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View Full Version : Remember when Pat Bowlen wasn't David Sterling?



BigDaddyBronco
03-19-2012, 08:59 AM
Pat Bowlen!!! WTF? Remember a few years ago the Broncos had cap issues and had to let good players go due to money. Heck, they even lost draft picks during the Super Bowl years because they were playing games to keep TD and Elway paid. Shanny had teams that had millions in dead cap space and was always blowing money on free agents that wouldn't work out. Now we will not even spend money on mid level free agents or keep our own players. We are among the league leaders in available cap space and could bring in a few guys even if we get Manning and have seen very little action. Is Bowlen only wanting to spend money if we have Manning and can make a run? Or is he only going to use Manning to keep the stands full and the money flowing in with an available $20 million sitting on the table and Manning not having anyone to protect him or throw the ball to.

So does he have cash flow problems (generally with all his businesses, not just the Broncos), is he trying to build a nice nest egg for his children, or is he losing it? Maybe the ploy the last few years is to keep the costs as low as possible to keep the stands full and he doesn't really care if we win the big one. Did he fire McDaniels because he was terrible or because people stopped going to the games? Maybe the years of Shanny wasting his money turned him into a spend thrift.

Either way, it sucks that we went from a team that had an owner that was willing to give the coaches what they wanted to make the team better to an owner that handcuffs the organization when they have millions available to spend. Or maybe Elway and Co. has mis-managed this horribly.

claymore
03-19-2012, 09:06 AM
I think Bowlen and Elway deserve our patience. Constantly calling them out for not picking guys up that A. dont want to be here, or B. We dont want them here... is ridiculous.

We are in the hunt for the most expensive dude ever. So, money probably isnt an issue.

silkamilkamonico
03-19-2012, 09:07 AM
I certainly don't agree with whats going on now, but I'm not sure I can really blame Bowlen either.

Remember c few years ago when Denver was paying out the highest amlunt of dead cap? Money to players who weren't even on the team? Like 20% of thier cap, with nothing really to show for it?

There's a part of me that can understand where he is coming from with not spending.

BigDaddyBronco
03-19-2012, 09:07 AM
The fact that we have more cap room than anyone else is telling Clay. Want to bet that we have more available cap room next year than anyone else again?

Jsteve01
03-19-2012, 09:09 AM
Clay this offseason has been pretty much a debacle. We still need corners and a starting caliber MLB. Now we also need multiple DT and a new starting TE. We're not even making lateral moves. We're losing guys. Mike Adams may be a decent player but does he bring the leadership of a Dawkins? I'm pissed as well.

claymore
03-19-2012, 09:10 AM
The fact that we have more cap room than anyone else is telling Clay. Want to bet that we have more available cap room next year than anyone else again?

Thats a good thing. Its way better than the shanny era and always being over. The only must have guy is Payton Manning, and we are balls deep in that hunt.

Who else was a must have? Everyone out there was highly overpriced, and most had character issues.

chazoe60
03-19-2012, 09:12 AM
The part I find concerning is that we're not even signing our own guys who were big in helping us have a much better season last season than we ever expected.

We let Fells walk. Bunk is on his way out. Yet we resign Mays? WTF is that? This offseason without landing Manning is shit.

Chef Zambini
03-19-2012, 09:13 AM
shanahan spent money like a drunken sailor, bowlens money.
its what shanny does.
he now has a new patsy in D.C.
BOWLEN is still paying both shanny and JMCD millions for the priviledge of letting those 2 incompetents ruin his franchise !
ELWAY now is compelled to operate on a budget.
TEBOW was last years krispy kreme, he gratified the fans with yummy sugar and hot air, but the 2 johns know the sugar crash is coming THIS season.
They cant just jerk the bottle from the mouths of the bronco fans with infant minds,
manning was their one way out!
RG3 is off the table, they NEED a legitimate QB, for next season and the future,
so I see them being fiscally frugal and keeping the fans on their tebow formula, if they dont sign manning. continue to add talent via the draft, placate the mindless fans who fill the seats and re-load for a legitimate QB next year.

BigDaddyBronco
03-19-2012, 09:13 AM
I certainly don't agree with whats going on now, but I'm not sure I can really blame Bowlen either.

Remember c few years ago when Denver was paying out the highest amlunt of dead cap? Money to players who weren't even on the team? Like 20% of thier cap, with nothing really to show for it?

There's a part of me that can understand where he is coming from with not spending.

Sure, after Shanny left a bad taste in his mouth I totally understood where he was coming from. Now it just seems odd, we just came off a playoff year and have made some good strides, maybe it's time to open the wallet a little. Doing it for Manning is a no brainer as it will keep the seats filled, but smaller amounts could be spent to keep the defense improving or the running game going. We still have some time left in the FA period, but it seems like we are just going to maintain the status quo unless we get Manning.

claymore
03-19-2012, 09:14 AM
Clay this offseason has been pretty much a debacle. We still need corners and a starting caliber MLB. Now we also need multiple DT and a new starting TE. We're not even making lateral moves. We're losing guys. Mike Adams may be a decent player but does he bring the leadership of a Dawkins? I'm pissed as well.

