Where is the doom and gloom?

[MOtorboat]

Nothing really has changed, but no threads calling McDaniels the Devil have been started.

That's called irony.

It's preseason people, don't over-react, yet too many of you have...

[Northman]

Goddamn it MO, why you calling down the thunder you jackass!! lol

It was quiet, let the devils sleep in peace.

[sneakers]

I think a bunch of them were banned.

[MOtorboat]

Goddamn it MO, why you calling down the thunder you jackass!! lol

It was quiet, let the devils sleep in peace.

Nope, either you ball up or you don't. The fact that there are no complainers after this game tells all.

[Watchthemiddle]

Nope, either you ball up or you don't. The fact that there are no complainers after this game tells all.

You got that right...tells all.

In it through the good times and bad times....

Doomers credibility = ZERO

[Tned]

Nope, either you ball up or you don't. The fact that there are no complainers after this game tells all.

Tells what?

That...
They won?
There were no left handed passes?
There were no red zone INTs?
The defense actually created a turnover?
There weren't 10 penalties?
It was the 4th preseason game and the starters only played a serious or two?

Yep, it was telling, but not an indication that all is well in mudville...

[Tned]

Doomers credibility = ZERO

Why the hell you hating on Dumervil now? ;)

[Watchthemiddle]

"My how the turns have tabled" - Michael Scott

[MOtorboat]

You got that right...tells all.

In it through the good times and bad times....

Doomers credibility = ZERO

Actually, it shows the incredible stupidity of the anti-McDaniels crowd. I, personally, would be harping on this game, win or lose, because no one really played, yet we finally won.

The fact that they didn't, just shows their lack of knowledge of the situation. It was preseason football. Nothing more, nothing less. But, for some reason, the sky isn't falling after this game...:noidea:

I'm going to love to hear the McDumbass responses.

[NameUsedBefore]

I'm optimistic about Tom Bra-. But, since you seemingly live entirely in the present, I have to remind you that the three previous games, the ones where our starters played, resulted in about as bad of offensive output as one can get. You know, hardly any points at all, multitudes of turnovers, etc.

This game is about the bubble players, not what we're gonna see come Cincy.

[MOtorboat]

Tells what?

That...
They won?
There were no left handed passes?
There were no red zone INTs?
The defense actually created a turnover?
There weren't 10 penalties?
It was the 4th preseason game and the starters only played a serious or two?

Yep, it was telling, but not an indication that all is well in mudville...

That it was preseason, and it doesn't matter?

I didn't find that in your explanations....or your continual bitching of worthless preseason games.

I'm not going to sit here and let dipshits bitch and moan about the "performance" in preseason, when it doesn't mean shit, and when we perform well, everyone is silent. Having your cake and eating it too.

[honz]

We'll be lucky to win 1 game this season.

[NameUsedBefore]

Nobody is "silent", goddam, it's almost 1am and it was a preseason game featuring bubble-players in which very few people were actually able to watch.

[MOtorboat]

Nobody is "silent", goddam, it's almost 1am and it was a preseason game featuring bubble-players in which very few people were actually able to watch.

It's ironic that preseason doesn't matter, isn't it...

Oh, :championship: we totally dominated! I can't believe the idiots that doubt people! Fail!

[LoyalSoldier]

I was busy watching a thug sucker punch a player....also known as the Boise State vs Oregon game. Sorry, but real college football takes priority over the last preseason game. :D

[Shazam!]

When Denver lost in preseason the sky is falling, when they win in preseason it was scrubs and only preseason.

[Elevation inc]

Nothing really has changed, but no threads calling McDaniels the Devil have been started.

That's called irony.

It's preseason people, don't over-react, yet too many of you have...


LOL.....we didnt watch kyle orton throw 15 times for 96 yds, or turn the ball over 3 times in a game or watch a left handed int from a right handed thrower who has been in the league 5 years...of course there is no need for discord....

Tom brandy and the denver broncos= 1-0
Kyle orton at the helm =0-3 and way to many f'in mistakes for a 5 year vet who supposedly is the "guy"

tom brandy needs work, obviously, but its nice watching our offense get 5 scoring drives with a rookie, especially when 13 points came against a NFL first string defense that went to the SB last year....but hey who are we to judge stuff like that right????

[Watchthemiddle]

LOL.....we didnt watch kyle orton throw 15 times for 96 yds, or turn the ball over 3 times in a game or watch a left handed int from a right handed thrower who has been in the league 5 years...of course there is no need for discord....

Tom brandy and the denver broncos= 1-0
Kyle orton at the helm =0-3 and way to many f'in mistakes for a 5 year vet who supposedly is the "guy"

tom brandy needs work, obviously, but its nice watching our offense get 5 scoring drives with a rookie, especially when 13 points came against a NFL first string defense that went to the SB last year....but hey who are we to judge stuff like that right????

All that stuff you mentioned = It's only preseason.

[NameUsedBefore]

It's ironic that preseason doesn't matter, isn't it...

Oh, :championship: we totally dominated! I can't believe the idiots that doubt people! Fail!

Once again, our starting units have not looked up to par pretty much at all this entire preseason. Do you think we should excuse that because nobody cares about the bubble-players beating up other bubble-players? This game proves that our backups match up well against Arizona's backups. The three previous games showed that our starting units are completely outmatched. The former doesn't excuse the latter, ever. Certainly not because people don't particularly care about the 4th preseason game which is there almost entirely for the guys who will be playing special teams.

[honz]

Yeah, we looked good tonight, but it is only the preseason. We looked like crap the rest of the preseason and that is what I am judging the team off. You simply can't judge a team off how they play in the preseason.

[DenBronx]

"My how the turns have tabled" - Michael Scott

the office....great show.

[DenBronx]

the 4th preseason game = nothing

warner and fitz ran 5 plays or so? where was boldin? dansby?

cmon...it was like i was watching fresno state play the sun devils

regardless...i still think brandstater is going to be a good qb.

[Watchthemiddle]

Yeah, we looked good tonight, but it is only the preseason. We looked like crap the rest of the preseason and that is what I am judging the team off.

:confused:


You simply can't judge a team off how they play in the preseason

:confused:

[DenBronx]

^^^^ ahahahahaa:lol:

[honz]

:confused:



:confused:

Maybe you should try some Head and Shoulders to fix that itchy scalp of yours. :confused:

[Elevation inc]

the 4th preseason game = nothing

warner and fitz ran 5 plays or so? where was boldin? dansby?

cmon...it was like i was watching fresno state play the sun devils

regardless...i still think brandstater is going to be a good qb.

dansby played the full first quarter, in fact arizonas entire first string defense played the first quarter...its only pre-season your right, but brandy looks best against first string defenses so far.....gilmmer of hope i will hold onto after seeing kyle.

hopefully chris simms plays week 1 and shuts this kyle crap down for good.....


okay now waiting for all the people that think im not a fan......:coffee:

[Watchthemiddle]

Maybe you should try some Head and Shoulders to fix that itchy scalp of yours. :confused:

In one sentence you are saying you are judging the team by their preseason performance...then in the next sentence you are saying "You simply can't judge a team off how they play in the preseason".

So what is it?

[honz]

In one sentence you are saying you are judging the team by their preseason performance...then in the next sentence you are saying "You simply can't judge a team off how they play in the preseason".

So what is it?

I guess you don't know me well enough. My post was thoroughly lacquered in sarcasm.

[DenBronx]

dansby played the full first quarter, in fact arizonas entire first string defense played the first quarter...its only pre-season your right, but brandy looks best against first string defenses so far.....gilmmer of hope i will hold onto after seeing kyle.

hopefully chris simms plays week 1 and shuts this kyle crap down for good.....


okay now waiting for all the people that think im not a fan......:coffee:

thats good news then. i missed the 1st quarter...stupid direct tv had some blackout thing. never fails during a bronco game.:laugh:

[dogfish]

victory, i say. . . the nattering nabobs of negativism have been silenced!






the nattering nub of neutrality, however, has not. . . .

