Preseason Week 2 QB statistics.

[LoyalSoldier]

I will edit this later with Simm's and Brad's stats when the game is finished. Right now I have Orton's compiled. Orton's stats look much better this week.

Last week's stats can be found here

http://www.broncosforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=710540&postcount=1

Legend



Comp/At <- Completed Passes/Attempts
Comp % <- Percent of passes completed
Yards <- Total Yards
TD/Int <- Touchdowns to Interceptions
Rating <- Passer rating
Neg <- Number of Negative gains


Avg/C <- Average yards per completion
Std/C <- Standard deviation for completion(Consistency)
Avg/A <- Average yardage per attempt
Std/A <- Standard Deviation for attempts(Consistency)
Kyle Orton



Comp/At = 18/26
Comp % = 69.2%
Yards = 182
TD/Int = 1/1
Rating = 104.2
Neg = 0

Avg/C = 10.1 Yards
Std/C = +/- 5.94
Avg/A = 7.0 Yards
Std/A = +/- 6.83

Chris Simms



Comp/At = 5/7
Comp % = 71.4%
Yards = 44
TD/Int = 0/0
Rating = 87.8
Neg = 0

Avg/C = 8.8 Yards
Std/C = +/- 2.8
Avg/A = 6.3 Yards
Std/A = +/- 4.9
Tom Brandaster



Comp/At = 2/4
Comp % = 50.0%
Yards = 1
TD/Int = 0/0
Rating = 56.3
Neg = 1

Avg/C = 0.5 Yards
Std/C = +/- 4.9
Avg/A = 0.25 Yards
Std/A = +/- 2.9

[LRtagger]

Oh God when I saw that top table labelled as "Legend" I thought I was going to be looking at Jay Cutler's stats

[Superchop 7]

"Did I ever tell you that I was struck by lightning 7 times"

Kyle Orton

[Watchthemiddle]

Get better from week to week. He did that.

[LoyalSoldier]

Updated the stats to include Simms

[Northman]

I dont think SImms threw 70 passes.

[LoyalSoldier]

I dont think SImms threw 70 passes.

That zero is a stowaway :lol:

[Foochacho]

I know it kind of pointless but I am just curious. What would Ortons rate be had Gaffney caught that TD. Meaning 0 INT's, 2 TD's, and one more completion. Just wondering.

[LRtagger]

like 130ish

[Krugan]

Get better from week to week. He did that.

Thats being very kind of you. The left hand duck, should be enough to knock him back to equal to last weeks mess.

:)

[Lonestar]

Thats being very kind of you. The left hand duck, should be enough to knock him back to equal to last weeks mess.

:)



just a tad harsh my friend.. huge difference in making one desperate 4th down and no where to go throw and 3 picks..

atleast that is how I see it..

[LoyalSoldier]

I would say other than the left handed pick (I still couldn't believe he did that) he had a respectable game.

[Dean]

I would say other than the left handed pick (I still couldn't believe he did that) he had a respectable game.

Yes, he did. With the defense we have and the schedule we are to play, the Broncos need more than a respectable game if we are to win as McKid has alluded to.

[Ravage!!!]

I still see that first TD pass as lucky considering he threw the one right before that directly into the defender's hands.

[Krugan]

just a tad harsh my friend.. huge difference in making one desperate 4th down and no where to go throw and 3 picks..

atleast that is how I see it..

Well unless your Jake Plummer, then the world would have ended.

And no, its worse that he threw that left handed pick. Had he just put it out the back of the end zone, Seattle starts at the 2, not the 20. Huge difference in teh plays that called from each position.

So, in all reality its just as evil, its week 2, not week 1 anymore. I can look past first game issues, not the same kind of stupid in game 2, and look for nothing that silly in game 3.

[broncohead]

Well unless your Jake Plummer, then the world would have ended.

And no, its worse that he threw that left handed pick. Had he just put it out the back of the end zone, Seattle starts at the 2, not the 20. Huge difference in teh plays that called from each position.

So, in all reality its just as evil, its week 2, not week 1 anymore. I can look past first game issues, not the same kind of stupid in game 2, and look for nothing that silly in game 3.

