new LB

[smith49]

Per NBC sports we have signed Paris Lenon. A MLB of 35 years of age most recently a Cardinal. Thoughts? I don't know much about him.

[Joel]

Gotta be freakin' kidding me. A 35 year old MLB I've barely heard of (either)? Much better than drafting one early this year. Or last year. Or the six previous years I wanted to do it. Is this like with the RBs? Great Mikes are so common and such little worth drafting them in the first three rounds is wasteful? Should we just stay in Dime all the time and throw replace Ball (or whoever) with Os as a second QB?

Okay, bitchiness levels have reached the point I should sleep; it begins to look like the only place I can see my team win another Super Bowl (perhaps even playoff game.)

[TXBRONC]

Gotta be freakin' kidding me. A 35 year old MLB I've barely heard of (either)? Much better than drafting one early this year. Or last year. Or the six previous years I wanted to do it. Is this like with the RBs? Great Mikes are so common and such little worth drafting them in the first three rounds is wasteful? Should we just stay in Dime all the time and throw replace Ball (or whoever) with Os as a second QB?

Okay, bitchiness levels have reached the point I should sleep; it begins to look like the only place I can see my team win another Super Bowl (perhaps even playoff game.)

Why are complaining yet again? He was signed for depth purposes. :rolleyes:

[Krugan]

Why are complaining yet again? He was signed for depth purposes. :rolleyes:

The way I see it, that is part of the problem. We have alot of depth at MLB, but im not sure we have a starter...

[Northman]

Guess they are not planning on seeing Von anytime soon.

[slim]

I miss Al Wilson.

[chazoe60]

Championship.

[Ziggy]

Gotta be freakin' kidding me. A 35 year old MLB I've barely heard of (either)? Much better than drafting one early this year. Or last year. Or the six previous years I wanted to do it. Is this like with the RBs? Great Mikes are so common and such little worth drafting them in the first three rounds is wasteful? Should we just stay in Dime all the time and throw replace Ball (or whoever) with Os as a second QB?

Okay, bitchiness levels have reached the point I should sleep; it begins to look like the only place I can see my team win another Super Bowl (perhaps even playoff game.)

The fact that you've barely heard of him doesn't make him a scrub. It just means you don't watch a lot of NFL football. He's started every game the last 3 years for the Cards and averaged 107 tackles per season. The guy may be older, but he's quality depth. Get some sleep and ease up on the drama.

[TXBRONC]

The way I see it, that is part of the problem. We have alot of depth at MLB, but im not sure we have a starter...

IIRC Bradley has been starter and according to what's been said here he may have been playing out of position.

[CoachChaz]

Didnt he have a pretty good season with the Lions a few years ago? Maybe it was someone else. Too lazy to look it up

[CoachChaz]

Took the time to look it up. 810 career tackles in 11 years isnt too bad for a "no name". Had 103 last year for AZ

[Krugan]

IIRC Bradley has been starter and according to what's been said here he may have been playing out of position.

And Bradley is hurt.

Im not sold he is a starter at all, but maybe.

[Rick]

Gotta be freakin' kidding me. A 35 year old MLB I've barely heard of (either)? Much better than drafting one early this year. Or last year. Or the six previous years I wanted to do it. Is this like with the RBs? Great Mikes are so common and such little worth drafting them in the first three rounds is wasteful? Should we just stay in Dime all the time and throw replace Ball (or whoever) with Os as a second QB?

Okay, bitchiness levels have reached the point I should sleep; it begins to look like the only place I can see my team win another Super Bowl (perhaps even playoff game.)

Just how many top picks do we have?

We have ALSO been screaming for DL help forever and over the last 2 drafts our top 2 picks were DE/DT, Manning's replacement; DT, RB.

Maybe next year we take a MLB or maybe Woodyard proves to be as good a MLB as he is a WLB. Need to give Elway a bit of time to put it all together...cant fix every hole at once...

(and you mention a MLB in the first 3 rounds. they took Irving in round 3 to be MLB, just because he hasn't locked it down doesn't mean they didn't try)

[Joel]

I miss Al Wilson.
2005 was when I started saying we should look for a Mike early, because Wilson couldn't play forever and we had garbage behind him. Everyone said I was nuts; Wilson was in his prime, we had all kinds of great replacements for when he retired next century and even if we didn't great Mikes are a dime a dozen. Then the injury, retirement and DJ showing us a guy can be a stellar vet Will AND Sam yet still be awful at Mike.

