PDA

View Full Version : QB fight nothing new for Orton



Den21vsBal19
05-02-2009, 05:22 AM
Denver Post (http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_12277522)


Kyle Orton is here and Mark Sanchez is not.

Instead of a franchise quarterback, the Broncos took a franchise running back in Knowshon Moreno. Call draft day a win-win for Orton.

"There's no question about it, a good running game is the best friend for a quarterback," Orton said. "We've got a good group of running backs and Knowshon should fit in well."

The veteran Orton is attending the Broncos' rookie minicamp this weekend while the rookie Sanchez is nowhere near Dove Valley.

The Broncos thought about taking Sanchez, a pro-polished quarterback from USC, with their first pick in the NFL draft. They even flew to Los Angeles to give Sanchez a private workout five days before the draft, and discussed the possibility of moving up as many as four spots from their No. 12 overall pick.

Rather quickly, the Broncos decided it would be too costly to move up in the draft, and as it turned out, they weren't going to get Sanchez. He went to the New York Jets with the far-too-pricey No. 5 pick, and the Broncos stayed still at No. 12 and took Moreno.

"Oh, yeah, you hear about it, but like I said before, you're going to compete for your job every year," said Orton, the most likely candidate to replace Jay Cutler as the Broncos' starting quarterback this year. "And I don't have a problem competing."

Most teams hold three minicamps during the offseason. Orton will participate in five. He had one with the Chicago Bears before he was dealt March 2 to the Broncos in the Cutler trade and will participate in four with the Broncos, who were granted an additional minicamp because McDaniels is a first-year coach.

Better believe Orton will receive his $100,000 workout bonus this offseason.

"He threw himself into the playbook," McDaniels said. "I don't know what time he's leaving here (tonight), but I know it's not early."

To be clear, Orton isn't proclaiming himself the starting quarterback, only that he's competing for the position with another veteran, Chris Simms. McDaniels says this, too, although Simms is the underdog after essentially not playing the past three seasons.

The Broncos wound up drafting a quarterback last weekend, but not until the sixth round, where they selected the raw but promising Tom Brandstater from Fresno State. For his rookie season, Brandstater will be asked to perform two functions: observe and absorb.

At least he didn't spend his first day Friday getting the rookie treatment from Orton or Simms.

"They could easily not help me at all, but they've taken a liking to me, I hope, and they've been helping me, and I'm appreciative of that," Brandstater said. "And when I mess up on the field, they give me the corrections in a nice way."

Brandstater will not present the threat Sanchez would have posed, not that Orton would have been inexperienced in such a situation. In 2005, Orton won 10 games, more than any rookie quarterback since the 1970 merger except for Ben Roethlisberger's 14 wins in 2004. Yet Orton was yanked as the starter before the 2005 playoffs.

By 2007, Orton was behind both Rex Grossman and Brian Griese and was so lightly regarded the Bears planned to replace him as the No. 3 quarterback by drafting Florida's Chris Leak.

"Didn't bother me at all," Orton said.

Orton outplayed Leak in the preseason, and by the end of 2007, the Bears reached an epiphany: There was something about Orton. He has been starting since.

Sanchez? Even if he had been drafted by the Broncos, no one should have been surprised if he spent his rookie season watching Orton play.

"I've certainly been through a lot the first four years of my career, but I'm excited to be here," Orton said. "I think I've done a lot of good things in this league and a lot more good things to go."

Dirk
05-02-2009, 06:49 AM
I love Orton's attitude. I hope that he really get's things together and proves that he can be a franchise QB. You never know. Nobody thought Brady would be a franchise QB in the beginning.

I am a firm believer that with the right coaching he can succeed.

Den21vsBal19
05-02-2009, 07:07 AM
I love Orton's attitude. I hope that he really get's things together and proves that he can be a franchise QB. You never know. Nobody thought Brady would be a franchise QB in the beginning.

I am a firm believer that with the right coaching he can succeed.
Absolutely no reason why he can't be a success here, which is why Moreno was a good signing..............if he can shoulder some of the load, along with whichever backs also make the cut, Orton seems to be smart enough, and have enough mental toughness, to do his part of the puzzle.

Scarface
05-02-2009, 07:57 AM
QB fight nothing new for Orton

Journeyman players are used to fighting for a roster spot every year. Of course it's not new for Orton.

Ravage!!!
05-02-2009, 10:54 AM
Unfortunatly, he lost those fights to both Grossman and Griese.