[LoyalSoldier]

When Denver lost in preseason the sky is falling, when they win in preseason it was scrubs and only preseason.

Wow I am shocked people are even trying to make this comparison. This is just sad.

Was Royal on the Field? No
Was Orton on the Field? No
Was Moreno on the field? No
Were any of the starters playing? No

This isn't even a comparison. People are complaining when our starting units aren't looking up to par. I don't care if our 3rd stringers won a game, they aren't the ones that are going to have an impact on the season.

[Elevation inc]

looks like Kyle is the one feeling the doom and gloom:eek:

[sneakers]

"My how the turns have tabled" - Michael Scott

I think it was "My how the turntables have....."

[Dirk]

looks like Kyle is the one feeling the doom and gloom:eek:

Ha! KO looks like Hans Gruber (Alan Rickman) in that picture from Die Hard.

[sneakers]

looks like Kyle is the one feeling the doom and gloom:eek:

It looks like half his face is paralized from a stroke

[Elevation inc]

It looks like half his face is paralized from a stroke

yep he was probally in the midst of a stroke on that completion to chad jackson at the start...probally thinking wish i could throw that far.....






Disclaimer:::: party poopers.....remember this is all in good fun...................kind of....................

[claymore]

Nothing really has changed, but no threads calling McDaniels the Devil have been started.

That's called irony.

It's preseason people, don't over-react, yet too many of you have...

Weird how it coincided with Orton not starting.

[Tned]

victory, i say. . . the nattering nabobs of negativism have been silenced!






the nattering nub of neutrality, however, has not. . . .

Haven't you heard, you can't be neutral. You have to take an extreme view, or you will have your fan card removed. Fan police are on the way to your house right now.

[claymore]

All that stuff you mentioned = It's only preseason.

Lets just call it fancy practice, which is what the pre-season is.

Brandy looks like the vet, and Orton looks like the rookie during fancy practice.

[Elevation inc]

Haven't you heard, you can't be neutral. You have to take an extreme view, or you will have your fan card removed. Fan police are on the way to your house right now.

i have tried to stay neutural but kyle led me to no choice.....dont even care about the cutler saga no more, and i still like MCD the coach(not the Part GM)...but kyle as our QB thats a whole nother ball of wax......like the dude alot especially his toughness but lets be real here....

just dont see how a left handed duck int from 3 yds out, on 4th down, with 3 minutes left in the half can be blamed on a system...and new players:confused:

[SoCalImport]

I don't much see the point of intentionally inflammatory thread titles. Outside of the smack forum that is.
That being said, this turned into a clone of a dozen other threads with a wide variety of titles. So I guess it's all good?

[Tned]

I don't much see the point of intentionally inflammatory thread titles. Outside of the smack forum that is.


Yep, on the one hand we complain when people rag on the team, and then we complain and inflame, when they don't. Obviously, it wasn't the ragging on the team causing the unhappiness, or we wouldn't be trying to prod people into doing some more of it.


i have tried to stay neutural but kyle led me to no choice.....dont even care about the cutler saga no more, and i still like MCD the coach(not the Part GM)...but kyle as our QB thats a whole nother ball of wax......like the dude alot especially his toughness but lets be real here....

just dont see how a left handed duck int from 3 yds out, on 4th down, with 3 minutes left in the half can be blamed on a system...and new players:confused:

I'm the other way. I don't feel great with Orton at QB, but I think he will be solid, a decent game manager. I think it is possible that he won't be able to carry the team with his athleticism, but if the system is running well, I think he will likely do fine.

My issues with McDaniels and the front office were more the questionable offseason moves and apparent "my way or the highway" approach that McDaniels takes. Once Cutler was traded, it isn't like there were a lot of options available to us that were any better than Orton.

However, at the same time, I am very happy about what I have heard from camp and seen in the first three games (and less so this game, because it was backups v. backups).

I think the defense will have made great strides over last year, and we can be competitive in many games this year.

[Elevation inc]

the defense is what i am most excited about, if we can go the whole season without conceeding a points differential of 20 in almost every loss its a improvement...lol

well maybe kyle will, but i just think this is to complex for him...he is just to tenative, he may finally get it by the bye week, but by then it could be way to late.....

[TXBRONC]

Yep, on the one hand we complain when people rag on the team, and then we complain and inflame, when they don't. Obviously, it wasn't the ragging on the team causing the unhappiness, or we wouldn't be trying to prod people into doing some more of it.



I'm the other way. I don't feel great with Orton at QB, but I think he will be solid, a decent game manager. I think it is possible that he won't be able to carry the team with his athleticism, but if the system is running well, I think he will likely do fine.

My issues with McDaniels and the front office were more the questionable offseason moves and apparent "my way or the highway" approach that McDaniels takes. Once Cutler was traded, it isn't like there were a lot of options available to us that were any better than Orton.

However, at the same time, I am very happy about what I have heard from camp and seen in the first three games (and less so this game, because it was backups v. backups).

I think the defense will have made great strides over last year, and we can be competitive in many games this year.

It's crazy, bitching at people because they're not bitching, but if they were bitching they would get bitched at for bitching. :confused:

I hope you're right about Orton being solid, but right now I'm still not there.

[Dreadnought]

Yep, on the one hand we complain when people rag on the team, and then we complain and inflame, when they don't. Obviously, it wasn't the ragging on the team causing the unhappiness, or we wouldn't be trying to prod people into doing some more of it.



I'm the other way. I don't feel great with Orton at QB, but I think he will be solid, a decent game manager. I think it is possible that he won't be able to carry the team with his athleticism, but if the system is running well, I think he will likely do fine.

My issues with McDaniels and the front office were more the questionable offseason moves and apparent "my way or the highway" approach that McDaniels takes. Once Cutler was traded, it isn't like there were a lot of options available to us that were any better than Orton.

However, at the same time, I am very happy about what I have heard from camp and seen in the first three games (and less so this game, because it was backups v. backups).

I think the defense will have made great strides over last year, and we can be competitive in many games this year.

I'm in the same boat, but with less hope for Orton than you have. i had little enthusiasm for the guy before he got here, and he's shown nothing to change that. When i see him hit 20 yard crossing patterns accurately I'll change my mind.

On a good note? I really like the defensive system. We're seeing guys who did nothing under Slowick show flashes of really good play. I've said before that for a lot of our defensive personnel it was almost impossible to really tell if they sucked or not because the system was so bad. Nate Webster and the safeties excluded because they sucked period. Some of our recent draftees seem to be thriving under Nolan - so far. lets see how this plays out in real games.

[TXBRONC]

I'm in the same boat, but with less hope for Orton than you have. i had little enthusiasm for the guy before he got here, and he's shown nothing to change that. When i see him hit 20 yard crossing patterns accurately I'll change my mind.

On a good note? I really like the defensive system. We're seeing guys who did nothing under Slowick show flashes of really good play. I've said before that for a lot of our defensive personnel it was almost impossible to really tell if they sucked or not because the system was so bad. Nate Webster and the safeties excluded because they sucked period. Some of our recent draftees seem to be thriving under Nolan - so far. lets see how this plays out in real games.

It was nice seeing Moss chasing plays down from the backside. He looks like he's much better fit at outside linebacker than he ever was at defensive end.

[Thnikkaman]

We'll be lucky to win 1 game this season.

You talking about Utah?

[frauschieze]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, I was only watching a choppy feed last night and was trying to entertain and cook at the same time, but wasn't our starting O-line in all first half? Royal didn't play that long, but Buckhalter did. Graham was in. And from what I could tell of Arizona's D, their starters were in for over the first quarter.

Or was my choppy feed just obscuring numbers so bad that I was delusional?

[TXBRONC]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, I was only watching a choppy feed last night and was trying to entertain and cook at the same time, but wasn't our starting O-line in all first half? Royal didn't play that long, but Buckhalter did. Graham was in. And from what I could tell of Arizona's D, their starters were in for over the first quarter.