Seven years later, we STILL don't have a legit Mike; apparently they aren't as common as commonly believed.


And Bradley is hurt.

Im not sold he is a starter at all, but maybe.
I believe the point was we were told Bradley was the Cards starter and now we're told Lenon was: Did they BOTH start at Mike for Arizona?

Anyway, I'm not saying the guy always sucked; I HAVE heard of him, just not much (and, no I don't watch Cardinals games much, because I've never had much respect for that whole division.) He's 35 though: There's a reason he's available, and it's hard to believe Lenon's a better 35 year old Mike than Urlacher. It just doesn't appear a priority for us, else we wouldn't wait till the last minute every year, then add the Lenons, Brookings and even Boss Baileys, only to do the same thing next year when age or ability prevents them being a big long term contributor.

Maybe drafting a MLB on the first day ends that desultory cycle for the foreseeable future. Which team released Wilson for us? Oh, right: We drafted him as the penultimate pick of round 1. ;)

[Joel]

Just how many top picks do we have?
Since 2005? Lemme take off my shoes... ~24. Minus penalties for salary cap violations and plus the extra first round picks from Chicago when we traded Cutler.


We have ALSO been screaming for DL help forever and over the last 2 drafts our top 2 picks were DE/DT, Manning's replacement; DT, RB.

Maybe next year we take a MLB or maybe Woodyard proves to be as good a MLB as he is a WLB. Need to give Elway a bit of time to put it all together...cant fix every hole at once...

(and you mention a MLB in the first 3 rounds. they took Irving in round 3 to be MLB, just because he hasn't locked it down doesn't mean they didn't try)
The DT picks are better arguments than the DE picks; if we look back over the past half dozen drafts we've taken a LOT of DEs early (Ayers in the first, Tim Crowder in the second and TRADED UP to get Jarvis Moss, though those weren't the only ones.) For examples of early picks we DID invest only to see them fizzle, those are better examples than MLB.

You're right about Irving, but one first day pick in 8 years isn't much. After we traded last years #25 overall pick last year to the Pats they DID spend it on Dont'a Hightower, MLB captain of Bamas #1 ranked D, but that doesn't count. I'll skip the well known litany of first day busts and miscues since '05 (Darcel McBath? Trading Minnesota the pick KC eventually spent on Jamaal Charles?) and just say:

Irving is both the first and last MLB we've drafted in the first three rounds since 2005. Before that the last one was: Al Wilson in 1999. You get what you pay for (if you're lucky.)

[TXBRONC]

And Bradley is hurt.

Im not sold he is a starter at all, but maybe.

When did they say Bradley was going on IR?

[Dapper Dan]

We're going to draft AJ Johnson in the next draft.

End of MLB complaining.

[Dzone]

So Lenon beat out Bradley the last 2 years, Lenon has rarely missed games while Bradly is injury prone and yet the Broncos went for Bradley first instead of Lenon.

[Dapper Dan]

So Lenon beat out Bradley the last 2 years, Lenon has rarely missed games while Bradly is injury prone and yet the Broncos went for Bradley first instead of Lenon.

Probably had something to do with age.

And what exactly was the ILB situation in AZ? Didn't they run a 3-4?

[SR]

Probably had something to do with age.

And what exactly was the ILB situation in AZ? Didn't they run a 3-4?

I thought so. I thought Bradley and Lenon were the ILBs.

[TXBRONC]

Probably had something to do with age.

And what exactly was the ILB situation in AZ? Didn't they run a 3-4?

I was just getting ready to say that it probably had something to do with age.

[Dzone]

According to this article today by eric goodman, Lenon beat out Bradley for starting middle linebacker...
http://milehighsports.com/2013/08/21/goodman-the-broncos-have-had-a-cruel-summer/

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

He might be the best ILB we've had in a while. :laugh:

Wouldn't it be funny if it worked out that way?

I'm kind of concerned about Irving. Has he not done enough to solidify himself as a Mike?

[ShaneFalco]

might as well have brought Urlacher out of retirement. PANIC MODE!

