Former Broncos Take In Practice

[Denver Native (Carol)]

A trio of former Broncos who starred on the defensive side of the ball attended Thursday afternoon’s training camp practice. Safety Brian Dawkins, who retired this offseason, was joined by a pair of Denver Broncos Ring-of-Fame linebackers in Karl Mecklenburg and Tom Jackson on the sidelines today in Dove Valley.

“Well, I think it’s great,” Head Coach John Fox said. “These guys were great players and have a lot of pride, much like all our fans here in Denver. Bringing back the alumni, they always have good messages for the guys because they did win a couple of championships and had great careers so these young guys have learned from them.”

Mecklenburg, a 12th round selection in the 1983 draft, has taken in the past two days of camp as a voluntary coach, working with the pass-rushers.

rest - http://blog.denverbroncos.com/denverbroncos/former-broncos-take-in-practice/

[Chef Zambini]

after that mays article, I thought JE brought in Meck for a try-out !

[Ravage!!!]

Mays is going to be fine. I've read much more good things about him than I have bad. That "one article" was crap.

Great to see the Old Broncos around. I think they are as excited about this season with Manning as the rest of the fans are. Good to finally be excited for a season to start, once again.

[BroncoWave]

Cool to see Dawk still involved with the Broncos even after retiring as an Eagle.

[Denver Native (Carol)]

I found the following interesting from the article:


Mecklenburg, a force on five division-title winning Broncos teams, said it felt great to be welcomed back to Bronco Country, adding that he hopes to see more former players around Dove Valley during the next few weeks.

http://blog.denverbroncos.com/denver...e-in-practice/

Since ownership is still the same - I would have to believe the reference to "welcomed back", must apply to not being welcome in the past under a previous coach, which I would have to believe was Shanahan, as McD was not here that long.

[Ravage!!!]

I found the following interesting from the article:



http://blog.denverbroncos.com/denver...e-in-practice/

Since ownership is still the same - I would have to believe the reference to "welcomed back", must apply to not being welcome in the past under a previous coach, which I would have to believe was Shanahan, as McD was not here that long.


Hmmm... I figured that just means "welcomed back" by the fans. Meaning its nice to see people glad he was here and welcomed the praise from them.

[Chef Zambini]

dawk now lives in denver so the eagles camp would be a really long commute, even in good traffic.

[Superchop 7]

Pretty sure it means.....welcomed back by the organization.

For some of these guys that may not make the Ring of Fame.....I think there should be a halftime "Orange jacket" presentation at home games so we can give thanks to the guys that paved the way.

[Chef Zambini]

how about some orange cowboy boots?

[Chef Zambini]

bump

[Rick]

Zam, if basing it off of that article, I am not sure that one is really conclusive with saying Shanny didn't let former players come around.

I didn't see anything in that article mention that, the only place I saw it mentioned was speculation by a couple of posters.

[Chef Zambini]

you darn well know that former players were not welcome during the shaNNY RE3GIM. THE ARTICLE QUOTED NO LONGER COMES UP.
BUT WHEN CAROL MAKES THE CONNECTION OF DOTS, YOU DONT SEE gem RIPPING HER A NEW A-HOLE! gem is just hostile ntorwardsme, I am the #1 adversary for her rat pack.
it has been documented from many writyers in denver that former players, especially JFE did not feel welcome at dove valley and shanny did NOTHING to encourage the link between old players and new !
JFE changed the "culture"
if I hadnt said it, gem and her crew would be praising JFE for the change in attitude.

[Rick]

The article does come up Zam, first post.

http://blog.denverbroncos.com/denverbroncos/former-broncos-take-in-practice/

I just don't see it in there man and do not remember it going on, but just my own memory,

[Chef Zambini]

These guys have got a lot of rings and a lot of pride in their team and how they played when their turn was called.

One of the most common themes expressed by every one of these great Broncos is that he feels welcome here.

To a man, they have praised the culture and atmosphere created by owner Pat Bowlen, team President Joe Ellis and Executive Vice President of Football Operations John Elway.

A culture is established from the top. You can only do what the top guys allow you to do. And by feel, touch, sense and any other way of labeling it, this is an atmosphere open to great Broncos over the years. You can feel it everywhere in the building.

[Chef Zambini]

These guys have got a lot of rings and a lot of pride in their team and how they played when their turn was called.

One of the most common themes expressed by every one of these great Broncos is that he feels welcome here.

To a man, they have praised the culture and atmosphere created by owner Pat Bowlen, team President Joe Ellis and Executive Vice President of Football Operations John Elway.

