McDaniels at risk of losing team.

[turftoad]

Video - NFL.com

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80f8b376

[DenBronx]

he said the broncos have hurt the trade value by tipping their hand. krieger also said hey have devalued cutler himself by making him look bad. if they were going to trade him why make a public announcement? why not give praise about cutler as a player yet privately try and trade him. all they are doing is bringing his trade value down.

you want him traded yet you keep bashing him. great maybe we'll end up with a 3rd round pick in 2010.

[claymore]

he said the broncos have hurt the trade value by tipping their hand. krieger also said hey have devalued cutler himself by making him look bad. if they were going to trade him why make a public announcement? why not give praise about cutler as a player yet privately try and trade him. all they are doing is bringing his trade value down.

you want him traded yet you keep bashing him. great maybe we'll end up with a 3rd round pick in 2010.

This is a shit sandwhich from start to finish. We cant even trade the guy with some professionalism.

[OB]

How is saying he is handling a situation bad devaluing his skills?

He isnt a tard like TO - he's not a cancer to a team (at least other than ours at the moment)

He will be a great acquisition for any team - this should not hurt his stock in the slightest - as much as i think Cutler is partly at fault - anyone with a brain also knows that McD could have handled this better and did start this war

[BroncoJoe]

Krieger is an idiot.

[skycoyote]

McD lost this team a month ago. Once a nerd always a nerd. He will never get any respect in Denver. He'll always be McDummy. Bowlen can fire him now, an save alot of time, or fire him later; either way its inevitable.

[Flatinum]

How did they hurt his stock? Do you think the teams that line up to trade for this guy are going to get together and say "Lets not offer what he's worth, let's lowball the Broncos because they said they're going to trade him" lol

If he's the great qb alot of people here and on NFL Netowrk think he is then there will be a bidding war for this guy. If Daniel Snyder, the Jets, Lions or anyone else want him they'll do whatever it takes to get him.

"Franchise Qb's don't grow on trees"

Besides the Broncos hold all the cards here, he doesn't get paid alot and he's signed for three years, they don't have to trade him just to trade him.

Who's to say that Jay hasn't hurt his stock by going on the way he is?

[NameUsedBefore]

"We'll give you a first, second and third."

"That's it?"

"Well excuse me, the guy obviously has personality problems."

"No he doesn't! Well, wait... ****..."

Basically.

Also, I'm a big fan of the "people notice and do not like liars" theory. McD's pressing all the right buttons on that one.

[DenBronx]

i hate shit sandwhiches....

[Thnikkaman]

Call me an idiot, but I don't think we will trade him.

However I am sick and tired of the circus.

[slim]

They will get plenty for him (probably more than he's worth). Herschel Walker told me so.

[BroncoJoe]

They will get plenty for him (probably more than he's worth). Herschel Walker told me so.

He's kickin' it on The Apprentice.

[shank]

if it was only one team,then cutler would be greatly devalued. there are 10 teams with interest, and like 3-4 with BIG interest. with a bidding war means that it's no longer about what cutler's value is to us, but what he's worth to the teams that want him.

if we trade him, i think his value will still be high.

[Benetto]

Call me an idiot, but I don't think we will trade him.

However I am sick and tired of the circus.

I won't call you an idiot, because I would be the idiot to do that, but I will try and remind you....Jay has already made his bonus money, and is set to only make 1.4 mill next year...

His agent knows he is a high commodity QB, and teams would be on their knees to try and trade their souls for him....Jay knows he no longer has Shanahan as a security blanket, and has an opportunity to make over 8 digits instead of 7... He's not going to be a Bronco.

[BroncoJoe]

I won't call you an idiot, because I would be the idiot to do that, but I will try and remind you....Jay has already made his bonus money, and is set to only make 1.4 mill next year...

His agent knows he is a high commodity QB, and teams would be on their knees to try and trade their souls for him....Jay knows he no longer has Shanahan as a security blanket, and has an opportunity to make over 8 digits instead of 7... He's not going to be a Bronco.

He can make close to $7 million next year with incentives.

[turftoad]

Krieger is an idiot.

Kriegers only one of a bunch of analysts that think so.

[getlynched47]

eff McDaniels. He should write a book titled "How To Dismantle A Prominent Franchise In 3 Months-For Dummies"

He's an expert :coffee:

[Nomad]

Call me an idiot, but I don't think we will trade him.

However I am sick and tired of the circus.

Whatever happens, Cutler will be under a microscope wherever he goes or if he stays and he better live up to the hype he is getting and bring the team deep in to the playoffs possibly a SB win, because if not he mine as well have George II on the back of his jersey.

Same could be said for McDaniels and Bowlen, as far as the BRONCOS success. If McDaniels fails with the offense (give him a couple years), he'll be brought to the town square and hung; Bowlen will just be another Jerry Jones/ Al Davis.

[getlynched47]

How is saying he is handling a situation bad devaluing his skills?

He isnt a tard like TO - he's not a cancer to a team (at least other than ours at the moment)

He will be a great acquisition for any team - this should not hurt his stock in the slightest - as much as i think Cutler is partly at fault - anyone with a brain also knows that McD could have handled this better and did start this war

Cutler was never a cancer to our team.......until McDipShit effed everything up.

[BroncoJoe]

Kriegers only one of a bunch of analysts that think so.

I'll listen to players like Stinky as opposed to a writer.


eff McDaniels. He should write a book titled "How To Dismantle A Prominent Franchise In 3 Months-For Dummies"

He's an expert :coffee:

Yeah. We've been SO successful the past several years.

