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Denver Native (Carol)
03-03-2009, 05:14 PM
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/9288268/Broncos-blew-it-with-Jay-Cutler-blunder?CMP=OTC-K9B140813162&ATT=5

Is it too late for Denver Broncos owner Pat Bowlen to re-hire Mike Shanahan?

After the recent controversy involving quarterback Jay Cutler, the thought should have crossed Bowlen's mind.

I'm not saying that Bowlen's December dismissal of Shanahan after 14 seasons was unjustified. The shine from two Lombardi Trophies won in the 1990s had faded as the Broncos were completing a decade-long stretch of postseason failure.

But if he were still head coach and de facto general manager, I feel confident in this: Shanahan wouldn't have handled the Cutler situation in the same disastrous fashion as replacements Josh McDaniels and Brian Xanders.

Wanting to trade Cutler as part of a three-way deal with Tampa Bay for New England quarterback Matt Cassel was a shaky enough proposition for Denver's new brain trust. Not being prepared to defuse the fallout from an unsuccessful bid was inexcusable after Cassel was instead shipped last Saturday to Kansas City.

While jettisoning a young Pro Bowl quarterback like Cutler seemingly makes little sense, I can understand if McDaniels wanted to begin his head coaching career with the same rising star he groomed as New England's offensive coordinator. There is a comfort level with Cassel and a track record of success working together — two things McDaniels doesn't have right now with Cutler.

Judging by Cutler's recent comments, he never will.

An irate Cutler told the Denver Post that he doesn't believe team officials who claim he was never being dangled and that trade propositions were coming from elsewhere. Strong trust is needed between a quarterback and head coach for NFL success, especially considering how hands-on McDaniels will be with Denver's offense. It seems highly unlikely now that Cutler will ever have the same kind of faith in McDaniels that he did in Shanahan.

Shanahan wasn't nicknamed "The Mastermind" solely because of his play-calling prowess. He would have understood the damage that placing Cutler on the trading block could cause if word of a failed deal leaked. Someone as savvy as Shanahan would have taken a preemptive strike, like assuring Cutler of his good standing before engaging in trade talks and then vehemently denying serious discussions ever occurred publicly and privately if things fell through.

Yes, that means lying. But that's part of the job. Every NFL head coach — even someone as hallowed as Tony Dungy — has fibbed, fudged or stretched the truth at some point to players and/or the media.

Alienating Cutler was a costly rookie mistake by the 32-year-old McDaniels and 37-year-old Xanders, both of whom are entering their first head-coach and general-manager stints respectively.

Bowlen, though, has no such excuse. He has been around long enough to know better.

Bowlen saw first-hand the damage that quarterback/coach friction can cause when John Elway and Dan Reeves butted heads in the early 1990s. Bowlen ultimately fired Reeves and stuck with Elway, who would later capture the only two Super Bowl titles of his Hall of Fame career under Shanahan's guidance.

Having failed to win a championship in his first 11 seasons as team owner, Bowlen handed Shanahan the keys to the Broncos kingdom in 1995. The power that Shanahan wielded was so great — Bowlen once declared him Denver's "coach for life" — that it ultimately led to his undoing.

It's believed part of the reason for Shanahan's dismissal was Bowlen's belief that he felt too comfortable with his job security despite having won just one playoff game this decade. Bowlen was even willing to pay Shanahan the $21 million remaining on the three years of his contract to regain "control" of the franchise.

Yet it now appears Bowlen is headed down the same road with McDaniels. Those familiar with the inner workings of Denver's front office say McDaniels exercises almost the same power as Shanahan, only with team executive Joe Ellis (who doesn't have an Xs and Os background) serving as a middleman for Bowlen. McDaniels already was successful in pushing for Xanders to replace general manager Jim Goodman (a holdover from the Shanahan regime), even though Bowlen initially declared that no changes were coming to his front office. Bowlen also has green-lighted extensive forays into free agency that Shanahan once took.

Bowlen isn't as involved with his team's personnel decisions as fellow team owners like Jerry Jones, Dan Snyder or Al Davis. But Bowlen should have intervened to make sure that losing out on one quarterback didn't mean potentially ruining a long-term relationship with an even more established one already on the roster.

