"It is what it is" But, what is "it"? (Offense)

[artie_dale]

Demaryius Thomas, Wes Welker, Eric Decker, and Julius Thomas... heck, our entire receiving element!

My question is, are any one of them a top Receiver individually?

The reason I ask is, none of them have showed that they can beat any DB on their own. None of them have showed any consistency to be reliable on their own. It seems that the ONLY way they become productive is if the defense they are up against is paying more attention to their counterparts and less attention to them.

When Peyton lost Marvin Harrison and only had Reggie Wayne & Dallas Clark, both those guys still found ways to contribute individually. Especially Reggie Wayne.

It just seems that Decker is most productive when Welker & Demaryius Thomas are doubled. Or when they are all setting picks for each other.

But, I have yet to see any one of these guys "consistently" beat their coverage.

Am I the only one?

[Buff]

Demaryius Thomas, Wes Welker, Eric Decker, and Julius Thomas... heck, our entire receiving element!

My question is, are any one of them a top Receiver individually?

The reason I ask is, none of them have showed that they can beat any DB on their own. None of them have showed any consistency to be reliable on their own. It seems that the ONLY way they become productive is if the defense they are up against is paying more attention to their counterparts and less attention to them.

When Peyton lost Marvin Harrison and only had Reggie Wayne & Dallas Clark, both those guys still found ways to contribute individually. Especially Reggie Wayne.

It just seems that Decker is most productive when Welker & Demaryius Thomas are doubled. Or when they are all setting picks for each other.

But, I have yet to see any one of these guys "consistently" beat their coverage.

Am I the only one?

Yes, you are the only one who thinks that our All-Pro receiving corps can't get open.

Mods, please close this thread.

[artie_dale]

Yes, you are the only one who thinks that our All-Pro receiving corps can't get open.

Mods, please close this thread.

The proof is in the pudding. Out of our "All-Pro receiving corps", who was the most productive last night????

[Buff]

The proof is in the pudding. Out of our "All-Pro receiving corps", who was the most productive last night????

You mean the 45+ TD passes divided among them? Or the most aggregate receiving yards? To your point, Bubba Caldwell stepped in and was productive last night. But I don't see how that proves anything other than us having productive WRs.

The receivers are by far the least of our problems. We had almost 300 yards passing last night in a loss.

[artie_dale]

You mean the 45+ TD passes divided among them? Or the most aggregate receiving yards? To your point, Bubba Caldwell stepped in and was productive last night. But I don't see how that proves anything other than us having productive WRs.

The receivers are by far the least of our problems. We had almost 300 yards passing last night in a loss.

Buff, those stats are great. What I'm trying to ask is, are our WRs capable of earning those stats on their own? Because the ONLY thing I've seen is Manning throwing to the guy who's being guarded by the weakest defensive link.

BUT, is that Manning exploiting/taking advantage the defense or is it the so-called All-Pro rcving corps not really an All-Pro rcving corps.

[SR]

Demaryius Thomas, Wes Welker, Eric Decker, and Julius Thomas... heck, our entire receiving element! My question is, are any one of them a top Receiver individually? The reason I ask is, none of them have showed that they can beat any DB on their own. None of them have showed any consistency to be reliable on their own. It seems that the ONLY way they become productive is if the defense they are up against is paying more attention to their counterparts and less attention to them. When Peyton lost Marvin Harrison and only had Reggie Wayne & Dallas Clark, both those guys still found ways to contribute individually. Especially Reggie Wayne. It just seems that Decker is most productive when Welker & Demaryius Thomas are doubled. Or when they are all setting picks for each other. But, I have yet to see any one of these guys "consistently" beat their coverage. Am I the only one?

Can't beat a DB on their own? You must have missed DT last night.

And DT is one of the best in the league.

[Buff]

Buff, those stats are great. What I'm trying to ask is, are our WRs capable of earning those stats on their own? Because the ONLY thing I've seen is Manning throwing to the guy who's being guarded by the weakest defensive link.

