I am going to regret this but

[Dortoh]

I know I know but a source I have (who has been fairly good not perfect) is telling me we are making a play for Peppers.

No link no anything take if for what it is worth.

:listen:

[DallasChief]

Cutler for Peppers!

[Ziggy]

Marshall and Sheff for Peppers.

[broncofaninfla]

If it's true we'll have to trade the kitchen sink to get him. Blue Run might have been onto something

[Dortoh]

I'm hearing 2 players and a day 1 pick.

[DallasChief]

I'm hearing 2 players and a day 1 pick.

Cutler and Marshall and the 12th pick for Peppers.

Sounds like a good deal.

[Thnikkaman]

Cutler and Marshall and the 12th pick for Peppers.

Sounds like a good deal.

Its a 3 way trade with the Chefs for Cassel.

[Dortoh]

Cutler and Marshall and the 12th pick for Peppers.

Sounds like a good deal.

:tsk:

[Dortoh]

I knew I was going to regret this :shocked:

[DallasChief]

Its a 3 way trade with the Chefs for Cassel.

Now you're talking. :elefant:

[DallasChief]

I knew I was going to regret this :shocked:

I'm going to get on Madden right now and test this trade out.

[Ziggy]

I'm hearing 2 players and a day 1 pick.

I'm still leary about aquiring Peppers and giving him a big contract to play a position that he's never played before. If this were to happen, it would be a gutsy move, which might ultimately decide the new coaches long-term fate.

[nj10]

From your sig:


2009 Mock Draft:

7. Bernard Scott- RB Abilene Christian

Hell no! You guys think Marshall can't stay out of trouble!!! This guy will be out of the league in 2 years...

[CoachChaz]

My guess is Sheff could be one of the names, but I'd have to think Moss would need to be the other if they are giving up Peppers. However...I just dont see this happening at all when it comes to the money.

[Ziggy]

Cutler and Marshall and the 12th pick for Peppers.
Sounds like a good deal.


I don't think it's going to happen. Carl Peterson doesn't work for the Broncos. :D

[Traveler]

Are you trying to start a rumor similar to the one started at the Freak?:listen:

[Dortoh]

I'm going to get on Madden right now and test this trade out.

The key to Madden is add a 7th rounder that makes all trades work out

Like Webster and a 7th rounder for Peppers :laugh:

[Dortoh]

Are you trying to start a rumor similar to the one started at the Freak?:listen:

Was this started at the freak?

[Ziggy]

From your sig:



Hell no! You guys think Marshall can't stay out of trouble!!! This guy will be out of the league in 2 years...

I believe you there. I didn't find out about his arrests until after i made my mock. It's a January mock though, so I'm keeping it just to see how my early predictions pan out.

[LRtagger]

Our first plus Scheff for their 3rd and Peppers

[DallasChief]

I don't think it's going to happen. Carl Peterson doesn't work for the Broncos. :D

I don't think Carl Peterson works for anyone right now.

[CoachChaz]

Our first plus Scheff for their 3rd and Peppers

I'll pretend I'm Carolina's GM for a minute...


DENIED!!

[Traveler]

Was this started at the freak?

I don't know. Don't frequent that site. Someone there started a rumor about Cutler that spread through the internet like wildfire.

[Dortoh]

No real word on actual names but a CB and RB and late 1st day pick with a pick coming back.

[LRtagger]

No real word on actual names but a CB and RB and late 1st day pick with a pick coming back.

Champ and Selvin and pick #48 for Peppers and pick #59

[Dortoh]

Champ and Selvin and pick #48 for Peppers and pick #59

Dont know but I screwed that up. I thought round 3 was still day 1 but I guess its day 2 now???

[Mike]

No real word on actual names but a CB and RB and late 1st day pick with a pick coming back.

Why would Carolina need a RB? :confused:

[Traveler]

Why would Carolina need a RB? :confused:

Especially one of ours.

[Bill Devaroe]

My sources have informed me that we are trading Cutler, Mc Daniels, and Marshall's fiance to New England for Bill Bellichick.

[Dortoh]

Why would Carolina need a RB? :confused:

Or a CB to be honest not sure this makes any sense. Just trying to let you know what I'm hearing.

[BroncoNut]

who is peppers?

[Drill-N-Fill]

It would make sense for Scheff, Dr. Doom, and a 2nd rounder. Not saying I like giving up a 2nd...

[claymore]

Or a CB to be honest not sure this makes any sense. Just trying to let you know what I'm hearing.

Champ and Marshal would be sweet.

[Mike]

Or a CB to be honest not sure this makes any sense. Just trying to let you know what I'm hearing.

Not doubting you. ;)

They just seem set at RB. Maybe FB? But I don't know what sets they run and if they utilize the FB.

[Dortoh]

Not doubting you. ;)

They just seem set at RB. Maybe FB? But I don't know what sets they run and if they utilize the FB.

latest update

I know Hillis is part of the "offer" and a 3rd the rest I dont think is settled. But Peppers and a return pick is being requested.

[Dortoh]

I have meetings the rest of the day. If I hear anything else and can I will report it.

Hopefully something comes out in the news to back up this info so I dont look retarded :laugh:

Ok I have someone from heres cell # so if I hear more I'll text them the update.

[TXBRONC]

Dont know but I screwed that up. I thought round 3 was still day 1 but I guess its day 2 now???

Yeah it's 2nd day pick but that's still not bad. Ryan Harris was a 3rd rounder.

[Ziggy]

Champ being involved would make sense. The salary absorbed by the Panthers would help pay for Peppers salary.

[LRtagger]

latest update

I know Hillis is part of the "offer" and a 3rd the rest I dont think is settled. But Peppers and a return pick is being requested.

As much as I would hate to lose Hillis, leveraging a 7th round pick for a serious difference maker on D would be wow. A real tribute to the Goodmans.

[Buff]

who is peppers?

The D-Lineman who intercepted Plummer in the endzone and ran it back 98 yards before Rod Smith caught him on the 2 yard line-- barely. Dude is an athletic freak.

But I'm with Ziggy, I don't know about signing him to a monster deal to play a position he's never played before. Not to mention the draft picks we'd have to sacrifice.

[CoachChaz]

The D-Lineman who intercepted Plummer in the endzone and ran it back 98 yards before Rod Smith caught him on the 2 yard line-- barely. Dude is an athletic freak.

But I'm with Ziggy, I don't know about signing him to a monster deal to play a position he's never played before. Not to mention the draft picks we'd have to sacrifice.


I think these two statements are what we need to consider. I personally have no doubt that he could be successful as a rush LB. The transition from DE to OLB is actually easier from the stance of rushing the QB. How he does in coverage is the question, but Carolina used alot of stunts with him dropping in to a zone, much like Miami use to do with Taylor, and he did well.

I look at it this way...one way or another, it's going to cost us to fix the defense. If Peppers was coming out of college today with people knowing what he can do, he would be the first player chosen. I have no problem giving up a #1 pick for him

[Buff]

I think these two statements are what we need to consider. I personally have no doubt that he could be successful as a rush LB. The transition from DE to OLB is actually easier from the stance of rushing the QB. How he does in coverage is the question, but Carolina used alot of stunts with him dropping in to a zone, much like Miami use to do with Taylor, and he did well.

I look at it this way...one way or another, it's going to cost us to fix the defense. If Peppers was coming out of college today with people knowing what he can do, he would be the first player chosen. I have no problem giving up a #1 pick for him

If we could trade our #12 for him straight up, then yeah, I'd give it up too... But if we're talking about a 1st and a 3rd, or any combination of multiple picks, then I think you have to start to weigh paying 1 player vs. 3 or 4 that you could have for that same price.

Especially on a defense that has so many holes to fill. We're not talking about a playoff calibur defense just looking for one or two players to get them to the next level. This is full on rebuilding.

[sanluis]

I'm hearing 2 players and a day 1 pick.

forget it. He's too old to give up a day one pick. Isn't he like 30 and played in the 4-3 his whole career? Did he have a bad shoulder as well?

I would also like to know who the two players are and then a conditional pick based on his performance. That might be OK.

[xzn]

If they'd take Doom, Hillis and our 2nd for Peppers I'd be surprised, pleasantly!

I've seen so many rumors lately that I'll wait and see.

I'd be jacked if Julius somehow put on orange swoosh pants...

[underrated29]

hmmm??? HEre are the options i see maybe playing out if this is legit- not doubting dortoh, but still like you said, its a rumor.

hillis, champ and 3rd/4th for peppers and a 2nd.


Hillis, scheff, 2nd for peppy and a 5th/6th.


I dont really know if any of those are fair. I really dont want us to trade champ though, so please lets keep him jay and brandon- the rest are up for grabs.......oh wait, we dont have anyone else worth two shyts! Dang.

[jrelway]

champ, selvin, scheffler, torrain, and our first and 3rd pick for peppers and jonathan stewart. hehe

[underrated29]

Something to think about Dortoh. This might be pretty real. Why else would we be signing all these RB's if we werent prepared to send out hillis.

nothing major here, but a little food for thought.

[underrated29]

champ, selvin, scheffler, torrain, and our first and 3rd pick for peppers and jonathan stewart. hehe

Minus champ- DEAL!

[xzn]

We just spent the first weeks of FA re-tooling the secondary with veterans. I can't see us turning around and trading the one building block we have in that secondary for anyone.

