 defense practice against each other. As far as I know the Broncos never do that.

[tomjonesrocks]

San Fran lost in the SB? Thought that's when you started firing coaches. Why would the Broncos hire those utter failures? Sent from my Nexus 7 using Forum Runner

Clever, but they didn't embarrass themselves in historic fashion nor get completely outclassed in every phase of the game.

[MOtorboat]

Clever, but they didn't embarrass themselves in historic fashion nor get completely outclassed in every phase of the game.

In one game.

[whiteniko]

When Manning was shattering all the records, I don't remember anybody mentioning Fox's contribution. It's all Manning and Adam Gase talk. So now Fox gets the blame? Head coach, especially with this organization, really has one job and one job only: keep the locker room together. Fox provides stability and is widely respected from both his players and the front office. He manages ego just fine. Getting rid of him now is only going to create more drama.

[spikerman]

When Manning was shattering all the records, I don't remember anybody mentioning Fox's contribution. It's all Manning and Adam Gase talk. So now Fox gets the blame? Head coach, especially with this organization, really has one job and one job only: keep the locker room together. Fox provides stability and is widely respected from both his players and the front office. He manages ego just fine. Getting rid of him now is only going to create more drama.

But seriously, take the challenge flag away from him.

[TimHippo]

When Manning was shattering all the records, I don't remember anybody mentioning Fox's contribution. It's all Manning and Adam Gase talk. So now Fox gets the blame? Head coach, especially with this organization, really has one job and one job only: keep the locker room together. Fox provides stability and is widely respected from both his players and the front office. He manages ego just fine. Getting rid of him now is only going to create more drama.

It's about getting to the next level. How can we improve to win it all.
We're close but I think Fox can't get to the next level.

[CrazyHorse]

No this is dumb. Maybe when Manning retires Fox will too and Gase will have enough experience to take over.

[TimHippo]

No this is dumb. Maybe when Manning retires Fox will too and Gase will have enough experience to take over.

Gase is not HC material. Too weak.

[MOtorboat]

Gase is not HC material. Too weak.

So. To clarify.

You're suggesting that Peyton Manning doesn't know what he's talking about?

[CrazyHorse]

In one game.

The most important game...

[MOtorboat]

The most important game...

True. But you don't evaluate players and seasons on one game. They didn't last year, they won't this year.

[Runamok]

Dungy could fix the defense and already has a great relationship with Manning.


Dungy could fix the defense? Now there's a debatable idea.

[TimHippo]

So. To clarify.

You're suggesting that Peyton Manning doesn't know what he's talking about?

Never said that.

You should probably shut up, you know. You jinxed the team with your goofy thread.
http://www.broncosforums.com/forums/showthread.php/579408-Richard-Sherman-will-have-2-interceptions

[Tned]

So. To clarify.

You're suggesting that Peyton Manning doesn't know what he's talking about?

Or Elway, who called him one of the smartest people he's ever met and someone he wished he played for (or something to that effect).

[Tned]

Ok, the exact quote from Elway on Gase:


There's a perception in some football circles that Gase is simply along for the ride, with Peyton Manning at the controls of the Broncos' record-breaking offense. To hear Elway tell it, that couldn't be further from the truth

"I wish I could have played for him," Elway added. "I think that he's so bright and he's working with Peyton and having been here with Josh (McDaniels) before that -- who is a very bright, young offensive mind -- he has just used all of that and learned from all that. With (Mike) McCoy here, then Peyton here and now him on his own, he's been able to put them all together and mold it as his personality and I think he's done a tremendous job. That shows up in the numbers we've put up this year."

Gase is a disciple of former St. Louis Rams coach and offensive innovator Mike Martz. People in the industry have described him to NFL Media Insider Ian Rapoport as a dynamic, young version of Chiefs coach Andy Reid.



http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000314586/article/john-elway-adam-gase-studly-for-delaying-interviews

Although, I think there is another quote where he referred to him as a genius or something like that.

[MOtorboat]

Never said that.