BUT, is that Manning exploiting/taking advantage the defense or is it the so-called All-Pro rcving corps not really an All-Pro rcving corps.

I don't know how you could possibly distinguish between the two. They showed a great clip of DT completely abusing his DB in the 1st quarter. The scheme is designed to get them open, but they still have to run effective routes. I have all the faith in the world in our WRs.

[artie_dale]

I don't know how you could possibly distinguish between the two. They showed a great clip of DT completely abusing his DB in the 1st quarter. The scheme is designed to get them open, but they still have to run effective routes. I have all the faith in the world in our WRs.

One play, Buff. One play. Where is the consistent exploitation by our WRs to their defenders?

But, like I said. Is Peyton taking the "easy route" by passing to the weakest guarded Rcvr? Or, is it that our All-Pro Wrs aren't getting open?

[Mike]

I don't know how you could possibly distinguish between the two. They showed a great clip of DT completely abusing his DB in the 1st quarter. The scheme is designed to get them open, but they still have to run effective routes. I have all the faith in the world in our WRs.

DT is elite talent, but he plays soft. Decker is good as is Welker, but both have spurts of play that is unreliable. All three struggle against physical CBs that jam at the LOS. All three have enough talent to be mentioned as the best WR core in the league, add in J.Thomas and someone should always be open. Always. I think Denver should also start targeting Moreno as a receiver more often as well.

It seems like NE, Indy, and now SD jammed them and sat on the shallow routes...then waited for the pass rush to pressure Manning. For whatever reason, the vertical threat that we saw the last 2 games completely disappeared. Be that the defensive gameplan or lapse in Denver's offense gameplan I don't know. But that seems to be the key to beating them.

[Broncolingus]

-


http://youtu.be/ERTT_sv8sV0


C'mon...somebody was waiting for 'it...'

:D

[SR]

The proof is in the pudding. Out of our "All-Pro receiving corps", who was the most productive last night????

Last night is not a good example. The offense, as wayninja pointed out, was off.

[Buff]

I don't know how you can make an argument that WRs aren't getting open or can't beat coverage when we have the best passing offense in the league. That is absurd to me.

[tripp]

I think Julius Thomas, Welker, and Demaryius Thomas are all studs. The jury is still out on Decker, in my humble opinion. What grinds my gears about him is he can't handle physical coverage nor is he a physical receiver. Always looks to officials for flags. I think he is a brilliant receiver... with the right QB.

To answer your question, we do have All-pro receivers, last night was.. well an off night, if you want to call it that. It annoys me when people think our offense isn't allowed to go 3 and out a couple of times, and yet it is acceptable for our defense to give up that many first downs and still have everyone's attention on our offense. It wasn't Manning who choked last night, or because it was cold, it was because our Defense couldn't create a turn over or stop them on 3rd down. Period. Manning shouldn't have to pull a magic trick out of his rear end every game for us to win.

[Broncolingus]

Last night is not a good example. The offense, as wayninja pointed out, was off.

I agree...

...I think it was just a bad night for the offense and I think all of those receives are great and we have great (quality) depth there.

(...geez, how many times can I put 'great' in a sentence :tsk: ...)

There are a 100 other areas of concern before the passing game and, in particular, the receiving corps...

JMO...

[SR]

One play, Buff. One play. Where is the consistent exploitation by our WRs to their defenders? But, like I said. Is Peyton taking the "easy route" by passing to the weakest guarded Rcvr? Or, is it that our All-Pro Wrs aren't getting open?

Go look at their stats dude. Your entire argument is baseless IMO

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

You can tell Caldwell doesn't get the reps. He was out of position several times last night. That probably didn't help.

[Mike]

Go look at their stats dude. Your entire argument is baseless IMO

I don't know about that. When they are good, they are very good. But when they are bad, they are pretty bad. One game is an aberration, two, three games and it is a problem that should be looked at. Denver has struggled multiple times with the WRs not getting open or fighting for the ball and not getting the ball down the field.