Dumerville is a solid 43 DE and would make sense as a replacement, although a downgrade he's still a starting quality player, for JP.

Another player and 1st day pick is reasonable but I don't think Champ would be the "sweetener".

[WARHORSE]

:coffee:Ive heard the rumours are true.......but Josh McDaniels is trading himself, Xanders and the 12th pick for Peppers..............

[CoachChaz]

I would give up our 1st and 3rd for Peppers and a 4th. We can make the argument of having 2 or 3 or 10 players for the same price, but I'd rather have one proven dominant force than a roster full of Websters.

Peppers just turned 29 this January.

[BigDaddyBronco]

I would give up our 1st and 3rd for Peppers and a 4th. We can make the argument of having 2 or 3 or 10 players for the same price, but I'd rather have one proven dominant force than a roster full of Websters.

Peppers just turned 29 this January.
Peppers is a great pass rusher and good against the run, but can he cover anybody? He played basketball well, so I'm thinking he has the athletic ability to do it, but he's never done it before.

That seems like a big risk for a 1st and 3rd.

[xzn]

Peppers is in his prime and proven star. I personally do not have any doubt that he would be athletic enough to play from a two point instead of a three point stance and be able to take zone drops often enough to keep offenses honest.

Does anyone doubt he can edge rush from OLB?

Plus we are reportedly still going to use 43 at times and he is 100% proven in that aspect!

Only questions are if this is a fantasy, and if not, at what asking price...

[sanluis]

I would give up our 1st and 3rd for Peppers and a 4th. We can make the argument of having 2 or 3 or 10 players for the same price, but I'd rather have one proven dominant force than a roster full of Websters.

Peppers just turned 29 this January.

That is a lot to give up! But he is proven in the 4-3 and would be a nice addition to your pass rush. JP on one side and doomer on the other looks like a nice combo.

Looks like JP is still in his prime.

[DenBronx]

sheff, dume and hillis all seem like players we could deal. i really like all of them but none of them are a wow factor at their position. sheff is too injury prone, dume is too one demensional and hillis is god trade bait.

maybe send dume and sheff with our 3rd. id like that.

[CoachChaz]

Peppers is a great pass rusher and good against the run, but can he cover anybody? He played basketball well, so I'm thinking he has the athletic ability to do it, but he's never done it before.

That seems like a big risk for a 1st and 3rd.

Carolina drops him into zone at times and he's seemed to do okay in that area. My TV time with Carolina is limited, but 4 INT's for a 4-3 DE is pretty decent.

[CoachChaz]

I see all this talk of Sheff, Doom and Hillis, but why?

What would be so enticing to Carolina about an oft-injured, non-blocking TE...an undersized DE that cant play the run and a fullback to run with 2 stud tailbacks...that they would give up a mega-stud pass rusher for them?

[xzn]

I think Mike Nolan knows what he needs in an OLB.... IF this happens it meant that our DC thinks JP can be effective in that role.

As long as we are not bringing him in to play 4 technique DE in a 34. That'd be a waste!

[underrated29]

Carolina drops him into zone at times and he's seemed to do okay in that area. My TV time with Carolina is limited, but 4 INT's for a 4-3 DE is pretty decent.



I think thats more than our whole team had last year. IF we got peppy and didnt give up champ, jay or brandon- i really think Mcd could have our team turnerd around pretty dam quick. (assuming we have a solid draft to boot).

[muse]

Doom would make sense. We've heard that Moss is officially moving to OLB but nothing on Doom. Obviously, he's not going to be a 3-4 end so at the moment we can only assume that he's going to be used in our 4-3 packages. I doubt he'd want to stay in that role and would command too much of a salary to re-sign next year, so we may as well get what we can take for him now.

Scheff looks like he's gone this year or next already which is a shame. But if Maccy D can't use him, then what can you do? Hillis is the only back worth squat in our backfield right now but it doesn't make that much sense seeing as the have Stewart and Williams, not to mention a solid FB in Brad Hoover. And then there's Champ...I'd really rather not trade him especially since our secondary looks much more problematic if we do. Not to mention the fact that more than a few guys won't be happy about it.

We may end up trading DJ - after all, McDaniels did say that he's excited about working with him which seems to be Patriot-speak for "you're being traded".

I'm intrigued by this story though - it'd further bolster the idea that Blue Run is who he says he is...

[CoachChaz]

I think thats more than our whole team had last year. IF we got peppy and didnt give up champ, jay or brandon- i really think Mcd could have our team turnerd around pretty dam quick. (assuming we have a solid draft to boot).

Exactly. Keep a core and fill in the gaps. A defense with Dawkins, Peppers, Champ and a motivated DJ goes a long way to making things happen.

By the way, the 4INT's for Peppers is a career number. Still more than 99% of the other DE's

[underrated29]

Exactly.

By the way, the 4INT's for Peppers is a career number. Still more than 99% of the other DE's



And still more than our whole team last year......Not really sure if thats true, but i bet its like 30% of what our whole team did last year.


Man it would be sick to get him here.

[SoCalImport]

At risk of sounding lame. Obviously Peppers could be a huge boost for this developing defense, but I'd hate to give up Hillis right now. I love the kid as a Bronco. Not to mention the 4.8 or so YPC. Then Again with the Jordan signing, maybe the writing's on the wall "Sigh"

[xzn]

Okay, listen, I "love me some Hillis" too... but if we can get a franchise quality front seven defender for a guy who we took in the SEVENTH ROUND last year I'm going to blow out my achilles tendon running to sign that contract!

[broncohead]

Okay, listen, I "love me some Hillis" too... but if we can get a franchise quality front seven defender for a guy who we took in the SEVENTH ROUND last year I'm going to blow out my achilles tendon running to sign that contract!

There is more to it then him just being drafted in the first round. He is a good character guy that can play. Very versitile. Though it would suck giving him up for those reasons it would help the team.

[sanluis]

And still more than our whole team last year......Not really sure if thats true, but i bet its like 30% of what our whole team did last year.


Man it would be sick to get him here.

Well, let's hope it doesn't happen !!!:lol::lol:

[xzn]

Leveraging a seventh round pick for Julius Peppers . . . 'nuf said!

[broncofaninfla]

Something to think about Dortoh. This might be pretty real. Why else would we be signing all these RB's if we werent prepared to send out hillis.

nothing major here, but a little food for thought.

Good point and it makes sense. That being said though I really like Hillis and think he can be a real attribute to our offense with the different skills he brings. I'd hate to see him go but Peppers in the mix would make it something to ponder.

[xzn]

Guys, the greatest FB in the history of the universe for a starting, multiple Pro Bowl rush linebacker is still a steal for the team that gets the QB killer.

Just sayin'

[broncofaninfla]

Leveraging a seventh round pick for Julius Peppers . . . 'nuf said!

Also says just how skilled and how much potetial Hillis has.

[CoachChaz]

I'm kind of in awe that there would be any hesitation in giving up a 7th round fullback that had 1.5 good games before getting injured as a rookie.

I'll agree he has some really nice tools, but we're talking about arguably the best DE in the game. We know what a DE is, right? That position where we havent had much success and very little consistency or success from in God knows how long. That position that provides us a legitimate pass rush.

[CoachChaz]

Also says just how skilled and how much potetial Hillis has.

Yes and no. Let's not pretend Hillis is the centerpiece of what Denver is giving up here

[TXBRONC]

forget it. He's too old to give up a day one pick. Isn't he like 30 and played in the 4-3 his whole career? Did he have a bad shoulder as well?

I would also like to know who the two players are and then a conditional pick based on his performance. That might be OK.

Jason Taylor was even further along in his career when he made the switch and that turned out pretty good for him.

[broncohead]

Guys, the greatest FB in the history of the universe for a starting, multiple Pro Bowl rush linebacker is still a steal for the team that gets the QB killer.

Just sayin'

It's not going to be a straight up trade...

[xzn]

I love Hillis.

I also love a good In-N-Out Cheeseburger.

If I can trade a burger for a filet mignon though . . . done deal!

[broncofaninfla]

I'll be the first to admit I have a man crush on Hillis and hope he stays BUT no hesitation, I'd pull the deal if I were the GM. No way a Hillis for Peppers deal would ever fly though. Now Hillis packaged with some picks could be a possibility.

[xzn]

It's not going to be a straight up trade...

DUH.

I'm just commenting on the people who are talking like giving up Hillis would be a deal breaker. :eek:

[xzn]

Time for a re-set.

IF THIS IS TRUE AT ALL.

What was reported by dortoh is that Hillis, a Third and another unknown player are being offered for JP and another pick.

[broncohead]

DUH.

I'm just commenting on the people who are talking like giving up Hillis would be a deal breaker. :eek:

No question I would do it but not with a 1st and would hesitate with a 2nd.

[CoachChaz]

Take a 1st and 3rd and take Hillis, Moss, Crowder...whatever. I'll send all the dead weight for a stud like Peppers and a 4th

[CoachChaz]

No question I would do it but not with a 1st and would hesitate with a 2nd.

What are you going to get in the 1st or 2nd that is going to equate to Peppers?

[claymore]

What are you going to get in the 1st or 2nd that is going to equate to Peppers?

I think Marshall and Champ seals the deal without losing a pick.

[WARHORSE]

I would give up our 1st and 3rd for Peppers and a 4th. We can make the argument of having 2 or 3 or 10 players for the same price, but I'd rather have one proven dominant force than a roster full of Websters.