Or was my choppy feed just obscuring numbers so bad that I was delusional?

I don't think all of the starting offensive line was out there and the ones that were out of the game before the half was over. In fact the only starter I remember seeing for sure was Clady.

[sneakers]

Haven't you heard, you can't be neutral. You have to take an extreme view, or you will have your fan card removed. Fan police are on the way to your house right now.

Tned is Swiss, always neutral

[frauschieze]

I don't think all of the starting offensive line was out there and the ones that were out of the game before the half was over. In fact the only starter I remember seeing for sure was Clady.

The whole starting O line was there in the beginning (assuming Olsen is considered the starter while Kuper is out), so I at least know that much. I don't remember seeing the 2nd stringers until 2nd half.

I am probably wrong, but I'm really curious about playing time this game. That didn't seem to be a normal 4th preseason game until halfway through the longest 3rd quarter ever.

[TXBRONC]

The whole starting O line was there in the beginning (assuming Olsen is considered the starter while Kuper is out), so I at least know that much. I don't remember seeing the 2nd stringers until 2nd half.

I am probably wrong, but I'm really curious about playing time this game. That didn't seem to be a normal 4th preseason game until halfway through the longest 3rd quarter ever.

I just read an article by Mike Klis and said the starter that were in came out after the first quarter.

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_13262990

Broncos' backups salvage finale
Brandstater helps ensure preseason not a washout
By Mike Klis
The Denver Post
Posted: 09/03/2009 06:15:00 PM MDT
Updated: 09/04/2009 06:21:47 AM MDT


Brandstater and the backups just beat Kurt Warner, Larry Fitzgerald and an Arizona Cardinals team that came within 35 seconds of winning the most recent Super Bowl.

If the Broncos' second team was better than Arizona's first team, does that mean . . . ?

At the very least, bring on the Bengals.

The Broncos may not be nearly as bad as the restless natives were suggesting after the team's anemic preseason performance just five days ago against the Chicago Bears. With starters Kyle Orton, Ben Hamilton and Chris Kuper looking on from the upper reaches of the press box, the Broncos benchwarmers defeated Arizona 19-0 in the preseason finale Thursday night, giving Josh McDaniels the first victory of any kind in his head coaching career.

"We definitely knew what people were thinking," Broncos cornerback Andre Goodman said. "There was so much transition in the offseason that people wanted to know what this team was going to be. I think everybody thought the Bears was the game to show it, and because we weren't able to play the way we wanted to, I think people were disappointed. But again, preseason. I think we learned a lot, and now we can carry this one into the season."

The next time the Broncos play will be for keeps. They open the regular season Sept. 13 against the Cincinnati Bengals.

But just because the game Thursday didn't count didn't mean it was meaningless. Ordinarily, the final preseason game is the least significant because starters play little, if at all.

But a paid crowd of 72,088 at Invesco Field at Mile High could have not been displeased to see such Arizona stars as Warner, who is one of the league's best quarterbacks, and Fitzgerald, who is all but indisputably the league's top receiver, play not one, not two, but all three first-quarter series.

The Broncos, meanwhile, sat their injury-depleted regular units after one possession. So when the Broncos still won the first quarter 10-0, hope was raised by a team that needed a little.

"We were a little down (after the Bears game) but we know we can improve," Broncos cornerback Champ Bailey said. "I think by the first game, we should be ready. I don't know how good we're going to be, but however good that is, it should show."

This final warm-up also taught some lessons. Like, don't bother trying to slip quarterback Tom Brandstater to the practice squad. The 6-foot-5, strong-performing rookie would never make it through waivers.

A sixth-round draft pick from Fresno State, Brandstater initially wasn't supposed to play in this preseason until the second half of the final exhibition against the Cardinals.

Instead, injuries to Orton (right index finger) and veteran backup Chris Simms (left ankle) made Brandstater a preseason veteran by the time he started the finale.

"I'm glad I got my shot, and hopefully I did some good with it," Brandstater said. "I'm trying to make this team. I still haven't even guaranteed myself a spot on the team. I'm trying to do everything I can to make it, just like everyone on this team is doing. I think this effort is definitely going to help that."

Needing a win to avoid the embarrassing distinction of becoming the first Broncos team to have a winless preseason since their inaugural year of 1960, Brandstater came through, completing 16-of-30 passes for 187 yards when he left after the third quarter with the Broncos already up 19-0.

In the first quarter, against the Cardinals' first-string defense, Broncos tailbacks Correll Buckhalter and Darius Walker combined for 52 yards rushing on just nine carries (5.8 yards per carry), and Brandstater threw for 108 yards.

If the preseason did anything for the Broncos, it gave them a third quarterback.

"He has a lot of poise for a rookie," Broncos receiver Brandon Lloyd said. "He has a really calm demeanor, and everything about him is positive."

Mike Klis: 303-954-1055 or mklis@denverpost.com

[jrelway]

****** worthless fan police who have nothing better to do than call out ppl after a win. worthless ass fan police who bitch and moan about ppl who have opinions on the preseason and players. im happy after the win because we saw improvement. will i complain about the team and players if we have our next loss and play like garbage? of course i will.

[yardog]

Actually, it shows the incredible stupidity of the anti-McDaniels crowd. I, personally, would be harping on this game, win or lose, because no one really played, yet we finally won.

The fact that they didn't, just shows their lack of knowledge of the situation. It was preseason football. Nothing more, nothing less. But, for some reason, the sky isn't falling after this game...:noidea:

I'm going to love to hear the McDumbass responses.

Actually, it shows the incredible stupidity of the anti-McDaniels crowd.:tsk:

My Lack of knowledge of the situation is tied to the QB play. If we could get that type of performance from the man under center I could live with the growing pains ahead. It's just my gut telling me we might have seen the best QB on the roster last night and next week he will be on the bench.

[MOtorboat]

****** worthless fan police who have nothing better to do than call out ppl after a win. worthless ass fan police who bitch and moan about ppl who have opinions on the preseason and players. im happy after the win because we saw improvement. will i complain about the team and players if we have our next loss and play like garbage? of course i will.

I guess I haven't seen you irrationally berating and belittling the team, coaches and organization, so I would say this thread and my posts weren't really directed at you, but if you took it as directed at you, I guess then maybe it was.

[Ravage!!!]

Nope, either you ball up or you don't. The fact that there are no complainers after this game tells all.

Tells me a lot of us didn't get to watch the game... THAT... and its the last preseason game where fewer of the starters play (in general) for lesser time (in general)... and most peopledon't watch the last preseason game because of it.

I'm not sure what that tells you.... other than it means that some of the "less than glossy, wide eyed, orange colored glass" fans may be reloading for the first game :)

[NightTrainLayne]

MB, I'm on the optimistic side of the fence. I haven't been spreading doom and gloom. .. quite the opposite.

However, your argument is pointless. Either the pre-season means something or it doesn't.

If the pre-season means something, then it means something when we play good and when we play bad.

If it doesn't mean anything, then it doesn't mean anything if we play bad or good.

Up until now you've been arguing that it was meaningless that we lost.

Now when we won, you're upset that the nay-sayers are silent. That's all well and good, but you kind of shoot yourself in the foot now by trying to make a big deal of this win and their reaction.

Maybe some of the nay-sayers are being hypocritical now in their silence. . .maybe not, because the game wasn't nationally televised and a bunch of us have yet to see it.

But, this thread started just to pick a fight with them almost paints you in that same light. Now all of a sudden your trumpeting and posturing about a pre-season game.

Let it go. Either McD will win with this team this season or he will lose, but we'll all get to see it together.

[MOtorboat]

Tells me a lot of us didn't get to watch the game... THAT... and its the last preseason game where fewer of the starters play (in general) for lesser time (in general)... and most peopledon't watch the last preseason game because of it.

Again, this is more directed at the irrational "McDumbass" posters that have just come to the site in flocks the last three weeks.

