View Full Version : Rumor: Should the Denver Broncos trade for Jared Allen, Jason Babin?
Magnificent Seven
10-24-2013, 04:33 PM
The NFL's 2013 trade deadline (2 p.m. MT on Tuesday, Oct. 29) is now five days away, and the rumors are starting to heat up. Keep in mind that those rumors are just that—rumors.
With that said, some rumors and connections do come to fruition (see: Manning, Peyton in 2012), and let's face it, they are fun to talk about. So let's talk!
The Denver Broncos have been vaguely connected to a pair of pass rushers—the Minnesota Vikings' Jared Allen and the Jacksonville Jaguars' Jason Babin—by Chris Wesseling in a "these teams would make sense for these players" story on NFL.com. Wesseling isn't the only one that has made the connection.
I'll leave it to Bronco Mike to discuss if and how these two players would fit into Denver's defensive scheme, for now, we'll consider the two player's backgrounds, contracts, and what it would take to get them.
As for Jason Babin, he has been a late boomer, waiting until his eighth year in the NFL before notching a 12.5-sack season with the Tennessee Titans and drawing recognition across the league in 2010. The next season, Babin exploded onto the scene as a member of the Philadelphia Eagles defense, recording 18 sacks and earning his second Pro Bowl selection.
Since then, Babin's numbers have dropped. He recorded seven sacks in 2012, splitting time with the Eagles and Jaguars, who claimed him off waivers after he was cut in Week 12. Playing for the 0-7 Jaguars, Babin has managed just two sacks through seven games this season.
Denver's defense needs help and Babin, though he is 33, is still being productive. Earlier this month, the Denver Post's Mark Kiszla wrote that Denver should trade for Babin if they are truly in a "win now" mode, which they obviously are.
http://www.milehighreport.com/2013/10/24/5022222/should-the-denver-broncos-trade-for-jared-allen-jason-babin
Northman
10-24-2013, 04:42 PM
If i had to choose, it would be Allen.
Does Allen play inside? Our outside line is alright.
Northman
10-24-2013, 04:57 PM
Does Allen play inside? Our outside line is alright.
Nah, it think he is outside.
HORSEPOWER 56
10-24-2013, 05:41 PM
I think we should look into Jay Ratliff. He's supposedly healthy, he's been cleared to play, and he's a great interior pressure guy who's also good vs the run. Way better than Mitch Unrein or Sly. He'll probably be expensive because he's a FA, but there's no better interior penetrator on the market. He's stupid strong, too. He played NT in Dallas' 3-4 at 300 LBs and was very effective.
If we did get Babin, it would allow Wolfe to move inside to his natural 3 technique spot where he might be more effective. He's been pretty much invisible this season, especially at rushing the passer.
Babin is a turd, but Allen would be awesome if we could get him at a firesale price. But as others have noted, our interior d-line is the bigger concern than outside with Phillips and Jackson stepping up.
claymore
10-24-2013, 06:04 PM
Id love to see Allen face the Chiefs twice a year. That would be fun.
Slick
10-24-2013, 06:07 PM
Is Allen still a stud or has his play declined? I haven't seen much of Minnesota this year. Missed the Monday night game this week.
silkamilkamonico
10-24-2013, 06:37 PM
What would Denver give for Babin or Allen?
Al Wilson 4 Mayor
10-24-2013, 07:44 PM
Is Allen still a stud or has his play declined? I haven't seen much of Minnesota this year. Missed the Monday night game this week.
He may not be the same player who won defensive mvp, but he's still a really good football player.
broken12
10-24-2013, 07:50 PM
I agree ratliff
Dapper Dan
10-24-2013, 08:52 PM
I've never liked Babin and I'm not sure why. I've always kinda liked Allen. I'd be worried about what it would take to get him in a trade plus the salary he gets/wants.