A culture is established from the top. You can only do what the top guys allow you to do. And by feel, touch, sense and any other way of labeling it, this is an atmosphere open to great Broncos over the years. You can feel it everywhere in the building.
http://blog.denverbroncos.com/jsaccomano/bronco-alums-a-welcome-presence/

[Chef Zambini]

shaNNAHAN DID NOT FOSTER an environment that welcomed back formewr players! ALMOST every writewr in the denver community made a point of pointing out how different it was from the shanahan era!
you all know its true !

[MOtorboat]

What are you babbling on about now?

If its that Shanahan didn't allow former players back, nothing you just posted comes anywhere near proving that.

[Rick]

I am not disputing the fact with you Zam that Elway has raised the bar and maybe has gone out of his way to make former players feel welcome, I am just saying I don't see, in either article, any reference that they did not feel welcome because of anything Shanny was doing.

Sorry man, there may be truth to it...I just don't remember it and am not seeing it in either article.

[Chef Zambini]

yes, mo, I made it all up.
I never heard tom jackson ever say anything about how JFE changed the culture and attitude at DV when it came to former players.
NOBODY remembers anything of the sort. I am so dillusional

[MOtorboat]

yes, mo, I made it all up.
I never heard tom jackson ever say anything about how JFE changed the culture and attitude at DV when it came to former players.
NOBODY remembers anything of the sort. I am so dillusional

Then prove it. Copying and pasting an article that doesn't even mention Shanahan doesn't prove your point. It does make you delusional.

[Chef Zambini]

tag your it.

[MOtorboat]

tag your it.

The burden of proof here is on you. I did a couple google searches, wafted through ten pages of the Denver Post archive and can't find anything even remotely talking about this, so the burden of proof is yours.

[Chef Zambini]

Why have we seen so many Broncos alumni like yourself back around the team in recent years?

“(Owner and CEO) Pat Bowlen has done a great job of making us all feel welcome. Of course, when John Elway came in, and (Head Coach John) Fox is really big on that, too. Fox is great as far as keeping that kind of Bronco family together. The whole thing for us has been great. It’s great to be able to come back. I was down on the field with my wife during a couple of the scrimmages. It’s just fun to be included.”
mark schlereth.


"shanahan always made sure the old bronco players felt welcome" -NOBODY.

[Rick]

But Zam, you can say the same thing about McDanials, Phillips and Reeves as well. None of them were mentioned in those articles either.

The only thing it DOES say is how welcome Elway and co are making them feel.

Great, leave it at that, but if you are trying to base that they were unwelcome because Shanny wasn't mentioned, well the other coaches were not mentioned either?

[MOtorboat]

Why have we seen so many Broncos alumni like yourself back around the team in recent years?

“(Owner and CEO) Pat Bowlen has done a great job of making us all feel welcome. Of course, when John Elway came in, and (Head Coach John) Fox is really big on that, too. Fox is great as far as keeping that kind of Bronco family together. The whole thing for us has been great. It’s great to be able to come back. I was down on the field with my wife during a couple of the scrimmages. It’s just fun to be included.”
mark schlereth.


"shanahan always made sure the old bronco players felt welcome" -NOBODY.

Whoa, whoa, whoa. Wait a second?

So you're entire rant about Shanahan here isn't based on anything Shanahan did or did not do?

[MOtorboat]

That is a MASSIVE leap in logic with ZERO proof.

[Pudge]

Zam I like you man, but the caps locks isn't necessary

[MOtorboat]

I've heard a number or former Broncos say things like that directly comparing McDaniels and Elway, but never from Shanahan to Elway.

[GEM]

you darn well know that former players were not welcome during the shaNNY RE3GIM. THE ARTICLE QUOTED NO LONGER COMES UP.
BUT WHEN CAROL MAKES THE CONNECTION OF DOTS, YOU DONT SEE gem RIPPING HER A NEW A-HOLE! gem is just hostile ntorwardsme, I am the #1 adversary for her rat pack.
it has been documented from many writyers in denver that former players, especially JFE did not feel welcome at dove valley and shanny did NOTHING to encourage the link between old players and new !
JFE changed the "culture"
if I hadnt said it, gem and her crew would be praising JFE for the change in attitude.

Carol isn't the one playing the game of laying out an OPINION as fact. That article said NOTHING about Shanny, in fact, it was after the MCDANIEL regime, which there are arcticles stating that he didn't want them around.

JUST BECAUSE YOU WANT IT TO BE FACT BECAUSE YOU ARE ON SOME CRUSADE AGAINST SHANNY DOESN'T MAKE IT TRUE!

