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Bullgator
04-14-2012, 09:56 PM
Mods move this pls to the appropriate place... not sure where to put something for spano to read.

In reference to your goodbye Tebow Nation rant...

You are 100% right about a faction of Tebow fans that go overboard. It was not cool the way they attacked Von or Elway or anyone they feel is not 100% on board with Timmy. You will be hard pressed to find a bigger Tebow supporter than me but even I have to agree that those fans are a disgrace and are hurting Tim. If Tim is destroyed by the "analysts" I believe that its because of his fans. Even if he sucks there are a lot of people who suck but no one gets picked apart like Tebow... and its because of a faction of his fans.

However I do not agree that they out number the good ones though. I think its about 10% but it just so happens that they are the most vocal. By in large most Tebow fans are good people. The very fact that they like Tebow is because they mostly agree with his views.

But unfortunately that's what happens when you bring religion into the equation. Nothing brings out the worst in people like religion... Not God or Christ mind you, (which tends to bring out the best in a person) but religion.

Some people here on this site would lump me in with them but nothing could be further from the truth. I Mostly just play a role here because its fun. But for the most part my opinion is based on football.

So anyways just wanted to say that I agree and you have been one of a kind in defending Timmy, you didn't sell out to either side that deserves some kudos.

Jsteve01
04-14-2012, 10:03 PM
well said bull. Spano and I actually had this debate on air one night when I called in. He was certain that the Broncos would have preferred to keep Tebow around if not for the circus. Lammey feels the same. It's sad that a small group of nitwits claim to support Timmy and don't stand for any of the things he stands for. It's also sad that they have created this circus that the Broncos don't want to be a part of. I for one am sad because I truly believe he'll be a fine player one day down the line and I would have liked to see it happen here.

jhildebrand
04-14-2012, 10:09 PM
I still laugh at the theory that a team will make a decision based on a player's fans or fans in general. Teams make decisions based on what they think will help them win. Teams buy in to distractions and circuses all the time-vick, TO, Ochocinco, Pacman, Lawrence Phillips, it doesn't matter.

If this FO got rid of TT solely because they are afraid some fans might chant for TT than either the FO is dumber and softer than I thought or they think Manning is soft. If it is the former, then they should be fired for cause tomorrow morning.

Bullgator
04-14-2012, 10:11 PM
well said bull. Spano and I actually had this debate on air one night when I called in. He was certain that the Broncos would have preferred to keep Tebow around if not for the circus. Lammey feels the same. It's sad that a small group of nitwits claim to support Timmy and don't stand for any of the things he stands for. It's also sad that they have created this circus that the Broncos don't want to be a part of. I for one am sad because I truly believe he'll be a fine player one day down the line and I would have liked to see it happen here.

Agreed, its a damn shame. That 10% reminds me of the islamic extremists... maybe instead of calling them Tebow fans we should call them the Tebow extremists.

Bullgator
04-14-2012, 10:16 PM
I still laugh at the theory that a team will make a decision based on a player's fans or fans in general. Teams make decisions based on what they think will help them win. Teams buy in to distractions and circuses all the time-vick, TO, Ochocinco, Pacman, Lawrence Phillips, it doesn't matter.

If this FO got rid of TT solely because they are afraid some fans might chant for TT than either the FO is dumber and softer than I thought or they think Manning is soft. If it is the former, then they should be fired for cause tomorrow morning.

well you have to factor in the fact that Fox and Elway are alpha males who dont like being forced to make decisions... no question that they would rather win with another guy than win with a guy they were forced to play...and if that other guy is Manning then its a no brainer...

IMO J, this decision was made by the FO because Tebows fanbase tied their hands

Jsteve01
04-14-2012, 10:19 PM
I still laugh at the theory that a team will make a decision based on a player's fans or fans in general. Teams make decisions based on what they think will help them win. Teams buy in to distractions and circuses all the time-vick, TO, Ochocinco, Pacman, Lawrence Phillips, it doesn't matter.

If this FO got rid of TT solely because they are afraid some fans might chant for TT than either the FO is dumber and softer than I thought or they think Manning is soft. If it is the former, then they should be fired for cause tomorrow morning.

