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View Full Version : Elway must REALLY want a CB



SmilinAssasSin27
04-25-2012, 06:39 PM
ShawnZobel_DHQ: Report: Denver Broncos have talked with Jacksonville Jaguars about trading up to No. 7 overall to select South Carolina CB Stephon Gilmore.

NightTerror218
04-25-2012, 06:43 PM
ShawnZobel_DHQ: Report: Denver Broncos have talked with Jacksonville Jaguars about trading up to No. 7 overall to select South Carolina CB Stephon Gilmore.

I hope it is just smoke and mirrors. Unless our defense is going to be in nickle formation a lot. We have Bailey and Porter. We also have a good youngster in the slot. Unless he foresees Bailey or Porter gone next season. I do not see that the immediate impact player he was talking about, atleast not at the position.

Tned
04-25-2012, 06:45 PM
Anyone have a feel for whether there is any chance of Porter getting suspended for the bounty stuff?

SmilinAssasSin27
04-25-2012, 06:46 PM
We'll all know tomorrow night, but if Elway's comments can be read into, he's most concerned about defending the pass.

Can never have too many good DBs

DT isn't the need many think it is

Teams who spread us out hurt us the most

SmilinAssasSin27
04-25-2012, 06:46 PM
Anyone have a feel for whether there is any chance of Porter getting suspended for the bounty stuff?

this does make ya wonder...

Nomad
04-25-2012, 06:49 PM
Did Skinny take Elway out drinking!:D

NightTerror218
04-25-2012, 06:50 PM
we were spread out but we destroyed in the middle of the field with no MLB in coverag, um Mays sucks in coverage. We also had Goodman and 2 young safeties part of the season. I would think MLB is more important that CB and SS. But we signed Porter and the other new safety. Figured our secondary was good and front 7 needed attention. But this makes you wonder.

Tned
04-25-2012, 07:15 PM
we were spread out but we destroyed in the middle of the field with no MLB in coverag, um Mays sucks in coverage. We also had Goodman and 2 young safeties part of the season. I would think MLB is more important that CB and SS. But we signed Porter and the other new safety. Figured our secondary was good and front 7 needed attention. But this makes you wonder.

Not sure about the safety. Might not win the starting job over the young guys.

Sent from my Android Xoom using Forum Runner

spikerman
04-25-2012, 07:18 PM
we were spread out but we destroyed in the middle of the field with no MLB in coverag, um Mays sucks in coverage. We also had Goodman and 2 young safeties part of the season. I would think MLB is more important that CB and SS. But we signed Porter and the other new safety. Figured our secondary was good and front 7 needed attention. But this makes you wonder.

I still think a DT who can push the pocket would do more for the pass defense than another CB. The Broncos can have 4 or 5 All Pros in the secondary and it won't matter if the QB never gets pressure in his face (see Brady, Tom). For some reason every team but the Broncos seems to have figured that out.

SmilinAssasSin27
04-25-2012, 07:21 PM
Not sure about the safety. Might not win the starting job over the young guys.

Sent from my Android Xoom using Forum Runner

The Brown is already our best Safety. He's very sound and will help the youngsters find their way. He and Carter are the starters until/if Moore gets his shit together.

NightTerror218
04-25-2012, 07:23 PM
The Brown is already our best Safety. He's very sound and will help the youngsters find their way. He and Carter are the starters until/if Moore gets his shit together.

I feel better about Bailey/Porter then those 2 or front 7.

Mannway187
04-25-2012, 07:30 PM
If we were able to move up to the seventh pick it would be to take either the best big body or to take the SS from Bama. But given that Dawkins will be sitting in the war room I'd say we go after the best Safety on the board. Get him before the Chargers move up and take him. They have been rumored to be trying to jump in front of the Cowboys who definately take him if he's still there. The talk of taking a corner has to be a smoke screen.

SmilinAssasSin27
04-25-2012, 07:33 PM
If we were able to move up to the seventh pick it would be to take either the best big body or to take the SS from Bama. But given that Dawkins will be sitting in the war room I'd say we go after the best Safety on the board. Get him before the Chargers move up and take him. They have been rumored to be trying to jump in front of the Cowboys who definately take him if he's still there. The talk of taking a corner has to be a smoke screen.

as evidenced by our offer to the Eagles for Samuel???