TXBRONC
10-25-2013, 06:34 AM
Babin is better suited to a wide nine technique and what does Allen have left in the tank. Besides that with both of those guys you have to mortgage the future. If Denver were to go out and get Ratliff he's not going to cost picks just salary.
Lancane
10-25-2013, 08:03 AM
I agree Ratliff makes more sense, but I can't help feel this is the Front Office simply trying to cure the symptoms but not the disease as I pointed out before. Overall, the defensive line has been solid, we have two defensive ends on pace for double digit sacks (Phillips and Ayers) and another just right behind them (Jackson) and we now have Miller back who is a maestro of pass rushing. So adding one of the aforementioned players will do what exactly? When you have defensive backs playing so far off the receiver that coverage is almost non-existent and they're more concerned with stopping the big play rather then playing the ball to interrupt the catch or trying to get to the ball to get a turnover, it also allows for the pass rush to become obsolete because quarterbacks are able to go through their check downs quicker and get the ball to one of their receivers faster. This isn't a case of not being able to get to the quarterback as much as having a defensive backfield which has almost no solid coverage due to the game planning and play calling, and is about as aggressive as a pop-warner team. We have to look no further then to stats and film to understand this...because who leads the team in interceptions? Danny Trevathan, a linebacker who has double that of any defensive back on the team.
CoachChaz
10-25-2013, 08:10 AM
I get a bunch of Vikings games and I'd give up a 2nd for Allen. He still has a high motor, but his problem is very similar to what we have in Denver. He doesnt get much help from his secondary. I dont care how good of a pass rusher you are...if you're only given 2 seconds to get to the QB...you wont get there very often. But I think playing on a contender with help from the other side would motivate him. We could then move Ayers to RE and Wolfe inside with Jackson in nickel packages. But at that point...what do we do with Phillips?
claymore
10-25-2013, 08:36 AM
I get a bunch of Vikings games and I'd give up a 2nd for Allen. He still has a high motor, but his problem is very similar to what we have in Denver. He doesnt get much help from his secondary. I dont care how good of a pass rusher you are...if you're only given 2 seconds to get to the QB...you wont get there very often. But I think playing on a contender with help from the other side would motivate him. We could then move Ayers to RE and Wolfe inside with Jackson in nickel packages. But at that point...what do we do with Phillips?
Phillips is another FA, so that problem is a short term one. :D
CoachChaz
10-25-2013, 09:13 AM
Phillips is another FA, so that problem is a short term one. :D
Well...so is Allen after the season
LTC Pain
10-25-2013, 09:30 AM
What would Denver give for Babin or Allen?
Hillman and a 4th for Allen!
Ravage!!!
10-25-2013, 10:07 AM
I'm not giving up on Hillman.
tripp
10-25-2013, 11:05 AM
Is Allen still a stud or has his play declined? I haven't seen much of Minnesota this year. Missed the Monday night game this week.
4.5 Sacks, 1 FF, 21 tackles. Minnesota is ranked 27th in total defense, 29th against the pass, and 14th against the run. Besides Erin Henderson, Jared Allen is the only bright spot on that defense.
EDIT: I would love to see Richard Seymour try out for us, and give him a reasonable contract for him to come on in certain situations. Need that veteran experience, I think the guy still has it. He was the only relevant player in Oakland from what I remember.
Simple Jaded
10-26-2013, 03:12 AM
As much time as the Broncos D spends on the field they should be able to find playing time for both Allen and Phillips.
elsid13
10-26-2013, 06:45 AM
IF they trade for Allen we are looking at 4th/5th rounder or later. A half season rental is not get a top of a draft pick.
atwater27
10-26-2013, 09:15 AM
Babin is a turd.
Jeebus, what the hell did he do to you?
I think we should look into Jay Ratliff. He's supposedly healthy, he's been cleared to play, and he's a great interior pressure guy who's also good vs the run. Way better than Mitch Unrein or Sly. He'll probably be expensive because he's a FA, but there's no better interior penetrator on the market. He's stupid strong, too. He played NT in Dallas' 3-4 at 300 LBs and was very effective.
