PDA

View Full Version : Pat Bowlen's letter to Broncos fans



Pages : [1] 2

ChairmanBron
04-03-2009, 02:01 PM
http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_12064844
By The Denver Post
Posted: 04/03/2009 12:55:35 PM MDT


Issued April 4, 2009:


Dear Broncos Fan,

I am writing this letter today because I feel compelled to give our community and our fans an explanation regarding the Jay Cutler situation.

One of my directives to Josh McDaniels upon his hiring was that he consider everything possible to return the Broncos to the level which you and I both expect, and this certainly includes making a fair evaluation of every opportunity presented to us which might improve the team. He and General Manager Brian Xanders have had my complete support throughout, and they have it now. It is important that you know that at all times we represented ourselves to Jay with honesty and integrity.

I assure you both Josh and I made repeated attempts to reach out to Jay, and I can not speak for him as to why he chose to limit his response. Ultimately, given his unwillingness to speak with either of us directly in the last 12 days- at the same time his agent clearly stating to us Jay's intentions- it became very apparent to me personally that he no longer wanted to play for the Denver Broncos. As such, we elected to trade him.

Understand this: it remains about team. Our franchise has gone to the Super Bowl six times, with three different coaches and with many different players. It has never been about one player, and it never will be. Coach McDaniels shares this vision, and everyone in the organization—players, coaches and staff—must understand and accept this unconditionally. If anyone does not, that person will not be a part of this franchise.

I am extremely proud of our franchise, its accomplishments, and the region and fans that we represent. We have an illustrious history, one which we are all anxious to add to, and if someone does not wish to be with us as we head in this direction, then we will move on, and move forward.

Over 96% of our season ticket holders have chosen to renew their tickets for the 2009 season. This is once again a compelling statement of support and trust by the greatest fans in the NFL, and I assure you my only goal is and always will be to compete at the highest championship level.

The Denver Broncos will move forward in 2009 as one team, united with the most loyal and passionate fan base in football, towards the only goal we will ever pursue.

Thank you for taking the time to read this and for your understanding and continued support.

Sincerely,

Pat Bowlen

girler
04-03-2009, 02:03 PM
Dear Broncos Fan,

Wow. Even Pat is acknowledging there is only one fan left. :Cry:

JKcatch724
04-03-2009, 02:05 PM
That's why Pat Bowlen is the shit.

dogfish
04-03-2009, 02:05 PM
gee, thanks pat. . . . now i feel SOOOOO much better about the whole thing. . . .


SMH




show us some results, and until such time as you can, save the speeches. . . . enh, flame away. . . .

Zweems56
04-03-2009, 02:07 PM
Lemons into lemonade. We'll survive.

topscribe
04-03-2009, 02:08 PM
Thank you for that. I went through a phase where I was doubting Mr. Bowlen,
but he is showing that he knows what he is doing. I believe part of our
problem as fans is that we were hoping against hope that Cutler was our next
Elway. He could have been, but for one difference: the difference that lies
between the ears. There is where Elway had it and Cutler did not.

We are witnessing how a team can downgrade in talent, while becoming a
better team. At this point, I would not trade Mr. Bowlen for any other owner
in sports.

-topscribe

-----

roomemp
04-03-2009, 02:09 PM
I liked that. He took the time to speak to us fans. Very classy guy. Very classy organization.

getlynched47
04-03-2009, 02:09 PM
I am extremely proud of our franchise

We'll see what different tune Bowlen is singing when McDaniels struggles to win games without a threat at Quarterback...

roomemp
04-03-2009, 02:10 PM
We'll see what different tune Bowlen is singing when McDaniels struggles to win games without a threat at Quarterback...

Yeah I agree :tsk:

CoachChaz
04-03-2009, 02:10 PM
We'll see what different tune Bowlen is singing when McDaniels struggles to win games without a threat at Quarterback...

Ignorance is bliss

claymore
04-03-2009, 02:10 PM
It could have only been better if he signed it with love "instead" of "Sincerely".

Zweems56
04-03-2009, 02:13 PM
It could have only been better if he signed it with love "instead" of "Sincerely".

I prefer "forever yours"

claymore
04-03-2009, 02:13 PM
gee, thanks pat. . . . now i feel SOOOOO much better about the whole thing. . . .


SMH




show us some results, and until such time as you can, save the speeches. . . . enh, flame away. . . .


We'll see what different tune Bowlen is singing when McDaniels struggles to win games without a threat at Quarterback...

All we can do is drive on guys. We have great potential with these picks. And I think we will all be surprised by Orton.

Zweems56
04-03-2009, 02:14 PM
all we can do is drive on guys. We have great potential with these picks. And i think we will all be surprised by orton.

there's my positive claymore!

getlynched47
04-03-2009, 02:16 PM
All we can do is drive on guys. We have great potential with these picks. And I think we will all be surprised by Orton.

Yeah, unfortunately it's over. But I wont stop flaming McDaniels until I see what he does in the draft ;)

OB
04-03-2009, 02:18 PM
I liked the letter :salute:

Tempus Fugit
04-03-2009, 02:20 PM
Yeah, unfortunately it's over. But I wont stop flaming McDaniels until I see what he does in the draft ;)

Newsflash:

In a startling turn of events in Denver, Colorado, it was discovered today that Josh McDaniels is only the head coach of the Denver Broncos. Apparently unknown to Broncos fans, a man with the last name of "Xanders" is the team's general manager, and another man named "Bowlen" is the team's owner and making the final decisions. This shocking discovery was made when McDaniels, in a moment of candor, admitted that the notion of trading Cutler away never even got serious enough to put before this mystery owner prior to Cutler's bout with severe PMS.

Stay tuned for new developments as warranted.

claymore
04-03-2009, 02:23 PM
Newsflash:

In a startling turn of events in Denver, Colorado, it was discovered today that Josh McDaniels is only the head coach of the Denver Broncos. Apparently unknown to Broncos fans, a man with the last name of "Xanders" is the team's general manager, and another man named "Bowlen" is the team's owner and making the final decisions. This shocking discovery was made when McDaniels, in a moment of candor, admitted that the notion of trading Cutler away never even got serious enough to put before this mystery owner prior to Cutler's bout with severe PMS.

Stay tuned for new developments as warranted.

That doesnt take the hurt away for some. Only winning will cure that.

getlynched47
04-03-2009, 02:24 PM
Newsflash:

In a startling turn of events in Denver, Colorado, it was discovered today that Josh McDaniels is only the head coach of the Denver Broncos. Apparently unknown to Broncos fans, a man with the last name of "Xanders" is the team's general manager, and another man named "Bowlen" is the team's owner and making the final decisions. This shocking discovery was made when McDaniels, in a moment of candor, admitted that the notion of trading Cutler away never even got serious enough to put before this mystery owner prior to Cutler's bout with severe PMS.

Stay tuned for new developments as warranted.

Doesnt mean anything to me unless McDaniels shows that he can win without a franchise QB.

weazel
04-03-2009, 02:26 PM
As a long time Chicago Blackhawks fan, I have to state how cool this kind of thing is. The owner of the Blackhawks, Bill Wirtz, would never have done that. Heck, he wouldnt talk that nice to his own players, let alone the fans.

We are lucky to be fans of an organization with such a great owner and respected person not only in the NFL but in all sports.

claymore
04-03-2009, 02:28 PM
As a long time Chicago Blackhawks fan, I have to state how cool this kind of thing is. The owner of the Blackhawks, Bill Wirtz, would never have done that. Heck, he wouldnt talk that nice to his own players, let alone the fans.

We are lucky to be fans of an organization with such a great owner and respected person not only in the NFL but in all sports.

He made millions by putting that letter out. It was as much a business decision as anything. :D

CoachChaz
04-03-2009, 02:30 PM
Doesnt mean anything to me unless McDaniels shows that he can win without a franchise QB.

Post Elway, the same could be said about Shanny

Tempus Fugit
04-03-2009, 02:30 PM
That doesnt take the hurt away for some. Only winning will cure that.

That's fine, but it doesn't justify the sort of over-the-top stuff that's been posted. The majority of the evidence favors the notion that McDaniels/Xanders did not initiate trade talks. Peter King is sticking by his assertion that Cutler made a trade request well before this situation even came about. Cutler has publicly undercut his own credibility by officially requesting a trade and then trying to claim that he didn't want to be traded. Cutler, according to reports, didn't return attempts to contact him made by the team, his agent (his agent verified this one) and his now ex-teammates.

The reality is that, to a reasonable person, Cutler/Cook has clearly been the one most responsible for the situation. The vitriol that's been aimed at McDaniels has been just ridiculous.

DenBronx
04-03-2009, 02:36 PM
bowlen said it in his press conferance when he fired shanahan, "i may be making a mistake"

well, only time will tell now. our offense has been dismantled and we shall see.

weazel
04-03-2009, 02:36 PM
He made millions by putting that letter out. It was as much a business decision as anything. :D

business decision or not, like I said, Wirtz would never have done that. We are so lucky to be fans of a team owned by Bowlen. He wants to win, and he cares.

I am not happy when people die, but knowing Bill Wirtz no longer has the 'hawks in his grasp makes me giddy!

claymore
04-03-2009, 02:37 PM
That's fine, but it doesn't justify the sort of over-the-top stuff that's been posted. The majority of the evidence favors the notion that McDaniels/Xanders did not initiate trade talks. Peter King is sticking by his assertion that Cutler made a trade request well before this situation even came about. Cutler has publicly undercut his own credibility by officially requesting a trade and then trying to claim that he didn't want to be traded. Cutler, according to reports, didn't return attempts to contact him made by the team, his agent (his agent verified this one) and his now ex-teammates.

The reality is that, to a reasonable person, Cutler/Cook has clearly been the one most responsible for the situation. The vitriol that's been aimed at McDaniels has been just ridiculous.
Bottom line we got Solid value in the trade. Jay Cutler was only here 3 years but its one of the best draft picks weve ever made.

CoachChaz
04-03-2009, 02:38 PM
bowlen said it in his press conferance when he fired shanahan, "i may be making a mistake"

well, only time will tell now. our offense has been dismantled and we shall see.

Dismantled? Give me a break

weazel
04-03-2009, 02:38 PM
bowlen said it in his press conferance when he fired shanahan, "i may be making a mistake"

well, only time will tell now. our offense has been dismantled and we shall see.

dismantled! :rolleyes:

JONtheBRONCO
04-03-2009, 02:42 PM
We'll see what different tune Bowlen is singing when McDaniels struggles to win games without a threat at Quarterback...

Jesus, no wonder you got booted out of the mane... Go somewhere else. Seriously.

honz
04-03-2009, 02:42 PM
That doesnt take the hurt away for some. Only whining will cure that.

Fixed. :D

honz
04-03-2009, 02:43 PM
Dismantled? Give me a break

We did cut Nate Jackson.

CoachChaz
04-03-2009, 02:43 PM
We did cut Nate Jackson.

I stand corrected.

roomemp
04-03-2009, 02:43 PM
dismantled! :rolleyes:

Yeah.....You haven't heard.....In addition to Jay ,We just traded Clady, Hamilton, Weigmann, Kuper, Harris, Stokely, Royal, Marshall, and Graham................Oh wait :tsk:

weazel
04-03-2009, 02:44 PM
We did cut Nate Jackson.

but we resigned Putz! ...championship

deacon
04-03-2009, 02:49 PM
Just an interesting side point: I was reading yesterday where The QB of the redskins, after hearing for a week he was going to be replaced by Cutler, said it was time to move on and he was going to do everything he could to help the Redskins win.

If Cutler had been mature enough to have that attitude he'd still be a Bronco.

I think McD and Bowlen made some big blunders in the way they handled the initial reports of the trade that didn't happen. But Cutler was a big baby all the way and he's the one who forced this situation. It's obvious to me that the team is better off with him gone and the distraction removed.

Time to move on.

turftoad
04-03-2009, 02:54 PM
That doesnt take the hurt away for some. Only winning will cure that.

I know what you mean Clay. I wan't this pissed off when Obama was voted in as POTUS.


:D

nmbroncosfan
04-03-2009, 03:03 PM
I've been lucky enough to meet both John Elway and Jay Cutler. Elway was the type that didn't mind visiting with the fan when you were able to run into him face to face and would visit with you. I met Cutler his rookie year at Dove Valley. You could tell Jay was an arrogant jerk, who thought his s-h-i-t didn't stink. You could even see it during games when thing were going right or if they were going wrong, he was a loner on the bench. I don't think he really cared about his teammates or the fans in the long run. It was all about Jay Cutler, IMO.

gregbroncs
04-03-2009, 03:11 PM
bowlen said it in his press conferance when he fired shanahan, "i may be making a mistake"

well, only time will tell now. our offense has been dismantled and we shall see.
I am sorry 1 disgruntled player is not dismantling. This offense still has a ton of talent and is returning one of the best O-lines in football.

getlynched47
04-03-2009, 03:23 PM
Jesus, no wonder you got booted out of the mane... Go somewhere else. Seriously.

No I was banned from Broncos Country for threatening Josh McDaniels :rolleyes:. If you dont like what I have to say, just throw me on the ignore list, it won't bother me

CoachChaz
04-03-2009, 03:26 PM
No I was banned from Broncos Country for threatening Josh McDaniels :rolleyes:. If you dont like what I have to say, just throw me on the ignore list, it won't bother me

Or you could manufacture an intelligent thought and not bait people into arguments with adolescent rhetoric.

Just an idea.

Hawgdriver
04-03-2009, 03:28 PM
He made millions by putting that letter out. It was as much a business decision as anything. :D

booo

Rex
04-03-2009, 03:29 PM
Bottom line we got Solid value in the trade. Jay Cutler was only here 3 years but its one of the best draft picks weve ever made.

