Decker

[jhns]

I'm not sure what to thunk of his play. He gets open and has the measurables to be a good receiver. He has decent stats this year and leads the team in TDs. He is doing a lot of good stuff on the field.

That said, this kid also makes a ton of mistakes. Dropped passes, QB slides, and tripping over air. He missed the wide open pass last game and we didn't hear from him again.

Is this just a young receiver getting overly excited or is he going to be like this? Is all of the good outweighing the bad? The mistakes make me want to see another receiver brought in this offseason. The TDs make me think that isn't needed. Hopefully these problems go away with more experience.

[DenBronx]

I dont know, let me "thunk" about it.

[NightTerror218]

He is getting better over the season. IMO he has some drops in several games last season and missed some easy ones this season. But lately he has been drastically better.

[Northman]

He will be fine.

[jhns]

I dont know, let me "thunk" about it.

Then you should know?

[hotcarl]

manning stopped looking at him after that play, he needs to be more studious and not jo during the game

[Ravage!!!]

I think he's been fine. Every WR drops passes, but because people were all over his jock last year, people just want to remember his the most. How come we don't see threads about DT and his "fumbles" with no one around him? The slide was a mental error trying to save the clock..dumb, but he was trying to think. The trip was a trip. Happens. Believe it or not, the catches over the shoulder like the one dropped in the game last Sunday, are the hardest to catch. I see WRs all over the league, every Sunday, drop those passes.

He's been good. He's been consistant, and he's been a guy that Manning looks for more and more. I think the fans just continue to look to be something he's not. He's not going to be a Julio Jones type of WR as the #2.

[jhns]

I think he's been fine. Every WR drops passes, but because people were all over his jock last year, people just want to remember his the most. How come we don't see threads about DT and his "fumbles" with no one around him? The slide was a mental error trying to save the clock..dumb, but he was trying to think. The trip was a trip. Happens. Believe it or not, the catches over the shoulder like the one dropped in the game last Sunday, are the hardest to catch. I see WRs all over the league, every Sunday, drop those passes.

He's been good. He's been consistant, and he's been a guy that Manning looks for more and more. I think the fans just continue to look to be something he's not. He's not going to be a Julio Jones type of WR as the #2.

I do have similar questions about DT. He is still learning to be a receiver though. His college experience didn't prepare him for the NFL. I think his drops are a result of still learning the game. He could just have bad hands. We will find out. Decker came in much more prepared and I didn't see this in his college days. He made amazing catch after amazing catch. This is why I'm wondering if he is just getting too excited or something. When the team drafted them, I expected Decker to be better than DT from the start. I expected DT to be the much better long term prospect. Decker was much more polished coming out. This is probably why people are questioning his mistakes more. It is why I do.

He has been good. He has not been consistent.

[Ravage!!!]

I do have similar questions about DT. He is still learning to be a receiver though. His college experience didn't prepare him for the NFL. I think his drops are a result of still learning the game. He could just have bad hands. We will find out. Decker came in much more prepared and I didn't see this in his college days. He made amazing catch after amazing catch. This is why I'm wondering if he is just getting too excited or something. When the team drafted them, I expected Decker to be better than DT from the start. I expected DT to be the much better long term prospect. Decker was much more polished coming out. This is probably why people are questioning his mistakes more. It is why I do.

He has been good. He has not been consistent.

I don't know why you guys would think that a 1st round pick would be less of a player than Decker coming out of college. I guess if that's how you viewed things, then its no wonder why you are stumped.

Decker is just fine. He makes very good catches, goes low and gets the ball, and gets open with nice routes. I dont know what you expect to see. Yes he drops some passes, but believe me, they alllllll do.

I don't know what "consistent" is. Is that meaning he drops only a certain amount per game, or has the same amount of passes to him per game? What is consistent? Meaning he drops a pass one game and not another?? Isn't that the way its supposed to be? If you are saying he drops one a game, isn't that consistent?

I never expected Decker to be something better than DT. DT had a ton of hype and expectations. Decker was always a role-player and 2nd WR type of option. Thats exactly what he is.