:tsk:

que - blame the defense.

[Lonestar]

I won't call you an idiot, because I would be the idiot to do that, but I will try and remind you....Jay has already made his bonus money, and is set to only make 1.4 mill next year...

His agent knows he is a high commodity QB, and teams would be on their knees to try and trade their souls for him....Jay knows he no longer has Shanahan as a security blanket, and has an opportunity to make over 8 digits instead of 7... He's not going to be a Bronco.

Actually it is 1.035 mil plus a very few incentives for this year and more money next year and even more for the final year..

So if he does not report to camp and we suspend him pending a trade.. It is not an issue.. Even setting on the bench for 1.035 or inactive each week might give the kid something to think about..

[broncophan]

eff McDaniels. He should write a book titled "How To Dismantle A Prominent Franchise In 3 Months-For Dummies"

He's an expert :coffee:

The dismantling had already started before McD was hired......although I am not sure exactly when..............he is just working on starting over from scratch......imo

[turftoad]

Whatever happens, Cutler will be under a microscope wherever he goes or if he stays and he better live up to the hype he is getting and bring the team deep in to the playoffs possibly a SB win, because if not he mine as well have George II on the back of his jersey.

Same could be said for McDaniels and Bowlen, as far as the BRONCOS success. If McDaniels fails with the offense (give him a couple years), he'll be brought to the town square and hung; Bowlen will just be another Jerry Jones/ Al Davis.

McDaniels will be under the microscope more than any of them.

He better produce, if not, he'll be run out of town.

[BroncoJoe]

Actually it is 1.035 mil plus a very few incentives for this year and more money next year and even more for the final year..

So if he does not report to camp and we suspend him pending a trade.. It is not an issue.. Even setting on the bench for 1.035 or inactive each week might give the kid something to think about..

Once again, he can make upwards of $7 million this year with incentives.

[getlynched47]

McDaniels will be under the microscope more than any of them.

He better produce, if not, he'll be run out of town.

I'm ready to run his ass outta town after 3 months...

[CoachChaz]

McDaniels will be under the microscope more than any of them.

He better produce, if not, he'll be run out of town.

...and rightfully so. If he's here for his contract and shows no signs of improving the team, then get rid of him...until then, I prefer to wait and see what he can do as a coach and judge him on that as opposed to his personality clash with one player

[turftoad]

...and rightfully so. If he's here for his contract and shows no signs of improving the team, then get rid of him...until then, I prefer to wait and see what he can do as a coach and judge him on that as opposed to his personality clash with one player

We'll have to wait to judge him as a coach.

The judging of his management and personel skills has already been done. :tsk:

[bcbronc]

he said the broncos have hurt the trade value by tipping their hand. krieger also said hey have devalued cutler himself by making him look bad. if they were going to trade him why make a public announcement? why not give praise about cutler as a player yet privately try and trade him. all they are doing is bringing his trade value down.

you want him traded yet you keep bashing him. great maybe we'll end up with a 3rd round pick in 2010.

do you really think it makes any difference? you realize of course that before McX trades Cutler, it's in their best interest to ensure that all teams know he's on the block, right?

you really think a team is going to change their opinion on Cutler because it's in the media that he's being shopped? after this past month of speculation and rumour and he said she said? riiiiight.

"we would have given you two firsts, but now that you've announced he's being traded, he's only worth a 2nd to us."

:rolleyes:

[Nomad]

McDaniels will be under the microscope more than any of them.

He better produce, if not, he'll be run out of town.

Maybe for BRONCO fans! McDaniels is a rookie HC and the expectations from him are not as high. Cutler, on the other hand, compared himself to one of the greatest QBs ever and he'll take that with him wherever he goes and the fans and media will expect that from him as many fans have annointed him here in BRONCO Nation.

And I don't disagree with McDaniels being gone if he doesn't produce given a couple years with the situation that has comeabout.

[Denver27og]

eff McDaniels. He should write a book titled "How To Dismantle A Prominent Franchise In 3 Months-For Dummies"

He's an expert :coffee:


so true

[CoachChaz]

We'll have to wait to judge him as a coach.

The judging of his management and personel skills has already been done. :tsk:

Assuming we know all the details about how things went down.

What if later we found that Cutler originally said to McD that he didnt want to be here, but would do it because he was under contract? We cant say it did or didnt happen...because we dont know.

As always...I'm not so much defending McD as much as I am simply saying that when it comes down to all the facts...we dont really know shit

[Denver27og]

for those of you that live in denver and get to go to the home games of our once prominent proud somewhat loyal franchise... bring your single a batteries.. shorties of jack daniels and jim beam.. and aim for mcdicks head

[BroncoJoe]

eff McDaniels. He should write a book titled "How To Dismantle A Prominent Franchise In 3 Months-For Dummies"

He's an expert :coffee:

Prominent?

Are you stuck in the late 90's? We haven't done shit since our last superbowl.

[slim]

for those of you that live in denver and get to go to the home games of our once prominent proud somewhat loyal franchise... bring your single a batteries.. shorties of jack daniels and jim beam.. and aim for mcdicks head

Weak...

[getlynched47]

Prominent?

Are you stuck in the late 90's? We haven't done shit since our last superbowl.

The entire league viewed the Broncos as a respectable franchise, regardless of how many playoffs games we've won since our Super Bowl. McDaniels is destroying that...