But he does have a good attitude.

oobehr
05-02-2009, 11:40 AM
I would be surprised if he doesn't flourish as the leader of our monster offense. He had decent numbers in Chicago and is coming to a much better situation, if he doesn't come out and have 3,500 yards 20 touchdowns then he must be bad.

Hobe
05-02-2009, 01:28 PM
Unfortunatly, he lost those fights to both Grossman and Griese.

But he does have a good attitude.

And nether Grossman or Griese did any better. The Bears just pay very little attention to offense, almost a mirror image of Shanahan's Broncos. Orton is now on an offense oriented team and has some real weapons to work with. I think he will be more productive in Denver then in Chicago just because of the circumstances. For the Broncos sake I hope he does well.

honz
05-02-2009, 01:42 PM
Sexy Rexy was a first round pick. That battle was over before it started. Orton started as a rookie 4th round pick and got the team to the playoffs. When he got the chance to start again last year, he played very well again.

Lonestar
05-02-2009, 01:56 PM
Sexy Rexy was a first round pick. That battle was over before it started. Orton started as a rookie 4th round pick and got the team to the playoffs. When he got the chance to start again last year, he played very well again.


Good insight..

Anyway I can't remember but one QB that the fans of the bears liked and that was Jim Mc.. before that maybe Sid Luckman..

The bears have always been a Defensive minded team.. or run first type..

The fans are used to it and eat QB's for High tea....

HE has to be feel like one of the luckiest men alive..

And a comment was made about Brady not being a franchise QB before being MADE one.. RIGHT ON..:salute:

franchise QB's are not all #1 draft choices.. Mostly but not all in fact there are more #1 round journeyman QB's out than franchise QB's.....

Scarface
05-02-2009, 04:15 PM
Sexy Rexy was a first round pick. That battle was over before it started. Orton started as a rookie 4th round pick and got the team to the playoffs. When he got the chance to start again last year, he played very well again.

Did he get the team to the playoffs or was it the defense? I'll answer my own question. It was the defense.

yardog
05-02-2009, 04:24 PM
Yep I can't express how excited I'm that we trade a franchise QB away and will be looking for the next Brady for 10 years or so. :tsk:

Lonestar
05-02-2009, 05:11 PM
Yep I can't express how excited I'm that we trade a franchise QB away and will be looking for the next Brady for 10 years or so. :tsk:

And How do you KNOW that we do not have the perfect guy right NOW..

For that matter how do YOU KNOW jay was a franchise QB from reading the press?

just because someone is drafted in the first round doth not make him a franchise player.. Is he good? SURE when his head is in the game..

Most franchise QBs do not have 130+ ratings and sub 50's in one year..

And frankly that is all we saw of jay ONE good between the 20's year/ears..

TXBRONC
05-02-2009, 05:21 PM
Sexy Rexy was a first round pick. That battle was over before it started. Orton started as a rookie 4th round pick and got the team to the playoffs. When he got the chance to start again last year, he played very well again.

The battle was over because Grossman was injuredm even so he started the last two games of the 2005 season.

Magnificent Seven
05-02-2009, 05:25 PM
Not interested in Orton. I am more interested in Tom Brandstater. He could surprise us.

yardog
05-02-2009, 05:43 PM
And How do you KNOW that we do not have the perfect guy right NOW..

For that matter how do YOU KNOW jay was a franchise QB from reading the press?

just because someone is drafted in the first round doth not make him a franchise player.. Is he good? SURE when his head is in the game..

Most franchise QBs do not have 130+ ratings and sub 50's in one year..

And frankly that is all we saw of jay ONE good between the 20's year/ears..


Only time will tell. We will see how it works out.

honz
05-02-2009, 05:47 PM
Did he get the team to the playoffs or was it the defense? I'll answer my own question. It was the defense.

Probably in his rookie season, yes...but he still got the job done and won games. However, he went 9-7 with a team that had a middle of the pack defense last year and a pretty bad surrounding cast on offense minus Forte.

honz
05-02-2009, 05:51 PM
The battle was over because Grossman was injuredm even so he started the last two games of the 2005 season.

No, I'm saying Orton never had a shot at playing ahead of a healthy Grossman since he was a 1st round pick for the Bears. Once Grossman proved he wasn't going to get any better and be the Bears' future QB though, Orton beat him out for the job.

horsepig
05-02-2009, 07:25 PM
Was Kenny Stabler considered a "franchise QB"? How about Jim Plunket? SB winners.
You never know what you're gonna get.

horsepig
05-02-2009, 07:26 PM
Plunket's a good story for you younger guys that might not know.

omac
05-02-2009, 08:01 PM
Did he get the team to the playoffs or was it the defense? I'll answer my own question. It was the defense.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/chi/2005.htm

I agree with that; the defense held opponents to 10 or less points 9 times; of the 16 games, in only 4 did the opponents score were 20 points or more (24, 20, 21, 34). Not surprisingly, in those 4 games, the Bears went 0-4.