If that's not the reason then what in the hell is he benefit of trading the guy? I don't believe they were just blowing smoke when they said that they like Tim. I think they got tired of the circus. John painted himself into a corner with all his talk about being more fan friendly and caring what the fan base had to say. In all honesty it's the only reason I can think of that Tebow went in instead of Quinn.

jhildebrand
04-14-2012, 10:28 PM
IMO J, this decision was made by the FO because Tebows fanbase tied their hands

Nah. That was McD. He did it the day he traded a king's ransom for TT.

Denver Native (Carol)
04-14-2012, 10:30 PM
I still laugh at the theory that a team will make a decision based on a player's fans or fans in general. Teams make decisions based on what they think will help them win. Teams buy in to distractions and circuses all the time-vick, TO, Ochocinco, Pacman, Lawrence Phillips, it doesn't matter.

If this FO got rid of TT solely because they are afraid some fans might chant for TT than either the FO is dumber and softer than I thought or they think Manning is soft. If it is the former, then they should be fired for cause tomorrow morning.

Well then - how about this????? Laugh all you want, but it happened in Denver, and the Jets do not want it happening there.


Florham Park, NJ. – The management of the New York Jets are moving to limit his media exposure. They realize that Tim Tebow has the ability to bring the circus to town and they want to limit it.


rest - http://www.inquisitr.com/214554/new-york-jets-want-to-limit-tim-tebows-media-exposure/

Bullgator
04-14-2012, 10:31 PM
If that's not the reason then what in the hell is he benefit of trading the guy? I don't believe they were just blowing smoke when they said that they like Tim. I think they got tired of the circus. John painted himself into a corner with all his talk about being more fan friendly and caring what the fan base had to say. In all honesty it's the only reason I can think of that Tebow went in instead of Quinn.

Denver literally is not big enough to have the Manning AND the Tebow circus in town at once... and ill tell you something else, no way Manning comes to Denver if he is not promised that Tebow would be on the first plane out of Denver. Manning left Indy because he didnt want Luck pushing him from the bench... Tebows sitch here is 10X worse with his fans.

so yea I have to agree that it works against Teebs to have such a vocal and loyal fan base.

jhildebrand
04-14-2012, 10:33 PM
If that's not the reason then what in the hell is he benefit of trading the guy? I don't believe they were just blowing smoke when they said that they like Tim. I think they got tired of the circus. John painted himself into a corner with all his talk about being more fan friendly and caring what the fan base had to say. In all honesty it's the only reason I can think of that Tebow went in instead of Quinn.

Tebow didn't want to be here. He wanted out and another shot elsewhere. We probably know that from the comments he made when the Orton trade failed. Of course Elway was happy to oblige. That is the Shanahan way. If you don't want to be a Bronco they would accomodate you any way possible. Why trade Lloyd? The compensatory pick might have been better. Why let Orton go? They said it was to save cash. However, if that Chiefs game kept Denver out of a home PO game, it would have been an $18 million dollar mistake.

I just wont ever buy the theory teams do anything with regard to the roster BECAUSE of the fans. They do what they want because they want to. The only thing done concerning TT on account of the fan was starting him the last 3 games of 2010 to prevent the end of the home sellout streak!

I know this is long but I said in PS that Fox put TT in during the Dallas game to show the fans how bad he was. I was told then quite colorfully that team's don't do things on account of the fans. Why now at the end of the season is that all of a sudden different? :confused: Can't have it both ways!

Bullgator
04-14-2012, 10:34 PM
Well then - how about this????? Laugh all you want, but it happened in Denver, and the Jets do not want it happening there.


rest - http://www.inquisitr.com/214554/new-york-jets-want-to-limit-tim-tebows-media-exposure/

which IMO tell me how the Jets staff is sold on TTs playing ability to put up with that circus... but you cat stop the circus... you can only hope to contain it.

jhildebrand
04-14-2012, 10:39 PM
Well then - how about this????? Laugh all you want, but it happened in Denver, and the Jets do not want it happening there.


rest - http://www.inquisitr.com/214554/new-york-jets-want-to-limit-tim-tebows-media-exposure/

What's your point, Carol? :confused: All that shows me is the NYJ FO is more sophisticated and prepared to handle TT than Denver's! :lol: Maybe they learned from afar. :noidea:

They aren't making FOOTBALL decisions regarding TT BASED on the fans. They aren't starting him because some crazies from the 904 are demanding he start. They aren't cutting or trading him, as it is suggested here, because of some crazies from the 904.