All the issues you state have been issues for the past 10+ years. We have always needed Saftey, DT and MLB help. I hope we get the dude out of Baltimore, but... Maybe he doesnt want to be here, or wants way to much money.

The only make or break player out there is Manning.

Chef Zambini
03-19-2012, 09:16 AM
The part I find concerning is that we're not even signing our own guys who were big in helping us have a much better season last season than we ever expected.

We let Fells walk. Bunk is on his way out. Yet we resign Mays? WTF is that? This offseason without landing Manning is shit.had to re-sign mays, hes the only LB on the roster who isnt under suspension!
bunk aint gone yet, stop packing his bags.

BigDaddyBronco
03-19-2012, 09:16 AM
All the issues you state have been issues for the past 10+ years. We have always needed Saftey, DT and MLB help. I hope we get the dude out of Baltimore, but... Maybe he doesnt want to be here, or wants way to much money.

The only make or break player out there is Manning.

If it comes down to personnel for Manning, does he go to the place where they are losing people and not replacing them or a place like the 49ers, where they have the pieces and are trying to figure out how to stay under the cap? I would hate to lose out on Manning because our owner is cheap.

silkamilkamonico
03-19-2012, 09:18 AM
I can't imagine Denver is desireable to Manning. He knows he will make us better, but he also has to know we aren't winning anything of significance anytime soon.
I think he feels the same way about Tennessee, which si why he hasn't committed yet.

Jsteve01
03-19-2012, 09:19 AM
and BDB is one of the more level headed posters we have on this site. You start seeing these types of posts from him and it's time to check your pulse.

claymore
03-19-2012, 09:21 AM
If it comes down to personnel for Manning, does he go to the place where they are losing people and not replacing them or a place like the 49ers, where they have the pieces and are trying to figure out how to stay under the cap? I would hate to lose out on Manning because our owner is cheap.

If we lose out on manning, it wont be because of money. It could be offensive talent. But, I didnt really see anyone in FA that would have fixed that. And, if there was, its hard to lure a wr here when Tebow is our QB.

Nomad
03-19-2012, 09:24 AM
I can't imagine Denver is desireable to Manning. He knows he will make us better, but he also has to know we aren't winning anything of significance anytime soon.
I think he feels the same way about Tennessee, which si why he hasn't committed yet.

Manning's being a media whore and pulling a Farvesque move here. Tom Condon is fueling the fire. BRONCOS may still have drama with Tebow after the Manning saga

claymore
03-19-2012, 09:24 AM
and BDB is one of the more level headed posters we have on this site. You start seeing these types of posts from him and it's time to check your pulse.

You guys get upset about the wrong things, then act like nothings wrong when shit actually hurts this team...

Tebow and McDaniels are/were bad for this team. Not overspending on FA scrubs is not bad. We've been down that road.

Northman
03-19-2012, 09:24 AM
I think Bowlen and Elway deserve our patience. Constantly calling them out for not picking guys up that A. dont want to be here, or B. We dont want them here... is ridiculous.

We are in the hunt for the most expensive dude ever. So, money probably isnt an issue.

^This

I said it before, spending money just for the sake of it is completely stupid (see Eagles). If your going to spend money than spend it on the right people (see Manning). From what we have heard they want to build through the draft and so far nothing has changed except adding a piece here or there via FA. I keep seeing people use the Packers as the blueprint for success yet they didnt go crazy in FA the last few years. They built through the draft.

Northman
03-19-2012, 09:25 AM
Thats a good thing. Its way better than the shanny era and always being over. The only must have guy is Payton Manning, and we are balls deep in that hunt.

Who else was a must have? Everyone out there was highly overpriced, and most had character issues.


Bingo. Its hilarious that Clay is now the voice of reason. :lol:

wayninja
03-19-2012, 09:27 AM
Yeah, McClain would have sucked. Good riddance to Bunkley too. We don't need those scrubs, we can find volunteers and UDFA's to bolster our depth and no one will know the difference.

Also, it's Tebow's fault.

Jsteve01
03-19-2012, 09:29 AM
You're exactly right. Don't overspend on guys that will never play up to their deals. But when two of the four FAs that you've visited with didn't even play last year, I have serious concerns about your strategy. I also am frustrated at the lack of visits. I'm not asking for the biggest name at every position but I am asking for movement.

BigDaddyBronco
03-19-2012, 09:31 AM
^This

I said it before, spending money just for the sake of it is completely stupid (see Eagles). If your going to spend money than spend it on the right people (see Manning). From what we have heard they want to build through the draft and so far nothing has changed except adding a piece here or there via FA. I keep seeing people use the Packers as the blueprint for success yet they didnt go crazy in FA the last few years. They built through the draft.