Also, only 4 games did the Bears score 20 points or more (38, 28, 20, 24). That game where they scored 38 was composed of 1 passing TD, 2 rushing TDs, 1 INT TD, 1 punt return TD, and a 48 yard FG.

It's just the way the Bears are built. They are a defense first team with an excellent ST unit, and a strong commitment to the rushing game.

Orton only needed to get 9 TDs versus 13 INTs for 10 wins. Still not bad at all; for a rookie, he put up only slightly lower numbers than Matt Leianart and Vince Young.

He's has gotten much better, and his performance during the 1st half of 2008 before his injury was just excellent. :cheers:

bcbronc
05-02-2009, 10:51 PM
Not interested in Orton. I am more interested in Tom Brandstater. He could surprise us.

maybe in 3-4 years...

Tned
05-02-2009, 11:02 PM
Not interested in Orton. I am more interested in Tom Brandstater. He could surprise us.

He could, but the odds are against him being a quality NFL starter.

Lonestar
05-02-2009, 11:24 PM
He could, but the odds are against him being a quality NFL starter.


just like they were for Brady and Cassell.. and a few others in other cities..

Day one QB's are not the only way to become a starter..

Ravage!!!
05-02-2009, 11:34 PM
just like they were for Brady and Cassell.. and a few others in other cities..

Day one QB's are not the only way to become a starter..

doesn't mean the ODDS still aren't against them.

Lonestar
05-02-2009, 11:42 PM
doesn't mean the ODDS still aren't against them.

Did I say they were not.. I just compared his odds to that of one budding HOF QB and a pretty good one year starter that just became very rich....

sorry if you did not understand my post.. RIF

Ravage!!!
05-03-2009, 12:08 AM
He could, but the odds are against him being a quality NFL starter.


just like they were for Brady and Cassell.. and a few others in other cities..

Day one QB's are not the only way to become a starter..


Did I say they were not.. I just compared his odds to that of one budding HOF QB and a pretty good one year starter that just became very rich....

sorry if you did not understand my post.. RIF

JR... couldn't Tned say the same thing to you, in your same tone???

"Where did I say they couldn't make it. I just compared ODDS to those of him being a quality starter. Sorry if you did not understand my post...RIF"

I don't think my response to your post was ANY different than your response to his :coffee:

Lonestar
05-03-2009, 12:10 AM
JR... couldn't Tned say the same thing to you, in your same tone???

"Where did I say they couldn't make it. I just compared ODDS to those of him being a quality starter. Sorry if you did not understand my post...RIF"

I don't think my response to your post was ANY different than your response to his :coffee:

:confused:

sorry I do not get it..

LoyalSoldier
05-03-2009, 12:27 AM
Sexy Rexy was a first round pick. That battle was over before it started. Orton started as a rookie 4th round pick and got the team to the playoffs. When he got the chance to start again last year, he played very well again.

Oh yes he was so good at getting his team to the playoffs he was benched mid-game. :rolleyes:

Honestly I wish people would quit giving him so much credit for the Bears that season. He was a rookie and he played like one. The Bears defense was playing flat out amazing football that year. They were crazy good.

I give him credit for playing a decent year last year, but his play in his rookie season was....well...rookie like.

Shazam!
05-03-2009, 02:10 AM
Journeyman players are used to fighting for a roster spot every year. Of course it's not new for Orton.

Umm, Orton hasn't yet earned 'journeyman QB' status. Not even close. His second team via trade doesn't count. Simms can qualify.


Not interested in Orton. I am more interested in Tom Brandstater. He could surprise us.

Agreed. The guy is a freak and has the physical tools, hopefully he'll pick the speed of the game, improve his mechanics (a constant criticism throughout the Draft) the playbook and the system which he is somewhat familiar with already.

Of COURSE the odds are against him, but you never know. Sometiems you need a little luck. Like Drew Bledsoe going down. Look at Kellen Clemmons? Promised the job after Pennington. Promised the job after Farve. Now they got Sanchez, he'll never have a crack at it. Sometimes you need luck and the stars have to be aligned.