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View Full Version : These Are the Top Ten QBs of All Time? Seriously?



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07-11-2009, 08:08 PM
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-total-access/09000d5d8113d1fe/Top-10-all-time-QBs

Elway is #7 on the list.

Behind Peyton Manning. And Dan Marino. And Y.A. Tittle. And Brett Favre.

Bart Starr, Otto Graham, and Roger Staubach are nowhere to be seen.

I don't know what that guy is on, but if I did that kind of stuff, I would want some of it . . .

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OrangeHoof
07-11-2009, 08:39 PM
I've always hated the QB rating formula. It rewards dink and dunk passers over deep passers. The formula needs a lot of tweaking.

As far as I'm concerned, the scoreboard looks like this:

1. Joe Montana. He has the stats, he has the rings. Never been a fan but he was clutch and has stood the test of time.
2. Johnny Unitas. He was Marino before there was Marino and he won some titles too.
3. Brett Favre. He's a drama queen and he throws too many picks but it is hard to overlook his career stats.
4. Terry Bradshaw. Hate to admit it but he has four rings and the last two were with pass-oriented teams that were close to unstoppable.
5. Tom Brady. He may rise or fall based on how he rebounds from his knee injury but, to this point in his career, he fits about here.
6. John Elway. The most physically gifted QB of all time. Makes you wonder what he could have done in a Walsh offense all those years when he was under Reeves.
7. Ken Stabler. Kind of underrated by most people but he had both skill and guts, plus a ring. Might have had two if it weren't for Franco Harris.
8. Troy Aikman. He's got the titles but I've always discounted him a bit for having Emmitt Smith to hand off to all those years.
9. Dan Marino. Best QB never to win a Super Bowl.
10. Bart Starr. He just knew how to win - or else Lombardi would have cut him.

Devilspawn
07-11-2009, 08:39 PM
I think he meant the 7th best QB...


to come out of Stanford. :lol:

I have to admit, it's a funny list.

EMB6903
07-11-2009, 09:11 PM
Wow Wyche is an idiot... Aikman isnt a top 20 QB of alltime much less top 10... Staubach was 10x more of a player than Aikman.... Also leaving out Steve Young?

what a joke

Shazam!
07-11-2009, 09:12 PM
Elway is a Top 10 QB, it's just some of the lists needs reshuffling.

Dreadnought
07-11-2009, 09:25 PM
No way in Hell is Moon better than Otto Graham, who ought to be top 5, much less top ten. Aikman? I think not. I'd plug Starr in there instead.

Graham won back to back titles in '54 and '55, for a total of 3 titles in 9 NFL years, to go with winning the AAFC title every year there, too. He had a career YPA of 9.0 - that's flat out incredible. Wyche displayed his dopiness, too. Tittle was more of a ball control guy - brilliant, but Graham was far more the long ball specialist than Tittle

NameUsedBefore
07-11-2009, 09:54 PM
If it has Aikman in the top-10 I'm not watching.

Northman
07-11-2009, 10:53 PM
I dont give a rats ass what anyone else thinks. Elway is #1. Call it homerism, call it bias. Whatever. I dont give a shit. I watched that guy my entire life and throughout his entire career and i HAVE NEVER SEEN ANOTHER QB PERFORM like John Elway. Ever. Ive seen Montana, Aikman, Kelly, Marino, etc, etc and none of them could of done what John did with what he had. Sorry. This clown can try and blow smoke up someone else's ass.

topscribe
07-11-2009, 11:11 PM
I dont give a rats ass what anyone else thinks. Elway is #1. Call it homerism, call it bias. Whatever. I dont give a shit. I watched that guy my entire life and throughout his entire career and i HAVE NEVER SEEN ANOTHER QB PERFORM like John Elway. Ever. Ive seen Montana, Aikman, Kelly, Marino, etc, etc and none of them could of done what John did with what he had. Sorry. This clown can try and blow smoke up someone else's ass.

A lot of very knowledgeable people agree with you, and I mean people who are
not necessarily Broncos fans.

Looky here: http://www.angelfire.com/fl3/existence/Ewyrem.html

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Shazam!
07-11-2009, 11:15 PM
I dont give a rats ass what anyone else thinks. Elway is #1. Call it homerism, call it bias. Whatever. I dont give a shit. I watched that guy my entire life and throughout his entire career and i HAVE NEVER SEEN ANOTHER QB PERFORM like John Elway. Ever. Ive seen Montana, Aikman, Kelly, Marino, etc, etc and none of them could of done what John did with what he had. Sorry. This clown can try and blow smoke up someone else's ass.

Elway was 10x the QB and the athlete than Aikman, Bradshaw (at least he admitted it) or Montana.

They got more rings, that's all.

Jim Kelly? Please.

Marino was a better pure passer but he didn't have the arm or the feet of Elway that made him twice as dangerous.

I'd like to see how some of those guys fared when half your career was spent with your best receivers being any of the Three Amigos.