[BroncoJoe]

The entire league viewed the Broncos as a respectable franchise, regardless of how many playoffs games we've won since our Super Bowl. McDaniels is destroying that...

Right. You have no clue as to what you're talking about.

[slim]

The entire league viewed the Broncos as a respectable franchise, regardless of how many playoffs games we've won since our Super Bowl. McDaniels is destroying that...

Good Lord...they haven't played of ******* game yet and he has destroyed the entire franchise?

I don't want to alarm you, but I think you may be overreacting.

[getlynched47]

Good Lord...they haven't played of ******* game yet and he has destroyed the entire franchise?

I don't want to alarm you, but I think you may be overreacting.

We haven't played a game, but McDaniels has managed to turn this team into the laughing stock of the NFL, get rid of our 25 year old QB, and get rid of a locker room favorite in Mike Leach for no reason.

That's destroying...

[CoachChaz]

Destroying a franchise or over-hauling a team stuck in medicrity?

[BroncoJoe]

We haven't played a game, but McDaniels has managed to turn this team into the laughing stock of the NFL, get rid of our 25 year old QB, and get rid of a locker room favorite in Mike Leach for no reason.

That's destroying...

Yep. I'm sure the rest of the league is really concerned.

:tsk:

[Tempus Fugit]

We haven't played a game, but McDaniels has managed to turn this team into the laughing stock of the NFL, get rid of our 25 year old QB, and get rid of a locker room favorite in Mike Leach for no reason.

That's destroying...

Paxton is, perhaps, the best long snapper in the NFL. He is a Patriots veteran who, along with Gaffney, can help McDaniels instill the both the on-the-field system and the off-the-field system that McDaniels wants to bring to the Broncos. That's only "no reason" if you aren't actually trying to be reasonable.

[BroncoJoe]

Paxton is, perhaps, the best long snapper in the NFL. He is a Patriots veteran who, along with Gaffney, can help McDaniels instill the both the on-the-field system and the off-the-field system that McDaniels wants to bring to the Broncos. That's only "no reason" if you aren't actually trying to be reasonable.

Welcome. Nice first post.

[claymore]

Paxton is, perhaps, the best long snapper in the NFL. He is a Patriots veteran who, along with Gaffney, can help McDaniels instill the both the on-the-field system and the off-the-field system that McDaniels wants to bring to the Broncos. That's only "no reason" if you aren't actually trying to be reasonable.

What kind of long snapping system is mcdaniels bringing in?

[turftoad]

Paxton is, perhaps, the best long snapper in the NFL. He is a Patriots veteran who, along with Gaffney, can help McDaniels instill the both the on-the-field system and the off-the-field system that McDaniels wants to bring to the Broncos. That's only "no reason" if you aren't actually trying to be reasonable.

I have no problem with this.

[Buff]

Krieger is an idiot.

Krieger is actually one of the better columnists in town... But I hate how much sympathy he has for Cutler. I have absolutely none.

[turftoad]

What kind of long snapping system is mcdaniels bringing in?

:spit:

[Tempus Fugit]

What kind of long snapping system is mcdaniels bringing in?

So you think that Paxton can't help players digest the new system because he's "just" a long snapper? You figure he never watched or participated in any other part of practice?

[claymore]

So you think that Paxton can't help players digest the new system because he's "just" a long snapper? You figure he never watched or participated in any other part of practice?

I doubt he will be out there instructing anyone on anything. Ive never heard of the need to bring in long snappers fluent in the "system"

[bcbronc]

So you think that Paxton can't help players digest the new system because he's "just" a long snapper? You figure he never watched or participated in any other part of practice?

and his 3 rings are meaningless as well, because he's just a long snapper.


wait, wasn't Leach also just a long snapper, but getting rid of him is one half of ruining the franchise? :confused:

I'm so confused by all this.

[Tempus Fugit]

I doubt he will be out there instructing anyone on anything. Ive never heard of the need to bring in long snappers fluent in the "system"

So you've never been in a professional sports clubhouse or heard professional sports teammates talking about how things are done, then?

[CoachChaz]

I doubt he will be out there instructing anyone on anything. Ive never heard of the need to bring in long snappers fluent in the "system"

If he means so little, then why did people cry about losing the complete clubhouse leader that Leach was portrayed to be?

[Nomad]

If he means so little, then why did people cry about losing the complete clubhouse leader that Leach was portrayed to be?

He was Cutler's BFF!!:D

[Tempus Fugit]

and his 3 rings are meaningless as well, because he's just a long snapper.


wait, wasn't Leach also just a long snapper, but getting rid of him is one half of ruining the franchise? :confused:

I'm so confused by all this.

I can understand the people who are disappointed at losing someone with Cutler's physical potential. Because they think the Broncos have shafted Cutler, every other move and decision must be wrong. That's where they lose their credibility.

[CoachChaz]

He was Cutler's BFF!!:D

I thought the perennial Pro-Bowl, icon of health, Tony Sheffler was...my bad

[broncofaninfla]

he said the broncos have hurt the trade value by tipping their hand. krieger also said hey have devalued cutler himself by making him look bad. if they were going to trade him why make a public announcement? why not give praise about cutler as a player yet privately try and trade him. all they are doing is bringing his trade value down.

you want him traded yet you keep bashing him. great maybe we'll end up with a 3rd round pick in 2010.

Add this to the long list of mistakes team McD and we are only two months into his tenor. Hopefully they are smart enough to hold out for a deal that will actually help the team not one that will accelerate Mcd's eventual termination.