Again....show me ONE article where former players weren't welcome by Shanny. Just one, Zam.

[GEM]

shaNNAHAN DID NOT FOSTER an environment that welcomed back formewr players! ALMOST every writewr in the denver community made a point of pointing out how different it was from the shanahan era!
you all know its true !

Then POST JUST ONE that says that. If there are so many, it shouldn't be hard.

[GEM]

And if you feel I am after you or leading some crusade, you're wrong. I wouldn't even care, if your posting didn't affect my enjoyment of this board in every ******* Broncos thread on here. If I could put you on ignore, I would. Your non-sensical rhetoric is old and it affects the enjoyment of the board by many members. I don't lead the stampede, you brought that on yourself with all the ******* retarded posts.

[dogfish]

sorry guys, but i believe zam is right. . .

i remember hearing a number of rumors over the years that elway and shenanigans had had a falling out of some kind. . .

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/413764-mile-high-feud-john-elway-and-mike-shanahan-still-have-a-beef-but-why



For now, however, it appears that Elway is focused mostly on rebuilding his relationship with the Broncos, a relationship that became strained after his retirement, as he and ex-coach Mike Shanahan didn’t always see eye to eye.

“Honestly, some things went on between Mike and me,” said Elway, who wouldn’t give any details.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/06/27/john-elway-would-like-to-be-an-owner/



However, even after Shanahan and Elway won two Super Bowls (after losing three together) and John retired, the abyss widened, because Bowlen had shouted "this one's for John" after the first title. Shanahan didn't want Elway in an executive role, and if the coach won without Elway, that one would be for Shanahan.

So, John was persona non grata at Dove Valley until Mc- Daniels reached out to Elway.


With a new regime, Elway was enthused about ending the split.

"It's easier to be involved now. I don't need a job title. I don't want to call shots. It's not necessarily day-to-day, but if I can help Josh, Pat and Joe get this franchise back on track, that's important. It's just a matter of being the guy there who if you wanted a different point of view, I can give it."

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_15386559



Two years ago, I asked [Elway] why he never exercised his option to buy a minority ownership interest in the team from Bowlen upon his retirement as a player. You'll recall that option caused Bowlen a bit of legal trouble with former Broncos owner Edgar Kaiser.

"To me, where the Broncos were and where I would have fit in, it wasn't the right fit at the time," Elway said then. "I think L.A. was going on around that time and I was talking to some groups out there. The timing wasn't right. I just always thought that at some point in time down the road I'd get another opportunity. And I still think I will."

That last line is suddenly looking prescient. It wasn't too hard to read between the lines of this explanation. With Shanahan in charge of everything football-related in Dove Valley, there was no substantive role for Elway. He could have had a ceremonial role as a minority owner, but he wasn't interested.

As an owner/executive in the AFL, I asked him if he still harbored ambitions of getting back into the NFL.

"Yeah, at some point in time," he said. "I just haven't had an opportunity up to this time. I think (about) that, especially as my kids grow up. I love the arena league, it's been a great experience, so if that doesn't come about, I'm thrilled and happy to be with the arena league. But I'd definitely look at some opportunities if they were to arise."

He probably didn't need the AFL to suspend operations to make the jump, but it doesn't hurt.

When I asked Shanahan two years ago about hiring Elway, he said the Hall-of-Fame quarterback was "too smart" to coach because of the hours and that a general manager or scout's job would also entail more hours than Elway probably wanted to devote to it.

What he didn't say was that Elway was interested in a meaningful executive position and Shanahan held all of those.

This may well have come up in discussions between Bowlen and Shanahan leading up to Shanahan's firing. It wouldn't surprise me if Bowlen offered Shanahan an opportunity to continue coaching under a new general manager and Shanahan, still mindful of the lesson he learned working for Al Davis, turned it down.

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/dec/30/krieger-goodbye-shanahan-hello-elway/


there's not much out there in terms of documentation, but read between the lines of john's comments. . . i bet PN would know more about this. . .

[MOtorboat]

Yes, the rift between Elway and Shanahan is well-documented, but that's because Elway wanted into the front office. What Zam is saying is that all alumni weren't welcome. Again, none of that says they weren't welcome at practices and alumni days, etc. and that's what Zam is arguing.

[Chef Zambini]

JFE is responsable for that change in culture, !
shanny NEVER wanted old timers around !