Ya after 2 games with a new system we should expect perfection...

[Ravage!!!]

Complaining about missing on an out route, or throwing the ball to high/low is 'expecting perfection.' Simply expecting a 5th year QB to know better than not to throw a left handed pass from the two... is expecting a professional QB.

[broncohead]

Complaining about missing on an out route, or throwing the ball to high/low is 'expecting perfection.' Simply expecting a 5th year QB to know better than not to throw a left handed pass from the two... is expecting a professional QB.

New team, coaches, system, reads, routes, and other factors into it. I'm sure he knew after he made the pass he shouldn't have. He won't do it again. Thankfully it's preseason and the games don't count for anything.

[Ravage!!!]

New team, coaches, system, reads, routes, and other factors into it. I'm sure he knew after he made the pass he shouldn't have. He won't do it again. Thankfully it's preseason and the games don't count for anything.

I'm not saying I think he would do it again. I'm quite sure he wouldn't even if it wasn't intercepted. But all the other things you listed just don't have anything to do with that "decision." Not at all. THats a direct reaction to pressure.

Again. I'm truly not judging Orton on this one play. But I'm also confident that a new system has nothing to do with choosing to NOT take a sack and throw a left handed hook into the endzone.

[Lonestar]

Well unless your Jake Plummer, then the world would have ended.

And no, its worse that he threw that left handed pick. Had he just put it out the back of the end zone, Seattle starts at the 2, not the 20. Huge difference in teh plays that called from each position.

So, in all reality its just as evil, its week 2, not week 1 anymore. I can look past first game issues, not the same kind of stupid in game 2, and look for nothing that silly in game 3.

your entitled to your thoughts, I just think they are tad harsh for a new guy playing with in some cases other new guys in others players new to him but old to fans and expecting the team to run like a grandfathers clock..

most fan on here subscribed to the theory it take a bout three years to learn a system.. so far it is two week and some mini camps.. we just might be expecting to much..

well I guess I'll wait to see what happens this year before becoming chicken little..

[Dean]

I don't mean to put words in Ravage's mouth. I read him saying that it is not a scheme issue. There is no offensive scheme that has a right handed QB throwing a left hand hook pass any where or any time. Trust me on this.:D

[TXBRONC]

I don't mean to put words in Ravage's mouth. I read him saying that it is not a scheme issue. There is no offensive scheme that has a right handed QB throwing a left hand hook pass any where or any time. Trust me on this.:D

That's what I've been saying as well.

[Lonestar]

I don't mean to put words in Ravage's mouth. I read him saying that it is not a scheme issue. There is no offensive scheme that has a right handed QB throwing a left hand hook pass any where or any time. Trust me on this.:D


your correct Coach as usual but I suspect in your days on the field the QB's made mistakes from time to time.. and you probably did not roast them for it in a meaningless game as long as they did not repeat it or am I wrong here..

[Krugan]

Ya after 2 games with a new system we should expect perfection...

I dont expect perfection, but I do expect a certain amount of function.

Any QB can have a decent completion percentage when the majority of the plays are 5 yard outs, short slants, screen...

I see nothing but average, its all over this.

Of course im stating my opinion, which you are entitled to disagree with, but at least come up with something more expecting perfection.

I expect a team that looks like its improving week to week, at least in the some of the little things.

You know like not blowing 3 time outs due to being lost, or left handed passes, or having the first string utterly suck it up against backups in the 3rd quarter. Small things you know

[MOtorboat]

I dont expect perfection, but I do expect a certain amount of function.

I didn't watch the game, and I don't take much stock in preseason football, but he had a rating over 100...I think he functioned just fine...except for one pass...misguided as it may have been.

Let's try to grasp a little reality...

[Krugan]

your entitled to your thoughts, I just think they are tad harsh for a new guy playing with in some cases other new guys in others players new to him but old to fans and expecting the team to run like a grandfathers clock..

most fan on here subscribed to the theory it take a bout three years to learn a system.. so far it is two week and some mini camps.. we just might be expecting to much..

well I guess I'll wait to see what happens this year before becoming chicken little..

No chicken little here.

Why do most posters have to toss in a jab at the ends of posts?