[jhns]

I don't know why you guys would think that a 1st round pick would be less of a player than Decker coming out of college. I guess if that's how you viewed things, then its no wonder why you are stumped.

Decker is just fine. He makes very good catches, goes low and gets the ball, and gets open with nice routes. I dont know what you expect to see. Yes he drops some passes, but believe me, they alllllll do.

I don't know what "consistent" is. Is that meaning he drops only a certain amount per game, or has the same amount of passes to him per game? What is consistent? Meaning he drops a pass one game and not another?? Isn't that the way its supposed to be? If you are saying he drops one a game, isn't that consistent?

I never expected Decker to be something better than DT. DT had a ton of hype and expectations. Decker was always a role-player and 2nd WR type of option. Thats exactly what he is.

Draft status doesn't mean much. The same coach drafted Tebow in the first. What are your thoughts on Tebow again?

I honestly don't know how you could think the way you do. Thomas was not a receiver in college. He may have been called one, but he definately wasn't learning anything he needed for the NFL. Look at his stats in college. Watch how his offense played.

Decker was far more polished. Thomas was drafted higher because he has a much higher ceiling.

[Ravage!!!]

Draft status doesn't mean much. The same coach drafted Tebow in the first. What are your thoughts on Tebow again?

I honestly don't know how you could think the way you do. Thomas was not a receiver in college. He may have been called one, but he definately wasn't learning anything he needed for the NFL. Look at his stats in college. Watch how his offense played.

Decker was far more polished. Thomas was drafted higher because he has a much higher ceiling.

Stats. Stats aren't for judging talent. It's why guys like Tebow have great stats and can't play for a lick. But DT wasn't drafted purely on "potential" either. If he wasn't thought to be good enough to be drafted as a 1st round pick, as a WR, in the NFL....then so many people wouldn't have thought of him as a 1st round, WR, pick for the NFL.

So draft position doesn't tell how good a guy will be, but I don't know why you would expect Decker to be better than DT is? Different expectations I suppose. But if you can't see that Decker is still a more polished WR in the NFL than DT is, then I think you are missing something. Decker is still a more "polished" WR than DT is, but DT is the more dynamic talent. Hence why we see what we do. Decker being the guy that is targeted more often, is the underneath guy..the short yardage type of guy..and DT is the down the field WR.

So I think what we see on the field fits with exactly what you've stated that you expected to see. Other than the fact that you feel Decker isn't catching 100% of the balls, I guess.

[Locnar]

For all the mistakes he's had this season I still think he's done more good than bad. When he's not tripping over the ghosts of nfl past he has made some really good runs after catch, and him and Peyton seem to have a knack for playing catch in the end zone.

[LawDog]

Good thing with these horrible receivers Peyton still has managed to lead the NFL in passer rating. He must be some kind of wizard.

[DenBronx]

Yeah our WRs are bums.....lets trade them all for Jabar Gaffney and Randy Moss.

[Jsteve01]

Anyone remember a certain Mr Smith dropping a ton of easy balls early in his career. All the while dazzling you with spectacular catches on the next series. I think it's far to early to write the book on any of these guys.

[Poet]

I think he's been fine. Every WR drops passes, but because people were all over his jock last year, people just want to remember his the most. How come we don't see threads about DT and his "fumbles" with no one around him? The slide was a mental error trying to save the clock..dumb, but he was trying to think. The trip was a trip. Happens. Believe it or not, the catches over the shoulder like the one dropped in the game last Sunday, are the hardest to catch. I see WRs all over the league, every Sunday, drop those passes.

He's been good. He's been consistant, and he's been a guy that Manning looks for more and more. I think the fans just continue to look to be something he's not. He's not going to be a Julio Jones type of WR as the #2.

He can take over a game. I loathe him.

[Chef Zambini]

I don't know why you guys would think that a 1st round pick would be less of a player than Decker coming out of college. I guess if that's how you viewed things, then its no wonder why you are stumped.

Decker is just fine. He makes very good catches, goes low and gets the ball, and gets open with nice routes. I dont know what you expect to see. Yes he drops some passes, but believe me, they alllllll do.