Best draft picks ever......really?

Broncolingus
04-03-2009, 03:29 PM
Just an interesting side point: I was reading yesterday where The QB of the redskins, after hearing for a week he was going to be replaced by Cutler, said it was time to move on and he was going to do everything he could to help the Redskins win.

If Cutler had been mature enough to have that attitude he'd still be a Bronco.

I think McD and Bowlen made some big blunders in the way they handled the initial reports of the trade that didn't happen. But Cutler was a big baby all the way and he's the one who forced this situation. It's obvious to me that the team is better off with him gone and the distraction removed.

Time to move on.

Well said young one...

BigDaddyBronco
04-03-2009, 03:30 PM
All we can do is drive on guys. We have great potential with these picks. And I think we will all be surprised by Orton.
Way to sack up Claymore. :salute:

getlynched47
04-03-2009, 03:31 PM
Or you could manufacture an intelligent thought and not bait people into arguments with adolescent rhetoric.

Just an idea.

I dont bait anybody. I share my opinion which is out of the norm most of the time. Since my opinion is different, I get attacked. And just because I still support Jay Cutler (NOT the Bears), I'm an enemy. Tell me who's the one conjuring up stupid arguments. Nice vocab though :coffee:

Poet
04-03-2009, 03:31 PM
bowlen said it in his press conferance when he fired shanahan, "i may be making a mistake"

well, only time will tell now. our offense has been dismantled and we shall see.

Yeah, I mean the best part of your team is gone. Wait a second, you guys didn't trade your offensive line to Chicago. DOH!

You may as well just post "I, DenBronx, think that Jay Cutler run and pass blocks for the team when he is a QB. He also takes over his wideouts mind with his psychic powers and makes them run the right routes."

Broncolingus
04-03-2009, 03:32 PM
Bottom line we got Solid value in the trade. Jay Cutler was only here 3 years but its one of the best draft picks weve ever made.

I thought you said Ted Gregory was Denver's best draft pick ever?

OrangeHoof
04-03-2009, 03:35 PM
It's never a good sign when the owner has to publish an open letter to calm the restless natives. I particularly loved the "96%" claim about season ticket renewals - as if that somehow was a sign that most people supported McDiapers in all of this. You just traded your QB yesterday. Did you think people would so quickly abandoned the season tickets many spent years on a waiting list just to have?

Of course the Broncos will survive. The question is how many years will they travel through the wilderness before they have another coach like Mike Shanahan or another QB with the talent of Jay Cutler? My over/under starts around 8-10 years. Don't forget that not one of the coaches plucked from the Belichick tree has had a particularly successful afterlife but they were almost all hailed as geniuses when they were hired - Weis, Crennel, Mangini.. how many playoff games/bowl games have they won as head coaches?
I think McDiapers will just be one more. And was it worth running the team's best player out of town just so he could have his my-way-or-the-highway moment?

Bowlen has, for the most part, been a great and a classy owner but he has definitely screwed the pooch the past few months and each subsequent move seems only to reinforce that.

keithbishop
04-03-2009, 03:39 PM
gee, thanks pat. . . . now i feel SOOOOO much better about the whole thing. . . .


SMH




show us some results, and until such time as you can, save the speeches. . . . enh, flame away. . . .

How about borrowing from Al The Crypt Keeper and some "Just Win, Baby"? No excuses for our new coach.

weazel
04-03-2009, 03:48 PM
No I was banned from Broncos Country for threatening Josh McDaniels :rolleyes:. If you dont like what I have to say, just throw me on the ignore list, it won't bother me

Ive looked for the ignore, I cant find it.

weazel
04-03-2009, 03:49 PM
No I was banned from Broncos Country for threatening Josh McDaniels :rolleyes:. If you dont like what I have to say, just throw me on the ignore list, it won't bother me

the bears forum is waiting for you. I looked, they dont have getlynched available, but they have getf****d

MOtorboat
04-03-2009, 03:50 PM
Yeah, I mean the best part of your team is gone. Wait a second, you guys didn't trade your offensive line to Chicago. DOH!

You may as well just post "I, DenBronx, think that Jay Cutler run and pass blocks for the team when he is a QB. He also takes over his wideouts mind with his psychic powers and makes them run the right routes."

King, it's only a team game when you are denegrating Cutler.

FYI.

CoachChaz
04-03-2009, 03:50 PM
the bears forum is waiting for you. I looked, they dont have getlynched available, but they have getf****d

Not many posts make me laugh out loud lately, but this one sure as hell did.

Nice!

getlynched47
04-03-2009, 03:52 PM
the bears forum is waiting for you. I looked, they dont have getlynched available, but they have getf****d

I'm a Broncos fan. I've never been a Bears fan.

http://www.lolpats.com/images/epic_fail.jpg

MOtorboat
04-03-2009, 03:54 PM
http://www.lolpats.com/images/epic_fail.jpg

This folks...is what we call irony.

LawDog
04-03-2009, 03:56 PM
I've been lucky enough to meet both John Elway and Jay Cutler. Elway was the type that didn't mind visiting with the fan when you were able to run into him face to face and would visit with you. I met Cutler his rookie year at Dove Valley. You could tell Jay was an arrogant jerk, who thought his s-h-i-t didn't stink. You could even see it during games when thing were going right or if they were going wrong, he was a loner on the bench. I don't think he really cared about his teammates or the fans in the long run. It was all about Jay Cutler, IMO.

Thanks for posting nmbf. I think you said something about Elway and then something about Cutler, not sure 'cause I never really got past your avatar. There oughta be a law...

getlynched47
04-03-2009, 03:56 PM
This folks...is what we call irony.

No irony here. I've never contradicted myself. I've always said that I'm a Broncos fan. Just because I like Jay Cutler, it doesnt mean that I'm a Bears fan now.

What's gotten into you lately?

Poet
04-03-2009, 03:56 PM
King, it's only a team game when you are denegrating Cutler.

FYI.

Oh. In that case, let's put Jay Cutler in the Hall of Fame ASAP!

Poet
04-03-2009, 03:57 PM
No irony here. I've never contradicted myself. I've always said that I'm a Broncos fan. Just because I like Jay Cutler, it doesnt mean that I'm a Bears fan now.

What's gotten into you lately?

He must be allergic to bullshit. :confused:

MOtorboat
04-03-2009, 03:57 PM
No irony here. I've never contradicted myself. I've always said that I'm a Broncos fan. Just because I like Jay Cutler, it doesnt mean that I'm a Bears fan now.

What's gotten into you lately?

Forgive me if I'm sick and tired of the stupid, irrational Cutler rants.

He's gone. Get over it.

Like you said. You're a Broncos fan first, right...well, then get over it.

getlynched47
04-03-2009, 03:59 PM
Forgive me if I'm sick and tired of the stupid, irrational Cutler rants.

He's gone. Get over it.

Like you said. You're a Broncos fan first, right...well, then get over it.

As a Bronco fan, I have a right to dislike the head coach for getting rid of the franchise QB. I understand that it's done and there's no turning back. I'm hoping for the best, but I won't respect McDaniels until I see us winning games.

MOtorboat
04-03-2009, 04:00 PM
As a Bronco fan, I have a right to dislike the head coach for getting rid of the franchise QB. I understand that it's done and there's no turning back. I'm hoping for the best, but I won't respect McDaniels until I see us winning games.

I've got the same right to tell you when you're being irrational. And you're being irrational.

weazel
04-03-2009, 04:01 PM
As a Bronco fan, I have a right to dislike the head coach for getting rid of the franchise QB. I understand that it's done and there's no turning back. I'm hoping for the best, but I won't respect McDaniels until I see us winning games.

:Cry:

Dirk
04-03-2009, 04:12 PM
Wow. Even Pat is acknowledging there is only one fan left. :Cry:

I needed that laugh!!! :salute: :D

getlynched47
04-03-2009, 04:42 PM
I've got the same right to tell you when you're being irrational. And you're being irrational.

Alright then. Just simply because I respect your opinion, I will try to keep an open mind about the situation. I look forward to the possibility of those 2 first round picks being difference makers, and for this trade working out in the best interest of the Denver Broncos. However, I WILL NOT stop being a Jay Cutler fan because he's a Bear. I will support him unless he is playing against us in the regular/post season and I will limit my criticism of Josh McDaniels. Sound good enough?

OrangeHoof
04-03-2009, 06:25 PM
Regardless of who the head coach is, the talent cupboard at Dove Valley is threadbare and just got barer (not bear-er, even though that's a great pun for this situation). Now we have some draft picks to work with but the questions are:

1) Do the Broncos have anybody left who can actually make a sound draft choice? Answer: we don't know because Xanders and McDiapers have no track record.

2) Do the Broncos try to rebuild their piss-poor defense or will McDiapers spend to craft a "state-of-the-art" offense and expect Dick Nolan to forge a defense out of the leftover crumbs? Answer: we don't know because McDiapers has never had to build a defense. How was Nolan's defense in San Francisco?

3) Can the remaining Broncos rally around a coach who is younger than some of his players and has no head coaching experience? Answer: we don't know but the last comparable example is David Shula. Anyone remember how that went?

So expecting anyone to craft a winning team out of such a starting point within 2-3 years shows a lack of understanding about how big a hole the Broncos are in right now. Maybe the front office will reveal themselves as the best drafters since the '74 Steelers, the head coach will win like Chuck Noll and work miracles or maybe they will show they are in way over their heads and produce an epic fail.

History would suggest the latter happens far more often than the former.

atwater27
04-03-2009, 06:36 PM
Bowlen has lost the best coach he ever had, the second best quarterback he will ever have and along with that, his edge. And with his recent decisions, has guaranteed another champiobship will not occur while he still owns the Broncos.

BroncoJoe
04-03-2009, 06:47 PM
To OrangeHoof and atwater27:

:tsk:

Pathetic.

atwater27
04-03-2009, 06:50 PM
To OrangeHoof and atwater27:

:tsk:

Pathetic.

I agree. The Broncos are pathetic right now. Prove me wrong.

BroncoJoe
04-03-2009, 06:51 PM
I agree. The Broncos are pathetic right now. Prove me wrong.

I can't, but they most likely will. To pass judgment before the draft, left alone before they even play a game is childish.

Is that why you're so upset about the Cutler situation?

MOtorboat
04-03-2009, 06:54 PM
I agree. The Broncos are pathetic right now. Prove me wrong.

Prove yourself right.

nevcraw
04-03-2009, 07:11 PM
I can't, but they most likely will. To pass judgment before the draft, left alone before they even play a game is childish.

Is that why you're so upset about the Cutler situation?

what is childish is the group of forum thugs lashing out at anyone who doesn't share their new rosy disposition that all is well in Dove valley.

BroncoJoe
04-03-2009, 07:13 PM
what is childish is the group of forum thugs lashing out at anyone who doesn't share their new rosy disposition that all is well in Dove valley.

I'm simply waiting for the draft, and the season before I pass any judgment. To do otherwise, IMO, is immature and childish.

Den21vsBal19
04-03-2009, 07:14 PM
I'm simply waiting for the draft, and the season before I pass any judgment. To do otherwise, IMO, is immature and childish.
Gotta let the whole process play out..........

MOtorboat
04-03-2009, 07:15 PM
what is childish is the group of forum thugs lashing out at anyone who doesn't share their new rosy disposition that all is well in Dove valley.

You mean, like, how all of the Cutler apologists lashed out at anyone who was rational about the situation?

Really. Seriously?

What a pathetic argument. I'm childish because I'm sick and tired of people defending Cutler as if he was God.

:rolleyes:

I don't have a rosy outlook of Dove Valley right now, but I realize this team's better without that crybaby.

So spare me these broad assumptions.

Bozo Jr.
04-03-2009, 07:22 PM
We'll see what different tune Bowlen is singing when McDaniels struggles to win games without a threat at Quarterback...

Thanks for your positive input, way to support the team...guy. :rolleyes:

omac
04-03-2009, 07:27 PM
Here's the abridged version:

1. I hired McDaniels, and I'm the boss; he can do whatever he wants.

2. Neither I nor McDaniels ever lied; only Cutler did. We never did anything wrong; only Cutler did.

3. It's never been about 1 person, and I'm intentionally leaving out John Elway; the Broncos don't need Cutler. We've won without him and we'll win without him.

4. We have a great franchise and we have a lot of great fans; if you no longer want to be a fan, we don't need you.

5. No matter what we do, you will continue to buy tickets from me.

6. We'll weed out the malcontent fans just as we weed out the malcontent players.

It's a letter that didn't address nor acknowledge any shortcomings from him or McDaniels in the Cutler situation, and implying the blame lay solely on Cutler. It's a very strong letter, and it's purpose is not to apologize nor bring unity; indeed, he doesn't believe he owes the fans any apology for the situation ... that would show weakness.

The main focus of the letter is to convey strength ... his strength as the owner of the Broncos. It's a pretty good letter.

claymore
04-03-2009, 07:27 PM
Yeah.....You haven't heard.....In addition to Jay ,We just traded Clady, Hamilton, Weigmann, Kuper, Harris, Stokely, Royal, Marshall, and Graham................Oh wait :tsk:

I would be good with this.

nevcraw
04-03-2009, 07:32 PM
I'm simply waiting for the draft, and the season before I pass any judgment. To do otherwise, IMO, is immature and childish.