I never claimed the sky is falling.

Im just speaking my thoughts, the thought that we had a solid O, and were a solid RB away from being much better on the scoring side of things.

I just watched this team look worse this week than last, in pretty much all phases of the game, and cant help but think there are far more issues than are being spoken about.

[Krugan]

I didn't watch the game, and I don't take much stock in preseason football, but he had a rating over 100...I think he functioned just fine...except for one pass...misguided as it may have been.

Let's try to grasp a little reality...

You didnt watch the game.

How many QB's would have that good of a rating dropping 3-9 yard passes all game?

There is a little reality.

[MOtorboat]

I just watched this team look worse this week than last, in pretty much all phases of the game, and cant help but think there are far more issues than are being spoken about.

The sky isn't falling?

[MOtorboat]

You didnt watch the game.

How many QB's would have that good of a rating dropping 3-9 yard passes all game?

There is a little reality.

Get used to the new offense.

It's here to stay.

[Lonestar]

No chicken little here.

Why do most posters have to toss in a jab at the ends of posts?

I never claimed the sky is falling.

Im just speaking my thoughts, the thought that we had a solid O, and were a solid RB away from being much better on the scoring side of things.

I just watched this team look worse this week than last, in pretty much all phases of the game, and cant help but think there are far more issues than are being spoken about.


the chicken little was really pointed in other directions.. not necessarily at you..

I think they looked solid till the starters came out.. in years past they would substitute a player here and there this year it was wholesale changes and there does not to be any consistency in the 2'S..

[Krugan]

Get used to the new offense.

It's here to stay.

Dude, Im not saying it needs to go.

But I dont have to be happy with a polished piece of glass over a diamond either.

If you dont like my posts, please, feel free to ignore them.

[Krugan]

The sky isn't falling?

No its not.

Wow you people jsut cant handle someone speaking something other than sugar and puppies about this team.

[MOtorboat]

Dude, Im not saying it needs to go.

But I dont have to be happy with a polished piece of glass over a diamond either.

If you dont like my posts, please, feel free to ignore them.

That kind of distracts from the idea of reading a message board, doesn't it? You complained about the offense and the quarterback, I pointed out that his rating was over 100, which is above average, and then you pulled out some analogy about a diamond...

Now tell me to think outside the box...


No its not.

Wow you people jsut cant handle someone speaking something other than sugar and puppies about this team.

Reality seems to be a hard thing for you to understand.

[Krugan]

That kind of distracts from the idea of reading a message board, doesn't it? You complained about the offense and the quarterback, I pointed out that his rating was over 100, which is above average, and then you pulled out some analogy about a diamond...

Now tell me to think outside the box...



Reality seems to be a hard thing for you to understand.

My point is, you didnt watch the game, self admitted, you really have nothing more than a number to base your argument on.

I argue that pretty much any QB in this league can put up a 100, if the game plan is 4 wide sets with 5 yard passes. The % for a 5 yard pass is about as high as they can get.

What you seem to be missing is the confusion, happy feet, lack of anything beyond 20 yards, left handed passes. There is a lot more to a game than a statistic.

I have believe the play calling of short passes is more than just the offensive style, due to Orton not grasping the play calling.

Should I give a 33 game starter a pass simply due to a new system? Maybe, but I expect more after the moves made in the last 8 months. Not saying the previous QB would be better, but its the path this team followed, and im not going to just sit back and say "we are rebuilding and I can accept we arent very good."

[Elevation inc]

plain and simple kyle's stupid throw was as bad as three picks....why because it had a very good chance on 4th down to be taken to the house the other way....its 4th down throw it out, pin seattle on the 2 have the D...come to the LOS stacked...hide a blitzer somewhere and press...our chances as anotehr poster mentioned i would rather we have them go 98 yds than 80 with our defense.....

[MOtorboat]

My point is, you didnt watch the game, self admitted, you really have nothing more than a number to base your argument on.

I argue that pretty much any QB in this league can put up a 100, if the game plan is 4 wide sets with 5 yard passes. The % for a 5 yard pass is about as high as they can get.

What you seem to be missing is the confusion, happy feet, lack of anything beyond 20 yards, left handed passes. There is a lot more to a game than a statistic.

