we traded cutler for a second and third round pick!!

[broken12]

after trading our first next year to move into the second round this year what it came down to is we traded cutler to the bears for a second and third round pick....we got ripped!!! a franchise qb for a 2nd and third round pick!!! how in the hell are any of these mcdushbag supporters gonnna defend that..we havent even done anything to improve our front seven..these picks and waste of money in free agency to get rb and defensive backs and turn around and draft the same area with high picks tells me that they players they signed they arent too high on and wasted valuable money on them....forgot about ayers....but one year wonder!

[Greatspirits]

I"m a McDaniels supporter and your right, there's nothing to defend!. This has been one of the worst drafts ever. We gave up Cutler for a bunch of scrubs!!

[Broncospsycho77]

Yeah we did!

[broken12]

building defense from back to front hasnt worked for us for years now and now more of the same!!!

[BigDaddyBronco]

after trading our first next year to move into the second round this year what it came down to is we traded cutler to the bears for a second and third round pick....we got ripped!!! a franchise qb for a 2nd and third round pick!!! how in the hell are any of these mcdushbag supporters gonnna defend that..we havent even done anything to improve our front seven..these picks and waste of money in free agency to get rb and defensive backs and turn around and draft the same area with high picks tells me that they players they signed they arent too high on and wasted valuable money on them....forgot about ayers....but one year wonder!

Uh, we also got a 1st where we picked Robert Ayers and Kyle Orton. Try and keep up.

[Den21vsBal19]

A first, a second and a third

[NameUsedBefore]

Cutler, 5th

for

Ayers, Smith, 3rd and Orton



........

[broken12]

Uh, we also got a 1st where we picked Robert Ayers and Kyle Orton. Try and keep up.

inlcluded

[broken12]

Uh, we also got a 1st where we picked Robert Ayers and Kyle Orton. Try and keep up.

try and read up ayers included,,,orton will be here one year!! doesnt even count!@

[MOtorboat]

inlcluded


try and read up ayers included,,,orton will be here one year!! doesnt even count!@

What?

[Simple Jaded]

after trading our first next year to move into the second round this year what it came down to is we traded cutler to the bears for a second and third round pick....we got ripped!!! a franchise qb for a 2nd and third round pick!!! how in the hell are any of these mcdushbag supporters gonnna defend that..we havent even done anything to improve our front seven..these picks and waste of money in free agency to get rb and defensive backs and turn around and draft the same area with high picks tells me that they players they signed they arent too high on and wasted valuable money on them....forgot about ayers....but one year wonder!

Don't forget about Kyle Kitna and that 2nd round talent they took with the 18th pick.......

[BroncoJoe]

I'm just SO pleased we have so many NFL experts on this forum to tell me what the Broncos should be doing.

BTW - anyone actually employed by an NFL team?

Thought so.

[broken12]

the more i think about it the worse it gets...we had a qb that would have led our franchise for another 10 to 15 years. we trade him for orton who wont be our qb after 2010, de who needs to bulk up to play in 3-4 system. a cb in the second round after trading a 1st round pick to get him and another player to be named.....not just that we signed 3 defensve backs in free agency and spend 2 of our picks in first day of draft on dbs!!!

[NameUsedBefore]

I'm just SO pleased we have so many NFL experts on this forum to tell me what the Broncos should be doing.

BTW - anyone actually employed by an NFL team?

Thought so.

1st round pick > 2nd round pick.


It's basic math, really.

[BroncoJoe]

1st round pick > 2nd round pick.


It's basic math, really.

Who do you work for again? Wal*Mart?

[NameUsedBefore]

Who do you work for again? Wal*Mart?

Sorry, I didn't know you had to do anything other than graduate preschool to know which value is greater.

[broken12]

I'm just SO pleased we have so many NFL experts on this forum to tell me what the Broncos should be doing.

BTW - anyone actually employed by an NFL team?

Thought so.

im no expert but what i do know is that we signed 3 dbs in free agency and turn around and use 2 picks in second round on dbs...which ever way you look at it something is a waste.

[MOtorboat]

1st round pick > 2nd round pick.


It's basic math, really.

Eddie Royal > Marcus Nash.

2nd rounder > 1st rounder.

It's not basic math, really.

[Mike]

Who do you work for again? Wal*Mart?

Joe, you cannot really be defending the course the Broncos took in the 2nd round, can you? It was a disaster of Raider proportions.

[Italianmobstr7]

I'm not upset with the draft at all. There was no defender worth taking at #12, and Moreno is a man child. Ayers is EXTREMELY versatile, and if anyone watched the draft and the highlights they saw it. I don't know what to think on the Alphonso Smith pick. He's pretty short, but looks like a playmaker. I've heard/seen good things, but I said the same thing about Eddie Royal last year. The S from Texas Tech...eh.. I wouldn't take any defensive players from Tech. He does have some speed to COVER though which is kind of nice. His 40 time didn't show it, but he actually can cover recievers. I don't think this has been that bad of a draft. We still have a ton of picks tomorrow. Hopefully Mcd will get some late round gems.