Again if we had $20 million in cap room and resigned Bunkley and Fells, or went out and signed a CB or something I wouldn't be questioning anything. But, if we lose out on Manning and continue this route, we will have $30 million in cap space when this is done and you can't possibly tell me that we couldn't have picked up a player or two to make our defense better.

Northman
03-19-2012, 09:32 AM
You're exactly right. Don't overspend on guys that will never play up to their deals. But when two of the four FAs that you've visited with didn't even play last year, I have serious concerns about your strategy. I also am frustrated at the lack of visits. I'm not asking for the biggest name at every position but I am asking for movement.


Oh for christ sake Steve. Your worried about visits? Really? Come on. Who gives a shit about visits? We arent the ones running the team. If they dont feel someone who is a FA is going to help this team than they would be the ones to know. Hell, McClain came here but i can tell you now i dont think he is that special. He is basically a system LB who benefitted a lot from the guys around him yet i see a lot of you slobbering over him like he is Brian Urlacher. lol

Northman
03-19-2012, 09:36 AM
Again if we had $20 million in cap room and resigned Bunkley and Fells, or went out and signed a CB or something I wouldn't be questioning anything. But, if we lose out on Manning and continue this route, we will have $30 million in cap space when this is done and you can't possibly tell me that we couldn't have picked up a player or two to make our defense better.

Fells sucks so i dont care about him. Bunkley? Average but i would still take him back but maybe they dont like his asking price. As too CB? Who is out there that would be any better than Goodman? Answer: Nobody. Again, the FO has stated they want to build through the draft and if your someone who likes how the Packers did it than thats what you do. If Denver just needs "depth" or "bodies" they can sign ANY guy when the time comes for dirt cheap. There is no rush to spend a crapload of money on average players. Denver is probably sitting back because they know a lot of these players wont get the money they are asking for and will eventually come down on their asking price. Just look at some of the teams that have over spent on players. No way is Mario Williams worth the price he got paid in Buffalo. No way.

claymore
03-19-2012, 09:36 AM
You're exactly right. Don't overspend on guys that will never play up to their deals. But when two of the four FAs that you've visited with didn't even play last year, I have serious concerns about your strategy. I also am frustrated at the lack of visits. I'm not asking for the biggest name at every position but I am asking for movement.

The best affordable FA's are going to want to go to a team that is in our situation (Tebow/Manning/whoever). So we would have to over pay them. Id rather wait it out, and build thru the draft.

wayninja
03-19-2012, 09:37 AM
Oh for christ sake Steve. Your worried about visits? Really? Come on. Who gives a shit about visits? We arent the ones running the team. If they dont feel someone who is a FA is going to help this team than they would be the ones to know. Hell, McClain came here but i can tell you now i dont think he is that special. He is basically a system LB who benefitted a lot from the guys around him yet i see a lot of you slobbering over him like he is Brian Urlacher. lol

Which is it north? You don't want to go for big names and overspend, you don't want to go after small fish, or you just trust that everything the FO does must be the right move?

McClain would have filled an immediate need. He's not the best ILB int he world, but he's way better than Joe Mays.

Jsteve01
03-19-2012, 09:37 AM
you're right since we can't go after McClain/Lofton/Tulloch Joe Mays should do nicely. Hell at this rate the only DT on our roster will be Warren and Unrein. There is a balance to free agency. Don't overspend early but don't hold your cash too long or you end up overspending for 2nd and 3rd tier guys late.

Jsteve01
03-19-2012, 09:39 AM
Bunkley isn't avg lmao. if he were an UT he'd be subpar but according to PFF he was hands down the best 4-3 NT in the league vs the run last year. That's not someone you let walk at the ripe old age of 27.

BigDaddyBronco
03-19-2012, 09:44 AM
Hell the Packers build throuogh the draft, but they retain their own FA's as well. They paid good money to keep Finley even though they have plenty of guys on that team to catch the ball. Why? Because he is a hell of a TE.

I wouldn't pay crazy money to keep Bunkley, but when they didn't get Soliai they immediately got into the position where they had to pay Bunkley more than they wanted. Or you can try and replace Bunkley with some scrubs, we see how well that has worked over the years.

We can't build through the draft because we suck at drafting and never draft certain positions. I bet we don't take a DT in the first 3 rounds this year, lose Bunkley and replace him with a 34 year old DT on the way out of the league and then have posters on here wonder why we are getting the ball run down our throat and have no interior pass rush.

Northman
03-19-2012, 09:45 AM
Which is it north? You don't want to go for big names and overspend, you don't want to go after small fish, or you just trust that everything the FO does must be the right move?

McClain would have filled an immediate need. He's not the best ILB int he world, but he's way better than Joe Mays.


Do i trust the FO? Absolutely. I havent felt this confident in the FO in a very long time. And you cant overspend on guys just for the sake of doing it. We have to learn our lesson from the latter part of the Shanny era. IHOP anyone? And while McClain would of filled a need he also came from a 3-4 defense, one that Denver has started to stray away from. Mays is more familiar with the team right now and team chemistry is important.