I have believe the play calling of short passes is more than just the offensive style, due to Orton not grasping the play calling.

Well, short passes are what you're going to need to get used to. And not because of who the quarterback is.

This is the first two drives of a game last season. Tell me who the quarterback was.

Drive 1:
1-10 pass short right
2-4 pass short left
1-10 pass incomplete short middle
2-10 pass short middle
3-3 pass incomplete short left
(Running into the kicker on 4th down)
1-10 pass short left
1-10 pass incomplete deep left
2-10 pass short right (fumble by receiver)

Drive 2:
1-10 run
2-6 run
1-10 pass short right
1-10 run
2-1 pass incomplete short right
3-1 run
1-10 pass deep right

The offense is going to look dink and dunk and then they'll try to go over the top. It's the preseason and I don't expect McDaniels to call a lot of the deep stuff, and besides that he's trying to perfect the short routes. There won't be a lot of 20-yard crossing patterns in this offense. They just won't be there.


Should I give a 33 game starter a pass simply due to a new system? Maybe, but I expect more after the moves made in the last 8 months. Not saying the previous QB would be better, but its the path this team followed, and im not going to just sit back and say "we are rebuilding and I can accept we arent very good."

It's preseason.

[Foochacho]

My point is, you didnt watch the game, self admitted, you really have nothing more than a number to base your argument on.

I argue that pretty much any QB in this league can put up a 100, if the game plan is 4 wide sets with 5 yard passes. The % for a 5 yard pass is about as high as they can get.



That's funny I thought 182 yards out of 18 passes equals an average of 10 yards per pass not 5. Damn, looks like its back to school for me. I can't even do simple math.:rolleyes:

[MOtorboat]

That's funny I thought 182 yards out of 18 passes equals an average of 10 yards per pass not 5. Damn, looks like its back to school for me. I can't even do simple math.:rolleyes:

I agree with you, and I don't think he quite gets what this offense is going to look like, but it's per attempt, not per completion when they factor QBs yards per...his yard per was 7. His yard per completion was 10, yes...but it's yards per attempts when you see the stat on nfl.com.

[LoyalSoldier]

I think one stat that would be useful is the YAC of the WRs. Because any QB can get an 85 yard pass if they throw for 5 yards and have the receiver run 80. Would give you an idea how far Orton actually throws the ball on average.

[MOtorboat]

I think one stat that would be useful is the YAC of the WRs. Because any QB can get an 85 yard pass if they throw for 5 yards and have the receiver run 80. Would give you an idea how far Orton actually throws the ball on average.

It certainly does, but if he regularly does that, I don't have a problem with it.

There are just going to be a lot of short passes in this offense. That's what it is. Like I noted above, even with Tom Brady, who is a Hall of Fame Quarterback, the offensive scheme was short, short, short, short, over the top, short, short, short, short, short, over the top.

There just isn't a lot of intermediate passing.

[LoyalSoldier]

It certainly does, but if he regularly does that, I don't have a problem with it.

There are just going to be a lot of short passes in this offense. That's what it is. Like I noted above, even with Tom Brady, who is a Hall of Fame Quarterback, the offensive scheme was short, short, short, short, over the top, short, short, short, short, short, over the top.

There just isn't a lot of intermediate passing.

Well that is the thing is you still need to be able to go over the top to keep the defense honest. It doesn't have to be a 50 yard pass, but at the least you need to be able to throw 20 yard passes.

[Krugan]

That's funny I thought 182 yards out of 18 passes equals an average of 10 yards per pass not 5. Damn, looks like its back to school for me. I can't even do simple math.:rolleyes:

Did you happen to look at the yards after catch?

Guessing that might just upset your math a tad.

[Krugan]

I agree with you, and I don't think he quite gets what this offense is going to look like, but it's per attempt, not per completion when they factor QBs yards per...his yard per was 7. His yard per completion was 10, yes...but it's yards per attempts when you see the stat on nfl.com.

No MO, I do get it.

I guess you have a better understanding of how the game went by looking at numbers vs watching the game.

Im not going to argue this with you, I see what I saw, and you read some numbers.

