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Denver Native (Carol)
05-08-2012, 03:44 PM
I’ve received a lot of questions from readers about the impact of the Broncos parting ways with general manager Brian Xanders on Monday.

I know the move appeared to come out of the blue, and the fact that a general manager has left the team can result in major change. But allow me to reiterate my thoughts from Monday when the news broke: Nothing will change in Denver.

There will not be any structural or philosophical change. Xanders was not in command of the team, nor did he make major decisions. He was third in charge.

rest - http://espn.go.com/blog/afcwest/post/_/id/43862/why-broncos-structure-wont-change

dogfish
05-08-2012, 07:06 PM
Xanders simply wasn’t in the team’s plans. But his departure does not mean the Broncos will be run differently than they have since Elway took over.

i for one would really like to hope that our draft evaluations will get significantly better with a legitimately qualified pure scout in charge of the process. . . i want to believe that's the primary reason behind this move, as it's something i've been begging for since the moment we canned that clown mcdaniels. . .

i was horribly disappointed to hear that xanders was being retained as the head of the personnel department, so IMO this is just rectifying a mistake made then-- whether you believe it was elway's choice, or a compromise with the existing FO at the time. . . either way, i'm very much looking forward to seeing how well the department performs with a real personnel guy in charge instead of a glorified bean counter who needed the local press to help fluff up his marginal hands-on scouting experience. . .

i bet russell puts more than a hundred names on his first board next year. . . ;)


i know everyone doesn't view it this way, but this is very exciting stuff, IMO. . . of course, russell is an unknown, and i'd be even more psyched if we'd pilfered a top junior exec from a stud FO like baltimore or philly-- but i still like the odds of an unknown scout significantly higher than a stuffed shirt. . . at least now we're on some kind of even footing in the evaluation game-- in the same ballpark, at the very least. . . russell still has to show that he's good at it. . . but even a modest improvement would give fox and the coaching staff more to work with in the coming years. . .

given the fact that we're trending upwards as an organization anyway, stronger drafting is really what we need to put us over the top to legit contender status. . . with the presence of peyton ****ing manning, obviously. . . re-vamping the personnel department and replacing the strength and conditioning staff with a more modern group have been THE two biggest, most immediate and most pressing needs facing this franchise, as far as i'm concerned-- and we just knocked 'em both out in one ridiculously sweet off-season that also brought us a HOF quarterback. . . my somewhat lukewarm opinion on our recent draft aside, it certainly looks like elway and fox have a solid plan in place for this franchise. . . should be a fun ride, and i honestly can't say how thrilled i am at the prospect of actually going into next year's draft with some enthusiasm again. . .

the draft used to be one of my favorite events of the whole year-- it got marked off on the calendar as a weekend holiday. . . the past three years, though, i've barely even bothered to watch it. . . along with the stupid format change, the painfully bad drafting of mcdaniels and xanders had pretty much killed my enjoyment of it. . . next year, i'll be excited about it for the first time in a long while, and that's cool. . .


:defense:

Jsteve01
05-08-2012, 07:17 PM
Xanders simply wasn’t in the team’s plans. But his departure does not mean the Broncos will be run differently than they have since Elway took over.

i for one would really like to hope that our draft evaluations will get significantly better with a legitimately qualified pure scout in charge of the process. . . i want to believe that's the primary reason behind this move, as it's something i've been begging for since the moment we canned that clown mcdaniels. . .

i was horribly disappointed to hear that xanders was being retained as the head of the personnel department, so IMO this is just rectifying a mistake made then-- whether you believe it was elway's choice, or a compromise with the existing FO at the time. . . either way, i'm very much looking forward to seeing how well the department performs with a real personnel guy in charge instead of a glorified bean counter who needed the local press to help fluff up his marginal hands-on scouting experience. . .

i bet russell puts more than a hundred names on his first board next year. . . ;)


i know everyone doesn't view it this way, but this is very exciting stuff, IMO. . . of course, russell is an unknown, and i'd be even more psyched if we'd pilfered a top junior exec from a stud FO like baltimore or philly-- but i still like the odds of an unknown scout significantly higher than a stuffed shirt. . . at least now we're on some kind of even footing in the evaluation game-- in the same ballpark, at the very least. . . russell still has to show that he's good at it. . . but even a modest improvement would give fox and the coaching staff more to work with in the coming years. . .

given the fact that we're trending upwards as an organization anyway, stronger drafting is really what we need to put us over the top to legit contender status. . . with the presence of peyton ****ing manning, obviously. . . re-vamping the personnel department and replacing the strength and conditioning staff with a more modern group have been THE two biggest, most immediate and most pressing needs facing this franchise, as far as i'm concerned-- and we just knocked 'em both out in one ridiculously sweet off-season that also brought us a HOF quarterback. . . my somewhat lukewarm opinion on our recent draft aside, it certainly looks like elway and fox have a solid plan in place for this franchise. . . should be a fun ride, and i honestly can't say how thrilled i am at the prospect of actually going into next year's draft with some enthusiasm again. . .

the draft used to be one of my favorite events of the whole year-- it got marked off on the calendar as a weekend holiday. . . the past three years, though, i've barely even bothered to watch it. . . along with the stupid format change, the painfully bad drafting of mcdaniels and xanders had pretty much killed my enjoyment of it. . . next year, i'll be excited about it for the first time in a long while, and that's cool. . .