This is how teams will target the Broncos offense going in to the playoffs. Play physical with the WRs and take away the long ball and Denver is a very beatable team.

[artie_dale]

Go look at their stats dude. Your entire argument is baseless IMO

Stats for that last game? Or season stats? I know on paper, the season stats make all three (DT, WW, & ED) look fantastic.

What I'm trying to figure out is, if any one of them were the sole WR on this team, could they produce the same way? OR, do they need each other in order to succeed? OR, is it just the way Peyton dissects the defense that no matter what, the weakest covered Rcvr is going to get all the balls?

[Lancane]

I don't know about that. When they are good, they are very good. But when they are bad, they are pretty bad. One game is an aberration, two, three games and it is a problem that should be looked at. Denver has struggled multiple times with the WRs not getting open or fighting for the ball and not getting the ball down the field.

This is how teams will target the Broncos offense going in to the playoffs. Take away the long ball and Denver is a very beatable team.

I agree with both Mike and Artie, the Broncos' receiving corps. has talent but lack the instinct that makes them elite. Thomas was suppose to be another Brandon Marshall, but his YAC is pathetic because he doesn't fight for the ball, he refuses to put his body on the line and go through defenders. Other then that, Thomas is the closest thing to an elite receiver that we have, but he's not there - Manning has made it look like he is, but he is not. Would he be the same receiver with Osweiler? I don't think so, he'd still have a solid season, but he wouldn't be labeled elite either. Decker is another McCaffrey, he's a beast in the right scheme but he'll never be more then a second receiver on any roster and what he brings is more important and that is that he's got that toughness the rest of the corps. lacks other then Welker. Welker is unique in many ways, but he's also limited, he's suffered several concussions over the last few years and that can not be good for his future, when he is no longer in the sport, but till then he will do what he has to and the effectiveness of the corps. lifted by that fact, something we lack otherwise. J. Thomas next to Decker is probably tougher and closer to elite at his respective position, he still lacks refinement but overall he has emerged as a solid receiving tight end.

If Manning retires come the end of the season, I think you trade Demaryius Thomas to a team in need of a number one receiver, while keeping Eric Decker and Julius Thomas, he'll be spoiled from Manning and be use to what Manning has evolved him into, he'll struggle with a young quarterback who is still a little wet behind the ears who will need to grow with his top receiver, it would be different if he was more like Marshall, Fitzgerald or Johnson, he lacks their explosiveness. He is like a love child of Rod Smith and Brandon Marshall, has the size and physical traits but lacks the explosiveness, the assurity or hands of either of those two receivers.

[OrangeHoof]

Blame it on Manning who consistently throws to the open receiver instead of trying to single out star receivers whether they are covered or not.

[artie_dale]

Blame it on Manning who consistently throws to the open receiver instead of trying to single out star receivers whether they are covered or not.

And THAT just may very well be the case.

[jhildebrand]

This team could afford to have three of their TE's on the field with DT at times. They all can get open, are big, are physical, and can catch the ball. It would be worth getting a look these next two games.

[MOtorboat]

...and blame the best players on the team...never ceases to amaze me.

[Poet]

I don't know how you can make an argument that WRs aren't getting open or can't beat coverage when we have the best passing offense in the league. That is absurd to me.

Clearly the other WR's channel their abilities from Welker. /sarcasm.

This thread is terribad.

[Lancane]

...and blame the best players on the team...never ceases to amaze me.

No one is blaming them Mo, I simply refuse to put them on a pedestal when they have not proven their worth to be placed on such. It's a common problem within Broncomania, players are unfairly credited with bountiful accolade like praise and may be in truth not as stellar or even as good as they are made out to be. Mays, no Woodyard is the second coming; Lelie, no Royal will be Denver's next All-Star Broncos' Receiver; Van Pelt, no Mauck will be the next great Broncos' Quarterback - I can go on and on, heck we had people talking about Moreno being the next feature back two weeks ago and now that tune has changed.