Northman
03-19-2012, 09:46 AM
you're right since we can't go after McClain/Lofton/Tulloch Joe Mays should do nicely. Hell at this rate the only DT on our roster will be Warren and Unrein. There is a balance to free agency. Don't overspend early but don't hold your cash too long or you end up overspending for 2nd and 3rd tier guys late.

Again, chemistry. The biggest need for Denver is DT and we lost out to other bidders in that regard. It happens.

BORDERLINE
03-19-2012, 09:46 AM
I think Bowlen and Elway deserve our patience. Constantly calling them out for not picking guys up that A. dont want to be here, or B. We dont want them here... is ridiculous.

We are in the hunt for the most expensive dude ever. So, money probably isnt an issue.

I think Elway deserves our patience. But if Bowlen is unwilling to fork up the cash that's on him. He's the one that kept Shanny as the GM after all those failed FA pick up's. And then turns the franchise over to McDouche (I liked the pick up AT THE TIME) and let's him run the franchise to his liking with no oversight much like SHANNY. His decisions made HIM PAY. But that's just how I look at it.

It seems you feel like it's justified just going after Manning will be the end all be all. Clay, we might not get him and then what? Like I said in a previous post the 49ers franchised Goldson. Signed Moss/Manningham and are in the Manning sweepstakes plus I read a report that they might go after M.Wallace!!!! These guys came prepared for FA not to just pick up one guy and dick around.

We also need a CB. Carr was out there for a time and Porter is still available. Porter is visiting with OAK!!! And who are we looking at? rookie CB? It looks like we hit it BIG with Chris Harris but WE need to see more. So what's the plan?

Jsteve01
03-19-2012, 09:47 AM
Do i trust the FO? Absolutely. I havent felt this confident in the FO in a very long time. And you cant overspend on guys just for the sake of doing it. We have to learn our lesson from the latter part of the Shanny era. IHOP anyone? And while McClain would of filled a need he also came from a 3-4 defense, one that Denver has started to stray away from. Mays is more familiar with the team right now and team chemistry is important.

As is not missing tackles. Mays missed more tackles than any other 4-3 Mike in the league last year.

Northman
03-19-2012, 09:49 AM
I think Elway deserves our patience. But if Bowlen is unwilling to fork up the cash that's on him. He's the one that kept Shanny as the GM after all those failed FA pick up's. And then turns the franchise over to McDouche (I liked the pick up AT THE TIME) and let's him run the franchise to his liking with no oversight much like SHANNY. His decisions made HIM PAY. But that's just how I look at it.

It seems you feel like it's justified just going after Manning will be the end all be all. Clay, we might not get him and then what? Like I said in a previous post the 49ers franchised Goldson. Signed Moss/Manningham and are in the Manning sweepstakes plus I read a report that they might go after M.Wallace!!!! These guys came prepared for FA not to just pick up one guy and dick around.

We also need a CB. Carr was out there for a time and Porter is still available. Porter is visiting with OAK!!! And who are we looking at? rookie CB? It looks like we hit it BIG with Chris Harris but WE need to see more. So what's the plan?


Patience? Whats that? Oh, thats only something that Tebow deserves......

claymore
03-19-2012, 09:50 AM
Do i trust the FO? Absolutely. I havent felt this confident in the FO in a very long time. And you cant overspend on guys just for the sake of doing it. We have to learn our lesson from the latter part of the Shanny era. IHOP anyone? And while McClain would of filled a need he also came from a 3-4 defense, one that Denver has started to stray away from. Mays is more familiar with the team right now and team chemistry is important.

Yeah, Im in love with this FO. They inherited a turd sandwhich and have been taking a ton of shit over Tebow. I cant believe how well they have handled things.

We wont attract the FA's we want until we get some things Ironed out. We still have a HUGE head scratcher as our starting QB. Nobody wants a part of that.

Northman
03-19-2012, 09:50 AM
As is not missing tackles. Mays missed more tackles than any other 4-3 Mike in the league last year.


Oi vey. You guys give me a headache.

Northman
03-19-2012, 09:52 AM
Yeah, Im in love with this FO. They inherited a turd sandwhich and have been taking a ton of shit over Tebow. I cant believe how well they have handled things.

We wont attract the FA's we want until we get some things Ironed out. We still have a HUGE head scratcher as our starting QB. Nobody wants a part of that.


Indeed. But what do they know? All the armchair GM's here have all the answers. lmao

claymore
03-19-2012, 09:53 AM
I think Elway deserves our patience. But if Bowlen is unwilling to fork up the cash that's on him. He's the one that kept Shanny as the GM after all those failed FA pick up's. And then turns the franchise over to McDouche (I liked the pick up AT THE TIME) and let's him run the franchise to his liking with no oversight much like SHANNY. His decisions made HIM PAY. But that's just how I look at it.

It seems you feel like it's justified just going after Manning will be the end all be all. Clay, we might not get him and then what? Like I said in a previous post the 49ers franchised Goldson. Signed Moss/Manningham and are in the Manning sweepstakes plus I read a report that they might go after M.Wallace!!!! These guys came prepared for FA not to just pick up one guy and dick around.