[Ziggy]

He might be the best ILB we've had in a while. :laugh:

Wouldn't it be funny if it worked out that way?

I'm kind of concerned about Irving. Has he not done enough to solidify himself as a Mike?

Irving is the best Sam LB we have outside of Von. He needs to man that spot for at least the time that Von is suspended. I don't know if the coaches have given up on him as a mike or they just need him too much at the sam.

[Army Bronco]

He might be the best ILB we've had in a while. :laugh:

Wouldn't it be funny if it worked out that way?

I'm kind of concerned about Irving. Has he not done enough to solidify himself as a Mike? Funny but would also be pretty cool.

[Simple Jaded]

The fact that you've barely heard of him doesn't make him a scrub. It just means you don't watch a lot of NFL football. He's started every game the last 3 years for the Cards and averaged 107 tackles per season. The guy may be older, but he's quality depth. Get some sleep and ease up on the drama.

Joel specializes in European players.

[Rick]

Since 2005? Lemme take off my shoes... ~24. Minus penalties for salary cap violations and plus the extra first round picks from Chicago when we traded Cutler.


The DT picks are better arguments than the DE picks; if we look back over the past half dozen drafts we've taken a LOT of DEs early (Ayers in the first, Tim Crowder in the second and TRADED UP to get Jarvis Moss, though those weren't the only ones.) For examples of early picks we DID invest only to see them fizzle, those are better examples than MLB.

You're right about Irving, but one first day pick in 8 years isn't much. After we traded last years #25 overall pick last year to the Pats they DID spend it on Dont'a Hightower, MLB captain of Bamas #1 ranked D, but that doesn't count. I'll skip the well known litany of first day busts and miscues since '05 (Darcel McBath? Trading Minnesota the pick KC eventually spent on Jamaal Charles?) and just say:

Irving is both the first and last MLB we've drafted in the first three rounds since 2005. Before that the last one was: Al Wilson in 1999. You get what you pay for (if you're lucky.)

I suppose if you want to be including past regimes then you can go back and add in a ton of top picks we have had over the years. I am however arguing that you cannot fault THOSE picks on the current regime.

Elway has only been involved in 3 drafts, give him some time before complaining that he won't draft a MLB, and he in fact did draft one in the top 3 rounds in his first draft.

[tubby]

AZ LBs were good last year. I think Washington may have PED though. Not sure.

[Joel]

I suppose if you want to be including past regimes then you can go back and add in a ton of top picks we have had over the years. I am however arguing that you cannot fault THOSE picks on the current regime.

Elway has only been involved in 3 drafts, give him some time before complaining that he won't draft a MLB, and he in fact did draft one in the top 3 rounds in his first draft.
Alright, that's fair; Elway's not at fault for what predates his return, and he did draft Irving. Still, a single third round pick in three drafts only BARELY meets the desire for "a MLB in the first three rounds." Even sticking to those three years we had 9 picks in those rounds, right? Obviously we don't want to draft 10 MLBs (or anything else) in 2 years, but for now we're apparently still looking, and while there's still good talent left in the sixth it's a lot harder to find because there's a lot less of it; the bust/boom ratio goes up markedly.

Maybe it's as simple as being more than a couple stars from a title when Elway arrived, that we were in rebuild mode and that didn't change when we added PFM and Miller, undeniably helpful though they've been.

[Rick]

I can agree the position has been there with stong candidates when we have had picks and we went elsewhere.

I was surprised when we passed on Teo and though we like high charactor guys, Burflict to me was worth the risk in late rounds.

If we had gone that direction though and taken MLB and not gone after the DL or RB I believe we would be just as weak there as we are now at MLB and we would instead be complaining that Elway did not address those concerns.

And when Manning is done, we would have been upset that Elway had not drafted a QB and had left us in a Indy(Painter/Sorgi/etc) situation.

Let's just see what he does in the next draft with our top picks, and or let's see what Woody does at MLB. I have been wanting him on the field for years, despite all the objections all the time that he is too small...all he ever does is find himself around the ball and it appears Trevathon could be of a similar mold and if it pans out with those 2 then a high pick on a MLB will not be needed.

[Italianmobstr7]

Paris Lenon is hot garbage. Dude has ranked dead last as a MLB according to PFF last 2 years in a row. Depth or not, we could have and should have done better.