I don't know what "consistent" is. Is that meaning he drops only a certain amount per game, or has the same amount of passes to him per game? What is consistent? Meaning he drops a pass one game and not another?? Isn't that the way its supposed to be? If you are saying he drops one a game, isn't that consistent?

I never expected Decker to be something better than DT. DT had a ton of hype and expectations. Decker was always a role-player and 2nd WR type of option. Thats exactly what he is.you are right "consistent' is ambiguous ! is he RELIABLE?

DT needs to do some dancing, get the croud excited !
maybe he would have more chances to dance if he played safety?
just a thought.
if his football career does not work out he can always be a bullfighter.
OLE~

[jhns]

Stats. Stats aren't for judging talent. It's why guys like Tebow have great stats and can't play for a lick. But DT wasn't drafted purely on "potential" either. If he wasn't thought to be good enough to be drafted as a 1st round pick, as a WR, in the NFL....then so many people wouldn't have thought of him as a 1st round, WR, pick for the NFL.

So draft position doesn't tell how good a guy will be, but I don't know why you would expect Decker to be better than DT is? Different expectations I suppose. But if you can't see that Decker is still a more polished WR in the NFL than DT is, then I think you are missing something. Decker is still a more "polished" WR than DT is, but DT is the more dynamic talent. Hence why we see what we do. Decker being the guy that is targeted more often, is the underneath guy..the short yardage type of guy..and DT is the down the field WR.

So I think what we see on the field fits with exactly what you've stated that you expected to see. Other than the fact that you feel Decker isn't catching 100% of the balls, I guess.

So you agree that Decker came in more polished but argued with that point because...?

Some of you drama queens are way over the top. I said a lot of good things about Decker too. I didn't say we should cut him. The only thing you read is that the receivers suck. Message boards are pretty worthless if you are just looking for a conversation. Drama queens seem to love the web.

[Ravage!!!]

So you agree that Decker came in more polished but argued with that point because...?

Some of you drama queens are way over the top. I said a lot of good things about Decker too. I didn't say we should cut him. The only thing you read is that the receivers suck. Message boards are pretty worthless if you are just looking for a conversation. Drama queens seem to love the web.

No, I'm saying that the very thing you said you "expected to see"... is the exact thing that we already have. You expected Decker to be more polished, and he is. You expected DT to be more of the "future" because of his athletic ability, and thats exactly what we are seeing. YOU said that you expected Decker to be better than DT coming out of college, and I said I did NOT see that at all, and don't know how you came up with that.

So I'm only saying, that unless you expected Decker to simply catch every pass, or, expected him to be a dynamic WR like Julio Jones, then I don't know what you really expected to see from a guy that wasn't taunted as a super star coming into the draft. He's been, to me, exactly as what was expected of him. A possession WR.

Now that someone is simply saying that your expectations of Decker coming out of college seem to be WAYYYY too high, you want to call it drama.

[Ravage!!!]

Good thing with these horrible receivers Peyton still has managed to lead the NFL in passer rating. He must be some kind of wizard.

He is a wizard, and has made a lot of poor WRs look better than they are...thats for sure.

[Chef Zambini]

great place for an arguement and hostility. not a great spot for an open minded dialogue.
sad.
some great posters here.
some knowledgeable football fans, but..
also a handful that act like this place is their own private little tree house and they always want to pants the new kid on the block.
their 'attitude' gets in the way of whatever good football knowledge they do posess.
and even if they agree with you 100% they still want to give you an argument and a snuggie.

[Ravage!!!]

Jhns isn't a new guy. He's been a great poster for years.

[Poet]

Manning can take the average WR and make them look like Pro Bowlers. Pierre Garcon is just a pedestrian WR. The same for Austin Collie, Anthony Gonalzes, etc etc etc. Stokely is as average as they come, but because he's smart and can keep up with Manning's brain, they have wreaked havoc on the league. Manning improves everyone around him.


Wayne, Harrison and Edge were/are all obviously very talented players and good, but Manning helped to improve them. To be fair, they also helped him.

Decker and Thomas are talented and they have both improved.