[Foochacho]

Did you happen to look at the yards after catch?

Guessing that might just upset your math a tad.

When I rewatched the game I tried to pay attention to how far he was throwing most of his passes. And most passes were around 9 -14 yards when caught. Sure there were a few quick outs here and there, but when you are 3rd and 2 why would you throw it 10 yards when you only need 2? There were also alot of screen passes, but those are designed plays and you can't rag on Orton for that he's not the OC. So other than the screens he threw mainly mid range passes, not a bunch of short 5er's like everyone seems to think.

Besides all those screen passes there were hardly any Yards after carry. Just alot of solid 9-14 yard tosses. Orton also called alot of audibles that game. Seems to me like he might be able to be more of a general rather that just a game manager. I'm liking what I saw. We might have a solid QB in a few weeks.

You can go ahead and keep being a downer, it must get tiring crying all the time. Maybe you should give yourself a Jay Cutler emo hairdo and start cutting yourself.

[Krugan]

When I rewatched the game I tried to pay attention to how far he was throwing most of his passes. And most passes were around 9 -14 yards when caught. Sure there were a few quick outs here and there, but when you are 3rd and 2 why would you throw it 10 yards when you only need 2? There were also alot of screen passes, but those are designed plays and you can't rag on Orton for that he's not the OC. So other than the screens he threw mainly mid range passes, not a bunch of short 5er's like everyone seems to think.

Besides all those screen passes there were hardly any Yards after carry. Just alot of solid 9-14 yard tosses. Orton also called alot of audibles that game. Seems to me like he might be able to be more of a general rather that just a game manager. I'm liking what I saw. We might have a solid QB in a few weeks.

You can go ahead and keep being a downer, it must get tiring crying all the time. Maybe you should give yourself a Jay Cutler emo hairdo and start cutting yourself.

Im not crying, nor do I need a emo hairdo, but its pretty sad that most people on message boards feel the need to drop an insult to end posts.

Im unhappy with what I see, I see things that just dont give me confidence that this team is headed in the right direction.

Of course I could be wrong, ive never once claimed to be an expert.

But it seems you may be, knowing that im depressed and need a new haircut.(there, does that make me a standard super member, I used a minor insult)

[rcsodak]

Thats being very kind of you. The left hand duck, should be enough to knock him back to equal to last weeks mess.

:)

Now Krug.....

...even Jake had a lefty-pic, so all's not so bad.

It was 4th down and all they lost was field position.

He said he'd been practicing that all off-season, geesh. :D

[rcsodak]

I still see that first TD pass as lucky considering he threw the one right before that directly into the defender's hands.

Then I guess your boi jay was "lucky" that his passes into the hands/breadbaskets of the defenders, last week, were not held, as well?

Because we all know you're not biased in your opine. ;)

[MOtorboat]

Yes, because the worst collapse in divisional NFL history is better than an interception thrown with a left hand from a right-handed quarterback in preseason...

Time for some perspective...

[rcsodak]

I don't mean to put words in Ravage's mouth. I read him saying that it is not a scheme issue. There is no offensive scheme that has a right handed QB throwing a left hand hook pass any where or any time. Trust me on this.:D

Didn't Eli or Favre do it a couple years ago, also?

Question, coach....

What about the qb's that jump up in the air and lob the ball to the receiver?

What about the qb's that shotput the ball? Or throw side-armed?

Isn't it all relative? As long as the ball gets to where it's intended?

If Orton, say, has practiced all his life to throw left handed, when in a pinch? Not saying he has, but just playing devil's advocate. *wink*

He's on a brand new team, with a new system/teammates...ANY qb is liable to get nervous and pull an "oops". No different than starting a new job, people.....shit happens.

[rcsodak]

plain and simple kyle's stupid throw was as bad as three picks....why because it had a very good chance on 4th down to be taken to the house the other way....its 4th down throw it out, pin seattle on the 2 have the D...come to the LOS stacked...hide a blitzer somewhere and press...our chances as anotehr poster mentioned i would rather we have them go 98 yds than 80 with our defense.....

You know how stupid a qb would look, if on 4th down, at the goalline, he throws the ball AWAY? REALLY?