I disagree that anyone looking at the franchise as it stands today and is not ammused is immature and childish.

the draft will tell you nothing except for potential and yes the season will tell us all but man this team looks worse today than it did at the end of last season.
They spent 3 roster spots and good money on 3 third down backs. The got rid of the only consistant ST player for another at the same position. They made statements during the McJaygate only to contradict those statements several days later. One proven player was picked up in FA and god love him but he's 35. I could go on but I won't.. and I wont even begin to analyze the FO changes..
The state of the franchize has to make us wonder about the thinking in Doogie Valley... so being skeptical of what this team will do in the draft and behond should be more than understandable..

Day1BroncoFan
04-03-2009, 07:34 PM
All is well that ends well. Well, it ain't over yet.

Can we just see what happens before we judge?

I think I'll go hunting this weekend... oh, wait I traded my best gun for someone else' next two best guns they are going to buy. Forget it those guns are no good. I think I'll stay home and cry.

OrangeHoof
04-03-2009, 08:37 PM
To OrangeHoof and atwater27:

:tsk:

Pathetic.

So sorry. The truth hurts. The team is in ruins right now on both sides of the ball and the guys expected to lead us out of it have ZERO track record to indicate they can handle it. That's the fact.

Had Bowlen hired a defensive head coach with the smarts to leave the offense alone, he'd be better off than he is now trying to rebuild both sides of the ball at the same time with unproven management.

Hey, maybe the Broncos will defy the odds and get lucky but I won't buy into that until it happens. I'm a Broncos fan but I'm also a realist. This is a terrible team right now and it will take more than a pair of #1s to fix it.

I'll return you now to your fantasy world.

horsepig
04-03-2009, 09:11 PM
I disagree that anyone looking at the franchise as it stands today and is not ammused is immature and childish.

the draft will tell you nothing except for potential and yes the season will tell us all but man this team looks worse today than it did at the end of last season.
They spent 3 roster spots and good money on 3 third down backs. The got rid of the only consistant ST player for another at the same position. They made statements during the McJaygate only to contradict those statements several days later. One proven player was picked up in FA and god love him but he's 35. I could go on but I won't.. and I wont even begin to analyze the FO changes..
The state of the franchize has to make us wonder about the thinking in Doogie Valley... so being skeptical of what this team will do in the draft and behond should be more than understandable..

This team cannot possibly be worse than what we finished with last year. Yeah Cutler has taken his childish, bratty ways elsewhere, but with last year's defense we were soooo far away from anything good: see losing the division to the Sparklers with 3 up and 3 to play.

Shazam!
04-03-2009, 09:21 PM
The team is in ruins right now on both sides of the ball...

Actually no. Aside from the new question mark at QB, the additions on Defense and Mike Nolan will make the unit much better. Dawkins providing the leadership that was sorely missed with Lynch and Wilson gone. They even have a bonfide NT in Ron Fields. For the first time in many years since Ted Washington I think, they have one, even if he isn't a top tier Dlineman.

They'll Draft a QB in the later rounds to complete the change.

Hope is not lost. QBs succeed with good schemes and protection, two things Denver will have. I just hope they grab a QB.

I am optimistic and am glad the Cutler thing is over. I wish it turned out differently but why cry about it? it's done. Let's now let the Broncos concentrate on 2009.

Krugan
04-03-2009, 09:27 PM
Nice letter, but all I have to say is:

Dan, your fired!.

Not trying to start anymore crap, but I cant believe 3 words out of pretty much any of the bunch right now.

Front office, ex player, all morons for letting this whole crazy pile of fun happen.

Buff
04-03-2009, 09:50 PM
So sorry. The truth hurts. The team is in ruins right now on both sides of the ball.

Peter King disagrees.


The Broncos will miss Cutler, because they have the best young offensive nucleus in football. Tackles Ryan Clady and Ryan Harris will both go to multiple Pro Bowls. Brandon Marshall and Eddie Royal are the best receivers in tandem 26 or younger in football right now.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/peter_king/04/02/cutler.reaction.ap/index.html

Sir Foxx
04-03-2009, 10:08 PM
Actually no. Aside from the new question mark at QB, the additions on Defense and Mike Nolan will make the unit much better. Dawkins providing the leadership that was sorely missed with Lynch and Wilson gone. They even have a bonfide NT in Ron Fields. For the first time in many years since Ted Washington I think, they have one, even if he isn't a top tier Dlineman.

They'll Draft a QB in the later rounds to complete the change.

Hope is not lost. QBs succeed with good schemes and protection, two things Denver will have. I just hope they grab a QB.

I am optimistic and am glad the Cutler thing is over. I wish it turned out differently but why cry about it? it's done. Let's now let the Broncos concentrate on 2009.

Mike Nolan doesn't make anything better and what defensive addition is all that great that we've added?

Poet
04-03-2009, 10:11 PM
Mike Nolan doesn't make anything better and what defensive addition is all that great that we've added?

Normally a scheme can only drastically improve your team if you players improve, or if the scheme fits the players well.

However, the scheme that you had last year would have gotten your crushed, even if you had a good cast of defensive players (you would have gotten crushed less obviously).

bcbronc
04-03-2009, 10:13 PM
Normally a scheme can only drastically improve your team if you players improve, or if the scheme fits the players well.

However, the scheme that you had last year would have gotten your crushed, even if you had a good cast of defensive players (you would have gotten crushed less obviously).

wait..what? we had a scheme last year? link please, I don't buy it.

Poet
04-03-2009, 10:16 PM
wait..what? we had a scheme last year? link please, I don't buy it.

Don't make me tell you the name of the man who ran the scheme, I don't want to hurt you BCB. :salute:

Tempus Fugit
04-03-2009, 10:25 PM
wait..what? we had a scheme last year? link please, I don't buy it.

Yes, there was a scheme. And they would have gotten away with it, too, if it hadn't been for you meddling kids!

Poet
04-03-2009, 10:26 PM
Yes, there was a scheme. And they would have gotten away with it, too, if it hadn't been for you meddling kids!

/thread.

Superchop 7
04-03-2009, 10:37 PM
At least Jay said "mistakes were made by both sides"

thus, he admitted his part in the mess.

Pats letter came from his ego, not his heart.

Tempus Fugit
04-03-2009, 10:37 PM
/thread.

It needed to happen. That "both sides in ruins" stuff just had to die. :coffee:

Poet
04-03-2009, 10:46 PM
At least Jay said "mistakes were made by both sides"

thus, he admitted his part in the mess.

Pats letter came from his ego, not his heart.

I think it did come from his heart. He seems to be an owner who is usually in tune with the fans.

Admitting your part doesn't do much when you did what Jay did.

nevcraw
04-03-2009, 11:29 PM
This team cannot possibly be worse than what we finished with last year. Yeah Cutler has taken his childish, bratty ways elsewhere, but with last year's defense we were soooo far away from anything good: see losing the division to the Sparklers with 3 up and 3 to play.

Hope you are right.. But right now we are sitting on 2 back up qb's and a defense not suited for either the 3-4 or 4-3. oh yeah and 3 back up running backs.. and lonnieeee paxton..
Worse is a relative term..

BroncoTech
04-03-2009, 11:40 PM
Don't worry fellas our new long snapper will surely take us to the super bowl.

JKcatch724
04-03-2009, 11:54 PM
Don't worry fellas our new long snapper will surely take us to the super bowl.

Lonie doesn't take sarcasm lightly. I'd watch my back from now on if I were you.

BroncoTech
04-03-2009, 11:57 PM
What, me worry?

JKcatch724
04-04-2009, 12:00 AM
What, me worry?

It's Lonie Paxton's world, and we're all just living in it.

rcsodak
04-04-2009, 01:04 AM
Yeah, unfortunately it's over. But I wont stop flaming McDaniels until I see what he does in the draft ;)

Kool...

....that means we can continue flaming you, when you're not over on the Bears' boards.... :elefant:

rcsodak
04-04-2009, 01:17 AM
Regardless of who the head coach is, the talent cupboard at Dove Valley is threadbare and just got barer (not bear-er, even though that's a great pun for this situation). Now we have some draft picks to work with but the questions are:

1) Do the Broncos have anybody left who can actually make a sound draft choice? Answer: we don't know because Xanders and McDiapers have no track record.

2) Do the Broncos try to rebuild their piss-poor defense or will McDiapers spend to craft a "state-of-the-art" offense and expect Dick Nolan to forge a defense out of the leftover crumbs? Answer: we don't know because McDiapers has never had to build a defense. How was Nolan's defense in San Francisco?

3) Can the remaining Broncos rally around a coach who is younger than some of his players and has no head coaching experience? Answer: we don't know but the last comparable example is David Shula. Anyone remember how that went?

So expecting anyone to craft a winning team out of such a starting point within 2-3 years shows a lack of understanding about how big a hole the Broncos are in right now. Maybe the front office will reveal themselves as the best drafters since the '74 Steelers, the head coach will win like Chuck Noll and work miracles or maybe they will show they are in way over their heads and produce an epic fail.

History would suggest the latter happens far more often than the former.

How old it Pitt's Tomlin?

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 01:21 AM
Regardless of who the head coach is, the talent cupboard at Dove Valley is threadbare and just got barer (not bear-er, even though that's a great pun for this situation). Now we have some draft picks to work with but the questions are:

1) Do the Broncos have anybody left who can actually make a sound draft choice? Answer: we don't know because Xanders and McDiapers have no track record.

2) Do the Broncos try to rebuild their piss-poor defense or will McDiapers spend to craft a "state-of-the-art" offense and expect Dick Nolan to forge a defense out of the leftover crumbs? Answer: we don't know because McDiapers has never had to build a defense. How was Nolan's defense in San Francisco?

3) Can the remaining Broncos rally around a coach who is younger than some of his players and has no head coaching experience? Answer: we don't know but the last comparable example is David Shula. Anyone remember how that went?

So expecting anyone to craft a winning team out of such a starting point within 2-3 years shows a lack of understanding about how big a hole the Broncos are in right now. Maybe the front office will reveal themselves as the best drafters since the '74 Steelers, the head coach will win like Chuck Noll and work miracles or maybe they will show they are in way over their heads and produce an epic fail.

History would suggest the latter happens far more often than the former.

Oh please. Shanahan had the same credentials coming in as McDaniels does, maybe even worse because his short stint as LA Coach was a bomb. Denver will be fine.

rcsodak
04-04-2009, 01:26 AM
Oh please. Shanahan had the same credentials coming in as McDaniels does, maybe even worse because his short stint as LA Coach was a bomb. Denver will be fine.
Careful, Shaz....


...if any of us are TOO credible, we'll more than likely ruin cut-n-run'ers groupies.... :coffee:

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 01:32 AM
Those of us who have been in the Broncos' stables for this long have a finer vision.

Broncos Mtnman
04-04-2009, 02:02 AM
Oh please. Shanahan had the same credentials coming in as McDaniels does, maybe even worse because his short stint as LA Coach was a bomb. Denver will be fine.

Sorry Shaz, but you're wrong on this one.

Shanny had a full season plus 4 games in LA with the Raiders. That's two drafts to none for Mickey Mouse.

Not only that, but Shanny was coming home when he came here. He knew the organization, most of the players, and clearly knew the owner.

It's not even close.....

___________________________________

As far as Bowlen's copout letter goes, it was too little - too late. He blamed the whole mess on Cutler and made bogus claims.

His claim that it's "always the team" wasn't the case when Reeves tried to trade Elway to the Redskins.

His ticket renewal stat is misleading too. As a season ticket holder, I had to have my renewal in weeks ago, way before the Cutler fiasco.

Bowlen tried to soothe the fans because he knew he knew that since he "took control" it's been a major cluster ever since. It was weak at best and insincere at worst.

56crash
04-04-2009, 02:18 AM
Shazam go Google the name mike Shanahan I would get hand cramps typing all that he had achieved by the time he was the head coach of the Broncos. you really look like you have no clue .

56crash
04-04-2009, 02:22 AM
Careful, Shaz....


...if any of us are TOO credible, we'll more than likely ruin cut-n-run'ers groupies.... :coffee

fan police are in these days:elefant:

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 02:29 AM
Sorry Shaz, but you're wrong on this one.

Shanny had a full season plus 4 games in LA with the Raiders. That's two drafts to none for Mickey Mouse.

Not only that, but Shanny was coming home when he came here. He knew the organization, most of the players, and clearly knew the owner.

It's not even close...

Besides coming home and being the guy Elway wanted, Shanny was a hot commodity because of the incredible SF Offense and Steve Young's success, not for his days in Denver or Oakland. This is why it is smiliar to McDaniels is/was now.


Shazam go Google the name mike Shanahan I would get hand cramps typing all that he had achieved by the time he was the head coach of the Broncos. you really look like you have no clue .

'Achievements' without Elway: 1 Division title, 3 Wild Cards, 1 Playoff win, 4 blowout losses, a boatload of bad draft busts and horiffic Free agents.

You really look like you have no clue...

56crash
04-04-2009, 02:35 AM
Besides coming home and being the guy Elway wanted, Shanny was a hot commodity because of the incredible SF Offense and Steve Young's success, not for his days in Denver or Oakland. This is why it is smiliar to McDaniels is/was now.



'Achievements' without Elway: 1 Division title, 3 Wild Cards, 1 Playoff win, 4 blowout losses, a boatload of bad draft busts and horiffic Free agents.

You really look like you have no clue...


you left out a National title and a lot more.

56crash
04-04-2009, 02:38 AM
Shazam you sould like you hate Mike Shanahan if so I feel sorry for you .