[BroncoNut]

with that, I will now consider Jhns with skepticism from here on out.

[NightTerror218]

Manning can take the average WR and make them look like Pro Bowlers. Pierre Garcon is just a pedestrian WR. The same for Austin Collie, Anthony Gonalzes, etc etc etc. Stokely is as average as they come, but because he's smart and can keep up with Manning's brain, they have wreaked havoc on the league. Manning improves everyone around him.


Wayne, Harrison and Edge were/are all obviously very talented players and good, but Manning helped to improve them. To be fair, they also helped him.

Decker and Thomas are talented and they have both improved.

One player manning has not improved is Willis. He is running wrong routes or making mistakes. he is a WR that could lose his stop on roster very quickly next season. It prob a reason Stokley is on field so much at the age of 36, he is great with Manning and Willis is not pushing for that #3 spot.

[BroncoNut]

great place for an arguement and hostility. not a great spot for an open minded dialogue.
sad.
some great posters here.
some knowledgeable football fans, but..
also a handful that act like this place is their own private little tree house and they always want to pants the new kid on the block.
their 'attitude' gets in the way of whatever good football knowledge they do posess.
and even if they agree with you 100% they still want to give you an argument and a snuggie.

ZAM, would you say that I have grown into a valuable football poster since my induction into the Freak?

[Ravage!!!]

One player manning has not improved is Willis. He is running wrong routes or making mistakes. he is a WR that could lose his stop on roster very quickly next season. It prob a reason Stokley is on field so much at the age of 36, he is great with Manning and Willis is not pushing for that #3 spot.

Willis.... who?

[NightTerror218]

Willis.... who?

Matt Willis

[BroncoNut]

Willis.... who?

last name willis I think

[NightTerror218]

#12

[Ravage!!!]

last name willis I think

Ahh... ok. So its no wonder I haven't heard of him.

[BroncoNut]

Ahh... ok. So its no wonder I haven't heard of him.

what do you mean?

[Poet]

One player manning has not improved is Willis. He is running wrong routes or making mistakes. he is a WR that could lose his stop on roster very quickly next season. It prob a reason Stokley is on field so much at the age of 36, he is great with Manning and Willis is not pushing for that #3 spot.

I am unaware of who that is.

[Jsteve01]

So you agree that Decker came in more polished but argued with that point because...?

Some of you drama queens are way over the top. I said a lot of good things about Decker too. I didn't say we should cut him. The only thing you read is that the receivers suck. Message boards are pretty worthless if you are just looking for a conversation. Drama queens seem to love the web.

No, I'm saying that the very thing you said you "expected to see"... is the exact thing that we already have. You expected Decker to be more polished, and he is. You expected DT to be more of the "future" because of his athletic ability, and thats exactly what we are seeing. YOU said that you expected Decker to be better than DT coming out of college, and I said I did NOT see that at all, and don't know how you came up with that.

So I'm only saying, that unless you expected Decker to simply catch every pass, or, expected him to be a dynamic WR like Julio Jones, then I don't know what you really expected to see from a guy that wasn't taunted as a super star coming into the draft. He's been, to me, exactly as what was expected of him. A possession WR.

Now that someone is simply saying that your expectations of Decker coming out of college seem to be WAYYYY too high, you want to call it drama.rav what he's saying is simple. There is no one in the world who would have thought dt would be the better receiver early. Decker was the first option in a pro style offense. He was big and had nice tools and in allhonesty had it not been for the scary foot injury would likely have been a late first to mid second round pick. Dt alternatively was a physical freak which came from q triple option offense. Barring health concerns Decker was a likely person to have more impact early. Also the guys handswere glue in college. Not so in the pros. Op opinion is valid.

[Ravage!!!]

last name willis I think


what do you mean?

Imean, you didn't even know if his first or last name was willis, hence, its not exactly a guy that I should really know.