[Northman]

We looked like crap the rest of the preseason and that is what I am judging the team off. You simply can't judge a team off how they play in the preseason.

Uh, so in one hand you are judging them by preseason and on the other hand your not? Which is it? :lol:

[T.K.O.]

I'm optimistic about Tom Bra-. But, since you seemingly live entirely in the present, I have to remind you that the three previous games, the ones where our starters played, resulted in about as bad of offensive output as one can get. You know, hardly any points at all, multitudes of turnovers, etc.

This game is about the bubble players, not what we're gonna see come Cincy.

sounds alot like weeks 14-17 last season !:tsk:

[Northman]

****** worthless fan police who have nothing better to do than call out ppl after a win. worthless ass fan police who bitch and moan about ppl who have opinions on the preseason and players. im happy after the win because we saw improvement. will i complain about the team and players if we have our next loss and play like garbage? of course i will.


Somewhat par for the course. I dont agree with what MO did but i can understand his frustration. When you have people constantly entering threads for the sake of stirring up shit all offseason and then in the first 3 preseason games where we certainly didnt look our best it can be quite annoying and not very fun to come to this board. I for one, enjoyed the fact that i could actually enter into a game thread and not have to worry about the flaming and negativity of those who just cant move on from what has transpired this offseason. Despite the struggles we may have this year having to listen to the constant whining about why Jay isnt here or why Orton sucks just makes the board more intolerable than it needs to be.

There are plenty of people as Tned put it that have a more neutral and objective outlook on the situation this year but are also able to discuss it civily without it becoming a "Orton sucks my ass" or "I told you we would suck" type of posts. And likewise, for MO to start this pointless thread is just on the other side of the fence and makes him look like a hypocrite because he is doing exactly what it is he hates most right now. Either way, i really do hope we can go with a positive and negative game threads this year. Because the way the last game thread from last week went im just not sure i want to stay here if i have to deal with trolls starting a bunch of crap in the gameday thread while others are trying to watch and discuss the game.

[Ravage!!!]

Again, this is more directed at the irrational "McDumbass" posters that have just come to the site in flocks the last three weeks.

Guess when you have been called a "gloomer" because you don't see everything as being great, you tend to get a bit gun-shy.

[T.K.O.]

there have been plenty of reasons for "doom and gloom" and plenty of reasons to be excited about the upcoming season.
i see the problem being that of some people refuse to see any good in what the broncos are trying to do.
the drafting of the best rb in the draft is looked at by some as a complete blunder because they wanted d-line only.
well if knoshon turns out to be a great rb for us ,it will be a "great move"

if brian dawkins can bring a much needed "FIRE" to our d then it will be a "great move"
in this game all you really have are "ifs" until the games are played .
i think we all see that there have been mistakes made and most likely fantastic changes to the team.
its really just a matter of which ones we choose to dwell on.
the fact remains that there are absolutely no gaurentees which moves will turn out to good or bad .....so as they say "thats why they play the games"
and i for one intend to cheer the broncos all season (as i have done for 30+ years).win or lose i'm rollin' with the guys we have NOW !:salute:

[Ravage!!!]

I'm still looking for the bright. I don't think we improved our defense (yet).... simply because we are trying to move to a 34 without the personnel on the DL to run a 34. I know Knowshon may turn out to be good to great...but we've seen in the past that you can find VERY servicable RBs without having to spend the first round picks on them. So I was hoping to find a guy on Defense to fix our BIG needs and not just add to the side of the ball that needed the least amount of help.

The brightness won't show up for a while. We can "hope" that he has good insight. But as of right now, to me, none of that has been proved either. Simply believing he's installing a "change" doesn't mean its going to be successful. Change isn't good just because its change.

So yeah.... I definitely am keeping my optimism down until I can actually be shown that the change we made was one for the better.

Its like that word "faith." We are supposed to have "faith" in there being something greater out there, even though there isn't any proof of such a person/thing/place. Pure faith is what keeps people striving forward. But I'm confident that none of our coaches has earned that kind of "faith" yet. I need a bit more, right now.

[Dortoh]

Wow are the Cardinals bad or what ;)

[Gimpygod]

Actually, it shows the incredible stupidity of the anti-McDaniels crowd. I, personally, would be harping on this game, win or lose, because no one really played, yet we finally won.

The fact that they didn't, just shows their lack of knowledge of the situation. It was preseason football. Nothing more, nothing less. But, for some reason, the sky isn't falling after this game...:noidea:

I'm going to love to hear the McDumbass responses.

You would have a point if those who were pessimistic or upset were being so simply out of spite. Then, regardless of what happens, "McDaniels haters" would come on here and crap all over everything.... much like the Shanahan bashers. I, however, am new to the pessimism game so don't have all the intricacies down. But I sure do like the win/win situation of enjoying watching them do well yet having the option to complain my face off and claim moral victory when they lose..

My hope is the guys we know are going to start over the people who actually won last night ccan show the same poise, ability and toughness..

[MOtorboat]

You would have a point if those who were pessimistic or upset were being so simply out of spite.

And, I feel, the flocks of "McDumbass" people who have signed up and spammed this board in the last few weeks are doing it out of spite, and its annoying.

I would never count you as one of those people.

[Tned]

And, I feel, the flocks of "McDumbass" people who have signed up and spammed this board in the last few weeks are doing it out of spite, and its annoying.

I would never count you as one of those people.

If you believe that most people are inherently good natured, which I believe, than you might look at this 'flock' of McDaniels bashers differently.

It's very possible that there are more people so frustrated with the state of the Broncos, and looking for information on things like the Marshall situation, or to talk or vent about their frustrations, and they have found BF as a place to accomplish all of that.

It is much more likely (and it is happening) that people that were already long time members, but that held certain grudges (like Cutler being traded) that are posting inflammatory stuff out of spite. In the same way, we have people that were pissed at Shanhan and Cutler, because Plummer was benched for Cutler, that are rubbing the firing/Cutler trade in people's face, out of spite.

The new people flocking in don't have old battles, so it doesn't make sense for them to be posting out of spite, but instead it is most likely out of frustration.

[MOtorboat]

If you believe that most people are inherently good natured, which I believe, than you might look at this 'flock' of McDaniels bashers differently.

It's very possible that there are more people so frustrated with the state of the Broncos, and looking for information on things like the Marshall situation, or to talk or vent about their frustrations, and they have found BF as a place to accomplish all of that.

It is much more likely (and it is happening) that people that were already long time members, but that held certain grudges (like Cutler being traded) that are posting inflammatory stuff out of spite. In the same way, we have people that were pissed at Shanhan and Cutler, because Plummer was benched for Cutler, that are rubbing the firing/Cutler trade in people's face, out of spite.

The new people flocking in don't have old battles, so it doesn't make sense for them to be posting out of spite, but instead it is most likely out of frustration.

I guess I took "out of spite," to mean out of spite towards the team.

[Tned]

I guess I took "out of spite," to mean out of spite towards the team.

I just don't see it that way. I could be wrong. What I see is people that love the Broncos that are upset and frustrated, and they are voicing that frustration. Isn't that what you are doing? I don't see it as a spiteful think, but a frustration thing.

[Dean]

I couldn't find a thread that this fit and I didn't want to start one but did anyone see Hillis last night? I don't remember a single carry by him? 'Sup wit dat?

[Tned]

I couldn't find a thread that this fit and I didn't want to start one but did anyone see Hillis last night? I don't remember a single carry by him? 'Sup wit dat?

I haven't watched the NFLN replay. I taped it and will probably rewatch the first half. Between the game day thread, twitter and the streamed video, I missed a lot.

HOwever, I don't think he got any carries. Not sure about any returns.

[dogfish]

I couldn't find a thread that this fit and I didn't want to start one but did anyone see Hillis last night? I don't remember a single carry by him? 'Sup wit dat?

i haven't watched it yet so i can't comment, but i'm not going to complain if they spared him the pounding in an ultimately meaningless exhibition game. . . save those punishing runs for when it counts. . . of course, if doogie forgets about him during the regular season i'm not going to be very happy. . .

i kind of feel like that will be one of the early measuring sticks of his success and ability-- can he find a way to keep all of our weapons involved while also keeping the offense in rhythm?