NightTerror218
04-25-2012, 07:33 PM
I am scared what moving up to top 10 would cost us.......but hey why not take the best ILB instead of Cb :D Keuchly (however you spell it)

claymore
04-25-2012, 07:57 PM
as evidenced by our offer to the Eagles for Samuel???

That could have been a smokescreen too. After Elway landed Manning, I doubt he would miss on Samuels if he REALLY wanted him.

elsid13
04-25-2012, 08:03 PM
That could have been a smokescreen too. After Elway landed Manning, I doubt he would miss on Samuels if he REALLY wanted him.

They only reason that deal fell through is because Samuels wouldn't accept Denver's restructured contract offer. The deal was done accord to several sources.

Nomad
04-25-2012, 08:03 PM
That could have been a smokescreen too. After Elway landed Manning, I doubt he would miss on Samuels if he REALLY wanted him.


I would hope this is a smokescreen, because then the "Trust in EFX.....they take BPA" mantra around here would be false.

SmilinAssasSin27
04-25-2012, 08:10 PM
I would hope this is a smokescreen, because then the "Trust in EFX.....they take BPA" mantra around here would be false.

not necessarily. If EFX believe that Gilmore is the BPA and maybe the only player they really have interest in, then that could be exactly what they are doing.

broncobryce
04-25-2012, 09:02 PM
nickel corner is huge these days, because most of the NFL uses 3 WR, one TE and on RB most of the time. We got killed last year when teams ran the ball against our nickel. So this guy must be fantastic against the run.

chazoe60
04-25-2012, 09:04 PM
If we got the 7th pick and didn't draft Luke Kuechly I would be one pissed off guy. Kuechly will end up being the best defensive player to come out of this draft.

Nomad
04-25-2012, 09:06 PM
So, you 2 guys would take Gilmore over Kuechly because he'd more than likely be at 7.

SmilinAssasSin27
04-25-2012, 09:06 PM
http://www.draftcountdown.com/ScoutingReports/CB/Stephon-Gilmore.php


Very good vs the run from what I remember when watching So Carolina games.

Tebowtime2011
04-25-2012, 09:23 PM
No way if we take him at #7 if we move up then I will be extremely pissed when we could have grabbed luke kuechly

Jsteve01
04-25-2012, 09:34 PM
If we flipping mortgage our future for Gilmore when we could have just anted up for Samuel I will be pissed

pipes
04-25-2012, 09:36 PM
Mike Klis
There's a report out there saying the Broncos have talked about trading up to Jacksonville's No. 7 spot for CB Stephon Gilmore. Absurd. The Broncos have just one second-round pick (end of round at No. 57) and one third-round pick (end of round at No. 87). You can't get there from here. Broncos may move up a spot or three from No. 25, but even that is unlikely. Broncos wouldn't mind moving back, but they go to bed tonight expecting to make their pick at No. 25.
7 minutes ago
+

Northman
04-25-2012, 09:38 PM
That would be stupid considering there are plenty of decent DB's in the draft.

SmilinAssasSin27
04-25-2012, 09:58 PM
Mike Klis
There's a report out there saying the Broncos have talked about trading up to Jacksonville's No. 7 spot for CB Stephon Gilmore. Absurd. The Broncos have just one second-round pick (end of round at No. 57) and one third-round pick (end of round at No. 87). You can't get there from here. Broncos may move up a spot or three from No. 25, but even that is unlikely. Broncos wouldn't mind moving back, but they go to bed tonight expecting to make their pick at No. 25.
7 minutes ago
+

The Falcons used 5 picks (including 2 future picks) to move from 27 to 6 to land Julio Jones. We'd be moving from 25 to 7 in this scenario. I don't believe that this will happen, but it's hardly impossible or even unprecedented.

pipes
04-25-2012, 10:18 PM
The Falcons used 5 picks (including 2 future picks) to move from 27 to 6 to land Julio Jones. We'd be moving from 25 to 7 in this scenario. I don't believe that this will happen, but it's hardly impossible or even unprecedented.

Just to be clear, that was from Mike Klis.
Last year Atlanta firmly believed that they were 1 playmaker away from serious title contention.

Are the Broncos 1 CB away?
-I'd say no, but I also think 1 great draft and they very well could be.