You should probably shut up, you know. You jinxed the team with your goofy thread.
http://www.broncosforums.com/forums/showthread.php/579408-Richard-Sherman-will-have-2-interceptions


Never said that.

You should probably shut up, you know. You jinxed the team with your goofy thread.
http://www.broncosforums.com/forums/showthread.php/579408-Richard-Sherman-will-have-2-interceptions

Yeah, I know. But that doesn't make you smarter.

So, all aboard the logic train...


Gase is not HC material. Too weak.

OK.

Peyton Manning has told the media he's head coach material (so has John Elway).

So...

You're telling me Peyton Manning and John Elway don't know what they're talking about?


Never said that.

You should probably shut up, you know. You jinxed the team with your goofy thread.
http://www.broncosforums.com/forums/showthread.php/579408-Richard-Sherman-will-have-2-interceptions

Actually, that's EXACTLY what you said by saying he's not head coaching material.

:clap2:

Also. Anyone who supported Tim Tebow as much as you did probably shouldn't tell me to shut up.

[TimHippo]

Ok, the exact quote from Elway on Gase:



http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000314586/article/john-elway-adam-gase-studly-for-delaying-interviews

Although, I think there is another quote where he referred to him as a genius or something like that.

What's your point? Do you actually expect him to say anything otherwise about his own player or coach?

Elway also said, "December 21, 2011: "Tim Tebow's not going anywhere."
http://blogs.westword.com/latestword/2011/12/john_elway_tim_tebow_quotes.php?page=3

[Denver Native (Carol)]

I made a thread on the following, but will also post it here. I can't imagine Elway and Fox hosting a news conference together tomorrow, and then Elway firing Fox.

John Elway and John Fox will host a news conference at 2pm on Tuesday to give a glimpse of what comes next following the Broncos' collapse. Make sure to listen to 850 KOA as we carry it live.

[TimHippo]

http://www.broncosforums.com/forums/showthread.php/579408-Richard-Sherman-will-have-2-interceptions
.

Still not taking any accountability for your arrogant, smarmy thread but what's new. But then what can you expect from a Kyle Orton fanboi.

[chazoe60]

What's your point? Do you actually expect him to say anything otherwise about his own player or coach?

Elway also said, "December 21, 2011: "Tim Tebow's not going anywhere."
http://blogs.westword.com/latestword/2011/12/john_elway_tim_tebow_quotes.php?page=3

And your true motivation is revealed.

Nothing like a big Broncos loss to bring out the Tebow crazies.

[MOtorboat]

Still not taking any accountability for your arrogant, smarmy thread but what's new. But then what can you expect from a Kyle Orton fanboi.

I see reading and logic are both not your strong point.


Yeah, I know.

[MOtorboat]

And your true motivation is revealed.

Nothing like a big Broncos loss to bring out the Tebow crazies.

He also spent a good time here after the Indianapolis game.

[DenBronx]

I made a thread on the following, but will also post it here. I can't imagine Elway and Fox hosting a news conference together tomorrow, and then Elway firing Fox.

John Elway and John Fox will host a news conference at 2pm on Tuesday to give a glimpse of what comes next following the Broncos' collapse. Make sure to listen to 850 KOA as we carry it live.

Lol that would be sort of odd wouldnt it? Just the usual trigger happy fans after a loss. Nothing to see here really.


If anything it will be a shake up with specialty coaches. I can't see Elway firing Fox, Del Rio or Gase. Not sure Manning himself would even like that.


Injuries hurt us more this year than anything. We had injuries at key positions we needed the most this season.

[dogfish]

lol! stupid thread is still stupid. . .

[DenBronx]

What's your point? Do you actually expect him to say anything otherwise about his own player or coach?

Elway also said, "December 21, 2011: "Tim Tebow's not going anywhere."
http://blogs.westword.com/latestword/2011/12/john_elway_tim_tebow_quotes.php?page=3



Who gives a shit.


Manning made us better than what Tim did or ever could have done.



Tim makes great commercials now. That's the last I heard of him.