[Tned]

BTW - anyone actually employed by an NFL team?

Thought so.

No, but I stayed at a Mövenpick last week...

[BroncoJoe]

Sorry, I didn't know you had to do anything other than graduate preschool to know which value is greater.

Plenty of 1st round busts, plenty of later round diamonds.

Who's in grade school?

[NameUsedBefore]

Eddie Royal > Marcus Nash.

2nd rounder > 1st rounder.

It's not basic math, really.

Oh shit. Call the FO, MO and tell them Brady was a 6th.

Everyone cool with next year's first for a sixth?

Derpa derp.

[MOtorboat]

Joe, you cannot really be defending the course the Broncos took in the 2nd round, can you? It was a disaster of Raider proportions.

I guess Carolina is just as stupid. :noidea:

[BroncoJoe]

Joe, you cannot really be defending the course the Broncos took in the 2nd round, can you? It was a disaster of Raider proportions.

I will wait and see. Are you a scout by chance? Do you run an NFL franchise?

If the answer is no, you're not qualified to make judgments.

[MOtorboat]

Oh shit. Call the FO, MO and tell them Brady was a 6th.

Everyone cool with next year's first for a sixth?

Derpa derp.

So, just to be clear, it's not basic math.

They had a guy they wanted. They went and got him. Period. Relax.

[Tned]

I will wait and see. Are you a scout by chance? Do you run an NFL franchise?

If the answer is no, you're not qualified to make judgments.

Isn't what you are doing, making judgements? :confused:

[Mike]

I will wait and see. Are you a scout by chance? Do you run an NFL franchise?

If the answer is no, you're not qualified to make judgments.

No, but I am qualified to give my opinion just like everyone else. If you don't like that then you are in the wrong place. And anyone that can't see that giving a 1st for a 2nd is stupid...well...

[NameUsedBefore]

I will wait and see. Are you a scout by chance? Do you run an NFL franchise?

If the answer is no, you're not qualified to make judgments.

Tned, none of us are qualified for this.

Close down the forums.



So, just to be clear, it's not basic math.

They had a guy they wanted. They went and got him. Period. Relax.

Sure. And the 2nd Raiders pick wasn't dumb?

Everyone praying Cutler bombed in Chicago better hope they take them to the friggin' Superbowl to prevent this trade from looking absolutely ridiculous.

[Ravage!!!]

I guess Carolina is just as stupid. :noidea:

actually.. they got a fourth as well...

So they actually showed our FO that a 1st isn't a straight up trade for a 2nd

[Italianmobstr7]

Also, all these people getting mad about us getting DB's are crazy. WE NEED DB's too! Just as much as we need front 7 players.

Our Safeties are Dawkins, Hill, Barrett. Our Cb's are Bailey, Goodman, Jack Williams, Josh Bell. We have no depth so we NEED to draft DB's. I'm not that upset about it. We do have Marcus Thomas, Ronald Fields, Jarvis Moss, Tim Crowder, Darrel Reid, Elvis Dumervil, Kenny Peterson, Carlton Powell, Ryan McBean, Nic Clemons, Matthias Askew, and (Robert Ayers now) at DL. We also have DJ, Boss, Woodyard, Larsen, Green, Haggan, Andra Davis at LB. So we have a lot of players. Not many superstars. We hardly had any DB's at all. They were need picks also. Hopefully we can grab a couple good D studs tomorrow. But in no way am I upset with this draft, except for giving up next years 1st.

[BroncoJoe]

Isn't what you are doing, making judgements? :confused:

Not at all. I will wait to see the product on the field. I will not judge any pick until then. No one knows how any player will perform until the season starts.

Period.

[Greatspirits]

This draft has totally killed any enthusiasm I had for this season! We're headed towards Raideresque ways to build a football team.

[Ravage!!!]

Everyone praying Cutler bombed in Chicago better hope they take them to the friggin' Superbowl to prevent this trade from looking absolutely ridiculous.

hA! thats a good point.... first everyone was talking how they hoped he failed to help our picks.. NOW they are going to become Chicago fans as to not make this STUPID trade to look worse! thats just flat out funny

[hamrob]

I'm certainly not a big fan of Mc-Hoodie yet. That being said, when the dust settles this might not be a bad haul.

We drafted for both need and bpa. I really wanted an LB...and we had plenty of chances...but I guess they feel comfortable with D.J. and Davis in the middle with Ayers at OLB and Doom on the other side...and Moss and what's his name backing up.

The kid from WF is our new nickle back. The kid from Texas Tech is our new Free Safety...ala (a poor man's) Reed.

- Moreno is a stud
- Ayers is a potential stud
- Alphonso Smith is a stud at nickle
- Darcel McBath is a play making Free Safety

I would have rather added...Maulaluga, Laurenitus or Brace...but this isn't all that bad.

I'd give it a C+/B-

I also think our Defense will be better...just with improved coaching. Orton and Simms scare me...but we'll have to see the preseason to get a read on that. The rest of the offense is superb...with Moreno and the rest of our new improved stable.