THEY WELCOMED THE CIRCUS. The same circus so many here said NO OTHER TEAM would put up with. This story gets worse for Denver if TT turns out to be a huge success for NY. If a Defensive coach hits it big with a QB nobody wanted including a former HOF QB that doesn't end will with things here in Denver. Just know that.

Tebow has done what Matt Ryan can't. Matt Ryan who is a great pocket passer. Great Mechanics. great footwork. In fact, in 15 games TT has done a lot that MANY QB's before him couldn't DESPITE his limitations! I don't know why we needed to sit through 34 games of Orton just to be sure but couldn't sit through another 16 of TT.

All I know is Manning and company have no reason not to at least duplicate last year's results if not outperform them. Anything less would be a colossal failure!

Denver Native (Carol)
04-14-2012, 10:44 PM
which IMO tell me how the Jets staff is sold on TTs playing ability to put up with that circus... but you cat stop the circus... you can only hope to contain it.

Well then, I guess the Jets will get some new Tebow fans, and the Broncos will get some new Manning fans. If the Jets staff is willing to put up with the circus, why are they taking steps to limit Tebow's media exposure - because they know what can and will happen.

jhildebrand
04-14-2012, 10:49 PM
Well then, I guess the Jets will get some new Tebow fans, and the Broncos will get some new Manning fans. If the Jets staff is willing to put up with the circus, why are they taking steps to limit Tebow's media exposure - because they know what can and will happen.

With all due respect, how is the Manning circus any different? Fan is short for fanatic. It comes with the territory!


If the Jets staff is willing to put up with the circus, why are they taking steps to limit Tebow's media exposure - because they know what can and will happen.

At the end of the day they saw a talented athlete who could help them win games. It is about winning games. Not how you win, unless you are in Denver, but winning. Why are they taking steps to limit his media exposure you ask? Again maybe they are more sophisticated. Maybe they are making sure he focuses on football knowing they didn't make him do that here! Who knows. But the fact is they traded for the guy when so many here said NOBODY would put up with it.

Bullgator
04-14-2012, 10:58 PM
Well then, I guess the Jets will get some new Tebow fans, and the Broncos will get some new Manning fans. If the Jets staff is willing to put up with the circus, why are they taking steps to limit Tebow's media exposure - because they know what can and will happen.

What? That Tim will be starting by week 6?

Why does everyone think its a bad thing? All I hear nowa days is that "if sanchez plays bad the Tebow fans will start the chants!" and that Mark has a fragile mind and that Tebow will take over yada yada...

well if mark is weak and plays like shit then isnt that whats supposed to happen? the back should take over... but people act like its the worse thing in the world for Tim to actually take over.

Tell me this carol... how did it work out for denver when the fans forced Foxs hand and Tim took over? everyone in the media was shocked and appalled that the fans thought Tebow should start... hoge said it was comical... but what actually happened? Hell it should have happened sooner.

jhildebrand
04-14-2012, 11:01 PM
Hell it should have happened sooner.

I have been saying that since 2010. 1st rounders need to put up or shut up. That goes for Sanchise, Tebow, Smith, anyone!

All I know is if there is a duplication with the NYJ and TT and they go to the POs and Denver doesn't....it will get UGLY. Lindsey Lohan on Meth (not even once, folks) UGLY!

Bullgator
04-14-2012, 11:17 PM
I have been saying that since 2010. 1st rounders need to put up or shut up. That goes for Sanchise, Tebow, Smith, anyone!

All I know is if there is a duplication with the NYJ and TT and they go to the POs and Denver doesn't....it will get UGLY. Lindsey Lohan on Meth (not even once, folks) UGLY!

If Manning stays healthy then playoffs should be no prob.. if...

Jets on the other hand I think will be back in the afc championship and with the help of Tebow in the redzone I think they have a real shot... just like the 2006 UF team with Chris leak (which was JUST LIKE sanchez, could play but was a choke artist in the redzone) moving the ball between the 20s and Tebow being a red zone scoring machine, I think the jets will be very hard to beat, they already have the defense.