Simple Jaded
04-25-2012, 10:37 PM
I thought the possibily of Denver trading up to #7 was completely out of the question.......right up until Mike Klis said it was absurd.......

broncobryce
04-25-2012, 10:46 PM
http://www.draftcountdown.com/ScoutingReports/CB/Stephon-Gilmore.php


Very good vs the run from what I remember when watching So Carolina games.

Good to know I'm not on EVERYONE's ignore list. ;)

MOtorboat
04-26-2012, 07:34 AM
That would be stupid considering there are plenty of decent DB's in the draft.

Yeah, moving up 18 spots is a huge move and would require a lot of assets, which would probably include next year's first.

HORSEPOWER 56
04-26-2012, 07:42 AM
Yeah, moving up 18 spots is a huge move and would require a lot of assets, which would probably include next year's first.

It would definitely require next year's first or pretty much every pick from this year's draft. I really, really, really, hope this is just smoke because Gilmore isn't even that good (top 10 pick worthy). We'd pretty much be giving up our whole draft for the 2nd or 3rd best CB in this year's draft? Makes no sense. I know we're on a tight schedule to win now, but it's not like Gilmore is even a rock-solid "lock" prospect.

I've been screaming for a DT for years and I wouldn't be happy with trading up that far, even for a DT like Cox. It's a waste of picks that rivals Alphonso Smith or Tebow. Let's just stay where we are and take BPA. Hell, who knows, Kirkpatrick might actually fall to us (and Jenkins almost definitely will) and we can take him without giving up our whole draft to do it.

In other news, the Falcons traded for Asante Samuel yesterday and renegotiated his contract to 3 years, 18 million... roughly 6 million a year. Joe Mays and Ty Warren will cost the Broncos over 8 Million this year... food for thought.

If we really wanted a CB who could play right away, wouldn't Samuel have been a better option?

MOtorboat
04-26-2012, 07:47 AM
Yeah, it would definitely require next years first, I was being kind to the idea...

The point is Denver can get a cornerback that can play at 25. And I'd rather not have Samuel.

Cugel
04-26-2012, 07:53 AM
We'll all know tomorrow night, but if Elway's comments can be read into, he's most concerned about defending the pass.

Can never have too many good DBs

DT isn't the need many think it is

Teams who spread us out hurt us the most

First of all, this trade will never happen. The Broncos would have to give up not only their entire draft but also cripple themselves for YEARS to pull it off.

And for what? A starting CB? Unless you were SURE this guy would be the next Champ Bailey it's just not worth it. And who can know that in advance?

Second, DT IS the need everybody says it is. The Broncos can continue to ignore it, just as they have for the last 10 years, but then their DL has SUCKED for the last 10 years, despite having Dumervil for several of those years.

It's never been even mediocre. And the defense as a whole has been pretty BAD for years too. And that has limited the success the team has had since 2005.

Ty Warren and Vickerson were supposed to be the starting DTs LAST season too -- and neither of them got out of training camp. Why would anybody think it will be different this year? Or that the Broncos will be any good at DT even if both stay healthy for a change? Warren hasn't played since 2009 and Vickerson is a career backup.

And who exactly is going to replace either of them?

To pretend that some UTTER SCRUB like Mitch Unrein is going to be adequate is beyond idiocy.

If Elway really believes the company line that DT "isn't the need everybody thinks it is" then he's fooling himself.

We've been down that road many times before, when they've tried to rely on has-been or never-were injured, old or under-achiever FAs: Gerrard Warren, Amon Gordon, Antwon Burton, Sam Adams, Jimmy Kennedy, Ron Fields, Jamal Williams, Dewayne Robertson, Le Kevin Smith, and now, Vickerson, Warren and Justin Bannan.

They're all the same. NONE of them was any good or a long-term solution. :coffee:

Cugel
04-26-2012, 08:03 AM
Just to give people an idea of how much you would have to give up to trade up this high, the #7 pick is worth 1500 points. The #25 pick is worth 720.

The difference, 780 points, is equal to the #22 pick of the 1st round. So, you need the equivalent of TWO first round picks to move up that high.

In addition to the Broncos #25 pick, the entire rest of their draft in 2012 doesn't equal 780 points! For instance their next three picks are worth (approximately because I'm not taking into account supplemental picks), 320, 140 and 50 points respectively.