Elway is the prototype for QB greatness today. Period.

Northman
07-11-2009, 11:19 PM
Elway was 10x the QB and the athlete than Aikman, Bradshaw (at least he admitted it) or Montana.

They got more rings, that's all.

Jim Kelly? Please.

Marino was a better pure passer but he didn't have the arm or the feet of Elway that made him twice as dangerous.

I'd like to see how some of those guys fared when half your career was spent with your best receivers being any of the Three Amigos.

Exactly man. I mean, i know that John ended up bombing in a few of those Super Bowls. And a lot of that was just the abundance of talent took over which was pretty evident by the NFC dominance back then. But what a lot of people try to forget is that teams like the Browns and Oilers back then were stacked with great players and John had to literally (as we all know) carry those teams to victory and even into the Super Bowls to begin with. I mean just getting to the big dance was tough enough as it was let alone trying to win one against far superior teams back then.

Shazam!
07-11-2009, 11:34 PM
Put Elway on Montana's 49ers and nothing changes. In fact, they'd be better.

Put Montana in Denver, he'd be a cripple.

SM19
07-12-2009, 12:16 AM
Absolutely embarrassing. I'm biased when it comes to both Graham and Elway, but come on. Ranking Brady ahead of Elway doesn't pass the laugh test.

NameUsedBefore
07-12-2009, 01:00 AM
Elway's right arm doesn't look imposing: It's 34 inches long, and his biceps are a modest 12 inches unflexed.

This is what has always cracked me up about Elway. He has those noodle arms but can still rocket a ball 70 yards downfield. He also has a strange, gimpy stride but can evade and outrun defenders with ease.

rcsodak
07-12-2009, 01:09 AM
This is what has always cracked me up about Elway. He has those noodle arms but can still rocket a ball 70 yards downfield. He also has a strange, gimpy stride but can evade and outrun defenders with ease.

I highly doubt that. :confused:

Reidman
07-12-2009, 03:07 AM
OMG, I love Elway as much as the next Bronco fan but anyone calling him better than Montana needs there frickin head examined.

Yes, Elway worked his way to the top while it seemed Montana started out there, but come on people, Montana was clutch city USA, while it took Elway seasons to get to that point...you can say Montana had a better team surrounding him but all anybody remembers is Rice....

Also, I have to agree with EMB6903, where is Steve Young?? Almost as good as Montana himself...

One last thing, why so many discounting Aikman?? He was awesome! He may have had Emmitt to hand off to and Michael Irvin to pass to but he accomplished a lot in his own right. Almost 10,000 yds in the SB years and broke Montana's record of straight passes without an INT...

SoCalImport
07-12-2009, 05:32 AM
.you can say Montana had a better team surrounding him but all anybody remembers is Rice....

It's impossible to separate the QB from the system..BUT

Montana may have been the smartest QB on the list because he absolutely mastered Walsh's system. He could read a defense like P.Manning, but had a consistently great D to help him out.
Craig and Clark are two names that immediately come to mind when you mention Rice as the only name folks remember.
Not to mention all the studs on those defenses.

It's all conjecture anyway, but there's no way Elway falls out of the top 5 all time on that list. There's also no way He's #1

ursamajor
07-12-2009, 06:16 AM
Manning will be a top 10 guy. I don't think that Moon or Tittle should be on that list (although Y.A. Tittle would be on my top 10 All-Time Funniest Name List-Behind Dick Butkus of course). And who cares about how many passing yards Moon had in the CFL? No one cares about how many yards Warner had in the Arena League.

you argue the remaining order of that list with Graham and Young in there, and I won't debate it too much.

gobroncsnv
07-12-2009, 08:22 AM
If you are putting Favre on the list because of stats, then Tarkenton should be on this list as well, and I don't see anyone clamoring for him. He held the record for most passing yards for quite a few years, as I recall.
Nah, for my money, Elway is at LEAST top 3, and I'll give him #1 if I'm compiling this list. And I would put Starr on there as well, 'cause he outdueled Unitas many a time.

EMB6903
07-12-2009, 09:45 AM
the only person who you can argue as the greatest ever other than Elway is Montana...and soon to be Tom Brady and Peyton Manning... other than that it doesnt come close.

topscribe
07-12-2009, 11:05 AM
you can say Montana had a better team surrounding him but all anybody remembers is Rice....


All you remember is Rice.

Along with a lot of other people, I remember Dwight Clark, Roger Craig, John
Taylor, Wendell Tyler, Tom Rathman, Brent Jones, et al.

And then there is one of the elite offensive lines that not only excelled in pass
blocking, but also helped the rushing game to to top 5 in nearly every
category.

Also, having a defense that consistently ranked in the top 5 in nearly every
category kept the ball in Montana's hands.

Elway never had that kind of supporting cast. Ever. The only time he came
close was in 1998, yet he still did not have that kind of defense playing for
him.