At Shanahan's farewell news conference, Bowlen said he was going to take a more active role in running the franchise.

"I'm here every day and I make the decisions," Bowlen said. "I run the show."

He's running it into the ground if the Cutler debacle is a sign of things to come.

Den21vsBal19
03-03-2009, 05:20 PM
Worrying times indeed...................I hate it when we can be laughed at by Faider & even Lions fans :tsk:

Bowlen really needs to get a grip of things, otherwise we're in a whole world of hurt...........

My preferred methodology would be the necks of Cutler & McDaniels in each hand, and bang their heads together utnil they sort things out ;)

jrelway
03-03-2009, 05:28 PM
somewhere, shanny and the goodmans are laughing their asses off drinking jameson and chasing it with some guiness.

Buff
03-03-2009, 05:48 PM
I wish the national media would run more stories on this.

Medford Bronco
03-03-2009, 05:53 PM
I wish the national media would run more stories on this.

the liberal media :lol:

what a shocker really

anton...
03-03-2009, 06:02 PM
mcd hasnt even been given a chance to finish putting a team together let alone play a single game of football and already they are saying he and bowlen are running the team into the ground...

the passion for money is never fickle among those who write articles...

Broncogator
03-03-2009, 06:13 PM
Worrying times indeed...................I hate it when we can be laughed at by Faider & even Lions fans :tsk:

Bowlen really needs to get a grip of things, otherwise we're in a whole world of hurt...........

My preferred methodology would be the necks of Cutler & McDaniels in each hand, and bang their heads together utnil they sort things out ;)

I wish our new coach would take a fishing trip..:coffee:

BeefStew25
03-03-2009, 06:28 PM
I wish our new coach would take a fishing trip..:coffee:

In high seas, G8R?

Broncogator
03-03-2009, 06:34 PM
In high seas, G8R?

Yes, after taking many "catbong" hits..

omac
03-03-2009, 07:01 PM
somewhere, shanny and the goodmans are laughing their asses off drinking jameson and chasing it with some guiness.

I kinda doubt that; Jay is the QB Shanny's been searching for since Elway. He probably hates that this is happening to him.

frenchfan
03-04-2009, 02:50 AM
What if we make the playoff this season with McD and Jay?
Let's judge them at the end of the next season before saying they are not the guys. IMHO.

I think it was a bad idea to think of trading Jay, but in another hand, it seems the deal was not that bad (3 1st rounder and Cassel). I think that could deserve a thought even though I believe Cutler has a great potential.
Anyway, in McD's shoes, I would have talked to Jay about that then... saying it's not about lack of trust in him, but about an opportunity to think how to make this team back to the superbowl (a QB alone can't win it even if he's one of the greatest... you need a TEAM).

Now, in Cutler's shoes, I'd have reacted in another way... I would have talked face to face first with Broncos organization. He has to understand he has to be a leader. We need a winner, not a whiner... :D

2 horrible bad calls if you ask me.

Hope they'll have a good talk together and move on. :coffee:

BroncoJoe
03-04-2009, 02:59 AM
Classic over-reaction. Shall we give the new guy a chance to show his wares on the field first?

MNPatsFan
03-04-2009, 10:11 AM
Now I am going to preface this post by saying that I have not followed the Cutler situation very closely, but I heard a commentator on the radio or television make the following point:

Why is Jay Cutler so upset if the Broncos did actually engage in talks to potentially trade him if/when several week earlier Jay demanded a trade after the Broncos dismissed his offensive coordinator or QB coach (I can't presently remember which coach it was).

I don't know whether Jay actually demanded the trade. If, however, Jay did request the trade, then he is being disingenuous by throwing a fit because the Broncos were investigating the feasibility of doing what he requested.

Please educate or correct me concerning any incorrect information or misconceptions I may have. What are your thoughts regarding the commentator's point?

CoachChaz
03-04-2009, 10:36 AM
I dont see Jay as a hipocrite and acting this way if he did indeed ask for a trade earlier. Unless maybe he did ask and then retracted it after smoothing things out. But, regardless of what happened in the FO, I personally thinkg Jay went a little too far in being public about his ire and throwing the team and staff under the bus and calling them liars. At the end of the day, there was probably a better way for both sides to have handled it, but we'll never know because none of us were there.

TXBRONC
03-04-2009, 12:41 PM
I dont see Jay as a hipocrite and acting this way if he did indeed ask for a trade earlier. Unless maybe he did ask and then retracted it after smoothing things out. But, regardless of what happened in the FO, I personally thinkg Jay went a little too far in being public about his ire and throwing the team and staff under the bus and calling them liars. At the end of the day, there was probably a better way for both sides to have handled it, but we'll never know because none of us were there.

Here's something Woody Paige wrote before the story broke that Cutler and McDaniels are going to meet next week.

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_11822672

woody paige
Paige: Avoid a wreck at all costs
By Woody Paige
The Denver Post
Posted: 03/03/2009 12:30:00 AM MST

Josh and Jay have reached a standoff similar to the old Kansas law: "When two trains approach each other at a crossing, both shall come to a full stop, and neither shall start up again until the other has gone."

It's silly. Somebody has to make a positive move.

The differences between Josh McDaniels and Jay Cutler must not become irreconcilable.

If the coach and the quarterback aren't willing and able to get together and make up, then the owner, who insisted this is his franchise again, has to step into the standstill. Where are you, Pat Bowlen?

These are the issues:

Despite McDaniels' denials, the Broncos did have discussions with Tampa Bay and Detroit about a potential three-way deal that would have brought Matt Cassel from New England to Denver. Multiple NFL sources have confirmed to me that the Broncos were involved in talks as Cassel was being traded to Kansas City.

Cutler is upset the Broncos would consider trading him, and claims he still could be dealt. NFL sources state emphatically that Cutler will not be traded now, as McDaniels has stated publicly.

McDaniels has asked Cutler to come into his office and discuss the matter, and Cutler has said he doesn't care to.

It has to be believed that McDaniels doesn't consider Cutler as valuable to the Broncos as Cassel, who was acquired by Kansas City, and Cutler doesn't trust McDaniels, or consider him as valuable to his career as he did Mike Shanahan and former Broncos offensive coordinator Jeremy Bates.

McD and Jay-C are headed for a train wreck.

These are my opinions:

McDaniels shouldn't have even pondered trading Cutler for Cassel. Although Cutler has a 17-20 record as a starter, didn't get the Broncos into the playoffs this past season, can be nerve-racking to everyone with his costly mistakes (the uncalled fumble against the Chargers in the opener, the untimely interceptions in several games), has not become a leader yet on the field and in the clubhouse and has not endeared himself to the media or the community, his upside is much higher than Cassel's.

Cassel was a career backup until last season, then a one-year system quarterback. Cutler was victimized by the worst defense in the league, forcing him to do things he shouldn't have. He's high risk, high reward, as John Elway was. If surrounded by talent and tutored properly, Cutler will be a successful Pro Bowl and postseason quarterback, with big numbers, for a long time.

If McDaniels believed that information about a possible trade wouldn't be leaked out of Tampa and Detroit, he was mistaken and naive. When the trade didn't happen, he should have been truthful. If he chose not to warn Cutler beforehand, his first call after the news escaped should have been to Cutler. The coach ought to have come clean with the quarterback.

Cutler shouldn't have gone into snit mode. Pro football is a business, and this is business as usual. He's a big boy who signed a six-year, $47.86 million contract in 2006. He should suck it up and prove to the new staff that he is capable of being a championship quarterback. He should have agreed to meet with McDaniels and work through their differences.

If Cutler did ask to be traded, he should acknowledge it. If not, he should deny it.

Bowlen should demand that McDaniels, Cutler, general manager Brian Xanders and CEO Joe Ellis meet with him, air out the problems and get the Broncos back on track. The franchise can't plummet into Cowboys-like chaos and confusion. If Bowlen can't unite the factions, then he shouldn't have taken control back from Shanahan, and the new organizational chart already isn't working.