**now I'm exaggerating, of course. Yes, I've heard of Willis. But he's not a guy that I would have thought of that didn't grow under Manning because he was pretty low on the depth chart**

[Ravage!!!]

rav what he's saying is simple. There is no one in the world who would have thought dt would be the better receiver early. Decker was the first option in a pro style offense. He was big and had nice tools and in allhonesty had it not been for the scary foot injury would likely have been a late first to mid second round pick. Dt alternatively was a physical freak which came from q triple option offense. Barring health concerns Decker was a likely person to have more impact early. Also the guys handswere glue in college. Not so in the pros. Op opinion is valid.

All opinions are valid. I"m just saying that I, personally, feel that his expectations of Decker were/are too high. Now I admit that I didn't really think he was ever a 1st round talent to begin with, so I'm judging him on the kind of talent at which he was drafted. Nothing spectacular, but a possession WR. I guess that's what I've always expected from him, and thus, what I've always seen from him. Nothing more.

The difference is the expectations coming in. He had much higher expectations coming into the NFL...being much better than DT early (and don't know how long 'early' is supposed to be...years?) and I didn't. DT may have come from a different offensive system in the NFL, but he wasn't expected to go in the first round if he couldn't run routes at all.

Like I said, some have higher expectations from which I don't know where they come from. If you truly felt that Decker was going to be a better WR than DT, then I can understand why you would be disappointed pretty quickly.

[BroncoNut]

Imean, you didn't even know if his first or last name was willis, hence, its not exactly a guy that I should really know.


**now I'm exaggerating, of course. Yes, I've heard of Willis. But he's not a guy that I would have thought of that didn't grow under Manning because he was pretty low on the depth chart**

well, i was pretty sure there was a last name willis as a receiver, but like you, if I dont' hear much about him, don't think on him too much

[slim]

Decker is way overrated by Bronco fans.

I am not saying he sucks or anything, but he isn't as good as you guys want him to be.

[BroncoNut]

great place for an arguement and hostility. not a great spot for an open minded dialogue.
sad.
some great posters here.
some knowledgeable football fans, but..
also a handful that act like this place is their own private little tree house and they always want to pants the new kid on the block.
their 'attitude' gets in the way of whatever good football knowledge they do posess.
and even if they agree with you 100% they still want to give you an argument and a snuggie.

I was bullied pretty bad when I came on the football forums. but I hung in there and look what I am today? a few nasty scars , but I like what I see in the mirror today

[BroncoNut]

Decker is way overrated by Bronco fans.

I am not saying he sucks or anything, but he isn't as good as you guys want him to be.

I know what you mean. he's tough though, makes some nice catches

[slim]

I know what you mean. he's tough though, makes some nice catches

He is not tough at all. Franklly, they need to give him a different number. We can't have him sliding like a ***** while wearing #87. It is just wrong.

[BroncoNut]

He is not tough at all. Franklly, they need to give him a different number. We can't have him sliding like a ***** while wearing #87. It is just wrong.

I completley disagree with your fatass. the man can take a hit and does possess a toughness

[slim]

I completley disagree with your fatass. the man can take a hit and does possess a toughness

Fine, be that way.

[BroncoNut]

Fine, be that way.

oh, well thank you for allowing me that

[Ravage!!!]

He is not tough at all. Franklly, they need to give him a different number. We can't have him sliding like a ***** while wearing #87. It is just wrong.

I think you are being too hard on Decker. He's not nearly as BAD as some of you think him to be, and judge him on that slide WAyyyyy too much. He was trying to make a "smart" play by getting down and saving the clock. Sometimes, when your head is thinking more than it should, you get jumbled. Happens to all of us, and happens to players on the field all the time. The difference is, it's not always on a play or with a player that is out in the open field like that. Sometimes they step out of bounds when they shouldn't, or not go out of bounds when they should. Crap happens.

[Poet]

What are Decker's stats?

[BroncoNut]

I think you are being too hard on Decker. He's not nearly as BAD as some of you think him to be, and judge him on that slide WAyyyyy too much. He was trying to make a "smart" play by getting down and saving the clock. Sometimes, when your head is thinking more than it should, you get jumbled. Happens to all of us, and happens to players on the field all the time. The difference is, it's not always on a play or with a player that is out in the open field like that. Sometimes they step out of bounds when they shouldn't, or not go out of bounds when they should. Crap happens.

very true. experience will lessen the frequency of that.