As far as the game, the loss was a team loss, defense and offense both came up short, so there is plenty enough blame to go around already.

[Lancane]

Clearly the other WR's channel their abilities from Welker. /sarcasm.

This thread is terribad.

Not really King, it's a thread based on arguable and debatable points of view on a specific topic that is in the end, not one that can be proven one way or another at this point.

[artie_dale]

Last night's rcving production.

REC YDS AVG TD LG TGTS
A. Caldwell 6 59 9.8 2 15 10
M. Ball 5 49 9.8 0 15 5
J. Thomas 4 49 12.3 0 22 8
D. Thomas 4 45 11.3 0 21 5
E. Decker 2 42 21.0 0 21 5
K. Moreno 5 36 7.2 0 15 6
J. Tamme 1 9 9.0 0 9 2
Team 27 289 10.7 2 22 41


What happened to that All-Pro Elite WR Corps? Not ONE OF THE Elite produced in this game. I can understand ONE of them having a bad day. I honestly thought the combination of DT, Decker, and JT, would surely up our passing attack. But nope. If Welker is the reason the other three are productive, then what does that say about the other three? Because obviously, they aren't productive when Welker isn't there.

Can't blame Peyton for this one. That INT wasn't entirely his fault (good pass rush) and outside of that, he was throwing into some tight windows all night (but who's supposed to make those window's bigger?).

[Poet]

Well, I can pretty much prove to you that Welker is one of the best WR's in the game. I can do the same thing for D. Thomas. I can pretty much prove to you that Decker is the best third WR in the game right now. I can prove to you that Julius Thomas is one of the best receiving TE's in the game as well. These guys are getting open. It might not always be Welker or Decker sitting in the middle of no man's land in because the other team was running a cover two or three, but they're getting open. They have been doing so consistently all year.

[artie_dale]

Well, I can pretty much prove to you that Welker is one of the best WR's in the game. I can do the same thing for D. Thomas. I can pretty much prove to you that Decker is the best third WR in the game right now. I can prove to you that Julius Thomas is one of the best receiving TE's in the game as well. These guys are getting open. It might not always be Welker or Decker sitting in the middle of no man's land in because the other team was running a cover two or three, but they're getting open. They have been doing so consistently all year.

Right. I don't deny that. They've been doing it all year, TOGETHER. But, remove one of them and it makes it that much easier for defenses to guard the rest. How "elite" is that??? Yes, they compliment each other greatly. But, there's a difference between calling a handful of WRs All Pro when they are together, vs them not acting like it when they are on their own. How talented can they be if they don't produce crap when you remove Welker? Even when Julius Thomas sat out, who else had to shine? Tamme.

It just seems to me that this offense is only dangerous when it has ALL of it's Rcving weapons. Sucks that the case may be that if one of them is out, the rest are that much easier to shut down.

[Poet]

Right. I don't deny that. They've been doing it all year, TOGETHER. But, remove one of them and it makes it that much easier for defenses to guard the rest. How "elite" is that??? Yes, they compliment each other greatly. But, there's a difference between calling a handful of WRs All Pro when they are together, vs them not acting like it when they are on their own. How talented can they be if they don't produce crap when you remove Welker? Even when Julius Thomas sat out, who else had to shine? Tamme.

It just seems to me that this offense is only dangerous when it has ALL of it's Rcving weapons. Sucks that the case may be that if one of them is out, the rest are that much easier to shut down.

Your sample size is not nearly large enough to make this assertion. Last year it was mainly Thomas and Decker who were doing the heavy lifting. So why would the addition of Welker and J.Thomas somehow impede their ability to get it done this season? Thomas was out against the Patriots, and in that game Moreno was the beast because of the gameplan. This past game was just a nightmare. Unfortunately, the Broncos aren't going to go out every week and drop 45 points on their opposition.

