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Npba900
02-19-2012, 10:12 PM
Brian Billick said:

"I think the No. 1 thing Tim Tebow has to do, I don't think he can lift the way he's lifted before. There's three people that can't lift the way Tim Tebow does: pro quarterbacks, pro tennis players and golfers."

Tebow packs 236 chiseled pounds onto his 6-3 frame.

"He has got to cut back on that rigid, thick (frame)," said Billick. "I know it keeps him alive as a running quarterback, but it does not bode well for his passing, the fluidity that he has to have. So that's, to me, job one in the off-season, he's got to change his (conditioning) mindset."

Read more:

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/thehuddle/post/2012/01/brian-billick-john-elways-endorsement-of-broncos-tim-tebow-weak-but-qb-must-slim-down/1#.T0G3RvWOBas

wayninja
02-19-2012, 10:30 PM
I'm not convinced. I don't see any reason why you can't have the muscle mass and the fluidity. It may not be as easy, but it's also not mutually exclusive.

I've seen Tebow be fluid. His only problem is consistency. That implies muscle is not his issue.

If anything, I think a change at this point is bad. He needs to keep what he's got and learn to use it consistently.

Npba900
02-19-2012, 10:39 PM
We will see. One thing is for sure the elite QB's in the NFL are not built like Tebow. The QB's in today's NFL are not as heavily muscled in the shoulders and latts(sp), and heavy weight lifting has been none to cause your muscles and flexibility to tighten up to the point you loose valuable flexibility to ensure accuracy when throwing the football.

But in any regard I hope Fox scraps the Read-Option in 2012 and make Tebow execute full time from inside the pocket/behind center; while throwing the ball 25-30 times a game. That's the only way you can get a fair evaluation on whether Tebow can make the jump/adjustment of becoming an NFL Caliber QB.

underrated29
02-19-2012, 11:41 PM
Dumb.

Tebow is not innacurate because he is strong. Tables weight is not also only in his shoulders and biceps. The man has legs as thick as lineman and rbs.

Really, this was brought up last year or the year before and was debunked quickly. Not sure why billick would say something dumb like this

BORDERLINE
02-20-2012, 12:06 AM
I'm not convinced. I don't see any reason why you can't have the muscle mass and the fluidity. It may not be as easy, but it's also not mutually exclusive.

I've seen Tebow be fluid. His only problem is consistency. That implies muscle is not his issue.

If anything, I think a change at this point is bad. He needs to keep what he's got and learn to use it consistently.

consistency is the key. some have faith he will and some don't. it's up to Tebow

PAINTERDAVE
02-20-2012, 12:33 AM
Tebow is built. That is who he is...

eve if he lost 10-15 lbs...

he is still gonna be muscled and built.

I think it is a non issue.

Hisfootwork, quick decisons, confidence in throwing to a spot, and knowledge (reading defense)
is much more what he needs to work on...

wayninja
02-20-2012, 01:40 AM
For some reason Tebow reminds me of twin peaks.

Best plot I've seen in a really long time, but ridiculously bad acting.

Is it just me?

jlarsiii
02-20-2012, 02:31 AM
For some reason Tebow reminds me of twin peaks.

Best plot I've seen in a really long time, but ridiculously bad acting.

Is it just me?

No, it isn't just you. I also thought highly of twin peaks...

MasterShake
02-20-2012, 08:22 AM
I think he has a point. All of my muscled, chiseled frame gets in MY way when I use photoshop all day at work.

Dirk
02-20-2012, 08:28 AM
Flexibility is definately an issue when you are a body builder. I just don't think TT is too big at this point for it to be a problem. But what do I know.

SoCalImport
02-20-2012, 08:49 AM
Hisfootwork, quick decisons, confidence in throwing to a spot, and knowledge (reading defense)
is much more what he needs to work on...


Agree. whether or not his superman physique has any effect on his ability to make NFL throw (with NFL quickness) these other things are far more important.

vandammage13
02-20-2012, 09:31 AM
But in any regard I hope Fox scraps the Read-Option in 2012 and make Tebow execute full time from inside the pocket/behind center; while throwing the ball 25-30 times a game. That's the only way you can get a fair evaluation on whether Tebow can make the jump/adjustment of becoming an NFL Caliber QB.

I would like for Fox/McCoy to scale back on the read option, but I wouldn't like them to scrap it alltogether...Our QB is great at running it and it is still not something that most teams are used to defending.

The read option got us to be the #1 rushing attack in the league, so that's not something that you should just throw away just because it doesn't fit the "traditional mold."

I'd like to see us rely less on it, but I think that purely hinges on whether or not Tebow can improve enough to win games with his arm.

Read option coupled with a 58-63% completion rate would be a force to be reckoned with IMO.

Northman
02-20-2012, 10:18 AM
I'm not convinced. I don't see any reason why you can't have the muscle mass and the fluidity. It may not be as easy, but it's also not mutually exclusive.

I've seen Tebow be fluid. His only problem is consistency. That implies muscle is not his issue.

If anything, I think a change at this point is bad. He needs to keep what he's got and learn to use it consistently.

While Tim does need to become consistent i see what Billick is saying. Its why you dont see FB's, LB's, etc playing QB. As Brian pointed out from a toughness perspective it helps Tim survive the hits but i can see how it would effect his play as a QB. There's really no reason for him to be THAT big (muscle wise). His improvement needs to come from the mechanics area, not strength wise.

Chef Zambini
02-20-2012, 10:39 AM
brian billek is, was, and always will be a huge bag of wind. he needs to work on his ignorance!
as for tebow, he does need a conditioning regement for a QB, not a linebacker!
with TUTEN now gone, maybe all our players can enjoy a custom exercise and conditioning program to best suit their NEEDS.
tebow does not need to be any stronger, he neeeds to be SMARTER and more consistent as a PAsser more muscle and weight lifting are just going to get in the way of his progress.
brian remains an idiot!

Ravage!!!
02-20-2012, 10:45 AM
Of course it makes sense. QB'ing is a finesse position. He has the size, its the OVER working out and the MASSING up is the problem. All QBs lift weights, so he's not saying to stop lifting. Bill is saying that the lifting so hard to acquire mass is A problem (not THE problem), and he's right. People thought that it wouldn't hurt David Boston, either.

GEM
02-20-2012, 12:06 PM
Ok...I do agree with the statement somewhat.

Comparison, Tebow has large biceps, my only comparison can be having large boobs. His bulge comes from the arm, mine from the side boob. ( :laugh: ) When I am tossing the football with my boys, the sideboob definitely affects the throwing motion. I would imagine that the large bicep would do the same.

Hope that made sense. :laugh:

Superchop 7
02-20-2012, 12:07 PM
Tebow needs to have an 8 week swimming program before camp, it does help with his type of muscle mass plus it is a great cross train.

Mike
02-20-2012, 12:13 PM
I am not saying that I necessarily disagree.

But I will say that Brian Billick isn't someone that I put a lot of confidence in regarding QB comments.

Lancane
02-20-2012, 03:11 PM
Dumb.

Tebow is not innacurate because he is strong. Tables weight is not also only in his shoulders and biceps. The man has legs as thick as lineman and rbs.

Really, this was brought up last year or the year before and was debunked quickly. Not sure why billick would say something dumb like this

Actually UR, it was never debunked or disproved because it's a fact, one I might add can not be argued. Excessive weight of any sort can wear on joints and cartilage, muscle not only weighs more it can also strain the same said areas faster then lard due to the tightness of those same said muscles, the weight and the adaption of the skeletal frame in order to do so. He's not claiming that his mass is effecting his overall accuracy, he's stating that he believes it would help in all facets if he shed some of the muscle, and I completely agree with that assessment and I'm not a Billick fan to begin with. Look at the injuries Stafford has undergone, many suspect that it's due to the same issues, he's 6-2 and carrying way to much for his frame. I know people want to compare Tebow to Roethlisberger or Flacco, in some ways they are similar, give that both are taller then Tebow, Big Ben is 6-5 and Flacco is 6-6, and height/weight ratio comes into play. Tebow right now weighs what I would expect of someone with a 6-5 frame, he should be at least 10lbs. lighter and would do well to be 15lbs. lighter, if he could. It would help his overall fluidity, quickness and cause far less wear on his body.

JeMarcus Russell struggled, much of which was due to his excessive weight and that's why as Rav said we do not see a lot of heavy quarterbacks. A number of fans on here were worried about Cutler in the same aspect when he was diagnosed with diabetes. Serena Williams has struggled due to her excess muscle mass as a tennis player and it has caused damage to her body that is irreparable. And don't get me started on wrestlers and bodybuilders who suffer from a plethora of bone, joint, tendon and cartilage damage for the same reason.

catfish
02-20-2012, 03:43 PM
Actually UR, it was never debunked or disproved because it's a fact, one I might add can not be argued. Excessive weight of any sort can wear on joints and cartilage, muscle not only weighs more it can also strain the same said areas faster then lard due to the tightness of those same said muscles, the weight and the adaption of the skeletal frame in order to do so. He's not claiming that his mass is effecting his overall accuracy, he's stating that he believes it would help in all facets if he shed some of the muscle, and I completely agree with that assessment and I'm not a Billick fan to begin with. Look at the injuries Stafford has undergone, many suspect that it's due to the same issues, he's 6-2 and carrying way to much for his frame. I know people want to compare Tebow to Roethlisberger or Flacco, in some ways they are similar, give that both are taller then Tebow, Big Ben is 6-5 and Flacco is 6-6, and height/weight ratio comes into play. Tebow right now weighs what I would expect of someone with a 6-5 frame, he should be at least 10lbs. lighter and would do well to be 15lbs. lighter, if he could. It would help his overall fluidity, quickness and cause far less wear on his body.

JeMarcus Russell struggled, much of which was due to his excessive weight and that's why as Rav said we do not see a lot of heavy quarterbacks. A number of fans on here were worried about Cutler in the same aspect when he was diagnosed with diabetes. Serena Williams has struggled due to her excess muscle mass as a tennis player and it has caused damage to her body that is irreparable. And don't get me started on wrestlers and bodybuilders who suffer from a plethora of bone, joint, tendon and cartilage damage for the same reason.

IIRC Cam Newton has a very similar build to Tebow. I think he is 6-5 248. He doesn't seem to have any issues. The issue could be flexibility, but a good strength coach can help with that. I don't think build is the issue

Northman
02-20-2012, 03:53 PM
IIRC Cam Newton has a very similar build to Tebow. I think he is 6-5 248. He doesn't seem to have any issues. The issue could be flexibility, but a good strength coach can help with that. I don't think build is the issue

Cam is a couple of inches taller than Teebs but im not sure that Cam spends his time building up muscle mass like Tim does. I do think Tim needs to spend less time on the weights and more time with his mechanics. Even despite how close Cam and Tim are in size and weight you can just tell that they are vastly different when it comes to flexibility and how they deliver the ball to the receivers.

Lancane
02-20-2012, 04:35 PM
IIRC Cam Newton has a very similar build to Tebow. I think he is 6-5 248. He doesn't seem to have any issues. The issue could be flexibility, but a good strength coach can help with that. I don't think build is the issue

Ummmm....Cat, Tebow is 6'3, not 6'5, height and weight ratio is a viable medical prognosis and scientific theory. His frame is that of the average NFL quarterback, his weight is about 10lbs. heavier then that of the average of those same said quarterbacks. Newton, Flacco and Roethlisberger have skeletal frames that can hold excessive weight due to the same concept. Even if he was 6'4, I'd still say he needs to trim down five pounds at least, right now I'd say he needs to shed 10lbs., without question it would help him.

Cam Newton 6'5, 248lbs.
Joe Flacco 6'6, 245lbs.
Ben Roethlisberger 6'5, 241lbs.
Matt Schaub 6'5, 241lbs.
Philip Rivers 6'5, 228lbs.

Aaron Rodgers 6'2, 225lbs.
Matthew Stafford 6'2, 232lbs.
Eli Manning 6'4, 218lbs.
Matt Ryan 6'4, 217lbs.
Jay Cutler 6'3, 220lbs.
Tony Romo 6'2, 228lbs.
Matt Hasselbeck 6'4, 225lbs.
Alex Smith 6'4, 217lbs.
Mark Sanchez 6'2, 225lbs.
Sam Bradford 6'4, 224lbs.

Tim Tebow 6'3, 236lbs.

Npba900
02-20-2012, 04:49 PM
Tebow is training like a TE. If he insists on it, we should move him there. For that matter, QBs never hit the weight room past maintenance. There is a point where you start to lose familiarity with what your body can do and cant do. I see Tebow buffing up at this point as one of the worst ideas, for a guy of his skill set.

Same goes for Brady Quinn. Brady and Tebow were both number one picks and the biggest knock against them is their accuracy. Teams have a lot invested in them. You'd think that someone----somewhere would say----hey guys, we have a lot invested in you, let's start by getting you OUT of the weight room because your accuracy is sub par.

catfish
02-20-2012, 05:13 PM
Ummmm....Cat, Tebow is 6'3, not 6'5, height and weight ratio is a viable medical prognosis and scientific theory. His frame is that of the average NFL quarterback, his weight is about 10lbs. heavier then that of the average of those same said quarterbacks. Newton, Flacco and Roethlisberger have skeletal frames that can hold excessive weight due to the same concept. Even if he was 6'4, I'd still say he needs to trim down five pounds at least, right now I'd say he needs to shed 10lbs., without question it would help him.

Cam Newton 6'5, 248lbs.
Joe Flacco 6'6, 245lbs.
Ben Roethlisberger 6'5, 241lbs.
Matt Schaub 6'5, 241lbs.
Philip Rivers 6'5, 228lbs.

Aaron Rodgers 6'2, 225lbs.
Matthew Stafford 6'2, 232lbs.
Eli Manning 6'4, 218lbs.
Matt Ryan 6'4, 217lbs.
Jay Cutler 6'3, 220lbs.
Tony Romo 6'2, 228lbs.
Matt Hasselbeck 6'4, 225lbs.
Alex Smith 6'4, 217lbs.
Mark Sanchez 6'2, 225lbs.
Sam Bradford 6'4, 224lbs.

Tim Tebow 6'3, 236lbs.

the height/weight were for newton. Just as an example Brady Quinn has the same height, same weight and same build as Tebow yet I haven't heard anything about him having any issues with throwing a tight spiral, but I admit I havent paid much attention to Quinn so he may have the same issue.

I could see if he was 30 lbs over the average it would be one thing. I don't think it would hurt to shed a few pounds, I just dont think 10 extra pounds of muscle spread over a 6-3 frame will affect anything that much. Certainly not if he has a good trainer who is making him focus on flexibility. I just dont see it hampering his ROM enough to be the main problem

edit: paper on flexibility

http://books.google.com/books?id=3pPAWd1PW2sC&pg=PA124&lpg=PA124&dq=relationship+between+muscle+mass+and+flexibilit y&source=bl&ots=6msPLmzS_h&sig=eCceXl-Vzmb0rZy-QdL2Tczv9Ls&hl=en&sa=X&ei=fMxCT53UF4Tj0QHU97WACg&ved=0CEAQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=relationship%20between%20muscle%20mass%20and%20f lexibility&f=false

page 128 addresses some misconceptions regarding muscle mass vs flexibility

in short except in extreme cases(linemen, pro-body builders etc) muscle mass does not negatively affect flexibility and in many cases may improve it. It isn't a matter of just putting on mass, it is how you do it, you can add mass and as long as you stretch correctly there will be no negative affect to ROM until you get to a point where your muscle mass is a physical impediment to ROM

Lancane
02-20-2012, 06:20 PM
the height/weight were for newton. Just as an example Brady Quinn has the same height, same weight and same build as Tebow yet I haven't heard anything about him having any issues with throwing a tight spiral, but I admit I havent paid much attention to Quinn so he may have the same issue.

I could see if he was 30 lbs over the average it would be one thing. I don't think it would hurt to shed a few pounds, I just dont think 10 extra pounds of muscle spread over a 6-3 frame will affect anything that much. Certainly not if he has a good trainer who is making him focus on flexibility. I just dont see it hampering his ROM enough to be the main problem

The height/weight ratio is not a problem for Newton because he's got a good two inches on Tebow, his frame allows for him to carry the weight. And it's fair to say that he may be two or three pounds over the ideal weight for his frame, big difference compared to Matthew Stafford who is fifteen to eighteen pounds overweight for his frame or Tebow who is carrying about ten pounds of muscle over the ideal weight for his own. And yes, Brady Quinn has had issues, and not simply in one aspect or another. Or he'd have been the starter over Tebow without question IMHO, because as of now he is still a better passing quarterback. The big difference between Quinn and Tebow is that Tebow is younger, was drafted by Denver and as such the team has more invested in him then Quinn...add the media coverage Tebow receives and it makes sense. I've already stated that Tebow became the quarterback due to fan intervention rather then earning the spot, I truly believe Quinn is a better all around quarterback.

As to the comment about throwing tight spirals...where did I even mention throwing spirals? I said losing a good 10lbs. would help him in several areas. Muscle strangles the joints, that's why bodybuilders and wrestlers with excessive mass lack free-range motion and are at risk for joint and tendon injuries far more often then most athletes, not to mention torn muscle damage. For those of us that remember when Elway tore his tricep, he said that he'd wait on surgery and felt that he had more free-range motion in his arm, because he did. Muscle effects the shoulder muscles, the Trapezius, Deltoid, Tricep and Infraspinatus muscles can effect the Scapulothoracic Joint, Glenohumeral Joint and the Acromioclavicular Joint, not to mention the rotator cuff and the tendons associated to the motion of the cuff itself. If you don't believe me, go throw a football about twenty-five times and then do the same with a buckle weight of 5lbs. on your upper arm, above the bicep and again throw the ball twenty-five times, I guarantee you'll notice the strangulation on the joints and the lack of free-range motion, which will likewise effect your windup and release, even your accuracy.

And there is no easy way for a trainer to help someone retain the flexibility of someone with less muscle mass. The most notable I can think of is stretching the tendons which could lead to tears and loosening the joints which comes usually from forcing the joints to loosen by force and is truly excruciating. It would be far easier for him to simply shed five to ten pounds of muscle and that's what a good trainer would demand, between that and exercise which focus on flexibility he'd be in far more better shape.

By the way, Michael Alter is well respected, but his views are not agreed on by everyone in the Sports Medicine field. A lot of people believe his knowledge is limited since he's never worked outside the gymnastics arena, and doesn't have the scientific or full medical background to support his own theories. He's most noted for his regiment of stretching exercises he created and that's what has given him the credit and respect he does have.

catfish
02-20-2012, 06:40 PM
The height/weight ratio is not a problem for Newton because he's got a good two inches on Tebow, his frame allows for him to carry the weight. And it's fair to say that he may be two or three pounds over the ideal weight for his frame, big difference compared to Matthew Stafford who is fifteen to eighteen pounds overweight for his frame or Tebow who is carrying about ten pounds of muscle over the ideal weight for his own. And yes, Brady Quinn has had issues, and not simply in one aspect or another. Or he'd have been the starter over Tebow without question IMHO, because as of now he is still a better passing quarterback. The big difference between Quinn and Tebow is that Tebow is younger, was drafted by Denver and as such the team has more invested in him then Quinn...add the media coverage Tebow receives and it makes sense. I've already stated that Tebow became the quarterback due to fan intervention rather then earning the spot, I truly believe Quinn is a better all around quarterback.

As to the comment about throwing tight spirals...where did I even mention throwing spirals? I said losing a good 10lbs. would help him in several areas. Muscle strangles the joints, that's why bodybuilders and wrestlers with excessive mass lack free-range motion and are at risk for joint and tendon injuries far more often then most athletes, not to mention torn muscle damage. For those of us that remember when Elway tore his tricep, he said that he'd wait on surgery and felt that he had more free-range motion in his arm, because he did. Muscle effects the shoulder muscles, the Trapezius, Deltoid, Tricep and Infraspinatus muscles can effect the Scapulothoracic Joint, Glenohumeral Joint and the Acromioclavicular Joint, not to mention the rotator cuff and the tendons associated to the motion of the cuff itself. If you don't believe me, go throw a football about twenty-five times and then do the same with a buckle weight of 5lbs. on your upper arm, above the bicep and again throw the ball twenty-five times, I guarantee you'll notice the strangulation on the joints and the lack of free-range motion, which will likewise effect your windup and release, even your accuracy.

And there is no easy way for a trainer to help someone retain the flexibility of someone with less muscle mass. The most notable I can think of is stretching the tendons which could lead to tears and loosening the joints which comes usually from forcing the joints to loosen by force and is truly excruciating. It would be far easier for him to simply shed five to ten pounds of muscle and that's what a good trainer would demand, between that and exercise which focus on flexibility he'd be in far more better shape.

By the way, Michael Alter is well respected, but his views are not agreed on by everyone in the Sports Medicine field. A lot of people believe his knowledge is limited since he's never worked outside the gymnastics arena, and doesn't have the scientific or full medical background to support his own theories. He's most noted for his regiment of stretching exercises he created and that's what has given him the credit and respect he does have.

It is quite possible you are correct. My athletic training knowledge is pretty limited, just what I picked up in a few classes over the years. One of my professors was big on muscle mass/flexibility issue, insisted on the no limit except genetics/physical impediment, but of course we didn't challenge that so I can only take his word for it.

I indicated the tight spiral as that is what I assumed would be affected by a lack of flexibility/limited range of motion. Between that and maybe a limit on the ability to throw the deep ball I didn't see what else would be affected, but I am open to other items I didn't think of

Lancane
02-20-2012, 07:02 PM
It is quite possible you are correct. My athletic training knowledge is pretty limited, just what I picked up in a few classes over the years. One of my professors was big on muscle mass/flexibility issue, insisted on the no limit except genetics/physical impediment, but of course we didn't challenge that so I can only take his word for it.

I indicated the tight spiral as that is what I assumed would be affected by a lack of flexibility/limited range of motion. Between that and maybe a limit on the ability to throw the deep ball I didn't see what else would be affected, but I am open to other items I didn't think of

Physical impediment can be cause by excessive weight, and again muscle weighs more then fat. Genetics in regards to athletics is a risque theological view, I've seen kids of overweight, asthma riddled parents have none of the same physical problems, but there is a school of thought that focuses on the decline of humans and athletics due genetic crossbreeding and more. Sounds like a professor I'd like to talk with.

The throwing of a spiral comes more from the elbow joint up the forearm to the movement of the wrist and placement of the fingers at the time of release. The most effected part of quarterbacking mechanics in my opinion would be his windup because of the muscle placement and interconnection on and around the shoulder area and upper arm, the tightening of the tendons and so forth. If Tebow shed five to ten pounds, he'd have a slightly quicker windup, his long-ball ability would not be effected either since muscle has nothing to do with overall arm strength in terms of throwing the football.

I'm not asking that he become a 6'3, 217lbs. prototypical quarterback, but at 6'3, 225lbs. he'd be able to retain most of his physical mass and therein add some free-range flexibility where he seems to lack some at the moment, even shaving time of his windup and the timing overall in his throws which I'm sure you'd agree only helps him. However, even if he doesn't shed any weight, he should refrain from weightlifting and adding more mass because it would only harm him more at this point.

catfish
02-20-2012, 07:07 PM
Physical impediment can be cause by excessive weight, and again muscle weighs more then fat. Genetics in regards to athletics is a risque theological view, I've seen kids of overweight, asthma riddled parents have none of the same physical problems, but there is a school of thought that focuses on the decline of humans and athletics due genetic crossbreeding and more. Sounds like a professor I'd like to talk with.

The throwing of a spiral comes more from the elbow joint up the forearm to the movement of the wrist and placement of the fingers at the time of release. The most effected part of quarterbacking mechanics in my opinion would be his windup because of the muscle placement and interconnection on and around the shoulder area and upper arm, the tightening of the tendons and so forth. If Tebow shed five to ten pounds, he'd have a slightly quicker windup, his long-ball ability would not be effected either since muscle has nothing to do with overall arm strength in terms of throwing the football.

I'm not asking that he become a 6'3, 217lbs. prototypical quarterback, but at 6'3, 225lbs. he'd be able to retain most of his physical mass and therein add some free-range flexibility where he seems to lack some at the moment, even shaving time of his windup and the timing overall in his throws which I'm sure you'd agree only helps him. However, even if he doesn't shed any weight, he should refrain from weightlifting and adding more mass because it would only harm him more at this point.

I can agree with all of that...if I could remember the professors name I would give it to you for you to look him up, he was referring to genetics as to natural elasticity of joints/skin etc, it was an elective undergrad intro to sport medicine over 10 years ago...I majored in Electrical engineering so the class was far from memorable :)

Lancane
02-20-2012, 07:27 PM
I can agree with all of that...if I could remember the professors name I would give it to you for you to look him up, he was referring to genetics as to natural elasticity of joints/skin etc, it was an elective undergrad intro to sport medicine over 10 years ago...I majored in Electrical engineering so the class was far from memorable :)

If you do remember let me know. As to what he was referring to such as the elasticity of joints and flexibility of skin, is basic geneticsm, there are some who are part of a particular school of thought which believe that overpopulation and crossbreeding has in fact over the years caused more orthopedic, neuromuscular, cardiovascular and pulmonary disorders in the human species.

I majored in Digital Design and Commercial Art, then switched to Computer Science and Linguistics, finally choosing Journalism while minoring in Sports Medicine. I really couldn't make up my mind...lol. College costs too much now, so hopefully my kids are more sure then I ever was. I should have just become a tattoo artist and been done with it!

:lol:

catfish
02-20-2012, 07:40 PM
If you do remember let me know. As to what he was referring to such as the elasticity of joints and flexibility of skin, is basic geneticsm, there are some who are part of a particular school of thought which believe that overpopulation and crossbreeding has in fact over the years caused more orthopedic, neuromuscular, cardiovascular and pulmonary disorders in the human species.

I majored in Digital Design and Commercial Art, then switched to Computer Science and Linguistics, finally choosing Journalism while minoring in Sports Medicine. I really couldn't make up my mind...lol. College costs too much now, so hopefully my kids are more sure then I ever was. I should have just become a tattoo artist and been done with it!

:lol:

me too...would have had a lot more fun...engineering school is not conducive to partying