Peppers just turned 29 this January.


1st and a 3rd??

The 12th pick is plenty enough. They dont have a first rounder and they dont really want to pay Peppers 17 million for one year.

Peppers in a rush LB role where we could move him all over the place would be some instant QB pressure.

Id have happy feet.

[broncohead]

What are you going to get in the 1st or 2nd that is going to equate to Peppers?

Peppers is on the downside of his career. I give him 2 more decent years and with the change in scheme and coaches it'll play a factor in his play. We won't get anyone in the 1st or 2nd as dominant right away but I would rather take my chances on a draft pick that could be here longer then an aging DE.

[MOtorboat]

Peppers is on the downside of his career. I give him 2 more decent years and with the change in scheme and coaches it'll play a factor in his play. We won't get anyone in the 1st or 2nd as dominant right away but I would rather take my chances on a draft pick that could be here longer then an aging DE.

He's 29. Not 35.

[CoachChaz]

1st and a 3rd??

The 12th pick is plenty enough. They dont have a first rounder and they dont really want to pay Peppers 17 million for one year.

Peppers in a rush LB role where we could move him all over the place would be some instant QB pressure.

Id have happy feet.

Yeah, I'd add the 3rd. it's not like we're talking about a DE that is coming off of the only good season he's ever had. This is the definition of a pass rushing athlete that can completely change an OC's gameplan the way Champ can.

[broncohead]

He's 29. Not 35.

29 isn't young in the NFL...

[CoachChaz]

Peppers is on the downside of his career. I give him 2 more decent years and with the change in scheme and coaches it'll play a factor in his play. We won't get anyone in the 1st or 2nd as dominant right away but I would rather take my chances on a draft pick that could be here longer then an aging DE.

I think you are confusing Peppers with Taylor.

And if Peppers produces as long as Taylor has, we'll have a stud for 5 more years.

[MOtorboat]

29 isn't young in the NFL...

We're talking about a player who's going to play for 15 years, barring injury, not a flash in the pan type of guy.

[broncohead]

I think you are confusing Peppers with Taylor.

And if Peppers produces as long as Taylor has, we'll have a stud for 5 more years.

Another thing I would consider is his contract. How long is he locked up for and how much is his contract worth?

[xzn]

29 is "in your prime".

4-5 years, barring injury, at peak physical ability with experience.

IDEAL.

Add another 2-3 years with diminishing skills but even more experience.

Age = non-issue in this case

[MOtorboat]

Another thing I would consider is his contract. How long is he locked up for and how much is his contract worth?

He's been franchised. You'd need to negotiate a long term deal with him, or he'd be here just one year. Most of the time, when you make a trade like that, you have a deal negotiated in advance.

[TXBRONC]

29 isn't young in the NFL...

For defensive end that's not bad, because he can still be super productive for at least another 4 or 5 years.

[WARHORSE]

I see all this talk of Sheff, Doom and Hillis, but why?

What would be so enticing to Carolina about an oft-injured, non-blocking TE...an undersized DE that cant play the run and a fullback to run with 2 stud tailbacks...that they would give up a mega-stud pass rusher for them?

Look, when Scheff is playing, he can flat out catch the ball. They dont have anything even close to his ability as far as a receiving threat coming from that position.

As for Hillis..........his HANDS are what makes him so valuable. And the dude is a PLAYMAKER.

Doomerville is a rush specific player, but he has value in pressuring the QB.


A first rounder will peel Peppers out of their hands.

Look at all the LBs we have on tap. Dooms might not be here for OTAs.

[MOtorboat]

Look, when Scheff is playing, he can flat out catch the ball. They dont have anything even close to his ability as far as a receiving threat coming from that position.

As for Hillis..........his HANDS are what makes him so valuable. And the dude is a PLAYMAKER.

Doomerville is a rush specific player, but he has value in pressuring the QB.


A first rounder will peel Peppers out of their hands.

Look at all the LBs we have on tap. Dooms might not be here for OTAs.

I think you're overvaluing our players, a little, war.

[CoachChaz]

29 isn't young in the NFL...

Not for a RB, but most DE's hit their prime around now

2008 Sack leaders and age

Ware - 26
Porter - 31
Abraham - 30
Harrison - 30
Allen - 26
Peppers - 29
Tuck - 25
Williams - 24
Woodley - 24
Mathis - 28
Freeney - 29
Howard - 32
Kampman - 29

[broncohead]

He's a dominant player but he is on the bubble to start seeing deminishing skills. From what I understand he is a good locker room guy. I just think giving up the 1st rd. pick for him would be a good move. A 2nd and a couple players like Dume, Crowder, Hillis, or Schef wouldn't be bad.

[CoachChaz]

Look, when Scheff is playing, he can flat out catch the ball. They dont have anything even close to his ability as far as a receiving threat coming from that position.

As for Hillis..........his HANDS are what makes him so valuable. And the dude is a PLAYMAKER.

Doomerville is a rush specific player, but he has value in pressuring the QB.


A first rounder will peel Peppers out of their hands.

Look at all the LBs we have on tap. Dooms might not be here for OTAs.

WHEN Sheff plays is the key, but even then, we have better weapons for the new offense. DOOM is essentially being replaced by Peppers in this case, so that's a non-issue. Hillis is a talent, but again...where does he fit into this offense and is he going to produce more on offense than Peppers will on defense? Not a chance. No one will be gameplanning against Hillis, Doom or Sheff.

[xzn]

The RUMOR that was conveyed, by dortoh, from an unnamed "source" was:

Hillis

3rd Round Pick

Unknown player

For JP and additional draft pick

NO MENTION OF US GIVING UP #12

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

Its a 3 way trade with the Chefs for Cassel.

Not exactly but close..its a 4 team trade where we get vick, peppers and carolinas 1st, cutler and marshall and our 3rd go to carolina and atlanta gets sheff.

[CoachChaz]

He's a dominant player but he is on the bubble to start seeing deminishing skills. From what I understand he is a good locker room guy. I just think giving up the 1st rd. pick for him would be a good move. A 2nd and a couple players like Dume, Crowder, Hillis, or Schef wouldn't be bad.


And this statement is proven by what? The fact he just had the highest sack total and best season of his career?

[CoachChaz]

The RUMOR that was conveyed, by dortoh, from an unnamed "source" was:

Hillis

3rd Round Pick

Unknown player

For JP and additional draft pick

NO MENTION OF US GIVING UP #12

No...but I would give up #12 in a heartbeat for a player like Peppers.

[xzn]

No...but I would give up #12 in a heartbeat for a player like Peppers.

Coach, I don't disagree but that is not what was "reported". :listen:

[DenBronx]

i personally think peppers has alot left in the tank...like 5-8 years left. the dude has a great ethic and is extremely athletic. he would instantly improve our pass rush without question. if we gave up our 1st for him i would have no problem with that. who in the 1st is going to make that much of an impact on our team anyway and we still would have to pay the rookie a large contract anyway.

denver trades: 1st rounder and sheffler.
carolina trades: 3rd rounder and peppers.

[Ziggy]

Homerism abounds as usual. Put yourself in Carolina's shoes for a minute. Would you trade one of the top 3 pass rushing DE's in the NFL for a 7th round RB/FB that competely tore his hamstring in the last game he played, and an oft injured TE? Even with a draft pick, it's not going to happen. Add in Dumerville's name. He's an undersized pass rush specialist that gets pushed around in the running game.

If it were Denver trading Peppers for this combination of players and a draft pick to another team, folks in here would be going nuts. Champ is one of my favorite players, but I have no problem whatsoever giving up a 12 millon dollar CB for an impact player in the front 7. Building a defense front to back instead of the other way around not only makes sense, but it's a long-proven technique.

[WARHORSE]

Yeah, I'd add the 3rd. it's not like we're talking about a DE that is coming off of the only good season he's ever had. This is the definition of a pass rushing athlete that can completely change an OC's gameplan the way Champ can.


Im not doubting his ability. I just think we can get him for the 12th pick.

Or the second and some players.........or third.


Scheff, Hillis, Doom and a 3rd for Peppers and a 5th.:coffee:


I got my poker face on.

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

Not exactly but close..its a 4 team trade where we get vick, peppers and carolinas 1st, cutler and marshall and our 3rd go to carolina and atlanta gets sheff.

from what i am hearing a 5th team may want in on this deal..lol

[WARHORSE]

Homerism abounds as usual. Put yourself in Carolina's shoes for a minute. Would you trade one of the top 3 pass rushing DE's in the NFL for a 7th round RB/FB that competely tore his hamstring in the last game he played, and an oft injured TE? Even with a draft pick, it's not going to happen. Add in Dumerville's name. He's an undersized pass rush specialist that gets pushed around in the running game.

If it were Denver trading Peppers for this combination of players and a draft pick to another team, folks in here would be going nuts. Champ is one of my favorite players, but I have no problem whatsoever giving up a 12 millon dollar CB for an impact player in the front 7. Building a defense front to back instead of the other way around not only makes sense, but it's a long-proven technique.


Peppers doesnt want to be there.

They dont want to pay franchise salary for a single year.


But they suffer in the passing game, and both Scheff and Hillis are awesome receiving threats. Dont think that they arent appealing to Carolina.

[Ziggy]

Peppers doesnt want to be there.

They dont want to pay franchise salary for a single year.


But they suffer in the passing game, and both Scheff and Hillis are awesome receiving threats. Dont think that they arent appealing to Carolina.