We also need a CB. Carr was out there for a time and Porter is still available. Porter is visiting with OAK!!! And who are we looking at? rookie CB? It looks like we hit it BIG with Chris Harris but WE need to see more. So what's the plan?

The plan B if we dont get Manning is to get Barkley. Manning is the only player that can take us to the next level. No other combination of FA's out there will take us to the next level.

We will suck if we cant get Manning. No sense in making promises to a bunch of FA's here when we will be slopping thru shit next year with Tebow. THen we will have a locker room full of non bronco whiners... No thanks...

Krugan
03-19-2012, 09:54 AM
This FA period obviously isnt about money, they are willing throw millions ata single player.

Im not sure why there isnt more unease with the FO, there are missing parts all over, and we havent made a step to keep one of our own in one of the weakest spots.

Every year this place screams abotu DTs, and we had one who actually was producing here, and let him go. Why not the screaming about that move?

Its been reported that FA are "on hold" until this manning deal shakes out, that right there is poor management. You never puts all your eggs in one basket, with anything.

wayninja
03-19-2012, 09:58 AM
Exactly, if we can't get manning, we should just forfeit the season. There's no sense in trying, sorta like last season.

pnbronco
03-19-2012, 10:01 AM
had to re-sign mays, hes the only LB on the roster who isnt under suspension!
bunk aint gone yet, stop packing his bags.

:lol: and yet so true.......
Mays was never brought in here to be a full time LB. He was brought in to be strong on ST and help out at LB.

Clay is right and a bunch today. What we need we have needed for over 10 years. Plus do you really want to pay out over 20% of your cap space to misses. Plus I just posted in another thread that Bowlen had to pay Shanny's asst coaches the full years salary the year he was fire and Shanny spent a lot of money on support cost before he left.

I look at this way. I could buy Starbucks every day if I wanted to because I have the money, but I don't. I save it and when I want to buy a car for cash I can.

Plus I agree with Clay.....man that sounds weird....sorry sweetie. I don't think a lot of the FA's are interested in coming here right at this moment. Look Royal was not interested in staying here with the QB situation as it stands. WR are what they are they want to catch passes, see themselves in highlights to get better contracts. That's just who they are. Royal was just more PC than Lloyd, but they felt the same way.

claymore
03-19-2012, 10:04 AM
:lol: and yet so true.......
Mays was never brought in here to be a full time LB. He was brought in to be strong on ST and help out at LB.

Clay is right and a bunch today. What we need we have needed for over 10 years. Plus do you really want to pay out over 20% of your cap space to misses. Plus I just posted in another thread that Bowlen had to pay Shanny's asst coaches the full years salary the year he was fire and Shanny spent a lot of money on support cost before he left.

I look at this way. I could buy Starbucks every day if I wanted to because I have the money, but I don't. I save it and when I want to buy a car for cash I can.

Plus I agree with Clay.....man that sounds weird....sorry sweetie. I don't think a lot of the FA's are interested in coming here right at this moment. Look Royal was not interested in staying here with the QB situation as it stands. WR are what they are they want to catch passes, see themselves in highlights to get better contracts. That's just who they are. Royal was just more PC than Lloyd, but they felt the same way.

Not alot of people want to admit it, but Tebow does not attract FA's.

Krugan
03-19-2012, 10:09 AM
Not alot of people want to admit it, but Tebow does not attract FA's.

Pretty broad keyboard strokes there, to stick it down to one player causing lack of desire to be here.

Any one of these guys would have come here and listened to offers had the team invited them. We had 3 players here, and the brain trust hopped a plane to NC.

Wouldnt inspire me to want to be there, if I was 2nd fiddle in a 1 piece band.

Chef Zambini
03-19-2012, 10:09 AM
Exactly, if we can't get manning, we should just forfeit the season. There's no sense in trying, sorta like last season.your sarcasm is delightful.

pnbronco
03-19-2012, 10:10 AM
Bingo. Its hilarious that Clay is now the voice of reason. :lol:

I know....and you and I are on the same side....:lol:

Spending money because you can doesn't make you a better business man. If the FO decides that they will try to get the best FA out there and spend the money on him then great, because it will change our team right away. However if there long term plan is to fix what's broken with the draft then better yet for our team.

claymore
03-19-2012, 10:16 AM
Pretty broad keyboard strokes there, to stick it down to one player causing lack of desire to be here.

Any one of these guys would have come here and listened to offers had the team invited them. We had 3 players here, and the brain trust hopped a plane to NC.

Wouldnt inspire me to want to be there, if I was 2nd fiddle in a 1 piece band.The issues surrounding Tebow are vast. So you have to use broad strokes.

Lack of talent at QB, religious, weird fan cult stuff, rah rah leadership style, and no other real talent outside of a maybe 10 players on the team. Bubby brister wouldnt have attracted FA's either. I think the mess (all inclusive) surrounding Tebow might actually frighten the good FA's off.