MOtorboat
04-15-2012, 12:46 AM
With all due respect, how is the Manning circus any different? Fan is short for fanatic. It comes with the territory!



At the end of the day they saw a talented athlete who could help them win games. It is about winning games. Not how you win, unless you are in Denver, but winning. Why are they taking steps to limit his media exposure you ask? Again maybe they are more sophisticated. Maybe they are making sure he focuses on football knowing they didn't make him do that here! Who knows. But the fact is they traded for the guy when so many here said NOBODY would put up with it.

How is Manning different?

"Clueless" doesn't even begin to describe it.

tomjonesrocks
04-15-2012, 01:32 AM
Tebow cost Denver 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round picks--and they wound up trading him for one 4th. Of course the circus was the reason for moving him for such weak compensation.

Simple Jaded
04-15-2012, 02:06 AM
The Broncos traded Tim Tebow because he's the worst passer in the league and he's not worth the brain damage that goes along with Tebowmania. It's both Tebow and his ridiculous fanbase.

And you know who you are. Put it this way, if you rented a billboard or high fived the jack off who did, it's you!

If you chanted Tebow's name during the game, it's you!

If you stormed off to tweeter to bash the GOAT because he wouldn't commit to the worst passer in the league, it's you!

If you flooded the sports talk radio about how Elway, Fox, Xanadu and McCoy was sabotaging Tim Tebow, it's you!

If you're pissed off that Denver was scouting college QB's, it's you!

If you're pissed that the Broncos signed a HoF QB to replace the worst passer in the league, it's you!

If you think Tebow was treated unfairly, it's you!

If you're already plotting your criticism for Elway if Manning doesn't work out, it's you!

Most objective people know that Tebow's backup skill set played a major role in is exit from Denver, but if you think it's just the lunatic fringe like Bullgator you're mistaken. The Broncos knew that no matter what they did they would be criticized, they had nothing to gain from keeping Tebow around.......

Simple Jaded
04-15-2012, 02:21 AM
Stop playin!

If it's just about wins then why would the Jets need Tim Tebow? Sanchez has won a hell of a lot more than Tebow. Plus he can complete passes to the right side of the field. It's not just about wins, that's just the bullshit people fall back on when the player in question is mostly inept. See, Kyle Orton, 6-0 in 2009. He may be a complete ****** bed wetter but "he just wins". Even after that Orton had all the excuses he needed until the Broncos drafted a new mascot.......I mean QB.......

Simple Jaded
04-15-2012, 02:30 AM
The Broncos started Tebow in 2010 because they were worried about the home sell out streak?

The 2012 season will define whether or not the Manning signing was successful?

Where do Tebowfags get this shit?.......

Simple Jaded
04-15-2012, 02:36 AM
This thread is Full. Of. Shit. It's you, Bullshitter! Spano is talking about you, you're the reason Tebow is no longer a Bronco (not that you care which team he plays for, you're just butthurt because the Broncos don't swing from his short-and-curlies like you). Nice try.......

Northman
04-15-2012, 08:37 AM
Jets will plummet, just watch.

DenBronx
04-15-2012, 12:00 PM
I think it came down more to if EFX believed Tebow could really become a top 10 NFL QB and not so much "The circus of fans." Of course that includes "throwing" the football acurately. I believe they would have put up with the circus if they felt Tebow could be that guy for them.

Also, keep in mind that Hasselbeck, Kolb, Cassel, Smith and more were going to get sent packing if their team would have landed Manning. So circus or not it more came down to Peyton Manning. Do you want prime rib or do you want chop liver???

jhildebrand
04-15-2012, 04:14 PM
How is Manning different?

"Clueless" doesn't even begin to describe it.

But it does begin to describe you. You have continuously failed to read what was precisely written or keep up.

I didn't ask how Manning is different but how the circus that follows him is any different. Not too subtle Mo! Many of the Tebow critics are critics for no other reason than his followers and the constant attention he got. Manning has his own following in case you haven't noticed and the attention is just as focused and intense!

MOtorboat
04-15-2012, 04:17 PM
But it does begin to describe you. You have continuously failed to read what was precisely written or keep up.

I didn't ask how Manning is different but how the circus that follows him is any different. Not too subtle Mo! Many of the Tebow critics are critics for no other reason than his followers and the constant attention he got. Manning has his own following in case you haven't noticed and the attention is just as focused and intense!