[artie_dale]

Your sample size is not nearly large enough to make this assertion. Last year it was mainly Thomas and Decker who were doing the heavy lifting. So why would the addition of Welker and J.Thomas somehow impede their ability to get it done this season? Thomas was out against the Patriots, and in that game Moreno was the beast because of the gameplan. This past game was just a nightmare. Unfortunately, the Broncos aren't going to go out every week and drop 45 points on their opposition.

Then why couldn't they do it yesterday?

I do still blame the defense & Del Rio for the loss yesterday. But the WRs that were supposed to come through, didn't. SD or any team isn't supposed to be able to shut all of those guys down. But, that's what SD did.

[Poet]

Then why couldn't they do it yesterday?

I do still blame the defense & Del Rio for the loss yesterday. But the WRs that were supposed to come through, didn't. SD or any team isn't supposed to be able to shut all of those guys down. But, that's what SD did.

Because they're not robots. You're not going to go out and get the same result every time. They do it far more often than not.

[artie_dale]

Because they're not robots. You're not going to go out and get the same result every time. They do it far more often than not.

Usually, at least one of them is the go-to-guy for a particular game. The fact that none of them were that guy, and that Andre Caldwell ended up being that guy (the no-body), my confidence in them are down. I thought for sure we'd win that game on the shoulders of Peyton, DT, Decker, & Julius. We lost and 3 of those rcvrs were nil.

[Poet]

Usually, at least one of them is the go-to-guy for a particular game. The fact that none of them were that guy, and that Andre Caldwell ended up being that guy (the no-body), my confidence in them are down. I thought for sure we'd win that game on the shoulders of Peyton, DT, Decker, & Julius. We lost and 3 of those rcvrs were nil.

You just said it yourself. Usually. It usually happens. It's not always going to happen.

Caldwell was a Bengal. He was horrid. He wasted his great speed, his routes were shit, he couldn't get separation, he was just a warm body that could block. Your corps are so good that they can get that bastion of badness into the endzone twice. That's another point.

[BroncoWave]

So one game where none of our WRs stood out shows that we have a problem at WR? Wut?

[artie_dale]

You just said it yourself. Usually. It usually happens. It's not always going to happen.

Caldwell was a Bengal. He was horrid. He wasted his great speed, his routes were shit, he couldn't get separation, he was just a warm body that could block. Your corps are so good that they can get that bastion of badness into the endzone twice. That's another point.

for DT, Decker, & Julius to be completely shut down (49 yds was top producer), that doesn't bode well. For people to sit here and say they are all top rcvrs but can all be shut down in one game... that doesn't make sense. If they are all top performers, then week in and week out, at least one of them should find a way to get open and be productive, especially at home. but apparently, SD's DBs are either underrated, or our rcvrs are overrated. If all teams have to do is be more physical with our guys, how great are they really?

[BroncoWave]

for DT, Decker, & Julius to be completely shut down (49 yds was top producer), that doesn't bode well. For people to sit here and say they are all top rcvrs but can all be shut down in one game... that doesn't make sense. If they are all top performers, then week in and week out, at least one of them should find a way to get open and be productive, especially at home. but apparently, SD's DBs are either underrated, or our rcvrs are overrated. If all teams have to do is be more physical with our guys, how great are they really?

Dude, shit happens. Some days even the best of offenses get shut down. You are just looking for something to panic about if you think the WRs are a problem.

[artie_dale]

Dude, shit happens. Some days even the best of offenses get shut down. You are just looking for something to panic about if you think the WRs are a problem.

I'm not panicking. I'm disappointed. Here all this time I thought we had an elite compliment of rcvrs that at least one of them would step up to ensure pass production in each game, but instead, they each can be shut down all in a single game. It baffles me.

When they are all healthy, it's "Who will get the ball today?" Not "Demaryius stepped up today" or "Welker stepped up today". It's "Decker gets his 4th TD against their weakest DB!"