Chef Zambini
03-19-2012, 10:18 AM
look at the WR that have bailed on the broncos since tebow arrived.
anyone see any TEs ligning up to be a bronco, or a runningback?
nopw if we land9ed0 manning wouldnt that pave the way for more FA interest?
ity would seem to justify the pursuit of the white whale.
how else can EFX get out from under the tebow phenomenon, unless they can replace him with someone like manning?
free agency aint over, the drat remains, can we lower the rifles on the firing aquad and offer elway something other than a cigarette and a blind-fold?

Chef Zambini
03-19-2012, 10:19 AM
The issues surrounding Tebow are vast. So you have to use broad strokes.

Lack of talent at QB, religious, weird fan cult stuff, rah rah leadership style, and no other real talent outside of a maybe 10 players on the team. Bubby brister wouldnt have attracted FA's either. I think the mess (all inclusive) surrounding Tebow might actually frighten the good FA's off.I like stroking broads.

Mike
03-19-2012, 10:21 AM
I know....and you and I are on the same side....:lol:

Spending money because you can doesn't make you a better business man. If the FO decides that they will try to get the best FA out there and spend the money on him then great, because it will change our team right away. However if there long term plan is to fix what's broken with the draft then better yet for our team.

This team is in no way better than we were 1-2 years ago. It can be argued that we are worse. There are multiple FAs out there that would immediately be better than the crap we have starting, on both sides of the ball. Hell, outside of a 3rd string MLB, we can't even re-sign our own players. We have the money, so spend it. I am not talking about spending money to spend it. But with the holes we have, spending anything is improvement. And show some freaking class and interest in the players that are coming to visit.

SD and KC have brought in players and spent money to make them better. While we put everything on hold for a player that has no interest in playing for us.

As is, this team will finish in the bottom 5 this year. Probably finish 4 and miss out on the top QBs there.

Timmy!
03-19-2012, 10:27 AM
Bronco talk is like pulling teeth this offseason. Somebody sacrifice a small woodland creature to the football gods or something already.

Krugan
03-19-2012, 10:38 AM
The issues surrounding Tebow are vast. So you have to use broad strokes.

Lack of talent at QB, religious, weird fan cult stuff, rah rah leadership style, and no other real talent outside of a maybe 10 players on the team. Bubby brister wouldnt have attracted FA's either. I think the mess (all inclusive) surrounding Tebow might actually frighten the good FA's off.

Thats a one sided opinion, which im sure your aware of.

I try not to look at as everything "glass half empty". I see upside to the player, I see downside to the following, but it doesnt cloud the overall picture for me.

We are talent lacking, and have been for awhile, not just due to Tebow being here. That as much as we arent trying to bring people in due to the chasing of manning, has more to do with it than just 1 guy.

Mike
03-19-2012, 10:40 AM
Tolbert signs with the Panthers.

wayninja
03-19-2012, 10:46 AM
How many picks do we have in the draft again? How many holes and depth issues?

yeah, draft is all we need.

wayninja
03-19-2012, 10:47 AM
look at the WR that have bailed on the broncos since tebow arrived.

Huh? Not a single WR has 'bailed' on the broncos since Tebow arrived. We traded away a few and didn't re-sign another... Not sure how that equates to them 'bailing'.

claymore
03-19-2012, 10:48 AM
Thats a one sided opinion, which im sure your aware of.

I try not to look at as everything "glass half empty". I see upside to the player, I see downside to the following, but it doesnt cloud the overall picture for me.

We are talent lacking, and have been for awhile, not just due to Tebow being here. That as much as we arent trying to bring people in due to the chasing of manning, has more to do with it than just 1 guy.

All we can do is give our opinion because none of us really know.

I have a hard time believing Elway doesnt want to upgrade talent, I also have a hard time believing FA's think Tebow is the long term solution, and would want to be a part of the drama on the horizon.

I dont see what we would have to offer other than money. So, we would have to overpay. Which, I dont think we are going to do. Especially, when we will probably suck anyway.

Northman
03-19-2012, 10:48 AM
Pretty broad keyboard strokes there, to stick it down to one player causing lack of desire to be here.



Not really. Its one reason why Lloyd wanted out of Denver.

chazoe60
03-19-2012, 10:49 AM
The point of the offseason is to get better. If we don't pull a rabbit out of out hat and sign Manning then we have done nothing but get worse this offseason. Oh, but lets go ahead and blame it on Tebow. That dude is the reason for all of our troubles actually.

wayninja
03-19-2012, 10:49 AM
I'm sure when we have no quarterback, we will be much more attractive to FA's.

Northman
03-19-2012, 10:51 AM
This team is in no way better than we were 1-2 years ago. It can be argued that we are worse. There are multiple FAs out there that would immediately be better than the crap we have starting, on both sides of the ball. Hell, outside of a 3rd string MLB, we can't even re-sign our own players. We have the money, so spend it. I am not talking about spending money to spend it. But with the holes we have, spending anything is improvement. And show some freaking class and interest in the players that are coming to visit.