McDaniels should guarantee Cutler that he won't be traded and he is the quarterback, and Cutler should guarantee McDaniels that he will adapt to the changes and get over what has transpired. Or McDaniels must recant his statement to me that he hoped that Cutler was as excited about playing for him as he was about coaching Cutler. And Cutler has to acknowledge he wasn't as eager about the new offense and direction as he indicated. Both had asserted Cutler was "on board" with McDaniels.

If they can't bring themselves and the Broncos together, particularly with all the changes in personnel being made the past several days, then Bowlen must order one or the other to go, as in the Elway-Reeves relationship.

McDaniels can be forgiven his rookie mistake, just as Cutler has been forgiven many of his rookie, sophomore, third-season mistakes, but the coach can't lie and cover up, and the quarterback can't act aggrieved and resentful as the face of the Broncos. They have to accept their responsibilities to each other, the players and the people of Denver.

At this crossing, deadlock must yield to equilibrium.

Woody Paige: 303-954-1095 or wpaige@denverpost.com

WARHORSE
03-04-2009, 02:53 PM
I dont see Jay as a hipocrite and acting this way if he did indeed ask for a trade earlier. Unless maybe he did ask and then retracted it after smoothing things out. But, regardless of what happened in the FO, I personally thinkg Jay went a little too far in being public about his ire and throwing the team and staff under the bus and calling them liars. At the end of the day, there was probably a better way for both sides to have handled it, but we'll never know because none of us were there.


Whats funky about all of this, is even though when you read Cutlers comments about learning of the different possible trades they seem inflammatory, when you listen to the interview he didnt seem ruffled much at all. In fact, I thought he seemed rather calm.

But you could tell it definitely wasnt something he wanted to be talking about in the offseason. Who would be?

He probably wanted to be getting the offense under his belt.

He came here for that, and then left again.

I would have done the same thing. Why continue to learn the offense if Im about to be traded?

Lets just hope it all gets worked out on Monday.

Lonestar
03-04-2009, 04:10 PM
Whats funky about all of this, is even though when you read Cutlers comments about learning of the different possible trades they seem inflammatory, when you listen to the interview he didnt seem ruffled much at all. In fact, I thought he seemed rather calm.
But you could tell it definitely wasnt something he wanted to be talking about in the offseason. Who would be?

He probably wanted to be getting the offense under his belt.

He came here for that, and then left again.

I would have done the same thing. Why continue to learn the offense if Im about to be traded?

Lets just hope it all gets worked out on Monday.

yet the new papers, interviewer and reporters seem to have blow it totally out of proportion..

frenchfan
03-05-2009, 02:03 AM
yet the new papers, interviewer and reporters seem to have blow it totally out of proportion..JR... It's because of the crisis... They need to make some money ;) :laugh:

WARHORSE
03-05-2009, 02:11 AM
yet the new papers, interviewer and reporters seem to have blow it totally out of proportion..


Well, if people simply read his words on paper, or on a forum discussion board, or a BLOG, then you really cant properly understand what was being communicated. Because people didnt write how he sounded, nor did they accentuate their writings to try and reflect his tone of voice.


That alone leaves the reader to assume what he or she may decide.


So its no real surprize that it was blown out of proportion.

Lonestar
03-05-2009, 02:16 AM
Well, if people simply read his words on paper, or on a forum discussion board, or a BLOG, then you really cant properly understand what was being communicated. Because people didnt write how he sounded, nor did they accentuate their writings to try and reflect his tone of voice.


That alone leaves the reader to assume what he or she may decide.


So its no real surprize that it was blown out of proportion.

I listened to it also and was wondering what the big deal was.. so someone got their panties in a wad and I suspect it started with all the reporters/analysts with an agenda maybe even Billy from Boston

WARHORSE
03-05-2009, 02:20 AM
I listened to it also and was wondering what the big deal was.. so someone got their panties in a wad and I suspect it started with all the reporters/analysts with an agenda maybe even Billy from Boston


They wanted it to be a story.........in a sense.....it was. When do you see teams entertaining trading their franchise QBs?:tsk:


Especially in year three?

Simple Jaded
03-05-2009, 02:29 AM
It's people like Schlereth, Alfred Williams and Scott Hastings that blew Cutler's reaction out of proportion.......Williams and Hastings make it a daily habit, without bitching about Cutler their show would dead air.......