If we did get Babin, it would allow Wolfe to move inside to his natural 3 technique spot where he might be more effective. He's been pretty much invisible this season, especially at rushing the passer.
If we can afford him, I like this idea, and not just because we wouldn't have to give up other current and/or future players. As others have noted, the main place we need pass rushing help on the line is inside, and I think that's mainly because our DTs are oriented toward being immovable objects rather than irresistable forces. If we make a change, it needs to be for a guy who can be as effective against the run as our current DTs, not some glorified UT who's characterization as "quick" and "agile" is really just a a smokescreen for "weak." Seriously: Would anyone trade Knightons bulk for Marcus Thomas' "agility"?
I agree Ratliff makes more sense, but I can't help feel this is the Front Office simply trying to cure the symptoms but not the disease as I pointed out before. Overall, the defensive line has been solid, we have two defensive ends on pace for double digit sacks (Phillips and Ayers) and another just right behind them (Jackson) and we now have Miller back who is a maestro of pass rushing. So adding one of the aforementioned players will do what exactly? When you have defensive backs playing so far off the receiver that coverage is almost non-existent and they're more concerned with stopping the big play rather then playing the ball to interrupt the catch or trying to get to the ball to get a turnover, it also allows for the pass rush to become obsolete because quarterbacks are able to go through their check downs quicker and get the ball to one of their receivers faster. This isn't a case of not being able to get to the quarterback as much as having a defensive backfield which has almost no solid coverage due to the game planning and play calling, and is about as aggressive as a pop-warner team. We have to look no further then to stats and film to understand this...because who leads the team in interceptions? Danny Trevathan, a linebacker who has double that of any defensive back on the team.
We've had tons of coverage sacks; the secondary's generally done its job: It's just impossible for even the best DBs to cover everyone forever. We haven't seen many opposing QBs make 2 or 3 second passes, because they haven't been forced; opposing QBs frequently have 7 or 8 seconds to wait for someone to get free. It's to our secondary's credit even 9 or 10 seconds is sometimes not enough, and we get our share of sacks out of that, but just as better coverage increases sacks, better pressure increases Ints. I honestly think our secondary makes our rush looks better than it is, and our rush makes our secondary look worse.
To me, the real issue isn't our base, but what happens in our nickel/dime, when we know a pass is coming and "just" need to stop it. We rarely get their without a blitz, and if we blitz someone's open. Wolfe's been MIA most of the season, regressed rather than progressed, and we're feeling that; right now I'd rather have Jackson on those downs. Ratliff would be better than either, but Allen or Babin wouldn't; that would just mean pulling Ayers or Phillips, and their sack numbers suggest any improvement would be marginal.
DenBronx
10-26-2013, 03:28 PM
This is all a pipe dream and Denver most likely wont pull the trigger on any of these kind of deals.
Simple Jaded
10-27-2013, 11:42 PM
This is all a pipe dream and Denver most likely wont pull the trigger on any of these kind of deals.
The Broncos would probably prefer to roll over 2013 cap space to next year anyway. Thomas and Allen would eliminate any chance of that.
Ziggy
10-28-2013, 01:41 AM
The Broncos would probably prefer to roll over 2013 cap space to next year anyway. Thomas and Allen would eliminate any chance of that.
I wouldn't mind seeing the Broncos use some of that 2013 cap space to tie up a guy like DRC, Woodyard, Holliday, or Chris Harris before the season ends.
atwater27
10-28-2013, 08:33 AM
If we are in win now mode, and for the right price, netting Jared Allen would be a coup! Especially with the added motivation he would have against Kansas City. It would more than erase the loss of Dumervil, and take some serious pressure off of Manning.
Broncolingus
10-28-2013, 08:34 AM
Hillman and a 4th for Allen!
I might take that...