SD and KC have brought in players and spent money to make them better. While we put everything on hold for a player that has no interest in playing for us.

As is, this team will finish in the bottom 5 this year. Probably finish 4 and miss out on the top QBs there.


So i guess we wont be seeing you on the forum much?

wayninja
03-19-2012, 10:51 AM
The guys that have visited and we let walk only came as a courtesy. In all actuality, they were scared shitless of playing with Tebow.

Northman
03-19-2012, 10:52 AM
How many picks do we have in the draft again? How many holes and depth issues?

yeah, draft is all we need.


Yes, because GB solved all that in one year. :rolleyes:

Mike
03-19-2012, 10:53 AM
So i guess we wont be seeing you on the forum much?

No, I will be here. And probably bitch as much as clay did the last year or two.

Northman
03-19-2012, 10:53 AM
I'm sure when we have no quarterback, we will be much more attractive to FA's.


We dont have a QB now, whats the difference?

wayninja
03-19-2012, 10:53 AM
Yes, because GB solved all that in one year. :rolleyes:

That's true, this is the first year we've had this problem. :rolleyes:

BigDaddyBronco
03-19-2012, 10:54 AM
You know, I wouldn't be bitching if we were in the middle of the pack in terms of unspent money. But aren't we dead last? Again tell me how this isn't the Clippers? Every guy you can over analyze and make excuses why he isn't worth what he wants, but the bottom line is the whole group of players is at the bottom of the barrel in terms of payroll. That tells you that our current cast does not have the talent to play for other teams or are due some money when their contracts are up.

I guess this will be a five year project to build through the draft since we suck at drafting and don't pay to retain our key talent.

wayninja
03-19-2012, 10:54 AM
We dont have a QB now, whats the difference?

Yes, we do, the guy who's earned the starting job going into camp that Elway hopes will be here for a long, long time. :lol:

claymore
03-19-2012, 10:55 AM
No, I will be here. And probably bitch as much as clay did the last year or two.

The problem is you were positive when you shouldnt have been, and are being negative when you should be positive. Its all moot till Tebow is gone. We cant get bette

Northman
03-19-2012, 10:55 AM
That's true, this is the first year we've had this problem. :rolleyes:


The rebuilding is still in effect. We didnt start until 2010. Green Bay did what? 3-4 years before they finally reached the potential and a SB?

BroncoJoe
03-19-2012, 10:56 AM
Bowlen has always ponied up the money and spend on free agents - save the past couple years, and I don't blame him. He had coaches WAY overspending, paying dudes that weren't even in the league anymore and it got him exactly one playoff win in 10 years.

If my kid kept coming to me for money and was being irresponsible with it and just blowing it, I'd eventually cut them off too.

Northman
03-19-2012, 10:56 AM
Yes, we do, the guy who's earned the starting job going into camp that Elway hopes will be here for a long, long time. :lol:


Oh, the FB who thinks he is a QB. Yes, your right. lmao

wayninja
03-19-2012, 10:56 AM
The rebuilding is still in effect. We didnt start until 2010. Green Bay did what? 3-4 years before they finally reached the potential and a SB?

We didn't start until 2010? Which time?

Mike
03-19-2012, 10:57 AM
The problem is you were positive when you shouldnt have been, and are being negative when you should be positive. Its all moot till Tebow is gone. We cant get bette

To be honest, I am just trying to do reverse-mojo, jedi mind-trick the FO. I think there is a lot of time to make things happen.

wayninja
03-19-2012, 10:58 AM
Oh, the FB who thinks he is a QB. Yes, your right. lmao

Yeah, the FB who beat the number one ranked defense in the first Broncos playoff game in 6 years. LMAO

I'm enjoying this sarcasm joust, btw.

BigDaddyBronco
03-19-2012, 10:59 AM
Bowlen has always ponied up the money and spend on free agents - save the past couple years, and I don't blame him. He had coaches WAY overspending, paying dudes that weren't even in the league anymore and it got him exactly one playoff win in 10 years.

If my kid kept coming to me for money and was being irresponsible with it and just blowing it, I'd eventually cut them off too.

Yea, but now he has gone into miser mode. He isn't spending the money to maintain the team. I agree that Shanny spent to much money and never delivered, I don't blame Bowlen for not wanting to do that. But when you make the playoffs, and can actually improve and continue to build your defense, why not spend the money to incrementally get better?

He is at the bottom of the barrel in team payroll. This isn't not wanting to waste money, this is something else.

wayninja
03-19-2012, 11:01 AM
We aren't talking about spending 10's of millions dollars chasing near-retirement age has-beens. We can't even re-sign our halfway decent DT.

BigDaddyBronco
03-19-2012, 11:02 AM
Maybe with Manning we can get some guys at discount.

Northman
03-19-2012, 11:04 AM
Yeah, the FB who beat the number one ranked defense in the first Broncos playoff game in 6 years. LMAO

I'm enjoying this sarcasm joust, btw.