:defense:not rain on your parade but if reports are true danders has never ha much say. He just became irrelevant

dogfish
05-08-2012, 07:24 PM
not rain on your parade but if reports are true danders has never ha much say. He just became irrelevant

you can't bring me down, steve!


:D :welcome:

Cugel
05-09-2012, 01:41 PM
i for one would really like to hope that our draft evaluations will get significantly better with a legitimately qualified pure scout in charge of the process. . . i want to believe that's the primary reason behind this move, as it's something i've been begging for since the moment we canned that clown mcdaniels. . .

i was horribly disappointed to hear that xanders was being retained as the head of the personnel department, so IMO this is just rectifying a mistake made then-- whether you believe it was elway's choice, or a compromise with the existing FO at the time. . . either way, i'm very much looking forward to seeing how well the department performs with a real personnel guy in charge instead of a glorified bean counter who needed the local press to help fluff up his marginal hands-on scouting experience. . .

i bet russell puts more than a hundred names on his first board next year. . . ;)


i know everyone doesn't view it this way, but this is very exciting stuff, IMO. . . of course, russell is an unknown, and i'd be even more psyched if we'd pilfered a top junior exec from a stud FO like baltimore or philly-- but i still like the odds of an unknown scout significantly higher than a stuffed shirt. . . at least now we're on some kind of even footing in the evaluation game-- in the same ballpark, at the very least. . . russell still has to show that he's good at it. . . but even a modest improvement would give fox and the coaching staff more to work with in the coming years. . .

given the fact that we're trending upwards as an organization anyway, stronger drafting is really what we need to put us over the top to legit contender status. . .

That's how I felt too. I've been hoping they would get rid of Xanders ever since he was hired and then somehow let McDaniels seize full control over the organization, while Jim Goodman, who actually knew a thing or two about the draft was fired.

I still don't know how that happened. The GM was supposed to be independent and have the ultimate control over player personnel decisions, and yet within months McDaniels was making all the decisions and screwing everything up.

And Xanders Sgt. Shulz act "I see nothing. NOTHING!" always seemed like bull to me. What advice was he giving about Knowshon Moreno and Robert Ayers and trading a 1st round pick for a 2nd back in 2009?

I still have no idea why Xanders thinks he's some kind of draft expert. He was a glorified accountant who wanted to be a real GM, but he's never shown any particular skill at it.

Cugel
05-09-2012, 01:47 PM
not rain on your parade but if reports are true danders has never ha much say. He just became irrelevant

He never had the ultimate authority, but that doesn't mean he "had no say." He wasn't a deaf-mute in there in the war room.

He was supposed to be the one in charge in fact, but he let McDaniels make all the decisions.

And McDaniels response to Xanders claims of lamb-like innocence after McMoron was fired, was to point out that Xanders was in there the whole time helping to make decisions. And to say "someone had to take control" meaning that Xanders wasn't doing it and he, McDaniels seized control due to the vacuum of decision making at the top.

I don't know if that's true of course, but the Broncos did say that the GM would be independent prior to McDaniels little coup.

Why didn't Xanders speak out, go to Bowlen or Joe Ellis and complain? And if he wasn't going to be given that kind of power, then why did the team make that statement?

Superchop 7
05-09-2012, 03:08 PM
A change was absolutely necessary, we need some savvy in the draft desperately. We reached on our first three picks.....inexcusable.

Hell, half of us on the board would have done better.

John needs an outside advisor, someone to provide a perspective and not a yes man.

Ravage!!!
05-09-2012, 04:13 PM
He never had the ultimate authority, but that doesn't mean he "had no say." He wasn't a deaf-mute in there in the war room.

He was supposed to be the one in charge in fact, but he let McDaniels make all the decisions.

And McDaniels response to Xanders claims of lamb-like innocence after McMoron was fired, was to point out that Xanders was in there the whole time helping to make decisions. And to say "someone had to take control" meaning that Xanders wasn't doing it and he, McDaniels seized control due to the vacuum of decision making at the top.

I don't know if that's true of course, but the Broncos did say that the GM would be independent prior to McDaniels little coup.

Why didn't Xanders speak out, go to Bowlen or Joe Ellis and complain? And if he wasn't going to be given that kind of power, then why did the team make that statement?

Who cares why they wo uld make that statement? What I wonder, is why you guys keep taking interview quotes, or any quotes to the media, as fact? We have NO idea what their duties are, what they ar responsible for, and what is said while they are doing THEIR jobs. It just goes to show that we don't have a clue as to what is doing what, who's job is exactly what, and where the lines are mingled.

Why didn't he complain? About what? He probably knew it wasn't his job, thus nothing to complain about. I'm betting X knew what his position was and didn't need to speak out or complain....because it wasn't his place.