[claymore]

So you've never been in a professional sports clubhouse or heard professional sports teammates talking about how things are done, then?If your trying to make a point on how important the long snapper is..... just stop.

Leach was just as good as anyone else at the position. Nobody in the league knew who paxton was before this ridiculous signing.

A longsnapper is going to bring in as much leadership, system experience etc... As a punter.

Unless Paxton snaps the ball at 7200 RPM i dont wanna here it. If he went missing for a year we wouldnt win any more or lose any less. We would just put in a reserve tightend or shitty guard with some highschool expereience to fill his position.

If he means so little, then why did people cry about losing the complete clubhouse leader that Leach was portrayed to be?

I thought it was a hilarious move. It was lateral in talent, and a downgrade in Cap space. But I gave McD a pass because of the position, although important.... Its not a team killer.

Locker room presence and leadership is laughable to me.

[Tempus Fugit]

Add this to the long list of mistakes team McD and we are only two months into his tenor. Hopefully they are smart enough to hold out for a deal that will actually help the team not one that will accelerate Mcd's eventual termination.

Ok, now this is the type of argument I've been seeing on this site since this all began. So.....

What is this long line of mistakes? For the sake of the discussion, let's even assume that McDaniels did, in fact, initiate trade talks and then lied to Cutler about it. Other than that, what are the other "mistakes"?

[LawDog]

I can understand the people who are disappointed at losing someone with Cutler's physical potential. Because they think the Broncos have shafted Cutler, every other move and decision must be wrong. That's where they lose their credibility.

Doesn't matter what people think, it does matter what the other players on the team think.

Taking a well liked, locker room leader, who is one of the best at a mostly overlooked position and replacing him --for more money-- with "your" guy who knows the Patriot way and expecting the rest of the players to trust and respect you for it displays an alarming level of ignorance.

The players will be asking "should we or should we not follow the advice of the galactically stupid"?

McDaniels has zero credibility as a headcoach - will that change? Who knows.

[Tempus Fugit]

Doesn't matter what people think, it does matter what the other players on the team think.

Taking a well liked, locker room leader, who is one of the best at a mostly overlooked position and replacing him --for more money-- with "your" guy who knows the Patriot way and expecting the rest of the players to trust and respect you for it displays an alarming level of ignorance.

The players will be asking "should we or should we not follow the advice of the galactically stupid"?

McDaniels has zero credibility as a headcoach - will that change? Who knows.

Ok, so which players have you spoken to that have said the McDaniels' decision to choose Paxton over Leach destroyed all his credibility?

[turftoad]

Ok, so which players have you spoken to that have said the McDaniels' decision to choose Paxton over Leach destroyed all his credibility?

I don't give a shit about Leach or Paxton.

This has zero relevance.

[Watchthemiddle]

I thought the perennial Pro-Bowl, icon of health, Tony Sheffler was...my bad

icon of health...love it

I usually call him the next Nate Jackson...but I like yours better.:laugh:

[CoachChaz]

Doesn't matter what people think, it does matter what the other players on the team think.

Taking a well liked, locker room leader, who is one of the best at a mostly overlooked position and replacing him --for more money-- with "your" guy who knows the Patriot way and expecting the rest of the players to trust and respect you for it displays an alarming level of ignorance.

The players will be asking "should we or should we not follow the advice of the galactically stupid"?

McDaniels has zero credibility as a headcoach - will that change? Who knows.

According to what "experts"?

[claymore]

Ok, so which players have you spoken to that have said the McDaniels' decision to choose Paxton over Leach destroyed all his credibility?
I think you are lonnie Paxton.

[turftoad]

According to what "experts"?

Don't need experts. He hasn't coached even one game as a HC yet so he doesn't have any credibilty YET.

[LawDog]

Ok, so which players have you spoken to that have said the McDaniels' decision to choose Paxton over Leach destroyed all his credibility?

Obviously you are able to read, so you will notice that I did not say that players have said that that decision destroyed his credibility. Whether I have talked to them or not is irrelevant.

What I did say is that McDaniels has no credibility as a headcoach. I say that because he has never been a headcoach. Starts at zero, get it?

Let's see if he can generate some, but so far he has been stumbling.

[broncofaninfla]

Ok, now this is the type of argument I've been seeing on this site since this all began. So.....

What is this long line of mistakes? For the sake of the discussion, let's even assume that McDaniels did, in fact, initiate trade talks and then lied to Cutler about it. Other than that, what are the other "mistakes"?

Wasted $$$ in free agency, 3 Rb's who aren't any better than the guys we had, over paying the new LS, not one sure starter out of free agency on the DL (our biggest need) and start to finish the way he handled the Cutler issue.

[CoachChaz]

Don't need experts. He hasn't coached even one game as a HC yet so he doesn't have any credibilty YET.

That is a ridiculously pessimistic approach, but okay

[LawDog]

According to what "experts"?

You and Tempus suffer from the same disease.

McDaniel's experience to date gives him a lot of promise to be a great headcoach, but he ain't been one yet and thus has no credibility. You don't need to be an expert to get the concept.

[Tempus Fugit]

Obviously you are able to read, so you will notice that I did not say that players have said that that decision destroyed his credibility. Whether I have talked to them or not is irrelevant.

What I did say is that McDaniels has no credibility as a headcoach. I say that because he has never been a headcoach. Starts at zero, get it?

Let's see if he can generate some, but so far he has been stumbling.

This has been another problem with the Cutler supporters. They seem to think that their opinion is somehow the exact same thing as an incontrovertible fact.