Lancane
10-28-2013, 12:22 PM
I wouldn't mind seeing the Broncos use some of that 2013 cap space to tie up a guy like DRC, Woodyard, Holliday, or Chris Harris before the season ends.
Harris is a restricted free agent, though I don't know the details, but they should tie up Rodgers-Cromartie as quick as possible. Woodyard on the other hand bleeds orange and blue, I don't see him looking for the best offer till the Broncos have a chance to make an offer.
LTC Pain
10-28-2013, 01:17 PM
I wouldn't mind seeing the Broncos use some of that 2013 cap space to tie up a guy like DRC, Woodyard, Holliday, or Chris Harris before the season ends.
Decker, Woody, DRC and Harris are priority to re-sign. Holliday not so much. Cutting Champ will give the Broncos some salary cap room.
Decker, Woody, DRC and Harris are priority to re-sign. Holliday not so much. Cutting Champ will give the Broncos some salary cap room.
Holiday would be much harder to replace than Decker.
Simple Jaded
10-28-2013, 10:07 PM
Holiday would be much harder to replace than Decker.
Which part, the returns for TD's or the constant mistakes?
Lancane
10-28-2013, 10:43 PM
Holiday would be much harder to replace than Decker.
In some aspects maybe, but of all the current Broncos on the offensive side of the ball, he is undoubtedly the biggest fan favorite next to Manning.
TXBRONC
10-29-2013, 09:28 AM
In some aspects maybe, but of all the current Broncos on the offensive side of the ball, he is undoubtedly the biggest fan favorite next to Manning.
It's pick your poison both would be difficult to replace.
olathebroncofan
10-29-2013, 12:42 PM
Looks like Seattle is looking to trade for Allen. Did anyone have an idea on who the second team is that it's looking to trade for Allen?
Dzone
10-29-2013, 12:59 PM
Ya, just heard that Seattle is going after Allen. Nobody knows yet who the second team is. Hopefully not KC, but thats possible
Trade deadline is 2 pm mst this afternoon
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000271927/article/jared-allen-reportedly-subject-of-seahawksvikings-trade-talks
mopatt24
10-29-2013, 01:06 PM
Jay Glazer @JayGlazer
Contrary to what is out there Seattle is NOT one of the teams in it for Jared Allen. Two others but Seattle is not talking to Vikes for him
ProFootballTalk @ProFootballTalk
Vikings have signed DE Justin Trattou. Are they filling Jared Allen's spot on the depth chart before trading him?
I got the feeling, its us
In some aspects maybe, but of all the current Broncos on the offensive side of the ball, he is undoubtedly the biggest fan favorite next to Manning.
But he isn't a special talent.
Guys like Holiday are hard to come by. He is getting to Hester's level as a return man. Those guys only come around once every ten years or so.
mopatt24
10-29-2013, 01:11 PM
Decker, Woody, DRC and Harris are priority to re-sign. Holliday not so much. Cutting Champ will give the Broncos some salary cap room.
I think Champ will retire after this season. Hate to say it, but his legs are gone. That was evident in the playoff loss to BAL. ( The 2nd TD to Smith )
mopatt24
10-29-2013, 01:43 PM
Gil Brandt @Gil_Brandt
Hearing @DenverBroncos attempting to trade for Jared Allen. @Seahawks inquired. Deadline is 4p ET
Slick
10-29-2013, 01:46 PM
I don't think Denver has the cap room. We'll know in less than 3 hours.
LTC Pain
10-29-2013, 01:54 PM
I don't think Denver has the cap room. We'll know in less than 3 hours.
Cut Champ now and they would......................................... :behindsofa:
Ziggy
10-29-2013, 01:58 PM
I don't think Denver has the cap room. We'll know in less than 3 hours.
I think they actually do Slick. They might have to move one small contract in the trade, but it's doable. I just hope that we don't give up more than a 3rd round pick if the deal gets done.
Ziggy
10-29-2013, 02:06 PM
Vic Lombardi @VicLombardi
Yup. Definitely something cooking at Dove Valley. We'll see. Trade deadline one hour away.12:57 PM - 29 Oct 2013
...
Slick
10-29-2013, 02:07 PM
One site I just looked at says we have less than 7 million in cap space.
Ziggy
10-29-2013, 02:13 PM
One site I just looked at says we have less than 7 million in cap space.
That's around what Allen is owed for the rest of the season. Keep in mind that one source said he would consider restructuring for the right situation, and that the Broncos may throw in a player with the draft pick.
pipes
10-29-2013, 02:14 PM
Schefter just said Denver will be making NO trades today...
claymore
10-29-2013, 02:14 PM
But he isn't a special talent.
Guys like Holiday are hard to come by. He is getting to Hester's level as a return man. Those guys only come around once every ten years or so.
Agreed. I think Manning will easily overcome the loss of Decker. If Holiday uses Hesters contract as a starting point, there is no way we keep him either though.
Ziggy
10-29-2013, 02:16 PM
Adam Kinney @DSNAdam
Hearing offer could be as high as a second round pick for Jarred Allen, but Denver wants to ensure Allen stays long term before deal is made1:12 PM - 29 Oct 2013 from South Aurora, CO, United States
I have no idea who Kinney is. Anyone else?
CoachChaz
10-29-2013, 02:43 PM
Schefter just said Denver will be making NO trades today...
I believe 10% of what Schefter says any more. Maybe this falls into that 10%...who knows
Ravage!!!
10-29-2013, 02:46 PM
Schefter seems pretty certain.... BUT.... things could change over the hour. Most likely, Denver doesn't make a move. I wo uld like to see an OL if anything is traded for.
Ziggy
10-29-2013, 03:04 PM
Well, it looks like the trade deadline has come and gone without the Broncos making a move. I would have loved to have gotten Allen, but I respect Elway's respect of draft picks. Great teams build through the draft (and add a Peyton Manning when they have the chance).
Slick
10-29-2013, 03:38 PM
Well, it looks like the trade deadline has come and gone without the Broncos making a move. I would have loved to have gotten Allen, but I respect Elway's respect of draft picks. Great teams build through the draft (and add a Peyton Manning when they have the chance).
Someone tweeted that Denver was asking for the Vikes to pay half his salary.
CoachChaz
10-29-2013, 03:40 PM
Someone tweeted that Denver was asking for the Vikes to pay half his salary.
They let that slide for a little over 3 million?
Ziggy
10-29-2013, 03:44 PM
If that's true, I wonder what the compensation was that was agreed to.
DenBronx
10-29-2013, 03:53 PM
Looking towards next year, I respect Elways value of cap room even more than late round draft picks.
We should now just roll it over for 2014.
DenBronx
10-29-2013, 03:57 PM
Jarred Allen has 4.5 sacks.
Meanwhile in Denver: Phillips has 6.5, Ayers 4.5, Malik 3.5 and now Miller is back with 1. Your guys opinions about us needing QB pressure are going to change after the bye week. In the 2nd half against the Redkins I think we got our first real look at what this defense is going to do when everyone is together.
We didnt need Allen or Babin.
Denver Native (Carol)
10-29-2013, 04:08 PM
Mike Klis @MikeKlis 1h
I talked to high-ranking Broncos source this morning and team was not in on Jared Allen. Shaun Phillips has 6.5 sacks. Jared Allen has 4.5.
DenBronx
10-29-2013, 04:16 PM
Mike Klis @MikeKlis 1h
I talked to high-ranking Broncos source this morning and team was not in on Jared Allen. Shaun Phillips has 6.5 sacks. Jared Allen has 4.5.
For ALOT cheaper than Allen too. Robert Ayers is doing everything Allen is doing this year too. Had one of these guys went down with an injury before this trade deadline then I could have seen us doing this deal. Just didnt make sense with Miller back now. Glad to see the Broncos looking into it though.....tells me they are serious about winning this year.
elsid13
10-29-2013, 04:16 PM
I have strange feeling they did what every good team does, called around to find out if there was any interest and what it would cost. Rarely do you see trade in season because of the time it take a player to learn the playbook and the scheme.
Dzone
10-29-2013, 04:17 PM
Yes we have good pass rushers on our team and dont need Allen. Just dont want him going to san diego or kc.
DenBronx
10-29-2013, 04:20 PM
Heck even Wolfe was getting some action finally. Just too many rushers now for the other teams to block, someone WILL get to the QB now. I think teams are going to have to double Von, that leaves Phillips or Ayers wide open. I can even see our corners blitzing just to throw them off too.
DenBronx
10-29-2013, 04:21 PM
Yes we have good pass rushers on our team and dont need Allen. Just dont want him going to san diego or kc.
Maybe that's the real reason we looked into Allen, to keep him away from KC.
MOtorboat
10-29-2013, 04:31 PM
Allen isn't going back to KC, even though Peterson is gone...
Slick
10-29-2013, 04:40 PM
Jon Heath*@JonHeathNFLAccording to @VicLombardi, Jared Allen would have been traded to #Broncos if the "Vikes had agreed to pickup half remaining salary."2:12 PM - 29 Oct 201310*RETWEETS*1*FAVORITEReplyRetweetFavorite
Denver Native (Carol)
10-29-2013, 04:45 PM
Vic Lombardi @VicLombardi 2m
Elway on the Jared Allen talks: "not close ... we're always exploring different options, but we're happy with the team we have right now".
DenBronx
10-29-2013, 08:38 PM
Jon Heath*@JonHeathNFLAccording to @VicLombardi, Jared Allen would have been traded to #Broncos if the "Vikes had agreed to pickup half remaining salary."2:12 PM - 29 Oct 201310*RETWEETS*1*FAVORITEReplyRetweetFavorite
The trade would have made sense on our end if Minn would have picked up half of Allens remaining salary. Other than that it really wouldnt have.
dogfish
10-30-2013, 01:05 AM
Jon Heath*@JonHeathNFLAccording to @VicLombardi, Jared Allen would have been traded to #Broncos if the "Vikes had agreed to pickup half remaining salary."2:12 PM - 29 Oct 201310*RETWEETS*1*FAVORITEReplyRetweetFavorite
the duke, trying to find peyton a neil smith. . . too bad, that woulda been pimp. . .
Canmore
10-30-2013, 01:34 AM
the duke, trying to find peyton a neil smith. . . too bad, that woulda been pimp. . .
Agreed. Neil Smith was a beast, but I will always picture him in red.
claymore
10-30-2013, 08:00 AM
Agreed. Neil Smith was a beast, but I will always picture him in red.
I always picture him holding the Lombardi Trophey. :D
TXBRONC
10-30-2013, 08:43 AM
I never really thought Denver needed to go after Jared Allen. He would have been a nice addition but don't think Denver hurt themselves by not pursuing Allen aggressively. Once a season gets underway trades like that are very difficult pull off.
Denver Native (Carol)
10-30-2013, 02:06 PM
This was never going to be the type of trade market in which the Broncos would take part.
"Everybody wants to trade somebody that's going to be a free agent," said John Elway, the Broncos' director of football operations. "I'm not going to give up a draft pick for eight games."
The NFL trading deadline expired at 2 p.m. Tuesday with the Broncos standing pat with a roster that has compiled a 7-1 record and leads the NFL by a wide margin with 42.9 points per game.
Twitter jammed the cool Rocky Mountain air Tuesday with speculation the Broncos were trying to make a deal for Minnesota Vikings defensive end Jared Allen. Not true.
rest - http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_24414488/denver-never-wanted-vikings-defensive-end-jared-allen
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.4 Release Candidate 2 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.