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Tebow4Ever
03-22-2009, 05:27 PM
Aside from what has happened. If you were to put yourself in the shoes of McDaniels knowing what you knew about quarterbacks in the NFL. Would you have also secretly hoped you could bring the guy in who you had built a relationship over the past four years with? Or would you take on the challenge of becoming acclimated to a new guy who has had some success but is not entirely familiar with the system you want to incorporate in your new stadium? It's easy for us to bash our new coach. But to be a fan is to support the coach and the team. Just my two cents. I would like to see Cutler stay but only if they can attribute their success to a solid working relationship.

BroncoJoe
03-22-2009, 05:39 PM
Aside from what has happened. If you were to put yourself in the shoes of McDaniels knowing what you knew about quarterbacks in the NFL. Would you have also secretly hoped you could bring the guy in who you had built a relationship over the past four years with? Or would you take on the challenge of becoming acclimated to a new guy who has had some success but is not entirely familiar with the system you want to incorporate in your new stadium? It's easy for us to bash our new coach. But to be a fan is to support the coach and the team. Just my two cents. I would like to see Cutler stay but only if they can attribute their success to a solid working relationship.

Ditto.

Requiem / The Dagda
03-22-2009, 05:52 PM
I would trade Jay Cutler immediately to the highest bidder and give the reigns to Darrell "Half-Foot Howitzer" Hackney. He is ready to lead this team.

Hardwired
03-22-2009, 06:14 PM
Based on my experience from being married for 30 years, I know the proper action in a situation like this is to assume everything wrong is my fault, humbly abase myself before the offended party, and apologize. Flowers and chocolate are usually appropriate as well.

Magnificent Seven
03-22-2009, 06:24 PM
I would resign and head back to east coast.

Day1BroncoFan
03-22-2009, 06:33 PM
I would tell Cutler to either join me with the Broncos and play or I would trade him if we couldn't come to an agreement.

Northman
03-22-2009, 07:29 PM
Aside from what has happened. If you were to put yourself in the shoes of McDaniels knowing what you knew about quarterbacks in the NFL. Would you have also secretly hoped you could bring the guy in who you had built a relationship over the past four years with? Or would you take on the challenge of becoming acclimated to a new guy who has had some success but is not entirely familiar with the system you want to incorporate in your new stadium? It's easy for us to bash our new coach. But to be a fan is to support the coach and the team. Just my two cents. I would like to see Cutler stay but only if they can attribute their success to a solid working relationship.


Honestly? If i was McD i would of taken on the challenge of taking a QB of Jay's calibur and put him in the best senario as possible to succeed in my scheme. Knowing what i did with a Qb who hasnt started since high school i would be salivating at the thought of what i could do with a guy who has the signs of the "it" factor. Although i would have listened to any offer that may have come my way i wouldnt have actively seeked any kind of trade for a QB who had 1 good year with a team (despite how long ive known him) that already had far more balance, veteran leadership, and stability to help that Qb succeed. I wouldnt have wanted to rock the boat by alienating a young Qb who i know is generally outspoken and honest to the media within my first 2 months of being the HC. This part of this senario is a major breakdown of communication and class on McD's part. I wouldnt of handled it this way personally but regardless of what happens with Jay i am willing to give McD this year to prove to me he is the right guy. He wasnt brought in to start from scratch, he was brought in to win and if we dont do better than 8-8 this year than he will be a failure in my eyes. But yes, i would of handled it much differently than McD has early on in this fiasco.

jrelway
03-22-2009, 07:53 PM
i would buy myself a dildo so i can go **** myself. but if cutler and mcdaniels can work it out, all is forgiven.

Lonestar
03-22-2009, 08:06 PM
I would have done exactly the same thing Josh did listen to the offer try to sweeten it a bit and trade him in a heart beat..

Even though they have not worked together He knows of him.. from scouting reports from eh NE defense..


Do not be stupid here folks he knows something that we do not..

He had a great relationship with Cassell for the past two or more years.. He knows what he can do and how much more potential there is in the kid....

He knows how the pats were going to attack jay and what his weak points are..

and contrary to those that think he walks on water.. jay has flaws..