Any way you meant its monumentally different.

:tsk:

jhildebrand
04-15-2012, 04:19 PM
Any way you meant its monumentally different.

:tsk:

That would be your perception. Doesn't mean it is everybody's.

MOtorboat
05-19-2013, 10:00 PM
But it does begin to describe you. You have continuously failed to read what was precisely written or keep up.

I didn't ask how Manning is different but how the circus that follows him is any different. Not too subtle Mo! Many of the Tebow critics are critics for no other reason than his followers and the constant attention he got. Manning has his own following in case you haven't noticed and the attention is just as focused and intense!

Well that observation was dead wrong...

chazoe60
05-19-2013, 10:01 PM
Are you drunk MO?

Dzone
05-20-2013, 01:30 AM
This Tebow stuff is much ado about nothing. who cares if he has fans? big deal

Lancane
05-20-2013, 12:24 PM
This Tebow stuff is much ado about nothing. who cares if he has fans? big deal

Well, he is the most popular unemployed person on the planet...

chazoe60
05-20-2013, 12:32 PM
I just love how so many Bronco fans will so quickly take a shit all over a guy who isn't here anymore and at the same time will coddle and pamper a guy who had one of the worst plays I'ver ever seen by a safety that was a major role in our playoff loss.


Go ahead by all means, continue the Tebow bashing Rahim Moore love fests.

CoachChaz
05-20-2013, 12:50 PM
I just love how so many Bronco fans will so quickly take a shit all over a guy who isn't here anymore and at the same time will coddle and pamper a guy who had one of the worst plays I'ver ever seen by a safety that was a major role in our playoff loss.


Go ahead by all means, continue the Tebow bashing Rahim Moore love fests.

Actually...both are dumb. Moore made a bad play, but he is still a Bronco. Tebow isnt a Bronco, but he's a good human being.

Lancane
05-20-2013, 12:53 PM
I just love how so many Bronco fans will so quickly take a shit all over a guy who isn't here anymore and at the same time will coddle and pamper a guy who had one of the worst plays I'ver ever seen by a safety that was a major role in our playoff loss.


Go ahead by all means, continue the Tebow bashing Rahim Moore love fests.

Again Chazoe you're blowing smoke brother, Moore's play wasn't what cost us that game, but you and the so-called pundits keep telling yourselves the loss is his fault, every person with a football acumen of a respectable degree have themselves even said that it was on more then one person, that it's just more memorable because the timing of the play in the game itself - those who work at the Post don't count either. Moore had a pretty solid season last year and one really bad play that came at a key moment, but I love how you overlook the other players who had a good year but also had some key mistakes, such as Manning, Thomas, Decker and so forth.

Thomas had 11 dropped passes, Decker 12 do you think we should trade them? And guess what...Welker had 15, maybe we shouldn't have signed him. Manning threw a pivotal interception in the AFC Divisional game as well, maybe the Broncos shouldn't have picked up his contract. Every team has a couple missed opportunities and make some key mistakes in almost every game...remember San Francisco 49ers the year before last? Hate on the kid if you want, but please quit using that one moment as an excuse, find more then one so you actually have an argument, no player deserves to be hated for one piss poor moment in sports. Maybe we should have cut Jason Elam, as good as he was...he did miss some kicks!

As for the Tebow bashing, I am not bashing him...I am stating an obvious fact. He is the most popular unemployed person on the planet. You know why Denver replaced him and he can not find a job? Because he is just not that good, in fact as a quarterback at this level, he is down right atrocious - if he really wanted to have a career in the NFL, he'd quit being stubborn and move to another position. "Only the meek shall inherit the earth", not very humble to demand you be a quarterback when your skills no longer allow that to be the case.

GEM
05-20-2013, 12:58 PM
Tebow was on Celebrity Apprentice last night, his foundation donated $200,000 to the American Red Cross. Pretty Awesome.

Lancane
05-20-2013, 01:03 PM
Tebow was on Celebrity Apprentice last night, his foundation donated $200,000 to the American Red Cross. Pretty Awesome.