[Krugan]

Hillis was there and dressed, didnt see him play, no returns.

As for the starting of this thread, was it even needed?

Just a touch of reality, it was a game played 98% by backups and future cuts.

Its not a game where you can say yay or nay to. But had the first string came in and played a full half and stunk it up, then maybe there would be reason to complain.

On the upside, Tom B. played much better as a rookie last night than the starter has up to this point.

But, I suppose I shouldnt be excited about that, as they are all learning a new system and we shouldnt expect much...

[LRtagger]

I don't think this thread was necessary...but at the same time I don't think it's a coincidence that certain people did not post in the gameday thread last night...not to mention the fact that the thread itself was half as many pages as the previous two gameday threads.

I think it says a lot about some of the posters here. It seems fun to be pessimistic for some people when we are losing. It's a shame, really because Broncos fans should have the most fun when they win...regardless of it being the 4th preseason game or not.

I personally found it to be a lot of fun to watch the last game and I went to bed in a great mood. I almost have to wonder if some fans were upset that we played well. I understand that people like to vent when the team sucks, but at least show your faces when we don't suck. Sheesh.

[Ravage!!!]

again.. I'm betting very few were able to watch this game... not to mention it was the last pre-season game which is usually VERY lame, and very boring to watch. I know I, for one, didn't watch it.

[LRtagger]

You may be right...just seems a bit suspicious

[Ravage!!!]

You may be right...just seems a bit suspicious

if it were the 3rd pre-season game.. where starters play.. I would agree.

[Dortoh]

I certainly hope nobody who claims to be a fan gets happy when we stink it up. I'm pretty sure that person would have a mental condition.

[Ravage!!!]

I certainly hope nobody who claims to be a fan gets happy when we stink it up. I'm pretty sure that person would have a mental condition.

Make no bones about it. There are fans that rooted against Shanahan, and knew the ONLY way shanahan would be gone is if he lost. Same thing will happen to/against McDaniels.

Its hard to say thats not a fan, IF/WHEN you believe the BEST thing for your team is to see that person/gm/coach/player gone. I personally feel as you do, but at the same time CAN understand if a fan simply wants a guy OUT of the organization.

[Dortoh]

Make no bones about it. There are fans that rooted against Shanahan, and knew the ONLY way shanahan would be gone is if he lost. Same thing will happen to/against McDaniels.

Its hard to say thats not a fan, IF/WHEN you believe the BEST thing for your team is to see that person/gm/coach/player gone. I personally feel as you do, but at the same time CAN understand if a fan simply wants a guy OUT of the organization.

I guess that makes some form of sense.

I'm happy with Shanny leaving and I'm ok with McD coming. Just not with some of this personel decissions. Yet once the ball is kicked it could be Satan himself on the sideline and I'm bleeding Orange and Blue

[dogfish]

I guess that makes some form of sense.

I'm happy with Shanny leaving and I'm ok with McD coming. Just not with some of this personel decissions. Yet once the ball is kicked it could be Satan himself on the sideline and I'm bleeding Orange and Blue

hey, that might be an idea. . . i bet he'd make a vicious defensive coordinator. . . .

[Dortoh]

hey, that might be an idea. . . i bet he'd make a vicious defensive coordinator. . . .

Maybe he could light a fire under Ortons ass.............that was just retarded I appologize :laugh:

[Ravage!!!]

hey, that might be an idea. . . i bet he'd make a vicious defensive coordinator. . . .

He would certainly put some FIRE under their asses!!

He would surely stick a fork in their attitude!!

I'm betting he could find a way to 'motivate' the the team!

He would have the defense seeing RED!

The team would be playing by fire and brimstone!!!

THe opposing teams would have HELL to pay!!

He wouldn't be good in interviews though.. he's known to have a forked tongue.

If we lose, would he walk away with his tail between his legs??

He's known as a player's coach...seems to get them to bare their soul!

But would I players be willing to sign ANY kind of contract he offered??

(trying to think of more)

[Dean]

He would certainly put some FIRE under their asses!!

He would surely stick a fork in their attitude!!

I'm betting he could find a way to 'motivate' the the team!

He would have the defense seeing RED!

The team would be playing by fire and brimstone!!!

THe opposing teams would have HELL to pay!!

He wouldn't be good in interviews though.. he's known to have a forked tongue.

If we lose, would he walk away with his tail between his legs??

He's known as a player's coach...seems to get them to bare their soul!

But would I players be willing to sign ANY kind of contract he offered??[SIZE]

(trying to think of more)

Ravage- You have to become more current and aware of the times.

Coaches have been speaking with forked tongues for years and the pregame speech has always been fire and brimstone.

Many rookies have been willing to sign anything put in front of them in blood if asked.

[Watchthemiddle]

again.. I'm betting very few were able to watch this game... not to mention it was the last pre-season game which is usually VERY lame, and very boring to watch. I know I, for one, didn't watch it.

Then I guess no one can really base Tom B's performance after last night because as you put it,it was a lame game and very boring to watch and you didn't even watch it.

[Watchthemiddle]

I don't think this thread was necessary...but at the same time I don't think it's a coincidence that certain people did not post in the gameday thread last night...not to mention the fact that the thread itself was half as many pages as the previous two gameday threads.

I think it says a lot about some of the posters here. It seems fun to be pessimistic for some people when we are losing. It's a shame, really because Broncos fans should have the most fun when they win...regardless of it being the 4th preseason game or not.

I personally found it to be a lot of fun to watch the last game and I went to bed in a great mood. I almost have to wonder if some fans were upset that we played well. I understand that people like to vent when the team sucks, but at least show your faces when we don't suck. Sheesh.


Hammer meet nail because you hit it on the head

[Buff]

Make no bones about it. There are fans that rooted against Shanahan, and knew the ONLY way shanahan would be gone is if he lost. Same thing will happen to/against McDaniels.

Its hard to say thats not a fan, IF/WHEN you believe the BEST thing for your team is to see that person/gm/coach/player gone. I personally feel as you do, but at the same time CAN understand if a fan simply wants a guy OUT of the organization.

I do not understand that logic at all, nor would I consider those people fans. Fans want their team to win, period. There is no such thing as "let's lose now so we can win later" in the NFL.

It's the classic cut off your nose to spite your face logic.

[LoyalSoldier]

hey, that might be an idea. . . i bet he'd make a vicious defensive coordinator. . . .

He would know just how to tempt the other team's offense into a mistake.

[Ravage!!!]

Then I guess no one can really base Tom B's performance after last night because as you put it,it was a lame game and very boring to watch and you didn't even watch it.

You can judge Tom B's performance based on the competition he played against... sure. But everyone knows that in general, most teams SIT their starters the last pre-season game, and its basically a game of seeing the last 'scrubs' to possibly make the roster and/or practice team. If it was on a local channel here, I would have watched it, but it wasn't a game I would have been sure to go to a sports bar to see, like say the 3rd pre-season game. I don't judge how any player is playing based on the 4th pre-season game...ever. Thats the lamest of the pre-season games.

[Ravage!!!]

I do not understand that logic at all, nor would I consider those people fans. Fans want their team to win, period. There is no such thing as "let's lose now so we can win later" in the NFL.

It's the classic cut off your nose to spite your face logic.

Thats your right, and I understand what you are saying. But you can't say they aren't fans IF they are TRULY wanting the best for their team in the long run. If they truly believe in their heart, that the team would be better off without Shanahan (or whomever) and knows the only way the team would get rid of them is to lose, then aren't you basically rooting for your favorite team to improve??

Don't we accept (well, some of us do, not all of us) that in order for us to get better, we have to get worse (go through some learning patches) first? Isn't that the mantra around here lately? "Yeah, we may go 3-13, but our team is making strides towards being a better 'team' "... or whatever?