[slim]

What are Decker's stats?

Roughly 50 for 600 and 7 TDs.

[slim]

I think you are being too hard on Decker. He's not nearly as BAD as some of you think him to be, and judge him on that slide WAyyyyy too much. He was trying to make a "smart" play by getting down and saving the clock. Sometimes, when your head is thinking more than it should, you get jumbled. Happens to all of us, and happens to players on the field all the time. The difference is, it's not always on a play or with a player that is out in the open field like that. Sometimes they step out of bounds when they shouldn't, or not go out of bounds when they should. Crap happens.

I don't think he is bad at all.

I think he is an average NFL WR. Nothing special, but good enough to be a #2 type WR.

[Ravage!!!]

What are Decker's stats?

6'3"..218lbs..dark hair, dark eyes...engaged :D

[Ravage!!!]

I don't think he is bad at all.

I think he is an average NFL WR. Nothing special, but good enough to be a #2 type WR.

Oh.. well if that's the case, then I think you are right on

[Magnificent Seven]

Alternatively, Peyton Manning's arm is too strong. :D

[Jsteve01]

The thing is I completely agree with rav about the slide. Its been completely overstated. People forget that the kid is a willing blocker and returned kicks for a while. KR are not pussies. My concern is the drops because he didn't drop balls in college.

[Ravage!!!]

The thing is I completely agree with rav about the slide. Its been completely overstated. People forget that the kid is a willing blocker and returned kicks for a while. KR are not pussies. My concern is the drops because he didn't drop balls in college.

yeah.. but the windows are tighter in the NFL. Guys are moving much faster, cuts much more precise, defensive hands swiping closer.... and bigger stages. I just don't find it to be a concern because I don't see his drops as being a "problem" I guess.

[Ravage!!!]

Alternatively, Peyton Manning's arm is too strong. :D

yeah, we need to injury his neck again so that we can weaken him up a bit

[BroncoNut]

I don't think he is bad at all.

I think he is an average NFL WR. Nothing special, but good enough to be a #2 type WR.

I think that is fair. sounded like you hated him Slim.

Plus, how can we at home really critique the wr position? alot of times we only get a piece of their route. nice moves and speed are easily noted, but there's more to route running than that.

[Chef Zambini]

He is not tough at all. Franklly, they need to give him a different number. We can't have him sliding like a ***** while wearing #87. It is just wrong.you make a very valid point! the #87 does come with a set of values and rsponsabiliy !
togh, SMART football.
I think PM has been too focused on decker in a few games and should be looking for other targets ! STOKELY is without question his most reliable target, and the backs, mcgehee and hillman can and should see more balls!

[BroncoNut]

you make a very valid point! the #87 does come with a set of values and rsponsabiliy !
togh, SMART football.
I think PM has been too focused on decker in a few games and should be looking for other targets ! STOKELY is without question his most reliable target, and the backs, mcgehee and hillman can and should see more balls!

maybe you should see more balls because you sure seem agitated here. maybe stokely and company are not open like Decker. but what does PM know?

btw, Do you even have a clue what player wore number 87? If I were a betting man, I would say not

[Ravage!!!]

you make a very valid point! the #87 does come with a set of values and rsponsabiliy !
togh, SMART football.
I think PM has been too focused on decker in a few games and should be looking for other targets ! STOKELY is without question his most reliable target, and the backs, mcgehee and hillman can and should see more balls!

Seems you said the same th ing about Stokely early on. "Manning is focusing in on Stokely, this says a lot about our WRs..." I believe is something you wrote. Now you are saying he's paying too much attention to other WRs. Seems weird, doesn't it? I mean, one of the greatest QBs of all times NOT knowing what WR to throw to and when???

I'm glad you are here to point these out to him....... and not actually anywhere near Manning to try and point these things out to him.

[bcbronc]

I don't think he is bad at all.

I think he is an average NFL WR. Nothing special, but good enough to be a #2 type WR.

I don't disagree at all, but I would add that Decker is developing into a very reliable red zone target. A solid #2 between the 20s, but could become a top tier red zone threat.