[spikerman]

It's time to admit that for all intents and purposes, the Broncos gave away Cutler to the Bears. It's similar to how the Rockies gave Holliday to the A's. Whether you're defending the Broncos' draft or not, it can't be denied that they did not bother to address their biggest need.

No, I'm not a scout, but even I can see they needed DT help. Maybe I know more about football than this team's current leadership anyway.

[Watchthemiddle]

Everyone needs to calm down. Did anyone really think that ALL of our original 10 picks would become superstars some day? I sure didn't. Maybe 3-4, and most of the play makers and contributors come in the 4-7th rounds if you ask me.

The first and second rounds are built on hype players. Thats all they are. The later rounds are the hard working long term players for the future.

[Tned]

Not at all. I will wait to see the product on the field. I will not judge any pick until then. No one knows how any player will perform until the season starts.

Period.

Your judging people's opinions and making cracks about where they work and such. Sounds pretty judgemental to me.

[BroncoJoe]

Your judging people's opinions and making cracks about where they work and such. Sounds pretty judgemental to me.

I apologize for the Wal*mart crack.

Not for anything else though. I think it's pretty stupid to judge this draft class, and/or McDaniels, before we even play a game.

Just my opinion, of course.

[spikerman]

Everyone needs to calm down. Did anyone really think that ALL of our original 10 picks would become superstars some day? I sure didn't. Maybe 3-4, and most of the play makers and contributors come in the 4-7th rounds if you ask me.

The first and second rounds are built on hype players. Thats all they are. The later rounds are the hard working long term players for the future.Again, the problem is that Denver did not address its most pressing need despite plenty of opportunity to do so. Instead they traded a first round pick for a player that wasn't the greatest need and probably would have been there for them without the trade.

[Denver27og]

I'm just SO pleased we have so many NFL experts on this forum to tell me what the Broncos should be doing.

BTW - anyone actually employed by an NFL team?

Thought so.


oh wise one bronco joe... it doesnt take a freakin expert to know that our front office efffed alot of things up this year

[Mike]

Everyone needs to calm down. Did anyone really think that ALL of our original 10 picks would become superstars some day? I sure didn't. Maybe 3-4, and most of the play makers and contributors come in the 4-7th rounds if you ask me.

The first and second rounds are built on hype players. Thats all they are. The later rounds are the hard working long term players for the future.

Honestly, the picks don't bother so much. The trade really is what bothers me. I just can't wrap my mind around trading up for a guy who could have made it to the third round and doesn't fit a dire need and then giving up a #1 for it. I just don't get it.

[NameUsedBefore]

I apologize for the Wal*mart crack.

Not for anything else though. I think it's pretty stupid to judge this draft class, and/or McDaniels, before we even play a game.

Just my opinion, of course.

Well, by your own logic you can still judge the numbers.

#1-32 > #37


Right?

Right.

[Watchthemiddle]

Again, the problem is that Denver did not address its most pressing need despite plenty of opportunity to do so. Instead they traded a first round pick for a player that wasn't the greatest need and probably would have been there for them without the trade.

We still have 7 picks left.

:coffee:

[Watchthemiddle]

oh wise one bronco joe... it doesnt take a freakin expert to know that our front office efffed alot of things up this year

And thats different than years past how?

[Tned]

I apologize for the Wal*mart crack.

Not for anything else though. I think it's pretty stupid to judge this draft class, and/or McDaniels, before we even play a game.

Just my opinion, of course.

That's what message boards are about, posting opinions.

What draft hasn't been judged on message boards, newspapers, sports radio, etc.

That's what's done by fans, coaches and media.

[Buff]

Everyone praying Cutler bombed in Chicago better hope they take them to the friggin' Superbowl to prevent this trade from looking absolutely ridiculous.

I heard on the radio that we gave them our #1 next year and kept Chicago's... So I'm still hoping Cutler bombs.

[Mike]

I heard on the radio that we gave them our #1 next year and kept Chicago's... So I'm still hoping Cutler bombs.

I hope that is not true. :tsk:

[spikerman]

We still have 7 picks left.

:coffee:That doesn't excuse passing on players of need to take chances on players that are less critical. By your logic, why don't the Broncos just trade all their picks for the first 4 rounds every year and stockpile picks for rounds 5-7? In the long run there would be more picks.

[Tned]

Honestly, the picks don't bother so much. The trade really is what bothers me. I just can't wrap my mind around trading up for a guy who could have made it to the third round and doesn't fit a dire need and then giving up a #1 for it. I just don't get it.

Agreed.

What I was holding on to, in order to deal with driving Cutler out of town, was two first this year and two next. I could live with Moreno and Ayers, even if surprised. However, the two firsts next year, which included being able to use one on a QB, if Orton isn't as good as McDaniels seems to think, and another on more defensive help or a key need.

Now, trading one of those firsts for an undersized DB that had EVERY commentator on ESPN, NFLN, NFL radio and I am sure every outlet I wasn't following, laughing their ass off and scratching their heads.