Shazam!
03-22-2009, 08:53 PM
I would have just added this to one of the numerous Cutler/McDanils threads.

dogfish
03-22-2009, 08:57 PM
seppuku. . . .

ChairmanBron
03-22-2009, 09:14 PM
I would have just added this to one of the numerous Cutler/McDanils threads.

If I was Mc-, I would have Cutler bend over and demand that he say "Thank you Sir! May I have Another!"

TXBRONC
03-22-2009, 09:31 PM
Honestly? If i was McD i would of taken on the challenge of taking a QB of Jay's calibur and put him in the best senario as possible to succeed in my scheme. Knowing what i did with a Qb who hasnt started since high school i would be salivating at the thought of what i could do with a guy who has the signs of the "it" factor. Although i would have listened to any offer that may have come my way i wouldnt have actively seeked any kind of trade for a QB who had 1 good year with a team (despite how long ive known him) that already had far more balance, veteran leadership, and stability to help that Qb succeed. I wouldnt have wanted to rock the boat by alienating a young Qb who i know is generally outspoken and honest to the media within my first 2 months of being the HC. This part of this senario is a major breakdown of communication and class on McD's part. I wouldnt of handled it this way personally but regardless of what happens with Jay i am willing to give McD this year to prove to me he is the right guy. He wasnt brought in to start from scratch, he was brought in to win and if we dont do better than 8-8 this year than he will be a failure in my eyes. But yes, i would of handled it much differently than McD has early on in this fiasco.

In my opinion McDaniels will get about three years to prove himself.

Shazam!
03-22-2009, 09:33 PM
If Denver wins a few playoff games with or without Cutler, or gets to or even close to the Super Bowl within 2 years he'll be the best thing since the automatic transmission, and all who call him McDipshit will be kissing his butt. Fact.

Gamechanger
03-22-2009, 09:35 PM
watch as my team destroy your team :lol:

TXBRONC
03-22-2009, 09:43 PM
If Denver wins a few playoff games with or without Cutler, or gets to or even close to the Super Bowl within 2 years he'll be the best thing since the automatic transmission, and all who call him McDipshit will be kissing his butt. Fact.

True if McDaniels is successful with or without Cutler all is forgotten, however if he isn't the criticism will become more intense.

Northman
03-22-2009, 09:45 PM
In my opinion McDaniels will get about three years to prove himself.

Im sure he will but for me personally he gets this year.

TXBRONC
03-22-2009, 09:47 PM
Im sure he will but for me personally he gets this year.

If McDaniels does that poorly and you want to fire him, I've got your back. :D

atwater27
03-22-2009, 10:07 PM
If I am McDaniels.....

I would have kept the goodmans and Mr. Bates. Then I would have had more amazing drafts for years to come and a good o-coordinator to bear most of the offensive load while I fix WHAT IS REALLY WRONG WITH THE TEAM, THE DEFENSE. I then would have wined, dined and 69'ed my stud strong armed QB and started to mould him into an all time great. I would have never ever ******* EVER considered trading him, and if I did, I wouldn't have let it hit his ears from anybody else's lips but mine.

But he didn't so he is a douchebag. And he has alot of douchebag worshippers already in Denver strangely enough.

Requiem / The Dagda
03-22-2009, 11:45 PM
Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the Goodman's weren't entirely responsible for our good drafts.

bullis26
03-22-2009, 11:57 PM
Im sure he will but for me personally he gets this year.

okay so he goes 3-13 this year....then wins 2 straight superbowls that wouldnt prove anything to you?

atwater27
03-23-2009, 06:28 AM
Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the Goodman's weren't entirely responsible for our good drafts.

Yeah. They were just the gimps in the closet.:rolleyes:

Dirk
03-23-2009, 07:48 AM
Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the Goodman's weren't entirely responsible for our good drafts.


I agree. Sundquist was there when Cutler was drafted and let's not forget that Shanny had A LOT to do with the drafts.

The Goodmans had a key part but it all came down to Shanny and his decision on all player personel.

TXBRONC
03-23-2009, 08:09 AM
okay so he goes 3-13 this year....then wins 2 straight superbowls that wouldnt prove anything to you?

:lol: The chances of going from 3-13 to winning two straight Super Bowls is slim at best. If we should go 3-13 this season then next season the team better show drastic improvement or he could end up being gone by the end of the 2011 season in my opinion. That being said, what you do if he has back to back 3-13 seasons? He might get one more season but he wouldn't have any room for error.

And for the record I sure hope that doesn't happen because I don't want him to fail.

Requiem / The Dagda
03-23-2009, 08:17 AM
I agree. Sundquist was there when Cutler was drafted and let's not forget that Shanny had A LOT to do with the drafts.

The Goodmans had a key part but it all came down to Shanny and his decision on all player personel.

It is more than that.

It really boils down tothe fact that Denver subscribes to a National Scouting Service (as do most teams, besides two -- I believe Buffalo and Washington) and has around ten scouts roaming the country scouting prospects. To give the Goodman's all the credit in regards to the draft(s) we've had as of late is ridiculous and a short-sighted assessment; considering the bulk of information regarding prospects comes through the NSS and the reports the regional scouts do. Yep, the Goodman's played a role -- but to put it all on them. . . HA.

drewloc
03-23-2009, 08:41 AM
It is more than that.

It really boils down tothe fact that Denver subscribes to a National Scouting Service (as do most teams, besides two -- I believe Buffalo and Washington) and has around ten scouts roaming the country scouting prospects. To give the Goodman's all the credit in regards to the draft(s) we've had as of late is ridiculous and a short-sighted assessment; considering the bulk of information regarding prospects comes through the NSS and the reports the regional scouts do. Yep, the Goodman's played a role -- but to put it all on them. . . HA.

I agree, not to mention that some people were quick to blame everyone else for the supposed bad defensive draft of '07. You can't have it both ways. Did the Goodman's have something to do with the good parts of the draft? Yes, did they have a hand in the bad parts? Yes. It wasn't all on one person, good or bad. I also thought that Bates left of his own accord, and he wasn't fired, but took the OC position at USC. Or was he fired?

TXBRONC
03-23-2009, 08:45 AM
I agree, not to mention that some people were quick to blame everyone else for the supposed bad defensive draft of '07. You can't have it both ways. Did the Goodman's have something to do with the good parts of the draft? Yes, did they have a hand in the bad parts? Yes. It wasn't all on one person, good or bad. I also thought that Bates left of his own accord, and he wasn't fired, but took the OC position at USC. Or was he fired?

Bates left of his own accord.

claymore
03-23-2009, 09:04 AM
It is more than that.

It really boils down tothe fact that Denver subscribes to a National Scouting Service (as do most teams, besides two -- I believe Buffalo and Washington) and has around ten scouts roaming the country scouting prospects. To give the Goodman's all the credit in regards to the draft(s) we've had as of late is ridiculous and a short-sighted assessment; considering the bulk of information regarding prospects comes through the NSS and the reports the regional scouts do. Yep, the Goodman's played a role -- but to put it all on them. . . HA.
The goodmans get the majority of the credit because thats where the buck stopped. If they failed, thats who would have been blamed as well as Shannahan.

We all know about the staff that worked for them, the scouts and the scouting service.

But it was the Goodmans job to see it from start to finnish. And they did a good job. They handled the staff, scouting service etc... allot better than Sundquist did. THATS why they get credit, and allot of us didnt want them to go.

In other words, the Goodmans were not the problem, and they were released.

Requiem / The Dagda
03-23-2009, 09:05 AM
The buck didn't stop with them, Shanahan made the final decision regarding the selections. That has been noted time and time again.

claymore
03-23-2009, 09:07 AM
The buck didn't stop with them, Shanahan made the final decision regarding the selections. That has been noted time and time again.

They were in charge of the scouting whether you like it or not. It stated it in they're job title.

They handed the ratings on players to Shannahan. He said yes or no.

But they did a shit ton better than Sundquist did.

Northman
03-23-2009, 09:40 AM
okay so he goes 3-13 this year....then wins 2 straight superbowls that wouldnt prove anything to you?


Sure it would but i dont see it happening. At this stage in the game its up to him to prove me wrong. But we went 8-8 with one of the worst defenses in the league last year so anything less this year is a major step back. There's absolutely no reason for us to finish with a worst record this year.

Dirk
03-23-2009, 09:59 AM
Sure it would but i dont see it happening. At this stage in the game its up to him to prove me wrong. But we went 8-8 with one of the worst defenses in the league last year so anything less this year is a major step back. There's absolutely no reason for us to finish with a worst record this year.


I hope you are correct. But I think the "toughness" of the upcoming season is going to play a huge role in a better record than 8-8.

I will be just fine if we do 8-8 with a brand new wet behind the ears coach with the upcoming schedule. I think that it will show a lot of how well Coach McD is going to be coaching this team.

If he coaches this team to 8-8 then look out over the next few years!! I can give him a break his first year implementing a new offensive scheme and a new defensive scheme. That is a lot to adjust to.

Albeit I would be thrilled to death if we go into the post season next year! :D

Shazam!
03-23-2009, 10:06 AM
I am not ruling anything out. Miami was AWFUL 1-15, won the division and made the Playoffs with new players all over. Anything can happen. If McD can bring a fraction of the stability the Patriots have, and the defense becomes even competent watch out.

Northman
03-23-2009, 11:11 AM
I hope you are correct. But I think the "toughness" of the upcoming season is going to play a huge role in a better record than 8-8.

I will be just fine if we do 8-8 with a brand new wet behind the ears coach with the upcoming schedule. I think that it will show a lot of how well Coach McD is going to be coaching this team.

If he coaches this team to 8-8 then look out over the next few years!! I can give him a break his first year implementing a new offensive scheme and a new defensive scheme. That is a lot to adjust to.

Albeit I would be thrilled to death if we go into the post season next year! :D

Frankly SWM, "toughness" of schedule is overrated. A lot of people went into last year with the same concerns but we ended up beating teams we shouldnt and losing to teams we shouldnt. Thats not toughness, thats inconsistency. Not too mention if we were still in a rebuilding/project mode than we should of just stayed with Shanahan because that is what we were doing anyway. Bowlen didnt hire McD to start all over from scratch. He hired him to come in and fix those inconsistencies but when you start messing with a part of your team that really doesnt need that much fixing there are problems. Maybe he makes it work and as a Bronco fan i hope he can. But i do expect to do better than last year in this coming season. You dont replace one Coach who was rebuilding with another one just so he can have 2-3 more average seasons. And looking at what has happened in Arizona, Atlanta, and Miami there is no reason to expect a "great mind" like McD should fail with one of the most successful franchises in the NFL. Sounds to me like people are already getting their excuses ready should this guy fail. :tsk:

Shazam!
03-23-2009, 11:37 AM
Not too mention if we were still in a rebuilding/project mode than we should of just stayed with Shanahan... Bowlen didnt hire McD to start all over from scratch. He hired him to come in and fix those inconsistencies...

And looking at what has happened in Arizona, Atlanta, and Miami there is no reason to expect a "great mind" like McD should fail with one of the most successful franchises in the NFL. Sounds to me like people are already getting their excuses ready should this guy fail.


Point 1- A big problem with Shanahan was the lack of motivation and leadership, not to mention a slew of defensive woes the past few years. The team was flat and dead too often in the last two seasons. Sure leadership dissipated on the field (Rod, Al, Lynch, etc) but Shanahan should have provided a little more direction and not expect players to respond automatically, especially a group of such young guys. Sometimes the message doesn't get through without the personnel to set the example on the sidelines. As I have said many times before he should have resigned with 'I did what we set out to do and the franchise is better now than when I arrived' in 1999 when Elway retired and handed the team to Kubiak.

Point 2- I agree 100%. McDaniels will be ok I think. I wanted Spags but he was a terrible interviewer I read from too many sources here when he met with the NYJ. McD was my second choice and I'm glad they got him. We have to wait until the 2010 season to officially say 'He's a failure.' And the whole thing with NE coaches failing wherever they go post-Patriots, that gives McD a chance to break that. The odds are in his favor.

Medford Bronco
03-23-2009, 11:43 AM
Frankly SWM, "toughness" of schedule is overrated. A lot of people went into last year with the same concerns but we ended up beating teams we shouldnt and losing to teams we shouldnt. Thats not toughness, thats inconsistency. Not too mention if we were still in a rebuilding/project mode than we should of just stayed with Shanahan because that is what we were doing anyway. Bowlen didnt hire McD to start all over from scratch. He hired him to come in and fix those inconsistencies but when you start messing with a part of your team that really doesnt need that much fixing there are problems. Maybe he makes it work and as a Bronco fan i hope he can. But i do expect to do better than last year in this coming season. You dont replace one Coach who was rebuilding with another one just so he can have 2-3 more average seasons. And looking at what has happened in Arizona, Atlanta, and Miami there is no reason to expect a "great mind" like McD should fail with one of the most successful franchises in the NFL. Sounds to me like people are already getting their excuses ready should this guy fail. :tsk:


That is so true.

Denver lost to a pathetic Raider team and a Bills team with nothing to play for at home :tsk: The Bills game still pisses me off to this day when Slowbrain stopped being aggressive when Denver was up 13-3 I think. Inexcusable and why the playoffs were missed at well, unfortunatley.

Denver won at Atlanta and at the Jets (after the Jets knocked off Tenn who was 10-0 at the time.)

Great post Northman

Northman
03-23-2009, 12:24 PM
Point 1- A big problem with Shanahan was the lack of motivation and leadership, not to mention a slew of defensive woes the past few years. The team was flat and dead too often in the last two seasons. Sure leadership dissipated on the field (Rod, Al, Lynch, etc) but Shanahan should have provided a little more direction and not expect players to respond automatically, especially a group of such young guys. Sometimes the message doesn't get through without the personnel to set the example on the sidelines. As I have said many times before he should have resigned with 'I did what we set out to do and the franchise is better now than when I arrived' in 1999 when Elway retired and handed the team to Kubiak.

Disagree with you here as i think and still think Shanahan was/is a great Coach. I would of been seriously bummed had he retired after 98'. With that said, i know by the way that it looked that Shanahan just looked burnt out and i think even his own motivation fell drastically after 05'. I didnt expect him to be here much longer than 2 more years but Bowlen pulled the plug and now we have to move on.


Point 2- I agree 100%. McDaniels will be ok I think. I wanted Spags but he was a terrible interviewer I read from too many sources here when he met with the NYJ. McD was my second choice and I'm glad they got him. We have to wait until the 2010 season to officially say 'He's a failure.' And the whole thing with NE coaches failing wherever they go post-Patriots, that gives McD a chance to break that. The odds are in his favor.


Maybe, we shall see. I dont think he has done a lot to really earn the respect of the team as he has managed his social skills with Jay to crumble. However, maybe there is a plan and McD is really just an evil genius waiting to pounce. Hopefully it will be the latter. :D

Shazam!
03-23-2009, 12:29 PM
Disagree with you here as i think and still think Shanahan was/is a great Coach...

Shanahan the X's and O's coach yes, but he could never rally the troops. Without veteran leadership this was a problem. There was no shortage of that in the Super years.

Lonestar
03-23-2009, 01:07 PM
Shanahan the X's and O's coach yes, but he could never rally the troops. Without veteran leadership this was a problem. There was no shortage of that in the Super years.

He was a schemer and finesse guy and rarely does that win the big games.. w
He wanted lean, mean and fast..

Had it in the SB OLINE and bunch of rag tag chip on my shoulder mostly over the hill guys..

Once this group started to retire he tried to get them back with over priced mostly out of gas vets and absolutely bombed in the draft from 1999 until 2006.. 4 decent LB's, 1 RB and a DE/DT..

In fact until the 2006 draft I do not recall a draft that wound up with more than one eventual starter in it..

his demise was thinking he could have a OK defense and being able to win it all on offense..

super bowls over the past 20 years or so show that to be consistently wrong.. almost all of those wins were because they had a Good to Great defense.. not merely OK.. More balanced teams than not..

mikey had his glory and lifetime contract and ego the size of mile high.. beyond that it was way past time to go..