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 02:48 AM
I feel sorry for you and your ignorance. I was on board with Shanahan when he first became Broncos Coach and I was ecstatic. I still have the newspaper clipping, "Shanahan grabs Broncs offer; Pete too?" (Pete Carroll was the SF DC and was rumored to follow him here if you weren't just a baby then FYI), but all those years later with Denver in mediocrity a change was needed. Shanahan was not the be all end all of Coaches, and Cutler is not the be all end all of QBs. Hate to break it to you.

nevcraw
04-04-2009, 03:12 AM
You mean, like, how all of the Cutler apologists lashed out at anyone who was rational about the situation?

Really. Seriously?

What a pathetic argument. I'm childish because I'm sick and tired of people defending Cutler as if he was God.

:rolleyes:

I don't have a rosy outlook of Dove Valley right now, but I realize this team's better without that crybaby.

So spare me these broad assumptions.

you are freakishly childish because you cannot handle dissenting opinion.. Find one Cutler is god quote.. anywhere?

f'ing crickets...

Yup every team is better without their franchise QB. Keep digging..

what's a Cutler apologist anyway? someone who doesnt believe all of the corporate speak from the FO? I blame both sides but hell I rather be one of your version of apologist than a "go root for the bears" db...

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 03:16 AM
I blame both sides...


...and this is the correct stance.

NameUsedBefore
04-04-2009, 04:31 AM
I'm not remotely convinced.

This has all the makings of an epic disaster. I'm surprised at how quickly people have already forgotten that McDaniels handling of Cutler isn't his only shady operation. The cutting of the Goodmans, Bates, randomly giving millions to a long snapper to replace Mike Leach. These have all been rubbish decisions. We haven't gotten a single upgrade at any position, and severely downgraded at the only one that was set. Unless you're one of these lopsided folks running around claiming Orton "isn't that bad", usually followed by a question mark, cause we all know such innuendo can't actually be made confidently. Partly because he's Kyle Orton, partly because he might not even be the starter.

This line of argument is usually followed by the mantra that McDaniels made a career back up look like a star. Apparently the Patriots entire team has transferred to Denver -- you know, the one that just got done setting offensive records, going undefeated, and getting to the Superbowl. How amazing it is for a man to come into the league and light it up. It's almost like the NFL has never seen that act before, much less on a record-setting Superbowl team. Regardless, very few around here seem to extend the comparisons... You know, the bit where Denver is a team with no defense, horrible special teams, and no solid running game -- and save me your stats arguments that don't even begin to observe how the games actually played out, it isn't an accident this negligence towards how the actual games were played has only recently sprung up. This is still pretty much the same team unable to overcome the league's worst starting positions and a blow-over defense with a jaw-dropping lack of turnovers. If 8-8 wasn't good enough for you with that, man, just wait until we got noodle-armed game managers with no pocket presence leading the charge.

In other words, we aint the Patriots, McDaniels isn't Bill Belichick and nobody on our squad is Matt Cassel who himself has to do what many star-backups have failed, which is continue their success past that initial break out season.

We have to lean on a rookie GM and rookie coach making the right calls during the draft since we received no real tangible returns on trading Cutler. Basically, they can't screw up on something that requires just as much luck as it does skill.

Maybe I'm being far too pessimistic, but when you step way outside historical boundaries and make a move like the Broncos just did, and with the shape the team is in right now, with a rookie headcoach whose peers have unanimously failed, playing in a city that is gonna have a short leash on its anger, that truly looks like a cocktail of epic proportions -- good or bad.

And don't think for a second that Cutler's play in Chicago is going to be irrelevant. If he lights it up there McDaniels leash will get shorter. Worst case scenario is that the Kyle Orton + vanilla wafer defense doesn't translate to wins (shocking) and Cutler plays lights out in Chicago. If that happens I don't think McDaniels lasts more than two years.


So yeah. That looks like it. I think this could end up possibly being one of the worst decisions in NFL history, hands down. So with that said that the FO would be coloring it up and backing itself is of no surprise. That anyone actually buys into it is surprising. I certainly don't. I mean, honestly, who do they take me for? They certainly aren't going to admit that an unmistakably giant risk has just been taken, that's for sure. Many here don't even seem to be all that aware of it. Yet, anyway.

JKcatch724
04-04-2009, 06:24 AM
Shazam you sould like you hate Mike Shanahan if so I feel sorry for you .

You really make an ass out of yourself every time you post.

Tempus Fugit
04-04-2009, 09:27 AM
I'm not remotely convinced.

This has all the makings of an epic disaster. I'm surprised at how quickly people have already forgotten that McDaniels handling of Cutler isn't his only shady operation. The cutting of the Goodmans, Bates, randomly giving millions to a long snapper to replace Mike Leach. These have all been rubbish decisions. We haven't gotten a single upgrade at any position, and severely downgraded at the only one that was set. Unless you're one of these lopsided folks running around claiming Orton "isn't that bad", usually followed by a question mark, cause we all know such innuendo can't actually be made confidently. Partly because he's Kyle Orton, partly because he might not even be the starter.

1.) McDaniels didn't fire the Goodmans.

2.) Firing the coaching personnel of the former coach isn't shady. It is, in fact, standard operating procedure. Keeping that personnel is the exception.

3.) Paxton is arguably the best in the game, he's familiar with the Patriots system, and he knows how McDaniels wants the clubhouse to be run. Also, just like replacing coaching staffs, New coaches replacing old players isn't "Shady", it's standard procedure. The fact that you find any of this stuff to be "rubbish decisions" should clue you in to your ridiculously unfair position on McDaniels.


So yeah. That looks like it. I think this could end up possibly being one of the worst decisions in NFL history, hands down. So with that said that the FO would be coloring it up and backing itself is of no surprise. That anyone actually buys into it is surprising. I certainly don't. I mean, honestly, who do they take me for? They certainly aren't going to admit that an unmistakably giant risk has just been taken, that's for sure. Many here don't even seem to be all that aware of it. Yet, anyway.

If every draft pick taken busts in the first 30 seconds of their careers, this still wouldn't be "one of the worst decisions in NFL history". Ricky Williams for an entire draft.... the Herschel Walker trade.... those are the sort of deals that become known as "one of the worst decisions in NFL history".

nevcraw
04-04-2009, 09:42 AM
1.) McDaniels didn't fire the Goodmans.

2.) Firing the coaching personnel of the former coach isn't shady. It is, in fact, standard operating procedure. Keeping that personnel is the exception.

3.) Paxton is arguably the best in the game, he's familiar with the Patriots system, and he knows how McDaniels wants the clubhouse to be run. Also, just like replacing coaching staffs, New coaches replacing old players isn't "Shady", it's standard procedure. The fact that you find any of this stuff to be "rubbish decisions" should clue you in to your ridiculously unfair position on McDaniels.



If every draft pick taken busts in the first 30 seconds of their careers, this still wouldn't be "one of the worst decisions in NFL history". Ricky Williams for an entire draft.... the Herschel Walker trade.... those are the sort of deals that become known as "one of the worst decisions in NFL history".

1. If you don't think he was involoved I've got a bridge to sell you..
2. Since all Teams are trying to find the next Mike Tomlin.. what did he do? oh.. kept the defensive coordinator of a different philosophy than his own.. Now that's a smart new coach..
3. Lonnie Paxton is argiuably nothing... Mike leach was considered the best in the game not Lonnie F'ing paxton... so replace leach and over pay for his replacement Solid planning..
McDaniels is full of wholes so far, and by dumping Culter he has shortned his own leash to a choke collar.. Hope he's up for it b/c he brought it on himself.

Tempus Fugit
04-04-2009, 09:55 AM
1. If you don't think he was involoved I've got a bridge to sell you..

Feel free to provide any smattering of evidence you have about this, as it would be greatly appreciated.


2. Since all Teams are trying to find the next Mike Tomlin.. what did he do? oh.. kept the defensive coordinator of a different philosophy than his own.. Now that's a smart new coach..

Please tell me that you're too smart to compare Dick LeBeau and Bates, and this item was just a fatigue-induced folly of an argument on your post.


3. Lonnie Paxton is argiuably nothing... Mike leach was considered the best in the game not Lonnie F'ing paxton... so replace leach and over pay for his replacement Solid planning..

Ok, so between this argument and the one previous, it's abundantly clear that you aren't even trying to be reasonable.


McDaniels is full of wholes so far, and by dumping Culter he has shortned his own leash to a choke collar.. Hope he's up for it b/c he brought it on himself.

It was Bowlen who dumped him. I guess Bowlen's job is now in danger.

Den21vsBal19
04-04-2009, 10:27 AM
The way I'm looking at this is that Bowlen has owned the Broncos for 25 years, the majority of which have seen us as being one of the best orginizations in the League, and has done very little to make me doubt that he wants the best for the team.

That track record suggests to me that he deserves our loyalty until proven otherwise, and trading away a player who has only been here three years isn't of itself reason enough to start disbelieving him

turftoad
04-04-2009, 10:32 AM
The way I'm looking at this is that Bowlen has owned the Broncos for 25 years, the majority of which have seen us as being one of the best orginizations in the League, and has done very little to make me doubt that he wants the best for the team.

That track record suggests to me that he deserves our loyalty until proven otherwise, and trading away a player who has only been here three years isn't of itself reason enough to start disbelieving him

No, your're probably right. But.............. the way he and the rest of the FO handled the Cutler thing is.

Nomad
04-04-2009, 10:36 AM
The way I'm looking at this is that Bowlen has owned the Broncos for 25 years, the majority of which have seen us as being one of the best orginizations in the League, and has done very little to make me doubt that he wants the best for the team.

That track record suggests to me that he deserves our loyalty until proven otherwise, and trading away a player who has only been here three years isn't of itself reason enough to start disbelieving him

Well said! Assuming and speculating will drive someone mad! Mr Bowlen has never done anything to make me doubt so you've said what I believe!

deacon
04-04-2009, 10:42 AM
As far as Bowlen's copout letter goes, it was too little - too late. He blamed the whole mess on Cutler and made bogus claims.

His claim that it's "always the team" wasn't the case when Reeves tried to trade Elway to the Redskins.

His ticket renewal stat is misleading too. As a season ticket holder, I had to have my renewal in weeks ago, way before the Cutler fiasco.

Bowlen tried to soothe the fans because he knew he knew that since he "took control" it's been a major cluster ever since. It was weak at best and insincere at worst.

Has anyone noticed what McD said in his presser yesterday? He clearly said that they (He, Bowlen, and X) had talked to Cutler BEFORE the trade talk for Cassel got very far. Interesting if true because Cutler made it sound as though he found out along with the rest of us.

I don't see that McD has a reason to lie about this. He has nothing to gain. I also was interested that on NFL network yesterday one of the talking heads (don't know his name) said he thought Cutler wanted out after Shanny and Bates left and used this as an excuse to make the Broncos look like the bad guys. From what I've seen of his agent (look at the mess with Favre) and know of Cutler being a spoiled kid, this sounds plausible to me.

As for Bowlens ticket renewal stat; you're right. However, do you seriously think no one would pick yours up if you decided not to renew? You know better. There isn't going to be any lack of folks wanting season tickets.

Bronco Bible
04-04-2009, 10:43 AM
We'll see what different tune Bowlen is singing when McDaniels struggles to win games without a threat at Quarterback...

If he does he does then we look for a new coach but Cutler proved what he is all about.:tsk:

deacon
04-04-2009, 10:51 AM
If he does he does then we look for a new coach but Cutler proved what he is all about.:tsk:

Does anyone seriously believe Bowlen was left with a choice? Cutler forced this. There's no way around that. And, if you want to see how he and his agent operated look no farther than him demanding a trade then, when it happened, saying he didn't want it.

He was trying to pressure the Broncos into doing things his way....letting HIM run the organization. It didn't work.

Bronco Bible
04-04-2009, 10:52 AM
bowlen said it in his press conferance when he fired shanahan, "i may be making a mistake"

well, only time will tell now. our offense has been dismantled and we shall see.

Ya.. Cutler was the whole offense:rolleyes:

Den21vsBal19
04-04-2009, 10:59 AM
No, your're probably right. But.............. the way he and the rest of the FO handled the Cutler thing is.
I kinda know what you mean.............part of me wonders if the whole thing goes back to Cutler's reaction to Shanny's firing, and a case of giving him enough rope to hang himself :whoknows:

rcsodak
04-04-2009, 12:56 PM
fan police are in these days:elefant:

If you're going to label me as such, then I want a frickin' BADGE!!!!! :mad::lol:

rcsodak
04-04-2009, 01:03 PM
you are freakishly childish because you cannot handle dissenting opinion.. Find one Cutler is god quote.. anywhere?

f'ing crickets...

Yup every team is better without their franchise QB. Keep digging..

what's a Cutler apologist anyway? someone who doesnt believe all of the corporate speak from the FO? I blame both sides but hell I rather be one of your version of apologist than a "go root for the bears" db...


defending Cutler as if he was God.
Two words that ruined your argument.

The problem with you feeling sorry for cut-n-run'er, is the fact that you're initially pissed that Shanny's gone, as is Bates, jr. And prolly the fact that your fantasy football team won't have a denver QB as the starter.

Broncos Mtnman
04-04-2009, 01:46 PM
Has anyone noticed what McD said in his presser yesterday? He clearly said that they (He, Bowlen, and X) had talked to Cutler BEFORE the trade talk for Cassel got very far. Interesting if true because Cutler made it sound as though he found out along with the rest of us.

You said it. Interesting IF true. You don't know and it's interesting that he makes such a statement AFTER the fact.


I don't see that McD has a reason to lie about this. He has nothing to gain. I also was interested that on NFL network yesterday one of the talking heads (don't know his name) said he thought Cutler wanted out after Shanny and Bates left and used this as an excuse to make the Broncos look like the bad guys. From what I've seen of his agent (look at the mess with Favre) and know of Cutler being a spoiled kid, this sounds plausible to me.