[Broncospsycho77]

"Everybody is entitled to their own opinion. It’s just that yours is stupid."
-Unknown

[spikerman]

And thats different than years past how?If you're saying this draft is ok because it's the same as years past then I would argue that we should have kept Shanahan. At least then the Broncos would have had a poor draft AND still have a potentially great quarterback.

[Ravage!!!]

if he was a specacular player, it would be one thing. But this is a player that if he was NOT there at 48, it wouldn't have been a guy that we couldn't replace or find another just like. There could be a guy in the 1st next year that is HEADS above the next guy at his position..... this was just a dumb dumb trade.

Trading away a franchise QB you needed something to give yourself that 'comfort' because we were compensated. Anyone feel compensated with this selection?

[NameUsedBefore]

I don't know how many of you were in the chat room, but Tned was first to report the trade and everyone was like "lulz, ha ha, wutever" etc. That quickly changed... Probably the best/funniest part of the day.

[Watchthemiddle]

if he was a specacular player, it would be one thing. But this is a player that if he was NOT there at 48, it wouldn't have been a guy that we couldn't replace or find another just like. There could be a guy in the 1st next year that is HEADS above the next guy at his position..... this was just a dumb dumb trade.

Trading away a franchise QB you needed something to give yourself that 'comfort' because we were compensated. Anyone feel compensated with this selection?


Let me get back to ....oooo...about the 4th week of the season.

:coffee:

[Tned]

Yea, I think I was called a dumb ass or something to that effect, because you guys thought I was making a bad joke.

[spikerman]

How many want to bet that Brian Dawkins is on the phone with his agent right now saying "Get me the eff back to Philly!"?

[Watchthemiddle]

How does anyone honestly know who will or will not pan out on this board?

How does anyone on here do a mock draft?

You listen to all the talking heads on internet sites, radio, and TV and go along with the hype.

NO ONE knows how its going to pan out. Until the players hit TC and the field it remains to be seen.

Everyone is intittled to their opinion, but it seems like most on here are basing their opinions on other peoples opinions and have not actually seen most of the guys drafted even play.

[spikerman]

How does anyone honestly know who will or will not pan out on this board?

How does anyone on here do a mock draft?

You listen to all the talking heads on internet sites, radio, and TV and go along with the hype.

NO ONE knows how its going to pan out. Until the players hit TC and the field it remains to be seen.

Everyone is intittled to their opinion, but it seems like most on here are basing their opinions on other peoples opinions and have not actually seen most of the guys drafted even play.I'm basing mine on watching every game this team has played for many years and seeing that one of its biggest weaknesses has been undersized/ineffective DTs. Today I saw the team with a lot of opportunity to finally correct that problem pass up chance after chance to do so. I'll admit that I haven't seen a lot of these players play, but I do know that none of them had "DT" after their name and that's why the Broncos failed today.

[Krugan]

if he was a specacular player, it would be one thing. But this is a player that if he was NOT there at 48, it wouldn't have been a guy that we couldn't replace or find another just like. There could be a guy in the 1st next year that is HEADS above the next guy at his position..... this was just a dumb dumb trade.
Trading away a franchise QB you needed something to give yourself that 'comfort' because we were compensated. Anyone feel compensated with this selection?

All that guy would need next year is 4 inches to be heads above!

Okay so it was lame joke, im just trying to keep a positive attitude.

[NameUsedBefore]

Cutler, 5th

for

Ayers, Smith, Quinn, Orton



...

[broken12]

and blocking te lol

[Watchthemiddle]

I'm basing mine on watching every game this team has played for many years and seeing that one of its biggest weaknesses has been undersized/ineffective DTs. Today I saw the team with a lot of opportunity to finally correct that problem pass up chance after chance to do so. I'll admit that I haven't seen a lot of these players play, but I do know that none of them had "DT" after their name and that's why the Broncos failed today.

Thats a very fair statement that I would agree with.

[BroncoJoe]

Well, by your own logic you can still judge the numbers.

#1-32 > #37


Right?

Right.

Wrong.

[Denver27og]

And thats different than years past how?


how??????????? when in the history of the nfl has a team traded away RECORD BREAKING YOUNG FRANCHISE PROBOWL QB?? and completley disregarded our glaring needs of DEFENSE... man front office is smoking crack

[Tned]

Cutler, 5th

for

Ayers, Smith, Quinn, Orton



...

Cutler, 5th, 3rd

for

Ayers, Smith, Quinn, Orton, 4th

Have to add in the extra 3rd we just gave up for Quinn, and the 4th we got back. Not 100% accurate, but we also only got 'half' of Quinn from Chicago.

[NameUsedBefore]

Wrong.

No I'm right.

You see, every single team in the league would take #1-32 over #37.

Would they take, say, Alex Smith over Tom Brady? No. But they're players, not numbers.

We're talking numbers since you said you refuse to "judge" before the players hit the field. Apparently either the numbers can't be judged either -- which is just strange -- or you just fail miserably at basic math.