[Watchthemiddle]

You and Tempus suffer from the same disease.

McDaniel's experience to date gives him a lot of promise to be a great headcoach, but he ain't been one yet and thus has no credibility. You don't need to be an expert to get the concept.

Well obviously he must be doing something right to bring in the # of free agents to Denver...not to mention a potential HOF Safety that will bring the Hat to a much needed depleted defense.

[claymore]

This has been another problem with the Cutler supporters. They seem to think that their opinion is somehow the exact same thing as an incontrovertible fact.

What do the players say? In your one on one conversations with Clady and Royal, how do they feel?

[LawDog]

This has been another problem with the Cutler supporters. They seem to think that their opinion is somehow the exact same thing as an incontrovertible fact.

If you are going to bother quoting my post, at least write something that is even remotely related to what I posted.

Care to try again?

[LawDog]

Well obviously he must be doing something right to bring in the # of free agents to Denver...not to mention a potential HOF Safety that will bring the Hat to a much needed depleted defense.

None of them came in for a paycut... and we had a pro bowl QB when they signed. But whatever, McDaniels = Genius, I get it.

[slim]

If your trying to make a point on how important the long snapper is..... just stop.

Leach was just as good as anyone else at the position. Nobody in the league knew who paxton was before this ridiculous signing.

A longsnapper is going to bring in as much leadership, system experience etc... As a punter.

Unless Paxton snaps the ball at 7200 RPM i dont wanna here it. If he went missing for a year we wouldnt win any more or lose any less. We would just put in a reserve tightend or shitty guard with some highschool expereience to fill his position.


I thought it was a hilarious move. It was lateral in talent, and a downgrade in Cap space. But I gave McD a pass because of the position, although important.... Its not a team killer.

Locker room presence and leadership is laughable to me.

I hear Mike Leach is available.

[Buff]

for those of you that live in denver and get to go to the home games of our once prominent proud somewhat loyal franchise... bring your single a batteries.. shorties of jack daniels and jim beam.. and aim for mcdicks head

Do us all a favor and go smash your computer with a sledge hammer.

[Watchthemiddle]

None of them came in for a paycut... and we had a pro bowl QB when they signed. But whatever, McDaniels = Genius, I get it.
I'm not saying he is a genius, but the way Cutler is acting is absurd.

Finally, someone has let Cutler know he is NOT bigger than the TEAM.

Bye Cutler.

[claymore]

for those of you that live in denver and get to go to the home games of our once prominent proud somewhat loyal franchise... bring your single a batteries.. shorties of jack daniels and jim beam.. and aim for mcdicks head


Do us all a favor and go smash your computer with a sledge hammer.

Then go over to Cswil's house and smash his computer up too.

[hotcarl]

McMarmot and Professor Xavier need to get on the same page as Flat Blowlen so we can trade Jane Buttler for something decent. Heck, throw in Baloney Chestler and Branflakes Marshmellow and see if you can get someone like Duncan Roberts :welcome:

[LawDog]

I'm not saying he is a genius, but the way Cutler is acting is absurd.

Finally, someone has let Cutler know he is NOT bigger than the TEAM.

Bye Cutler.

And in two years someone will let McDaniels know he is NOT bigger than the TEAM...

Cutler did not handle it well - but you, I and no one else on the board knows what was really going on between the parties. I blame all three of them (I think Xanders is just along for the ride) for this debacle. I'm not on any one's "side" but McDaniels is still here so I will feel free to criticize him as I see fit.

[Tempus Fugit]

What do the players say? In your one on one conversations with Clady and Royal, how do they feel?

I don't know, but I'm not claiming that I do. If you can't see the irony, I don't know what to tell you.

[claymore]

I don't know, but I'm not claiming that I do. If you can't see the irony, I don't know what to tell you.

That was your argument. Players openly stated the Paxton thing made no sense.

[Requiem / The Dagda]

Paxton rules!

[Tempus Fugit]

That was your argument. Players openly stated the Paxton thing made no sense.

It wasn't my argument at all. Feel free to go back and re-read.

[Watchthemiddle]

And in two years someone will let McDaniels know he is NOT bigger than the TEAM...

Cutler did not handle it well - but you, I and no one else on the board knows what was really going on between the parties. I blame all three of them (I think Xanders is just along for the ride) for this debacle. I'm not on any one's "side" but McDaniels is still here so I will feel free to criticize him as I see fit.

Oh I totally agree that none of us really know what has happened, but Cutler was really the "innocent" one in all of this, don't you think he would have said something by now?

He hasn't exactly come out and said that there were now text's or calls from the owner or HC. He could have come out and said they are lying, they never reached out, but it hasn't happened. Cutler knows he is in the wrong. He is probably embarrassed and knows that the fan base ( atleast 50%) think he is a big baby. I wouldn't want to come back to that either. He is not mature or man enough to face Denver ever again. He would rather go play for teams where fans wear brown paper bags over their faces ....that way they are embarrassed to be fans of that team, and Cutler doesn't have to see anyone face to face.

[claymore]

So you've never been in a professional sports clubhouse or heard professional sports teammates talking about how things are done, then?


Ok, so which players have you spoken to that have said the McDaniels' decision to choose Paxton over Leach destroyed all his credibility?



It wasn't my argument at all. Feel free to go back and re-read.

Tell me how I am misreading this.....

[Tempus Fugit]

Wasted $$$ in free agency, 3 Rb's who aren't any better than the guys we had, over paying the new LS, not one sure starter out of free agency on the DL (our biggest need) and start to finish the way he handled the Cutler issue.