[Dapper Dan]

Paris Lenon is hot garbage. Dude has ranked dead last as a MLB according to PFF last 2 years in a row. Depth or not, we could have and should have done better.

For example?

[dogfish]

okay, that's it!!

joel's never heard of him and PFF doesn't like him. . .


wait, wut?

[Simple Jaded]

Alright, that's fair; Elway's not at fault for what predates his return, and he did draft Irving. Still, a single third round pick in three drafts only BARELY meets the desire for "a MLB in the first three rounds." Even sticking to those three years we had 9 picks in those rounds, right? Obviously we don't want to draft 10 MLBs (or anything else) in 2 years, but for now we're apparently still looking, and while there's still good talent left in the sixth it's a lot harder to find because there's a lot less of it; the bust/boom ratio goes up markedly.

Maybe it's as simple as being more than a couple stars from a title when Elway arrived, that we were in rebuild mode and that didn't change when we added PFM and Miller, undeniably helpful though they've been.

Helpful? They're the two best players on the team, they're the backbone of Denver's title hopes. Players like your Mythical MLB are here to HELP them!

If they're in rebuild mode why are you bent that they haven't drafted at the position you think they should have? Maybe they'll get to it when they feel like it? Maybe they don't value the position as much as you do?

Maybe it's that simple?

You go ahead and bet against "your" Broncos but taking the field is low hanging fruit.

[Joel]

I can agree the position has been there with stong candidates when we have had picks and we went elsewhere.

I was surprised when we passed on Teo and though we like high charactor guys, Burflict to me was worth the risk in late rounds.

If we had gone that direction though and taken MLB and not gone after the DL or RB I believe we would be just as weak there as we are now at MLB and we would instead be complaining that Elway did not address those concerns.

And when Manning is done, we would have been upset that Elway had not drafted a QB and had left us in a Indy(Painter/Sorgi/etc) situation.

Let's just see what he does in the next draft with our top picks, and or let's see what Woody does at MLB. I have been wanting him on the field for years, despite all the objections all the time that he is too small...all he ever does is find himself around the ball and it appears Trevathon could be of a similar mold and if it pans out with those 2 then a high pick on a MLB will not be needed.
Yeah, that's probably a lot of that; the Dutch boy and the dike again: Too many holes, not enough fingers.


Helpful? They're the two best players on the team, they're the backbone of Denver's title hopes. Players like your Mythical MLB are here to HELP them!

If they're in rebuild mode why are you bent that they haven't drafted at the position you think they should have? Maybe they'll get to it when they feel like it? Maybe they don't value the position as much as you do?

Maybe it's that simple?

You go ahead and bet against "your" Broncos but taking the field is low hanging fruit.
Way to chew my rear for not saying exactly what I said—except the "betting against the team" garbage; you just pulled that out of YOUR rear. Do you even read my posts, or just quote them so people know which person you think is full of crap?

[Simple Jaded]

Yeah, that's probably a lot of that; the Dutch boy and the dike again: Too many holes, not enough fingers.


Way to chew my rear for not saying exactly what I said—except the "betting against the team" garbage; you just pulled that out of YOUR rear. Do you even read my posts, or just quote them so people know which person you think is full of crap?

No, I read your posts; Miller doesn't play MLB and Manning takes up too much cap space for a QB who can't play RB, but other than that they're somewhat useful.

As for the garbage I pulled out of my ass, just look at your response to Rick.

[Simple Jaded]

"Okay, bitchiness levels have reached the point I should sleep; it begins to look like the only place I can see my team win another Super Bowl (perhaps even playoff game.)"

This isn't Joel betting against "his" team, this is me pulling garbage outta my ass.

[TXBRONC]

Alright, that's fair; Elway's not at fault for what predates his return, and he did draft Irving. Still, a single third round pick in three drafts only BARELY meets the desire for "a MLB in the first three rounds." Even sticking to those three years we had 9 picks in those rounds, right? Obviously we don't want to draft 10 MLBs (or anything else) in 2 years, but for now we're apparently still looking, and while there's still good talent left in the sixth it's a lot harder to find because there's a lot less of it; the bust/boom ratio goes up markedly.

Maybe it's as simple as being more than a couple stars from a title when Elway arrived, that we were in rebuild mode and that didn't change when we added PFM and Miller, undeniably helpful though they've been.

When you say it doesn't meet the desire for a mike linebacker you mean your personal desire. Your desires are not important what Elway and Fox think is what is most important. You still don't get that a great middle linebacker is necessary in this defense. Yet you act like you know more than Elway and Fox. Heck you called Lenon a scrub without no knowing jack about him.

[Slick]

If I remember correctly, Paris was a defensive lineman at Tennessee in college.

[Dapper Dan]

If I remember correctly, Paris was a defensive lineman at Tennessee in college.

Parys Harralson. Which was my first thought too. Paris Lenon went to Richmond.

[Slick]

Parys Harralson. Which was my first thought too. Paris Lenon went to Richmond.

Oops.

[Dapper Dan]

Oops.

Parys is still with the Niners. I was really excited when I thought that was him.

[Slick]

Parys is still with the Niners. I was really excited when I thought that was him.

Your Parys (Tennessee Vol) played on the National Championship team along side John Henderson, right?

[Dapper Dan]

Your Parys (Tennessee Vol) played on the National Championship team along side John Henderson, right?

No. He was there around the time Casey Clausen was. Early 2000s. About 4 years after the championship.

[Dapper Dan]

Deion Grant. Cedrick Wilson. Shaun Ellis. Dante Stallworth. I think that's about the only guys I can think of still hanging around from that 98 team.

[Slick]

Deion Grant. Cedrick Wilson. Shaun Ellis. Dante Stallworth. I think that's about the only guys I can think of still hanging around from that 98 team.

Ellis must have been the guy I was thinking of. I remember both of the starting DT's from that team played successfully in the NFL for a long time.

[Joel]

"Okay, bitchiness levels have reached the point I should sleep; it begins to look like the only place I can see my team win another Super Bowl (perhaps even playoff game.)"

This isn't Joel betting against "his" team, this is me pulling garbage outta my ass.
No, it's venting frustration at a depressing preseason while badly sleep deprived. There's a reason I went to bed.


When you say it doesn't meet the desire for a mike linebacker you mean your personal desire. Your desires are not important what Elway and Fox think is what is most important. You still don't get that a great middle linebacker is necessary in this defense. Yet you act like you know more than Elway and Fox. Heck you called Lenon a scrub without no knowing jack about him.
Right, my desire. I consciously chose to avoid "my," and generally to avoid those like "you" and "I," to prevent personalizing stuff that shouldn't be personal. Much good it does.

[Simple Jaded]

Really? When was the last time you slept, Joel? I only ask cause you've been a buzzkill for two years now.

[Joel]

Really? When was the last time you slept, Joel? I only ask cause you've been a buzzkill for two years now.
I've been a buzzkill since the Cutler trade, only briefly changing my tune halfway through 2011 after a half dozen impossible wins. Back then, IIRC, you were the Negative Nancy, but no Loyalty Officer showed up to arrest you as a traitor to the revolution. We strongly disagreed over Denvers QB at the time, and I've been on your Enemies List ever since. Get over it and move on like everyone else did long ago.

[Simple Jaded]

I've been a buzzkill since the Cutler trade, only briefly changing my tune halfway through 2011 after a half dozen impossible wins. Back then, IIRC, you were the Negative Nancy, but no Loyalty Officer showed up to arrest you as a traitor to the revolution. We strongly disagreed over Denvers QB at the time, and I've been on your Enemies List ever since. Get over it and move on like everyone else did long ago.

"Get over it and move on"? Priceless.

I'm still Negative Nancy but I got over Denver's choice of QB's long before you. Considering you're still butthurt over Tebow, you're the one that hasn't moved on. What I can't get over is that people like you can't get over it; Peyton Manning or Tim Tebow, life rarely (as in Never) has answers this ******* easy.

Btw, EVERYBODY questioned my loyalty to the Broncos after the Cutler fiasco but your faith in Tebow is not what brought me to question yours, I had you mistaken for a misguided Broncos fans until you told everybody how you're an Oilers/Texans/Frankfurt Galaxy/Japan fan who hated Elway and the Broncos until they played a style of football that you approved of. I understand you better, I don't think you're any better or worse than I am, we just have different and often opposing priorities.