He also has nothing to lose by lying now, does he? Isn't it interesting that Jay in his presser in Chicago refused to say anything negative about the Broncos, while Bowlen and his Belichick wanna-be head coach have blamed the whole mess on Jay.

And excuse me, you KNOW Cutler's a spoiled kid? I wasn't aware that you were involved behind the scenes. That statement alone shows your bias in the situation.

By the way, the "mess" with Favre was Bret's own doing. He RETIRED. HE FREAKING RETIRED. Were the Packers supposed to ignore drafting QBs and getting on with things with Rodgers in the hope that Bret would change his mind? Bus Cook being his agent had nothing to do with Favre's inability to stick to a decision once he made it.


As for Bowlens ticket renewal stat; you're right. However, do you seriously think no one would pick yours up if you decided not to renew? You know better. There isn't going to be any lack of folks wanting season tickets.

So far, no one has. But let's look at it this way. Apparently there IS a lack of folks wanting tickets. Otherwise, his letter would have stated that 100% of ticket holders renewed.

As a matter of fact, that's been the case since the new stadium was built. Did you know that Club Seats aren't counted in the "sold out" data? There are still seats available on that level and there are games where the entire sections on the south end of the stadium are empty. Spare me your "knowledge" about season tickets. I have them. I know what I'm talking about.

Broncos Mtnman
04-04-2009, 01:49 PM
Ya.. Cutler was the whole offense:rolleyes:

Naw, only 67%. :rolleyes:

nevcraw
04-04-2009, 02:00 PM
Two words that ruined your argument.

The problem with you feeling sorry for cut-n-run'er, is the fact that you're initially pissed that Shanny's gone, as is Bates, jr. And prolly the fact that your fantasy football team won't have a denver QB as the starter.

As if or is.. makes no difference to me.. People are pissed at this debacle and some choise to bash the QB and some chose the coach.. I have only been defending the right to do so against a few tools who feel justified in telling people how to think feel or be a fan..
you should read a few of my posts before making any statements about me.. and if you do want some of this you better where your big boy pants. :welcome:

OrangeHoof
04-04-2009, 02:55 PM
The way I'm looking at this is that Bowlen has owned the Broncos for 25 years, the majority of which have seen us as being one of the best orginizations in the League, and has done very little to make me doubt that he wants the best for the team.

That track record suggests to me that he deserves our loyalty until proven otherwise, and trading away a player who has only been here three years isn't of itself reason enough to start disbelieving him

Fair enough. But professional sports are full of well-meaning very successful businessmen who make horrible personnel decisions when it comes to sports because they are out of their element. You don't expect the owner to make football decisions. You expect the owner to hire competent people to make football decisions. When the owner makes the football decisions, you get Jerry Jones and Dan Snyder.

I know what Bowlen must have thought. He had great success hiring Shanahan until Shanny's flaws were eventually exposed. Hiring McDiapers, in his mind, was hiring the next Shanahan. Maybe McDiapers is all that but his resume is much thinner than Shanny's was at that stage. IMO, he doesn't have the results yet to be carrying such arrogance with him.

All of that glosses over the fact that it was the defense, not the offense, that had completely tanked and needed fixing. Hiring an OC who hasn't done anything more with a defense than study videos isn't a very smart way to resolve that problem. Maybe Mike Nolan is the solution but where else has Mike Nolan been tried and found not to be the solution?

I'm perfectly willing to be proven wrong but, from the moment he fired Shanny, the Broncos have appeared to make one f--- up after another. How much of that you want to blame on Bowlen and how much you want to blame on his underlings, there is going to be blame regardless.

Unless you really believe McDiapers will coach the team to a winning record this year. if you do, I'd say you're extremely delusional.

Den21vsBal19
04-04-2009, 03:10 PM
Unless you really believe McDiapers will coach the team to a winning record this year. if you do, I'd say you're extremely delusional.

I wasn't expecting much of an improvement in results (if any) this year, not with this schedule.........

I'm hoping for an improvement in attitude on the field, too many players, too often, over the last few years have appeared disinterested.

atwater27
04-04-2009, 03:16 PM
I don't have a rosy outlook of Dove Valley right now, but I realize this team's better without that crybaby.


HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA.

Funniest joke I have ever heard.

MOtorboat
04-04-2009, 03:22 PM
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA.

Funniest joke I have ever heard.

Now THERE's a solid argument.

Piss off. Maybe you should be a Bears fan now.

atwater27
04-04-2009, 03:43 PM
Now THERE's a solid argument.

Piss off. Maybe you should be a Bears fan now.

Way ahead of you. How does McDaniels mushroom tip feel deep inside your lower intestine?

Nomad
04-04-2009, 03:46 PM
Way ahead of you. How does McDaniels mushroom tip feel deep inside your lower intestine?

A little extreme aren't you!

BroncoJoe
04-04-2009, 03:48 PM
Anyone that gives up on this franchise because of a player that has not given us anything in the win column or has spent a short time here (three years vs. nearly 50) is, well, either a short time fan, or not one at all.

JMO.

MOtorboat
04-04-2009, 03:50 PM
Way ahead of you. How does McDaniels mushroom tip feel deep inside your lower intestine?

Good.

Keep up with the personal insults, it's funny, and childish, kinda like your boy Cutler.

atwater27
04-04-2009, 03:50 PM
Anyone that gives up on this franchise because of a player that has not given us anything in the win column or has spent a short time here (three years vs. nearly 50) is, well, either a short time fan, or not one at all.

JMO.

Oh no. An internet challenge to fandom.

MOtorboat
04-04-2009, 03:51 PM
Oh no. An internet challenge to fandom.

This is just sad and childish.

BroncoJoe
04-04-2009, 03:52 PM
Oh no. An internet challenge to fandom.

I think your comments prove your fandom, not mine.

Broncos Mtnman
04-04-2009, 03:58 PM
Anyone that gives up on this franchise because of a player that has not given us anything in the win column or has spent a short time here (three years vs. nearly 50) is, well, either a short time fan, or not one at all.

JMO.

http://www.picpop.com/gallery/albums/userpics/1-14-05/incorrect.jpg

Poet
04-04-2009, 03:59 PM
Way ahead of you. How does McDaniels mushroom tip feel deep inside your lower intestine?

Atwater, you understand that Cutler forced their hand right? One could have made a decent argument that it was almost all, or mostly on McD and company until Jay demanded a trade and wouldnt talk with them.

All Jay Cutler did was make Bowlen and McDaniels look better and smarter.

MOtorboat
04-04-2009, 03:59 PM
Anyone that gives up on this franchise because of a player that has not given us anything in the win column or has spent a short time here (three years vs. nearly 50) is, well, either a short time fan, or not one at all.

JMO.

Don't worry Joe...the pied piper has left town, and we should only have to put up with the children for a few more weeks.

BroncoJoe
04-04-2009, 04:00 PM
How so, mtnman?

I've been a fan for as long as I can remember. Crappy coaching, players, losing seasons. I have never given up faith.

If you decide to become a fan of a player and not the organization that's been around for 50 years, so be it.

I call that someone who is not a true fan.

Poet
04-04-2009, 04:02 PM
Joe, would you like to bet how many message board names that will be similar to "Denver Bears fan, or Colorado Bear" pop up on Bear sites?

Nomad
04-04-2009, 04:04 PM
How so, mtnman?

I've been a fan for as long as I can remember. Crappy coaching, players, losing seasons. I have never given up faith.

If you decide to become a fan of a player and not the organization that's been around for 50 years, so be it.

I call that someone who is not a true fan.

Frustration leads to negative thoughts. I'lll give mtn-man some slack because he's been around alot longer than I have. Not speaking for anyone else! I love the USA, no matter what!;)

MOtorboat
04-04-2009, 04:04 PM
Joe, would you like to bet how many message board names that will be similar to "Denver Bears fan, or Colorado Bear" pop up on Bear sites?

The Bears were a minor league baseball team from 1955-1984.

MOtorboat
04-04-2009, 04:05 PM
Frustration leads to negative thoughts. I'lll give mtn-man some slack because he's been around alot longer than I have. Not speaking for anyone else! I love the USA, no matter what!;)

I hope they don't trade Obama. :rolleyes:

atwater27
04-04-2009, 04:06 PM
Atwater, you understand that Cutler forced their hand right? One could have made a decent argument that it was almost all, or mostly on McD and company until Jay demanded a trade and wouldnt talk with them.

All Jay Cutler did was make Bowlen and McDaniels look better and smarter.
A guy can only take so much bullshit. Put yourself in his shoes.

slim
04-04-2009, 04:07 PM
I hope they don't trade Obama. :rolleyes:

I hope we do :welcome:

atwater27
04-04-2009, 04:07 PM
How so, mtnman?

I've been a fan for as long as I can remember. Crappy coaching, players, losing seasons. I have never given up faith.

If you decide to become a fan of a player and not the organization that's been around for 50 years, so be it.

I call that someone who is not a true fan.

And you know what the consequences of that judgement is Minuteman?

Broncos Mtnman
04-04-2009, 04:10 PM
How so, mtnman?

I've been a fan for as long as I can remember. Crappy coaching, players, losing seasons. I have never given up faith.

If you decide to become a fan of a player and not the organization that's been around for 50 years, so be it.

I call that someone who is not a true fan.

Yeah, I've been spending thousands every year since 1994 on season tickets just because of Jay Cutler.

The topic of the thread is Bowlen's letter. As a season ticket holder since 1994, I'd say I put my money where my mouth is, and Bowlen's letter was pathetic, as is the product he expects everyone to pay for this year.

:coffee:

Poet
04-04-2009, 04:11 PM
A guy can only take so much bullshit. Put yourself in his shoes.

What bullshit did he take? He took some bullshit and cried about it. For ****s sake, how many grown ass men don't answer their phone when their boss calls you?

He wanted to be a Bronco...then he didn't. He played for his teammates, and then he wouldn't go with his teammates to prepare to play. He claimed that he loved his teammates and that he loved his city, so much so that he WANTED the same damn thing that got him pissed about.

For a long time Cutler's hands were clean. Now his hands are the dirtiest of them all.

He is an arrogant little punk, and his recent actions prove my past criticisms about him right.

Jay Cutler wasn't even the best player on your team. You're acting like you lost a great QB when in reality you lost a good one and got compensated pretty well for it considering you didn't have a lot of leverage.

If you want to blame someone for not being a Bronco blame the guy who tried the hardest to trade Jay Cutler. It wasn't McDaniels, or Bowlen, it wasn't Xanders, and it wasn't Jay Cutler....oh wait, it WAS Jay Cutler.

atwater27
04-04-2009, 04:15 PM
What bullshit did he take? He took some bullshit and cried about it. For ****s sake, how many grown ass men don't answer their phone when their boss calls you?

He wanted to be a Bronco...then he didn't. He played for his teammates, and then he wouldn't go with his teammates to prepare to play. He claimed that he loved his teammates and that he loved his city, so much so that he WANTED the same damn thing that got him pissed about.

For a long time Cutler's hands were clean. Now his hands are the dirtiest of them all.

He is an arrogant little punk, and his recent actions prove my past criticisms about him right.

Jay Cutler wasn't even the best player on your team. You're acting like you lost a great QB when in reality you lost a good one and got compensated pretty well for it considering you didn't have a lot of leverage.

If you want to blame someone for not being a Bronco blame the guy who tried the hardest to trade Jay Cutler. It wasn't McDaniels, or Bowlen, it wasn't Xanders, and it wasn't Jay Cutler....oh wait, it WAS Jay Cutler.

McDaniels is an arrogant little punk, and I wouldn't want to work for him either. I have quit jobs before when I didn't like my boss. Why should you have to work for an ******* when you don't have to.. More power to Cutler. Again. Broncos loss.

MOtorboat
04-04-2009, 04:19 PM
Yeah, I've been spending thousands every year since 1994 on season tickets just because of Jay Cutler.

The topic of the thread is Bowlen's letter. As a season ticket holder since 1994, I'd say I put my money where my mouth is, and Bowlen's letter was pathetic, as is the product he expects everyone to pay for this year.

:coffee:


McDaniels is an arrogant little punk, and I wouldn't want to work for him either. I have quit jobs before when I didn't like my boss. Why should you have to work for an ******* when you don't have to.. More power to Cutler. Again. Broncos loss.

Nothing like jumping to conclusions.

atwater27
04-04-2009, 04:20 PM
Nothing like jumping to conclusions.

Speak for yourself. Keep on towing the Bowlen McDaniels line.

Poet
04-04-2009, 04:20 PM
McDaniels is an arrogant little punk, and I wouldn't want to work for him either. I have quit jobs before when I didn't like my boss. Why should you have to work for an ******* when you don't have to.. More power to Cutler. Again. Broncos loss.

He isn't as arrogant as Jay Cutler. Jay Cutler was so offended at the thought that he may not be able to dictate who his coaches and coordinators are and that he could be traded (better players than Cutler have been traded) that he wanted a trade.

He should go to work and do what he is told to do like everyone else. That's one of the great things about sports is that someone else will always take you. If most people threw a bitch fit about who their bosses were and then wouldn't answer their phone their career would be killed because word gets around.

In NFL land you just get traded and probably ink a new and more lucrative deal. Oh, and that deal is based on future production and not past production in Cutler's case. Yeah, poor Jay Cutler. He's a ******* punk ass bitch.

MOtorboat
04-04-2009, 04:21 PM
Speak for yourself. Keep on towing the Bowlen McDaniels line.