If you don't think the running backs that were brought in are upgrades for the roles they will play, there's really nothing I can tell you other than that you're claiming "mistakes" by McDaniels that are not definite mistakes. The idea that Arrington isn't a better fit for the Kevin Faulk role than the running backs that were already on the roster is just one example. The same goes for the rest of your post, really. You're using the word "mistake" to cover things that are nothing but your take on players.

[Tempus Fugit]

Tell me how I am misreading this.....

Sure, you're conflating two separate posts as if they are in response to the exact same thing when you must know full well that they aren't. The first is a general response. I've been the locker rooms of professional sports teams, and I've been around when professional sports players are talking about their game, and I know that the players ask questions of the players who might know the answer.

The second was a specific question about a specific comment.

[turftoad]

That is a ridiculously pessimistic approach, but okay

There IS cause to be pessimistic about McD.

[hotcarl]

Sure, you're conflating two separate posts as if they are in response to the exact same thing when you must know full well that they aren't. The first is a general response. I've been the locker rooms of professional sports teams, and I've been around when professional sports players are talking about their game, and I know that the players ask questions of the players who might know the answer.

The second was a specific question about a specific comment.

jay cutler found?

[CrazyHorse]

Paxton rules!

Paxton for QB!

[Lonestar]

might as well add woodys mondays crap to this thread..

http://photos.denverpost.com/photoprojects/galleries/video.html?bcpid=1504364485&bclid=1443772310&bctid=17308048001

[BroncoNut]

I don't give a shit about Leach or Paxton.

This has zero relevance.

Concerning your post.


this isn't the lounge and shit is a naughty word. You're a mod here aren't you? Maybe you should be setting a better example.

thanks for your understanding


:D

[turftoad]

Concerning your post.


this isn't the lounge and shit is a naughty word. You're a mod here aren't you? Maybe you should be setting a better example.

thanks for your understanding


:D

You can say shit Nut. ;)

[gregbroncs]

eff McDaniels. He should write a book titled "How To Dismantle A Prominent Franchise In 3 Months-For Dummies"

He's an expert :coffee:
I don't get how people can be on Cutler's side now if they are Broncos fans. How hard is it to answer the phone for your boss if he has been calling for 10 days? How big of a ***** are you if you won't pick up the phone because you don't like what he may say?

I tried to stay neutral but 2 times now he has refused calls from the owner of the team instead of answering them and hearing the guy out. To me that's being a ***** and acting like a 5 year old avoiding a difficult situation instead of dealing with it like an adult. Grow up Cutler.

This was the last straw for me. I hope he gets traded to the Lions or 49ers who have no offensive lines and just learns what it is like to play for a team that does not care about trying to protect their QB. Then when he gets hurt and sits the sidelines not earning his incentive money and ends up out of the league in 5 years we can all laugh at him.

I would wish the Broncos just sat him on the bench for 3 years but that hurts my favorite team and I hope they get something in return for him and Cutler turns out to be the next Ryan Leaf or Jeff George.

[OB]

shit nut - hey you can :D

Anywho - i wanted to say this on the first page but work had to interrupt me

Where does it say in that video anyone from the team is upset about this - It was that reporters speculation that players may lose respect

I dont like the title of this thread it is misleading

The End ;)

[Tempus Fugit]

I'm confused....... the Cutler apologists are claiming that Cutler's been nothing but honest, and that McDaniels is a liar, but here's one reporter writing about the phone calls:


Sources close to Cutler said of owner Pat Bowlen's announcement that his quarterback had failed to reply to phone calls by the Broncos over the last 10 days and that Cutler would be traded, that Cutler contends he has not received any such calls from the Broncos.

Sources close to Bowlen responded in five words: "We have the phone records."

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d80f8e2d7&template=without-video-with-comments&confirm=true

So are those "sources close to Bowlen" now lying about something as verifiable as phone records, too, is the reporter just making this stuff up, or is J.C., mighty J.C., striking out?

[scott.475]

Well, it is a done deal now, but watch McD at the beginning of that video. He has so many tells that he is being dishonest it is amazing. He is a terrible liar, and by that I mean he cannot cover his lies well. If I were in a room an my boss/friend/anybody talked to me with those same mannerisms and way of speaking, I would know they were not being honest and could not be trusted. No wonder the face-to-face meeting fell apart.

Geez, when I consider that not one other Pats assistant has had any luck as a HC, and then I see all the rest that has happened here, I really do not have much hope for the next few years.

By the way, I am not a bandwagon, fair weather fan, and frankly NO ONE should be calling anyone here fair weather fans just because they are upset about what is going on. Our fans are extremely loyal, no matter what side of the current drama you are on. I live in Seattle, I know fair weather fans, and Denver fans are by no means "fair weather" or "bandwagon" fans, so knock it off.

[Dean]

Bowlen will just be another Jerry Jones/ Al Davis.

Not a big chance of that. They make decisions. Unless forced to do so Bowlen would rather not stick his head out of his shell.

[LawDog]

I'm confused....... the Cutler apologists are claiming that Cutler's been nothing but honest, and that McDaniels is a liar, but here's one reporter writing about the phone calls:



http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d80f8e2d7&template=without-video-with-comments&confirm=true

So are those "sources close to Bowlen" now lying about something as verifiable as phone records, too, is the reporter just making this stuff up, or is J.C., mighty J.C., striking out?