[Joel]

You don't think me any better or worse off than you? So you're just snide and condescending for the Hell of it? :tongue: I'm not butthurt over Tebow; it's in the distant past and pointless to dwell on now, however one felt at the time. No, I wasn't a Broncos fan before the end of the '96 season, and have always been upfront about that. If that's not long/good enough for anyone else: Tough.

[TXBRONC]

"Get over it and move on"? Priceless.

I'm still Negative Nancy but I got over Denver's choice of QB's long before you. Considering you're still butthurt over Tebow, you're the one that hasn't moved on. What I can't get over is that people like you can't get over it; Peyton Manning or Tim Tebow, life rarely (as in Never) has answers this ******* easy.

Btw, EVERYBODY questioned my loyalty to the Broncos after the Cutler fiasco but your faith in Tebow is not what brought me to question yours, I had you mistaken for a misguided Broncos fans until you told everybody how you're an Oilers/Texans/Frankfurt Galaxy/Japan fan who hated Elway and the Broncos until they played a style of football that you approved of. I understand you better, I don't think you're any better or worse than I am, we just have different and often opposing priorities.

Did I really question your team loyalty? I don't remember doing that.

[ShaneFalco]

I've been a buzzkill since the Cutler trade, only briefly changing my tune halfway through 2011 after a half dozen impossible wins. Back then, IIRC, you were the Negative Nancy, but no Loyalty Officer showed up to arrest you as a traitor to the revolution. We strongly disagreed over Denvers QB at the time, and I've been on your Enemies List ever since. Get over it and move on like everyone else did long ago.
he does the same shit to everyone. And its a joke. Put em on your ignore list and move on.

Fan Police are not worth anyone's time. Especially ones who cant stand the fact "their" teams last playoff win of 5 years was with Timmy.

[TXBRONC]

he does the same shit to everyone. And its a joke. Put em on your ignore list and move on.

Fan Police are not worth anyone's time. Especially ones who cant stand the fact "their" teams last playoff win of 5 years was with Timmy.

He's not being the fan police. You just can handle the fact he's called you out.

[ShaneFalco]

ooooooooooooooooo callled out on a bronco forum.... i cant handle it! what will i do!!!!!???? Im so terrified! What will happen next!??

[TXBRONC]

ooooooooooooooooo callled out on a bronco forum.... i cant handle it! what will i do!!!!!????

Obviously you'll whine.

[ShaneFalco]

Who sits around trying to tell people what they like?

what a joke. Enjoy your fan police badges, im sure you can put it on your resume one day.

[TXBRONC]

Who sits around trying to tell people what they like?

what a joke. Enjoy your fan police badges, im sure you can put it on your resume one day.

Grow up. :lol:

[MOtorboat]

So, I didn't even look.

Did this dude play last night?

[TXBRONC]

So, I didn't even look.

Did this dude play last night?

Yes. He recorded two tackles fwiw.

[Simple Jaded]

Did I really question your team loyalty? I don't remember doing that.

I don't remember, when I say "everybody" it's your typical exaggeration.

There were about 2-3 people that agreed with my butthurt, most of the rest tried to grin and bare it but it was fairly obvious that nearly everyone agreed with the more vocal. I was a world class ******* and, truth be told, I'd still be a world class ******* if I was still forced to watch Tebow launch retarded ducks until 2:00 minutes left in the game.

[TXBRONC]

I don't remember, when I say "everybody" it's your typical exaggeration.

There were about 2-3 people that agreed with my butthurt, most of the rest tried to grin and bare it but it was fairly obvious that nearly everyone agreed with the more vocal. I was a world class ******* and, truth be told, I'd still be a world class ******* if I was still forced to watch Tebow launch retarded ducks until 2:00 minutes left in the game.

I was just giving you a hard time. :D

[MOtorboat]

Yes. He recorded two tackles fwiw.

I completely forgot to look for him.

[dogfish]

I completely forgot to look for him.

unacceptable, midget! get yer shit right. . .

[MOtorboat]

unacceptable, midget! get yer shit right. . .

Meh.

[TXBRONC]

I completely forgot to look for him.

I don't know know this but right now he is wearing number 43 iirc.