If thats true, than if you TRULY love the Broncos and truly think the current coach/player/GM/QB/waterboy is NOT good for your favorite team, than "cutting your tail off in hopes of growing back a better one" could (in some people's eyes) be something they are willing to sacrifice. Much like those that believe the season is "worth sacrificing" if it makes us better.

They are fans. They may want different things than you do, but they still (in their hearts) are wanting the BEST for the Broncos. Thats a fan.

[Northman]

Thats your right, and I understand what you are saying. But you can't say they aren't fans IF they are TRULY wanting the best for their team in the long run. If they truly believe in their heart, that the team would be better off without Shanahan (or whomever) and knows the only way the team would get rid of them is to lose, then aren't you basically rooting for your favorite team to improve??

Don't we accept (well, some of us do, not all of us) that in order for us to get better, we have to get worse (go through some learning patches) first? Isn't that the mantra around here lately? "Yeah, we may go 3-13, but our team is making strides towards being a better 'team' "... or whatever?

If thats true, than if you TRULY love the Broncos and truly think the current coach/player/GM/QB/waterboy is NOT good for your favorite team, than "cutting your tail off in hopes of growing back a better one" could (in some people's eyes) be something they are willing to sacrifice. Much like those that believe the season is "worth sacrificing" if it makes us better.

They are fans. They may want different things than you do, but they still (in their hearts) are wanting the BEST for the Broncos. Thats a fan.

Sounds like silly reasons to want your team to lose Rav. However, if thats the case with some people on here and you have already thrown in the towel than why not just leave the board and come back after the coach has been removed? Why subject everyone else on the board to your negativity (not you personally) and smart ass remarks? If people on here just want the team to win no matter who is at the helm shouldnt they at least be able to do it without having to deal with people who are only rooting for the team to lose?

If i really hated a coach or player that much and didnt want to root for the team i would just leave and come back after my team got someone different. Sounds like people just want to stir up shit for the sake of stirring it up. I cant say they dont have a right to feel that way but i dont understand the logic of an individual wasting his time on a board when all he is doing is essenitally trolling at that point. Most people want to see the good in what the team can do and give them support no matter what. The last thing they want to see is a bunch of fans who are rooting against their team. You cant say its voicing displeasure because everything that has been said has already been said. Those individuals are not bringing anything new to the table with concerns so why bother with the constant bashing? I say, if you want the team to lose and only will root for them when they get a different coach then just leave the board and come back when you feel the time is right. Let the people who want to stand by the team root for them in peace.

I know for me i will never root for my team to lose no matter if i dont like a certain player or coach. Its just not logical. If McDaniels fails as a head coach he fails, there are greater tragedies in the world but i will give him my support because he is my teams coach right now. Even if i like certain players who were here they are no longer Broncos and i will only concentrate on those who are still here. To hold grudges on situations that no one will really understand except for the individuals involved is only for the drama queens who cant move on. Harsh i know, but the sillyness has got to stop. Cutler is gone, whoever is at fault no longer matters. Im getting ready as a fan to root for my team and coach this coming Sunday. For those who dont want to root for them, go Sunday shopping with your wives or girlfriends or something.

[TXBRONC]

Then I guess no one can really base Tom B's performance after last night because as you put it,it was a lame game and very boring to watch and you didn't even watch it.

Haven't you not been one of those who have down played Orton's struggles because it's was only the preseason?

[Tned]

I could never and would never root for the Broncos to lose, even if somehow I thought it was in their best interest. Even if I thought the coach was horrible for the Broncos, or the QB the worst in the league, I would not root against the Broncos.

The only possible exception I could see to this would be something like a week 17 game, where the Broncos have won 2 games and losing would give them the first overall pick, and winning might give them the fifth pick, or something like that. In that rare circumstance, I might think "man, I hope they lose and get the number 1 pick". Short of that, I will root for them to win, and if the coach really is that bad (not my opinion, but in fact) than the wins, losses and Bowlen's decision will take care of itself.

[frauschieze]

I never wish for the Broncos to lose for draft position. A win is way better than a spot or five in the draft.

[Northman]

I never wish for the Broncos to lose for draft position. A win is way better than a spot or five in the draft.

Reminds me a lot of 2 years ago. I saw individuals on the Mane rooting for Denver to lose against Minny. I was ESTATIC when we beat them just because i dont see the logic in wanting your team to lose ever even if it means a higher draft pick. Winning is winning.

[frauschieze]

Reminds me a lot of 2 years ago. I saw individuals on the Mane rooting for Denver to lose against Minny. I was ESTATIC when we beat them just because i dont see the logic in wanting your team to lose ever even if it means a higher draft pick. Winning is winning.

That was exactly the situation I was thinking of. I was overjoyed to end the season on a high note. A loss in Minnesota would have made the offseason that much worse.

Maybe I'm just an orange colored glasses wearer. But I love my team always and I always want them to succeed. I can't get behind supporting them losing even if I think it'll be best in the long run.

[Tempus Fugit]

Reminds me a lot of 2 years ago. I saw individuals on the Mane rooting for Denver to lose against Minny. I was ESTATIC when we beat them just because i dont see the logic in wanting your team to lose ever even if it means a higher draft pick. Winning is winning.

If the #1 pick will be Peyton Manning or Tom Brady, and the #2 pick will be David Carr or Joey Harrington, hope your team loses.

[Tned]

I never wish for the Broncos to lose for draft position. A win is way better than a spot or five in the draft.

That's why I said it would have to be a rare circumstance, like where the one win in week 17 would have to make the difference between number 1 overall and number 5.

When it comes to a loss in general, like two years ago, I was hoping for the Broncos to win, even though I think there was talk of a loss being worth 5 spots in the middle of the first round.

However, when you are talking a chance at the number one overall pick, that's a big thing.

Now, this is hypothetical, because in the 24 years I have been following the Broncos, they have never been in that situation (a loss means they get the number one overall pick), but I could certainly see myself rooting for the pick if that situation ever arose.

I recently started the poll would you rather have a 7-9 season or the number one overall pick, and voted 7-9 and talked about how I cherish every Broncos win, but I can see that one scenario, where I would change my position.

[Northman]

If the #1 pick will be Peyton Manning or Tom Brady, and the #2 pick will be David Carr or Joey Harrington, hope your team loses.

Considering the draft is a crap shoot anyway ill go with the winning part. :D

[pnbronco]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, I was only watching a choppy feed last night and was trying to entertain and cook at the same time, but wasn't our starting O-line in all first half? Royal didn't play that long, but Buckhalter did. Graham was in. And from what I could tell of Arizona's D, their starters were in for over the first quarter.

Or was my choppy feed just obscuring numbers so bad that I was delusional?

Sorry I'm late I was working yesterday. Anyway the first O-line was only in for the 1st set of downs. Then the back ups were in for the rest of the game. The reason I know this is I thought oh I forgot to look to see if Kuper was better and when I looked on the 2nd set of downs I discovered than none of the 1st were out there? That actually made me excited that they did so well because at that point AZ had still had their firsts in.

I could never root for my team to loose. It just goes against everything that I believe in. Last season people were talking about how the Avs should try to loose games to move up to the 2nd or 1st pick. I argued you can not play to loose it go against everything your are taught to do.

Everyone knows that I will always be a Jake fan, I just like the guy he was really good to me in so many different ways. So when Cutler went in I was not happy for personal reasons, but I still rooted for the team to win.

BTW I have to be honest, being told that I have sunshine blowing out my behind more than once did hurt my feeling so I backed off for a few. After thinking about it I decided that there are too many posters that I really enjoy so I got over it and learned to use the ignore button.

[Ravage!!!]

Sounds like silly reasons to want your team to lose Rav. However, if thats the case with some people on here and you have already thrown in the towel than why not just leave the board and come back after the coach has been removed? Why subject everyone else on the board to your negativity (not you personally) and smart ass remarks? If people on here just want the team to win no matter who is at the helm shouldnt they at least be able to do it without having to deal with people who are only rooting for the team to lose?