I always loved your optimism War, but we're going to have to disagree on the value of Sheff and Hillis. I'm a huge fan of both, but they still have a lot to prove in this league. While I'm sure that they are both appealing to Carolina, it doesn't mean that they are going to give up a 29 year old freak of nature pass rusher for them and a 2nd or 3rd round pick. I'd be jumping for joy if they did, but I just don't see it happening.

[xzn]

Carolina signed Jordan Gross and Franchised Peppers.

Peppers does not want to sign there long term, for whatever reason.

It is in Carolina's interest to trade Peppers for the best deal they can get.

It would also free up a huge amount of cap space for them.

It is possible that what we are offering is the best deal out there for them, I hope so!

[Traveler]

Carolina signed Jordan Gross and Franchised Peppers.

Peppers does not want to sign there long term, for whatever reason.

It is in Carolina's interest to trade Peppers for the best deal they can get.

It would also free up a huge amount of cap space for them.

It is possible that what we are offering is the best deal out there for them, I hope so!

Peppers does hold some sway in that he didn't sign his franchise tender. Meaning he can (kind of) dictate where he goes because the team trying to get him must first sign him to a new contract.

[Foochacho]

Peppers does hold some sway in that he didn't sign his franchise tender. Meaning he can (kind of) dictate where he goes because the team trying to get must first sign him to a new contract.

This is definitely true because who would sell the farm to have him for only one year with an outrageous salary.

[WARHORSE]

I always loved your optimism War, but we're going to have to disagree on the value of Sheff and Hillis. I'm a huge fan of both, but they still have a lot to prove in this league. While I'm sure that they are both appealing to Carolina, it doesn't mean that they are going to give up a 29 year old freak of nature pass rusher for them and a 2nd or 3rd round pick. I'd be jumping for joy if they did, but I just don't see it happening.


Well, I asked this at a couple of Panther boards.

http://www.carolinahuddle.com/forum/carolina-panthers/9202-carolina-denver-trade-talks-peppers-rumor.html#post1967262

Heres the first response:

I could live with that...depends on how healthy scheffler is. Shame you dont have any defensive talent to give us.
__________________

[Traveler]

Well, I asked this at a couple of Panther boards.

http://www.carolinahuddle.com/forum/carolina-panthers/9202-carolina-denver-trade-talks-peppers-rumor.html#post1967262

Heres the first response:

I could live with that...depends on how healthy scheffler is. Shame you dont have any defensive talent to give us.
__________________

I see you are really taking Hillis up over there!:beer:

[Ziggy]

... and that the "I could live with that" mentality doesn't seem to be the majority concensus.

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

i would assume peppers will command close to what haynesworth got.

average of the top 5 linebackers and defensive end is close to 9 mil. seems feasible...

[LRtagger]

Lolololololloolo


how bout, take out hillis and change that pick to a first and 3rd rounder.

Peppers
for
scheffler + 2009 1st rounder + 2009 3rd rounder/2010 2nd rounder

[weazel]

scheffler, marshall, cutler, 1st round pick and the rights to elway merchandise profits!

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

Lolololololloolo

throw in a few cycles of HGH and we have a deal

[WARHORSE]

... and that the "I could live with that" mentality doesn't seem to be the majority concensus.


More guys like it than not like it.

[CoachChaz]

Well, I asked this at a couple of Panther boards.

http://www.carolinahuddle.com/forum/carolina-panthers/9202-carolina-denver-trade-talks-peppers-rumor.html#post1967262

Heres the first response:

I could live with that...depends on how healthy scheffler is. Shame you dont have any defensive talent to give us.
__________________

I think this is funny as hell.

[cuzz4169]

If this was really happening wouldnt it be on a website some where? Some sports writer wouldve gotten wind of this and posted it some where. I believe it when I see it. But I would love peppers dude is a beast.

[Traveler]

From a poster on their forum...

A friend inside the Broncos organization just sent me a text saying this rumor actually has some teeth. Apparently Brian Xanders has been on the phone with Hurney part of the morning. The hold up seems to be over players, not draft picks. The Panthers seem interested in plucking one of Denver's young WRs.

I'll update if I get anymore info.

http://www.carolinahuddle.com/forum/9202-carolina-denver-trade-talks-peppers-rumor-6.html

[underrated29]

Alright guys, if its true yeha- even if it doesnt work out. But dont make stuff up pretending it to be true. Not saying you are Trav., but i dont need to get my hopes up for something that was just someone playing around.

[Traveler]

Alright guys, if its true yeha- even if it doesnt work out. But dont make stuff up pretending it to be true. Not saying you are Trav., but i dont need to get my hopes up for something that was just someone playing around.

It's not me. I wouldn't play like that. Just added the link.

[Ziggy]

Send em Marshall in the deal. They can deal with his off field issues and upcoming contract negotiations.

[underrated29]

Send em Marshall in the deal. They can deal with his off field issues and upcoming contract negotiations.



If we do that, then we better sign TO to replace him...Dont get me wrong, eddie, gaffney,stokley, cjax isnt bad, but our offense was rolling with a solid WR opposite ed.

[CoachChaz]

From a poster on their forum...

A friend inside the Broncos organization just sent me a text saying this rumor actually has some teeth. Apparently Brian Xanders has been on the phone with Hurney part of the morning. The hold up seems to be over players, not draft picks. The Panthers seem interested in plucking one of Denver's young WRs.

I'll update if I get anymore info.

http://www.carolinahuddle.com/forum/9202-carolina-denver-trade-talks-peppers-rumor-6.html

Hmmm...would I part with Marshall or Royal for Peppers...

On one hand we have a solid talent in Marshall, but always gamble on whether he'll ever be allowed to play a full season and if so...how many balls will he drop.

On the other, we have a nice compliment in Royal, but is he or isnt he a one year wonder?

Tough call, but I think I could be swayed to part with Marshall if I absolutely had to.

[LRtagger]

LOL these guys are killing me


peppers and a fourth rounder for brandon Marshall and thirteenth overall pick

[CoachChaz]

If we do that, then we better sign TO to replace him...Dont get me wrong, eddie, gaffney,stokley, cjax isnt bad, but our offense was rolling with a solid WR opposite ed.

I dont know. The NE offense made a star out of Welker and even made Gaffney look good. I dont know that we need 2 total studs.

[Traveler]

Eh mon . All I can say is that you have to give someting of worth to get someting.

[ikillz0mbies]

I'd rather part with Marshall. He's got way too many off-field issues. The drops doesn't help either. The only thing I would miss would be his size that can create a lot of mismatch against defenders.

I'd prefer to keep Royal because he plays much bigger than his size. Even though he is small, the guy plays physical football. He's fast and has good hands. He can even run the ball. Royal is more versatile than Marshall, which I think McDaniels can properly utilize.

[OrangeHoof]

Marshall and Sheff for Peppers.

I could see Carolina being intrigued by that. I'm not sure they'd really want Sheff but B-Marsh would certainly add something to their offense opposite Steve Smith. And if it doesn't work out, they've found a roomie for Rae Carruth.

[ikillz0mbies]

I could see Marshall and a combination of Dumervil/Moss/Crowder plus a pick for Peppers. From their perspective, they are giving away one of the best defensive players in the game. I would think they want defense in return. They could gamble and see if any of those 3 can pan out for them. Or they could even want Champ + Marshall. I just don't see them trading without getting defense in return.

[underrated29]

Remember we have the upper hand here. Peppy does NOT want to play there anymore, they dont want to pay him that much money...

Peppers is one of the best DE/LB whatever he is in the game.

marshall is not yet, but can be one of the best WR in the game.


So to me they cancel each other out, brandon is young and not even peaked, but has some field issue. peppy is expensive as hell and is older, but a proven bad ass.

So then to me the clincher would be exchanging picks and maybe tossing in dooms or moss or someone small.


I would ideally like to see us keep Jay,Brandon,Champ and our #1- if we can land peppy without losing any of those i will be pumped like dream does wests butt.

[Grover]

CoachChaz:
I dont know. The NE offense made a star out of Welker and even made Gaffney look good. I dont know that we need 2 total studs.


Yeah, but Cutler is no Cassel! :D

I'm not keen on giving up any of our Receivers. But I feel that Royal has more long term potential in this new offense than does Marshall. Plus I gotta say that I'll take Royal's maturity level over Marshall's any time any place.

[CoachChaz]

Yeah, but Cutler is no Cassel! :D

I'm not keen on giving up any of our Receivers. But I feel that Royal has more long term potential in this new offense than does Marshall. Plus I gotta say that I'll take Royal's maturity level over Marshall's any time any place.

I agree. I think I'd stick with Royal as well.

[Simple Jaded]

I would consider the defense the Panthers may potentially run, guy's like Marcus Thomas/Elvis Dumervil/Wesley Woodyard may not have much trade value on their own but in a Multiple Player and draft pick package deal it would make sense for Ron Meeks Tampa2 defense, who you would think might be making sweeping changes also.

Imo, Marshall might be un-tradable at the moment, so if there is anything to this rumor I'd say they're interested Royal or a conditional deal on Marshall. Hillis wouldn't interest the Panthers unless he could pass a physical, that would have to be a pretty fast recovery from a hamstring being pulled away from the bone.

Scheffler is actually a pretty common sense trade for Doogie and his gay offense, it makes sense to adapt players into your system by using them the way they they've been effective before but let's not put too much on Doogie's Happy Meal plate.