As John Madden commented about Elway:


People used to talk about all the Super Bowls Elway lost. Well, I called a few of those games, and what people seem to forget is that those teams weren't that good. John Elway was the sole reason why those Bronco teams were playing in the Super Bowl. He was the closest thing to a one-man gang I've ever seen.

Could Montana have taken those teams to the Super Bowl? I doubt it. Of
course, we'll never know for sure, but the fact is, he didn't have to.

Elway did.

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Northman
07-12-2009, 11:20 AM
OMG, I love Elway as much as the next Bronco fan but anyone calling him better than Montana needs there frickin head examined.

.

I think you need to look in the mirror.

Northman
07-12-2009, 11:21 AM
All you remember is Rice.

Along with a lot of other people, I remember Dwight Clark, Roger Craig, John
Taylor, Wendell Tyler, Tom Rathman, Brent Jones, et al.

And then there is one of the elite offensive lines that not only excelled in pass
blocking, but also helped the rushing game to to top 5 in nearly every
category.

Also, having a defense that consistently ranked in the top 5 in nearly every
category kept the ball in Montana's hands.

Elway never had that kind of supporting cast. Ever. The only time he came
close was in 1998, yet he still did not have that kind of defense playing for
him.

As John Madden commented about Elway:



Could Montana have taken those teams to the Super Bowl? I doubt it. Of
course, we'll never know for sure, but the fact is, he didn't have to.

Elway did.

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Its an absolute joke that people just cant see that. Its like night and day when it comes to the talent that Montana had compared to Elway. Its not even close.

BroncoJoe
07-12-2009, 12:34 PM
Wow. I'm surprised JaMarcus Russell didn't make the list.

Shazam!
07-12-2009, 02:54 PM
Montana wasn't half the athlete Elway was.

The biggest knock against Elway, especially early on in his career, was his accuracy and he had no touch, that he put everything he had on every throw he made. But that is what happenes when you have a cannon for an arm, you are reliant on it and rely on it almost to a fault (especially when you are running for your life).

Montana was a more precision passer but Elway was the better total physical package.

You cannot compare those 49ers teams to Broncos teams.

EMB6903
07-12-2009, 03:03 PM
Elway played in pretty much the same system Montana thrived in the last years of his career and look what happened... could you imagine if Shanahan was calling the entire shots during Elway's entire career?

Shazam!
07-12-2009, 05:05 PM
I believe Young was a better overall QB than Montana physically, and Young didn't have all the Walsh assembled teams either.

Aikman also played behind a granite OLine all those years, the best OLine of the 90's before Denver's became the standard bearer. He also had a prolific Back and great WRs. Everyone forgot Alvin Harper, who looked 10x better the reciever with Irvin alongside him.

atwater27
07-12-2009, 05:40 PM
you can say Montana had a better team surrounding him but all anybody remembers is Rice....


As the great Dr. Evil would say...

How Bout NO!

Bill Walsh > Dan Reeves by faaaaaaaaaar.

Roger Craig > any broncos back during the same time period.

Tom Rathman > any broncos fullback or tailback for that matter during the same time period

John Taylor and Dwight Clark> Johnson, Jackson or Nattiel

SF offensive line over Elway's and Montana's careers were laughably different in talent and effectiveness.

On Defense, monsters like Ronnie Lott, Charles Haley, Bill Romanowski, Matt Millen, Dave Waymer and Michael Carter made over 20 pro bowls and a ton of all pro teams.

So, I think it is safe to say that Montana had a much, much better supporting cast, including several hall of famers.

NameUsedBefore
07-12-2009, 07:37 PM
That 49ers team wasn't just stacked on the players-front. Most of the modern, high-end coaches you see floating around today came out of that system. That organization was ballin' at pretty much every level. I still think, though, that as far as that era is concerned it is between Elway and Montana. I'm taking Elway, maybe because of bias I dunno, but I don't see a pretty picture when I envision Montana on the Broncos during the 1980s.

slim
07-12-2009, 09:22 PM
All you remember is Rice.

Along with a lot of other people, I remember Dwight Clark, Roger Craig, John
Taylor, Wendell Tyler, Tom Rathman, Brent Jones, et al.

And then there is one of the elite offensive lines that not only excelled in pass
blocking, but also helped the rushing game to to top 5 in nearly every
category.

Also, having a defense that consistently ranked in the top 5 in nearly every
category kept the ball in Montana's hands.

Elway never had that kind of supporting cast. Ever. The only time he came
close was in 1998, yet he still did not have that kind of defense playing for
him.

As John Madden commented about Elway:



Could Montana have taken those teams to the Super Bowl? I doubt it. Of
course, we'll never know for sure, but the fact is, he didn't have to.

Elway did.

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You forgot to mention the coaching staff that revolutionized offensive football. I think that had a little something to do with Montana's success.

Peerless
07-12-2009, 11:22 PM
wtf, where is Bubby Brister? Home dog is always getting the shaft.