[BroncoJoe]

No I'm right.

You see, every single team in the league would take #1-32 over #37.

Would they take, say, Alex Smith over Tom Brady? No. But they're players, not numbers.

We're talking numbers since you said you refuse to "judge" before the players hit the field. Apparently either the numbers can't be judged either -- which is just strange -- or you just fail miserably at basic math.

Math has nothing to do with the draft.

[Watchthemiddle]

how??????????? when in the history of the nfl has a team traded away RECORD BREAKING YOUNG FRANCHISE PROBOWL QB?? and completley disregarded our glaring needs of DEFENSE... man front office is smoking crack

Its the Broncos draft curse. It happens every year.

[broken12]

no wonder cutler wanted out!!!

[NameUsedBefore]

Math has nothing to do with the draft.

Nothing?


A) The draft is by numbers.
B) The picks have mathematical values.


You're just being stubborn. If Chicago bombs next year and takes the 1st pick overall, is this trade still cool with you? How about they got 8-8 and have the 16th pick? Still cool?

[BroncoJoe]

Nothing?


A) The draft is by numbers.
B) The picks have mathematical values.


You're just being stubborn. If Chicago bombs next year and takes the 1st pick overall, is this trade still cool with you? How about they got 8-8 and have the 16th pick? Still cool?

No, you're being stubborn. There have been as many 1st round busts as 5th round gems. Who gives a rip where someone is picked. The proof will be on the field, not on the numbers.

[JKcatch724]

I will wait and see. Are you a scout by chance? Do you run an NFL franchise?

If the answer is no, you're not qualified to make judgments.

Not saying I necessarily disagree with you about trusting the choices of the FO, but that's a ridiculously immature thing to say.

We're on an online forum, for Christ's sake.

The point of a forum like this is to judge EVERY SINGLE THING the franchise does. Obviously nobody on here is employed by the NFL, but that doesn't mean they can't voice their opinions.

[MOtorboat]

Edit:

Nevermind...the TE is named Quinn...I apologize. I panicked for a moment.

[NameUsedBefore]

No, you're being stubborn. There have been as many 1st round busts as 5th round gems. Who gives a rip where someone is picked. The proof will be on the field, not on the numbers.


When we talk numbers you say we should judge the players. But then if we try to judge the players you say we can't do that till they hit the field.

By your own logic we shouldn't be upset if Denver trades their whole draft for the last pick in the draft because, who knows, until the player hits the field he could be the best ever. We certainly can't judge until then, and we certainly aren't going to be going by numbers obviously.

Btw, I asked a question.

[Mike]

Wait, what...tornado scare and my internet goes down and QUINN is a BRONCO! WTF...

Both our 3rds to make that happen too.

[Broncospsycho77]

The tight end Quinn.

[BroncoJoe]

Not saying I disagree with you, but that's a ridiculously immature thing to say.

We're on an online forum, for Christ's sake.

The point of a forum like this is to judge EVERY SINGLE THING the franchise does. Obviously nobody on here is employed by the NFL, but that doesn't mean they can't voice their opinions.

Immature? Probably the wrong word there. Yes, we're exchanging thoughts on a forum, but to call this draft a failure, before we even play a game, is, well,....

premature.

[MOtorboat]

Edit:

Nevermind...the TE is named Quinn...I apologize. I panicked for a moment.

Bump...sorry...confused...shit was crazy here the last 45 minutes...

[BroncoJoe]

When we talk numbers you say we should judge the players. But then if we try to judge the players you say we can't do that till they hit the field.

By your own logic we shouldn't be upset if Denver trades their whole draft for the last pick in the draft because, who knows, until the player hits the field he could be the best ever. We certainly can't judge until then, and we certainly aren't going to be going by numbers obviously.

Btw, I asked a question.

That would be a valid point if it actually happened.

Fail.

[Nomad]

Immature? Probably the wrong word there. Yes, we're exchanging thoughts on a forum, but to call this draft a failure, before we even play a game, is, well,....

immature.

What......are you 25 and haven't told anyone??:D

[JKcatch724]

Immature? Probably the wrong word there. Yes, we're exchanging thoughts on a forum, but to call this draft a failure, before we even play a game, is, well,....

immature.

Where did I say this draft was a failure? Go ahead and re-read the first sentence of my post.

[NameUsedBefore]

That would be a valid point if it actually happened.

Fail.

Well you've just admitted I'm right. You obviously didn't realize it so let me point it out:

If that's a valid point, then what is the difference between trading a whole draft for lesser value than one pick for lesser value other than the degree of value?


:coffee:

[BroncoJoe]

Well you've just admitted I'm right. You obviously didn't realize it so let me point it out:

If that's a valid point, then what is the difference between trading a whole draft for lesser value than one pick for lesser value other than the degree of value?


:coffee:

Are you high or something? WTF are you trying to say?

[spikerman]

Bump...sorry...confused...shit was crazy here the last 45 minutes...

Sounds like the Broncos' war room all day.

[NameUsedBefore]

Are you high or something? WTF are you trying to say?

Apparently I have to spell your own shit out.


You say trading the whole draft for lesser value would make my point valid.

Trading one pick for lesser value, however, is a trade of only lesser degree than the previous.


I'll even do it mathematically for you:

A > B

A = entire draft; B = last pick. You: That would be absurd to have B over A!

A = #1-32; B = #37. You: We can't judge till we're on the field! I don't care about numbers!


I'll even do it for the literary folks:

Look at the lengths of stupidity one must go to defend this!

[BroncoJoe]

Apparently I have to spell your own shit out.


You say trading the whole draft for lesser value would make my point valid.

Trading one pick for lesser value, however, is a trade of only lesser degree than the previous.


I'll even do it mathematically for you:

A > B

A = entire draft; B = last pick. You: That would be absurd to have B over A!

A = #1-32; B = #37. You: We can't judge till we're on the field! I don't care about numbers!


I'll even do it for the literary folks:

Look at the lengths of stupidity one must go to defend this!

I think you're completely lost. Good luck with your psychiatrist. Pills are good, NUB. Pills are good.

[BroncoJoe]

So, let's say I buy something for $200k that someone else values at $100k. After a year, my $200k blossoms into $1MM.

Who's the idiot now?

Like I said, nothing can be determined until we see what happens.

[NameUsedBefore]

So, let's say I buy something for $200k that someone else values at $100k. After a year, my $200k blossoms into $1MM.

Who's the idiot now?

Like I said, nothing can be determined until we see what happens.

Occasionally, Joe, someone buys something for a $1 and it "blossoms" into millions. It's called a lottery ticket.

Clearly the stock broker who lost everything to Bear Sterns is an idiot, but the dude with the Confederate flag hanging over his trailer who managed to pay a dollar to a gas station register worker is a genius.

More so, this clearly means all other lottery buyers are geniuses too. Afterall, nothing can be determined until it happens.

Irrationality is preferable to foresight, although I know for a fact you don't believe that when you go to your job every morning instead of, say, scrounging the change under your couch for another lottery ticket.

[BroncoJoe]

Occasionally, Joe, someone buys something for a $1 and it "blossoms" into millions. It's called a lottery ticket.

Clearly the stock broker who lost everything to Bear Sterns is an idiot, but the dude with the Confederate flag hanging over his trailer who managed to pay a dollar to a gas station register worker is a genius.

More so, this clearly means all other lottery buyers are geniuses too. Afterall, nothing can be determined until it happens.

Irrationality is preferable to foresight, although I know for a fact you don't believe that when you go to your job every morning instead of, say, scrounging the change under your couch for another lottery ticket.

Yeah. And I should have befreinded Bill Gates in High School too.

[Bill Devaroe]

I heard on the radio that we gave them our #1 next year and kept Chicago's... So I'm still hoping Cutler bombs.

that is pure arogance. We will lucky to win 4 games.

[LoyalSoldier]

I'm just SO pleased we have so many NFL experts on this forum to tell me what the Broncos should be doing.

BTW - anyone actually employed by an NFL team?

Thought so.

Wow so just because we don't work for an NFL team that doesn't mean we can't comment and have an OPINION on how good or bad a move was?

I guess that also means since we aren't NFL coaches we can't discuss who is the best QB in the league since in our lack of knowledge we obviously can't tell if a QB is good or not. :rolleyes:

Just because we are not working in the business doesn't mean we are completely stupid when it comes to these kinds of things. The only way I see the trade for the 2nd this year even being remotely justifiable is if we have a winning record next year. Even if Smith turns out to be a good corner, if we don't win we basically just screwed our draft choices next year.

[BroncoJoe]

Wow so just because we don't work for an NFL team that doesn't mean we can't comment and have an OPINION on how good or bad a move was?

I guess that also means since we aren't NFL coaches we can't discuss who is the best QB in the league since in our lack of knowledge we obviously can't tell if a QB is good or not. :rolleyes:

Just because we are not working in the business doesn't mean we are completely stupid when it comes to these kinds of things.

You're right, but it also doesn't lend any credibility to you opinions.

[LoyalSoldier]

You're right, but it also doesn't lend any credibility to you opinions.
Credibility? Don't make me laugh. This is a message board on the internet. It isn't like we are writing for ESPN although I am not sure how much credibility there is in there anyways.

We are discussing what we think of the picks with other fans. I wouldn't be writting here if I was going for "creditable"

[BroncoJoe]

Credibility? Don't make me laugh. This is a message board on the internet. It isn't like we are writing for ESPN although I am not sure how much credibility there is in there anyways.

We are discussing what we think of the picks with other fans. I wouldn't be writting here if I was going for "creditable"

My point is that we don't know how these picks are going to turn out. As a fan of the Broncos, I tend to lean toward the positive. Not the negative.

Afterall, I'm not a draft/prospect expert. Neither are any of you.

[Bill Devaroe]

My point is that we don't know how these picks are going to turn out. As a fan of the Broncos, I tend to lean toward the positive. Not the negative.

Afterall, I'm not a draft/prospect expert. Neither are any of you.

I watch a lot of you tube tape,, NFL network and ESPN. I think that I can be considered an expert.

[LoyalSoldier]

My point is that we don't know how these picks are going to turn out. As a fan of the Broncos, I tend to lean toward the positive. Not the negative.

Your right we don't know, but what I do know is the price we payed for a second round draft pick was way too high unless we actually have a winning record next year. If Smith turns out to be anything less than a probowler it could also be seen as a waste.

It isn't that I hate who we have, but how we got them.


Afterall, I'm not a draft/prospect expert. Neither are any of you.

No I am not, but neither are many of the people actually making the picks. The draft is an art few master. Even those being paid to be masters rarely are.

[BroncoJoe]

I watch a lot of you tube tape,, NFL network and ESPN. I think that I can be considered an expert.

OK, Bill.

I hear the Broncos are looking for scouts. Please send your resume to wannabe@denverbroncos.com

tia.

[BroncoJoe]

No I am not, but neither are many of the people actually making the picks. The draft is an art few master.

You're joking, right?

[MOtorboat]

No I am not, but neither are many of the people actually making the picks. The draft is an art few master. Even those being paid to be masters rarely are.

:pound:

[omac]

I'm certainly not a big fan of Mc-Hoodie yet. That being said, when the dust settles this might not be a bad haul.

We drafted for both need and bpa. I really wanted an LB...and we had plenty of chances...but I guess they feel comfortable with D.J. and Davis in the middle with Ayers at OLB and Doom on the other side...and Moss and what's his name backing up.

The kid from WF is our new nickle back. The kid from Texas Tech is our new Free Safety...ala (a poor man's) Reed.

- Moreno is a stud
- Ayers is a potential stud
- Alphonso Smith is a stud at nickle
- Darcel McBath is a play making Free Safety

I would have rather added...Maulaluga, Laurenitus or Brace...but this isn't all that bad.

I'd give it a C+/B-

I also think our Defense will be better...just with improved coaching. Orton and Simms scare me...but we'll have to see the preseason to get a read on that. The rest of the offense is superb...with Moreno and the rest of our new improved stable.

Good points. :salute:

2 points ... would you give up next year's first round pick to move up for a stud nickel in the 2nd round? To give up a 1st round pick, even if it's next years, I'd want that DB to be able to close half the field, the way Champ used to, and the way Asomugah now does. Why give up a first rounder to get a nickel? At worst case, he'd better be our best CB, not just the #2, considering our crucial need in a 3-4 for a NT, and also how some think Maualuga isn't just a beast, but a leader on defense.

Also, would either have been available had we waited instead of reaching? This just reminds me of the reach for Jarvis Moss, and that turned out pretty bad so far.

[LoyalSoldier]

You're joking, right?

What's there to joke about?

I am pointing out that even the so called experts fail quite often. The draft is a crap shoot at best. You only raise the odds by being careful. Even successful teams like the Pats have had miserable failures such has Chad Jackson.

[BroncoJoe]

What's there to joke about?

I am pointing out that even the so called experts fail quite often. The draft is a crap shoot at best. You only raise the odds by being careful. Even successful teams like the Pats have had miserable failures such has Chad Jackson.

So, the people on this board are better?

What's your point?

[JKcatch724]

Some people are too arrogant. I'm on the side of "let's wait and see how these picks turn out" but just because some people hated the way our draft went today doesn't mean they're wrong. And it sure as hell doesn't make you right.

[MOtorboat]

What's there to joke about?

I am pointing out that even the so called experts fail quite often. The draft is a crap shoot at best. You only raise the odds by being careful. Even successful teams like the Pats have had miserable failures such has Chad Jackson.

So maybe, just maybe, we could wait to watch the season before judging the draft...no?

:noidea:

[LoyalSoldier]

So, the people on this board are better?

Never said that.


What's your point?

That just because those people are getting paid for the job doesn't mean their judgment is flawless and can not be questioned.

[BroncoJoe]

Never said that.



That just because those people are getting paid for the job doesn't mean their judgment is flawless and can not be questioned.


Questioned by who? Experts? Who are the experts?

[LoyalSoldier]

So maybe, just maybe, we could wait to watch the season before judging the draft...no?

:noidea:

The funny part is if you guys would actually bother to read my post, I have not said a single thing about what I think about the draft picks themselves.

I have said that I thought we paid too much to get Smith. He might be a good corner, but even if he is we could still be screwed if that pick we traded was a top 10. If we got smith for nearly any other price I may not have had a problem with it. I think a first rounder next year could very well hurt us.

[LoyalSoldier]

Questioned by who? Experts? Who are the experts?

Um maybe the fan base throwing money at the Broncos? :tsk:

[BroncoJoe]

The funny part is if you guys would actually bother to read my post, I have not said a single thing about what I think about the draft picks themselves.

I have said that I thought we paid too much to get Smith. He might be a good corner, but even if he is we could still be screwed if that pick we traded was a top 10.

That's a big matzo ball out there....

[BroncoJoe]

Um maybe the fan base throwing money at the Broncos? :tsk:

Like that's going to stop.

Please.

[LoyalSoldier]

That's a big matzo ball out there....

Well going by last year's team and looking at how much we have done to improve this year, it is still a high possibility we could very well suck next year. Especially if Orton fails to deliver.

[MOtorboat]

The funny part is if you guys would actually bother to read my post, I have not said a single thing about what I think about the draft picks themselves.

I have said that I thought we paid too much to get Smith. He might be a good corner, but even if he is we could still be screwed if that pick we traded was a top 10. If we got smith for nearly any other price I may not have had a problem with it. I think a first rounder next year could very well hurt us.

Right...so the trade wasn't part of the draft...ugh..."I didn't say that." Typical argument.

[aberdien]

McDaniels is quite the jokester so far. Maybe the defensive backs we got can play linebacker.

[BroncoJoe]

Well going by last year's team and looking at how much we have done to improve this year, it is still a high possibility we could very well suck next year. Especially if Orton fails to deliver.

New system, new players, new schemes. No one knows. I'll be the first one to bash the current staff, but until they play a game, let alone a season, I'm optimistic.

[LoyalSoldier]

Right...so the trade wasn't part of the draft..

Um what?!:confused:


.ugh..."I didn't say that." Typical argument.Maybe if you would quit putting words in the mouths of people you wouldn't hear it so much.

[rcsodak]

after trading our first next year to move into the second round this year what it came down to is we traded cutler to the bears for a second and third round pick....we got ripped!!! a franchise qb for a 2nd and third round pick!!! how in the hell are any of these mcdushbag supporters gonnna defend that..we havent even done anything to improve our front seven..these picks and waste of money in free agency to get rb and defensive backs and turn around and draft the same area with high picks tells me that they players they signed they arent too high on and wasted valuable money on them....forgot about ayers....but one year wonder!

Firstly, denver has already gone through an "as good as" ordeal, so why would you compare future draftpicks....NOT EVEN IN THE SAME POSITIONS, to losing cut-n-run'er?
Those picks were received IN COMPENSATION for a player....which has nothing to do with what is received.

I understand they traded Denver's original pick...NOT chicago's.
So your very first sentence is not a true statement.

Secondly, since your entire rant was based on that, I guess nothing else needs said.

Did I miss anything?

[MOtorboat]

Um what?!:confused:

Maybe if you would quit putting words in the mouths of people you wouldn't hear it so much.

So, you're not criticizing the draft?

Right...

Some people need to learn what the word "imply" means.

[LoyalSoldier]

So, you're not criticizing the draft?

Right...

I am not criticizing the players, but the method we used to obtain those players. For the price we payed the only way it is justified is if Smith is a probowl corner or we have a low enough draft spot next year(aka lot of winning). Smith could very well be a good corner, but for this to be a good deal he must be a great corner. That is too much of a gamble.


Some people need to learn what the word "imply" means.

The problem is you tend to read the wrong "implied meaning" into posts all too often.

[MOtorboat]

I am not criticizing the players, but the method we used to obtain those players. For the price we payed the only way it is justified is if Smith is a probowl corner or we have a low enough draft spot next year(aka lot of winning). Smith could very well be a good corner, but for this to be a good deal he must be a great corner.



The problem is you tend to read the wrong "implied meaning" into posts all too often.

So criticizing the way we acquire players is not criticizing our draft? OK...noted.

You are criticizing our draft. Nowhere did I say you were bashing the players, you are bashing the organization for its draft as a whole. What part of that do you not understand?

You are criticizing the draft. Period.

[LoyalSoldier]

So criticizing the way we acquire players is not criticizing our draft? OK...noted.

You are criticizing our draft. Nowhere did I say you were bashing the players, you are bashing the organization for its draft as a whole. What part of that do you not understand?

You are criticizing the draft. Period.

Ok fine I am. Happy?

At any rate, the trades were the only part of the draft I really hated. The first round picks were ok.

[MOtorboat]

What's there to joke about?

I am pointing out that even the so called experts fail quite often. The draft is a crap shoot at best. You only raise the odds by being careful. Even successful teams like the Pats have had miserable failures such has Chad Jackson.


So maybe, just maybe, we could wait to watch the season before judging the draft...no?

:noidea:

That's my point.

Apparently we can't read.

[LoyalSoldier]

That's my point.

Apparently we can't read.

So I misread one post. Oh well I'm human. As if you never have.

[MOtorboat]

So I misread one post. Oh well I'm human. As if you never have.

Just maybe, maybe, you'd quit accusing me of doing the same.

[LoyalSoldier]

Just maybe, maybe, you'd quit accusing me of doing the same.

If you would quit doing it so much then yes maybe I could, but it has happened on more than one occasion and not just my posts either.

[NameUsedBefore]

I don't even know why half of you are even here at all during the offseason given the rejection of discussion.

[Broncospsycho77]

Shut up NUB.