Also, if there is anything to this rumor, do not discount the possibility of Cutler for Peppers.......Personally, I will never underestimate McDenials stupidity.

Btw, getting both Peppers and Kemoeatu would be a coup as long as it's not at too much of a cost, I'd be surprised if Kemoeatu fits what Meeks will be doing and he'd make a better NT than the stiff they just brought in.......

[rcsodak]

My guess is Sheff could be one of the names, but I'd have to think Moss would need to be the other if they are giving up Peppers. However...I just dont see this happening at all when it comes to the money.

Throw in Clam Crowder! It's been so long since he actually touched foot to the chalklines, the other day they told him to take the field, and he started ripping up grass by the fistful!

Of course, that could also be from his skrewling from UT.

[Magnificent Seven]

Marshall and Sheff for Peppers.

Makes Sense

[Magnificent Seven]

Trade Marshall and Sheff for Peppers. Sign T.O.

[Bill Devaroe]

Trade Marshall and Sheff for Peppers. Sign T.O.

You are ****ing crazy.

[Simple Jaded]

Pat Bowlen pretty much wiped his ass with the idea of signing B.O three years ago, I don't see it happening.......

[CoachChaz]

You are ****ing crazy.

Yeah...and when Marshall is suspended and Sheff is on IR and Peppers is killing QB's, we'll be reminded to sedate our insanity for considering such a ludicrous option

[LRtagger]

Pat Bowlen pretty much wiped his ass with the idea of signing B.O three years ago, I don't see it happening.......

Schefter said we offered him a deal, but the Cowboys offered him more guaranteed money which is why he chose them.

[Magnificent Seven]

You are ****ing crazy.

Well. Marshall sucks big time! He couldn't catch any ball and He could face lengthy suspension. Moreover, Tony Scheffler was on IR and nursing his old injury.

[Simple Jaded]

Well. Marshall sucks big time! He couldn't catch any ball and He could face lengthy suspension. Moreover, Tony Scheffler was on IR and nursing his old injury.

Marshall "couldn't catch" his way to 104 catches.......

[Simple Jaded]

Schefter said we offered him a deal, but the Cowboys offered him more guaranteed money which is why he chose them.

Maybe so, but at the time Pat Bowlen said otherwise.......

[Simple Jaded]

Yeah...and when Marshall is suspended and Sheff is on IR and Peppers is killing QB's, we'll be reminded to sedate our insanity for considering such a ludicrous option

I think he's calling the idea of signing B.O crazy, at least that's my reaction to the idea.......

[LRtagger]

Maybe so, but at the time Pat Bowlen said otherwise.......

What do you mean he said otherwise? Denver and Dallas were the only two teams negotiating contracts with him. If Dallas hadn't offered him the better deal he would be a Bronco right now.

[MOtorboat]

Marshall "couldn't catch" his way to 104 catches.......

If someone would be willing to take on his off-the-field problems, which certainly could include a four-six, maybe even an eight game suspension next year, AND give us one of the top pass rushers in the game, and only having to give up a fullback - someone who won't be all that useful in the new offense - and swapping a couple of picks...I'm all for it.

I don't think that Carolina would pull the trigger on a deal involving Marshall. I think Scheffler might be a likely target, although that's an injury problem there. I wouldn't imagine this trade involves Cutler (and I'm bringing that up, I haven't even really seen it discussed much), as the Panthers are fairly set at quarterback, but you never know, Delhomme isn't a spring chicken.

Royal, to me, would seem like the main target for the Panthers, although they already have an undersized Steve Smith. And who knows, maybe Jarrett will turn a corner finally, and they'd have three solid receivers. And, I don't see the Broncos getting rid of Royal with Marshall's problems. But, you never know. He was drafted by Shanahan, and clearly Shanahan's boys aren't all that safe.

[Dean]

Can you imagine what kind of locker room cancer T.O. must be for Dallas to take a 9 million dollar salary cap hit to get rid of him. This is a player that caught 38 TDs over the last three years. That is a huge, huge number!

Since this is the third team who could not release him fast enough, the track record says that T.O. won't chage.

[Simple Jaded]

If someone would be willing to take on his off-the-field problems, which certainly could include a four-six, maybe even an eight game suspension next year, AND give us one of the top pass rushers in the game, and only having to give up a fullback - someone who won't be all that useful in the new offense - and swapping a couple of picks...I'm all for it.

I don't think that Carolina would pull the trigger on a deal involving Marshall. I think Scheffler might be a likely target, although that's an injury problem there. I wouldn't imagine this trade involves Cutler (and I'm bringing that up, I haven't even really seen it discussed much), as the Panthers are fairly set at quarterback, but you never know, Delhomme isn't a spring chicken.

Royal, to me, would seem like the main target for the Panthers, although they already have an undersized Steve Smith. And who knows, maybe Jarrett will turn a corner finally, and they'd have three solid receivers. And, I don't see the Broncos getting rid of Royal with Marshall's problems. But, you never know. He was drafted by Shanahan, and clearly Shanahan's boys aren't all that safe.

Delhomme's playoff performance has to scare the shit out the Panthers, 5 Int's.

Pretty much any combination that doesn't include the 12th pick and Cutler/Clady/Harris/Bailey is intriguing, imo, and WR/TE makes sense for them.......

[Simple Jaded]

What do you mean he said otherwise? Denver and Dallas were the only two teams negotiating contracts with him. If Dallas hadn't offered him the better deal he would be a Bronco right now.

Back then, Bowlen said he didn't want B.O, if you choose not believe it.......so be it.......

[Simple Jaded]

"I had a number of issues with it in terms of our locker room," Bowlen said. "I just didn't think we needed it. I have nothing against T.O., but his track record wasn't good in that area."

Denver may be well down the list of possible landing spots for Owens. Although Broncos Coach Mike Shanahan seems willing to deal with high-maintenance players (see Maurice Clarett) and runs the West Coast offense, the system Owens thrived in with San Francisco, the team's owner, Pat Bowlen, was not thrilled with the idea. ''I'd have plenty of reservations,'' Bowlen said at the owners' meetings. He declined to elaborate.

Mike Klis, of the Denver Post, reports Denver Broncos owner Pat Bowlen
weighed in on WR Terrell Owens Thursday, Feb. 2. "This is a process, and
when a player like this becomes available, we just felt like we owed it to
ourselves to let him know that at the appropriate time, we might be
interested," Broncos owner Pat Bowlen said. "We're not going to be the only
team he visits. The only reason why I think this story created such an
uproar was because we were the first ones he talked to." Owens is expected
to soon meet with Kansas City and Miami. "Obviously, there is concern about
character," Bowlen said. "That is why we wanted to talk to him and why we
talked to many of our own players. We don't take the character element with a player lightly. If he doesn't conform to the way we do things with the
Denver Broncos, then he won't be playing for the Denver Broncos. It's as
simple as that.".......

[Northman]

I hear Carolina really wants the Punter. Cha-Ching$

[JKcatch724]

Peppers for Paxton, straight up.

[TXBRONC]

Peppers for Paxton, straight up.

I bet Panthers would jump on that one right away. :laugh:

[Medford Bronco]

Peppers for Paxton, straight up.

and frau drives him to the airport:lol:

[JKcatch724]

I bet Panthers would jump on that one right away. :laugh:

Paxton's the best snapper in the game. Peppers is merely in the top 3 of DE's. They'd be ripping us off...

[fcspikeit]

Why would Carolina need a RB? :confused:

Maybe they want Hillis! :tsk:

[Medford Bronco]

Maybe they want Hillis! :tsk:

If we can get Peppers giving up Hillis it is okay by me
and probably a lot here.

Our defense is in need of help and Peppers can bring that.

[fcspikeit]

Yes and no. Let's not pretend Hillis is the centerpiece of what Denver is giving up here

Good, then they can leave him out of the deal :D

[TXBRONC]

If we can get Peppers giving up Hillis it is okay by me
and probably a lot here.

Our defense is in need of help and Peppers can bring that.

I like Hillis, but if it meant bringing Peppers in here I would find away to cope with the loss. ;)

At that point I would wake up from the dream.

[EMB6903]

this would be an amateur move if we traded for Peppers.

[Medford Bronco]

I like Hillis, but if it meant bringing Peppers in here I would find away to cope with the loss. ;)

At that point I would wake up from the dream.

Right now I like our RBs if they stay healthy.

Jordan is a good RB who can catch balls ala Kevin Faulk
and right now Buckholder and Jordan can share carries and maybe a sprikle of Arrington.

Also who knows if all of them will be on the roster. I am sure the cap hits are not that high, especially for Arrigton for his injury right now.

I also Like Hilllis but more as a Mike Alsott type of player.

[Medford Bronco]

this would be an amateur move if we traded for Peppers.

why?

please educate us?

Getting a potential pass rusher is ameteur? I dont see where you are coming from.. If we give up too much it might not be a good deal but not ameteur

[rcsodak]

Guys, the greatest FB in the history of the universe for a starting, multiple Pro Bowl rush linebacker is still a steal for the team that gets the QB killer.

Just sayin'

Well, Michael Pittman, when asked on Sirius Radio about Torrain, abruptly started talking about Hillis, comparing him to ProBowl FB's he's played with;
Alstott -better feet and faster
Centers - better hands, faster, stronger

And adding that Hillis will quickly bolt to the top of FB's in the league, seeing lots of PB's.