[MOtorboat]

Come on, Tim.

Take accountability for your inability to read and your poor logic, buddy.

[Jsteve01]

Listen, I'm not saying fire Fox, but at what point do you say, that the idea he is horrid at in game adjustments and responding to being kicked in the nuts is valid? This is John Fox's legacy to this point. he's a solid football coach. Better than say Marty Schottenheimer who is also a solid football coach, but getting embarrassed the way the Broncos did yesterday has to fall on the coaching staff to some degree. You don't go in as a two point favorite and the best offense in the history of the game and get shown up that way. You just don't. Yes we are missing defensive starters by the bushel, and yes there were some freaky plays, but at some point your leaders both in uniforms and the ones wearing head sets have to get the team settled down and back on track.

Momentum is a very odd thing, but the best coaches find the way to remind their players how good they are and get them back to playing that way. They also find ways to respond to success by the other team. We didn't do that yesterday.

[Tned]

What's your point? Do you actually expect him to say anything otherwise about his own player or coach?

Elway also said, "December 21, 2011: "Tim Tebow's not going anywhere."
http://blogs.westword.com/latestword/2011/12/john_elway_tim_tebow_quotes.php?page=3

There is a big difference between saying nothing or some vague complement and gushing over the guy. If you can't see the difference than nothing I say is going to change that.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Forum Runner

[Joel]

General Custard, in the Conservatory, with the lead pipe.

[EastCoastBronco]

General Custard, in the Conservatory, with the lead pipe.

Edited for accuracy...

Seattle Seahawks, in Met Life Stadium, with the lead pipe.

[TXBRONC]

Dungy could fix the defense and already has a great relationship with Manning.

Like he fixed the defense in Indianapolis? That's bullshit Tim.


Getting rid of Fox because this one game be stupid and Elway isn't stupid.

[TXBRONC]

If quite good equals

2002 = 25th
2003 = 22nd
2004 = 4th
2005 = 22nd
2006 = 12th
2007 = 30th
2008 = 22nd

If that's somehow fixed and quite good, then Denver's right on track with what they already have. Dungy did nothing to turn the mentality of that defense around. He had 1 good year, 1 average to above average year, and 5 bad to terrible defenses.

This is their overall ranking? Because I thought they ranked 32nd overall or was that just against the run?

[TXBRONC]

I see reading and logic are both not your strong point.

You know MO I would like to see Gase become Denver's head coach in the nearby future because like Elway and Manning I think he's going to be good one. But it's not going to happen this year.

[MOtorboat]

You know MO I would like to see Gase become Denver's head coach in the nearby future because like Elway and Manning I think he's going to be good one. But it's not going to happen this year.

And I didn't say I want it to. This dude said Gase isn't head coaching material, and he obviously doesn't know what he's talking about.

I don't want them to fire Fox, or bring any of those coaches this year. The reality is, Gase is probably getting a head job elsewhere next year.

[TXBRONC]

And I didn't say I want it to. This dude said Gase isn't head coaching material, and he obviously doesn't know what he's talking about.

I don't want them to fire Fox, or bring any of those coaches this year. The reality is, Gase is probably getting a head job elsewhere next year.

Yeah I know and I totally disagree with him. I'm not saying they should fire Fox what I have funny feeling that Fox might want to step down in another year and if that should happen I would love for them transition to Gase as the head coach.

[elsid13]

You know why certain franchise always seem to be successful, it because they are consistent in their front office and coaching philosophies. It helps the scouts get the players they need to fit a scheme and to find those players in the latter in draft and in free agency that will help teams win. When you look at Cleveland and Redskins you see high turnover on the coaching staffs and front offices which lead to disaster. Getting rid of Fox now screws this franchise.

[Lancane]

You know why certain franchise always seem to be successful, it because they are consistent in their front office and coaching philosophies. It helps the scouts get the players they need to fit a scheme and to find those players in the latter in draft and in free agency that will help teams win. When you look at Cleveland and Redskins you see high turnover on the coaching staffs and front offices which lead to disaster. Getting rid of Fox now screws this franchise.

That is debatable! ;)

[Tned]

That is debatable! ;)

Not debatable, repeatable.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Forum Runner

[TimHippo]

John Fox's coaching is not too shabby.

[johnnyvbfl]

Coach Cowher or stand our ground !

[Buff]

How is Cowher still even being talked about? I'd rather hire Marty Schottenheimer.

I love Fox's brand of locker room leadership. Everyone loves the guy, but they also respect him. He is a perfect leader of men. But his game day management drives me crazy. He needs to get into the 21st century and ditch his prehistoric conservative tendencies. His coaching definitely contributed to the Baltimore defeat last year imo.

[DenBronx]

Coach Cowher or stand our ground !



HotCarls back everyone!

[luckyseven]

Ultimately he did not have the Broncos prepared to play in the Super Bowl after two weeks of preparation. And was unable to make any adjustments during the game.
Fox has shown the ability to only get so far with the Broncos and with Carolina before that.

Assuming Manning comes back and there is a 1 year window with him do you stick with Fox or do you try to upgrade with Gruden, Cowher, Dungy for one last shot at a World Title. This team is still really close to winning it all but Fox seems like the captain of the Titanic or Custard leading his troops to slaughter at the Little Big Horn in the big games. It would be a tough decision to remove him but it may be necessary to get to the next level with the window closing.

you do realize that anytime you replace a HC they generally want their own coaching staff as well as a change in schemes.

why would you want to upset the balance of the team, locker room (Fox is loved by his players), as well as the HC in put on the draft and UFA.

if you are going to make a change it is right after the season ends.

I would not replace him for anyone of those three, even at the end of the season.

[Lancane]

Despite Coach Fox's deficiencies, I would not prefer Cowher, Dungy or Gruden to replace him. I like the idea of Marty Schottenheimer though, it would be a sort of irony if he came here after all the defeats at our hands and won a title with the team who was a thorn in his side for his entire career.

[Simple Jaded]

Tell me more about this Custard fellow.

He's a pie maker, duh!

[Mike]

Despite Coach Fox's deficiencies, I would not prefer Cowher, Dungy or Gruden to replace him. I like the idea of Marty Schottenheimer though, it would be a sort of irony if he came here after all the defeats at our hands and won a title with the team who was a thorn in his side for his entire career.

Marty can build teams from nothing, but I don't trust his post-season record. He is as conservative and his teams clamp down as much as Fox's in pressure games. No thanks. Not interested in Cowher, Dungy, or Gruden either. Not sure who the best fit is, a hungry young coach with a wise/experienced GM is my preference though.

[luckyseven]

Despite Coach Fox's deficiencies, I would not prefer Cowher, Dungy or Gruden to replace him. I like the idea of Marty Schottenheimer though, it would be a sort of irony if he came here after all the defeats at our hands and won a title with the team who was a thorn in his side for his entire career.

Marty IMO does not have the stones to win the big one. Great regular season coach but like a lot of athletes just not good enough to me stalky take it to the next level.

[luckyseven]

Marty can build teams from nothing, but I don't trust his post-season record. He is as conservative and his teams clamp down as much as Fox's in pressure games. No thanks. Not interested in Cowher, Dungy, or Gruden either. Not sure who the best fit is, a hungry young coach with a wise/experienced GM is my preference though.

Perhaps it is time to elevate Gase into making Those tough calls allow Fox to motivate and keep the players loose but let. Gase and manning decide on those fourth down and going for two. The same applies to allow JDR to make the calls on defense.

Pipe dream I know but being a tight ass being that conservative guy that his rectum clenches is not a good thing In the playoffs.

[Ravage!!!]

Marty IMO does not have the stones to win the big one. Great regular season coach but like a lot of athletes just not good enough to me stalky take it to the next level.