Cugel
05-09-2012, 05:17 PM
Who cares why they wo uld make that statement? What I wonder, is why you guys keep taking interview quotes, or any quotes to the media, as fact? We have NO idea what their duties are, what they ar responsible for, and what is said while they are doing THEIR jobs. It just goes to show that we don't have a clue as to what is doing what, who's job is exactly what, and where the lines are mingled.

Why didn't he complain? About what? He probably knew it wasn't his job, thus nothing to complain about. I'm betting X knew what his position was and didn't need to speak out or complain....because it wasn't his place.

:laugh: First you argue that we can't know anything, and then you argue that "you're betting" that Xanders didn't complain because he "knew his place."

You can't have it both ways! :laugh:

I don't think this is unlikely. It's easy to imagine that Xanders knew that Bowlen had fallen in love with McMoron and that any complaining by Xanders that McMoron was usurping his supposed role as the final authority on Player Personnel decisions would only lead to Xanders being fired like Ted Sundquist was by Shanahan.

But, we certainly don't KNOW this!

And I'd say that public statements by McMoron in the media are more evidence than pure speculation. I was careful to discount to a certain extent his statements which might have been self-serving.

But, they sound like a man who is saying "Hey! I'm taking all the blame but he was there helping to make all those decisions." And that's certainly consistent with what we know about what the Broncos announced publicly about Xanders role.

The most probable scenario is simply that McMoron had the final word on everything because he had Bowlen's support. Xanders knew that and didn't push his luck, but Xanders did have plenty of input in the Broncos draft decisions and was not nearly so opposed to all the insanity as he likes to pretend after McMoron was fired.

But, no, we don't "know" this . :coffee:

My point about "why didn't Xanders complain" was rhetorical. If he knew all these decisions were wrong, why did he stay there and take part of the blame for them?

You can imagine different answers: He wanted to keep his job. He hoped everything might somehow work out and if he stood in the doorway and left the Broncos he might end up looking bad. etc.

But, none of those answers render him mute and helpless as McMoron ravaged the organization. If he felt so strongly about it, then his proper course of action was to try and get a job somewhere else. Clearly he didn't.

dogfish
05-09-2012, 05:53 PM
yea, this is what i don't get about people making excuses for xanders. . .

"well, he didn't have the final say!"

okay. . . so how, exactly, does that suddenly equate to him having no say at all, and merely being some helpless innocent by-stander who stood there and wrung his hands while mcD drafted zane beadles in the second round?

you guys really think we paid him an executive's salary to do nothing? to just stand there and look dumb? "okay, brian, can you just sorta stand over there in the corner and try not to break anything?"

he was the general manager for three years! we're to believe that he had no hand in setting the draft board? he had no authority over the regional scouts, they were completely autonomous, or only worked with elway? you think maybe mcD organized all the college scouting in his copious spare time when he was here? xanders had no input over the last two years as to which college players we picked for additional scouting? all he did the whole time was show elway where to find agent numbers in the rolodex? and we paid him an almost-certainly six figure salary for that?

i suppose it's possible. . . i personally find it hard to credit. . .

hell. . . even if that was the case, we still benefit from getting rid of him, simply by saving or diverting that salary. . .

Ravage!!!
05-09-2012, 06:16 PM
I personally don't give a flying crap if he stays or doesn't stay. It certainly won't change me one way or the other, I have/had absolutely no feelings for this guy one way or the other. But I just think he's this "whipping boy" and reason for the dog-pile that seems to grow over time. I don't think X had much say in personnel at all, and never did. So I hope it 'helps' our Broncos. But other than hoping, I don't think anything changes.

Tned
05-11-2012, 06:12 AM
That's how I felt too. I've been hoping they would get rid of Xanders ever since he was hired and then somehow let McDaniels seize full control over the organization, while Jim Goodman, who actually knew a thing or two about the draft was fired.

I still don't know how that happened. The GM was supposed to be independent and have the ultimate control over player personnel decisions, and yet within months McDaniels was making all the decisions and screwing everything up.

And Xanders Sgt. Shulz act "I see nothing. NOTHING!" always seemed like bull to me. What advice was he giving about Knowshon Moreno and Robert Ayers and trading a 1st round pick for a 2nd back in 2009?

I still have no idea why Xanders thinks he's some kind of draft expert. He was a glorified accountant who wanted to be a real GM, but he's never shown any particular skill at it.

Really, you "don't know how" it happened. You really don't get the fact that McDaniels and the Goodmans clashed over personel decisions, so they were fired and McDaniels given full control. Something that was stated when McDaniels was eventually fired. It was stated that McDaniels was given full control, because that's what Bowlen had done with every one of his coaches and what he was comfortable with, even though they said in hindsight it was a mistake.

You saying "Xanders...let McDaniels seize full control over the organization, while Jim Goodman, who actually knew a thing or two about the draft was fired...I still don't know how that happened" is like me saying, "Cugel let the NFL owners lock out the players, leading to a a work stoppage, I still don't know how he let that happen..."