[bullis26]

no way mcdaniels would ever agree to trade paxton for peppers those two are a pair :) but panthers would not be wanting hillis they have deangelo whose a great back and they have stewart a very good back, but peppers does take a lot of plays off he proved it two years ago

[xzn]

Well, Michael Pittman, when asked on Sirius Radio about Torrain, abruptly started talking about Hillis, comparing him to ProBowl FB's he's played with;
Alstott -better feet and faster
Centers - better hands, faster, stronger

And adding that Hillis will quickly bolt to the top of FB's in the league, seeing lots of PB's.

I don't disagree. Hillis is beast. I'd still trade him if it meant I could get Peppers. Assuming of course that the overall deal was acceptable.

For those who haven't read this entire thread the speculation is:

Hillis + 3rd Round Pick + Unnamed additional player

for

Peppers + undisclosed (to be negotiated) draft pick

[fcspikeit]

Yeah...and when Marshall is suspended and Sheff is on IR and Peppers is killing QB's, we'll be reminded to sedate our insanity for considering such a ludicrous option

I'm pretty sure he was referring to the signing of t.O as crazy..

[bullis26]

panthers do not want hillis they have brad hoover at FB and D. Williams, Jonathan Stewart and if they have to Nick Goings they dont want a rb

[rcsodak]

No...but I would give up #12 in a heartbeat for a player like Peppers.

That's why you're not GM!

Just because a player is franchised, doesn't mean it'll take only a 1st round to get him. ie. Cassell this year. Others in the past.

When has NE ever overpaid? They look at what the other team needs and work their way up.

I think it'd be assinine to give up a #1 for a 30yr old DE! Let alone additional players. You don't shoot yourself in the foot because your knee itches.

[EMB6903]

why?

please educate us?

Getting a potential pass rusher is ameteur? I dont see where you are coming from.. If we give up too much it might not be a good deal but not ameteur

Because hes most likely going to be available next year in FA, Denver has already signed 12 FA's, what happened to the idea of Denver building through the draft?

Hes 29 years old, he had 14.5 sacks this year (Contract year) and 2.5 the year before. Hes also a known under achiever and I dont think this team should jump the gun for a guy that has been KNOWN to give it half ass alot on the field (an entire season)

I really wanted to make a play for him if he hit the FA market but I'd rather keep the picks, so unless its champ and a 4th for Peppers Ill pass

Multiple first day picks~~~~>Peppers

just gotta be patient

[fcspikeit]

If we can get Peppers giving up Hillis it is okay by me
and probably a lot here.

Our defense is in need of help and Peppers can bring that.

I would love to get Peppers, I know what kind of impact he would have...

If they really want Hillis then it would be hard to say no, but I don't want them throwing in Hillis as a sweatner like a late round pick is used to get the deal done.

IMO we don't realize what we have in Hillis. IMO the guy is at least worth a 2nd round pick in value. If Carlina doesn't agree with that then they should have no problem keeping him out of the deal.

Both Royal and Marshall are worth 1st round picks. IMO Sheff is worth a 3rd round pick. Champ is still worth a 1st round pick.

I would rather us give them our 1st and 4th for Peppers.. If they want a WR, I could agree with giving them Marshall and Sheffler..

But I really hope they can keep Hillis out of the deal!

[Bill Devaroe]

Well. Marshall sucks big time! He couldn't catch any ball and He could face lengthy suspension. Moreover, Tony Scheffler was on IR and nursing his old injury.

Yes, he sucked himself all the way to back to back 100 catch seasons and a trip to the pro bowl. He may be a moron, but he is the most athleticly gifted WR we have ever had.

You however, are just a moron.

[underrated29]

ummm... I think peppers has had 10+ sacks every year in his career except last year...wasnt he injured too?

I think he has only missed 2-3 games a year, he is worth it...





alright DORTOH where are you with some updates for us? We need more. I want more.



:elefant:

[underrated29]

Yes, he sucked himself all the way to back to back 100 catch seasons and a trip to the pro bowl. He may be a moron, but he is the most athleticly gifted WR we have ever had.

You however, are just a moron.



LMFAO!


Hilarious, bill devaroe.

[rcsodak]

panthers do not want hillis they have brad hoover at FB and D. Williams, Jonathan Stewart and if they have to Nick Goings they dont want a rb

Didn't they cut Nick Goings?

[EMB6903]

ummm... I think peppers has had 10+ sacks every year in his career except last year...wasnt he injured too?

I think he has only missed 2-3 games a year, he is worth it...





alright DORTOH where are you with some updates for us? We need more. I want more.



:elefant:

Peppers is a ridiculous talent, no denying that but Peppers started 14 games in 2007 while playing healthy nearly the entire year and only managed to record 2.5 sacks, hes had more in 1 game before. thats tells you a lot.

[EMB6903]

panthers do not want hillis they have brad hoover at FB and D. Williams, Jonathan Stewart and if they have to Nick Goings they dont want a rb

chill, it was a joke man

Hillis for Peppers straight up would be an absolute steal

would have to be Champ/3rd/Hillis

[bullis26]

chill, it was a joke man

Hillis for Peppers straight up would be an absolute steal

would have to be Champ/3rd/Hillis

i still dont think hillis will be a part of any trades with the panthers but if it happens it happens, bailey is obviously on the down slide of his career and would be a good trade but i would like to see champ retire a bronco so skill wise we'd get the better deal but i would miss champ

[Simple Jaded]

Peppers is a ridiculous talent, no denying that but Peppers started 14 games in 2007 while playing healthy nearly the entire year and only managed to record 2.5 sacks, hes had more in 1 game before. thats tells you a lot.

That tells me nothing, one bad season does not make a pattern, he's only had two seasons with less than 10.5 sacks.......name the last Broncos player to have more than one season in a row w/ 10.5 sacks, much less 5 out of seven seasons.

That I can remember off the top of my head, it's happened once in recent history, and that was a decade ago, so whether @ OLB or @ DE, Peppers would instantly be the one of the best, if not the best pass rusher the Broncos have ever had.......

[bullis26]

I would love to get Peppers, I know what kind of impact he would have...

If they really want Hillis then it would be hard to say no, but I don't want them throwing in Hillis as a sweatner like a late round pick is used to get the deal done.

IMO we don't realize what we have in Hillis. IMO the guy is at least worth a 2nd round pick in value. If Carlina doesn't agree with that then they should have no problem keeping him out of the deal.

Both Royal and Marshall are worth 1st round picks. IMO Sheff is worth a 3rd round pick. Champ is still worth a 1st round pick.

I would rather us give them our 1st and 4th for Peppers.. If they want a WR, I could agree with giving them Marshall and Sheffler..

But I really hope they can keep Hillis out of the deal!

in madden you may be able to get that type of value for those players but at best marshall is a third round but thats even highly unlikely prolly something like a 4th or later cuz marshall repeatedly gets himself in trouble royal yes i can see him being a number one champ is on the downside of his career i dont see anybody giving up a first rounder for him possibly a second but second is more of what he's worth and shef hes always hurt i think a 4th is what we could get for him but thats just not fair value for him or marshall because on the field there both great but they just have trouble getting on the field due to injuries and off the field stuff and bailey has been getting hurt too lately

[bullis26]

i dont agree with emb much but he's right peppers does take plays off, i hope we dont give up too much if we get him, i would like him but i wouldnt want to lose anything more than a second round pick, and trevor pryce btw link

[fcspikeit]

in madden you may be able to get that type of value for those players but at best marshall is a third round but thats even highly unlikely prolly something like a 4th or later cuz marshall repeatedly gets himself in trouble royal yes i can see him being a number one champ is on the downside of his career i dont see anybody giving up a first rounder for him possibly a second but second is more of what he's worth and shef hes always hurt i think a 4th is what we could get for him but thats just not fair value for him or marshall because on the field there both great but they just have trouble getting on the field due to injuries and off the field stuff and bailey has been getting hurt too lately

So what value would you put on Peppers?

People can always say a player isn't worth that much and I might have them rated high but that's the draft spot I would expect to have to have to replace those guys.

[EMB6903]

That tells me nothing, one bad season does not make a pattern, he's only had two seasons with less than 10.5 sacks.......name the last Broncos player to have more than one season in a row w/ 10.5 sacks, much less 5 out of seven seasons.

That I can remember off the top of my head, it's happened once in recent history, and that was a decade ago, so whether @ OLB or @ DE, Peppers would instantly be the one of the best, if not the best pass rusher the Broncos have ever had.......

peppers went an entire season with limited production at best. I know that might mean anything to you but when an elite pass rusher dissapears for a complete year and then the next during his contract year he has his best year yet?

all that does is show me Peppers takes plays off

and please dont bring up the injury excuse Peppers played 14 games with minor injuries(just like everybody else in the league)

[MOtorboat]

So what value would you put on Peppers?

People can always say a player isn't worth that much and I might have them rated high but that's the draft spot I would expect to have to have to replace those guys.

Champ's stock is down because of the injury this past year. I'd say he's probably worth a second in this particular off season. Normally, yes, he's worth a first-round pick, but I would think that teams might be leery of him coming back 100 percent healthy.

[bullis26]

So what value would you put on Peppers?