Total = 510 points. Not even close.

They'd have to give up probably a 2nd or 3rd round pick THIS year, plus their #1 NEXT season to have a chance to pull this off.

I.E. it would cost them TWO #1's and a #2 or a #3 total to get the #7 over-all pick.

And, because there's always a PREMIUM demanded by teams to move down that far it would probably cost more. And in addition, it's doubtful that any top 10 team wants to move all the way down to #25. They'd probably rather stay somewhere in the top 15-20.

I have no idea about the validity of these rumors, but I'd be totally amazed if the Broncos did anything like this. It just wouldn't be worth it to get one player and give up the chance to draft THREE!

CoachChaz
04-26-2012, 08:08 AM
Yeah, it would definitely require next years first, I was being kind to the idea...

The point is Denver can get a cornerback that can play at 25. And I'd rather not have Samuel.

Then we can draft Samuel 2.0 in the 2nd round...Casey Hayward. Only difference is Hayward can tackle

MOtorboat
04-26-2012, 08:24 AM
http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/40413/60/final-mock-barron-goes-top-10?pg=3

Evan Silva with Gilmore off the board at 5 and Denver taking Martin. Only thing that stuck out to me about this was Coples lasting all the way to 32.

CoachChaz
04-26-2012, 08:25 AM
http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/40413/60/final-mock-barron-goes-top-10?pg=3

Evan Silva with Gilmore off the board at 5 and Denver taking Martin. Only thing that stuck out to me about this was Coples lasting all the way to 32.

If Coples is there at 25, I will fly to NY and turn the card in myself

BroncoNut
04-26-2012, 08:43 AM
If you're going to trade up to 7 from 25, you're going to have to pay the price. Nothing's free.

MOtorboat
04-26-2012, 08:46 AM
If you're going to trade up to 7 from 25, you're going to have to pay the price. Nothing's free.

Nut, can we get you to start a lounge thread with your draft insights throughout the day and into the evening?

BroncoNut
04-26-2012, 08:50 AM
Nut, can we get you to start a lounge thread with your draft insights throughout the day and into the evening?

so that you can make fun of me? no thanks fake friend

BroncoNut
04-26-2012, 08:51 AM
Nut, can we get you to start a lounge thread with your draft insights throughout the day and into the evening?

no, I'll give it some thought. I have nothing but time today.

Jsteve01
04-26-2012, 09:00 AM
you're right nut except beer...beer is free

Jsteve01
04-26-2012, 09:01 AM
i like Spano but fueling this ridiculous rumor is lame

NightTerror218
04-26-2012, 11:19 AM
this is prob an ancient rumor that just got out, was prob when Tebow was still a bronco and the trade included him.

GEM
04-26-2012, 11:37 AM
I will place a cheese grater on the wall and repeatedly slap my forehead against it if this were true. The amount we would have to give up to get there would leave us with no draft and all for a CB. And on a CB...we've had Champ for what 8 years, what did that help the rest of the defense?

******* cheese grater!!

Chef Zambini
04-26-2012, 11:49 AM
one great CB is easy for a QB/ offense to ignore.
a defense is only as strong as its third receiver match-up.
Or if a D has a huge target, like a goodman.

BroncoNut
04-26-2012, 11:51 AM
I would rather we buy the no. 1 spot from Indy and grab luck to tell you the truth. I am ALL over this guy.

Superchop 7
04-26-2012, 02:08 PM
It will cost way too much and screw us down the road.

BroncoNut
04-26-2012, 02:18 PM
It will cost way too much and screw us down the road.

that's what Clay wants. He loves to be screwed down the road. :pound: :pound:

omg, I so hope he doesnt' see this

CoachChaz
04-26-2012, 06:38 PM
Keep in mind, the big nickel package is becoming more and more necessary lately with the emergence of the athletic TE's. To the point where you need pass coverage on first down

ShooterJM
04-27-2012, 03:52 PM
Wonder if they'll roll the dice on jenkins in the 2nd.

bcbronc
04-27-2012, 05:51 PM
Wonder if they'll roll the dice on jenkins in the 2nd.

I think they will. Just a guess on my part, but if I'm right it confirms my Internet genius.