That is pretty awesome, the thing is that I respect the kid as a person, I just don't believe he is a good quarterback. Sadly, with his stubbornness to switch positions, I feel his time as an NFL player is at an end. And I wish nothing but the best for him going forward, I don't hate the kid...if even half the idiots in the NFL had his character, well...

Maybe it's time for him to think about coaching, but his popularity could be his undoing if his fans continue to praise him and not point out his shortcomings. I think he has the temperament to be a coach and he has the football IQ, but that is just my opinion.

chazoe60
05-20-2013, 01:08 PM
Tebow was on Celebrity Apprentice last night, his foundation donated $200,000 to the American Red Cross. Pretty Awesome.

**** that. He doesn't deserve to be on celebrity apprentice, he's the worst football player ever.


Now, has anyone seen Rahim's binky?

LTC Pain
05-20-2013, 01:30 PM
**** that. He doesn't deserve to be on celebrity apprentice, he's the worst football player ever.


Now, has anyone seen Rahim's binky?

You constantly the ringing the bell against Moore for his one mistake against the Ravens is making you sound like the Tebowites (Tebow in HOF), Zam (anti Oz) and Chop (Pro Dysert) with their singular, skewed point of view. Which, by the way, convinces no one or brings fans to your side. On the contrary................

LTC Pain
05-20-2013, 01:30 PM
Again Chazoe you're blowing smoke brother, Moore's play wasn't what cost us that game, but you and the so-called pundits keep telling yourselves the loss is his fault, every person with a football acumen of a respectable degree have themselves even said that it was on more then one person, that it's just more memorable because the timing of the play in the game itself - those who work at the Post don't count either. Moore had a pretty solid season last year and one really bad play that came at a key moment, but I love how you overlook the other players who had a good year but also had some key mistakes, such as Manning, Thomas, Decker and so forth.

Thomas had 11 dropped passes, Decker 12 do you think we should trade them? And guess what...Welker had 15, maybe we shouldn't have signed him. Manning threw a pivotal interception in the AFC Divisional game as well, maybe the Broncos shouldn't have picked up his contract. Every team has a couple missed opportunities and make some key mistakes in almost every game...remember San Francisco 49ers the year before last? Hate on the kid if you want, but please quit using that one moment as an excuse, find more then one so you actually have an argument, no player deserves to be hated for one piss poor moment in sports. Maybe we should have cut Jason Elam, as good as he was...he did miss some kicks!

As for the Tebow bashing, I am not bashing him...I am stating an obvious fact. He is the most popular unemployed person on the planet. You know why Denver replaced him and he can not find a job? Because he is just not that good, in fact as a quarterback at this level, he is down right atrocious - if he really wanted to have a career in the NFL, he'd quit being stubborn and move to another position. "Only the meek shall inherit the earth", not very humble to demand you be a quarterback when your skills no longer allow that to be the case.

This times quad!!!

chazoe60
05-20-2013, 01:37 PM
You constantly the ringing the bell against Moore for his one mistake against the Ravens is making you sound like the Tebowites (Tebow in HOF), Zam (anti Oz) and Chop (Pro Dysert) with their singular, skewed point of view. Which, by the way, convinces no one or brings fans to your side. On the contrary................

8 of my last 250 posts(that's as far back as I cared to go but I'm sure I could go even further) did I even mention or refer in anyway to Rahim Moore. So what exactly is your ****** up definition of "constantly"?

slim
05-20-2013, 01:46 PM
You constantly the ringing the bell against Moore for his one mistake against the Ravens is making you sound like the Tebowites (Tebow in HOF), Zam (anti Oz) and Chop (Pro Dysert) with their singular, skewed point of view. Which, by the way, convinces no one or brings fans to your side. On the contrary................

I think you have it backwards. It's those that are constantly making excuses for Moore that resemble Tebow fans...just making shit up to prop up a crappy player.

Lancane
05-20-2013, 01:56 PM
I think you have it backwards. It's those that are constantly making excuses for Moore that resemble Tebow fans...just making shit up to prop up a crappy player.