We deal with "verifiable" phone records all the time in my line of work. Tells you that a call was made from one number to another, when and for how long. Records don't tell you who was on the phone and phone records (at least the ones that Bowlen's staff or someone "close to him" would have now - and curious that they would need to say they have them anyway...) don't tell you about calls that were never completed.

Cutler can say they never called and tried to talk to him and Bowlen can say oh yes we did and they could both be technically truthful. They're all being idiots about this. "They never called me." "We've got the phone records." OMG what are you, like, five? Get the trade done and get out of the sandbox already.

[Tempus Fugit]

We deal with "verifiable" phone records all the time in my line of work. Tells you that a call was made from one number to another, when and for how long. Records don't tell you who was on the phone and phone records (at least the ones that Bowlen's staff or someone "close to him" would have now - and curious that they would need to say they have them anyway...) don't tell you about calls that were never completed.

Cutler can say they never called and tried to talk to him and Bowlen can say oh yes we did and they could both be technically truthful. They're all being idiots about this. "They never called me." "We've got the phone records." OMG what are you, like, five? Get the trade done and get out of the sandbox already.

So you're saying that Cutler doesn't actually use his own phone or look at the messages, that his carrier is the worst in the world and that the Broncos making the calls were using *67 and not leaving messages?

[LawDog]

So you're saying that Cutler doesn't actually use his own phone or look at the messages, that his carrier is the worst in the world and that the Broncos making the calls were using *67 and not leaving messages?

Dude, no that is not what I am saying. But a call from Dove Valley to some hotel in Nashville (not based in fact, just a random example) doesn't prove that they tried to get in touch with Cutler and it doesn't prove that Cutler refused to talk to them. It's just nothing.

And, like time, I gotta fly.

[omac]

might as well add woodys mondays crap to this thread..

http://photos.denverpost.com/photoprojects/galleries/video.html?bcpid=1504364485&bclid=1443772310&bctid=17308048001

Thanks for the link. Woody's pretty harsh on McDaniels. He says that if you dealt with McDaniels, you'd know why he rubs people the wrong way.

I'm not sure I see it that way; I think McDaniels tries a little too hard to be Belichick, at least in the way he treats his players and runs an organization. Give McDaniels some time and he'll probably find a style that suits him perfectly.

[WARHORSE]

McDaniels sucks, and we have the dumbest front office in the land.

No wonder the Goodmans left.

I bet my bottom dollar McMuffin started the trade discussions in house, the Goodmans balked, and out the door they went.

I sure would like to hear them answer some questions about why they left............

[hotcarl]

McDaniels sucks, and we have the dumbest front office in the land.

No wonder the Goodmans left.

I bet my bottom dollar McMuffin started the trade discussions in house, the Goodmans balked, and out the door they went.

I sure would like to hear them answer some questions about why they left............

you seem like you think your opinion is very important all the time

goodnight sweet fart

[omac]

McDaniels sucks, and we have the dumbest front office in the land.

No wonder the Goodmans left.

I bet my bottom dollar McMuffin started the trade discussions in house, the Goodmans balked, and out the door they went.

I sure would like to hear them answer some questions about why they left............

If Woody's take on McDaniels is true, then he probably rubbed them the wrong way.

[Superchop 7]

Thanks Woody,

We already had a beat on what McKid is all about.

Don't want the Jets, want first pick in draft.

Keep slamming him till he is gone, I love it.

[hotcarl]

we should all fart on it

stick it McGeyver!

[Hawgdriver]

He can make close to $7 million next year with incentives.

BJ sounds like you have looked at the $ angle...care to elaborate?

[Lonestar]

Thanks for the link. Woody's pretty harsh on McDaniels. He says that if you dealt with McDaniels, you'd know why he rubs people the wrong way.

I'm not sure I see it that way; I think McDaniels tries a little too hard to be Belichick, at least in the way he treats his players and runs an organization. Give McDaniels some time and he'll probably find a style that suits him perfectly.


In all of my jobs going into problem locations and being tacked with fixing them it was always go in as a hard ass and back off when you knew the people.. get rid of the malingerers and problem kids and keep and reward the good to great workers..

It is impossible to go in as be the Nice guy and then crack the whip if that does not work.

I see nothing wrong with what has happened here..

[bcbronc]

McDaniels sucks, and we have the dumbest front office in the land.

No wonder the Goodmans left.

I bet my bottom dollar McMuffin started the trade discussions in house, the Goodmans balked, and out the door they went.

I sure would like to hear them answer some questions about why they left............

I though the Goldmans' left because they got fired? :confused:

but I wouldn't be surprised if you are right, that discussing Cutler is where the disagreement between camps was. if so, I'm cool with that. the Goodmen helped draft Cutler, but it's McDaniels offense and McDaniels team. I do believe McDaniels was genuine when he said recently that he wanted Cutler to be his QB..."now" is inferred. but Jay can't get past that and wants to move on. that's the business of the sport, and if Jay doesn't do what's right for Jay, he's not going to be an effective football player. he's got all the potential in the world, but if something doesn't "click" for him soon, it probably never will.

so let's turn him into some new assets and start climbing out of this morass of mediocrity we've been in for way too long.

[claymore]

In all of my jobs going into problem locations and being tacked with fixing them it was always go in as a hard ass and back off when you knew the people.. get rid of the malingerers and problem kids and keep and reward the good to great workers..

It is impossible to go in as be the Nice guy and then crack the whip if that does not work.

I see nothing wrong with what has happened here..