People can always say a player isn't worth that much and I might have them rated high but that's the draft spot I would expect to have to have to replace those guys.

id say prolly a late first early second, he takes too many plays off, but when he plays every down he's great , nobody would give you what you wanted for those players except possibly royal. Marshall is a first round talent but he's too big of a risk and sheff prolly third round talent(sucks at blocking great at catcjing) is hurt too much but i still think people would be leary to give shef a third rounder because of his blocking

[EMB6903]

what would Peppers be worth right now?

would probably take a mid 1st and a 3rd to get peppers if no players were involved.

(not worth it)

[Simple Jaded]

peppers went an entire season with limited production at best. I know that might mean anything to you but when an elite pass rusher dissapears for a complete year and then the next during his contract year he has his best year yet?

all that does is show me Peppers takes plays off

and please dont bring up the injury excuse Peppers played 14 games with minor injuries(just like everybody else in the league)

So the only season that means anything in your mind is the one he struggled with? Having one bad season could mean a lot of things, to you it means he takes plays off and nothing else, that's all there is to it in your mind, so be it.

You're looking for perfect solutions, perfect solutions don't exist.......

[claymore]

You're looking for perfect solutions, perfect solutions don't exist.......

Me and you alone in a hotel....... It doesnt get any more perfect than that handsome. :drinking:

[EMB6903]

So the only season that means anything in your mind is the one he struggled with? Having one bad season could mean a lot of things, to you it means he takes plays off and nothing else, that's all there is to it in your mind, so be it.

You're looking for perfect solutions, perfect solutions don't exist.......

edited

Panthers | Fox says nothing wrong with Peppers - from www.KFFL.com
Mon, 12 Nov 2007 11:41:17 -0800

Carolina Panthers head coach John Fox dispelled rumors Monday, Nov. 12, that there is anything physically wrong with DL Julius Peppers. Peppers has just 1.5 sacks so far this season.
now we know

Again yes when you are that good and you disappear an entire year i think it says something

I just dont think you realize how much Peppers is worth right now and how much it would take to bring him in (along with signing him to a HUGE contract)

THAT is why I do not want to do it, I like Peppers as a player and I do think hes productive

I would think it would take MULTIPLE 1st day picks to trade for him which I wouldnt want to give up.

Rather do things the right way and build through the draft instead of getting hyped over a player on the block and giving up too much.

I'd love for Denver to make a play for Peppers if it was really for a 3rd/Hillis/ and an unnamed player but theres no way i can see that happening, Panthers can get more for Peppers than that I would assume

[WARHORSE]

First of all, stop all the Hillis for Peppers straight up swap for swap talk.


Thats borderline idiotic..........not callin anyone an idiot mind you.



But a team will give up a solid pick for him.



May as well be us.


If Hillis and Scheff are thrown in.........thats different.




But Im starting to think Hillis will be staying here.

They did afterall throw to the fullback in NE.

[EMB6903]

like Bullis said earlier, why would Carolina want Hillis?

it doesnt make any sense

[fcspikeit]

like Bullis said earlier, why would Carolina want Hillis?

it doesnt make any sense

I hope they don't...

[rcsodak]

So what value would you put on Peppers?

People can always say a player isn't worth that much and I might have them rated high but that's the draft spot I would expect to have to have to replace those guys.

The problem with figuring out a player's worth, is, two different teams will have different needs. A FB will have higher worth in a two-back system, but in a spread, not so much. A small wr on one team vs a tall wr on another, et al.

AGAIN, as I stated earlier, what NE has done is find another team's weakness or need, and work their way back from there. More than not, they'll not overspend and will walk away happy.

So Hillis might be worth more to us than, say, Carolina, but more to a team like, say, Arizona, than for us presently.

Eh.....this whole thing about Peppers is bogus anyways.

:lol:

[OMorange&blue]

I know I know but a source I have (who has been fairly good not perfect) is telling me we are making a play for Peppers.

No link no anything take if for what it is worth.

:listen:

Oh. My. God.

You, sir, are a dripping moose knuckle.

[frauschieze]

Okay....apparently I was supposed to update this thread, I think. I got a text this afternoon around 4 pm. Trade talking was done for the day and currently it is Hillis, Royal and our 2nd for Peppers and Carolina's 3rd.

Champ was inquired about and nixed by Xanders.
Carolina doesn't want Marshall.
Xanders does not want to give up Royal, so that is the sticking point.

Pure unsubstantiated rumor.
You're welcome.

[bullis26]

Ok EMB has been trying to tell you guys peppers takes plays off that is definately true, fox has said it sportscasters say it, and peppers has never denied it so obviously its true he takes plays off. I think a player that kind of reminds me of peppers is michael johnson he's 6"7 same as peppers bout the same speed and weight and both take plays off, dont get me wrong peppers is much much better and went #2 overall where johnson will likely be a third rounder i wouldnt mind taking him in the third if avialable or atleast trade up in the third

[OMorange&blue]

Okay....apparently I was supposed to update this thread, I think. I got a text this afternoon around 4 pm. Trade talking was done for the day and currently it is Hillis, Royal and our 2nd for Peppers and Carolina's 3rd.

Champ was inquired about and nixed by Xanders.
Carolina doesn't want Marshall.
Xanders does not want to give up Royal, so that is the sticking point.

Pure unsubstantiated rumor.
You're welcome.

uhhhmmm. Thank you, ma'am.

May I have another?

[EMB6903]

rather trade Champ than Royal, I really hope this doesnt go down.

Royal is the best route runner in the NFL

at this point I would rather Denver pursue Shaun Rogers over Julius Peppers

[topscribe]

Okay....apparently I was supposed to update this thread, I think. I got a text this afternoon around 4 pm. Trade talking was done for the day and currently it is Hillis, Royal and our 2nd for Peppers and Carolina's 3rd.

Champ was inquired about and nixed by Xanders.
Carolina doesn't want Marshall.
Xanders does not want to give up Royal, so that is the sticking point.

Pure unsubstantiated rumor.
You're welcome.

Why would Carolina want Hillis? :confused:

They already have Stewart and Williams . . .

-----

[frauschieze]

Why would Carolina want Hillis? :confused:

They already have Stewart and Williams . . .

-----

Beats me. :whoknows:

I'm just the conduit for information, currently. I don't know squat.

[bullis26]

i think a second, dum, and a third could work throw in shef or hillis we should really have something

[EMB6903]

Peppers is actually talented as a football player, unlike Johnson who will be drafted on measurables (very bad comparison)

[topscribe]

rather trade Champ than Royal, I really hope this doesnt go down.

Royal is the best route runner in the NFL

at this point I would rather Denver pursue Shaun Rogers over Julius Peppers

You got that right, if Rogers can work his way out of Cleveland. Peppers isn't
even proven as an OLB. Because he is one of the best 4-3 DEs does not
mean he can be one of the best OLBs.

Rogers, on the other hand, is proven at the position where the Broncos want him.

Nonetheless, to depart with Royal would be dumber than stupid . . .

-----

[EMB6903]

Hillis and Royal are two great football players.... I dont see Xanders dealing these 2

nice to see how other teams respect Hillis as a football player though.... In my opinion hes a stronger Marion Barber

[honz]

So does this rumor actually have legs? I don't feel like going through 14 pages to find out.

[OMorange&blue]

14 pages worth....

Check the mane.

[topscribe]

So does this rumor actually have legs? I don't feel like going through 14 pages to find out.

Nah, it's new, I think. I just mentioned a few posts ago that I heard the
rumor, and Frau told us about the text she got on it. That's about it, far as
I know.

-----

[bullis26]

royal is not the best route runner in the NFL he's good but andre johnson, fitz, reggie, theres many good people.
And i knew somebody would take my comparision wrong i was comparing there body type and skills i said peppers has much much better football skills but they possess much of the same physical tools. I would rather waste a 3rd on him then give up a first on peppers because neither are proven lb's in this league

[OMorange&blue]

Nah, it's new, I think. I just mentioned a few posts ago that I heard the
rumor, and Frau told us about the text she got on it. That's about it, far as
I know.

-----

frau..

:tsk:

[bullis26]

hillis isnt stronger than barber he's just a better runner, he lowers his shoulder when he runs people over marion doesnt same with brandon jacobs. Marion's game is a lot of stiff arms too

[frauschieze]

So does this rumor actually have legs? I don't feel like going through 14 pages to find out.

According to my source's source, yes this has legs, but Xanders really doesn't want to deal Royal.

But then, my source just told me he's wearing a snuggie, so take it for what it's worth. :lol:

[MOtorboat]

Okay....apparently I was supposed to update this thread, I think. I got a text this afternoon around 4 pm. Trade talking was done for the day and currently it is Hillis, Royal and our 2nd for Peppers and Carolina's 3rd.

Champ was inquired about and nixed by Xanders.
Carolina doesn't want Marshall.
Xanders does not want to give up Royal, so that is the sticking point.

Pure unsubstantiated rumor.
You're welcome.

If this really were true, this is what I thought when I heard the possibility of it being, Hillis, a wide receiver and a draft pick for Peppers and a draft pick.

I would be totally surprised after last Sunday that ANYONE is inquiring about Brandon Marshall without totally low-balling the Broncos on it. Still surprised a little that they would target Royal, though, as that would make two under-sized wideouts and an unproven Jarrett.