If you could produce a shred of evidence that he's crappy, then you'd have an argument. But you can not, because his stats support the other side of the argument, and you can not find enough film showing him making too many mistakes, he was above average and better then half the free safeties currently starting in the league. Also, he's entering his third season, you do realize that most football players struggle their second year in the league more then at any other time...don't know why, I don't think anyone does, something about the sophomore season. Point is Slim, as I said earlier, hating on the kid for one mere mistake when I've seen almost every starter on the roster make just as piss poor decisions at some time this season is basically shallow and empty, prove he is what you say and people will listen, but one play is not proof...it's a witch hunt for the sake of a witch hunt.

slim
05-20-2013, 02:01 PM
If you could produce a shred of evidence that he's crappy, then you'd have an argument. But you can not, because his stats support the other side of the argument, and you can not find enough film showing him making too many mistakes, he was above average and better then half the free safeties currently starting in the league. Also, he's entering his third season, you do realize that most football players struggle their second year in the league more then at any other time...don't know why, I don't think anyone does, something about the sophomore season. Point is Slim, as I said earlier, hating on the kid for one mere mistake when I've seen almost every starter on the roster make just as piss poor decisions at some time this season is basically shallow and empty, prove he is what you say and people will listen, but one play is not proof...it's a witch hunt for the sake of a witch hunt.

I'm not talking about one play, I am talking about two years of below average saftey play.

You can pretend like he is an above average saftey if you want, but I'm not going to do that. Let's just tell it like it is, man. Why do we have to sugar coat this thing? That is what I don't understand. We don't do that for other players, why should we do it for Rahim?

chazoe60
05-20-2013, 02:02 PM
He's gotten much better in the area of tackling, I will grant that, but as a "ballhawk" which is what we were told when he was drafted, he has done almost nothing. His ball skills are terrible and the one bad play was so heartbreakingly bad that it can't just he glossed over like a blip in an otherwise steplar career or something.

It was embarrassing all the way around. And the coddling of him by some of the fans just makes no sense when other guys who have frankly done more for this franchise are shat upon all the time and I'm not just talking about Tebow. He just seems like such an odd character for so many Bronco fans to stand behind and protect from a little criticism.

slim
05-20-2013, 02:08 PM
He's gotten much better in the area of tackling, I will grant that, but as a "ballhawk" which is what we were told when he was drafted, he has done almost nothing. His ball skills are terrible and the one bad play was so heartbreakingly bad that it can't just he glossed over like a blip in an otherwise steplar career or something.

It was embarrassing all the way around. And the coddling of him by some of the fans just makes no sense when other guys who have frankly done more for this franchise are shat upon all the time and I'm not just talking about Tebow. He just seems like such an odd character for so many Bronco fans to stand behind and protect from a little criticism.

He is not particularly effective against the run and his strength was supposed to be his ball skills, but he has only 2 ints in 2 years and the interception he got last year was on a tipped ball IIRC....it's not like he made a great play on it or anything.

So an average tackler, not really a big hitter (he can load up every now and then), a liability in run support and subpar coverage/ball skills.

Yeah, let's sign him to a lifetime deal :fart:

Northman
05-20-2013, 02:29 PM
8 of my last 250 posts(that's as far back as I cared to go but I'm sure I could go even further) did I even mention or refer in anyway to Rahim Moore. So what exactly is your ****** up definition of "constantly"?

Yea, i do have to say. If not for Carol posting that article today there probably would not have been much to talk about regarding Rahim. Not saying that Carol shouldnt post articles but its not like those who have a gripe with Rahim started the age old debate again.

Lancane
05-20-2013, 02:35 PM
I'm not talking about one play, I am talking about two years of below average saftey play.

You can pretend like he is an above average saftey if you want, but I'm not going to do that. Let's just tell it like it is, man. Why do we have to sugar coat this thing? That is what I don't understand. We don't do that for other players, why should we do it for Rahim?