I could point you in some directions, if you would like to ask them ;)


If i really hated a coach or player that much and didnt want to root for the team i would just leave and come back after my team got someone different. Sounds like people just want to stir up shit for the sake of stirring it up.
Although I 'kinda' understand what you are saying, I feel that I disagree. Fanhood does NOT mean simply saying something rosy about the team. Nor does it mean feeling positive about the team, the players, or the coach all the time. As I'm sure you've seen the debate on 'booing'.... fans have a right to boo and express displeasure if they do not like/enjoy the product that is put on the field. Same can be said for not wanting a coach on the team. If you, as a fan, truly disliked that coach.... that doesn't take away from your PASSION for the team... it only means your passion for the team is tainted because you dislike the coach, the QB... or whatevers. If you, as a passionate fan, wanted the BEST for the team and the ONLY way for you to get a product on the field that YOU feel is better is to lose that particular person... then I only think its human nature for a person to wish for/hope for the circumstances that would result in that happening.


I cant say they dont have a right to feel that way but i dont understand the logic of an individual wasting his time on a board when all he is doing is essenitally trolling at that point.
Again.. you are saying that if a person doesn't have positive things to say, they are a Troll. To me, thats not true. It means they are a disgruntled fan, and fans have a right NOT to be happy with the team and/or the direction its going. If they, as passionate fans, want to express every bad 'Daft' pick that has been made, thats not trolling. Thats simply using their right to express their opinion on the same medium as others expressing theirs.


Most people want to see the good in what the team can do and give them support no matter what. The last thing they want to see is a bunch of fans who are rooting against their team. You cant say its voicing displeasure because everything that has been said has already been said. Those individuals are not bringing anything new to the table with concerns so why bother with the constant bashing? I say, if you want the team to lose and only will root for them when they get a different coach then just leave the board and come back when you feel the time is right. Let the people who want to stand by the team root for them in peace.

well.. for some reason you have the discussion based purely on this message board. Initionally I wasn't just talking about posters, I'm talking about FANS in general. Whether they be posters here, or fans sitting in the seats buying season tickets. Yes.. people buying season tickets have a right not to be happy with something, and they have a right to express that displeasure. If you, as a fan, don't want to see people putting down YOUR team..... then most likely you'll have to hide from any sports talk show, only read certain "rosy" writers, and generally hide from anything outside of the orange-n-blue world.

You have said that they can't add any more. Really??? You don't think that there is still another 17 weeks of things to criticize? Of course there is. There are going to be a TON of losses this year. One could say the same thing about the positive comments on the team/coach/gm/QB. What else could be said that hasn't already been said? If we stop with all those comments (both positive and negative), the board would be dead.

I know you understand what I'm saying... but lets say there is a player you absolutely hate. I don't know how you personally feel about Vick.. but I know there are a lot of people on this board that absolutely hate him. So lets say you were one that absolutely HATED this man and everything about him. That being said, can you say you would honestly root for him to win if he was starting for us? Would you ever admire/cheer/gloat on his great plays? You might (you might feel you would simply because he was wearing our orange), but I'm betting deep down you would wish him to fail, simply to see him gone (obviously all assumptions based on a ficticious example on how you feel).

[dogfish]

I never wish for the Broncos to lose for draft position. A win is way better than a spot or five in the draft.


Reminds me a lot of 2 years ago. I saw individuals on the Mane rooting for Denver to lose against Minny. I was ESTATIC when we beat them just because i dont see the logic in wanting your team to lose ever even if it means a higher draft pick. Winning is winning.

yea, thank GOD we won that game against minnesota! if we'd lost we might well been able to get patrick willis instead of jarvis moss. . . . but the warm fuzzy glow from that victory is still with me, while willis would long since have moved on. . . .

[Lonestar]

I know that few follow my thought process but I will try .. While losing a game is bad and I think today would never want a team to throw one.. but losing a game is not the end of the world..

while it would make for a lousy off season (see last season) we survived it although it was indeed rough and there seems to be a lot of division amongst the fans on the direction we should have taken..

I think we will be better long term in losing those games.. the team needed a change and what a change it has been..

even if Josh is not the answer I have not doubt that 5 years from now we will be improved over the malaise we were in the past 2-3 years..


that said I do not think I would ever want less than a #5 pick in the draft as the money up front is not worth the potential failure...

I suspect this is something that will be addressed in the new CBA when it is being worked on.. I can not fathom the veterans are happy with rookies making much more than established Veterans are making.. and since the veterans out number rookies by a 4 or 5 to 1 number it should be a no brainer..

[Northman]

Again.. you are saying that if a person doesn't have positive things to say, they are a Troll. To me, thats not true.

Not true actually. I have seen a couple of individuals (yourself, Tned as examples) who although have a more pessimistic attitude you both at least explain your stances and actually try to have a discussion. However, there are quite a few on your side of the fence that do nothing but troll. Thankfully, some of those are so inadequate at getting anything right that they get banned anyway so part of the solution is already there.


If you, as a fan, don't want to see people putting down YOUR team..... then most likely you'll have to hide from any sports talk show, only read certain "rosy" writers, and generally hide from anything outside of the orange-n-blue world.

Great post and yes, i only take in so much sports talk right now. I guess thankfully because i live out of state i dont have to get bombarded with incessant Bronco bashing. However, in most cases the sports talk idiots talk out their ass anyway so ive never been one to listen to it 24-7. Writers in general have nothing better to do and generally have a slant or agenda regardless.


I know you understand what I'm saying... but lets say there is a player you absolutely hate. I don't know how you personally feel about Vick.. but I know there are a lot of people on this board that absolutely hate him. So lets say you were one that absolutely HATED this man and everything about him. That being said, can you say you would honestly root for him to win if he was starting for us? Would you ever admire/cheer/gloat on his great plays? You might (you might feel you would simply because he was wearing our orange), but I'm betting deep down you would wish him to fail, simply to see him gone (obviously all assumptions based on a ficticious example on how you feel).

You actually answered this for me. If Vick had become a Bronco i definitely would deep down root for him to fail just like i will while he is in philly. However, if we were winning i would be happy but i wouldnt spend a lot of time gloating that he is the greatest player/person alive. If i feel you are a bad person/player im going to continue that trend until i feel differently. As crappy as Romo was as person he was a great linebacker and i could appreciate his talent there. But he was never one of my favorite players and i never gave him as much credit as i gave a lot of the players. If Vick was a Bronco i would be happy with the winning but i wouldnt worry about bashing the guy 24-7 on a message board in the stands. I would keep my hatred to myself regarding him and concentrate on everything else going on with the team. If that makes any sense to you.

[Northman]

yea, thank GOD we won that game against minnesota! if we'd lost we might well been able to get patrick willis instead of jarvis moss. . . . but the warm fuzzy glow from that victory is still with me, while willis would long since have moved on. . . .


If Denver had wanted Willis bad enough we would of had him. One thing that Shanny could do during the draft was move up and down the board. It was his picks that were question marks. Unless you have some link that proves that we were going to draft him i say BS. ;)

[Northman]

I know that few follow my thought process but I will try .. While losing a game is bad and I think today would never want a team to throw one.. but losing a game is not the end of the world..

while it would make for a lousy off season (see last season) we survived it although it was indeed rough and there seems to be a lot of division amongst the fans on the direction we should have taken..

I think we will be better long term in losing those games.. the team needed a change and what a change it has been..

even if Josh is not the answer I have not doubt that 5 years from now we will be improved over the malaise we were in the past 2-3 years..


that said I do not think I would ever want less than a #5 pick in the draft as the money up front is not worth the potential failure...

I suspect this is something that will be addressed in the new CBA when it is being worked on.. I can not fathom the veterans are happy with rookies making much more than established Veterans are making.. and since the veterans out number rookies by a 4 or 5 to 1 number it should be a no brainer..