He was hoping for a lucky bounce! A tipped ball!

I imagine he'd get ROASTED if he'd have just thrown it away!

Your thinking, is called 'playing it safe'. Tell me how many games are won by "playing it safe".

Imagine it's coming to the end of the game, and denver needs 6 to win. It's 4th down. Do you really want him to throw the ball away? Last I saw, most teams don't score points with their D's. ;)

I'm not trying to justify his throw, but at least he made an attempt. Granted, it looked like Obama's pitch, but it was still an attempt. :D

[Dean]

Didn't Eli or Favre do it a couple years ago, also?

Question, coach....

What about the qb's that jump up in the air and lob the ball to the receiver?

What about the qb's that shotput the ball? Or throw side-armed?

Isn't it all relative? As long as the ball gets to where it's intended?

QBs grow up learning some terrible habits. Sometimes they revert. It still isn't what the offense calls for and therefore whether it is complete or not it needs to be fixed. . . and I could be wrong here but I don't think the person he intended to catch the ball did.:D


If Orton, say, has practiced all his life to throw left handed, when in a pinch? Not saying he has, but just playing devil's advocate. *wink*

Then would he be giving his team the best chance to win the game? I don't think so but maybe or maybe not.


He's on a brand new team, with a new system/teammates...ANY qb is liable to get nervous and pull an "oops". No different than starting a new job, people.....shit happens.

I guess I see it as intended to switch the ball from right to left and let it go in a nonthrowing motion (it didn't look practiced). If I remember the saying goes like this- to whom much is given much will be expected. It isn't his first rodeo and he is well paid for what he does. I loved Plummer's grit but when he did it I thought it was wrong then as well.

[MOtorboat]

QBs grow up learning some terrible habits. Sometimes they revert. It still isn't what the offense calls for and therefore whether it is complete or not it needs to be fixed. . . and I could be wrong here but I don't think the person he intended to catch the ball did.:D



Then would he be giving his team the best chance to win the game? I don't think so but maybe or maybe not.



I guess I see it as intended to switch the ball from right to left and let it go in a nonthrowing motion (it didn't look practiced). If I remember the saying goes like this- to whom much is given much will be expected. It isn't his first rodeo and he is well paid for what he does. I loved Plummer's grit but when he did it I thought it was wrong then as well.

I loved how Cutler led us to three straight collapses. That was awesome.

But...hey...his mechanics were superb.

[Dean]

I loved how Cutler led us to three straight collapses. That was awesome.

I don't think that awesome is the modifier I would use but if you are telling the story then tell it how you like. ;)


But...hey...his mechanics were superb.

I guess we differ once again. A left handed throw is not a mechanics problem.

[Elevation inc]

You know how stupid a qb would look, if on 4th down, at the goalline, he throws the ball AWAY? REALLY?

actually it was a broken play to begin with you throw that out the back of the endzone before half you look a lot less stupid than throwing a duck with your non throwing arm into 4 defenders that can go for six the other way!!!

He was hoping for a lucky bounce! A tipped ball!

yeah thats it hail mary from the 2 with the left hand right....tons of time on the clock????

I imagine he'd get ROASTED if he'd have just thrown it away!

actually i would have supported it no need to do dumb shit like that before half with a lead and plenty of time on the clock for the otehr team,.... the game could have had a whole different outcome, especially had we got a safety or stopped them and got the ball back.... the percentage favored us in that situation....it doesnt favor a left handed duck throw into 4 defenders.....

Your thinking, is called 'playing it safe'. Tell me how many games are won by "playing it safe".

um actually we had a lead and playing safe would have kept us in the lead with them pinned on there own 2 as a coach you tell your Qb to throw it away...even MCd questioned it and kyle is his boy....end of game different story before half you throw that shit away.....

Imagine it's coming to the end of the game, and denver needs 6 to win. It's 4th down. Do you really want him to throw the ball away? Last I saw, most teams don't score points with their D's. ;)

it wasnt the end of the game it was before the half....lets not play the what if game here...i wouldnt have had a big as issue if it was at the end of the game and he felt the desperation of trying to come from behind shit happens in those situations, but before half time was a poor poor judgement and very sad to see...


I'm not trying to justify his throw, but at least he made an attempt. Granted, it looked like Obama's pitch, but it was still an attempt. :D

it sure sounds like your trying to justify it, the last 2 games have given many people thge right to be worried.....

repsonse to your comment in red, my own thoughts below.....

if cutler did that ya all would crucify him....as far as not wanting him to throw it away on 4th down??? are you kidding me? no i love the fact he threw a left handed interception before halftime with our team in the lead that could have led to a easy six points had the DB stayed on his feet. i love it.....especially after he threw 3 horrible picks the week before. i mean why would we want to enter half time with a lead...who does that right?:lol: he throws it away and saves the play we now pin them on the 2 with a defense that is proving it can get pressure...and they now have to drive 98 yds instead of 80 a lot harder from your own 2.....

that play had nothing to do with new system, new players or any other crazy excuses you all are coming up with.....KYLE ORTON F'ed UP and bad....if he can do that in a pre-season game he certainly has the ability to do it in the reg season...whether he does or not is mute. the fact is the last 2games he has showed horrible decision making......

Why you all feel the need to blame the system or new players is beyond me. I still have some faith in kyle, and i still fully support the direction this team is headed....but kyle has done nothing the last 2 weeks to show he can lead this team to victory if he has to and with injuries to our running backs already and tons of unknowns on defense he needs to be able to show he can make the decision to win a game if need be.

he hasnt shown that, so i have every damn right to crticize his boneheaded mistakes and not make excuses for him the same way you guys tend to knock what cutler did here and tell us not to make excuses for him. It works both ways.

[rcsodak]

repsonse to your comment in red, my own thoughts below.....

if cutler did that ya all would crucify him....as far as not wanting him to throw it away on 4th down??? are you kidding me? no i love the fact he threw a left handed interception before halftime with our team in the lead that could have led to a easy six points had the DB stayed on his feet. i love it.....especially after he threw 3 horrible picks the week before. i mean why would we want to enter half time with a lead...who does that right?:lol: he throws it away and saves the play we now pin them on the 2 with a defense that is proving it can get pressure...and they now have to drive 98 yds instead of 80 a lot harder from your own 2.....

that play had nothing to do with new system, new players or any other crazy excuses you all are coming up with.....KYLE ORTON F'ed UP and bad....if he can do that in a pre-season game he certainly has the ability to do it in the reg season...whether he does or not is mute. the fact is the last 2games he has showed horrible decision making......

Why you all feel the need to blame the system or new players is beyond me. I still have some faith in kyle, and i still fully support the direction this team is headed....but kyle has done nothing the last 2 weeks to show he can lead this team to victory if he has to and with injuries to our running backs already and tons of unknowns on defense he needs to be able to show he can make the decision to win a game if need be.

he hasnt shown that, so i have every damn right to crticize his boneheaded mistakes and not make excuses for him the same way you guys tend to knock what cutler did here and tell us not to make excuses for him. It works both ways.

I'm confused.....

...at first, you say not to "play the what-if game".....

...then...you do just that by saying the int "could have lead to a easy six points".

Umm...it didn't, right?

For some reason, some of you are expecting Orton to have the system down pat, know all the intricacies of his wr's, and have a 120+ qb rating every time out.

Guess what....that doesn't happen in the real world.

Just label those of us that you disagree with, realists.

[Elevation inc]

I'm confused.....

...at first, you say not to "play the what-if game".....

...then...you do just that by saying the int "could have lead to a easy six points".

Umm...it didn't, right?

lol......i didnt play the what if game i played the could have game....different animals.....:lol:

For some reason, some of you are expecting Orton to have the system down pat, know all the intricacies of his wr's, and have a 120+ qb rating every time out.

Guess what....that doesn't happen in the real world.

Just label those of us that you disagree with, realists.

this isnt about wanting orton to have perfect games or 120 rating this is about wanting him to not turn the ball over and cost us points...his int still lead to six points the other way it just happened to be 3 minutes later. i actually blame his 3 ints the previous game on nerves and otehr variables but that left handed duck throw was as poor a decisions as a Qb can make its inexcusable period!!!!


in red......