I'm not on anyone's line. I'm just not hanging from Cutler's ball sack, and for some stupid reason that makes you post like a child.

Broncospsycho77
04-04-2009, 04:21 PM
Speak for yourself. Keep on towing the Bowlen McDaniels line.

Or maybe just rooting for the Denver mother****ing Broncos.

atwater27
04-04-2009, 04:23 PM
He isn't as arrogant as Jay Cutler. Jay Cutler was so offended at the thought that he may not be able to dictate who his coaches and coordinators are and that he could be traded (better players than Cutler have been traded) that he wanted a trade.

He should go to work and do what he is told to do like everyone else. That's one of the great things about sports is that someone else will always take you. If most people threw a bitch fit about who their bosses were and then wouldn't answer their phone their career would be killed because word gets around.

In NFL land you just get traded and probably ink a new and more lucrative deal. Oh, and that deal is based on future production and not past production in Cutler's case. Yeah, poor Jay Cutler. He's a ******* punk ass bitch.

You don't know a goddamn thing or conversation that went on during the whole situation, and neither do I. I think McDaniels is a punk as bitch. You think Cutler is. Oh well, guess we disagree.

Broncospsycho77
04-04-2009, 04:25 PM
and neither do I..

Huh.

Poet
04-04-2009, 04:25 PM
You don't know a goddamn thing or conversation that went on during the whole situation, and neither do I. I think McDaniels is a punk as bitch. You think Cutler is. Oh well, guess we disagree.

I know that Jay Cutler demanded the very thing that hurt his feelings. I know that he refused to answer Bowlen's phone calls.

I know that where I'm from that makes you a bitch. His contract was coming up soon, and if he didn't want to play for the Broncos he could keep busting his ass and then some team like the Redskins or even the Eagles (once McNabb is gone) could offer him a mega bucks deal.

Or, he could force the owner's hands and get a trade. Jay Cutler is a girl. A whiny girl who was gifted with the freakish abilities that he has.

atwater27
04-04-2009, 04:25 PM
I am trying to do what turftoad asks, but I can't when you are on my jock.

atwater27
04-04-2009, 04:26 PM
Huh.

Cute. Nice new avy though. Did Dove Valley send it to you in their PR package?

Poet
04-04-2009, 04:27 PM
I am trying to do what turftoad asks, but I can't when you are on my jock.

Atwater, I love you and I cherish you as a message board member. Go make a Phillip Rivers sucks thread and we can relive the good days.

Poet
04-04-2009, 04:27 PM
Cute. Nice new avy though. Did Dove Valley send it to you in their PR package?

The only thing Dove Valley needs to send anyone is some tissues and astroglide to Jay Cutler.

Sorry, I had to get that last one in.

atwater27
04-04-2009, 04:28 PM
I know that Jay Cutler demanded the very thing that hurt his feelings. I know that he refused to answer Bowlen's phone calls.

I know that where I'm from that makes you a bitch. His contract was coming up soon, and if he didn't want to play for the Broncos he could keep busting his ass and then some team like the Redskins or even the Eagles (once McNabb is gone) could offer him a mega bucks deal.

Or, he could force the owner's hands and get a trade. Jay Cutler is a girl. A whiny girl who was gifted with the freakish abilities that he has.

Again, you are assumming way too much. It is naive or however you spell it, to think that it is all Cutler's fault. It takes 2 to tango. 2.

Poet
04-04-2009, 04:29 PM
Again, you are assumming way too much. It is naive or however you spell it, to think that it is all Cutler's fault. It takes 2 to tango. 2.

I have never once said it is all his fault. At the beginning of this I said a lot of this, if not most of it was on McDaniels. Over time Jay Cutler made it escalate to the point that got him traded. Jay Cutler did more to get himself out of Denver than anyone else did.

atwater27
04-04-2009, 04:35 PM
I have never once said it is all his fault. At the beginning of this I said a lot of this, if not most of it was on McDaniels. Over time Jay Cutler made it escalate to the point that got him traded. Jay Cutler did more to get himself out of Denver than anyone else did.

The freaking damage had already been done! A young, headstrong coach like McDaniels is not going to say he was wrong, and certainly is not going to let Cutler get the last word. He was a dick to him the whole time, and made it painfully, glaringly obvious that their relationship would always be that way. McDaniels didn't get mad. he got even. And all he did was hurt the organization in the process.

Broncospsycho77
04-04-2009, 04:37 PM
Cute. Nice new avy though. Did Dove Valley send it to you in their PR package?

I'm just saying it works both ways. King didn't know what went behind closed doors. Neither did you. How did you jump to that conclusion that McD is the one at fault?

Here's my rationale in all of this:

----
If you're a Denver Broncos fan, then, logically, you would be a fan of the Denver Broncos. You may not like the moves the organization is making, you may not like that your favorite player is gone, you may not like the current head coach, but in the grand scheme of things, coaches, players, and arguments will pass, but, in the end, one thing remains constant: Being a Denver Broncos fan. And that's what it's about to me.
----

I'm not a huge fan of Josh McDaniels, and I kind of liked Jay Cutler last season, but since this ordeal has gone by, I've lost respect for both of them (I was on the "hire Raheem Morris" bandwagon, but oh well), but you know what? Jay Cutler's not a Bronco anymore. Doesn't mean I don't hate him. Josh McDaniels is a Bronco. Doesn't mean I have to like him.

I like the Broncos. Hell, I've rooted for the Rockies, Nuggets, and Avalanche when they were the laughing stock of their respective leagues, but there are always little glimmers of hope and happiness that are associated with the game: the passion (Forsberg returning for the Avs), the winning (Rocktober), the potential for success (Carmelo Anthony, Troy Tulowitski... almost every rookie player to ever play for any Denver sports franchise)... and that's why I love and cherish watching, discussing, and basically living Denver sports. That's not going to change, regardless of who the coach is. So long as the Broncos stay in Denver, there's something to root for.

Oh, and thanks. I made it myself.

Poet
04-04-2009, 04:39 PM
The freaking damage had already been done! A young, headstrong coach like McDaniels is not going to say he was wrong, and certainly is not going to let Cutler get the last word. He was a dick to him the whole time, and made it painfully, glaringly obvious that their relationship would always be that way. McDaniels didn't get mad. he got even. And all he did was hurt the organization in the process.

I think Jay Cutler got MAD and EVEN by demanding a trade. Look, your team is worse without Jay, and the things you got to compensate your loss are gambles.

If the picks work out and you get like one stud and one good player, or an elite player, any combination really I think it would be too easy to go "HAHAH TOLD YOU SO!!!"

Just like it would be too easy if the picks you had were just solid good picks, or a guy got hurt bad, etc etc etc.

At the end of the day the person who forced the situation to be what it is is Jay Cutler.

I think we have debated our points fine and I will leave the Cutler threads. Thanks for the discussion, and I appreciate you staying civil with me.

atwater27
04-04-2009, 04:46 PM
I'm just saying it works both ways. King didn't know what went behind closed doors. Neither did you. How did you jump to that conclusion that McD is the one at fault?

Here's my rationale in all of this:

----
If you're a Denver Broncos fan, then, logically, you would be a fan of the Denver Broncos. You may not like the moves the organization is making, you may not like that your favorite player is gone, you may not like the current head coach, but in the grand scheme of things, coaches, players, and arguments will pass, but, in the end, one thing remains constant: Being a Denver Broncos fan. And that's what it's about to me.
----

I'm not a huge fan of Josh McDaniels, and I kind of liked Jay Cutler last season, but since this ordeal has gone by, I've lost respect for both of them (I was on the "hire Raheem Morris" bandwagon, but oh well), but you know what? Jay Cutler's not a Bronco anymore. Doesn't mean I don't hate him. Josh McDaniels is a Bronco. Doesn't mean I have to like him.

I like the Broncos. Hell, I've rooted for the Rockies, Nuggets, and Avalanche when they were the laughing stock of their respective leagues, but there are always little glimmers of hope and happiness that are associated with the game: the passion (Forsberg returning for the Avs), the winning (Rocktober), the potential for success (Carmelo Anthony, Troy Tulowitski... almost every rookie player to ever play for any Denver sports franchise)... and that's why I love and cherish watching, discussing, and basically living Denver sports. That's not going to change, regardless of who the coach is. So long as the Broncos stay in Denver, there's something to root for.

Oh, and thanks. I made it myself.

Great post. Her is my take.... I will always be a Broncos fan, just more for their HISTORY right now than their present existence. I think Shanahan's firing was horrible. I think Bowlen should have took more control of McDaniels from the start and gave him an off limits list for firings or trades. Either way, I think Cutler was done wrong, and even though (contrary to some douches on this site) I am a Broncos fan, I am telling you, I am rooting for Cutler to do well. I like players and am loyal to them even if they are cast away by my team. I want Cutler to succeed, and I will root for him to play gret like I know he can, if they ever play Denver. I think he deserves to beat McDaniels and shoe Bowlen that he should have stuck by him instead of his infant coach in that situation. So, as long as McDaniels is coach, I will root for Cutler to get the best of him if they ever meet. If McDaniels goes away, I will go back to rooting for the Broncos if they play the bears. Anyways, it is not like they are going to play alot. Oh well, if that makes me a bad fan. So be it. GUILTY AS CHARGED!

atwater27
04-04-2009, 04:48 PM
Atwater, I love you and I cherish you as a message board member. Go make a Phillip Rivers sucks thread and we can relive the good days.

I was speaking to MB.:D

Poet
04-04-2009, 05:27 PM
I was speaking to MB.:D

Does that mean I can't troll a Cleveland Browns site then? Cause then you and I may really have some issues then.

Tned
04-04-2009, 05:32 PM
Does anyone seriously believe Bowlen was left with a choice? Cutler forced this. There's no way around that. And, if you want to see how he and his agent operated look no farther than him demanding a trade then, when it happened, saying he didn't want it.

He was trying to pressure the Broncos into doing things his way....letting HIM run the organization. It didn't work.

Kind of sounds like McDaniels forced it and got exactly what he wanted. I'm just hoping he is as smart as he thinks he is and that this won't set the Broncos way back.

slim
04-04-2009, 05:35 PM
Kind of sounds like McDaniels forced it and got exactly what he wanted. I'm just hoping he is as smart as he thinks he is and that this won't set the Broncos way back.

Why do you think McD forced it?

silkamilkamonico
04-04-2009, 05:38 PM
Why do you think McD forced it?

I think it's clearly evident that Cutler forced this with his lying.

People thought McDaniels started this by trying to trade Cutler "behind his back", which was proved to be false. Then they said "McDaniels lied" to Cutler, when it just now came out that McDaniels did in fact inform Cutler that teams were calling inquiring about him. SO not only did he not try and trade Cutler, he didn't hide anything from him either.

Meanwhile, Cutler was lying almost the entire time throughout the media, and it's coming out more and more almost every day.

Tned
04-04-2009, 05:59 PM
Why do you think McD forced it?

He did one of two things, based on the information we have:


Forced Jay out with very calculated moves
Acted like a 32 year old, rookie head coach with a big ego and lack of experiecne


Even in the one meeting they had, he reportedly told Jay that anyone could be traded at any time if it improved the organization. For a week or so after the story broke, the Broncos refused to state "Jay is our QB, he isn't being traded." Eventually, a Broncos spokesperson stated something like, "Jay won't be traded" and then a day or two later, McD repeated that same one sentence to the press.

As a coach, it shouldn't about being 'right' and 'proving' he has the power, it's about getting the most out of the players.

He should have done a mea culpe, said he got carried away at the prospect of getting his guy, and lost perspective. That one of the reasons he wanted the Denver job was to work with one of the best young QB's in football, and he really hopes that his lapse in judgement doesn't prevent that from happening, and end it with an, "I'm sorry, Jay."

However, by all accounts, he did nothing of the kind, instead he got in a pissing contest and prove he was the boss. I 'real' boss doesn't have to prove that fact.

MOtorboat
04-04-2009, 06:00 PM
He did one of two things, based on the information we have:


Forced Jay out with very calculated moves
Acted like a 32 year old, rookie head coach with a big ego and lack of experiecne


Even in the one meeting they had, he reportedly told Jay that anyone could be traded at any time if it improved the organization. For a week or so after the story broke, the Broncos refused to state "Jay is our QB, he isn't being traded." Eventually, a Broncos spokesperson stated something like, "Jay won't be traded" and then a day or two later, McD repeated that same one sentence to the press.

As a coach, it shouldn't about being 'right' and 'proving' he has the power, it's about getting the most out of the players.

He should have done a mea culpe, said he got carried away at the prospect of getting his guy, and lost perspective. That one of the reasons he wanted the Denver job was to work with one of the best young QB's in football, and he really hopes that his lapse in judgement doesn't prevent that from happening, and end it with an, "I'm sorry, Jay."

However, by all accounts, he did nothing of the kind, instead he got in a pissing contest and prove he was the boss. I 'real' boss doesn't have to prove that fact.

Sorry, T, but have you missed the last week and a half of this whole fiasco?

slim
04-04-2009, 06:10 PM
He did one of two things, based on the information we have:


Forced Jay out with very calculated moves
Acted like a 32 year old, rookie head coach with a big ego and lack of experiecne


Even in the one meeting they had, he reportedly told Jay that anyone could be traded at any time if it improved the organization. For a week or so after the story broke, the Broncos refused to state "Jay is our QB, he isn't being traded." Eventually, a Broncos spokesperson stated something like, "Jay won't be traded" and then a day or two later, McD repeated that same one sentence to the press.

As a coach, it shouldn't about being 'right' and 'proving' he has the power, it's about getting the most out of the players.