I don't see how that is, or why people make that statement. He had Elway beaten and with 97 yards to go. He had Elway beaten AGAIN, and the RB fumbles on the ONE (1) yrd line! How is that Marty's fault? That's taking the BROWNS ..repeat...the BROWNS to two, straight, AFC Championship games!

He took the Chiefs to the AFC Championship game. Know how may playoff games the chiefs had won between their Super Bowl win and Marty taking over? Zero (0) with just one playoff appearance. Know how many playoff wins have they since he's left? Zero.

He then took the Chargers to the AFC Championship game and had the PATRIOTS BEAT...but the safety that intercepted the ball to win the game, turns around and FUMBLES it BACK to the patriots. Again, not Marty's fault. He has some VERY bad luck, but that man is an AMAZING coach.

[luckyseven]

I don't see how that is, or why people make that statement. He had Elway beaten and with 97 yards to go. He had Elway beaten AGAIN, and the RB fumbles on the ONE (1) yrd line! How is that Marty's fault? That's taking the BROWNS ..repeat...the BROWNS to two, straight, AFC Championship games!

He took the Chiefs to the AFC Championship game. Know how may playoff games the chiefs had won between their Super Bowl win and Marty taking over? Zero (0) with just one playoff appearance. Know how many playoff wins have they since he's left? Zero.

He then took the Chargers to the AFC Championship game and had the PATRIOTS BEAT...but the safety that intercepted the ball to win the game, turns around and FUMBLES it BACK to the patriots. Again, not Marty's fault. He has some VERY bad luck, but that man is an AMAZING coach.

He and his team lost them all, he can not win the big one in the AFC let alone the really big Super Bowl.

They lacked mental toughness to overcome mistakes. You make your own luck, he could not.

[Dapper Dan]

No.

[Ravage!!!]

He and his team lost them all, he can not win the big one in the AFC let alone the really big Super Bowl.

They lacked mental toughness to overcome mistakes. You make your own luck, he could not.

and I think that is an absurd perspective.

[Lancane]

He and his team lost them all, he can not win the big one in the AFC let alone the really big Super Bowl.

They lacked mental toughness to overcome mistakes. You make your own luck, he could not.

How bad did we just get our asses beat in the Super Bowl? That was lack of mental toughness or proper preparedness.

The only reason Schottenheimer didn't take Cleveland to the Super Bowl(s) was due to one man, John 'Freaking' Elway, the Duke, the Comeback Kid, jeez. Heck, and the Super Bowl he lost? Fox has lost two, Cowher lost what, two or three? Dungy could barely get to that stage and after his initial surge Gruden became inept...even the legendary Bill Belichick has lost a couple. I guess the Harbaughs are weak coaches, one has been to the NFC Championship three times, lost twice and went to the Super Bowl and lost, I guess he sucks too.

[luckyseven]

How bad did we just get our asses beat in the Super Bowl? That was lack of mental toughness or proper preparedness.

The only reason Schottenheimer didn't take Cleveland to the Super Bowl(s) was due to one man, John 'Freaking' Elway, the Duke, the Comeback Kid, jeez. Heck, and the Super Bowl he lost? Fox has lost two, Cowher lost what, two or three? Dungy could barely get to that stage and after his initial surge Gruden became inept...even the legendary Bill Belichick has lost a couple. I guess the Harbaughs are weak coaches, one has been to the NFC Championship three times, lost twice and went to the Super Bowl and lost, I guess he sucks too.

Nowhere have I advocated hiring any if the coaches you have listed.

But since you mentioned Elway, beating Marty, one would think he could have devised a plan to beat him, if he was that great of a coach.

Marty was predictable and therefore beatable.

If I were to replace Fox whom is also predictable it certainly would no be any of those listed.

At this stage of Mannings career we have to hope that old Fox learns new tricks. IMO we lost that game because our young players were not mentally tough (physically either) enough to win it.

[Ravage!!!]

But since you mentioned Elway, beating Marty, one would think he could have devised a plan to beat him, if he was that great of a coach.

Well that makes sense. I guess any coach that has lost a game should be fired. After all, they should have devised a game that should have beaten the other team. Hell, I guess Belicheck should be fired for losing to Eli, twice.