JFE knows the importance of intilling the pride and passing the torch!
JFE recognized that when HE won the SB every bronco of the past had a part and took great joy in the victory !



the above is my OPINION !
it is based on countless comments I recall from shlereth , T. jackson , A, shefter and others when discussing the culture at dove valley.
were former players BARRED from coming to practices, not likely.
But did they feel welcome, or did SHANNY go out of his way to foster a welcome environment or encourage former players to speak to the team, absolutly NOT.
you can CHOOSE to believe what you want, let me know next time shanny holds an alumni day for redskins !

[MOtorboat]

LOL...

The Redskins had an alumni day with Shanahan as coach before he even coached a game. Fail argument is fail.

[MOtorboat]

www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/wp/2012/11/04/deangelo-williams-angry-at-redskins-homecoming-game/

From November of last year:

Opening line of the article:


The Redskins have made a major effort in recent seasons to bring back alumni from the good old days, during both training camp and the regular season.

[Ravage!!!]

Oops.

This might be a good time to bring out that article that shows where Nolan wanted to move Champ to safety.

[Chef Zambini]

dan snyder, and long standing tradition with the redskins, long before shanny showed up.

funny, I dont see shanny mentioned in your newsarticle either MO. So it lacks the credability that you say is delinquent from mine for the very same reason.
Mo, if you want to believe that shanny fostered a welcome attitude to old vets, god love ya, I know different.
just be sure to applaud as lowd as I do when shanny has his "homecoming" this year.

[MOtorboat]

dan snyder, and long standing tradition with the redskins, long before shanny showed up.

funny, I dont see shanny mentioned in your newsarticle either MO. So it lacks the credability that you say is delinquent from mine for the very same reason.
Mo, if you want to believe that shanny fostered a welcome attitude to old vets, god love ya, I know different.
just be sure to applaud as lowd as I do when shanny has his "homecoming" this year.

Is that why he hired so many to coach?

[TXBRONC]

Oops.

This might be a good time to bring out that article that shows where Nolan wanted to move Champ to safety.

Ouch! :lol:

[MOtorboat]

Hey Zam, why did the Broncos have the "biggest ever" alumni reunion in 2007?

http://blog.denverbroncos.com/jsaccomano/alumni-reunion-bigger-than-ever/

[dogfish]

Yes, the rift between Elway and Shanahan is well-documented, but that's because Elway wanted into the front office. What Zam is saying is that all alumni weren't welcome. Again, none of that says they weren't welcome at practices and alumni days, etc. and that's what Zam is arguing.

gotcha. . . i thought you were mostly talking about john. . .

[Chef Zambini]

Hey Zam, why did the Broncos have the "biggest ever" alumni reunion in 2007?

http://blog.denverbroncos.com/jsaccomano/alumni-reunion-bigger-than-ever/
Because Pat Bolen is a first class guy and it was the tenth anniversary of our first SB winning season, and 30th anniversary of our first SB appearance.
it sure as hell wasnt because shanny conjured up the notion of honoring former players !

[MOtorboat]

Because Pat Bolen is a first class guy and it was the tenth anniversary of our first SB winning season, and 30th anniversary of our first SB appearance.
it sure as hell wasnt because shanny conjured up the notion of honoring former players !

lol

I knew that was going to be your response. Especially after you've been proven so wrong, and haven't introduced a shred of evidence to support your conspiracy theory about Shanahan. Priceless.

[Chef Zambini]

Hey Zam, why did the Broncos have the "biggest ever" alumni reunion in 2007?

http://blog.denverbroncos.com/jsaccomano/alumni-reunion-bigger-than-ever/thanks for posting the article.
I particularly liked the part where shanny is quoted talking about the importance of acknowledging players of the past.

[Chef Zambini]

lol

I knew that was going to be your response. Especially after you've been proven so wrong, and haven't introduced a shred of evidence to support your conspiracy theory about Shanahan. Priceless.its great to know you anticipated the TRUTH from me!
your own article makes it very clear that ANY alumni appreciation in the denver franchise during the shanny regime, was a directive from BOWLEN !

[MOtorboat]

thanks for posting the article.
I particularly liked the part where shanny is quoted talking about the importance of acknowledging players of the past.

You said alumni weren't welcome when Shanahan was coach. You said the Redskins don't support alumni now that Shanahan is coach. You've been proven wrong.

Or at least produce one shred of evidence for once.

[BroncoJoe]

You said alumni weren't welcome when Shanahan was coach. You said the Redskins don't support alumni now that Shanahan is coach. You've been proven wrong.

Or at least produce one shred of evidence for once.

He can't. He's banned!

:elefant:

[MOtorboat]

He can't. He's banned!

:elefant:

He couldn't anyway.