He should have done a mea culpe, said he got carried away at the prospect of getting his guy, and lost perspective. That one of the reasons he wanted the Denver job was to work with one of the best young QB's in football, and he really hopes that his lapse in judgement doesn't prevent that from happening, and end it with an, "I'm sorry, Jay."

However, by all accounts, he did nothing of the kind, instead he got in a pissing contest and prove he was the boss. I 'real' boss doesn't have to prove that fact.

Well, we will have to agree to disagree.

I read the whole thing differently. So he had trade talks with other teams? I honestly don't see why that is an issue. It certainly doesn't excuse Jay's behavior.

If one of your employees refused to return your calls or speak to you, would you kiss their ass? Or would you fire them? I have to beleive you would fire them. I know I would.

Tned
04-04-2009, 06:23 PM
Sorry, T, but have you missed the last week and a half of this whole fiasco?

Nope, I haven't missed the last week and a half. My point is that an experienced head coach would not have let it get this far.


Well, we will have to agree to disagree.

I read the whole thing differently. So he had trade talks with other teams? I honestly don't see why that is an issue. It certainly doesn't excuse Jay's behavior.

If one of your employees refused to return your calls or speak to you, would you kiss their ass? Or would you fire them? I have to believe you would fire them. I know I would.

Nothing excuses Jay's behavior. However, McDaniels should have been smart enough to not let it get this far.

As a boss, I know that many, many times I have to put my ego in check for the good of the company. It isn't about 'proving' I am right or that I am the 'boss', but about doing what is right.

As a head coach, McDaniels shouldn't be saying to Jay, "come on buddy, let's whip them out and see who's is bigger."

McDaniels clearly put his ego in front of what was best for the team.

It's done, I am still a Broncos fan, and am rooting for McDaniels to be successful as the Broncos head coach, but that doesn't stop me from recognizing his huge blunder while learning on the job.

Denver Native (Carol)
04-04-2009, 06:30 PM
We may never know what the truth really is:

Cutler has been unhappy ever since learning that McDaniels failed to inform him about trade talks in which the Broncos showed interest in Matt Cassel.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4031893

VERSUS

McDaniels also said it wasn't true he didn't clue in Cutler to the trade talks that sparked the firestorm. He said he informed Cutler and Cook on Feb. 28 that he had received a phone call that morning asking if he would be willing to part with Cutler in a three-way deal.

"That morning, we told them that there were some people who had called about an issue with [Matt] Cassel, that we had talked to them, that we did not initiate the contact, that that's where it stood," McDaniels told the Associated Press.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports...,4901621.story

Nature Boy
04-04-2009, 08:06 PM
Bring Back Mikey! Bring Back Mikey! Bring Back Mikey!!!



.

MOtorboat
04-04-2009, 08:07 PM
Bring Back Mikey! Bring Back Mikey! Bring Back Mikey!!!



.

A.) His name is Mike Shanahan.

B.) Please.

OrangeHoof
04-04-2009, 08:52 PM
It's done, I am still a Broncos fan, and am rooting for McDaniels to be successful as the Broncos head coach, but that doesn't stop me from recognizing his huge blunder while learning on the job.

That deserves more than just a High Five. If Cutler is this big a problem to McDiapers, what would he have done with TO or Ocho Cinco or others who are clearly bigger discipline problems than Jay Cutler?

Bronco fans may have learned that their new coach lacks the maturity and diplomacy to be an NFL head coach. You have to learn when to confront your multi-millionaire stars and when to let criticism roll off your back for the good of the organization. I guess we'll learn more based on whether Scheffler gets the same treatment on his way out the door.

Nature Boy
04-04-2009, 08:56 PM
That deserves more than just a High Five. If Cutler is this big a problem to McDiapers, what would he have done with TO or Ocho Cinco or others who are clearly bigger discipline problems than Jay Cutler?

Bronco fans may have learned that their new coach lacks the maturity and diplomacy to be an NFL head coach. You have to learn when to confront your multi-millionaire stars and when to let criticism roll off your back for the good of the organization. I guess we'll learn more based on whether Scheffler gets the same treatment on his way out the door.


I want McDummass gone by the end of the season.

.

OrangeHoof
04-04-2009, 09:07 PM
We may never know what the truth really is:

Cutler has been unhappy ever since learning that McDaniels failed to inform him about trade talks in which the Broncos showed interest in Matt Cassel.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4031893

VERSUS

McDaniels also said it wasn't true he didn't clue in Cutler to the trade talks that sparked the firestorm. He said he informed Cutler and Cook on Feb. 28 that he had received a phone call that morning asking if he would be willing to part with Cutler in a three-way deal.

"That morning, we told them that there were some people who had called about an issue with [Matt] Cassel, that we had talked to them, that we did not initiate the contact, that that's where it stood," McDaniels told the Associated Press.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports...,4901621.story

I honestly don't believe that was the flash point for this whole falling out. To me, it's a red herring. Certainly McDiapers and his QB would have spoken before the end of February. He'd been hired for practically two months at that point and you would presume that the brand new head coach would be eager to start spreading his gospel to his new quarterback. If he didn't, that just shows he hasn't learned Head Coaching 101.

So my presumption is that the two had had words long before the Cassel trade came up and they must not have gone well because McDiapers then starts jerking himself off to bringing in Cassel.

But once the story leaked, naturally the press would want to know "what's wrong with the Pro Bowl QB you already have?" So, they called Cutler which is when everything hit the fan.

Now, maybe Cutler is lying and McDiapers briefed him every step of the way. Or maybe McDiapers got caught with his pants down and had to start lying to save face and Bowlen was forced to back him up or, obviously, the decision to hire McDiapers comes back at him when he'd already stuck his neck out by firing Shanahan. So, Bowlen and the FO decide to stand by their coach and Cutler, seeing the writing on the wall, demands a trade rather than play for a team he feels doesn't support him.

What's done is done and it is good the Broncos did the trade for no better reason than the whole thing was never going to go away until one of the particulars did. So, let's focus on moving forward with what we have.

Reidman
04-04-2009, 09:22 PM
So is this letter an apology or what?

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 10:06 PM
If the Broncos defense is improved, the QBs decent, they are in the Playoffs or on the cusp of the postseason (in better form than last season), will people still want McDaniels gone?

BeefStew25
04-04-2009, 10:08 PM
If the Broncos defense is improved, the QBs decent, they are in the Playoffs or on the cusp of the postseason (in better form than last season), will people still want McDaniels gone?

Oh I don't know. I can't speak for you guys. It would depend on the effectiveness of the draft you guys are going to have if I was a Bronco fan.

Tned
04-04-2009, 10:16 PM
That deserves more than just a High Five. If Cutler is this big a problem to McDiapers, what would he have done with TO or Ocho Cinco or others who are clearly bigger discipline problems than Jay Cutler?

Bronco fans may have learned that their new coach lacks the maturity and diplomacy to be an NFL head coach. You have to learn when to confront your multi-millionaire stars and when to let criticism roll off your back for the good of the organization. I guess we'll learn more based on whether Scheffler gets the same treatment on his way out the door.

Exactly. I think Cutler screwed up in how he handled things, but he's a dumb, 25 year old, spoiled, football star and millionaire. Head coaches in the NFL are supposed to know how to deal with these kids and their immaturity, not resort to a game of sticks and stones.

Denver Native (Carol)
04-04-2009, 10:16 PM
I honestly don't believe that was the flash point for this whole falling out. To me, it's a red herring. Certainly McDiapers and his QB would have spoken before the end of February. He'd been hired for practically two months at that point and you would presume that the brand new head coach would be eager to start spreading his gospel to his new quarterback. If he didn't, that just shows he hasn't learned Head Coaching 101.

So my presumption is that the two had had words long before the Cassel trade came up and they must not have gone well because McDiapers then starts jerking himself off to bringing in Cassel.

But once the story leaked, naturally the press would want to know "what's wrong with the Pro Bowl QB you already have?" So, they called Cutler which is when everything hit the fan.

Now, maybe Cutler is lying and McDiapers briefed him every step of the way. Or maybe McDiapers got caught with his pants down and had to start lying to save face and Bowlen was forced to back him up or, obviously, the decision to hire McDiapers comes back at him when he'd already stuck his neck out by firing Shanahan. So, Bowlen and the FO decide to stand by their coach and Cutler, seeing the writing on the wall, demands a trade rather than play for a team he feels doesn't support him.

What's done is done and it is good the Broncos did the trade for no better reason than the whole thing was never going to go away until one of the particulars did. So, let's focus on moving forward with what we have.

They did talk before Feb 28th - Cutler was here for two weeks, studying the playbook, etc., and then the ROOF fell in. Cutler's dad dropped off the playbook at Dove Valley on Friday.

Tned
04-04-2009, 10:17 PM
If the Broncos defense is improved, the QBs decent, they are in the Playoffs or on the cusp of the postseason (in better form than last season), will people still want McDaniels gone?

Winning cures most ills. If McDaniels leads the Broncos to the playoffs or beyond, then fans should be happy.

56crash
04-04-2009, 10:21 PM
Good.

Keep up with the personal insults, it's funny, and childish, kinda like your boy Cutler.

Kind of like you telling a person he is not a fan unless he towes your line . as he said ....


(O):eek:

MOtorboat
04-04-2009, 10:23 PM
Kind of like you telling a person he is not a fan unless he towes your line . as he said ....


(O):eek:

I didn't say that at all.

Keep making things up.

56crash
04-04-2009, 10:23 PM
Winning cures most ills. If McDaniels leads the Broncos to the playoffs or beyond, then fans should be happy.

I will hate the man until the day he is fired .

Dreadnought
04-04-2009, 10:24 PM
If the Broncos defense is improved, the QBs decent, they are in the Playoffs or on the cusp of the postseason (in better form than last season), will people still want McDaniels gone?

Yes.

Poet
04-04-2009, 10:24 PM
I will hate the man until the day he is fired .

So even if he puts up a HOF worthy career you will hate him? Your feelings are not subject to change no matter what he does?

Poet
04-04-2009, 10:27 PM
Yes.

This makes no sense. If he made your team better you would want him gone? If that happened it would validate his move and it would honestly be so embarrassing for so many of the Cutler lovers that it isn't funny.

Why do you guys act like he came to your house and kicked your pet or peed in your food?

Especially since Cutler forced the trade at the end.

Broncospsycho77
04-04-2009, 10:27 PM
Yes.

Why?

56crash
04-04-2009, 10:31 PM
I didn't say that at all.

Keep making things up.

Now THERE's a solid argument.

Piss off. Maybe you should be a Bears fan now.

:confused:

Tned
04-04-2009, 10:32 PM
This makes no sense. If he made your team better you would want him gone? If that happened it would validate his move and it would honestly be so embarrassing for so many of the Cutler lovers that it isn't funny.

Why do you guys act like he came to your house and kicked your pet or peed in your food?

Especially since Cutler forced the trade at the end.

I think McDaniels srewed the pooch big time, BUT I am now ready to watch him rebuild this team and get us back to the playoffs.

In my mind, the two aren't mutually exclusive. I can recognize the fact he fumbled the ball as a rookie head coach, but still want him to be successful and the team to win.

Nothing would make me happier than him being the Broncos head coach for the next 14 years, and bring us a couple SB titles.

MOtorboat
04-04-2009, 10:34 PM
Now THERE's a solid argument.

Piss off. Maybe you should be a Bears fan now.

:confused:

So, whose line was I toeing? I'd love to see this response.

Tned
04-04-2009, 10:37 PM
So, whose line was I toeing? I'd love to see this response.

:coffee:

56crash
04-04-2009, 10:45 PM
So, whose line was I toeing? I'd love to see this response.

that was you statement putz not mine ...

56crash
04-04-2009, 10:47 PM
Piss off. Maybe you should be a Bears fan now.

that was your line .

I really hate them words by the way .

56crash
04-04-2009, 10:49 PM
people should let everyone have space and let them work out how they feel you telling them how they should feel is BS.

bcbronc
04-04-2009, 10:55 PM
They did talk before Feb 28th - Cutler was here for two weeks, studying the playbook, etc., and then the ROOF fell in. Cutler's dad dropped off the playbook at Dove Valley on Friday.

I don't think it's just coincidence that Jay took a look at the playbook, and *then* asked for a trade. ;)


I will hate the man until the day he is fired .

then any takes you have on McDaniels are completely irrelevant.

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 10:55 PM
Piss off. Maybe you should be a Bears fan now.

that was your line .

I really hate them words by the way .



that was you statement putz not mine ...



people should let everyone have space and let them work out how they feel you telling them how they should feel is BS.

You are totally clueless, as proved last night. Go back under your bridge. Not you BC, damn you're fast on the draw.

Tned
04-04-2009, 10:58 PM
You are totally clueless, as proved last night. Go back under your bridge. Not you BC, damn you're fast on the draw.

When you slam someone, it's best if you quote them, so they can fully appreciate your witty words.

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 11:02 PM
Done.

Poet
04-04-2009, 11:05 PM
Ummm... Can we like, get along and stuff?

Tned
04-04-2009, 11:07 PM
Ummm... Can we like, get along and stuff?

Wouldn't that be nice?

Poet
04-04-2009, 11:17 PM
Wouldn't that be nice?

I think we need to all agree to put an end with the fan comments. This is not directed at you Tned so you know.

A lot of great fans (in my opinion) are upset that Cutler is gone. A lot of great fans (in my opinion) are indifferent, like the move (for a variety of reasons that I won't get into).

On each side of the argument there are so retarded "points" that have been made. On EACH side.