[EMB6903]

Fitz, andre johnson and all the others you mentioned are great

Im not saying Royal is a better overall reciever but as a route runner I dont think anybody in the NFL runs as crisp of routes as Eddie Royal... you could make a case for Wes Welker, Andre Johnson, and Reggie Wayne But Ill go with Eddie Royal

[EMB6903]

hillis isnt stronger than barber he's just a better runner, he lowers his shoulder when he runs people over marion doesnt same with brandon jacobs. Marion's game is a lot of stiff arms too

what??????????????????????

:::::::Shaking head::::::::

Hillis is definately stronger than marion Barber

[honz]

I'm just wondering why this rumor about us trying to trade for Peppers hasn't surfaced elsewhere...I really, really hope we don't trade Royal though.

[honz]

what??????????????????????

:::::::Shaking head::::::::

Hillis is definately stronger than marion Barber

They are both beasts that deliver a serious pounding to whoever tries to tackle them.

[bullis26]

yeah forgot wes welker somehow i think i'd go with him but you still do gotta mention fitz in there but i'd go welker, Johnson, Fitz, Wayne, then royal

[bullis26]

They are both beasts that deliver a serious pounding to whoever tries to tackle them.

yeah definately agree with that i cant pick a side there about the same i just went with marion because when he runs people over he just runs over them, where hillis is a much smarter football player and lowers his houlder, so if barber did that i think he'd run more people over. Brandon Jacobs on the other hand delivers more blows than a lot of defensive players just gotta remind you all of laron laundry week 1

[EMB6903]

Brandon Jacobs is just a freak, Ive never seen a player that tough to tackle, but Hillis has like 20 pounds on Barber thats the only reason I Think hes much stronger

[bullis26]

all three are very hard to tackle but barber could be better i think if he lowered his shoulder but you never know since he doesnt do it now

[getlynched47]

If it's true we'll have to trade the kitchen sink to get him. Blue Run might have been onto something

Are u effing serious?? Blue Run came here to spew his shit also?

What about roro?

[Foochacho]

Okay....apparently I was supposed to update this thread, I think. I got a text this afternoon around 4 pm. Trade talking was done for the day and currently it is Hillis, Royal and our 2nd for Peppers and Carolina's 3rd.

Champ was inquired about and nixed by Xanders.
Carolina doesn't want Marshall.
Xanders does not want to give up Royal, so that is the sticking point.

Pure unsubstantiated rumor.
You're welcome.

**** that shit. No way we trade Royal and Hillis. Unless Peppers can magically make this D top 5 that is a damn rip off.

[MOtorboat]

**** that shit. No way we trade Royal and Hillis. Unless Peppers can magically make this D top 5 that is a damn rip off.

Well we'd start talking about a defense with 3 HOF players on it.

Think about that...three of them...and a budding star in D.J. Williams...plus some solid veterans at the back end, and a solid Andra Davis...I'm still not happy with any front line movement...as in I'd like to see us come up with a really big 3-4 NT in FA, but that ain't happening...

Are Royals and Hillis THAT important to this team moving forward?

They were Shanahan-style, Shanahan-offense type players. I love the potential of both, but it makes you wonder.

[bullis26]

i still think a Dum, second, third, and maybe hillis or another back would get this done maybe like dum, third, fourth, and a condiotional pick with dum, and hillis

[EMB6903]

It would take a lot more than that to get Peppers.

Dumervil is useless as a 4-3 end... yes he can rush the passer but hes as big of a liability against the run that ive ever seen

I doubt Carolina would want him

[MOtorboat]

It would take a lot more than that to get Peppers.

Dumervil is useless as a 4-3 end... yes he can rush the passer but hes as big of a liability against the run that ive ever seen

I doubt Carolina would want him

Carolina loves them some big mofos on the front line...Doom won't be involved. If this rumor is true, they clearly want a WR and Hillis.

[Foochacho]

Well we'd start talking about a defense with 3 HOF players on it.

Think about that...three of them...and a budding star in D.J. Williams...plus some solid veterans at the back end, and a solid Andra Davis...I'm still not happy with any front line movement...as in I'd like to see us come up with a really big 3-4 NT in FA, but that ain't happening...

Are Royals and Hillis THAT important to this team moving forward?

They were Shanahan-style, Shanahan-offense type players. I love the potential of both, but it makes you wonder.

I could care less about a dominant D a decent one will do fine. I love some good denver bronco high scoring offensive football. Nothing more boring and annoying than watching a shit ass offense struggle to get a first down.

[MOtorboat]

I could care less about a dominant D a decent one will do fine. I love some good denver bronco high scoring offensive football. Nothing more boring and annoying than watching a shit ass offense struggle to get a first down.

Losing Royal and Hillis will not really detract from the effectiveness of a Patriot-style offense...it just won't...Royal, we're losing a little more, but Hillis won't get a lot of PT in this offense, and I really think they are looking to move him.

[Foochacho]

But we are most likely losing marshall for half the season too. So that leaves us with scrub backs and recievers and an inconsistent qb. No thanks

[MOtorboat]

But we are most likely losing marshall for half the season too. So that leaves us with scrub backs and recievers and an inconsistent qb. No thanks

Come on now...the offseason isn't over...:crabtree: :D

[frauschieze]

Well, a 2nd source has confirmed hang up is on Royal's value.

[Foochacho]

even if we keep Royal I want crabtree if he is still available. Trade Marshall but Royal needs to stay. He was a rookie and stepped up big time. I wanna see him after a couple more seasons and time to gel with Jay.

[bullis26]

i think that could get him especially with conditional picks but they would want doom he's a great pass rusher he's a great 3rd down DE but your right he cant stop the run i kinda hope he gets traded to the viks he'd be great there

[Foochacho]

Well, a 2nd source has confirmed hang up is on Royal's value.

Royal and Peppers is a straight up trade IMO. He has too much upside to even diagnose his value so what we have to go off as of now shows an elite receiver.

[MOtorboat]

i think that could get him especially with conditional picks but they would want doom he's a great pass rusher he's a great 3rd down DE but your right he cant stop the run i kinda hope he gets traded to the viks he'd be great there

They don't want doom. Get over it.

[EMB6903]

Come on now...the offseason isn't over...:crabtree: :D

Im praying for Crabtree to fall to 12 even though this defense is an absolute joke.

[topscribe]

**** that shit. No way we trade Royal and Hillis. Unless Peppers can magically make this D top 5 that is a damn rip off.

And that is the question.

Royal has proven successful at WR. Hillis has proven successful at RB, FB, HB,
just about anywhere you want to play him.

Peppers has not proven successful at OLB. Now, assuming the Broncos are
going to the 3-4, and Peppers is not big enough to play DE in the 3-4 (nor
would he be happy there since he wants to be a big-money "star"), if he does
not work out as expected at OLB, what then will his value be to the Broncos?

So then the Broncos have this 4-3 DE albatross, and Carolina has our Royal
and Hillis.

I am already forming a dislike for McKiddie and Co. This would take me over
that line, from where I'm not sure I could be brought back . . .

-----

[EMB6903]

But we are most likely losing marshall for half the season too. So that leaves us with scrub backs and recievers and an inconsistent qb. No thanks

inconsistent?

when a QB throws the ball 600 times theres gonna be some mistakes, quit hatin Cutler is the best young QB in this league.

[bullis26]

who wouldnt want doom? he has had great production..... and i highly doubt crabtree falls but if he does maybe we should get him and forget about marshall marshall is great but he needs to stay outta atlanta

[EMB6903]

I Think Peppers would dominate as a 3-4 linebacker actually, dude is a freak athlete (could have been a 1st rounder as a basketball player in the NBA)

I would have loved to take a shot at him if he hit the FA but trading 2 key players of ours plus a 3rd rounder?

Ill pass on that one..

[EMB6903]

who wouldnt want doom? he has had great production..... and i highly doubt crabtree falls but if he does maybe we should get him and forget about marshall marshall is great but he needs to stay outta atlanta

doom was nowhere to be found in 13 games he played in.

[MOtorboat]

inconsistent?

when a QB throws the ball 600 times theres gonna be some mistakes, quit hatin Cutler is the best young QB in this league.

He's inconsistent.

Young, talented, great potential, but definitely inconsistent.

[bullis26]

cutler is a star in this league wow your smart and we still have royal a legit #2 maybe #1, and the best slot to ever play the game in stokely(welker will be when he is done but stokely has done it for so long cant say welker yet) chad jackson(showed little promise in NE rookie year) gaffeney who is decent and shefler whose basically a wr anyways

[bullis26]

with that D line who could be? they doubled him every time he was in because he was the only one who could get a sack

[Foochacho]

inconsistent?

when a QB throws the ball 600 times theres gonna be some mistakes, quit hatin Cutler is the best young QB in this league.

I'll jump on the cutler bandwagon when he can hit a receiver in stride and doesn't overthrow them when they are wide open 40-50 yards down the field. I could care less about what his stats are as of now. He throws the ball 40 times a game he better have some yards to show for it. Different systems produce different stats. I go by what I see.

[MOtorboat]

cutler is a star in this league wow your smart and we still have royal a legit #2 maybe #1, and the best slot to ever play the game in stokely(welker will be when he is done but stokely has done it for so long cant say welker yet) chad jackson(showed little promise in NE rookie year) gaffeney who is decent and shefler whose basically a wr anyways

Cutler is a budding star, but his shit don't stank like he thinks it does. Stokley, the best slot ever? Um, ok...

Welker and Stokley the best slot receivers ever, um, ok...

Not sure where your argument falls in here in the line of conversation, but whatever...