I am not sugar coating a damn thing Slim, nor am I saying his play is above reproach, but the whole goddamn team has made monumental mistakes and yet you and Chazoe overlook that in order to continue your paraded attacks on a kid who played better then a good number of other players in the league, not to mention on the team itself. So who has a fairer argument? Not those who are using absolutely no logic to slap a kid in the face. I asked you to gather any evidential proof of your argument, film or stats which you base your so-called argument against him and I'll listen, I don't take intoxicated hot-air which has no basis give one play as such. I am willing to listen to a logical argument, but I, like many others have watched the games, I have also looked at the stats and compared them to a number of current starters at the same time in their careers and I'll admit he's not a world-beater Free Safety, but he is a capable starter which Tebow was not and who could prove to be more then that, I also don't form definitive opinions about a player who shows they're capable with only two years under their belt as I've seen so many do, including yourself. According to your line of thinking, the Broncos of the 80's should have parted ways with Shannon Sharpe, Steve Watson, Rulon Jones, Vance Johnson, Sammy Winder, Louis Wright, Dennis Smith and the list goes on.

slim
05-20-2013, 02:39 PM
I am not sugar coating a damn thing Slim, nor am I saying his play is above reproach, but the whole goddamn team has made monumental mistakes and yet you and Chazoe overlook that in order to continue your paraded attacks on a kid who played better then a good number of other players in the league, not to mention on the team itself. So who has a fairer argument? Not those who are using absolutely no logic to slap a kid in the face. I asked you to gather any evidential proof of your argument, film or stats which you base your so-called argument against him and I'll listen, I don't take intoxicated hot-air which has no basis give one play as such. I am willing to listen to a logical argument, but I, like many others have watched the games, I have also looked at the stats and compared them to a number of current starters at the same time in their careers and I'll admit he's not a world-beater Free Safety, but he is a capable starter which Tebow was not and who could prove to be more then that, I also don't form definitive opinions about a player who shows they're capable with only two years under their belt as I've seen so many do, including yourself. According to your line of thinking, the Broncos of the 80's should have parted ways with Shannon Sharpe, Steve Watson, Rulon Jones, Vance Johnson, Sammy Winder, Louis Wright, Dennis Smith and the list goes on.

Well, the arguments have been made...ad nauseum. In fact, you and I have looked at the stats in depth on more than one occassion. I am not going to rehash all that.

We obviously disagree. But, in the end, I hope you are right. Simply because the Broncos need Rahim to become a player.

Lancane
05-20-2013, 02:50 PM
Well, the arguments have been made...ad nauseum. In fact, you and I have looked at the stats in depth on more than one occassion. I am not going to rehash all that.

We obviously disagree. But, in the end, I hope you are right. Simply because the Broncos need Rahim to become a player.

I hope I am right as well, not for the sake of the argument...but for the sake of the player and untapped potential he has. But I also know as a former player and coach that sometimes the best thing for any athlete is not continually winning without diversity or likewise being coddled by coaches and staff, but rather to be knocked on your ass so hard that you have to reflect and either pop back up with a new outlook or remain the kid sitting on his worthless ass.

slim
05-20-2013, 02:54 PM
I hope I am right as well, not for the sake of the argument...but for the sake of the player and untapped potential he has. But I also know as a former player and coach that sometimes the best thing for any athlete is not continually winning without diversity or likewise being coddled by coaches and staff, but rather to be knocked on your ass so hard that you have to reflect and either pop back up with a new outlook or remain the kid sitting on his worthless ass.

One of my fears is he won't be able to rebound from that play. Do you remember the preseason his rookie year when he was called for laying out Donald Jones (or whoever that WR was)? That play got into his head and it took him a long ass time to overcome it. The meltdown in the playoff game is on a completely different level.

Lancane
05-20-2013, 02:59 PM
One of my fears is he won't be able to rebound from that play. Do you remember the preseason his rookie year when he was called for laying out Donald Jones (or whoever that WR was)? That play got into his head and it took him a long ass time to overcome it. The meltdown in the playoff game is on a completely different level.

There is that possibility, but he deserves the season to prove one way or the other. He's either going to do the same and remain substandard or he's going to take it and become a better player or even elevate his play to a whole new plateau.

Simple Jaded
05-20-2013, 11:53 PM
I just love how so many Bronco fans will so quickly take a shit all over a guy who isn't here anymore and at the same time will coddle and pamper a guy who had one of the worst plays I'ver ever seen by a safety that was a major role in our playoff loss.


Go ahead by all means, continue the Tebow bashing Rahim Moore love fests.

Two huge differences between the two.

1, Rahim Moore can actually play the position he was drafted to play.

2, Moore makes a couple pathetic plays and he's garbage, Tebow makes a career outta pathetic and the world begs for more.

Btw, I seem to remember most people around here coddling and pampering the shit outta poor little Timmy.