No one likes it when they are told to go cheer for someone else, or that they are a bad fan. To be honest, all the organization cares about is if you give them money. Yes, some owners like Bowlen and the Rooneys do care more about you, at least that's what their actions have stated. But at the end of the day it's a business first and foremost. If Bowlen could make mad crazy money by cutting the starting QB every year and finding a way to get a new young stud out of the draft he would.

If he could make a ton of money by forcing the LBs to play WR or the QB to play RB he would. My point is that fans should try to stick together first and foremost because you are the little man.

There are varying levels of fandom, everyone knows that. But even if someone in your fanbase is a friggin idiot (and ALL fanbases have them) and even if they can't post anything or say anything intelligent rail on them for that. But to say they are not a fan, or that they should not be a fan of your team is unnessacary.

I won't lie, I have enjoyed the Cutler drama because I like to argue and debate. At times I have chimed in just to get people riled up. More so for debate's sake, but still.

I know a lot of people are saying that it's over move on. But to me, this is one of the biggest and most important things to ever happen to your franchise. Keep talking about it, it's huge.

A poster that I respect the hell out of is Dogfish. And he and I are on different sides of the fence on this one, but I can respect his argument. I can see how he got to where he is on it, although I disagree.

I am far from a "let's always stay nice to each other" kind of guy. I think that that mentality is phony and only causes more problems than it fixes when applied to a subject that people are passionate about on a message board, within reason of course.

And within reason, while posting a link to a Bears site IS quite funny, there is also a point that people should back away.

Oh, and I expect you to change this to Bearsforums.com/forums by tommorrow Tned. :coffee:

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 11:19 PM
I for one, HATE all the drama surrounding our team the last few years.

Plummer/Cutler
Cutler/Plummer
Shanahan fied
McDaniels/Shanahan
Cutler/McDaniels
Bowlen/McDaniels

The last few years have been not favorable for Broncos fans.

But it could be worse...























The Broncos could be the Bengals.

Bizzarro
04-04-2009, 11:26 PM
The last few years have been not favorable for Broncos fans.

But it could be worse...


The Broncos could be the Bengals.

I don't think even if they tried to lose, they could be the Bengals. :eek:

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 11:32 PM
Bizzaro is awesome!

Poet
04-04-2009, 11:34 PM
I for one, HATE all the drama surrounding our team the last few years.

Plummer/Cutler
Cutler/Plummer
Shanahan fied
McDaniels/Shanahan
Cutler/McDaniels
Bowlen/McDaniels

The last few years have been not favorable for Broncos fans.

But it could be worse...























The Broncos could be the Bengals.

You sir a a bad man and now I hope all your players tear their acls.

your choice in super heros is awful and Captain Marvel is a cheap superman knockoff designed to lure fools! :coffee:

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 11:38 PM
Hey! I never wish ill will on a player! Except Jay Cutler...

Captain Marvel kicked Superman's ass... Um, I just like him in DC vs. Mortal Kombat.

Ok.

Here's a great deal.

A #1 and Orton for Palmer.

What'cha think King?

Poet
04-04-2009, 11:41 PM
Hey! I never wish ill will on a player! Except Jay Cutler...

Captain Marvel kicked Superman's ass... Um, I just like him in DC vs. Mortal Kombat.

Ok.

Here's a great deal.

A #1 and Orton for Palmer.

What'cha think King?

Captain Marvel was the business in DC versus MK.

I would say no. Not that I think Palmer is going to be back to his 05 form (for a variety of reasons).

I think letting the Cincinnati offensive line maul ANOTHER QB is just mean spirited.

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 11:45 PM
I was kidding.

Poet
04-04-2009, 11:46 PM
I was kidding.

So was I.

Carson Palmer is worth 13 first day picks son!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

OoOOooOooOooo YEAHHAHAHAHAHAHH

GOOooOooOoOooOooO Caaaaaaraaaaaaazy!!!!!!!!!!

Shazam!
04-04-2009, 11:48 PM
More like a stale hero sandwich. That poor bahstahd should pull a Cutler and demand a trade before he wastes more time there wallowing away in teh river of sub-mediocrity.

Poet
04-04-2009, 11:50 PM
More like a stale hero sandwich. That poor bahstahd should pull a Cutler and demand a trade before he wastes more time there wallowing away in teh river of sub-mediocrity.

Nah, unlike Jay Cutler Carson Palmer is actually a grown man.

I wouldn't tell him to go to Denver. If he went there your crazy obsessed fans would stalk him.

Most of you guys are gay.


lolzlzlzllzolzolzsolzolzolzolzolzolzolzoozllzo

MUAHAHAHHAEHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

/fart.

Dean
04-04-2009, 11:58 PM
This letter sure doesn't sound like Pat Bolen speaks. People sometimes write better than they speak but it does make me wonder if Pat was the author.

Tned
04-05-2009, 12:06 AM
Oh, and I expect you to change this to Bearsforums.com/forums by tommorrow Tned. :coffee:

Ok, I thought this was a secret, but I guess someone let the cat out of the bag. I had planned on making an announcement next weekend.

Well, it isn't completed yet, but since the news leaked out, here goes.

Next weekend BroncosForums.com will move to BearsForums.com.

The new site is located here: http://www.bearsforums.com/forums

Anyone that wants to volunteer to help with some of the graphic work, let me know.

NightTrainLayne
04-05-2009, 12:08 AM
Ok, I thought this was a secret, but I guess someone let the cat out of the bag. I had planned on making an announcement next weekend.

Well, it isn't completed yet, but since the news leaked out, here goes.

Next weekend BroncosForums.com will move to BearsForums.com.

The new site is located here: http://www.bearsforums.com/forums

Anyone that wants to volunteer to help with some of the graphic work, let me know.

. . .I'm speechless. . .

My resignation will be forthcoming. :laugh:

Tned
04-05-2009, 12:12 AM
. . .I'm speechless. . .

My resignation will be forthcoming. :laugh:

I truely hope the mod team in place now will stay on. The bears have a great tradition, great QB, and we will be able to start saying Da Bears.... It never worked with the Broncos -- Da Broncos...

I've thought long and hard about this and come to the conclusion that changing our forum affiliation to the Bears is the only thing that makes sense for the community.

Shazam!
04-05-2009, 12:18 AM
Please stop before I send the Legion of Doom to your house right now TNed.

Poet
04-05-2009, 12:29 AM
Ok, I thought this was a secret, but I guess someone let the cat out of the bag. I had planned on making an announcement next weekend.

Well, it isn't completed yet, but since the news leaked out, here goes.

Next weekend BroncosForums.com will move to BearsForums.com.

The new site is located here: http://www.bearsforums.com/forums

Anyone that wants to volunteer to help with some of the graphic work, let me know.

I'm the mother ******* King, of course I knew.

Broncospsycho77
04-05-2009, 12:30 AM
It's like the French version of Halo 2 all over again...

Shazam!
04-05-2009, 12:50 AM
I cannot imagine Master Chief speaking french...

nevcraw
04-05-2009, 12:56 AM
That doesn't give you a good reason to act like a "punk as bitch," either, though.

no one but you are telling lifelong fans to go root for another team if they don't agree with you..

Dreadnought
04-05-2009, 12:58 AM
I truely hope the mod team in place now will stay on. The bears have a great tradition, great QB, and we will be able to start saying Da Bears.... It never worked with the Broncos -- Da Broncos...

I've thought long and hard about this and come to the conclusion that changing our forum affiliation to the Bears is the only thing that makes sense for the community.

You will have my total support. Its exciting to see the Bears with their first great QB since Sid Luckman. And no, Jim McMahon does not count.

Poet
04-05-2009, 01:07 AM
I cannot imagine Master Chief speaking french...

I agree, Master Chief would never surrender.

slim
04-05-2009, 01:13 AM
I think we need to all agree to put an end with the fan comments. This is not directed at you Tned so you know.

A lot of great fans (in my opinion) are upset that Cutler is gone. A lot of great fans (in my opinion) are indifferent, like the move (for a variety of reasons that I won't get into).

On each side of the argument there are so retarded "points" that have been made. On EACH side.

No one likes it when they are told to go cheer for someone else, or that they are a bad fan. To be honest, all the organization cares about is if you give them money. Yes, some owners like Bowlen and the Rooneys do care more about you, at least that's what their actions have stated. But at the end of the day it's a business first and foremost. If Bowlen could make mad crazy money by cutting the starting QB every year and finding a way to get a new young stud out of the draft he would.

If he could make a ton of money by forcing the LBs to play WR or the QB to play RB he would. My point is that fans should try to stick together first and foremost because you are the little man.

There are varying levels of fandom, everyone knows that. But even if someone in your fanbase is a friggin idiot (and ALL fanbases have them) and even if they can't post anything or say anything intelligent rail on them for that. But to say they are not a fan, or that they should not be a fan of your team is unnessacary.

I won't lie, I have enjoyed the Cutler drama because I like to argue and debate. At times I have chimed in just to get people riled up. More so for debate's sake, but still.

I know a lot of people are saying that it's over move on. But to me, this is one of the biggest and most important things to ever happen to your franchise. Keep talking about it, it's huge.

A poster that I respect the hell out of is Dogfish. And he and I are on different sides of the fence on this one, but I can respect his argument. I can see how he got to where he is on it, although I disagree.

I am far from a "let's always stay nice to each other" kind of guy. I think that that mentality is phony and only causes more problems than it fixes when applied to a subject that people are passionate about on a message board, within reason of course.

And within reason, while posting a link to a Bears site IS quite funny, there is also a point that people should back away.

Oh, and I expect you to change this to Bearsforums.com/forums by tommorrow Tned. :coffee:

Go be a Browns fan.

Poet
04-05-2009, 01:28 AM
Go be a Browns fan.

Your mother.

56crash
04-05-2009, 10:25 AM
Done.

no you are going to have real fun this next season I promise !

56crash
04-05-2009, 10:34 AM
Ok, I thought this was a secret, but I guess someone let the cat out of the bag. I had planned on making an announcement next weekend.

Well, it isn't completed yet, but since the news leaked out, here goes.

Next weekend BroncosForums.com will move to BearsForums.com.

The new site is located here: http://www.bearsforums.com/forums

Anyone that wants to volunteer to help with some of the graphic work, let me know.

LOL I really like you ,you do have a great sense of humor on the fan police ...:beer:

:laugh:

OrangeHoof
04-05-2009, 07:18 PM
I will hate the man until the day he is fired .

I won't. But here's a parallel. My favorite MLB team is the Houston Astros. In 2001, they fired Larry Dierker as manager, a fan favorite, and replaced him with Jimy Williams. Williams already had one foot in the grave replacing a local legend but, worse, his track record showed that everytime he got fired, his old team improved until they reached the World Series.

Williams was a numbskull who made the most idiotic managerial moves - like when the star hitter was mired in a terrible slump he played him every day and then when the star finally gets a good day at the plate, he benched him because "he needs a rest".

So, yes, I couldn't wait until the Astros fired Williams (and I wasn't alone if you'll recall the boos that poured down when Williams was introduced in front of his HOME crowd at the 2004 All-Star Game). Sure enough, after Williams was canned, the Astros reached the World Series the next year.

Now, I'm willing to give McDiapers a chance but if he makes one bonehead move after another and the teams falls into the Top 5 of the 2010 draft, I'll lead the campaign to get him fired and replaced with somebody more competent.

Because I'm a Broncos fan and that's what we fans do - recognize when the team has crap leadership and campaigns for a change, right Jr?

Shazam!
04-05-2009, 09:06 PM
Aside from the Cutler nonsense (which Jay helped bring to critical mass) I think McDaniels' offseason moves have been very good. We'll see how he does when the Broncos take the field. I won't condemn him until I see his actions translate to failure on the field. I like what I have seen thus far.

Ravage!!!
04-05-2009, 09:11 PM
This lil speech by Bowlen didn't give me more confidence whatsoever. Didn't the season ticket holders have to commit to their purchases before this entire ordeal went down? Do you think that there would have been a drop had the "cutler for Orton" deal was announced one hour prior to ticket sales?

Shazam!
04-05-2009, 09:14 PM
No. Fans root for the uniforms first, players second. Denver will be fine.

MOtorboat
04-05-2009, 09:15 PM
lol i really like you ,you do have a great sense of humor on the fan police ...:beer:

:laugh:

lol

Broncos Mtnman
04-05-2009, 09:19 PM
This lil speech by Bowlen didn't give me more confidence whatsoever. Didn't the season ticket holders have to commit to their purchases before this entire ordeal went down? Do you think that there would have been a drop had the "cutler for Orton" deal was announced one hour prior to ticket sales?

Exactly right, my friend. I had to have my renewal in the end of Feb.

One more thing to know. Club seat holders such as myself signed license agreements for a specific period of time that incur huge penalties for trying to give back the tickets.

Bowlen's letter was a crock.

MOtorboat
04-05-2009, 09:20 PM
Fight the power!

Ravage!!!
04-05-2009, 09:20 PM
No. Fans root for the uniforms first, players second. Denver will be fine.

You are obviously a fan that hasn't been around pre-FA days. That used to be a synonomous statement.

But please, don't try to insinuate that you are a better 'fan' simply because you choose to close yoru eyes or insult every player that chooses to leave.

Shazam!
04-05-2009, 09:24 PM
You are obviously a fan that hasn't been around pre-FA days. That used to be a synonomous statement.

But please, don't try to insinuate that you are a better 'fan' simply because you choose to close yoru eyes or insult every player that chooses to leave.

Please stop it. I said nowhere that I am a better fan than anyone else. I'm a fan that's been around a long time, probably longer than you. Cutler is gone. Have a kleenex. Get over it.