Ive never had a problem with losing. Getting beat is getting beat. But i remember while playing Minny when the Vikings started to make their comeback in the second half people were actually cheering the Vikings on. Thats where my problem is.

[Lonestar]

Ive never had a problem with losing. Getting beat is getting beat. But i remember while playing Minny when the Vikings started to make their comeback in the second half people were actually cheering the Vikings on. Thats where my problem is.



again I was ambivalent about that game I really thought we would get crushed.. and if we would have lost it would not have broken my heart.. and frankly getting a number 7-8 pick IIRC would not have broken my heart..

I was tired of getting our ass kicked from time to time and losing trap games because were were not mentally ready or prepared correctly..

so I'm glad we had a change from above..

[dogfish]

If Denver had wanted Willis bad enough we would of had him. One thing that Shanny could do during the draft was move up and down the board. It was his picks that were question marks. Unless you have some link that proves that we were going to draft him i say BS. ;)

there was an article in the post after the draft that said we'd tried hard to try to get up to #10 to take him, but houston wanted akoye and was afraid he'd be gone by the they time they got on the board if they dropped all the way back to #21. . . .

[LRtagger]

Ive never had a problem with losing. Getting beat is getting beat. But i remember while playing Minny when the Vikings started to make their comeback in the second half people were actually cheering the Vikings on. Thats where my problem is.

Last year there were some posters hoping we would lose so we could draft Curry...

well, we lost and look where we ended up. Ironically the fan(s) that wanted us to lose so we could draft Curry are pessimistic about how this offseason has gone. Funny how that works.

[Lonestar]

Last year there were some posters hoping we would lose so we could draft Curry...

well, we lost and look where we ended up. Ironically the fan(s) that wanted us to lose so we could draft Curry are pessimistic about how this offseason has gone. Funny how that works.



a doom and gloomer is a doom and gloomer.. is a doom and gloomer..is a doom and gloomer..is a doom and gloomer..is a doom and gloomer

[Ravage!!!]

again I was ambivalent about that game I really thought we would get crushed.. and if we would have lost it would not have broken my heart.. and frankly getting a number 7-8 pick IIRC would not have broken my heart..

I was tired of getting our ass kicked from time to time and losing trap games because were were not mentally ready or prepared correctly..

so I'm glad we had a change from above..

I personally don't think there is such things as "trap games" in the NFL. Every team can beat any team, on any given sunday in this league.

Thats why we've only seen ONE undefeated team in the history of the game. Somewhere along the way, some team that wasn't considered as good beat a team that was supposed to be better. Happens every year to every team.

[Lonestar]

Rav your correct about on any given day anyone can win.

But even you have to admit it happened to denver more than it did the other way around.

Not sure how members on BC posted, but on here almost every trap game predicted by our members was indeed lost.

We also got our asses handed to us more than we should have the past few years. IMHO.

That means either we were ill prepared mentally or phyiscally for those games. In either case that falls squarely on the H/C shoulders.
Also while I don't follow the betting line all that close I seem to remember seeing/hearing about DEN not covering the spread most of the time. While this is not proof it makes one think trap games do indeed exisit.

[Ravage!!!]

Jr.. thats because you didn't count the 'trap games' that people predicted we would lose and didn't. EVERy week people would predict that we would lose to a lesser team, calling it a 'trap game'... and if/when we won, no one thought about it. But when a team loses, it's exaggerated to the degree, and its "I told you so's" and those that predicted the 'trap game loss" come out of the woodwork (even though they predicted every other 'trap game' to lose).

As far as covering the line... I honestly haveNO idea what that has to do with anything.

[Ravage!!!]

So I ask.... when we lose to cincinatti... is that a trap game? does it count? are they a weaker team? Is anyone in the NFL considered a weaker team this year?

I think the proof that every season no team goes undefeated... proves that every team h as these supposed "trap games".. and every team succumbs to them.

[Nomad]

There will be no 'trap' games this year because we'll always be the underdog!!

[TXBRONC]

Jr.. thats because you didn't count the 'trap games' that people predicted we would lose and didn't. EVERy week people would predict that we would lose to a lesser team, calling it a 'trap game'... and if/when we won, no one thought about it. But when a team loses, it's exaggerated to the degree, and its "I told you so's" and those that predicted the 'trap game loss" come out of the woodwork (even though they predicted every other 'trap game' to lose).

As far as covering the line... I honestly haveNO idea what that has to do with anything.

Over the last few years when Denver has beaten teams that they were not predicted to beat it was always sloughed off as a "lucky" win. There have been some people in the past even when Denver would win a "trap" game would find something to piss and moan about. I suspect that same standards will no longer apply.

[LRtagger]

Over the last few years when Denver has beaten teams that they were not predicted to beat it was always sloughed off as a "lucky" win. There have been some people in the past even when Denver would win a "trap" game would find something to piss and moan about. I suspect that same standards will no longer apply.

We could go 12-4 and people would still piss and moan.

[TXBRONC]

We could go 12-4 and people would still piss and moan.

The vast majority fans would be elated to see Denver go 12-4.

[Tned]

The vast majority fans would be elated to see Denver go 12-4.

There were a lot that weren't happy last time we went 13-3.

[TXBRONC]

There were a lot that weren't happy last time we went 13-3.

Yeah I remember that there were some that were unhappy, but I think we would more people would be happy with Denver having a winning record than there would be of people who would be unhappy.

[T.K.O.]

Yeah I remember that there were some that were unhappy, but I think we would more people would be happy with Denver having a winning record than there would be of people who would be unhappy.

huh?
i would be happy if denver has a winning record,i would be ecstatic if they had a winning record at the end of the season !

:salute:

[LRtagger]

Yeah I remember that there were some that were unhappy, but I think we would more people would be happy with Denver having a winning record than there would be of people who would be unhappy.

Obviously that is true, but it is still amazing that we have fans that get pissed even when the team wins (in the past and I am willing to bet in the future, too).

ESPECIALLY now...there are fans here who do not want to see McDaniels win out of pure spite even if it means watching the Broncos lose. I would imagine those people would be pissed if we won this year.

[MOtorboat]

How in the world are you a fan of the team if you are unhappy when they are winning? That's just moronic.

[Tned]

How in the world are you a fan of the team if you are unhappy when they are winning? That's just moronic.

I'm sure you saw people complaining and mad in 2005, because the Broncos were 'winning with smoke and mirrors'. They will be a lot less happy if we have a three or five win season, and they will miss the glory years of the 13 win seasons, 'smoke and mirrors' and AFCCG blowouts.

[MOtorboat]

I'm sure you saw people complaining and mad in 2005, because the Broncos were 'winning with smoke and mirrors'. They will be a lot less happy if we have a three or five win season, and they will miss the glory years of the 13 win seasons, 'smoke and mirrors' and AFCCG blowouts.

The team is what it is, we can't change it. And complaining about success is just moronic.

Plummer took us to the playoffs 3 times. Cutler took us to the playoffs 0 times, yet people really would rather have the Cutler years rather than the Plummer years, just so they can be "right"...it's seriously amazing.

[Northman]

The vast majority fans would be elated to see Denver go 12-4.

True. And my god it would get a whole lot quietter from some individuals on here as well. :lol:

[NameUsedBefore]

I'd be elated to go 12-4. I'd also be elated to be awarded a Ferrari. I try to keep things as realistic as possible in both scenarios, although I really want a free Ferrari so hit me up if we can hash that out.

[Tned]

The team is what it is, we can't change it. And complaining about success is just moronic.

Plummer took us to the playoffs 3 times. Cutler took us to the playoffs 0 times, yet people really would rather have the Cutler years rather than the Plummer years, just so they can be "right"...it's seriously amazing.

See, we can agree on something. Agreed, 100%.

[T.K.O.]

one playoff win.....just ONE ! and i would feel great about where we are headed.
remember its always darkest just before the dawn !!!!!:salute: