Thoughts From The Coach - Part 1

[Denver Native (Carol)]

http://blog.denverbroncos.com/mrice/thoughts-from-the-coach-part-1/

The Broncos and quarterback Jay Cutler could never get on the same page. Now, after the blockbuster trade that occurred on Friday, April 3, Cutler is in Chicago and the Broncos are moving on with quarterback Kyle Orton, an extra first-round and third-round draft pick this year and another first-rounder in 2010.

There has been much speculation about who said what to whom and when. Broncos Head Coach Josh McDaniels spoke with Dave Logan and Lois Melkonian on 850 KOA’s “The Ride Home” on the day the Broncos made the trade. I wanted to share some of the questions and responses because they hit on many of the key issues in this whole saga. Part one of that interview follows.

850 KOA attempted to speak with Jay Cutler, but text messages went without response on two occasions, once before the trade and once immediately after the deal.

KOA: After you took the job, when the initial trade possibility was discussed with whomever, with Jay Cutler as a possibility, did you and the Broncos initiate that trade conversation or did other teams?

JM: We never initiated any conversations. We were busy preparing for free agency. That was where our focus was. We never had any desire and we had no plan to do anything like that (trading Cutler). The day or two before free agency opened, people started to call and initiate some conversation about entertaining a possibility of a three-way trade. We had conversations. Some were very short and there were a couple of other conversations that we actually took part in. That’s what happened. Things started happening faster on the other end (but) nothing ever came to the point where we were considering an opportunity or anything. Then the deal was done on the other side (Cassell traded to the Chiefs). We called Jay and (his agent) Bus (Cook) and let them know what happened. The communication from that point forward started to go the other way.

KOA: Would it be curious that other NFL teams would call the Broncos and ask, “We’re thinking about the possibility of maybe trying to put a package together for a guy like Jay Cutler?” With some of the other teams that have a top quarterback, do conversations like that take place a lot?

JM: I’m not sure. I would say this was a little bit of a different situation based on my history and where I’d come from. I think the entire line of speaking between some other team and our organization was based on the fact that they knew Matt Cassell had played for me in New England. I think that was the only reason that conversations took place and I think that was the only reason they felt like they might have a chance to broker some kind of a deal. But again, nothing ever got even close (to getting done) but they wanted to call and I think that’s exactly why.

KOA: At any point during this standoff, did you think about forcing the issue and making him (Cutler) sit down and talk with you?

JM: We had a conversation on the phone and he (Cutler) wouldn’t do anything without Bus Cook. We requested numerous times to have an opportunity to sit down and speak to Jay and discuss everything, whatever he wanted to talk about and some of the things we wanted to talk about. It never got to the point where they would allow the communication to go any further. It broke down to the point where (in) the last weeks he just refused to respond to anything, including (Broncos’ owner) Pat Bowlen. When you go to that length to show your displeasure, I think you’re really sending a clear message to the organization that you don’t want to play there any more.

KOA: (In) your last conversation with Jay Cutler, Bus Cook was there and (so was) Brian Xanders of the Broncos, in the sit down meeting. Did the Matt Cassell situation come up in that conversation in that room and is there a possibility Jay Cutler left that meeting (believing) that you, if given an opportunity, might still consummate a trade for Matt Cassell?

JM: There’s no way he could have left the room thinking that. We discussed what had happened. We discussed how to go forward from there. He understood exactly what had happened that couple days. He agreed and understood why there may have been some kind of connection with some other team trying to broker a three-way trade. He understood that completely. Then the meeting ended. The tone of the conversation while we were in the meeting was totally different that what it was represented afterwards.

KOA: So you left the meeting thinking this is going to work and this is going to be my quarterback?

JM: I was waiting for a phone call later that afternoon and that was clearly stated and communicated and obviously not executed.

KOA: When you took the Broncos job, when you sat down and talked with Pat Bowlen, did Pat ask you your opinion on what you thought of Jay Cutler and what direction you were going in with respect to the offense?

JM: A lot of things came up when we had discussions before I was hired and Jay was part of those discussions. But Jay Cutler was a big reason why this position was very attractive to me. As a person who has worked on the offensive side of the ball the last five years, coming to a place with a quarterback like Jay Cutler was exciting. That’s why I go back to the fact that we never initiated or we would never have any reason to initiate it (the original trade talks) because we felt comfortable with that. Pat knew what direction we were going to go. We were going to bring our system here and implement it. We have players here that can fit in comparably to the players that I’ve worked with in the past and I’m excited to work with that entire group. The conversations were all positive about that stuff and we were looking forward to doing that.

Later this week, we’ll share more from Coach McDaniels’ interview with 850 KOA.

Thanks for reading,
Mike

[LRtagger]

Sounds more and more like Cutler just found an opening to try to get a new contract and stuck with a plan to get that contract.

[BroncoJoe]

It's pretty clear to me Jay wanted out immediately after Shanahan and Bates were let go.

[Medford Bronco]

Sounds more and more like Cutler just found an opening to try to get a new contract and stuck with a plan to get that contract.

that is what I said a long time ago. I felt that that POS Bus Cook was angling that way.

[honz]

You can listen to the whole interview here (http://www.broncosradionetwork.com/cc-common/podcast/single_podcast.html?podcast=Interviews.xml).

[Broncolingus]

that is what I said a long time ago. I felt that that POS Bus Cook was angling that way.

100% agree, brother...

I think had that jack-off not been involved, Cutler would've still be a Bronco today.

[OrangeHoof]

If McDiapers was committed to Cutler and he was really excited to work with Cutler, then phone calls inquiring about a trade should have lasted no longer than 10 seconds. How long does it take to say "no, we're not interested."?

Cutler and Cook may have been angling for a new contract but McDiapers opened the door for them by not being adamant about who their starting QB was.

[BroncoJoe]

If McDiapers was committed to Cutler and he was really excited to work with Cutler, then phone calls inquiring about a trade should have lasted no longer than 10 seconds. How long does it take to say "no, we're not interested."?

Cutler and Cook may have been angling for a new contract but McDiapers opened the door for them by not being adamant about who their starting QB was.

Idiotic plays on a person's name make those stating them look stupid.

[NameUsedBefore]

After the sit down the story was that Cutler had been waiting for McDaniels to call him up after.

This breakdown in communication is ridiculous and no side has shown me any reason to think their story is legit.

[getlynched47]

I could care less what the coach has to say.

The only way he's going to prove that trading Cutler was in the best interest of the team is if he has a stellar 2009 draft class.

Talk is cheap McDipShit :coffee:

[BroncoJoe]

I could care less what the coach has to say.

The only way he's going to prove that trading Cutler was in the best interest of the team is if he has a stellar 2009 draft class.

Talk is cheap McDipShit :coffee:


Idiotic plays on a person's name make those stating them look stupid.

Huh.

[ikillz0mbies]

I could care less what the coach has to say.

The only way he's going to prove that trading Cutler was in the best interest of the team is if he has a stellar 2009 draft class.

Talk is cheap McDipShit :coffee:

And if the Broncos have a stellar 09-10 season, will you still be calling him McDipShit?

[MasterShake]

Knock off the personal stuff,:focus:

[getlynched47]

And if the Broncos have a stellar 09-10 season, will you still be calling him McDipShit?

Absolutely. I'm not obligated to like the head coach because I'm a Denver Broncos fan.

The fact is that he got rid of one of my favorite players, and I don't like it.

But what's done is done, so I hope he does good in the draft and wins. That's all I ask from him.

[Thnikkaman]

I could care less what the coach has to say.

The only way he's going to prove that trading Cutler was in the best interest of the team is if he has a stellar 2009 draft class.

Talk is cheap McDipShit :coffee:

So were you a fly on the wall for the whole situation? Do you know exactly what happened?

Its great that you have an opinion about the whole situation, but it would be nice if you would stop crying over spilled milk.

[Denver Native (Carol)]

I could care less what the coach has to say.

The only way he's going to prove that trading Cutler was in the best interest of the team is if he has a stellar 2009 draft class.

Talk is cheap McDipShit :coffee:

I first supported Cutler, but the more and more I read, I really think he caused the trade - or his agent caused it. Last night Rod Mackey, on Overtime, ran a sit down conversation with McD, and he point blank ask McD if he had informed Jay of the trade talk, and McD, without hesitation stated that after he received the call on Feb 28th, he informed both Jay and Cook.

[getlynched47]

So were you a fly on the wall for the whole situation? Do you know exactly what happened?

Its great that you have an opinion about the whole situation, but it would be nice if you would stop crying over spilled milk.

How is that crying? I don't have an obligation to like the head coach because I'm a Bronco fan. I hate McDaniels. All I'm saying is that he needs to have a great draft to make this Jay Cutler trade worth while.

The Cutler ordeal is over, I'm just hoping that we come out of the trade winners.

[Thnikkaman]

How is that crying? I don't have an obligation to like the head coach because I'm a Bronco fan. I hate McDaniels. All I'm saying is that he needs to have a great draft to make this Jay Cutler trade worth while.

The Cutler ordeal is over, I'm just hoping that we come out of the trade winners.

The perception of your hatred for McDaniels is all about this Cutler fiasco. He hasn't coached one game yet.

You see, you are saying one thing yet doing another.

[MasterShake]

How is that crying? I don't have an obligation to like the head coach because I'm a Bronco fan. I hate McDaniels. All I'm saying is that he needs to have a great draft to make this Jay Cutler trade worth while.

The Cutler ordeal is over, I'm just hoping that we come out of the trade winners.

Its fine to hate the coach now, but would you change your mind if we have a good season? It just seems a little silly to bury the hatchet before the tree even grows. I miss Cutler too, but I still hope the best for the Broncos. I think you do too, just seems a bit strange to jump so strongly to one side. Nothing Cutler did gave me any indication he wanted to stay, and I really wanted to believe he did.

[honz]

You can listen to the whole interview here (http://http://a1135.g.akamai.net/f/1135/18227/1h/cchannel.download.akamai.com/18227/podcast/DENVER-CO/KOA2-IP/4-3-09%20Josh%20McDaniels%20on%20TRH.mp3?CPROG=PCAST&MARKET=DENVER-CO&NG_FORMAT=newstalksports&SITE_ID=3906&STATION_ID=KOA2-IP&PCAST_AUTHOR=Broncos_Radio_Team&PCAST_CAT=Spoken_Word&PCAST_TITLE=Bronocos_Radio_Interviews).

I guess this was a faulty link...

Just go here and it's the first interview listed at the top...

http://www.broncosradionetwork.com/cc-common/podcast/single_podcast.html?podcast=Interviews.xml

[getlynched47]

The perception of your hatred for McDaniels is all about this Cutler fiasco. He hasn't coached one game yet.

You see, you are saying one thing yet doing another.

So?

I'm not happy that Cutler was traded. I'm not happy that McDaniels hasn't coached one game in the NFL, yet has managed to get rid of the 25 year old Pro Bowl QB. What was the point of getting rid of Mike Leach? How does McDaniels believe that Buckhalter can be a featured running back? Why does he think that our defense will be better with castoff, 2nd tier defensive players and a Defensive Back set all over 30?

The Cutler ordeal is not the only reason I dislike McDaniels. I have a right to dislike McDaniels.

I didn't bring up the Cutler ordeal, I simply said that McDaniels needs to score in this draft or people will want to rip his head off for trading Cutler.

[getlynched47]

Its fine to hate the coach now, but would you change your mind if we have a good season? It just seems a little silly to bury the hatchet before the tree even grows. I miss Cutler too, but I still hope the best for the Broncos. I think you do too, just seems a bit strange to jump so strongly to one side. Nothing Cutler did gave me any indication he wanted to stay, and I really wanted to believe he did.

By all means I want the Broncos to succeed. I want us to come out winners in this trade. I want us to win games. But McDaniels just isn't my kind of guy. I'm not rooting against the Broncos or hoping that McDaniels fails, but I just don't like McDaniels.

I hope we score HUGE in the draft and all these changes McDaniels makes up are worth while, but I'm not going to hop onto his bandwagon. He hasn't coached an NFL game.

[Bronco Bible]

If McDiapers was committed to Cutler and he was really excited to work with Cutler, then phone calls inquiring about a trade should have lasted no longer than 10 seconds. How long does it take to say "no, we're not interested."?

Cutler and Cook may have been angling for a new contract but McDiapers opened the door for them by not being adamant about who their starting QB was.

Only a damn fool would not listen to the offer IMO, maybe they would not intend to take or make a deal....but ya gotta listen:coffee:

[MasterShake]

By all means I want the Broncos to succeed. I want us to come out winners in this trade. I want us to win games. But McDaniels just isn't my kind of guy. I'm not rooting against the Broncos or hoping that McDaniels fails, but I just don't like McDaniels.

I hope we score HUGE in the draft and all these changes McDaniels makes up are worth while, but I'm not going to hop onto his bandwagon. He hasn't coached an NFL game.

I'm no means on the bandwagon for McDaniels, but I can see your concern. Hopefully we will just win this season, that will solve a lot of problems! I know I will feel better! :lol:

[LawDog]

It was more than just listening to phone calls. He says in the interview that some calls were short and a couple of others that they participated in. Plus, McDaniels said at the time that they had been late to the dance (http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_11944006). I think that as more information regarding Cutler's conduct has come to light after the trade, it is clear that he was manipulating the situation, however, I also think that McDaniels is still trying to spin this whole thing in his favor.

Whatever Coach, just don't jack up the draft, put a solid team on the field and the fans will come around.

[Tned]

Sounds more and more like Cutler just found an opening to try to get a new contract and stuck with a plan to get that contract.

You never really know who to believe in these "he said, she said.".

I'm guess McDaniels could have handled things better, but lacks the experience.

It sure seems like Cutler and Cook made up their mind they either wanted out, or were going to try and use this to get an extension.

However, if Cutler really refused to answer Bowlen's call, I find that inexcusable.

[BroncoJoe]

So?

I'm not happy that Cutler was traded. I'm not happy that McDaniels hasn't coached one game in the NFL, yet has managed to get rid of the 25 year old Pro Bowl QB. What was the point of getting rid of Mike Leach? How does McDaniels believe that Buckhalter can be a featured running back? Why does he think that our defense will be better with castoff, 2nd tier defensive players and a Defensive Back set all over 30?

The Cutler ordeal is not the only reason I dislike McDaniels. I have a right to dislike McDaniels.

I didn't bring up the Cutler ordeal, I simply said that McDaniels needs to score in this draft or people will want to rip his head off for trading Cutler.

Stopped reading after that statement.

[Tned]

The Cutler ordeal is over, I'm just hoping that we come out of the trade winners.

We will come out winners. Once we move to BearsForums.com on Friday, we will be the winners of the trade!!! :D

[BroncoJoe]

I'd expect a comment like that from you.

Let me try and communicate with you:

durrrr.........duh.........durrrr....huh.....dur.. ........ugh.......duh....huh.....

Please excuse me, speaking "idiot" is not my specialty but I tried my best to communicate with you :salute:

"well, you know, it's like, ya know we didn't, ya know perform as good as, ya know, we could have."

- Jay Cutler

[MOtorboat]

[850 KOA attempted to speak with Jay Cutler, but text messages went without response on two occasions, once before the trade and once immediately after the deal.

:pound:

[turftoad]

Stopped reading after that statement.

AFC Pro Bowl Roster 2009:

AFC (starers, followed by their reserves)

QB -- Peyton Manning, Colts. Jay Cutler, Broncos, Brett Favre, Jets.
RB -- Thomas Jones, Jets. Chris Johnson, Titans. Ronnie Brown, Dolphins.
FB -- Le'Ron McClain, Ravens.
WR -- Andre Johnson, Texans and Brandon Marshall, Broncos; Reggie Wayne, Colts. Wes Welker, Patriots.
TE -- Tony Gonzalez, Chiefs. Antonio Gates, Chargers.
T -- Joe Thomas, Browns and Jason Peters, Bills. Michael Roos, Titans.
G -- Alan Faneca, Jets and Kris Dielman, Chargers. Brian Waters, Chiefs.
C -- Kevin Mawae, Titans. Nick Mangold, Jets.
DE -- Mario Williams, Texans and Dwight Freeney, Colts. Robert Mathis, Colts.
DT -- Albert Haynesworth, Titans and Kris Jenkins, Jets. Shaun Rogers, Browns.
OLB -- James Harrison, Steelers and Joey Porter, Dolphins. Terrell Suggs, Ravens.
MLB -- Ray Lewis, Ravens. James Farrior, Steelers.
CB -- Nnamdi Asomugha, Raiders and Courtland Finnegan, Titans. Darrelle Revis, Jets.
S -- Ed Reed, Ravens and Troy Polamalu, Steelers. Chris Hope, Titans.
K -- Stephan Gostkowski, Patriots.
P -- Shane Lechler, Raiders.
KR -- Leon Washington, Jets.
ST -- Brendon Ayanbadejo, Ravens.

[BroncoJoe]

AFC Pro Bowl Roster 2009:

AFC (starers, followed by their reserves)

QB -- Peyton Manning, Colts. Jay Cutler, Broncos, Brett Favre, Jets.
RB -- Thomas Jones, Jets. Chris Johnson, Titans. Ronnie Brown, Dolphins.
FB -- Le'Ron McClain, Ravens.
WR -- Andre Johnson, Texans and Brandon Marshall, Broncos; Reggie Wayne, Colts. Wes Welker, Patriots.
TE -- Tony Gonzalez, Chiefs. Antonio Gates, Chargers.
T -- Joe Thomas, Browns and Jason Peters, Bills. Michael Roos, Titans.
G -- Alan Faneca, Jets and Kris Dielman, Chargers. Brian Waters, Chiefs.
C -- Kevin Mawae, Titans. Nick Mangold, Jets.
DE -- Mario Williams, Texans and Dwight Freeney, Colts. Robert Mathis, Colts.
DT -- Albert Haynesworth, Titans and Kris Jenkins, Jets. Shaun Rogers, Browns.
OLB -- James Harrison, Steelers and Joey Porter, Dolphins. Terrell Suggs, Ravens.
MLB -- Ray Lewis, Ravens. James Farrior, Steelers.
CB -- Nnamdi Asomugha, Raiders and Courtland Finnegan, Titans. Darrelle Revis, Jets.
S -- Ed Reed, Ravens and Troy Polamalu, Steelers. Chris Hope, Titans.
K -- Stephan Gostkowski, Patriots.
P -- Shane Lechler, Raiders.
KR -- Leon Washington, Jets.
ST -- Brendon Ayanbadejo, Ravens.

Total misnomer. He didn't deserve it, and if the voting took place at the end of the season, he wouldn't have been a "Pro-Bowl" QB.

P.S. I'm glad he won a popularity contest.

[turftoad]

total misnomer. He didn't deserve it, and if the voting took place at the end of the season, he wouldn't have been a "pro-bowl" qb.


afc pro bowl roster 2009:

afc (starers, followed by their reserves)

qb -- peyton manning, colts. jay cutler, broncos, brett favre, jets.
Rb -- thomas jones, jets. Chris johnson, titans. Ronnie brown, dolphins.
Fb -- le'ron mcclain, ravens.
Wr -- andre johnson, texans and brandon marshall, broncos; reggie wayne, colts. Wes welker, patriots.
Te -- tony gonzalez, chiefs. Antonio gates, chargers.
T -- joe thomas, browns and jason peters, bills. Michael roos, titans.
G -- alan faneca, jets and kris dielman, chargers. Brian waters, chiefs.
C -- kevin mawae, titans. Nick mangold, jets.
De -- mario williams, texans and dwight freeney, colts. Robert mathis, colts.
Dt -- albert haynesworth, titans and kris jenkins, jets. Shaun rogers, browns.
Olb -- james harrison, steelers and joey porter, dolphins. Terrell suggs, ravens.
Mlb -- ray lewis, ravens. James farrior, steelers.
Cb -- nnamdi asomugha, raiders and courtland finnegan, titans. Darrelle revis, jets.
S -- ed reed, ravens and troy polamalu, steelers. Chris hope, titans.
K -- stephan gostkowski, patriots.
P -- shane lechler, raiders.
Kr -- leon washington, jets.
St -- brendon ayanbadejo, ravens.

:d :d

[BroncoJoe]

:d :d

Turf, if you weren't a Jay Cutler ball hanger, you could come up with other QB's much more deserving of the Pro-Bowl than Jay Cutler.

[Tned]

Total misnomer. He didn't deserve it, and if the voting took place at the end of the season, he wouldn't have been a "Pro-Bowl" QB.

P.S. I'm glad he won a popularity contest.

Totally agree, it was the west coast bias that got him the nod over Rivers.... Errr, well maybe the no-coast bias... :lol:

Seriously, Rivers should have gotten the bid. I hate Rivers, but he deserved it more.

[Simple Jaded]

Why do people care what we call McDaniels?.......It's nothing personal to you.......

[BroncoJoe]

Totally agree, it was the west coast bias that got him the nod over Rivers.... Errr, well maybe the no-coast bias... :lol:

Seriously, Rivers should have gotten the bid. I hate Rivers, but he deserved it more.

You could argue Chad Pennington as well. Cutler and Favre in the Pro-Bowl was a complete joke.

[Tned]

You could argue Chad Pennington as well. Cutler and Favre in the Pro-Bowl was a complete joke.

I thought Favre was a complete Joke, Cutler was good enough to be a Pro-Browler, but others were more deserving.

That will all change when he kicks ass as a Bear this year.

[BroncoJoe]

I thought Favre was a complete Joke, Cutler was good enough to be a Pro-Browler, but others were more deserving.

That will all change when he kicks ass as a Bear this year.

OK, maybe not a complete joke, but seriously. 18 INT's, five fumbles (not all lost, but it cost the Broncos). That's 23 times he gave the other team an opportunity to score.

[turftoad]

Turf, if you weren't a Jay Cutler ball hanger, you could come up with other QB's much more deserving of the Pro-Bowl than Jay Cutler.

I know he's not the Broncos QB anymore. I can deal with that.

I also know, he's a 25yr old Pro Bowl QB with a bunch of future potential. I also know he'll be playing for 10 more years and he's only going to get better.

The whole sitch with him and McD pisses me off.

You can be pisses at Jay for whinning all you want. It wan't ALL his fault. It could have been handled better.

You can't say that at 25yrs old he wasn't already a good player. IMO, in 4-5 more years he's going to be a great player.

I would have liked to see him in orange and blue when he becomes great.

I have moved on but can still be pissed about it. It's my right.

That said, GO KYLE ORTON !! :eek:

[Tned]

OK, maybe not a complete joke, but seriously. 18 INT's, five fumbles (not all lost, but it cost the Broncos). That's 23 times he gave the other team an opportunity to score.

Most of those fumbles were the Wegman's or the RB's fault.

[Tned]

I know he's not the Broncos QB anymore. I can deal with that.

I also know, he's a 25yr old Pro Bowl QB with a bunch of future potential. I also know he'll be playing for 10 more years and he's only going to get better.

The whole sitch with him and McD pisses me off.

You can be pisses at Jay for whinning all you want. It wan't ALL his fault. It could have been handled better.

You can't say that at 25yrs old he wasn't already a good player. IMO, in 4-5 more years he's going to be a great player.

I would have liked to see him in orange and blue when he becomes great.

I have moved on but can still be pissed about it. It's my right.

That said, GO KYLE ORTON !! :eek:

Yes, it's easy to blame it all on Cutler, but the reality is that an experienced head coach would likely never have let it go this far.

[OrangeHoof]

Only a damn fool would not listen to the offer IMO, maybe they would not intend to take or make a deal....but ya gotta listen:coffee:

Why? Do the Colts listen when someone calls and wants to trade for Peyton Manning? Do the Vikings listen when someone wants to trade for Adrian Peterson? No, you politely tell them "stop wasting my time" and hang up the phone - if you're committed to your quarterback the way the head coach claims he was.

[turftoad]

OK, maybe not a complete joke, but seriously. 18 INT's, five fumbles (not all lost, but it cost the Broncos). That's 23 times he gave the other team an opportunity to score.

Again, he's only 25yrs old. Ya think he might improve there.

[Tned]

Why? Do the Colts listen when someone calls and wants to trade for Peyton Manning? Do the Vikings listen when someone wants to trade for Adrian Peterson? No, you politely tell them "stop wasting my time" and hang up the phone - if you're committed to your quarterback the way the head coach claims he was.

Young, rookie head coach enamored with 'his' guy.

[honz]

AFC Pro Bowl Roster 2009:

AFC (starers, followed by their reserves)

QB -- Peyton Manning, Colts. Jay Cutler, Broncos, Brett Favre, Jets.
RB -- Thomas Jones, Jets. Chris Johnson, Titans. Ronnie Brown, Dolphins.
FB -- Le'Ron McClain, Ravens.
WR -- Andre Johnson, Texans and Brandon Marshall, Broncos; Reggie Wayne, Colts. Wes Welker, Patriots.
TE -- Tony Gonzalez, Chiefs. Antonio Gates, Chargers.
T -- Joe Thomas, Browns and Jason Peters, Bills. Michael Roos, Titans.
G -- Alan Faneca, Jets and Kris Dielman, Chargers. Brian Waters, Chiefs.
C -- Kevin Mawae, Titans. Nick Mangold, Jets.
DE -- Mario Williams, Texans and Dwight Freeney, Colts. Robert Mathis, Colts.
DT -- Albert Haynesworth, Titans and Kris Jenkins, Jets. Shaun Rogers, Browns.
OLB -- James Harrison, Steelers and Joey Porter, Dolphins. Terrell Suggs, Ravens.
MLB -- Ray Lewis, Ravens. James Farrior, Steelers.
CB -- Nnamdi Asomugha, Raiders and Courtland Finnegan, Titans. Darrelle Revis, Jets.
S -- Ed Reed, Ravens and Troy Polamalu, Steelers. Chris Hope, Titans.
K -- Stephan Gostkowski, Patriots.
P -- Shane Lechler, Raiders.
KR -- Leon Washington, Jets.
ST -- Brendon Ayanbadejo, Ravens.

Derek Anderson...

[MOtorboat]

Why? Do the Colts listen when someone calls and wants to trade for Peyton Manning? Do the Vikings listen when someone wants to trade for Adrian Peterson? No, you politely tell them "stop wasting my time" and hang up the phone - if you're committed to your quarterback the way the head coach claims he was.

Just out of curiosity...how do you know that they don't listen to trade offers for those players?

Don't forget this was a coaching change. I think we're being a little naive if we don't think that people called Tony Dungy and inquired about Peyton Manning in 2002.

Obviously, Dungy did the same thing McDaniels did initially, at the time, and said no. The difference is that Peyton Manning didn't flip out and go to the media.

[BroncoJoe]

Again, he's only 25yrs old. Ya think he might improve there.

Honestly? I don't. Other "gunslingers" didn't, i.e. Favre.

Orton's only 26. Started less (or near as many) games than Cutler. Ya think he might improve?

[Simple Jaded]

OK, maybe not a complete joke, but seriously. 18 INT's, five fumbles (not all lost, but it cost the Broncos). That's 23 times he gave the other team an opportunity to score.

Cutler threw more Int's because he threw more passes, if Orton's Int% were held true, he would have had 16 Int's with 616 attempts.

By his 466th attempt, Jay Cutler had 22 TD's and 14 Int's.......

[BroncoJoe]

Cutler threw more Int's because he threw more passes, if Orton's Int% were held true, he would have had 16 Int's with 616 attempts.......

Still less than 18.

[Northman]

Bus Cook or not Jay is a big boy and allowed all of this to transpire. Jay could of come in at anytime to talk to management and decided to play the ignore game not only to them but his own teammates. Accountability.

[Northman]

Derek Anderson...

Ouch. :lol:

[Simple Jaded]

Still less than 18.

By two.......wow.......

[BroncoJoe]

By two.......wow.......

Still less.

Wow.

[Simple Jaded]

Still less.

Wow.

You the one making a case for 18 being a lot, when it's not that of a deal.

If River had 616 attempts he would have had 14 Int's (almost 16 if you count his Int% including the playoffs) , at what point between 14 and 18 does a QB become what little you think of Cutler?.......

[BroncoJoe]

You the one making a case for 18 being a lot, when it's not that of a deal.

If River had 616 attempts he would have had 14 Int's (almost 16 if you count his Int% including the playoffs) , at what point between 14 and 18 does a QB become what little you think of Cutler?.......

18 is a lot. You can play percentages all you want. Fact is, Cutler threw 18 interceptions. Put the ball on the ground five times.

I wanted him to stay, but he wasn't the perfect QB that you all claim him to be.

[getlynched47]

18 is a lot. You can play percentages all you want. Fact is, Cutler threw 18 interceptions. Put the ball on the ground five times.

I wanted him to stay, but he wasn't the perfect QB that you all claim him to be.

Better than Kyle Orton or Matt Cassel......

[Simple Jaded]

18 is a lot. You can play percentages all you want. Fact is, Cutler threw 18 interceptions. Put the ball on the ground five times.

I wanted him to stay, but he wasn't the perfect QB that you all claim him to be.

No it isn't, that's the point, and you have to play percentages to be fair.......Manning, for example, threw 19 or more Int's three times in his career, he had 58 Int's in his first three years in the league and at no time was he even close to throwing 616 times. He has a career average of 2.8%, that's saying a lot considering he's had four seasons of 10 or less.

You seem to be acting as if Int's are exclusive to Jay Cutler, and worse yet, you don't even make time to put it all into perspective.

And to be fair, I never said Cutler was perfect either.......

[Denver Native (Carol)]

I found this article interesting:

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_12051212

And so, according to Pat Bowlen's official decree, the Broncos have a Pro Bowl quarterback for sale.

Now all they have to hope is that the next Josh McDaniels-Brian Xanders trade doesn't turn out like the last one they tried to make. That's how they got in this mess in the first place.

The kid coach and GM tried to swing a deal for Matt Cassel and, well, you know the rest of the story. That would have been the first trade consummated by the two in their new roles. Instead, their first deal will involve shipping Jay Cutler to the highest bidder.

They may have some help along the way. His name is Bus Cook.

Cook, Cutler's Hattiesburg, Miss.-based agent, didn't return the latest phone call from The Post. But if the Cutler deal is anything like other major NFL trades in recent years, he'll be in the middle of it.

Cook could impact where Cutler lands. That's assuming the Broncos give him permission to talk to other teams, which is typical when a disgruntled player has asked for a trade.

NFL insiders contacted by The Post, among them former Broncos general manager Ted Sundquist, envision Cook being involved.

"In the past, when we tried to trade guys, we did exactly the same thing," Sundquist said. "It's like, 'We'll work our end, you work your end, and we'll see what we come up with, what deal makes the most sense for either side.'

"It's one more line in the water. That's the best analogy."

The Broncos have no obligation to let Cook talk to other teams, but they've let agents get involved before. When they traded Ashley Lelie to Atlanta, for instance. Why? Because there's no downside. If Cook were to set up trade parameters with another team, McDaniels and Xanders could simply pass on the deal.

One certainty in all this is that, now that the Broncos have announced their intention to deal Cutler, Cook's phone will be ringing. And if he doesn't have permission to talk to other teams about Cutler?

"You get around it," said one NFL agent. "You talk about another player and then you say, 'Hypothetically, if this player were free . . .' Teams are going to call and the first thing they're going to want to know with Bus is: Does Cutler want to go to their team? And the second thing is, if they're receptive to a deal, is he looking for a new contract?"

In any scenario, Cook and Cutler don't have much leverage. In the end, the Broncos can trade Cutler to any team. And since he has three years remaining on his contract, he's not in a position to demand that an extension get worked out before a trade.

Not that Cook couldn't impact negotiations. Case in point: If Cook doesn't want Cutler traded to Cleveland, where Eric Mangini, like McDaniels a Bill Belichick disciple, is the head coach, the Browns still could pursue a deal, but it wouldn't make much sense to acquire a disgruntled player, particularly given the price Cutler is expected to net.

"A player doesn't have much recourse if he doesn't like the trade, other than to withhold his services," Sundquist said. "It's very similar to what Jake (Plummer) did with Tampa Bay. He just didn't report."

The most likely scenario to play out is that the Broncos swing a deal with a team that, in time, will give Cutler a contract extension, probably in the $100 million-plus range. In time, but not before the trade. It would be different if Cutler were in the final year of his deal, but not now.

"This kid is going to get paid," said the agent. "If he's not going to get paid today, he's going to get paid tomorrow. If you're going to give a boatload of stuff to the Broncos, you're going to pay him. Bus still has leverage, but he doesn't need to use it now. He's not going anywhere. He doesn't have to get that contract now."

Jim Armstrong: 303-954-1269 or jmarmstrong@denverpost.com

[Elevation inc]

Total misnomer. He didn't deserve it, and if the voting took place at the end of the season, he wouldn't have been a "Pro-Bowl" QB.
P.S. I'm glad he won a popularity contest.


Peyton manning-went
Jay cutler- went
Brett Favre- declined
Phillip rivers- Invited to repalce favre but declined
Kerry Collins- selected as alternate after rivers dropped
Big Ben- so-so all year, helped by serious defense
Chad Pennington- made okay case but was very average and miami only beat 2 teams over .500
Matt cassel- not a pro bowl Qb, he was just like pennigton....beat 3 teams over .500
Matt Ryan- rookie Qb's dont go if ever, good campaign, game manager
Joe flacco-rookie qb's dont go if ever, good campaign, game manager



looking at this the only other AFC qb that deserved it was rivers ahead of cutler, but rivers was suppose to go after favre dropped out, he declined so collins went, and pennington or big ben could have gone ahead of collins but it also could have gone either way.

you can spin it or look at it how ya want, but cutler not only deserved to go, he evetually would have went anyways.

it would have been manning, rivers, cutler.....

saying he wouldnt have gone or didnt earn it is actually kinda far from the truth.....

[claymore]

Honestly? I don't. Other "gunslingers" didn't, i.e. Favre.

Orton's only 26. Started less (or near as many) games than Cutler. Ya think he might improve?

Joe, why do you hate young people that have a full head of hair?

[Nomad]

Bus Cook or not Jay is a big boy and allowed all of this to transpire. Jay could of come in at anytime to talk to management and decided to play the ignore game not only to them but his own teammates. Accountability.

True! I keep hearing he was ONLY 25:confused:! So what a 25 yr old man can't make decisions for himself nowadays! Maybe we should raise the voting age to 28;)! I guess when they say 60 is the new 50, they do mean 25 is the new 15 because Jay has the mentality of a 15 yr old!

[CoachChaz]

I guess I just dont understand people sometimes. McDaniels has REPEATEDLY explained the details of how this whole ordeal went down with no rebuttal from Cook/Cutler. Why? Because they cant deny it. "I demand a trade"..."I never wanted a trade". There leaves very little room to see how the situation could have been handled better. It's obvious that Jay wanted out and did what he had to do to get out.

How is McDaniels the criminal in this? If hatred should be spewed anywhere, then point it at Bowlen. This technically all started when Shanny was fired. Jay wasnt happy with it and now he gets to throw into the wind to Hester and his old buddy Bennett while running for his life. He may be a good one, but he'll never accomplish in Chicago what he could have accomplished here.

[Elevation inc]

I guess I just dont understand people sometimes. McDaniels has REPEATEDLY explained the details of how this whole ordeal went down with no rebuttal from Cook/Cutler. Why? Because they cant deny it. "I demand a trade"..."I never wanted a trade". There leaves very little room to see how the situation could have been handled better. It's obvious that Jay wanted out and did what he had to do to get out.

How is McDaniels the criminal in this? If hatred should be spewed anywhere, then point it at Bowlen. This technically all started when Shanny was fired. Jay wasnt happy with it and now he gets to throw into the wind to Hester and his old buddy Bennett while running for his life. He may be a good one, but he'll never accomplish in Chicago what he could have accomplished here.


i still dont belive this cutler will have trouble in chicago crap. orton did well till injury and chicago went 9-7 last year with that same WR core, poor o-line, hester at WR that everyone is talking now. Cutler is more accurate, gives more oppurtunity to keep plays alive and is much more mobile than orton. also has a much greater pocket presence. as well as a ability to make deep throws orton could only dream about. a defense and matt forte will only aid cutler more.

if orton can throw to the TE's and Wr's im sure cutler can and then some. cutler will be just fine next year.

[BroncoJoe]

Joe, why do you hate young people that have a full head of hair?

I had a ton of hair when I was young, Clay.

:tsk:

[CoachChaz]

i still dont belive this cutler will have trouble in chicago crap. orton did well till injury and chicago went 9-7 last year with that same WR core, poor o-line, hester at WR that everyone is talking now. Cutler is more accurate, gives more oppurtunity to keep plays alive and is much more mobile than orton. also has a much greater pocket presence. as well as a ability to make deep throws orton could only dream about. a defense and matt forte will only aid cutler more.

if orton can throw to the TE's and Wr's im sure cutler can and then some. cutler will be just fine next year.

Cutler was more accurate with more time to throw and better options to throw to. A completion % is NOT always indicative of the QB's arm.

We can argue the quality of the Bears all day, but if you really feel that strongly about them, feel free to join the rest of the defectors that have switched allegiances.

[TXBRONC]

We will come out winners. Once we move to BearsForums.com on Friday, we will be the winners of the trade!!! :D

I'm still not use to the idea of rooting for an NFC team. ;)

[Dirk]

After reading all the comments, listening to the interviews by both McD and Cutty, I have come to one conclusion. And this conclusion seems like the logical and makes the most sense. Albeit it isn't what I like.

Being a HUGE Cutty fan, I don't like saying this but...

This whole fiasco is Cutler's fault. I think after Shanny was fired he had it out for whomever they were going to hire before the choice was made.

After they hired McD, Cutty voiced his desire for his man Bates to stay (his comfort zone) was being threatened.

After Bates left, NOT let go. Cutty was so frustrated that he decided he was either going to get a huge new contract or he was going to leave. I think it was more of a desire to leave because he found out that his "weight" in the way things worked wasn't much at all.

Again, after reading all of the interviews and seing how all things went down, I am willing to give McD the benefit of the doubt on this one and not Cutler.

I hope Cutler does fantastic in Chicago, but I want McD to shine more in Denver.

[CoachChaz]

After reading all the comments, listening to the interviews by both McD and Cutty, I have come to one conclusion. And this conclusion seems like the logical and makes the most sense. Albeit it isn't what I like.

Being a HUGE Cutty fan, I don't like saying this but...

This whole fiasco is Cutler's fault. I think after Shanny was fired he had it out for whomever they were going to hire before the choice was made.

After they hired McD, Cutty voiced his desire for his man Bates to stay (his comfort zone) was being threatened.

After Bates left, NOT let go. Cutty was so frustrated that he decided he was either going to get a huge new contract or he was going to leave. I think it was more of a desire to leave because he found out that his "weight" in the way things worked wasn't much at all.

Again, after reading all of the interviews and seing how all things went down, I am willing to give McD the benefit of the doubt on this one and not Cutler.

I hope Cutler does fantastic in Chicago, but I want McD to shine more in Denver.

Glad to see someone can read the facts and see reality and have the balls to admit it. Kudos!

[Nomad]

After reading all the comments, listening to the interviews by both McD and Cutty, I have come to one conclusion. And this conclusion seems like the logical and makes the most sense. Albeit it isn't what I like.

Being a HUGE Cutty fan, I don't like saying this but...

This whole fiasco is Cutler's fault. I think after Shanny was fired he had it out for whomever they were going to hire before the choice was made.

After they hired McD, Cutty voiced his desire for his man Bates to stay (his comfort zone) was being threatened.

After Bates left, NOT let go. Cutty was so frustrated that he decided he was either going to get a huge new contract or he was going to leave. I think it was more of a desire to leave because he found out that his "weight" in the way things worked wasn't much at all.

Again, after reading all of the interviews and seing how all things went down, I am willing to give McD the benefit of the doubt on this one and not Cutler.

I hope Cutler does fantastic in Chicago, but I want McD to shine more in Denver.

I'm glad to see someone else see's it this way, why else would he not greet his new HC when other teammates were during the 1st week of his hiring...oh yeah, Cutler was out of town;)! And many of the fans are the same way!!

[Elevation inc]

Cutler was more accurate with more time to throw and better options to throw to. A completion % is NOT always indicative of the QB's arm.

We can argue the quality of the Bears all day, but if you really feel that strongly about them, feel free to join the rest of the defectors that have switched allegiances.

i indicated nothing about switching teams, dont know why you selected that comment to post. Im a die hard denver fan.....i just dont feel like knocking a NFL player becasue he left a buisness oriented team for another business oriented team he felt better at. i fault no one now......there are 53 other players to worry about now!!!

and while not wearing hatorade glasses its clear to me cutler is going to a 9-7 football team, who had a less acurate and less mobile Qb in orton. that right there alone gives me enough reason to belive that cutler can and probally will do just fine.

i just dont buy the he will struggle hype. i mean i it could be attributed that cutler himself prevented 7-9 sacks last year because of his legs, does that means are o-line would have given up almost 20 sacks if we had orton, who has no mobility???.....hard to say, but perhaps the o-line crap in chicago wont be as big with cutlers mobility and pocket presence..


I mean lets face it we can spin just how bad we think chicago will end up, but i would wager to bet reality ends up alot different than what people want to belive here.

[CoachChaz]

i indicated nothing about switching teams, dont know why you selected that comment to post. Im a die hard denver fan.....i just dont feel like knocking a NFL player becasue he left a buisness oriented team for another business orienetd team he felt better at.

and while not wearing hatorade glasses its clear to me cutler is going to a 9-7 football team, who had a less acurate and less mobile Qb in orton. that right there alone gives me enough reason to belive that cutler should do just fine.

i just dont buy the he will struggle hype. i mean i it could be attributed that cutler himself prevented 7-9 sacks last year becasue of his legs, does that means are o-line would have given up almost 20 sacks if we had orton, who has no mobility.....


I mean lets face it we can spin just how bad we think chicago will end up, but i would wager to bet reality ends up alot different than what people want to belive here.

Because Jay is gone, our o-line suddenly goes from top notch to completely mediocre...really? Cutler was what made that bunch look good? Casey went to the Pro-Bowl and many thought Clady got snubbed...but that was ALL because of Cutler?

That's all I need to read to understand the jaded rationale and insane man-crush.

[Elevation inc]

Because Jay is gone, our o-line suddenly goes from top notch to completely mediocre...really? Cutler was what made that bunch look good? Casey went to the Pro-Bowl and many thought Clady got snubbed...but that was ALL because of Cutler?

That's all I need to read to understand the jaded rationale and insane man-crush.

i didnt say that, it cant be proven either way, why are you trying to spin me into a cutler man lover when thats not what i am or how im posting.

i feel i have been pretty even in this whole thing. i dont buy the cutler will fail hype and i dont buy the we are worse off with orton hype.


fact of the matter is coverage sacks is a very prominent thing in the pros on teams with Qb's that arent mobile. cutler is mobile. orton isnt. i have no doubt our o-line will improve orton, just as i have no doubt cutler doesnt need denvers o-line to succede.

seriosuly why are you reaching and over reading what i post....i didnt make factual statements about the o-line, i just hypothesized.....either way it cant be proven just like i said using the word could with question marks at the end.....

[CoachChaz]

i didnt say that, it cant be proven either way, why are you trying to spin me into a cutler man lover when thats not what i am or how im posting.

i feel i have been pretty even in this whole thing. i dont buy the cutler will fail hype and i dont buy the we are worse off with orton hype.


fact of the matter is coverage sacks is a very prominent thing in the pros on teams with Qb's that arent mobile. cutler is mobile. orton isnt. i have no doubt our o-line will improve orton, just as i have no doubt cutler doesnt need denvers o-line to succede.

seriosuly why are you reaching and over reading what i post....i didnt make factual statements about the o-line, i just hypothesized.....either way it cant be proven just like i said using the word could with question marks at the end.....


Somehow I dont think too many people can see where this is a "positive" statement about the quality of our line...


"i mean i it could be attributed that cutler himself prevented 7-9 sacks last year because of his legs, does that means are o-line would have given up almost 20 sacks if we had orton, who has no mobility???.....hard to say, but perhaps the o-line crap in chicago wont be as big with cutlers mobility and pocket presence"


One would think Chicago would be semi happy with their line based on the running of Forte, but if that's the case, then why are they rebuilding it with retreads and never will be's?

[Bronco Bible]

By two.......wow.......

Gosh, only two ....one of the two could have been in the end-zone vs. Buffalo
the other could have been in the first game (end zone again) vs the Chuggers

[Thnikkaman]

[snip]
i just dont buy the he will struggle hype. i mean i it could be attributed that cutler himself prevented 7-9 sacks last year because of his legs, does that means are o-line would have given up almost 20 sacks if we had orton, who has no mobility???.....hard to say, but perhaps the o-line crap in chicago wont be as big with cutlers mobility and pocket presence..

[snip]


The funny thing is that we don't loose the ball when there is a sack. Sure, we may end up punting, but a punt usually ends up being worse field position for our opposition than an int.

[Elevation inc]

Somehow I dont think too many people can see where this is a "positive" statement about the quality of our line...


"i mean i it could be attributed that cutler himself prevented 7-9 sacks last year because of his legs, does that means are o-line would have given up almost 20 sacks if we had orton, who has no mobility???.....hard to say, but perhaps the o-line crap in chicago wont be as big with cutlers mobility and pocket presence"


One would think Chicago would be semi happy with their line based on the running of Forte, but if that's the case, then why are they rebuilding it with retreads and never will be's?

seriously you quoted what i was trying to get at.....i am not saying anything bad about our o-line, but the fact is qb's mobility can go along way to helping a o-line.....i wasnt making anything i posted diffucult to understand. i even put it in question format, follwoed by hard to say(implying who really knows!!!!)....

[Elevation inc]

The funny thing is that we don't loose the ball when there is a sack. Sure, we may end up punting, but a punt usually ends up being worse field position for our opposition than an int.

we arent talking about Int's here we are talking about how cutler isnt going to fail as much as the haters want him to.....

the cutler haters are knocking anyone that comes with any semblance of question or reason........

i am not jumpin either side, i just refuse to blindly speculate cutler will do horrible in chicago becasue he has hester, bennet, and a mediocre o-line....when kyle orton took those same weapons to 9-7 and he doesnt have near the physical Qb abilites as cutler.....

Doesnt mean my views are jadded they are just open minded....to the same extent i belive orton landed in a excellent situation

[CoachChaz]

seriously you quoted what i was trying to get at.....i am not saying anything bad about our o-line, but the fact is qb's mobility can go along way to helping a o-line.....i wasnt making anything i posted diffucult to understand. i even put it in question format, follwoed by hard to say(implying who really knows!!!!)....

Fair enough. I can see where I may have misinterpreted that.

I guess my rebuttal would be that I dont think Orton is the statue he's played out to be. No...he doesnt have the athleticism of Cutler, but he can sidestep and make a good decision with a quick release.

There are more ways to avoid a sack without using your legs.

[Elevation inc]

Fair enough. I can see where I may have misinterpreted that.

I guess my rebuttal would be that I dont think Orton is the statue he's played out to be. No...he doesnt have the athleticism of Cutler, but he can sidestep and make a good decision with a quick release.

There are more ways to avoid a sack without using your legs.

which is true but you can not oversimplify pocket presence and cutler excelled at that as well as mobility.


personally i think orton ended up in a great spot for his career, but i refuse to belive cutler got the raw end, simply because there isnt a marshall, royal, sheff, or elite o-line.....


cutler doesnt have a coach or play caller that will want him to throw 616 times, so my guess is his stats will drop but his wins will improve based of a legit run otion and solid defense....more team concept if you will...he wont have to force things as much

i think bates away from cutler is the best thing for cutlers career, becasue bates relied way to much on playcalling pass when it wasnt needed, and at times it became backyard football for bates and cutler, which is where turnovers came in......

basic wining starts with running and stopping the run.....bates didnt know that, and he sure didnt help cutler learn that. lovie smith will get that drilled into cutler and he will become better for it.


both parties won in my mind here....having animosity towards eitehr at this point, just defeats the work of 53 other players that will show up on sundays next year.


here if MCd gets this defense right, our surrounding weapons will help orton to become very efficient....

[CoachChaz]

we arent talking about Int's here we are talking about how cutler isnt going to fail as much as the haters want him to.....

the cutler haters are knocking anyone that comes with any semblance of question or reason........

i am not jumpin either side, i just refuse to blindly speculate cutler will do horrible in chicago becasue he has hester, bennet, and a mediocre o-line....when kyle orton took those same weapons to 9-7 and he doesnt have near the physical Qb abilites as cutler.....

Doesnt mean my views are jadded they are just open minded....to the same extent i belive orton landed in a excellent situation

I dont think anyone really expects him to "fail" as much as we refuse to automatically assume that he will succeed. There are all kinds of assumptions out there that Chicago is now the team to beat in the NFC north. If that's true, I think it's more indicative of how weak that division is than what Cutler brings to the table.

It's a completely different scenario than in Denver and in reality...Cutler has far less weapons and protection there than he did here, yet...he failed here. Blame it on defense, running game...whatever. The team had a winning season under orton, but orton wasnt the reason. he didnt have great numbers, but he does have talent. Talent that can be utilized in Denver's system. Same goes for Cutler. He can bring things to the table that Orton didnt and maybe the Bears win more games. But if Cutler's numbers are only mildly better than Orton's (who missed time), then i wont be surprised based on the talent around him.

At the end of the day, I'll never say that Orton has more talent and skill than Cutler, but based on the team and potential...he could produce better numbers and more wins.

[Elevation inc]

I dont think anyone really expects him to "fail" as much as we refuse to automatically assume that he will succeed. There are all kinds of assumptions out there that Chicago is now the team to beat in the NFC north. If that's true, I think it's more indicative of how weak that division is than what Cutler brings to the table.

It's a completely different scenario than in Denver and in reality...Cutler has far less weapons and protection there than he did here, yet...he failed here. Blame it on defense, running game...whatever. The team had a winning season under orton, but orton wasnt the reason. he didnt have great numbers, but he does have talent. Talent that can be utilized in Denver's system. Same goes for Cutler. He can bring things to the table that Orton didnt and maybe the Bears win more games. But if Cutler's numbers are only mildly better than Orton's (who missed time), then i wont be surprised based on the talent around him.

At the end of the day, I'll never say that Orton has more talent and skill than Cutler, but based on the team and potential...he could produce better numbers and more wins.


we are seeing the same things, im not defending either side, and like i said in the previous post i think orton ended up in a great situation....

perhaps playing down the middle and not taking sides is throwing people off, maybe i should just pick a side:lol:

[Elevation inc]

simply put this is my current stance


Jay isnt a bronco anymore and the quicker people realize that the quicker they can move on with there lives.

Look people living in the past only clouds your judgement and acceptance when it comes to the future.

it does not matter who you side with. it does not matter if you like MCD bowlen or jay cutler.

What matters is that we as fans still root for the 53 other players that will where the logo come game days.

that is what matters now!!! whats done is done. let it go and start finding it in yourself to cheer for denver as a loyal fan.....

personally i have my own views about what went down, but now that its over, even i realize its time to focus on the next season and not what could have been, because as histroy has shown living in what if scenarios and past occurences only leads you to miss out on the future.



but fear not if the future is bleak come game days, then perhaps a re-evaluation is needed, for now however we as bronco fans should saunter into the future with our heads held high, untill we are give a reason(losses piling up) not to any longer!!

[CoachChaz]

we are seeing the same things, im not defending either side, and like i said in the previous post i think orton ended up in a great situation....

perhaps playing down the middle and not taking sides is throwing people off, maybe i should just pick a side:lol:

No...I can see your middle ground. I guess I'm just so use to the Bronco bashing by Bronco fans that it's easy to take things the wrong way lately

[Elevation inc]

No...I can see your middle ground. I guess I'm just so use to the Bronco bashing by Bronco fans that it's easy to take things the wrong way lately


In eddie royal i trust:salute:

[Thnikkaman]

we arent talking about Int's here we are talking about how cutler isnt going to fail as much as the haters want him to.....

the cutler haters are knocking anyone that comes with any semblance of question or reason........

i am not jumpin either side, i just refuse to blindly speculate cutler will do horrible in chicago becasue he has hester, bennet, and a mediocre o-line....when kyle orton took those same weapons to 9-7 and he doesnt have near the physical Qb abilites as cutler.....

Doesnt mean my views are jadded they are just open minded....to the same extent i belive orton landed in a excellent situation

Like Coach was saying, I was taking you for someone who is just swinging off of Cutlers nuts.

I live about 4 hours away from Chicago and get to see many of their games and listen to their fans. Unless they draft some new blood on the D-Side of the ball, I don't see their Defensive performance of last year being a fluke. Cutler makes Chicago better in the short term and hurts them from getting better in the long term unless Chicago can trade some of their aging talent for draft picks or young prospects that are failing in systems like our old one.

If Cutler gets his money, then bully to him. I don't know how this season is going to play out since I have no clue who is going to get injured, or what. And I will be more than happy to eat Crow if the Bears make it deep into the playoffs next year, but I don't see that happening.

[Elevation inc]

Like Coach was saying, I was taking you for someone who is just swinging off of Cutlers nuts.

I live about 4 hours away from Chicago and get to see many of their games and listen to their fans. Unless they draft some new blood on the D-Side of the ball, I don't see their Defensive performance of last year being a fluke. Cutler makes Chicago better in the short term and hurts them from getting better in the long term unless Chicago can trade some of their aging talent for draft picks or young prospects that are failing in systems like our old one.

If Cutler gets his money, then bully to him. I don't know how this season is going to play out since I have no clue who is going to get injured, or what. And I will be more than happy to eat Crow if the Bears make it deep into the playoffs next year, but I don't see that happening.



fair enough and thnk you, im certainly not one to sway you from your views, because as we saw last year anything is possible in the pros....

[Thnikkaman]

fair enough and thnk you, im certainly not one to sway you from your views, because as we saw last year anything is possible in the pros....

I guess the major feeling I have is that I will be willing to admit that I'm wrong if Cutler becomes a world beater in Chicago.

[CoachChaz]

I cant see why people are in love with the Chicago defense.

Anderson was a one year wonder, Brown is a joke and Ogunleye is on a downward spiral. Harris cant stay on the field and hasnt been worth a damn since he got his big money. Harrison and Dvoracek have potential, but niether are very good at the point of attack. The LB's are nothing after a solid, but aging Urlacher and a competent Briggs. They dont have any safeties and Tillman and Vasher relied on a strong front 7 to be adequate. That's not to say they cant be decent, but the cards are not in their favor.

The O-line...Kreutz is always solid, but is also 32. After that, Buenning and Reed are the guards and Chris Williams did so good at LT that they signed an old Pace to replace him, moving Williams to the right side.

Recievers...hester, Bennett, Aromashodu...I rest my case there.

My instinct is to say, I'll be surprised if Chicago goes 8-8, but in that division...anything is possible

[Lonestar]

After reading all the comments, listening to the interviews by both McD and Cutty, I have come to one conclusion. And this conclusion seems like the logical and makes the most sense. Albeit it isn't what I like.

Being a HUGE Cutty fan, I don't like saying this but...

This whole fiasco is Cutler's fault. I think after Shanny was fired he had it out for whomever they were going to hire before the choice was made.

After they hired McD, Cutty voiced his desire for his man Bates to stay (his comfort zone) was being threatened.

After Bates left, NOT let go. Cutty was so frustrated that he decided he was either going to get a huge new contract or he was going to leave. I think it was more of a desire to leave because he found out that his "weight" in the way things worked wasn't much at all.

Again, after reading all of the interviews and seing how all things went down, I am willing to give McD the benefit of the doubt on this one and not Cutler.

I hope Cutler does fantastic in Chicago, but I want McD to shine more in Denver.



I think this is the best post in this thread.. It is spot on in all respects..


Excepting I hope jay stinks it up in CHI-town in his first year I want a top 5 pick.. after that I could care less. If not jay then the whole team take a dump.. jsut want a great pick out of the back end of this trade..

[Nomad]

I think this is the best post in this thread.. It is spot on in all respects..


Excepting I hope jay stinks it up in CHI-town in his first year I want a top 5 pick.. after that I could care less. If not jay then the whole team take a dump.. jsut want a great pick out of the back end of this trade..


True! Since we have Chicago's #1 pick next year, I'm hoping they have a crappy year as well!!

[Traveler]

True! Since we have Chicago's #1 pick next year, I'm hoping they have a crappy year as well!!

C'mon! Don't jinx us. I remember when we got the pick from Washington and folks said the same thing. :listen:Think it, don't say out loud!

[CoachChaz]

True! Since we have Chicago's #1 pick next year, I'm hoping they have a crappy year as well!!

They're due

[getlynched47]

Ortons record when the D holds teams to 21 points or less. His record is 21-4, that means he has only won when the D held teams to 21 points or less!

Isn't Cutler 13-1 when the defense holds teams to under 21 points?

Orton can only win if the defense holds teams under 21 points! Good luck...

[Lonestar]

Like Coach was saying, I was taking you for someone who is just swinging off of Cutlers nuts.

I live about 4 hours away from Chicago and get to see many of their games and listen to their fans. Unless they draft some new blood on the D-Side of the ball, I don't see their Defensive performance of last year being a fluke. Cutler makes Chicago better in the short term and hurts them from getting better in the long term unless Chicago can trade some of their aging talent for draft picks or young prospects that are failing in systems like our old one.

If Cutler gets his money, then bully to him. I don't know how this season is going to play out since I have no clue who is going to get injured, or what. And I will be more than happy to eat Crow if the Bears make it deep into the playoffs next year, but I don't see that happening.3

Some very good points..

Where it differers is unless they come up with some draft choices to cover the ones they traded away, they are not gonna get better.. If jay gets a new contract which he most likely will there will be a lot less money to buy free agents..

In the short haul this team will not do as well as before and jays numbers should go down dramatically unless they find a rookie WR some where.. because throwing to what CHI has is not nearly what he had in DEN.. the only positive I see in this trade right now for jay is his RB made it through the season last year.. is ashley still available?:laugh::laugh:

Now on the flip side we have two extra picks inside the top 100 picks (now 5 inside #85 I think someone said) if we use them wisely on D while they may not start day one they will see alot of playing time this year..

Orton should be able to pick up this offense and play it just as well as jay was going to be allowed to do...

This is the key here folks just because jay had a cannon did not mean that he was gonna get to use it in the new scheme.. Those athletes that were not born with loads of ability to not take for granted what they have and play with a chip on their shoulder.. jay was not one of them IMHO..

I believe that Orton is and will do all possible to utilize all his new toys..

[claymore]

Ortons record when the D holds teams to 21 points or less. His record is 21-4, that means he has only won when the D held teams to 21 points or less!

Isn't Cutler 13-1 when the defense holds teams to under 21 points?

Orton can only win if the defense holds teams under 21 points! Good luck...

That doesnt matter. Everyone will say its Cutlers fault no matter what.

[slim]

Ortons record when the D holds teams to 21 points or less. His record is 21-4, that means he has only won when the D held teams to 21 points or less!

Isn't Cutler 13-1 when the defense holds teams to under 21 points?

Orton can only win if the defense holds teams under 21 points! Good luck...

What?

[Denver Native (Carol)]

After reading all the comments, listening to the interviews by both McD and Cutty, I have come to one conclusion. And this conclusion seems like the logical and makes the most sense. Albeit it isn't what I like.

Being a HUGE Cutty fan, I don't like saying this but...

This whole fiasco is Cutler's fault. I think after Shanny was fired he had it out for whomever they were going to hire before the choice was made.

After they hired McD, Cutty voiced his desire for his man Bates to stay (his comfort zone) was being threatened.

After Bates left, NOT let go. Cutty was so frustrated that he decided he was either going to get a huge new contract or he was going to leave. I think it was more of a desire to leave because he found out that his "weight" in the way things worked wasn't much at all.

Again, after reading all of the interviews and seing how all things went down, I am willing to give McD the benefit of the doubt on this one and not Cutler.

I hope Cutler does fantastic in Chicago, but I want McD to shine more in Denver.

I totally agree. At first, I thought Cutler had TOTALLY been treated unfairly, but after finding articles, reading different things, I definitely think that Cutler wanted out. First - Shanahan fired, then Bates left, and how do we know that when Jay came in for two weeks (before the trade talks surfaced), that by him being around McD, talking with McD, he sensed that he was not going to be coddled under the new regime - i.e. - he was not going to be treated any differently than any other player on the team. Thus, Cook/Jay used the trade talks to GET OUT OF TOWN.

[CoachChaz]

Ortons record when the D holds teams to 21 points or less. His record is 21-4, that means he has only won when the D held teams to 21 points or less!

Isn't Cutler 13-1 when the defense holds teams to under 21 points?

Orton can only win if the defense holds teams under 21 points! Good luck...

Fair enough, but i think there is a bit of a difference when you have a Shanny offense with a good line and top-notch receivers as opposed to the Bears offense. I dont mean to belittle Cutler, but he did have more to work with.

...And although your post is confusing, based on the content, that would mean Cutler is only 4-19 when the team gives up 21 or more. by that rationale, BOTH Cutler AND Orton "only" win when the defense holds teams under 21.

[Lonestar]

I cant see why people are in love with the Chicago defense.

Anderson was a one year wonder, Brown is a joke and Ogunleye is on a downward spiral. Harris cant stay on the field and hasnt been worth a damn since he got his big money. Harrison and Dvoracek have potential, but niether are very good at the point of attack. The LB's are nothing after a solid, but aging Urlacher and a competent Briggs. They dont have any safeties and Tillman and Vasher relied on a strong front 7 to be adequate. That's not to say they cant be decent, but the cards are not in their favor.

The O-line...Kreutz is always solid, but is also 32. After that, Buenning and Reed are the guards and Chris Williams did so good at LT that they signed an old Pace to replace him, moving Williams to the right side.

Recievers...hester, Bennett, Aromashodu...I rest my case there.

My instinct is to say, I'll be surprised if Chicago goes 8-8, but in that division...anything is possible

this chicago team on defense is not a boat load better than what we had
ranked 21 vs our 29

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?archive=false&conference=null&role=OPP&offensiveStatisticCategory=null&defensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&season=2008&seasonType=REG&tabSeq=2&qualified=true&Submit=Go

yards per game

12 vs 4

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?offensiveStatisticCategory=null&archive=false&seasonType=REG&defensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&d-447263-o=2&conference=null&d-447263-s=TOTAL_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-n=1&season=2008&qualified=true&Submit=Go&tabSeq=2&role=OPP&d-447263-p=1

first downs allowed

10 vs 4

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?offensiveStatisticCategory=null&archive=false&seasonType=REG&defensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&d-447263-o=2&conference=null&d-447263-s=FIRST_DOWNS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-n=1&season=2008&qualified=true&Submit=Go&tabSeq=2&role=OPP&d-447263-p=1

plays from scrimage

1087 vs 990 or worst vs 18th

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?offensiveStatisticCategory=null&archive=false&seasonType=REG&defensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&d-447263-o=2&conference=null&d-447263-s=SCRIMMAGE_PLAYS&d-447263-n=1&season=2008&Submit=Go&qualified=true&tabSeq=2&role=OPP&d-447263-p=1



Considering we had no talent, no coaching,no cohenrent scheme and HC that treated his Defensive players like second class citizens>

Does anyone think that a upgrade in players, huge upgrade in coaching and a HC that believes in TEAM play will not make a difference?

[CoachChaz]

Add to the the fact that Chicago doesnt have a 1st round pick to get top talent for the next 2 years

[Lonestar]

Add to the the fact that Chicago doesnt have a 1st round pick to get top talent for the next 2 years

nor a three this year....

Perhaps less if they traded away some others prior to getting stupid over jay..;)

[CoachChaz]

nor a three this year....

Perhaps less if they traded away some others prior to getting stupid over jay..;)

Yeah...Jay Cutler, Orlando Pace and a 2nd ropund pick doesnt make them all that much better.

[Lonestar]

Yeah...Jay Cutler, Orlando Pace and a 2nd ropund pick doesnt make them all that much better.




but but but but the defense is ahahahahahahahahahaaha

[deacon]

I could care less what the coach has to say.

The only way he's going to prove that trading Cutler was in the best interest of the team is if he has a stellar 2009 draft class.

Talk is cheap McDipShit :coffee:

I sure hope they win just so I can see you frontrunners jump back on the bandwagon.

[Medford Bronco]

Yeah...Jay Cutler, Orlando Pace and a 2nd ropund pick doesnt make them all that much better.

unless Orlando plays WR :lol: as that is where they are lacking right now.

[Bronco Bible]

I thought Favre was a complete Joke, Cutler was good enough to be a Pro-Browler, but others were more deserving.
That will all change when he kicks ass as a Bear this year.The high 5 was intened for that first part...definitely not the last part.




Orange=good
Red=bad