Hey, I'm all for exploiting their defense but I'm ready for our "great rcvrs" to dominate a good defender for once.

[Poet]

I'm not panicking. I'm disappointed. Here all this time I thought we had an elite compliment of rcvrs that at least one of them would step up to ensure pass production in each game, but instead, they each can be shut down all in a single game. It baffles me.

When they are all healthy, it's "Who will get the ball today?" Not "Demaryius stepped up today" or "Welker stepped up today". It's "Decker gets his 4th TD against their weakest DB!"

Hey, I'm all for exploiting their defense but I'm ready for our "great rcvrs" to dominate a good defender for once.

You are essentially saying that you wanted Manning to avoid Decker in the endzone so he could throw to guys who were not in the endzone. Or, that you wanted to scheme it so that you fight a team at their strength, and not their weakness. Man, I'm struggling to get your point.

[artie_dale]

You are essentially saying that you wanted Manning to avoid Decker in the endzone so he could throw to guys who were not in the endzone. Or, that you wanted to scheme it so that you fight a team at their strength, and not their weakness. Man, I'm struggling to get your point.

Yeah, it's not a simple one. I just refuse to call any of our rcvrs "all-pro" or "elite" if they can't consistently beat the guy guarding them. Which they haven't.

[artie_dale]

And last night's game, it was crunch time. If there was a time to use your abilities to get open, last night was it. But, it didn't happen.

[Poet]

Yeah, it's not a simple one. I just refuse to call any of our rcvrs "all-pro" or "elite" if they can't consistently beat the guy guarding them. Which they haven't.

They have been doing this all year. The numbers show that, man. You're pretty much just upset about the lackluster display, from what I can tell. I understand.

[MOtorboat]

Over one game? Come on Artie.

Calvin Johnson had two games this year with just three receptions. You telling me he's not elite?

[artie_dale]

They have been doing this all year. The numbers show that, man. You're pretty much just upset about the lackluster display, from what I can tell. I understand.

All the numbers show is flashes here and there. Peyton Manning penetrating the defenses, forcing the defense to change, which opens it up for anyone else the defense has to pay less attention to in order to pay attention to what Peyton exploited. Tom Brady has been doing that for years with mediocre WRs. Now Peyton is supposed to have a great WRs corps and he still has to throw to the weak defender? Was I overreaching thinking we had someone similar to Brandon Marshall in Demaryius Thomas? Or does everyone else already think our rcving corps is below the Marshalls and Bryants talent pool. Maybe my expectations were too high.

[Poet]

All the numbers show is flashes here and there. Peyton Manning penetrating the defenses, forcing the defense to change, which opens it up for anyone else the defense has to pay less attention to in order to pay attention to what Peyton exploited. Tom Brady has been doing that for years with mediocre WRs. Now Peyton is supposed to have a great WRs corps and he still has to throw to the weak defender? Was I overreaching thinking we had someone similar to Brandon Marshall in Demaryius Thomas? Or does everyone else already think our rcving corps is below the Marshalls and Bryants talent pool. Maybe my expectations were too high.

You realize that teams scheme versus the weak defender, right? Brady was more than happy to not bomb it to Moss if the LB couldn't stop their RB from picking up 8 years on a dumpoff pass. Or, if the safety help couldn't stop Donte Stallworth from burning them, he'd throw it to him. If I can almost always beat a guy for a first down and more, why would I ever go anywhere else? That's just bad strategy.

We have gone around and around. I'm sorry.

[MOtorboat]

All the numbers show is flashes here and there. Peyton Manning penetrating the defenses, forcing the defense to change, which opens it up for anyone else the defense has to pay less attention to in order to pay attention to what Peyton exploited. Tom Brady has been doing that for years with mediocre WRs. Now Peyton is supposed to have a great WRs corps and he still has to throw to the weak defender? Was I overreaching thinking we had someone similar to Brandon Marshall in Demaryius Thomas? Or does everyone else already think our rcving corps is below the Marshalls and Bryants talent pool. Maybe my expectations were too high.

Even Marshall, Johnson, Fitzgerald, etc. have lackluster games where they are covered. It happens. These guys are setting freaking records this year.

[Poet]

Even Marshall, Johnson, Fitzgerald, etc. have lackluster games where they are covered. It happens. These guys are setting freaking records this year.

A.J. Green got manhandled by Haden this year. We don't have an elite WR anymore.

[artie_dale]

Even Marshall, Johnson, Fitzgerald, etc. have lackluster games where they are covered. It happens. These guys are setting freaking records this year.

Yes. And it's supposed to be easier to shut those guys down because they are the only ones on their roster. We're supposed to have 3 that are damn close to each of those guys, and it seems they only produce when nobody is paying attention to them.

[MOtorboat]

Yes. And it's supposed to be easier to shut those guys down because they are the only ones on their roster. We're supposed to have 3 that are damn close to each of those guys, and it seems they only produce when nobody is paying attention to them.

Which, in case you haven't noticed, they've done for 13 of 14 games...shit happens. Relax.

[Poet]

Yes. And it's supposed to be easier to shut those guys down because they are the only ones on their roster. We're supposed to have 3 that are damn close to each of those guys, and it seems they only produce when nobody is paying attention to them.

Brandon Marshall has Jeffry. Fitzgerald has been alone for years. Calvin Johnson is the best WR since Jerry Rice, and is already a first ballot HoFer.

Do you understand that you are essentially arguing that since your WR's had one bad game as a whole that none of them are great, or elite?

No one thinks that Decker is close to those guys. Welker is a slot guy, so no, he's not close to them either. They play the same position, but play a different role. Thomas is the closest to those guys, and he's not far off from being there.

[Simple Jaded]

If the receiving core isn't up to snuff for Broncos fans how in the hell do stiffs like Beadles and Holiday get an once of support?

[Joel]

The reason teams need at least 2 and preferably 3 quality WRs is that defenses can and do doublecover teams with only 1 (just ask Andre Johnson.) They have these things called "shut down corners" too, and good defenses usually have one. So you can't expect our best WR to put up Pro Bowl numbers every game; Manning goes to the guy who gets open one-on-one, and which guy that is depends on the game, often on the past several games and who a given defense deems the most dangerous threat on any given night.

So at the start of the year DT tied the franchise record for receiving TDs in a game, JT tied it later, and Decker broke it two weeks ago. Thursday we were missing Welker, so Andre Caldwell had a good night. That's how it goes; I'm more than happy Mannings on pace to break Bradys season passing TD record with NONE of our receivers getting HALF of Moss' season receving TD record.

Our record-setting offense isn't the problem; the problem is our D that was at least good against the run isn't even that anymore, and we're still making the habitual "mental error" of not showing up for the first half, the second or sometimes even whole games, while doing stupid things like lining up offside on a punt, leaving a HoF TE uncovered on third and long, having 12 men on the field twice in one game and either fumbling away punts or signalling for fair catches >10 yds away from the nearest tackler. The turnovers have gotten better, but that's about it.

The offense is the only part of our team that ISN'T awful, and the only part Fox and Del Rio aren't actively running. Do the math....

[BroncoJoe]

How about we just give credit to Mike McCoy and his coaches for developing a game plan that was extremely effective. He does have some knowledge about us, after all.

[BroncoWave]

How about we just give credit to Mike McCoy and his coaches for developing a game plan that was extremely effective. He does have some knowledge about us, after all.

Which probably gives him a huge advantage in a short week, because he is way more familiar with our offense than the Broncos are with their defense.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

I don't know about that. When they are good, they are very good. But when they are bad, they are pretty bad. One game is an aberration, two, three games and it is a problem that should be looked at. Denver has struggled multiple times with the WRs not getting open or fighting for the ball and not getting the ball down the field.

This is how teams will target the Broncos offense going in to the playoffs. Play physical with the WRs and take away the long ball and Denver is a very beatable team.

That's how every team tries to play Denver. There's a blueprint to beating Denver. It usually doesn't work.

I think Thursday was a case of the team not having enough time to prepare for no Welker. We simply couldn't overcome the injuries and lack of preparation.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

How about we just give credit to Mike McCoy and his coaches for developing a game plan that was extremely effective. He does have some knowledge about us, after all.

Agreed, they simply looked like the hungrier and more prepared team.

[Joel]

How about we just give credit to Mike McCoy and his coaches for developing a game plan that was extremely effective. He does have some knowledge about us, after all.
What a pity Del Rio and especially Fox don't know McCoy as well as he knows them. One would think a defensive coach could come up with a gameplan capable of stopping or at least slowing his former OCs offense, especially with the crowd on his side. One would clearly be wrong, but one would certainly think that.

[MOtorboat]

What a pity Del Rio and especially Fox don't know McCoy as well as he knows them. One would think a defensive coach could come up with a gameplan capable of stopping or at least slowing his former OCs offense, especially with the crowd on his side. One would clearly be wrong, but one would certainly think that.

Oh FFS.

Denver won AT San Diego earlier this year, so seriously this is just asinine tripe.

[ForgettingBrandonMarshall]

Oh FFS.

Denver won AT San Diego earlier this year, so seriously this is just asinine tripe.

I couldn't agree more with this. I don't see much merit in the argument that McCoy knows Fox and Del Rio better than Fox and Del Rio know McCoy. We did beat McCoy at his place earlier. But, short memories and all that.

Also, I think McCoy has his hands a little bit on this offense, but this is Whisenhunt's offense. It's completely different than what McCoy did here in Denver.

The Chargers are not a bad team. Everyone points to their record at 7-7 (6-7 when they played us), but they were a few SECONDS away from solidifying a wildcard spot (see the Titans game, Texans game, Washington game). This was a division game on a short week. With the injuries we have on D and the first game in Welker's absence, we were vulnerable and the Chargers took advantage.

[artie_dale]

Hey, just want say sorry for seeming like a crazy who lost all hope and doubted our rcvrs. San Diego played us so well in every aspect and their defense flat out beat our offense.

My concerns ranked from highest to lowest:

1) Overall Defense/Defensive Coaching
2) Peyton + wet, cold, & windy
3) Peyton + cold & windy
4) Peyton + windy
5) Fox + lead = too conservative
6) Peyton + cold

[Broncolingus]

Hey, just want say sorry for seeming like a crazy who lost all hope and doubted our rcvrs. San Diego played us so well in every aspect and their defense flat out beat our offense.

My concerns ranked from highest to lowest:

1) Overall Defense/Defensive Coaching
2) Peyton + wet, cold, & windy
3) Peyton + cold & windy
4) Peyton + windy
5) Fox + lead = too conservative
6) Peyton + cold

Goodness...nothing to apologize for dude...

...it's a silly internet chat board and everyone's entitled to his/her own opinion.

Let the basement dwellers who consistently snipe everyone's comments thinking it makes them look tough & knowledgeable, and will fill their flaming inferiority complex and never having kissed a girl apologize...

[artie_dale]

Goodness...nothing to apologize for dude...

...it's a silly internet chat board and everyone's entitled to his/her own opinion.

Let the basement dwellers who consistently snipe everyone's comments thinking it makes them look tough & knowledgeable, and will fill their flaming inferiority complex and never having kissed a girl apologize...

That was just my way of putting my interaction on that specific topic to rest. I'm not remorseful or anything. Just conceding to that argument and moving on.

[Broncolingus]

That was just my way of putting my interaction on that specific topic to rest. I'm not remorseful or anything. Just conceding to that argument and moving on.

Trackin', brother...it's all good.

...and that was my way of taking a shot at some folks who get WAAAAAYYYYYYYYY to worked up about shit on this board and need to lighten the f#@k up.

Peace, brotha...:D