The same guy who scored 10 points vs one of the worst defenses in the league. Yea, that guy. :lol:

BigDaddyBronco
03-19-2012, 11:05 AM
All it took for us to spend $100M on Manning was for me to start this thread.

Thank you very much....

pnbronco
03-19-2012, 11:07 AM
To be honest, I am just trying to do reverse-mojo, jedi mind-trick the FO. I think there is a lot of time to make things happen.

Man Mike you had me freaked and it looks like it worked. Heck I thought it was a long shot, I don't know if I'm going to cry or dance....

BTW I saw this article as I was looking something up...


One of the interesting, under the radar stories after the first few days of free agents has been the lack of action on linebackers. None of the notable 4-3 MIKE LBs have signed at this point and in the case of Stephen Tulloch, widely seen as the top guy, there hasn't even been a visit scheduled..

rest of article....http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2012/3/18/2882432/nfl-free-agency-lb-market-still-wide-open

Northman
03-19-2012, 11:11 AM
Im so happy right now. Finally, the circus can leave town.

Mike
03-19-2012, 11:26 AM
Man Mike you had me freaked and it looks like it worked. Heck I thought it was a long shot, I don't know if I'm going to cry or dance....

BTW I saw this article as I was looking something up...


One of the interesting, under the radar stories after the first few days of free agents has been the lack of action on linebackers. None of the notable 4-3 MIKE LBs have signed at this point and in the case of Stephen Tulloch, widely seen as the top guy, there hasn't even been a visit scheduled..

rest of article....http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2012/3/18/2882432/nfl-free-agency-lb-market-still-wide-open

I am not kidding. Every time I started feeling like we'd get him and started talking about it, there'd be a bad news report. When I started being negative, there'd be something positive. Reverse mojo from now on.

pnbronco
03-19-2012, 11:36 AM
I am not kidding. Every time I started feeling like we'd get him and started talking about it, there'd be a bad news report. When I started being negative, there'd be something positive. Reverse mojo from now on.

Totally understand that. I went back and forth like 4 times about trying to get tickets next year. The guy I buy them from is letting his son take the ones I normally get. He said that he might be able to get 2 more but it would be one in front of the other. I just could not spend the money if it was more of the KC game, so I kept saying get, don't get them. Every time I said get them, bad news would come out. So on Friday I said, don't. Now he will try today, but I'm sure they are gone and I will gladly give them up if the reverse mojo worked.......:D

NightTrainLayne
03-19-2012, 11:48 AM
Who the hell is David Sterling?

I tried to google him, and this thread actually comes up as a 1st page result: https://www.google.com/#hl=en&sclient=psy-ab&q=david+sterling+football&oq=david+sterling+football&aq=f&aqi=g-v1&aql=&gs_sm=3&gs_upl=8843l10327l1l10999l9l5l0l4l4l0l406l1297l0.2 .2.0.1l8l0&gs_l=hp.3..0i15.8843l10327l1l10999l9l5l0l4l4l0l406 l1297l0j2j2j0j1l8l0.frgbld.&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=6065204996ecaac3&biw=1024&bih=571


And... wow. I was in this thread, and got side-tracked with work. .. .then back to reading this thread and it appears there is some good news. . ..what a crazy way to find out. :D

BroncoJoe
03-19-2012, 12:16 PM
Yea, but now he has gone into miser mode. He isn't spending the money to maintain the team. I agree that Shanny spent to much money and never delivered, I don't blame Bowlen for not wanting to do that. But when you make the playoffs, and can actually improve and continue to build your defense, why not spend the money to incrementally get better?

He is at the bottom of the barrel in team payroll. This isn't not wanting to waste money, this is something else.

Let's see what happens now that Manning has apparently chosen us. I would guess that plays a part in how they now approach the FA market.

BigDaddyBronco
03-19-2012, 12:23 PM
Who the hell is David Sterling?

I tried to google him, and this thread actually comes up as a 1st page result: https://www.google.com/#hl=en&sclient=psy-ab&q=david+sterling+football&oq=david+sterling+football&aq=f&aqi=g-v1&aql=&gs_sm=3&gs_upl=8843l10327l1l10999l9l5l0l4l4l0l406l1297l0.2 .2.0.1l8l0&gs_l=hp.3..0i15.8843l10327l1l10999l9l5l0l4l4l0l406 l1297l0j2j2j0j1l8l0.frgbld.&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=6065204996ecaac3&biw=1024&bih=571


And... wow. I was in this thread, and got side-tracked with work. .. .then back to reading this thread and it appears there is some good news. . ..what a crazy way to find out. :D

LOL. I meant Donald Sterling. BTW, this thread was a reverse-mojo thread. It is the reason Manning picked the Broncos, so have some respect.

slim
03-19-2012, 12:24 PM
All it took for us to spend $100M on Manning was for me to start this thread.

Thank you very much....

Thanks BDB....