Marty was predictable and therefore beatable.

He was SOOOO predictable, that he took THREE different, losing, franchises to the AFC Championship games. I guess allllllll those teams he beat just weren't as smart as you in "predicting" what he was doing.

I'm guessing you are one of those guys that thinks you can predict a team's playcalls, and could make better play selections based on the outcomes.

FOX was not the problem of our Super Bowl loss. Our problem was simply we were outmatched.

[luckyseven]

Well that makes sense.

FOX was not the problem of our Super Bowl loss. Our problem was simply we were outmatched.

GLad we for that straight. Time to move on.

[Northman]

He and his team lost them all, he can not win the big one in the AFC let alone the really big Super Bowl.

They lacked mental toughness to overcome mistakes. You make your own luck, he could not.


Marty is a cool dude but i never enjoyed watching someone fail more than he did. I would not want him as my HC just because he is a lot like Norv Turner (or vice versa) but thats just my personal preference. While his players failed him more than he did he still was someone who got overly conservative at the worst possible times and it reflected on his teams.

[luckyseven]

Marty is a cool dude but i never enjoyed watching someone fail more than he did. I would not want him as my HC just because he is a lot like Norv Turner (or vice versa) but thats just my personal preference. While his players failed him more than he did he still was someone who got overly conservative at the worst possible times and it reflected on his teams.




precisily

[Lancane]

Marty is a cool dude but i never enjoyed watching someone fail more than he did. I would not want him as my HC just because he is a lot like Norv Turner (or vice versa) but thats just my personal preference. While his players failed him more than he did he still was someone who got overly conservative at the worst possible times and it reflected on his teams.

Eh, really and John Fox is not conservative nor Del Rio? How many times when we have a lead did we go prevent defense and almost let teams back into the game? (just asking)...

;)

[luckyseven]

Eh, really and John Fox is not conservative nor Del Rio? How many times when we have a lead did we go prevent defense and almost let teams back into the game? (just asking)...

;)


ah you did not actually ask that one , did you?

[capt. Jack]

I think it is more like, THANK YOU JOHN FOX FOR BRINGING RESPECTABILTY BACK TO THE BRONCOS! THREE STRAIGHT AFC WEST CROWNS! The guy is AWESOME! This IS John Fox's team period. As far as the whole team sucking/totally CHOKING, and our QB looking sleepy in the beginning of the Super Bowl, well better luck next time. Re-tool and get back there and win the thing next time.

[luckyseven]

I think it is more like, THANK YOU JOHN FOX FOR BRINGING RESPECTABILTY BACK TO THE BRONCOS! THREE STRAIGHT AFC WEST CROWNS! The guy is AWESOME! This IS John Fox's team period. As far as the whole team sucking/totally CHOKING, and our QB looking sleepy in the beginning of the Super Bowl, well better luck next time. Re-tool and get back there and win the thing next time.

That was everyone was saying before the first snap..

After that the rest of your post.

most fans have very short attention spans.

[Northman]

Eh, really and John Fox is not conservative nor Del Rio? How many times when we have a lead did we go prevent defense and almost let teams back into the game? (just asking)...

;)

Ive never been a Fox fan either to be honest. But he's better than McD so you take what you can get following that travesty.

[luckyseven]

Ive never been a Fox fan either to be honest. But he's better than McD so you take what you can get following that travesty.

Fox was needed to stabilize the franchise, we needed a good strong leader type that the players would believe in. He is more conservative than I would have cared for but defensively, he believes in what I do. A strong LOS presence and has moved towards getting bigger with every acquisition on both sides of the LOS. He beleives ina strong defense and I think he is still not happy with where we are at. He is a run first guy and while that may work if you have real a group of Clydesdale's up front and a couple of TD types behind them, everyone would be singing his praises as a fundamentalist HC.

However I think if Elway knew that Manning was going to come available he would have made a different choice in which HC to bring in. To late for that now.