Thats my philosophy as well..... But we do not live in an environment where we have film of our employees.

[Lonestar]

I though the Goldmans' left because they got fired? :confused:

but I wouldn't be surprised if you are right, that discussing Cutler is where the disagreement between camps was. if so, I'm cool with that. the Goodmen helped draft Cutler, but it's McDaniels offense and McDaniels team. I do believe McDaniels was genuine when he said recently that he wanted Cutler to be his QB..."now" is inferred. but Jay can't get past that and wants to move on. that's the business of the sport, and if Jay doesn't do what's right for Jay, he's not going to be an effective football player. he's got all the potential in the world, but if something doesn't "click" for him soon, it probably never will.

so let's turn him into some new assets and start climbing out of this morass of mediocrity we've been in for way too long.


goodmans got fired and you can bet your ass if they had some dirt here it would be in the press..

so I doubt this goes back that far..

[Lonestar]

Thats my philosophy as well..... But we do not live in an environment where we have film of our employees.


sorry not following the film part..

[Hawgdriver]

sorry not following the film part..

because the film would reveal that Jay was an exceptional talent and worth sacrificing humility. a debatable point, but the one I think clay was after.

[omac]

In all of my jobs going into problem locations and being tacked with fixing them it was always go in as a hard ass and back off when you knew the people.. get rid of the malingerers and problem kids and keep and reward the good to great workers..

It is impossible to go in as be the Nice guy and then crack the whip if that does not work.

I see nothing wrong with what has happened here..

There are different styles for different situations and for different people. That's why you see a Tony Dunghy type, who's pretty successful with his team and players, and a Parcels/Belichick type who's also pretty successful. What may work in one situation, may not in another.

Harbaugh replaced the player-type coach in Billick, and his hard-nosed style made Baltimore a better team; Coughlin actually softened his image to his players, becoming more friendly and diplomatic with them, and even using Strahan(?) as a bridge for players to voice their needs, and that season, it got them a superbowl.

Different methods work in different situations.

[Simple Jaded]

I won't call you an idiot, because I would be the idiot to do that, but I will try and remind you....Jay has already made his bonus money, and is set to only make 1.4 mill next year...

His agent knows he is a high commodity QB, and teams would be on their knees to try and trade their souls for him....Jay knows he no longer has Shanahan as a security blanket, and has an opportunity to make over 8 digits instead of 7... He's not going to be a Bronco.

http://www.sportingnews.com/blog/real_scouts/entry/view/22464/jay_cutler_might_not_be_at_april_minicamp,_after_a ll

Jay Cutler didn't get a signing bonus, from what I've heard/read he's due 16 million is roster bonuses over the next two off-seasons.

Obviously, Jay Cutler gave the Broncos a huge break when signing his rookie deal with no signing bonus, and now he has as much to lose by asking to be traded as he does by showing up and playing for a Head Coach who clearly wants to go in another direction.

People want to think this is about getting a new contract, I think it's more likely to be about getting assurances for the current contract.......

[horsepig]

Somebody tell me if I'm wrong here, but doesn't Jay stand to make immediate millions over this whole farce? The Broncos then unload his coming BIG raises and invest that potential into someone else's potential.

This is beginning to look like "Monopoly in the NFL".

Detroit's probably our best bet for good return on investment, but I'd love to see Cutler go to NYC and try to live in that fishbowl.

[WARHORSE]

you seem like you think your opinion is very important all the time

goodnight sweet fart


Your mothers calling.



Time to put your pajamas on.

[getlynched47]

McDaniels had every chance to approach this issue with a diplomatic mind set. But he's so caught up in the "Patriot Way" that it will ultimately lead to his demise.

Note to McDaniels: YOU AREN'T BILL BELLICHICK!!

[scott.475]

I do believe McDaniels was genuine when he said recently that he wanted Cutler to be his QB..."now" is inferred...so let's turn him into some new assets and start climbing out of this morass of mediocrity we've been in for way too long.

I do not mean this to be an attack on your thoughts, as we are seeing way too much in these threads, but did you actually see that NFLN interview with McD? I cannot imagine anyone could actually watch that, watch how he reacts to the question, and think he is being honest; he literally could not conceal his desire to be rid of Cutler. So, as I said before, he is a very unskilled liar. Either that, or he is socially retarded and REALLY needs to work on his overall presentation, as he comes across as a liar even when he is honest. Frankly, though, I just think he is a liar and that is probably what Jay saw as well.

Having said that, the deal will be done, and I completely agree with the second part of your statement.

[Lonestar]

There are different styles for different situations and for different people. That's why you see a Tony Dunghy type, who's pretty successful with his team and players, and a Parcels/Belichick type who's also pretty successful. What may work in one situation, may not in another.

Harbaugh replaced the player-type coach in Billick, and his hard-nosed style made Baltimore a better team; Coughlin actually softened his image to his players, becoming more friendly and diplomatic with them, and even using Strahan(?) as a bridge for players to voice their needs, and that season, it got them a superbowl.

Different methods work in different situations.

Yes I know been doing it for 45 years.. the Dungy types are the exception to the rules the Coughlin types are more the standard.. come on strong identfiy the issues, fix them and then nuture those that are left....

[omac]

Yes I know been doing it for 45 years.. the Dungy types are the exception to the rules the Coughlin types are more the standard.. come on strong identfiy the issues, fix them and then nuture those that are left....

There are so many Dungy types though that succeed with their style, though. Also, I don't question your ability. :cheers: