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Requiem / The Dagda
03-16-2009, 09:56 AM
What will it be about!? :cool:

claymore
03-16-2009, 09:57 AM
What will it be about!? :cool:

Hopefully McDaniels gets fired.

Dirk
03-16-2009, 09:59 AM
Maybe Jay got his wish and the Broncos got Quinn in some kind of trade.

I would be OK with Quinn. (would rather have Jay if he can mature up a bit but...)

skycoyote
03-16-2009, 10:02 AM
I didn't know where to put this so I stuck it here. Feel free to move it or start a thread.

http://cbs11tv.com/sports/trade.cutler.denver.2.960215.html

claymore
03-16-2009, 10:04 AM
LIVE WEBCAST AT 10:30 A.M.
DENVER - Broncos quarterback Jay Cutler has formally asked to be traded, a request he made Sunday through his agent, Bus Cook.

For now, the Broncos are hoping to appease Cutler's concerns and reach an understanding so they do not have to trade him, coach Josh McDaniels told The Denver Post on Sunday night.

Cutler and Cook issued the trade request a day after a meeting with McDaniels and general manager Brian Xanders did not go the way quarterback had hoped.

"I would like to talk to Jay before we go on and start to discuss some other type of alternative," McDaniels said Sunday night. "In the last couple weeks, we've been all about trying to communicate and resolve his unhappiness with what happened - which we understand - and that's been our direction."
It won't happen at McDaniels' first team meeting, which will be held this morning at the Dove Valley headquarters. Cutler will not be there.

Cutler said he felt McDaniels was not in his corner during the meeting Saturday, telling ESPN.com, "I went in there with every intention of solving the issue, being a Bronco, moving forward as a Bronco. We weren't in there but about 20 minutes, (McDaniels) did most of the talking, and as far as I'm concerned, he made it clear he wants his own guy. He admitted he wanted Matt Cassel because he said he has raised him up from the ground as a quarterback. He said he wasn't sorry about it.

"At the end of the meeting, he wasn't like, 'Jay, I want you as our quarterback, you're our guy.' It felt like the opposite. . . . Really, I figured we'd hash things out, shake hands, laugh a little and move forward. What happened (Saturday) was the last thing I expected."

Cutler, who passed for 25 touchdowns and 4,526 yards last year but also threw 18 interceptions, has been unhappy since learning he was part of a trade proposal that would have sent him to Tampa Bay in a three-team swap that would have brought Cassel, McDan iels' former quarterback in New England, to Denver. Cassel was eventually traded to Kansas City.
Cutler has said he was not bothered by the trade proposal itself but by how he felt McDaniels misled him. McDan iels has said the Broncos merely listened to offers submitted from other teams, as they do for all players, but Cutler's camp never bought that explanation.

McDaniels explained the situation further Sunday.

"We were contacted multiple times about different scenarios," McDaniels said. "Some of the scenarios we discussed, and we did take part in those conversations. Nothing ever got to the point where we were going to be active on anything. We never went to Mr. (Pat) Bowlen with any scenario that was presented. And nothing ever happened.

"Obviously, the trade went through with another team. We moved on. I'm not sure if that's where all the discontent stems from or not. I'm sure most of it does."
Bowlen, the Broncos' owner, in his first comments since the Cutler drama began two weeks ago, said Sunday he is steadfastly supporting his new coach and that his disappointment lies in the way Cutler has handled the situation.

"I'm very disappointed," Bowlen said. "I'm disappointed in the whole picture, not just disappointed that we might lose our star quarterback."

The breakdown came just as it appeared Cutler and McDan iels were moving toward mending their relationship. Cutler returned to Denver late last week from Nashville, Tenn., where he has spent most of his offseason.

With McDaniels holding his first team meeting at 8 a.m. today, Cutler was not only planning to attend, he agreed to a pre-emptive personal meeting with his new coach and GM to work out their differences. Instead, Cutler came to the conclusion he's not wanted in Denver.

Under the NFL's collective-bargaining agreement, it is not mandatory for Cutler to attend the team meeting today. The first mandatory session Cutler would have to attend is the Broncos' first minicamp April 17-19. If Cutler skips that minicamp, the Broncos could fine him for each day he misses.

He could also risk a prorated portion of his signing bonus.

Cutler has insisted that until his situation gets resolved, all conversation with Broncos officials must include Cook, who led the discussions in the conference call a week ago that included Bowlen and chief operating officer Joe Ellis, and in the meeting Saturday with McDaniels and Xanders.

Cook also represents Brett Favre and helped facilitate the quarterback's trade last summer from the Green Bay Packers to the New York Jets.

"I would love to have a one-on-one conversation," McDaniels said. "I have been trying to get that realized here for the last two weeks. I would still be open to it."

The Broncos' current backup quarterback is Chris Simms, a former Tampa Bay starter who was recently signed to a two-year, $6 million contract from the free-agent market.
This is the first sense McDaniels has made thus far.

claymore
03-16-2009, 10:08 AM
I didn't know where to put this so I stuck it here. Feel free to move it or start a thread.

http://cbs11tv.com/sports/trade.cutler.denver.2.960215.html

That is a great article.

turftoad
03-16-2009, 10:13 AM
Analysis: The Cutler-McDaniels FeudBy Reggie Rivers
DENVER (CBS) ―





Broncos quarterback Jay Cutler and Broncos head coach Josh McDaniels botched what should have been a make-up meeting on Saturday morning, and now the situation has spiraled even further out of control.

Cutler has now flown out of Denver; his agent is expected to formally request a trade; Cutler will not attend the start of the team's voluntary off-season workout program Monday, and he says that he will not report to the Broncos facility until the first mandatory mini-camp sometime in late April or early May.

This situation is perilous for both Cutler and McDaniels.

While each man clearly believes that "justice" is on his side of the argument, people are watching this feud and drawing their own conclusions. Obviously public opinion has an impact on ticket sales for the Broncos and endorsement opportunities for Cutler. But this feud also directly affects their ability to play and coach in the NFL.

McDaniels is a young, first-time coach, and while there's no doubt that he has the football expertise to run an offense, there are serious questions about whether he has the managerial skills necessary for the job.

Although the rift with Cutler is the issue that has drawn the most public attention, I've spoken to several Broncos players who believe that McDaniels sabotaged his credibility in the locker room when he cut long-snapper Mike Leach and signed former Patriots long-snapper Lonnie Paxton to a $2 million contract.

Leach has proven to be among the most reliable snappers in the NFL, and replacing him seemed completely unnecessary and out of step with the message that a new coach should be sending to his team.

The players who were drafted or signed by the previous coach want to believe that the new coach will judge them based on their ability to perform on the field. But when McDaniels got rid of Leach it sent a very clear message that no matter how well the veterans performed, the new coach would cut them and pay more money to get players with whom he was more familiar.

Engaging in trade talks for Cutler was another McDaniels mistake. It's true that any player on any team is subject to trade, but this particular trade didn't make any sense. McDaniels wanted to ship Cutler to Tampa Bay in a three-way deal that would have brought then-Patriots quarterback Matt Cassel to Denver.

This is a carbon-copy of the Leach exchange, only worse. At least Leach and Paxton have similar ability. There was no reason to swap them out, but at least it wasn't a downgrade.

In the proposed Cutler-Cassel exchange, McDaniels would have been putting a less talented player under center, and the only rationale is the McDaniels is familiar with Cassel.

Again, the message to the Broncos veterans is clear: Your ability and performance on the field are irrelevant. McDaniels will replace you with someone less talented if he has had a longer relationship with that person.

This feud has the potential to doom McDaniels first stint as a head coach.

This dispute is dangerous for Cutler's career, too. He's supposed to be the leader of this team, and at some point he has to decide whether it's more important to keep fighting this personal crusade or to step up and act like a team leader.

The off-season workout program is an important period of bonding for players. There are a lot of new players on the Broncos roster. Every day that Cutler is not there, he loses another opportunity to earn the respect of his teammates. They will acknowledge him as a leader because he's the quarterback, but acknowledgement and respect are not equivalent terms.

Cutler also risks alienating other teams. For weeks, Cutler's tantrum has been a story in the national media and that could affect his future in the NFL. Everyone knows that Cutler is an extremely talented quarterback, but how many coaches want a signal caller who will frequently and publicly defy them?

Coaches are part of a small and tight fraternity and they empathize with each other. Each of them was a first-time coach at one point in his career, so they understand what McDaniels is going through. None of them will appreciate the fact that Cutler is going so far out of his way to undermine McDaniels' authority.

It's bad enough when a wide receiver, a running back or a defensive player throws tantrums or otherwise creates distractions, but when it's the guy who touches the ball on every offensive play, that's much harder for a team to manage.

Before all of this started, the only teams that wouldn't have wanted Cutler were those that already had a franchise quarterbacks. Every other team would have viewed Cutler as an upgrade. But now, there's probably a much shorter list of teams who are prepared to deal with the tantrums and PR fiascos that Cutler might bring with him.

Plus, this feud is eroding Cutler's trade value. Every team knows that he doesn't want to be in Denver, so the Broncos might not get as much as if Cutler was publicly content. The only thing that can save his value now is if two or three teams start competing for him.

But are there two or three teams out there who a) need Cutler, b) want Cutler despite his tantrums, and c) have something that the Broncos would accept in exchange for Cutler?

turftoad
03-16-2009, 10:16 AM
"We never went to Mr. (Pat) Bowlen with any scenario that was presented".

WTF, isn't Bowlen the owner.

I could see not going to him with a proposal for a mediocre player but this you our franchise QB.
Bowlen should have known about all of this going on.

McBozo and X mans manegerial skills are nill.

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 10:19 AM
Please be good news.

claymore
03-16-2009, 10:21 AM
Although the rift with Cutler is the issue that has drawn the most public attention, I've spoken to several Broncos players who believe that McDaniels sabotaged his credibility in the locker room when he cut long-snapper Mike Leach and signed former Patriots long-snapper Lonnie Paxton to a $2 million contract.

Leach has proven to be among the most reliable snappers in the NFL, and replacing him seemed completely unnecessary and out of step with the message that a new coach should be sending to his team.

The players who were drafted or signed by the previous coach want to believe that the new coach will judge them based on their ability to perform on the field. But when McDaniels got rid of Leach it sent a very clear message that no matter how well the veterans performed, the new coach would cut them and pay more money to get players with whom he was more familiar.

This is what Im talking about. The leach thing coupled with the goodmans and now Cutler...

McDaniels needs to take the day off and admit ignorance tomorrow.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 10:24 AM
"We never went to Mr. (Pat) Bowlen with any scenario that was presented".

WTF, isn't Bowlen the owner.

I could see not going to him with a proposal for a mediocre player but this you our franchise QB.
Bowlen should have known about all of this going on.

McBozo and X mans manegerial skills are nill.

Or maybe they never went to him because nothing ever presented itself that was good enough to bother him with.

I really wish people could see both sides of a situation.

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 10:25 AM
This is what Im talking about. The leach thing coupled with the goodmans and now Cutler...

McDaniels needs to take the day off and admit ignorance tomorrow.

Agreed, McD really seems like he is in way over his head and has no idea what it takes to lead a team. Mistake after mistake after mistake.....

turftoad
03-16-2009, 10:27 AM
Or maybe they never went to him because nothing ever presented itself that was good enough to bother him with.

I really wish people could see both sides of a situation.

Coach, McDanals was activly seeking and looking for a way to bring in Cassell. He's admitted that.

tomjonesrocks
03-16-2009, 10:27 AM
Oh goodie, a press conference. :rolleyes:

Everything McDaniels has done to this point has only made matters worse. Let's see if he can keep his impressive trend of utter incompetence going.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 10:28 AM
Coach, McDanals was activly seeking and looking for a way to bring in Cassell. He's admitted that.

Show me this...exactly as you stated it.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 10:29 AM
Agreed, McD really seems like he is in way over his head and has no idea what it takes to lead a team. Mistake after mistake after mistake.....

Yeah...because all of us here are the authority on what it takes.

nthngd2say
03-16-2009, 10:31 AM
While McDaniels is making the mistakes, Bowlen is the one who should be held accountable because IIRC, Bowlen said McDaniels had a very detailed outline of his plan for the Broncos moving forward and that Bowlen was impressed with what McDaniels had planned. Bowlen is also the one who has created a scenario where we are all but stuck with McDaniels if things don't pan out because between Shanny & McDaniels, over the next two seasons Bowlen is paying around $11 million for the two so I don't see how Bowlen will bite the bullet and throw another $3-4 million for another new head coach. All of this ultimately falls on Bowlen in my opinion.

claymore
03-16-2009, 10:34 AM
Yeah...because all of us here are the authority on what it takes.There is no way you can say McDaniels hasnt made a mess of things.


While McDaniels is making the mistakes, Bowlen is the one who should be held accountable because IIRC, Bowlen said McDaniels had a very detailed outline of his plan for the Broncos moving forward and that Bowlen was impressed with what McDaniels had planned. Bowlen is also the one who has created a scenario where we are all but stuck with McDaniels if things don't pan out because between Shanny & McDaniels, over the next two seasons Bowlen is paying around $11 million for the two so I don't see how Bowlen will bite the bullet and throw another $3-4 million for another new head coach. All of this ultimately falls on Bowlen in my opinion.
Bowlen needs to reel him in.

turftoad
03-16-2009, 10:35 AM
Show me this...exactly as you stated it.

This what Josh told Jay.

"Cutler also said that he felt like he could no longer trust McDaniels since, at first, the coach told him that he didn’t try to trade for Cassel, who was ultimately traded from the New England Patriots to the Kansas City Chiefs, only to later acknowledge that actually was the case.

That, my friend is McDanials lying.

skycoyote
03-16-2009, 10:37 AM
While McDaniels is making the mistakes, Bowlen is the one who should be held accountable because IIRC, Bowlen said McDaniels had a very detailed outline of his plan for the Broncos moving forward and that Bowlen was impressed with what McDaniels had planned. Bowlen is also the one who has created a scenario where we are all but stuck with McDaniels if things don't pan out because between Shanny & McDaniels, over the next two seasons Bowlen is paying around $11 million for the two so I don't see how Bowlen will bite the bullet and throw another $3-4 million for another new head coach. All of this ultimately falls on Bowlen in my opinion.

Right! Bowlen screwed the team. Pat, get on your knee's an give Shannahan a _________ to come back. :lol:

topscribe
03-16-2009, 11:03 AM
Right! Bowlen screwed the team. Pat, get on your knee's an give Shannahan a _________ to come back. :lol:

I'll tell you what: At this point, I might be on my knees to beg Shanny to come back . . .

-----

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 11:07 AM
Yeah...because all of us here are the authority on what it takes.

My current job capacity puts me in a manager of mangers role. My job is determine the “big picture” by assessing who can cut it, who can't, who can cut it but are in the wrong role, organizational structure changes and so on and so forth. Does that make me an expert, heck no, BUT I am posting my opinion based on what I’ve read. Given what I've read and seen from Mcd from this point I would say without hesitation it's time to sit him down and explain every transaction in question, the direction he wants the team to go and just how he plans on getting there. Every manager, coach, supervisor ect.. will be tested from time to time. It's how you handle those situations that determine what kind of leader you will be and how your team will perceive you. From the outside looking in, McD seems to lack direction on team needs, has no clue on who performed and who didn’t, cutting personal who performed and were respected leaders (leach) and multiple accounts on how the players don’t trust McD which shows a lack of faith in what he stands for and preaches. No way ANY of this works with out the players buying in and McD is young to boot. He just made it VERY hard on himself to earn the respect of the players on the team. These guys (Bronco brass) get paid the big bucks and there is not a doubt in my mind that there is way more to this than we will ever know BUT the big picture is, the Denver Bronco organization is in turmoil right now and seems to lack a sense of positive direction. McD might very well emerge from this in charge and more respected than ever but he is going to have to take a different approach than he has used to date OR land a monster trade deal that makes the team a better team despite possibly losing it's franchise QB.

Dortoh
03-16-2009, 11:13 AM
This wont be popular but

IMO McD should get infront of the press today and calmly say "Jay Cutler is under contract for the next 3 years. We expect Jay to come to work and act as a professional."

topscribe
03-16-2009, 11:16 AM
This wont be popular but

IMO McD should get infront of the press today and calmly say "Jay Cutler is under contract for the next 3 years. We expect Jay to come to work and act as a professional."

And then he should tell Cutler, in no uncertain terms, "You're our guy. We
want you, we need you. We are NOT going to trade you for anybody or
anything."

-----

LRtagger
03-16-2009, 11:18 AM
The Denver Broncos met as a team Monday for the first time since Head Coach Josh McDaniels took his new position. Some of the team members are expected to speak at a news conference scheduled to begin at 10:30 a.m. 9NEWS.com will live stream the event. A link will be provided here.

updated from the website

Dortoh
03-16-2009, 11:19 AM
updated from the website


Yep, I dont see anything big coming out of this at all.

DenverBronkHoes
03-16-2009, 11:20 AM
can anyone fire bowlen?

nthngd2say
03-16-2009, 11:20 AM
:coffee: seems like 9news was playing off the Cutler situation to get us to watch the standard player interviews. I guess we'll see...

turftoad
03-16-2009, 11:20 AM
Could someone please post the link for the webcast here. TIA

DenverBronkHoes
03-16-2009, 11:24 AM
if jay goes to minnesota WATCH OUT!!! with peterson and that D..... O boy....

G_Money
03-16-2009, 11:25 AM
I found this part of the Reggie Rivers article interesting.


Although the rift with Cutler is the issue that has drawn the most public attention, I've spoken to several Broncos players who believe that McDaniels sabotaged his credibility in the locker room when he cut long-snapper Mike Leach and signed former Patriots long-snapper Lonnie Paxton to a $2 million contract.

Leach has proven to be among the most reliable snappers in the NFL, and replacing him seemed completely unnecessary and out of step with the message that a new coach should be sending to his team.

The players who were drafted or signed by the previous coach want to believe that the new coach will judge them based on their ability to perform on the field. But when McDaniels got rid of Leach it sent a very clear message that no matter how well the veterans performed, the new coach would cut them and pay more money to get players with whom he was more familiar.

Engaging in trade talks for Cutler was another McDaniels mistake. It's true that any player on any team is subject to trade, but this particular trade didn't make any sense. McDaniels wanted to ship Cutler to Tampa Bay in a three-way deal that would have brought then-Patriots quarterback Matt Cassel to Denver.

This is a carbon-copy of the Leach exchange, only worse. At least Leach and Paxton have similar ability. There was no reason to swap them out, but at least it wasn't a downgrade.

In the proposed Cutler-Cassel exchange, McDaniels would have been putting a less talented player under center, and the only rationale is the McDaniels is familiar with Cassel.

Again, the message to the Broncos veterans is clear: Your ability and performance on the field are irrelevant. McDaniels will replace you with someone less talented if he has had a longer relationship with that person.

When you come in as a new head coach, you would like to get buy-in from your players. You did not draft these players, you did not sweet-talk them in free agency, you have not gone through 2-a-days and offseason workouts and training camp and the battles of the regular season with these players.

They don't know you from Adam.

So establishing trust is a key to the first bit of the new regime.

Instead, McDaniels has been bringing in people he feels like HE can trust, and expecting the remaining players to just fall in line.

If there were good, veteran leaders on this squad, maybe that would happen.

But he fired the veteran special teams leader (Leach) who was very good at his job, and is making the leader of the offense (Cutler) feel like he is on the block as well.

There are sometimes good reasons for kneecapping team leadership. If it's the wrong kind of leadership, for example. Parcells is famous for this. He will come in and ruffle all feathers. Entitled vets who've been living the good life get flustered and fired, and kids buried on the bench give a thousand percent effort and become quality starters for him.

Clearing out the dead weight can be a good thing.

But is that what's going on? It doesn't feel like it.

When Parcells comes in, you know that giving effort, doing everything he asks you to do, will give you a spot. If you kill yourself, he will reward you. And you'll all be a better team for it.

But McDaniels got rid of someone who was fine at his job before he ever saw him play, paid his replacement (who also happens to be a friend) more than the Pro-Bowl center is making, and got into a very public feud with his QB that he has shown no willingness to quell.

These are not the sorts of actions that unite a team and make them work toward one common goal. This is not trimming the fat and getting lean and mean. This is creating divisions in your locker room before much of the team has even met you face to face. it looks bad. Even if it's not ACTUALLY a bad idea, it gives off bad vibes to your other players.

Again, if you had good locker room leaders, this might not be as much of an issue. You could get on their good side, they could vouch for you.

But our locker room has been lacking in leadership.

- Champ Bailey? Not a rallying, locker room leader. And even if he was, his support for Slowik would cut him off at the knees.
- Dre Bly? He was our spokesman for the 2nd half of last year, but we cut him too.
- Wiegmann? He's a vet, but right now he's sort of in limbo. Contract talks have cooled and he's staying away from the offseason workout program "due to age."
- DJ? Not a leader in HS, nor college, nor the pros. He's a follower, not a leader, and he's not the sort of man who would be any sort of help in uniting the locker room.
- Stokley? Until a little while ago he didn't even know if he would be back with the team. Anything he says about new management would have a "bought off" feel.
- Cutler? Um...obviously a problem.
- Marshall? More cop trouble = shut up, Brandon.
- Hamilton? Quiet as a church mouse.

We don't have the sort of unifying presence in the locker room who could make this better. Cutler was the focal point, which can serve the same purpose, but once McDaniels and he started spitting fire at each other there's no one who can put it out.

Dawkins will be a good leader for us, but he doesn't even know the names of half his teammates yet. He can't really step in with any sort of authority.

I'm interested to see what this news conference is about. I'd love to be a fly on the wall for the team meeting today, where McDaniels tries to win back the trust he's been flushing the last few weeks.

But when you have poor or young locker room leadership, then you need to have a certain approach to getting everyone on the same page. McDaniels has not tried that approach. We have both problems - poor leadership on D, young leadership on O.

And these public feuds with the offensive leader blunt his message to the troops and can lead to confusion and anarchy within the team. Cam Cameron got one disastrous year with Miami - one. Bobby Petrino blew up in Atlanta. Mishandling your players can lead to disaster, even when there was a chance for mediocrity or even success.

I hope McDaniels can get this back on track. Based on our current leadership void, it'll have to be by his own doing - no one will step in and unify the locker room for him. And that could be a big problem.

~G

Northman
03-16-2009, 11:27 AM
I wonder if the Press Conference is of McDaniels stepping down? lol

Stranger things have happened.

JONtheBRONCO
03-16-2009, 11:28 AM
This is all bullshit. Speculation and what not from many different people that is beginning to cloud everyone's ability to look at the actual situation. I'm as big of a Cutler fan as anyone. I love the kid and have been able to look past the childish antics, and the immature temper tantrums that have been haunting us Broncomaniacs the past 3 weeks.

But all this talk about keeping Jay and firing McDaniels is bullshit. No one knows exactly what went on in the trade talks, who said what, who is influencing the situation and who is being honest. What i do know is McDaniels and the Broncos have tried to extend a helping hand to resolve the matter and Cutler is acting like a true *****.

Sorry, but whether it was Bus Cook, Bill Belichick, McDaniels himself, or Cutler himself, Jay is the one who is unwilling to cooperate. McDaniels has told the media, the fans, and Jay himself, he doesn't want to trade Jay - and what does Jay do? "No, he wants to trade me, I know he does, he doesn't want me... seriously, please believe me, he doesn't want me..." Okay Jay, way to be immature about it.

Am I upset? Hell yes. But I'm sick of speculation, Jay is being an ass. I never wanted to see number 6 in any other uniform besides a Denver Bronco's one, but this is beginning to become a high school break up. You have nothing to complain about Jay - money, fans and a place to play ball... Many of us would kill to be in the situation you are.. If your such a loyal guy, and claim to play for teammates, you have officially contradicted yourself. I'm beginning to think your nothing but a schmuck.

It all started with you telling the MEDIA, the Broncos better not fire your good buddy Bates.. Go wipe your ass with a twenty and head out to Detroit or Tampa, maybe you can dip into a large contract or a swimming pool of tears. But if this is how your going to act, get the hell out of Denver, same goes with any other player... This is McDaniels team, and I can't say I like how things or going, but like it or not, he's the guy. And if it takes three or four years, so be it, I plan on being a Bronco fan for the rest of my life..

LRtagger
03-16-2009, 11:30 AM
ugh i put off my lunch break to watch this presser and now they are saying it starts at 11 (1pm here)

**** this.

Shazam!
03-16-2009, 11:30 AM
Right on Jon. A MHS doesn't give that enough justice.

DenverBronkHoes
03-16-2009, 11:36 AM
I found this part of the Reggie Rivers article interesting.



When you come in as a new head coach, you would like to get buy-in from your players. You did not draft these players, you did not sweet-talk them in free agency, you have not gone through 2-a-days and offseason workouts and training camp and the battles of the regular season with these players.

They don't know you from Adam.

So establishing trust is a key to the first bit of the new regime.

Instead, McDaniels has been bringing in people he feels like HE can trust, and expecting the remaining players to just fall in line.

If there were good, veteran leaders on this squad, maybe that would happen.

But he fired the veteran special teams leader (Leach) who was very good at his job, and is making the leader of the offense (Cutler) feel like he is on the block as well.

There are sometimes good reasons for kneecapping team leadership. If it's the wrong kind of leadership, for example. Parcells is famous for this. He will come in and ruffle all feathers. Entitled vets who've been living the good life get flustered and fired, and kids buried on the bench give a thousand percent effort and become quality starters for him.

Clearing out the dead weight can be a good thing.

But is that what's going on? It doesn't feel like it.

When Parcells comes in, you know that giving effort, doing everything he asks you to do, will give you a spot. If you kill yourself, he will reward you. And you'll all be a better team for it.

But McDaniels got rid of someone who was fine at his job before he ever saw him play, paid his replacement (who also happens to be a friend) more than the Pro-Bowl center is making, and got into a very public feud with his QB that he has shown no willingness to quell.

These are not the sorts of actions that unite a team and make them work toward one common goal. This is not trimming the fat and getting lean and mean. This is creating divisions in your locker room before much of the team has even met you face to face. it looks bad. Even if it's not ACTUALLY a bad idea, it gives off bad vibes to your other players.

Again, if you had good locker room leaders, this might not be as much of an issue. You could get on their good side, they could vouch for you.

But our locker room has been lacking in leadership.

- Champ Bailey? Not a rallying, locker room leader. And even if he was, his support for Slowik would cut him off at the knees.
- Dre Bly? He was our spokesman for the 2nd half of last year, but we cut him too.
- Wiegmann? He's a vet, but right now he's sort of in limbo. Contract talks have cooled and he's staying away from the offseason workout program "due to age."
- DJ? Not a leader in HS, nor college, nor the pros. He's a follower, not a leader, and he's not the sort of man who would be any sort of help in uniting the locker room.
- Stokley? Until a little while ago he didn't even know if he would be back with the team. Anything he says about new management would have a "bought off" feel.
- Cutler? Um...obviously a problem.
- Marshall? More cop trouble = shut up, Brandon.
- Hamilton? Quiet as a church mouse.

We don't have the sort of unifying presence in the locker room who could make this better. Cutler was the focal point, which can serve the same purpose, but once McDaniels and he started spitting fire at each other there's no one who can put it out.

Dawkins will be a good leader for us, but he doesn't even know the names of half his teammates yet. He can't really step in with any sort of authority.

I'm interested to see what this news conference is about. I'd love to be a fly on the wall for the team meeting today, where McDaniels tries to win back the trust he's been flushing the last few weeks.

But when you have poor or young locker room leadership, then you need to have a certain approach to getting everyone on the same page. McDaniels has not tried that approach. We have both problems - poor leadership on D, young leadership on O.

And these public feuds with the offensive leader blunt his message to the troops and can lead to confusion and anarchy within the team. Cam Cameron got one disastrous year with Miami - one. Bobby Petrino blew up in Atlanta. Mishandling your players can lead to disaster, even when there was a chance for mediocrity or even success.

I hope McDaniels can get this back on track. Based on our current leadership void, it'll have to be by his own doing - no one will step in and unify the locker room for him. And that could be a big problem.

~G


holy crap G... u just made me have an epiphany

G_Money
03-16-2009, 11:38 AM
That sounds painful. Do they make hemorrhoid cream for that? ;)

~G

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 11:39 AM
Or maybe they never went to him because nothing ever presented itself that was good enough to bother him with.

I really wish people could see both sides of a situation.


While true, the cards are more and more falling to reveal a little Napleon in McDaniels......

I say we cant lose any money, fire the scrub and bring back Shanahan.

DenverBronkHoes
03-16-2009, 11:40 AM
at this point its just too late to keep cutler.....


he will be a jet or a viking by friday....


i like Sims.... he can be coached to play exceptional i believe....

were going to find out

DenverBronkHoes
03-16-2009, 11:42 AM
our fans will sell out games regardless.......

mcDeezNutts goes 4-12 this year, he'll be ran out or fired

turftoad
03-16-2009, 11:42 AM
OK, here's the link. 11:00 AM mt time.

http://www.9news.com/video/player_live_2.aspx

DenverBronkHoes
03-16-2009, 11:43 AM
OK, here's the link. 11:00 AM mt time.

http://www.9news.com/video/player_live_2.aspx

the text wont show turf

whoops just did!

underrated29
03-16-2009, 11:46 AM
I cant view it.....

Oh- wait its not 11 yet. Damit bill, you are wearing off on me.

getlynched47
03-16-2009, 11:49 AM
Cutler might not get traded. McDaniels says that he doesnt want draft picks...he wants a QuarterBack with just as much upside as Cutler if they deal him. There arent really any QuarterBacks with as much upside as Cutler...so that probably isnt going to happen.

I see this situation being treated as the Chad Johnson situation last offseason...

Zweems56
03-16-2009, 12:04 PM
Turn on please? My lunch break is dwindling!

weazel
03-16-2009, 12:04 PM
nice feed, not working here

underrated29
03-16-2009, 12:04 PM
Man i hope so. The longer those two are together the better i think. Mcd can see how good jay really is, and jay can see that he can own in this offense. Plus, nolans turn around defense (prob not this year)..... If jay stays this year, then i think its safe to say that he will stay another year, if that happens then he will probably get an extension, if he hasnt already and go carreer with us.




I hate being so positive, nothing ever works out the way i would like.

turftoad
03-16-2009, 12:07 PM
OK, here's the link. 11:00 AM mt time.

http://www.9news.com/video/player_live_2.aspx

It's started. Shit, I have all volumes up all the way and still can't hear it very well.

Thnikkaman
03-16-2009, 12:07 PM
The audio on the feed sucks.

G_Money
03-16-2009, 12:09 PM
I can't hear anything.

Somebody's gonna have to translate, cuz i'm not that good a lip-reader. :yardog:

~G

Tebow4Ever
03-16-2009, 12:09 PM
Whos this talking right now..Its been a while..Defenseive lineman...but who?

Tebow4Ever
03-16-2009, 12:09 PM
The reporters just WONT get off the Jay situation

Italianmobstr7
03-16-2009, 12:12 PM
Whos this talking right now..Its been a while..Defenseive lineman...but who?

Kenny Peterson.

tomjonesrocks
03-16-2009, 12:13 PM
With the cloud of the Cutler situation I am starting to think this is a stupid press conference.

What is the point of this, seriously?

Tebow4Ever
03-16-2009, 12:13 PM
Kenny Peterson.


Ahhh, thats right..He is a bright guy. Just didnt recognize the face.

Zweems56
03-16-2009, 12:14 PM
With the cloud of the Cutler situation I am starting to think this is a stupid press conference.

What is the point of this, seriously?

Probably first impressions of McDaniels from the players. Not surprising.

EMB6903
03-16-2009, 12:14 PM
any details?

Zweems56
03-16-2009, 12:15 PM
So... are they breaking it into separate parts, or was that it?

G_Money
03-16-2009, 12:15 PM
"Hi Kenny - yes, we've decided to bring you back as a Bronco, but only if you agree to go out and meet the firing squad, I mean reporters, as our first interviewee of the the new regime.

"Yep. That's right. Kenny Peterson, part-time rotational DL and Broncos spokesman. We like you that much.

"What Cutler issue? No, there won't be a problem there. All overblown. You won't have to take any questions on that, especially not all the one's I've been dodging. Sign here.."

~G

Tebow4Ever
03-16-2009, 12:16 PM
Peterson just got done talking, The live feed has stopped. At least for me anyway

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 12:16 PM
Agreed, McD really seems like he is in way over his head and has no idea what it takes to lead a team. Mistake after mistake after mistake.....


McStake, after McStake, after McStake............






This is the aftermath of three weeks of McFake, McFake, McFake.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 12:17 PM
On the other hand, if he had gone out and flamed the coaches and management, he'd be a superstar and icon.

TDmvp
03-16-2009, 12:17 PM
well that was as entertaining as it was pointless ...

Zweems56
03-16-2009, 12:18 PM
well that was as entertaining as it was pointless ...

So... since it was extremely piontless, then it was extremely entertaining?

Kaylore
03-16-2009, 12:18 PM
I couldn't hear anything.

Italianmobstr7
03-16-2009, 12:18 PM
well that was as entertaining as it was pointless ...

I'm sure they'll be interviewing more players...

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 12:20 PM
Analysis: The Cutler-McDaniels FeudBy Reggie Rivers
DENVER (CBS) ―

Broncos quarterback Jay Cutler and Broncos head coach Josh McDaniels botched what should have been a make-up meeting on Saturday morning, and now the situation has spiraled even further out of control.

Cutler has now flown out of Denver; his agent is expected to formally request a trade; Cutler will not attend the start of the team's voluntary off-season workout program Monday, and he says that he will not report to the Broncos facility until the first mandatory mini-camp sometime in late April or early May.

This situation is perilous for both Cutler and McDaniels.

While each man clearly believes that "justice" is on his side of the argument, people are watching this feud and drawing their own conclusions. Obviously public opinion has an impact on ticket sales for the Broncos and endorsement opportunities for Cutler. But this feud also directly affects their ability to play and coach in the NFL.

McDaniels is a young, first-time coach, and while there's no doubt that he has the football expertise to run an offense, there are serious questions about whether he has the managerial skills necessary for the job.

Although the rift with Cutler is the issue that has drawn the most public attention, I've spoken to several Broncos players who believe that McDaniels sabotaged his credibility in the locker room when he cut long-snapper Mike Leach and signed former Patriots long-snapper Lonnie Paxton to a $2 million contract.

Leach has proven to be among the most reliable snappers in the NFL, and replacing him seemed completely unnecessary and out of step with the message that a new coach should be sending to his team.

The players who were drafted or signed by the previous coach want to believe that the new coach will judge them based on their ability to perform on the field. But when McDaniels got rid of Leach it sent a very clear message that no matter how well the veterans performed, the new coach would cut them and pay more money to get players with whom he was more familiar.

Engaging in trade talks for Cutler was another McDaniels mistake. It's true that any player on any team is subject to trade, but this particular trade didn't make any sense. McDaniels wanted to ship Cutler to Tampa Bay in a three-way deal that would have brought then-Patriots quarterback Matt Cassel to Denver.

This is a carbon-copy of the Leach exchange, only worse. At least Leach and Paxton have similar ability. There was no reason to swap them out, but at least it wasn't a downgrade.

In the proposed Cutler-Cassel exchange, McDaniels would have been putting a less talented player under center, and the only rationale is the McDaniels is familiar with Cassel.

Again, the message to the Broncos veterans is clear: Your ability and performance on the field are irrelevant. McDaniels will replace you with someone less talented if he has had a longer relationship with that person.

This feud has the potential to doom McDaniels first stint as a head coach.

This dispute is dangerous for Cutler's career, too. He's supposed to be the leader of this team, and at some point he has to decide whether it's more important to keep fighting this personal crusade or to step up and act like a team leader.

The off-season workout program is an important period of bonding for players. There are a lot of new players on the Broncos roster. Every day that Cutler is not there, he loses another opportunity to earn the respect of his teammates. They will acknowledge him as a leader because he's the quarterback, but acknowledgement and respect are not equivalent terms.

Cutler also risks alienating other teams. For weeks, Cutler's tantrum has been a story in the national media and that could affect his future in the NFL. Everyone knows that Cutler is an extremely talented quarterback, but how many coaches want a signal caller who will frequently and publicly defy them?

Coaches are part of a small and tight fraternity and they empathize with each other. Each of them was a first-time coach at one point in his career, so they understand what McDaniels is going through. None of them will appreciate the fact that Cutler is going so far out of his way to undermine McDaniels' authority.

It's bad enough when a wide receiver, a running back or a defensive player throws tantrums or otherwise creates distractions, but when it's the guy who touches the ball on every offensive play, that's much harder for a team to manage.

Before all of this started, the only teams that wouldn't have wanted Cutler were those that already had a franchise quarterbacks. Every other team would have viewed Cutler as an upgrade. But now, there's probably a much shorter list of teams who are prepared to deal with the tantrums and PR fiascos that Cutler might bring with him.

Plus, this feud is eroding Cutler's trade value. Every team knows that he doesn't want to be in Denver, so the Broncos might not get as much as if Cutler was publicly content. The only thing that can save his value now is if two or three teams start competing for him.

But are there two or three teams out there who a) need Cutler, b) want Cutler despite his tantrums, and c) have something that the Broncos would accept in exchange for Cutler?

No wonder McDonkey is doing so much in FAgency.......hes trying to kill the uprising before it happens.

McFool is going to drag this organization right into Al Davis territory.

Fire the dude. NOW.

Kaylore
03-16-2009, 12:20 PM
I'm all for McDaniels telling players they're not entitled to anything. I think if Cutler thinks he's special he can go to some other team without all pro lineman blocking for him and pro-bowl receivers catching his balls and see how he likes it.:lol:

Zweems56
03-16-2009, 12:22 PM
I'm all for McDaniels telling players they're not entitled to anything. I think if Cutler thinks he's special he can go to some other team without all pro lineman blocking for him and pro-bowl receivers catching his balls and see how he likes it.:lol:

Thank you. I concur. Not that I WANT him throwing balls for someone else....

claymore
03-16-2009, 12:24 PM
I'm all for McDaniels telling players they're not entitled to anything. I think if Cutler thinks he's special he can go to some other team without all pro lineman blocking for him and pro-bowl receivers catching his balls and see how he likes it.:lol:

That same all proline is going to get Simms killed. And Our only Pro Bowl Receiver will be sitting on the couch for 3/4 of the season.

turftoad
03-16-2009, 12:25 PM
On again.

Italianmobstr7
03-16-2009, 12:25 PM
Next guy is up now.

Denver Native (Carol)
03-16-2009, 12:25 PM
Next guy is up now.

Who is it?

ikillz0mbies
03-16-2009, 12:26 PM
Andre Goodman

underrated29
03-16-2009, 12:26 PM
Think about it. If we lose Jay, and scheff (in a trade) we are also going to lose brandon. So if jay goes, brandon is not going to re-sign, and if we trade scheff we are going to be missing 3 of our biggest pieces on offense.

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 12:27 PM
This is all bullshit. Speculation and what not from many different people that is beginning to cloud everyone's ability to look at the actual situation. I'm as big of a Cutler fan as anyone. I love the kid and have been able to look past the childish antics, and the immature temper tantrums that have been haunting us Broncomaniacs the past 3 weeks.

But all this talk about keeping Jay and firing McDaniels is bullshit. No one knows exactly what went on in the trade talks, who said what, who is influencing the situation and who is being honest. What i do know is McDaniels and the Broncos have tried to extend a helping hand to resolve the matter and Cutler is acting like a true *****.

Sorry, but whether it was Bus Cook, Bill Belichick, McDaniels himself, or Cutler himself, Jay is the one who is unwilling to cooperate. McDaniels has told the media, the fans, and Jay himself, he doesn't want to trade Jay - and what does Jay do? "No, he wants to trade me, I know he does, he doesn't want me... seriously, please believe me, he doesn't want me..." Okay Jay, way to be immature about it.

Am I upset? Hell yes. But I'm sick of speculation, Jay is being an ass. I never wanted to see number 6 in any other uniform besides a Denver Bronco's one, but this is beginning to become a high school break up. You have nothing to complain about Jay - money, fans and a place to play ball... Many of us would kill to be in the situation you are.. If your such a loyal guy, and claim to play for teammates, you have officially contradicted yourself. I'm beginning to think your nothing but a schmuck.

It all started with you telling the MEDIA, the Broncos better not fire your good buddy Bates.. Go wipe your ass with a twenty and head out to Detroit or Tampa, maybe you can dip into a large contract or a swimming pool of tears. But if this is how your going to act, get the hell out of Denver, same goes with any other player... This is McDaniels team, and I can't say I like how things or going, but like it or not, he's the guy. And if it takes three or four years, so be it, I plan on being a Bronco fan for the rest of my life..


WRONG.

McDonkey is saying he wants Cutler in the press.

But you know what I dont hear from McDonkey? I dont hear him saying: Yes, I lied to Cutler and thats probably a big reason we have this impasse.
I told him one thing, and did another. I was wrong. Ive sent this awesome organization into a SPIRAL with my INEXPERIENCE in dealing with these types of issues. I hope to make amends with Jay.

Mc MAN UP!

tomjonesrocks
03-16-2009, 12:29 PM
I'm not sticking around to watch a parade of happy talk from the team's fringe players while the organization is clearly in disarray.

Back to work for me.

ikillz0mbies
03-16-2009, 12:30 PM
I wouldn't mind trading away Marshall and the baggage that follows him around.

claymore
03-16-2009, 12:31 PM
I'm not sticking around to watch a parade of happy talk from the team's fringe players while the organization is clearly in disarray.

Back to work for me.

We need a state of the union from someone in charge.

Denver Native (Carol)
03-16-2009, 12:31 PM
These players KNOW exactly what they should say, and KNOW exactly what they had better not say :tsk: What's the point of this????:rolleyes:

Zweems56
03-16-2009, 12:32 PM
I'd like a list of who attended today and who didn't. Marshall Particularly.

DallasChief
03-16-2009, 12:34 PM
We need a state of the union from someone in charge.

Do you really think Bus is going to speak at the press conference? :cool:

Denver Native (Carol)
03-16-2009, 12:35 PM
I'd like a list of who attended today and who didn't. Marshall Particularly.

FM1043 stated no shows were Cutler, Sheffler (because of trade talks involving them), and Wiegman (because he wants a new contract). On Ch7 tv, they showed Marshall walking in.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 12:35 PM
WRONG.

McDonkey is saying he wants Cutler in the press.

But you know what I dont hear from McDonkey? I dont hear him saying: Yes, I lied to Cutler and thats probably a big reason we have this impasse.
I told him one thing, and did another. I was wrong. Ive sent this awesome organization into a SPIRAL with my INEXPERIENCE in dealing with these types of issues. I hope to make amends with Jay.

Mc MAN UP!

Why would he admit to a fault that people ASSUME he made?

Zweems56
03-16-2009, 12:37 PM
FM1043 stated no shows were Cutler, Sheffler (because of trade talks involving them), and Wiegman (because he wants a new contract). On Ch7 tv, they showed Marshall walking in.

Good. Glad to hear it. As many mistakes as Marshall has made, I'm not QUITE ready to boot him out the door

turftoad
03-16-2009, 12:38 PM
Why would he admit to a fault that people ASSUME he made?


This what Josh told Jay.

"Cutler also said that he felt like he could no longer trust McDaniels since, at first, the coach told him that he didn’t try to trade for Cassel, who was ultimately traded from the New England Patriots to the Kansas City Chiefs, only to later acknowledge that actually was the case.

That, my friend is McDanials lying.

TXBRONC
03-16-2009, 12:38 PM
Why would he admit to a fault that people ASSUME he made?

Because he did admit to Jay that he lied and Toad even hightligted for you Chaz.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 12:39 PM
This what Josh told Jay.

"Cutler also said that he felt like he could no longer trust McDaniels since, at first, the coach told him that he didn’t try to trade for Cassel, who was ultimately traded from the New England Patriots to the Kansas City Chiefs, only to later acknowledge that actually was the case.

That, my friend is McDanials lying.

Again...give me the McDaniels quotes...not jay's interpretation of what was said.

honz
03-16-2009, 12:40 PM
I thought Cutler just wanted the truth...

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 12:40 PM
Because he did admit to Jay that he lied and Toad even hightligted for you Chaz.

That starts with "Jay also said".

Give me something that McDaniels said.

claymore
03-16-2009, 12:40 PM
Again...give me the McDaniels quotes...not jay's interpretation of what was said.

He wont man up long enough to talk about it.

DallasChief
03-16-2009, 12:40 PM
I thought Cutler just wanted the truth...

He can't handle the truth. :cool:

Mike
03-16-2009, 12:41 PM
Again...give me the McDaniels quotes...not jay's interpretation of what was said.

:lol:

turftoad
03-16-2009, 12:41 PM
Again...give me the McDaniels quotes...not jay's interpretation of what was said.

McDanials acknowledge to Jay that that was the case.

Acknowledge/admit = the same thing.

So............ it's NOT Jays interpretation, it's wha McDanials told him.

topscribe
03-16-2009, 12:41 PM
These players KNOW exactly what they should say, and KNOW exactly what they had better not say :tsk: What's the point of this????:rolleyes:

Yes. You know they have their own private opinions, and I'm sure they talk
among themselves, but they know better than to spill their guts to the press.
It just goes without saying . . .

-----

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 12:41 PM
He wont man up long enough to talk about it.

Are you f'ing serious?

Denver Native (Carol)
03-16-2009, 12:41 PM
This what Josh told Jay.

"Cutler also said that he felt like he could no longer trust McDaniels since, at first, the coach told him that he didn’t try to trade for Cassel, who was ultimately traded from the New England Patriots to the Kansas City Chiefs, only to later acknowledge that actually was the case.

That, my friend is McDanials lying.

Exactly - when this stupid press conference is over, I will post a link in regards to what Mark Schlereth said on this - two of his comments being:

When somebody just bold face lies to you, AND

Players need to be dealt with honestly.

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 12:42 PM
I can't get the feed but it sounds like a dog and pony to try and show everything is ok in Denver right?

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 12:45 PM
Exactly - when this stupid press conference is over, I will post a link in regards to what Mark Schlereth said on this - two of his comments being:

When somebody just bold face lies to you, AND

Players need to be dealt with honestly.

Yeah, because out of the blue Schlereth is a trustworthy source. This is the same guy that people bash for his comments on Denver

Denver Native (Carol)
03-16-2009, 12:45 PM
I can't get the feed but it sounds like a dog and pony to try and show everything is ok in Denver right?

Yeah that, and praise for McD - surprise surprise :rolleyes:

Denver Native (Carol)
03-16-2009, 12:47 PM
Yeah, because out of the blue Schlereth is a trustworthy source. This is the same guy that people bash for his comments on Denver

Whatever, in his phone conversation, he stated he has been critical of Jay in the past, and still feels Jay could have done some things differently. Why don't you listen to it after I post the link, before you make judgement on Schlereth???

tubby
03-16-2009, 12:48 PM
Clay get lost and go buy some Lions gear online.

bcbronc
03-16-2009, 12:49 PM
Yes. You know they have their own private opinions, and I'm sure they talk
among themselves, but they know better than to spill their guts to the press.
It just goes without saying . . .

-----

can someone make sure Cutler sees this post. TYIA. :salute:

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 12:49 PM
Yeah that, and praise for McD - surprise surprise :rolleyes:

Amazing, can't help but think this will only feed to the discontent in the locker room. Place a bunch of job scared players in front of the camera to give the apperance that everything is alright in Denver.

underrated29
03-16-2009, 12:51 PM
Yeah, because out of the blue Schlereth is a trustworthy source. This is the same guy that people bash for his comments on Denver



I like stink. Always have. I think he is a good source and good rep. He may not always sugar coat the broncos, but he tells it like it is. And he is usually correct.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 12:54 PM
I like stink. Always have. I think he is a good source and good rep. He may not always sugar coat the broncos, but he tells it like it is. And he is usually correct.

Yep...here they come out of the woodwork.

if Kiper decided tomorrow that he sided with Cutler, everyone would suddenly say they always agreed with him too.

claymore
03-16-2009, 12:55 PM
Clay get lost and go buy some Lions gear online.

We dont know Cutler is going there yet.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 12:55 PM
I think it kind of surprises me how many fans put a player above a team.

claymore
03-16-2009, 12:55 PM
Are you f'ing serious?

Yeah why?

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 12:57 PM
Yeah why?

If I told you that someone hear said something about you and they denied it, would you accuse them of not manning up?

claymore
03-16-2009, 12:57 PM
I think it kind of surprises me how many fans put a player above a team.

You are blindly trusting McDaniels. I am not.

Dreadnought
03-16-2009, 12:58 PM
I think it kind of surprises me how many fans put a player above a team.

Normally I'd agree - except in drastic cases where the team management sells out the fans first - and they have here. At that point you are stuck with loyalty to players and to tradition. Nothing else is left.

NightTrainLayne
03-16-2009, 12:58 PM
This what Josh told Jay.

"Cutler also said that he felt like he could no longer trust McDaniels since, at first, the coach told him that he didn’t try to trade for Cassel, who was ultimately traded from the New England Patriots to the Kansas City Chiefs, only to later acknowledge that actually was the case.

That, my friend is McDanials lying.

No. .. that's what Cutler and Cutler's agent said that Josh told Jay.

There's a big difference.

Obviously, there's two sides to every story, and in situations like this one, I usually find that the truth is somewhere in the middle. Very often in these situations the truth is in the middle but shaded more to the side of the party who is talking the least. Usually the blabber-mouth is the one who is stretching the truth more.

claymore
03-16-2009, 12:58 PM
If I told you that someone hear said something about you and they denied it, would you accuse them of not manning up?

Yes Cause I trust you.

TXBRONC
03-16-2009, 12:59 PM
Yep...here they come out of the woodwork.

if Kiper decided tomorrow that he sided with Cutler, everyone would suddenly say they always agreed with him too.

Nope.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 12:59 PM
Normally I'd agree - except in drastic cases where the team management sells out the fans first - and they have here. At that point you are stuck with loyalty to players and to tradition. Nothing else is left.

This shit is gone too far. First we believe EVERYTHING Cutler says regardless of anything to the contrary and now, the team is selling out the fans.

That crap statement is completely unwarranted and ridiculous.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 12:59 PM
Nope.

Bullshit

TXBRONC
03-16-2009, 01:01 PM
Bullshit

Until I'm certain you read my mind step off.

underrated29
03-16-2009, 01:01 PM
Yep...here they come out of the woodwork.

if Kiper decided tomorrow that he sided with Cutler, everyone would suddenly say they always agreed with him too.


Coach dont give me that crap. You should know me well enough atleast;to know i will not to double side things.

If kiper came out and say jay was the best, or burger bill or anyone else. I say they are still idiots. Even though i might agree with what they are saying at the time.

NightTrainLayne
03-16-2009, 01:01 PM
Normally I'd agree - except in drastic cases where the team management sells out the fans first - and they have here. At that point you are stuck with loyalty to players and to tradition. Nothing else is left.

How do you figure that the Team has sold out the fans?

claymore
03-16-2009, 01:02 PM
This shit is gone too far. First we believe EVERYTHING Cutler says regardless of anything to the contrary and now, the team is selling out the fans.

That crap statement is completely unwarranted and ridiculous.

I have no reason to not believe Cutler. And I have no reason to trust a belicheat disciple.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:02 PM
If aformer player that usually rags on the Broncos says something that could even remotely be construed as him supporting Cutler and he suddenly becomes a legitimate source, why the hell should I believe other naysayers wouldnt suddenly be given a free pass?

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:03 PM
I have no reason to not believe Cutler. And I have no reason to trust a belicheat disciple.

Jaded

Denver Native (Carol)
03-16-2009, 01:03 PM
Channel 9 just stated that during the meeting this morning, McD did address Jay's situation, but the players were not suppose to talk about it - WHAT A SURPRISE:rolleyes:

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:04 PM
Channel 9 just stated that during the meeting this morning, McD did address Jay's situation, but the players were not suppose to talk about it - WHAT A SURPRISE:rolleyes:

Why is this a bad thing? God forbid someone in the organization keep this shit in house. God knows Cutler wont

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 01:05 PM
I think it kind of surprises me how many fans put a player above a team.

That might be the case for some but I would have to say a majority just think it's a dumb move to trade Cutler at this point because the team will suffer as a result. It's hard to buy into ANY scenario that has Cutler leaving without knowing we are getting what we deserve or more in return. McD decisions to date make it justified to question if this in fact would be the case.

Denver Native (Carol)
03-16-2009, 01:05 PM
Here is the link in which Mark discussed the situation this morning. It is a good discussion by Mark:

Listen to it here:

http://www.fm1043thefan.com/denverSportsCenter/podcasts.cfm

underrated29
03-16-2009, 01:06 PM
If aformer player that usually rags on the Broncos says something that could even remotely be construed as him supporting Cutler and he suddenly becomes a legitimate source, why the hell should I believe other naysayers wouldnt suddenly be given a free pass?



Well as i said, i have always liked stink. When he stated that we were an 7-9 team and we suck, I still likes him. And guess what he was right. Which even though sucks, makes me like him more cuz he knows his shyt.


I dont get the last part of your statement.

Dortoh
03-16-2009, 01:06 PM
so to sum things up were ******

Does that cover it?

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:08 PM
That might be the case for some but I would have to say a majority just think it's a dumb move to trade Cutler at this point because the team will suffer as a result. It's hard to buy into ANY scenario that has Cutler leaving without knowing we are getting what we deserve or more in return. McD decisions to date make it justified to question if this in fact would be the case.

He let go of a long snapper...big f'ing deal.

Then he LISTENED to a trade proposal which eventually was not accepted. yeah, he's really screwed things up.

Mike
03-16-2009, 01:10 PM
so to sum things up were ******

Does that cover it?

I would add that the entire Bronco Nation has lost their freaking minds. ;)

claymore
03-16-2009, 01:10 PM
Jaded

Its my opinion McDaniels has done a terrible job directing this team. You dont have to agree.

Rex
03-16-2009, 01:12 PM
He let go of a long snapper...big f'ing deal.

Then he LISTENED to a trade proposal which eventually was not accepted. yeah, he's really screwed things up.

Clay is really burned up about that Longsnapper.

As a matter of fact, I think he has spent 3 sleepless nights pacing about the longsnapper.

Italianmobstr7
03-16-2009, 01:12 PM
He let go of a long snapper...big f'ing deal.

Then he LISTENED to a trade proposal which eventually was not accepted. yeah, he's really screwed things up.

He's obviously done more than that. If he's STILL making Jay feel like he can be traded at any time, then he did more than listen to offers. He admitted to Jay that he tried to get Cassell....

shank
03-16-2009, 01:12 PM
He let go of a long snapper...big f'ing deal.

Then he LISTENED to a trade proposal which eventually was not accepted. yeah, he's really screwed things up.

coach, i can still see why you're skeptical of the cutler situation, but how can you not see the implications behind the leach/paxton situation from a player's perspective? how?

Rex
03-16-2009, 01:12 PM
Its my opinion McDaniels has done a terrible job directing this team. You dont have to agree.

Really? I never would have guess that.

you have been so level headed and non-judgmental during this.

I mean, you and Warhorse are really holding up well.

Shazam!
03-16-2009, 01:12 PM
All this **** thrown around about McD, but if Denver somehow makes the playoffs, watch how he is suddenly a hero. And if Cutler woulda been dealt and Denver still succeeds, he's a friggn' genius.

claymore
03-16-2009, 01:14 PM
Really? I never would have guess that.

you have been so level headed and non-judgmental during this.

I mean, you and Warhorse are really holding up well.

I dont have the love for Plummer to keep me warm at night like you and Tubby.

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 01:14 PM
He let go of a long snapper...big f'ing deal.

Then he LISTENED to a trade proposal which eventually was not accepted. yeah, he's really screwed things up.

He let go a locker room leader and vet who was performing at his job at a bargin rate and brought in a guy to do the same job and make significantly more money and in the process affected the /leadership continuity in the locker. This money could have been better spent on the areas where we need it and still need it on the DL or OLB spots.

It's not that he listen to trade offers, it's how he handled it and has handled it since. Caoch, this is clearly a team divided. How can you NOT fault the people in charge for some or all of this?

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:14 PM
He's obviously done more than that. If he's STILL making Jay feel like he can be traded at any time, then he did more than listen to offers. He admitted to Jay that he tried to get Cassell....

Other than what Jay interpreted and said, where is there eveidence that McD TRIED to trade for Cassell as opposed to listening to the offer?

DenBronx
03-16-2009, 01:15 PM
All this **** thrown around about McD, but if Denver somehow makes the playoffs, watch how he is suddenly a hero. And if Cutler woulda been dealt and Denver still succeeds, he's a friggn' genius.

my thoughts exactly. even if we go 9-7 and make the playoffs mcfail is going to look like a genius and say that he turned cutler into a winner.

Dortoh
03-16-2009, 01:15 PM
Does anyone actually think these 2 can work together after all this crap. I hope I'm wrong but I'd say my chances of dating Jennifer Aniston are greater then the chances of Jay staying in Broncoland.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:16 PM
He let go a locker room leader and vet who was performing at his job at a bargin rate and brought in a guy to do the same job and make significantly more money and in the process affected the /leadership continuity in the locker. This money could have been better spent on the areas where we need it and still need it on the DL or OLB spots.

It's not that he listen to trade offers, it's how he handled it and has handled it since. Caoch, this is clearly a team divided. How can you NOT fault the people in charge for some or all of this?

What significant improvement was the minimal extra money going to buy us? This is the NFl and friends and vets are released and cut EVERY day. When the release of a long snapper divides the team, there are much bigger problems than appear.

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 01:16 PM
All this **** thrown around about McD, but if Denver somehow makes the playoffs, watch how he is suddenly a hero. And if Cutler woulda been dealt and Denver still succeeds, he's a friggn' genius.

Trust me, I'd LOVE to eat crow over all of this and still hope I do because that means the Broncos will be winners. It's way early and the season hasn't started but at this point, all I see is turmoil and poor supervision.

Zweems56
03-16-2009, 01:17 PM
I dont know if this has been said yet, but todays press conference makes a lot of sense. They're just bringing in the new guys (and guys that just resigned i.e. peterson) to talk to the press about it. I havent seen any press conferences from any of them but dawkins (and I havent been able to watch much today so I dont even know if he spoke). it would make a lot of sense for this to be just about that and not about Cutler.

Shazam!
03-16-2009, 01:17 PM
Seriously, we all need to stop villainizing everyone (myself included) from Cutler to McDaniels to Cook to Xanders and see how this all plays out first. All this speculation is causing a lot of stress about the team we all adore. Let's just hope this all gets worked out for the future of the Broncos' success.

Dreadnought
03-16-2009, 01:18 PM
How do you figure that the Team has sold out the fans?

In selling out a winning tradition and millions of fans on behalf of allowing a young man who is clearly not up to this job ransack our roster at random and lard up the payroll with hs buds. His ego clearly convinces him he can violate every established and sound principal of leadership and management since the dawn of time, and that his mighty brain and flawless system will make it all work anyway. Who needs Cutler? Why, in the perfect mechanism of the Josh McDaniels system we could field Chris Simms throwing to Todd Pinkston and Sami Parker and we'll contend!

Pfaugh

Dortoh
03-16-2009, 01:19 PM
Seriously, we all need to stop villainizing everyone (myself included) from Cutler to McDaniels to Cook to Xanders and see how this all plays out first. All this speculation is causing a lot of stress about the team we all adore. Let's just hope this all gets worked out for the future of the Broncos' success.

Gay ;)

You have to admit its been an interesting offseason.

underrated29
03-16-2009, 01:22 PM
All this **** thrown around about McD, but if Denver somehow makes the playoffs, watch how he is suddenly a hero. And if Cutler woulda been dealt and Denver still succeeds, he's a friggn' genius.


If cutler is dealt and we make the playoffs he will be a genius!!!! I dont even see with our schedule, jay hear next year and nolans new defense that we will make the playoffs. So if he can do that without jay, wich is even a bigger mountain to climb, by goerge he got it.....I still wont like him for shipping out jay, but be able to get a team to do that would be remarkable.


I would not make him a hero though. Thats way to far....

The most plausible scenario if this goes down is jay gets shipped out. All the crybabie-supporters cheer for joy. Then we watch out team blow detroit out of the water for the #1 overall pick and listen to how we need to draft a qb and use our 2nd,3rd rdrs for defense, but it wasnt anything to blame Mcd for.

claymore
03-16-2009, 01:22 PM
What significant improvement was the minimal extra money going to buy us? This is the NFl and friends and vets are released and cut EVERY day. When the release of a long snapper divides the team, there are much bigger problems than appear.

You know the paxton signing was silly. You want proof, there is proof. It was a ridiculous move. No logic in it whatsoever.

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 01:23 PM
Why is this a bad thing? God forbid someone in the organization keep this shit in house. God knows Cutler wont


Why is that a bad thing? Cause we look like the damn Dallas Cowgirls now with idiots telling grown men to put a cap on it.

CLASSIC.........and its a move of a NAPOLEON.

Get rid of the McIDIOT.

DallasChief
03-16-2009, 01:23 PM
so to sum things up were ******

Does that cover it?

Let's hope so. :cool:

NightTrainLayne
03-16-2009, 01:23 PM
In selling out a winning tradition and millions of fans on behalf of allowing a young man who is clearly not up to this job ransack our roster at random and lard up the payroll with hs buds. His ego clearly convinces him he can violate every established and sound principal of leadership and management since the dawn of time, and that his mighty brain and flawless system will make it all work anyway. Who needs Cutler? Why, in the perfect mechanism of the Josh McDaniels system we could field Chris Simms throwing to Todd Pinkston and Sami Parker and we'll contend!

Pfaugh

Ok.

I disagree totally, but I understand how you draw that conclusion.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:24 PM
In selling out a winning tradition and millions of fans on behalf of allowing a young man who is clearly not up to this job ransack our roster at random and lard up the payroll with hs buds. His ego clearly convinces him he can violate every established and sound principal of leadership and management since the dawn of time, and that his mighty brain and flawless system will make it all work anyway. Who needs Cutler? Why, in the perfect mechanism of the Josh McDaniels system we could field Chris Simms throwing to Todd Pinkston and Sami Parker and we'll contend!

Pfaugh

1. Every coach brings in his players. If it were Spagnuolo, he'd have brought his types of playes in as well.

2. Violating leadership principles by stating he will do ANYTHING that improves a team?

3. WE ARE NOT TRADING JAY CUTLER

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 01:25 PM
What significant improvement was the minimal extra money going to buy us? This is the NFl and friends and vets are released and cut EVERY day. When the release of a long snapper divides the team, there are much bigger problems than appear.

That money in conjunction with some more money could net us a starting DE. Try this anology, if you own a house with solid doors/windows but you need a new roof because it is leaking like a sieve, you don't go out and buy a new door/window before you fix the roof. Our defense was putrid last year, Mcd is ignoring the roof and buying windows and doors (RB's and LS).
Leach was a respected locker room leader and performing. There was NO point to bring in Paxton. It was wasted money IMO. Same with the RB's, not one of those guys was an improvement over what we have. Wasted money.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:26 PM
That money in conjunction with some more money could net us a starting DE. Try this anology, if you own a house with solid doors/windows but you need a new roof because it is leaking like a sieve, you don't go out and buy a new door/window before you fix the roof. Our defense was putrid last year, Mcd is ignoring the roof and buying windows and doors (RB's and LS).
Leach was a respected locker room leader and performing. There was NO point to bring in Paxton. It was wasted money IMO. Same with the RB's, not one of those guys was an improvement over what we have. Wasted money.

How the hell can anyone say this until we see results on the field? It's ludicrous.

G_Money
03-16-2009, 01:27 PM
All this **** thrown around about McD, but if Denver somehow makes the playoffs, watch how he is suddenly a hero. And if Cutler woulda been dealt and Denver still succeeds, he's a friggn' genius.

And if Cutler succeeds without us while we roll around in the muck?

Just curious, it does work both ways.

What's done is done.

There's still a decent chance Cutler is our QB next year and we get all this fixed, but if we trade him or he holds out or whatever...they'll still be playing the games this fall. It's entirely possible that we'll find a QB who will be perfect for us and isn't named Cutler.

And McDaniels will get the chance to prove his way was the right way.

I know people are advocating he not get that chance, but he's gonna get it. And unless we absolutely crater (still possible, with a tough schedule, a potential QB change, new coaches, etc) he'll get more than one year to prove it.

I just won't call this way of dealing with the problem a smart way. This is stupid, and Josh could have made it go away and has so far chosen not to. Maybe he is a coaching genius, and he still can weld our team together and turn them into an unstoppable force on the field in a couple of seasons.

But this is a bad start out of the blocks. Great sprinters can overcome that. Some guys can still break world records with bad starts, win titles and medals and glory.

Hopefully McDaniels has that sort of talent, because all this stumbling is making him look uncoordinated right now.

I no longer think the odds are in Josh's favor, but there's nothing I can do about it so I'm not gonna foam at the mouth. He'll get his shot.

He'd better make it count.

~G

MadMax
03-16-2009, 01:28 PM
He let go a locker room leader and vet who was performing at his job at a bargin rate and brought in a guy to do the same job and make significantly more money and in the process affected the /leadership continuity in the locker. This money could have been better spent on the areas where we need it and still need it on the DL or OLB spots.

It's not that he listen to trade offers, it's how he handled it and has handled it since. Caoch, this is clearly a team divided. How can you NOT fault the people in charge for some or all of this?

Paxton signed a 5 year contract (http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/03/01/broncos-sign-paxton-cut-leach/) for 5.1mil plus a 900k signing bonus this works out to 1.2mil/year.

Leaches contract (http://content.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/salaries/playerdetail.aspx?lname=leach&player=1360&loc=interstitialskip) last year paid him 730,000 plus 300k pro-rated signing bonus or 1mil/year.

How did we overpay?? And how could we have better spent $200,000/year?

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 01:29 PM
Really? I never would have guess that.

you have been so level headed and non-judgmental during this.

I mean, you and Warhorse are really holding up well.


Of course.

All I gotta say is, we just had three great years with Cutler.

Cutlers not new to this org.

But now McNapoleon comes in, (and I call him that because thats exactly how hes handled this situation with Cutler, with lies and what he sees as a huge gavel), and look at the aftermath.

Maybe there were times where Shanahan leaned favorably towards players he considered good for the lockeroom, but one thing ALL the players he dealt with would say today, INCLUDING Clinton Portis: Shanahan is a mans man, and you can look him in the eye and he will be honest with you.

You obviously like where we're at. I dont.

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 01:29 PM
How the hell can anyone say this until we see results on the field? It's ludicrous.

Your right Coach, I'm sure Paxton will be our new QB and break the TD pass record this season.

bcbronc
03-16-2009, 01:29 PM
That money in conjunction with some more money could net us a starting DE. Try this anology, if you own a house with solid doors/windows but you need a new roof because it is leaking like a sieve, you don't go out and buy a new door/window before you fix the roof. Our defense was putrid last year, Mcd is ignoring the roof and buying windows and doors (RB's and LS).
Leach was a respected locker room leader and performing. There was NO point to bring in Paxton. It was wasted money IMO. Same with the RB's, not one of those guys was an improvement over what we have. Wasted money.

doors and windows are a big investment and a major project, especially windows. the long snapper is more like changing baseboards. sure, the house had baseboards and they did the job, but changing them is a quick and easy way to update the look of your new home.

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 01:30 PM
How the hell can anyone say this until we see results on the field? It's ludicrous.


We arent even gonna make it to the field. Napoleon is going to implode.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:30 PM
Of course.

All I gotta say is, we just had three great years with Cutler.

Cutlers not new to this org.

But now McNapoleon comes in, (and I call him that because thats exactly how hes handled this situation with Cutler, with lies and what he sees as a huge gavel), and look at the aftermath.

Maybe there were times where Shanahan leaned favorably towards players he considered good for the lockeroom, but one thing ALL the players he dealt with would say today, INCLUDING Clinton Portis: Shanahan is a mans man, and you can look him in the eye and he will be honest with you.

You obviously like where we're at. I dont.


Did i miss something?

claymore
03-16-2009, 01:31 PM
doors and windows are a big investment and a major project, especially windows. the long snapper is more like changing baseboards. sure, the house had baseboards and they did the job, but changing them is a quick and easy way to update the look of your new home.

Its probably more like fixing the tree swing. Cause the swing has nothing to do with the house, and Leach/Paxton had nothing to do with our problems. :D

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 01:32 PM
doors and windows are a big investment and a major project, especially windows. the long snapper is more like changing baseboards. sure, the house had baseboards and they did the job, but changing them is a quick and easy way to update the look of your new home.

Meanwhile the roof still leaks.

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 01:35 PM
Did i miss something?


Yeah. Cutler............not the win loss record.


Cutler has definitely held up his end considering his lack of experience.

He has overachieved.

Broncospsycho77
03-16-2009, 01:35 PM
I don't care about this.

I wanna win.

I want to win some football games. We were pretty good at it last year for the first part of the season, and I liked that. I wanna win some more. That's it.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:36 PM
Yeah. Cutler............not the win loss record.


Cutler has definitely held up his end considering his lack of experience.

He has overachieved.

Yeah...4500 yards means the world. Put his name on the HOF ballot now.

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 01:36 PM
I don't care about this.

I wanna win.

I want to win some football games. We were pretty good at it last year for the first part of the season, and I liked that. I wanna win some more. That's it.


Then Bowlen needs to bring Xanders and McDoogie in and McSpank the both of them.

bcbronc
03-16-2009, 01:36 PM
Meanwhile the roof still leaks.

so you're saying McX have done nothing to address some of the problems on defense? he may have only thrown a tarp over the problem areas (Fields, Davis, Goodman) but he's at least brought in a legit roofing company (Nolan) to start the repair job. But until Nolan has had a chance to see if the sheathing is going to need to be replaced, he can only do so much.

turftoad
03-16-2009, 01:37 PM
Yeah. Cutler............not the win loss record.


Cutler has definitely held up his end considering his lack of experience.

He has overachieved.

I agree. He's started for 2 1/2 years and only 25 yrs old. EVERY personel guy in the league knows he has a very, very bright future in this league. He's only going to get better.

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 01:37 PM
Yeah...4500 yards means the world. Put his name on the HOF ballot now.


Or in your world, hand the reigns to Chris Simms.


FAIL!

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 01:38 PM
Are there any printed transcipts of this meeting?

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 01:38 PM
I agree. He's started for 2 1/2 years and only 25 yrs old. EVERY personel guy in the league knows he has a very, very bright future in this league. He's only going to get better.


Every personel guy except Xanders and McDummy.

turftoad
03-16-2009, 01:39 PM
Yeah...4500 yards means the world. Put his name on the HOF ballot now.

Not yet, but he's only 25 years old and been starting for 2 1/2 years. He's got the world ahead of him and will only get better.

Would you rather have Simms as the starter or even one year wonder Cassell?

Not me, but then again, I like to win.

broncofaninfla
03-16-2009, 01:40 PM
so your saying McX have done nothing to address some of the problems on defense? he may have only thrown a tarp over the problem areas (Fields, Davis, Goodman) but he's at least brought in a legit roofing company (Nolan) to start the repair job. But until Nolan has had a chance to see if the sheathing is going to need to be replaced, he can only do so much.

I guess I haven't been fair about Nolan, I liked this addition a lot, just don't see much what we have done to address our DL. I like our chnaces with Nolan assuming we give him some talent to work with.

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 01:41 PM
Not yet, but he's only 25 years old and been starting for 2 1/2 years. He's got the world ahead of him and will only get better.

Would you rather have Simms as the starter or even one year wonder Cassell?

Not me, but then again, I like to win.


4500 yards? Whats that? TONS of QBs throw for 4500 yards in this league Turf. Didnt you know that? Most of them cant move like Cutler can, but hey, we can get some DRAFT PICKS for him!!!!





:elefant:


*sarcasm on high*

MasterShake
03-16-2009, 01:41 PM
You know what the worst part is? Bowlen did all of this to gain control of his franchise back.
:lol:

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:42 PM
Or in your world, hand the reigns to Chris Simms.


FAIL!

Is that what I said? or did I say he could suffice if needed?

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:44 PM
Not yet, but he's only 25 years old and been starting for 2 1/2 years. He's got the world ahead of him and will only get better.

Would you rather have Simms as the starter or even one year wonder Cassell?

Not me, but then again, I like to win.

Something Simms and Cassell have done...but I know...it's all the defenses fault.

turftoad
03-16-2009, 01:46 PM
Is that what I said? or did I say he could suffice if needed?

Coach, I don't understand. Now we just want a suffice type QB?

There are NO better QB options out there for us than Cutler.

I don't want to NOT watch Broncos games because they suck. I tired of being frustrated in front of the TV.
The "D" did that last year and I'm afraid without Cutler, I will be with the "O" this year also.

This whole thing just sucks, plain and simple.

underrated29
03-16-2009, 01:48 PM
ANYONE else been interviewed yet?

TXBRONC
03-16-2009, 01:48 PM
Is that what I said? or did I say he could suffice if needed?

I suppose you'll stick that no matter what?

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:50 PM
Coach, I don't understand. Now we just want a suffice type QB?

There are NO better QB options out there for us than Cutler.

I don't want to NOT watch Broncos games because they suck. I tired of being frustrated in front of the TV.
The "D" did that last year and I'm afraid without Cutler, I will be with the "O" this year also.

This whole thing just sucks, plain and simple.

Suffice IF NEEDED. Do I want it to come to that? Hell no. I'm first in line for this tiff between Cutler and McD to get resolved and watch Cutler grow into something special. BUT...if he insists on being traded because he's upset about something that happens EVERY DAY in the NFL and his response is to whine and demand that trade...then I dont want him on my team.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 01:51 PM
I suppose you'll stick that no matter what?

No. I said IF NEEDED. Read my other posts

turftoad
03-16-2009, 01:55 PM
Suffice IF NEEDED. Do I want it to come to that? Hell no. I'm first in line for this tiff between Cutler and McD to get resolved and watch Cutler grow into something special. BUT...if he insists on being traded because he's upset about something that happens EVERY DAY in the NFL and his response is to whine and demand that trade...then I dont want him on my team.

Honesty is the most important thing here. Thats why Jay is so pissed off. McBozo lied to him.

Some things Carol posted about what stink said:

"Two things Mark said:

When somebody just bold face lies to you, and

Players need to be dealt with honestly"

G_Money
03-16-2009, 01:55 PM
The wait of this offseason is gonna suck more than most.

Results are too far off.

People like to know there's a plan in place. That the plan has the greatest chance for success.

If I told you in December that our plan for next year was to hire a whole new set of defensive coaches in Nolan and crew, most people would probably be happy. We had defensive coordination problems, we addressed them with a more proven defensive coordinator.

If I told you the plan was to take our two Pro-Bowlers and another starting pass catcher and essentially toss them overboard over the next year, that might be a little more disconcerting. Those weren't exactly our main problem areas.

So then you want to know what the alternate plan is, if "going with the Pro-Bowlers as an offensive foundation" is out.

"Start Simms and trust McDaniels because he's an offensive genius" is not a plan that inspires instant trust. None of the other geniuses from Bill's coaching tree have proven out yet, McDaniels has never been a head coach ever anywhere, Cutler was the only "real hope" we had for the immediate future...

If somebody comes in to take over the Saints and gets in a feud with Drew Brees it's gonna ruffle feathers. Yes, he's been to the playoffs more than Cutler since Cutler hasn't been, but the whole motif of messing with one of the only stable pieces you have and your offensive lynchpin...it's disconcerting.

*shrugs* It's a long time to wait and see, I guess. It'd be nice to say, "well, I'm sure this will work out" and just put it on the back burner for 5 months, but that's not gonna happen.

Not without complementary trips to the opium den courtesy of Bowlen or something.

~G

Zweems56
03-16-2009, 01:56 PM
On a side note, are we completely incapable of using his real friggin name?

TXBRONC
03-16-2009, 01:56 PM
No. I said IF NEEDED. Read my other posts

I don't think I said anything that condricts your statement.

turftoad
03-16-2009, 01:59 PM
On a side note, are we completely incapable of using his real friggin name?

Zweems, he's earned every nickname he's been called.

That is all. :D

Zweems56
03-16-2009, 02:03 PM
Zweems, he's earned every nickname he's been called.

That is all. :D

I'm going to call them Cutler and McDaniels regardless.

Denver Native (Carol)
03-16-2009, 02:07 PM
Honesty is the most important thing here. Thats why Jay is so pissed off. McBozo lied to him.

Some things Carol posted about what stink said:

"Two things Mark said:

When somebody just bold face lies to you, and

Players need to be dealt with honestly"

Here is the link again for those who want to listen. Mark makes some great points.

http://www.fm1043thefan.com/denverSportsCenter/podcasts.cfm

getlynched47
03-16-2009, 02:07 PM
Yeah...4500 yards means the world. Put his name on the HOF ballot now.

oh my gosh. I've never seen somebody ride McDipShit's jock so hard.

McDumbass = http://www.brodeur.com/openblog/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/liar-liar-pants-on-fire.jpg

getlynched47
03-16-2009, 02:08 PM
On a side note, are we completely incapable of using his real friggin name?

at this point...yes...we are all incapable of it.

He is McDipShit, McDumbass, McD-bag, McDoofus........you name it :salute:

Northman
03-16-2009, 02:09 PM
Honesty is the most important thing here. Thats why Jay is so pissed off. McBozo lied to him.

Some things Carol posted about what stink said:

"Two things Mark said:

When somebody just bold face lies to you, and

Players need to be dealt with honestly"


Ok, so now that McD has come clean how does the situation resolve itself? McD has said he is the Qb of this team but Jay wants no part of it even though his teammates want him here. Where does the team go from here now that Jay wants out?

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:11 PM
Where does the team go from here now that Jay wants out?

Get rid of the entire team and bring in some new players.

These guys are .500 players, and haven't made the playoffs in 3 years.

People are forgetting that.

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 02:12 PM
Get rid of the entire team and bring in some new players.

These guys are .500 players, and haven't made the playoffs in 3 years.

People are forgetting that.


So smart. If only you were McRunning the show.

BigAL56
03-16-2009, 02:14 PM
Get rid of the entire team and bring in some new players.

These guys are .500 players, and haven't made the playoffs in 3 years.

People are forgetting that.

sorry to say this, but that is one of the dumbest things I've heard on the board (not saying you are dumb, just your statement.) What's the average age of our team? We are young, and we have talent (at least on offense.) We've already overhauled the whole defense, so I'm guessing you want to get rid of the 2nd ranked offense in football that averages what, like 25 years old? Please. I hope you were kidding

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:14 PM
So smart. If only you were McRunning the show.

The first thing I would do is McRun all of Crytler's skirts clear out of the organization.
Football is a man's sport and girls and crybabies aren't allowed.

No wonder why Crytler's lost everywhere he's played.

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 02:15 PM
Suffice IF NEEDED. Do I want it to come to that? Hell no. I'm first in line for this tiff between Cutler and McD to get resolved and watch Cutler grow into something special. BUT...if he insists on being traded because he's upset about something that happens EVERY DAY in the NFL and his response is to whine and demand that trade...then I dont want him on my team.


Youre right. People get McLIED to everyday in the NFL. Its just that Cutler takes offense to it, and has the balls to say it.

And the leverage for that matter.


I have yet to find a single thing Cutler is QUOTED on, that I find out of order or place.

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:15 PM
sorry to say this, but that is one of the dumbest things I've heard on the board (not saying you are dumb, just your statement.) What's the average age of our team? We are young, and we have talent (at least on offense.) We've already overhauled the whole defense, so I'm guessing you want to get rid of the 2nd ranked offense in football that averages what, like 25 years old? Please. I hope you were kidding

So we have made the playoffs in the last 3 years?

Our defense wasn't arguably the worst in the franchise, ever?

Are you not really kidding?

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:16 PM
I also hear Crytlied wanted to have lunch with McDancingNancy and share a few laughs.

What a fruitcake.

Dr Velcro
03-16-2009, 02:17 PM
LOL!!!!


Good news!

They're going to bring in Favre!

I'm kidding, guys. This will all pan itself out.

I have faith.

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 02:17 PM
Youre right. People get McLIED to everyday in the NFL. Its just that Cutler takes offense to it, and has the balls to say it.

And the leverage for that matter.


I have yet to find a single thing Cutler is QUOTED on, that I find out of order or place.

With all due respect, you wouldnt admit it now if you were given that evidence and all you have to go on is Cutler's word that McD is lying. I guess that's all we need.

Zweems56
03-16-2009, 02:19 PM
Here's a novel idea. How about everyone thats supporting McDaniels, and everyone thats supporting Cutler form a big hippie drum circle, hold hands, sing kumbaya, and PRAY TO FRIGGIN GOD THAT THE TWO OF THEM CAN WORK IT OUT! If on the VERY OFF CHANCE, that either one of them reads broncosforums, like PFT read broncosfreaks.com, i think it'd do a hell of a lot more good for us to be thinknig that they should work it out and that both of them are an ASSET to our team, than us jumping down eachothers throats and blaming one or the other instead of looking at the whole picture.

Denver Native (Carol)
03-16-2009, 02:19 PM
http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_11924596

New Broncos coach Josh McDaniels met with his team for the first time this morning as a group and addressed his ongoing feud with quarterback Jay Cutler, who did not attend the meeting and has asked to be traded.

"He said, "I'll take care of it,' and that's pretty much it," said defensive lineman Kenny Peterson. "(As players), you can't control it. You got to control what you can control.

"Let them handle that. My job is to play D-Line and that's it. I don't know the ramifications of what's going on with that. It's a business. Let them handle it, let (management) deal with it."

Peterson said players were eager to begin workouts this week for their new coaches.

"Definitely exciting, definitely you can see the changes, along the walls, the new faces in the locker room. New beginning. Day One."

As for what McDaniels talked about, Peterson said, "Just his philosophy of how he's going to conduct things and what he expects of us as players. Pretty much the basics. He's the head coach. He could be 20, 40, 50, 60 years old, he's the head coach, and he's going to get the respect. He's very methodical, very articulate. I have nothing but respect for him."

Veteran cornerback Andre' Goodman, recently signed as a free agent, said McDaniels asked the players not to talk about what he said in the meeting about Cutler.

As for the controversy in general, with Cutler trying to force a trade after feeling disrespected, he said, "This is nothing new for me. I'm not shocked that a lot is going on, because every team in the league is adjusting. For me, it's not big deal."

He did add, however, that not having Cutler around is a big issue.

"The quarterback is the face of the team," Goodman said. "When you take the coach out of it, (the QB) is the face of the team. Everybody will tell you it starts with the quarterback."

He said it's up to the players to not be distracted by what's happening between McDaniels and Cutler.

"It's only hard if you allow it to be hard," he said. "If you're a professional you don't allow it to be hard. It's all about the approach you take as individuals."

McDaniels told The Denver Post Sunday night that he wants to talk to Cutler further before considering a trade.

"I would like to talk to Jay before we go on and start to discuss some other type of alternative," McDaniels said. "In the last couple weeks, we've been all about trying to communicate and resolve his unhappiness with what happened — which we understand — and that's been our direction."

Players are scheduled to start voluntary off-season workouts today.

BigAL56
03-16-2009, 02:19 PM
So we have made the playoffs in the last 3 years?

Our defense wasn't arguably the worst in the franchise, ever?

Are you not really kidding?

The talent on the team the last 3 years were all kids. We started to rebuild three years ago.

Our defense was awful, I agree. We already got rid of everyone. It's not the offenses fault that we didn't make the playoffs.

On a side note, I'm at starbucks and there is a fat mexican guy in his 40's playing a handheld video game with the most annoying music ever. If I sound irritated, that's probably why

honz
03-16-2009, 02:22 PM
Anyone that sides with McIdiot is McDumb and has McPointless arguments.

Hehe, I make funny.

Seriously guys, it's annoying and immature.

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:23 PM
The talent on the team the last 3 years were all kids. We started to rebuild three years ago.

Our defense was awful, I agree. We already got rid of everyone. It's not the offenses fault that we didn't make the playoffs.

On a side note, I'm at starbucks and there is a fat mexican guy in his 40's playing a handheld video game with the most annoying music ever. If I sound irritated, that's probably why

Great. Kids that develop a losing mentality. Get them out of here before it becomes a cancerous tumor.

turftoad
03-16-2009, 02:26 PM
Great. Kids that develop a losing mentality. Get them out of here before it becomes a cancerous tumor.

As you have already pointed out, we had the worst defense in the league last year.
The offense was/is not the problem.

Denver Native (Carol)
03-16-2009, 02:26 PM
My question on this is - apparently the Broncos' management appointed Dawkins to be the team rep???? Is this the way it is done, or should the players not vote on who is the Broncos' team rep? Seems strange that a brand new player, who has yet to even play a down for the Broncos, is NOW the Broncos team rep???

http://blogs.denverpost.com/broncos/2009/03/16/dawkins-at-nflpa-meeting-in-hawaii-not-in-denver/


DOVE VALLEY — One more notable absence from the first day of the Broncos’ off-season workout.

But there’s no drama here.

Safety Brian Dawkins, one of the team’s marquee free agent acquisitions, is the team’s representative at the NFL Player’s Association’s meeting in Hawaii. The NFLPA on Sunday selected lawyer DeMaurice Smith as its new executive director.

The Broncos’ former rep was defensive lineman Ebenezer Ekuban, but Ekuban was a free agent and was not re-signed by the team’s new coach and general manager.

Dawkins will rejoin the team for off-season workouts later this week, according to a team spokesman.

Dr Velcro
03-16-2009, 02:27 PM
***Cough*Favre*Cough****

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:27 PM
As you have already pointed out, we had the worst defense in the league last year.
The offense was/is not the problem.

The offense is far from being the perfect product so many of you think.

Not only are they merely average in scoring, but they have allowed the team to take on a soft and delicate image. Dropped passes, and turnovers are a reflection of that. At least hold on to the damn ball when your running with it. It ain't that hard.

Rex
03-16-2009, 02:27 PM
In selling out a winning tradition and millions of fans on behalf of allowing a young man who is clearly not up to this job ransack our roster at random and lard up the payroll with hs buds. His ego clearly convinces him he can violate every established and sound principal of leadership and management since the dawn of time, and that his mighty brain and flawless system will make it all work anyway. Who needs Cutler? Why, in the perfect mechanism of the Josh McDaniels system we could field Chris Simms throwing to Todd Pinkston and Sami Parker and we'll contend!

Pfaugh

Selling out a winning tradition?

WTF has Denver won since 1998 Dread? 1 playoff game and Jay Cutler was still in college.

He hired McDaniels and like it or not, there is going to be changes. Perhaps changes that get rid of 7-9, 9-7 seasons and 10 years of mediocrity by which we only gain satisfaction that they have been better than KC and Oakland.

Nature Boy
03-16-2009, 02:27 PM
-

Bring Back Mikey!

.

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:30 PM
My question on this is - apparently the Broncos' management appointed Dawkins to be the team rep???? Is this the way it is done, or should the players not vote on who is the Broncos' team rep? Seems strange that a brand new player, who has yet to even play a down for the Broncos, is NOW the Broncos team rep???

http://blogs.denverpost.com/broncos/2009/03/16/dawkins-at-nflpa-meeting-in-hawaii-not-in-denver/


DOVE VALLEY — One more notable absence from the first day of the Broncos’ off-season workout.

But there’s no drama here.

Safety Brian Dawkins, one of the team’s marquee free agent acquisitions, is the team’s representative at the NFL Player’s Association’s meeting in Hawaii. The NFLPA on Sunday selected lawyer DeMaurice Smith as its new executive director.

The Broncos’ former rep was defensive lineman Ebenezer Ekuban, but Ekuban was a free agent and was not re-signed by the team’s new coach and general manager.

Dawkins will rejoin the team for off-season workouts later this week, according to a team spokesman.

I think it's quite evident that the team failed miserably in having a take charge kind of person, or rep, and for their own best interest, one had to be appointed for them. The rep they choose last year clearly wasn't doing his job, and the proof was on the field.

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:30 PM
-

Bring Back Mikey!

.

Bring back Shanahan!!

We love .500 records!!

Nature Boy
03-16-2009, 02:32 PM
Bring back Shanahan!!

We love .500 records!!


OK, Bring Back Mikey! Bring Back Mikey! and a real GM! :lol:

.

Rex
03-16-2009, 02:32 PM
-

Bring Back Mikey!

.

Yeah.

Maybe he can build another defense like this one and go 7-9...or maybe 9-7 for the next 10 years with his handpicked QB.

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:33 PM
OK, Bring Back Mikey! Bring Back Mikey! and a real GM! :lol:

.

THAT I could accept.

Nature Boy
03-16-2009, 02:34 PM
Bring back Shanahan!!

We love .500 records!!


Yeah.

Maybe he can build another defense like this one and go 7-9...or maybe 9-7 for the next 10 years with his handpicked QB.


I guess you 2 rather have Matt Cassel QB this team as well.

.

Dr Velcro
03-16-2009, 02:34 PM
Hell...what's Reeves doing these days?

Rex
03-16-2009, 02:35 PM
I guess you 2 rather have Matt Cassel QB this team as well.

.

No.

I would prefer that the present QB act like an adult and show up for meetings and play football.

Cassel plays for KC so that option is not there.

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:35 PM
I guess you 2 rather have Matt Cassel QB this team as well.

.

Matt Cassel had a better record last year without a year of preparation in his first starting gig since high school than SHanahan did the last 3 years.

Dortoh
03-16-2009, 02:38 PM
Suffice IF NEEDED. Do I want it to come to that? Hell no. I'm first in line for this tiff between Cutler and McD to get resolved and watch Cutler grow into something special. BUT...if he insists on being traded because he's upset about something that happens EVERY DAY in the NFL and his response is to whine and demand that trade...then I dont want him on my team.

This is also my opinon.

I mostly want Jay and Mcdoogie to straighten up and act like freaking adults. If I were Bowlin those two would be locked in a broom closet until they could talk things out and then hug and make nice.

But, the way Jay is acting and has acted at times during the season I wonder if he really has the mental tuffness to really be a champion. Sure he has mad skills but I worry about his mental makeup.

BigAL56
03-16-2009, 02:40 PM
Matt Cassel had a better record last year without a year of preparation in his first starting gig since high school than SHanahan did the last 3 years.

My goodness. No individual is responsible for making the playoffs. It's a team sport. Offense, defense, and special teams. You can't judge a dude's success based on the team making the playoffs...especially when the defense was what 31st in the NFL? Cassel had a FAR better situation than Cutler did. Their defense could actually stop people. Should we put Shanny and Jay at linebacker?

WARHORSE
03-16-2009, 02:42 PM
My goodness. No individual is responsible for making the playoffs. It's a team sport. Offense, defense, and special teams. You can't judge a dude's success based on the team making the playoffs...especially when the defense was what 31st in the NFL? Cassel had a FAR better situation than Cutler did. Their defense could actually stop people. Should we put Shanny and Jay at linebacker?


Bubby Brister came in and drove the Cadillac for Elway too.

Undefeated he was............

claymore
03-16-2009, 02:43 PM
Matt Cassel had a better record last year without a year of preparation in his first starting gig since high school than SHanahan did the last 3 years.

How many points a game did his defense allow?

Northman
03-16-2009, 02:45 PM
My goodness. No individual is responsible for making the playoffs. It's a team sport. Offense, defense, and special teams. You can't judge a dude's success based on the team making the playoffs...especially when the defense was what 31st in the NFL? Cassel had a FAR better situation than Cutler did. Their defense could actually stop people. Should we put Shanny and Jay at linebacker?

Ill play linebacker if you want? Ill even take the base minimum.

Dr Velcro
03-16-2009, 02:46 PM
I am trolling....

I am sorry.

:sad:

shank
03-16-2009, 02:46 PM
How many points a game did his defense allow?

clay, what was their record the year before? it was really good if i remember correctly.. something like 13-3... or maybe 14-2... or maybe it was 15-1? i just can't seem to remember :whoknows:

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:47 PM
How many points a game did his defense allow?

At least your starting to understand that the "team" approach of the Patriots is much, much, much better than the "quarterback" approach of the Broncos the last few years.

BigAL56
03-16-2009, 02:48 PM
At least your starting to understand that the "team" approach of the Patriots is much, much, much better than the "quarterback" approach of the Broncos the last few years.

Please explain how we have taken the quarterback approach the past few years?

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:49 PM
Please explain how we have taken the quarterback approach the past few years?

Look at the state of our defense.

'Nuff said.

turftoad
03-16-2009, 02:49 PM
At least your starting to understand that the "team" approach of the Patriots is much, much, much better than the "quarterback" approach of the Broncos the last few years.

The Broncos are not the Patriots and McDanials is not Bill B.

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:50 PM
The Broncos are not the Patriots and McDanials is not Bill B.

Yea, unfortunately not for us.

Gamechanger
03-16-2009, 02:50 PM
and you guys see why you are getting laughed at? :noidea:

BigAL56
03-16-2009, 02:51 PM
Look at the state of our defense.

'Nuff said.

What does that have to do with jay cutler? That's not enough said. Make an argument

Den21vsBal19
03-16-2009, 02:51 PM
My goodness. No individual is responsible for making the playoffs. It's a team sport. Offense, defense, and special teams. You can't judge a dude's success based on the team making the playoffs...especially when the defense was what 31st in the NFL? Cassel had a FAR better situation than Cutler did. Their defense could actually stop people. Should we put Shanny and Jay at linebacker?
Whilst I'm not going to disagree with your general point, it has to be pointed out that if our 16th placed scoring offense had converted a few more of the opportunities that they'd created, maybe the crappy defense wouldn't have been such an issue :whoknows:

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:53 PM
What does that have to do with jay cutler? That's not enough said. Make an argument

Please don't make every argument about Jay Crytlied. He was merely the QB in the "Patriots team approach in comparison to Denver's quarterback approach".

Please try and keep up.

Gamechanger
03-16-2009, 02:54 PM
if it isn't broke don't fix it? :noidea:

turftoad
03-16-2009, 02:54 PM
Yea, unfortunately not for us.

Well then, maybe you start being a Pats fan then. Wouldn't hurt my feelings.

Wow.....

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:55 PM
Well then, maybe you start being a Pats fan then. Wouldn't hurt my feelings.

Wow. Way to completely miss the boat on that one. Are you getting seasick?

CoachChaz
03-16-2009, 02:56 PM
Ill play linebacker if you want? Ill even take the base minimum.

I will too, but if McD listens to an offer for me, I'm going to the media and demanding the trade take place.

shank
03-16-2009, 02:57 PM
Wow. Way to completely miss the boat on that one. Are you getting seasick?

how in the hell would he get seasick if he missed the boat? psht

silkamilkamonico
03-16-2009, 02:58 PM
how in the hell would he get seasick if he missed the boat? psht

He would see 2 boats, and jump into the one that was his blurred vision. You've never been sea sick have you?

shank
03-16-2009, 03:09 PM
He would see 2 boats, and jump into the one that was his blurred vision. You've never been sea sick have you?

no, i always missed the boat.

Dr Velcro
03-16-2009, 03:11 PM
and you guys see why you are getting laughed at? :noidea:

Have you noticed that when you point out how ridiculous the posting is getting....

Nobody replies, lol.

I see you, Gamechanger. :salute:

claymore
03-16-2009, 03:13 PM
Have you noticed that when you point out how ridiculous the posting is getting....

Nobody replies, lol.

I see you, Gamechanger. :salute:

If the new Colts Coach was trying to Trade Peyton we would see you or GC for a month. :D

DallasChief
03-16-2009, 03:14 PM
If the new Colts Coach was trying to Trade Peyton we would see you or GC for a month. :D

Nice, now you're comparing Cutler with Manning. You are delusional.