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Denver Native (Carol)
02-19-2009, 10:54 AM
http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_11735941

The Broncos' defensive reconstruction era has been preceded by the grisly destruction period.

Seven defensive coaches and six defensive players have been discharged brusquely. Another five defensive players will be released or become unrestricted free agents in coming days.

And this turnover, makeover and overhaul may stand as the biggest reclamation project in the half-century history of the Broncos. As few as 10 defensive players from this past season — including eight who started at least one game — could be on the opening-game roster in 2009.

Good.

Out with the rascals.

Dre Bly, Dewayne Robertson, Marquand Manuel, John Engelberger, Niko Koutouvides and Jamie Winborn are gone. Kenny Peterson and Ebenezer Ekuban likely will follow soon. Jordan Beck — we hardly knew him — is out. Nate Webster, Marlon McCree and Karl Paymah will be pushed into the free-agent market.

Twenty-three defensive players in last year's media guide have an X over their photos. Another eight or so replacements came and went.

And, of course, the executive vice president/coach, director of personnel, the assistant general manager and the defensive coordinator have been eradicated from the front of the book, too.

This sounds like something that could have happened in Constantinople in 1453.

Free-agent signings will begin Feb. 27. The NFL draft will be held April 25-26. The first regular-season game will be played Sept. 10.

The Broncos will need all the defensive help they can muster, because seven of their games are against playoff opponents.

And they will have to add to Champ Bailey, D.J. Williams and Elvis Dumervil, and the other Bailey, Boss, who will be brought back. The Broncos have those three (still questionable) defensive linemen from the 2007 draft — Jarvis Moss, Marcus Thomas and Tim Crowder (although who knows if and where they will play) — and the five young defensive players from 2008 — Wesley Woodyard, Jack Williams, Spencer Larsen, Josh Barrett and Carlton Powell.

The cupboard needs provisions, Kid Mac and The X- Man.

The Broncos will have money for groceries. They recently dumped salaries clearing about $22 million. The NFL is expected to raise the salary cap to around $123 million and the Broncos will have in the region north of $38 million to spend, a majority for the defensive side.

Despite all the posturing, the Broncos will return to the Orange Crush past, a base 3-4 defense, because coach Josh McDaniels (New England), defensive coordinator Mike Nolan (San Francisco) and defensive line coach Wayne Nunnely (San Diego) came from, and prefer, 3-4 systems.

So the Broncos will consider shifting players on the present squad (Moss, Thomas, Dumervil), drafting players who fit into a 3-4 and signing free-agent linemen and linebackers who are familiar with the 3-4, as well as defensive backs who are tough and can cover and, please, tackle.

The Broncos' brass has a wish list already. I have one of my own:

With the 12th pick in the first round, the Broncos probably can select USC inside linebacker Rey Maualuga or Boston College nose tackle B.J. Raji (334 pounds). Either one can play immediately.

I'd love for them to go after free-agent defensive ends Igor Olshansky of San Diego (who played for Nunnely) and Chris Canty of Dallas. Those are serious bookends. McDaniels will want to give consideration to the Patriots' Mike Wright.

At linebacker,
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and I've stated this previously, the Broncos should pursue the Dolphins' Channing Crowder, with a big upside, and Bart Scott from the Ravens. They could play inside, with Larsen and Boss Bailey spelling.

On the outside the Broncos already have Williams, Woodyard, Moss and maybe Dumervil. Marques Harris from the Chargers is worth a long thought.

And the secondary will be as critical as usual, without suspects. Only Champ Bailey is assured a spot, and he needs a guy, not a Bly, on the other side. How about Phillip Buchanon of the Bucs, if he doesn't get a franchise label, and a fellow named Domonique Foxworth, who became a starter in Atlanta after being jettisoned by the Broncos?

Or, of course, cornerback Nnamdi Asomugha, the big- ticket item from the Raiders if they don't franchise tag him (at approximately $12 million).

The best free-agent safety the Broncos could bring in is Oshiomogho Atogwe from the Rams, and they probably will want to take a run at James Sanders of the Patriots.

Olshansky, Maualuga, Asomugha, Oshiomogho.

Great.

The Broncos quickly could climb from the pits to the peaks. But, then, I always wanted a pony and a Porsche.

Construction ahead.

Woody Paige: 303-954-1095 or wpaige@denverpost.com

Dreadnought
02-19-2009, 11:15 AM
I've got to say that at this point I think we've taken the meat axe to the roster too liberally. Not that most of those guys were any great shakes, but we did too much too fast. I don't think this will end well. And I hope you can all laugh at this post a Year from now, too.

Denver Native (Carol)
02-19-2009, 11:28 AM
I've got to say that at this point I think we've taken the meat axe to the roster too liberally. Not that most of those guys were any great shakes, but we did too much too fast. I don't think this will end well. And I hope you can all laugh at this post a Year from now, too.

I have to agree with you. I hope we are both wrong.

topscribe
02-19-2009, 11:30 AM
I don't know how much Woody knows about Fantasy Football, but he surely
lives in a fantasy world occasionally. It would be nice to know where the
Broncos would get all that money for all those players.

Oh well, dreaming is fun, I guess . . .


Thanks for the read, Carol. :)


-----

Dreadnought
02-19-2009, 11:35 AM
I don't know how much Woody knows about Fantasy Football, but he surely
lives in a fantasy world occasionally. It would be nice to know where the
Broncos would get all that money for all those players.

Oh well, dreaming is fun, I guess . . .


Thanks for the read, Carol. :)


-----

So in real life we'll end up cobbling a defense together made of guys nobody else wanted and who have never worked together either. And our holdovers get to learn a new system. And the offense, which ain't broken, will get fixed whether it needs it or not.

There's a title from an old tune I listened to in my teens - "I Prophesy Disaster." I've got that sinking 3-13 feeling about now, and visions of a coaching/GM search in 2-3 years. We could be the next Rams.

topscribe
02-19-2009, 11:43 AM
So in real life we'll end up cobbling a defense together made of guys nobody else wanted and who have never worked together either. And our holdovers get to learn a new system. And the offense, which ain't broken, will get fixed whether it needs it or not.

There's a title from an old tune I listened to in my teens - "I Prophesy Disaster." I've got that sinking 3-13 feeling about now, and visions of a coaching/GM search in 2-3 years. We could be the next Rams.

Oh, I don't think it's that bad. The offense will keep the Broncos in a lot of
games. But we know it's going to take a year or two to get the defense
together . . . at least, I suppose so (please surprise me, Nolan! :pray: ).

What they are doing is scary, for sure. But it's necessary. Deadwood is good
for one of two things: burn or throw out. But you can't build with it, right?

-----

Dreadnought
02-19-2009, 11:52 AM
Oh, I don't think it's that bad. The offense will keep the Broncos in a lot of
games. But we know it's going to take a year or two to get the defense
together . . . at least, I suppose so (please surprise me, Nolan! :pray: ).

What they are doing is scary, for sure. But it's necessary. Deadwood is good
for one of two things: burn or throw out. But you can't build with it, right?

-----

I am normally a big Homer/Eternal optimist with the Broncs. I wish I could maintain even your level of optimism Top. Well, Slowick is gone anyway. But even there, are we so sure none of those guys we dumped can play? I'll grant that Webster is a total stiff just about anywhere, as is Manuel. But were the others costing so much (barring Robertson) that they didn't even warrant a shot to play for their jobs this Summer? This looks more like new management posturing about how they are in charge now than a rational plan. And I think that approach fails most of the time wherever its tried in football or anywhere else.

TXBRONC
02-19-2009, 11:55 AM
Oh, I don't think it's that bad. The offense will keep the Broncos in a lot of
games. But we know it's going to take a year or two to get the defense
together . . . at least, I suppose so (please surprise me, Nolan! :pray: ).

What they are doing is scary, for sure. But it's necessary. Deadwood is good
for one of two things: burn or throw out. But you can't build with it, right?

-----

I agree with this. Regardless of whether or not we run a 4-3 base defense or 3-4, there is no sense in keeping around the parts that don't fit.

MHCBill
02-19-2009, 12:07 PM
So in real life we'll end up cobbling a defense together made of guys nobody else wanted and who have never worked together either. And our holdovers get to learn a new system. And the offense, which ain't broken, will get fixed whether it needs it or not.

There's a title from an old tune I listened to in my teens - "I Prophesy Disaster." I've got that sinking 3-13 feeling about now, and visions of a coaching/GM search in 2-3 years. We could be the next Rams.Ask the 2008 Dolphin fans how they felt going into this season.

Their defense went throught a complete overhaul going into 2008, much like ours will going into 2009.

I think in today's NFL, it's not as big a deal. Why not... don't know.

Superchop 7
02-19-2009, 12:12 PM
I didn't know I was on the same wave-length with so many people.

"When ego gets in the way of common sense.......common sense should prevail"

McDaniels entire career is going to ride on a nose tackle that currently isn't available.

He is going to force fit a 3-4 without the most important piece.

Even if they get Raji, they will soon find out that he is inconsistent.

So, it's gonna be a rough year.

However, we can get some pieces in place.

In the FA market, I think we need to make a play at DE and CB, we will overpay for DE...but it's a buyers market for CB.

We can shore up LB and Safety in the draft.

Not a bad start.....take what you can get.

Dreadnought
02-19-2009, 12:15 PM
Ask the 2008 Dolphin fans how they felt going into this season.

Their defense went throught a complete overhaul going into 2008, much like ours will going into 2009.

I think in today's NFL, it's not as big a deal. Why not... don't know.

I know what you're saying, and I hope to Hell I look completely foolish after the next season. Just a bad sinking feeling is all.

frauschieze
02-19-2009, 12:20 PM
Uh....that article says the lesser Bailey will be back. :(

How many games you think he'll last next year before he gets put on IR? 3?

claymore
02-19-2009, 12:21 PM
Uh....that article says the lesser Bailey will be back. :(

How many games you think he'll last next year before he gets put on IR? 3?

Hopefully we have an intense Training camp and he falls out then.

Requiem / The Dagda
02-19-2009, 12:27 PM
Bailey might not be back. Can't get rid of him because if injury settlement clauses according to a few on the Mane since he ain't full speed. It'd actually cost us more to cut him than keep him by a million dollars. He's probably insurance right now. I guarantee we draft an OLB (SOLB) at some point in time.

I guess V. Lombardi was on the Fan the other day and he expects the Broncos to clear more cap room as well and get up to the fifty million mark. Good God.

claymore
02-19-2009, 12:28 PM
Bailey might not be back. Can't get rid of him because if injury settlement clauses according to a few on the Mane since he ain't full speed. It'd actually cost us more to cut him than keep him by a million dollars. He's probably insurance right now. I guarantee we draft an OLB (SOLB) at some point in time.

I guess V. Lombardi was on the Fan the other day and he expects the Broncos to clear more cap room as well and get up to the fifty million mark. Good God.

:faint:

honz
02-19-2009, 12:47 PM
I don't see why everyone thinks we will be worse next season because we are blowing up the defense. Our D allowed the most points last season and we were 29th in yards allowed. I don't think it can really get much worse than that. Our offense will still be in tact and we should be able to keep putting up points in '09.I don't really see why we would do worse than we did last season unless the players simply don't buy into the new system. I'd guess that we end up somewhere between 6-10 and 10-6 next season...10-6 may be a bit of a stretch with our schedule though.

Traveler
02-19-2009, 12:51 PM
My expectations for the upcoming season will remain low. Just the pessimistic side of me. That said, I am quite content the "defensive house cleaning" is required and way past due.

We ranked at or near the bottom of almost every statisical category on defense. Which makes it evident that the personnel we had were woeful and in need of an upgrade. I have no problem at all with X-Man and McDaniels jettisoning those players.

My hope is that whomever we get to replace them show steady improvement as the season progresses. Can't expect more than that. They should be playing the their best footbal towards the end of the season.

If that's the case, we can happily look to 2010-11 when Denver returns to elite status. Until then, I'll wait and let them assemble a roster before making comments.

Lonestar
02-19-2009, 01:04 PM
I don't see why everyone thinks we will be worse next season because we are blowing up the defense. Our D allowed the most points last season and we were 29th in yards allowed. I don't think it can really get much worse than that. Our offense will still be in tact and we should be able to keep putting up points in '09.I don't really see why we would do worse than we did last season unless the players simply don't buy into the new system. I'd guess that we end up somewhere between 6-10 and 10-6 next season...10-6 may be a bit of a stretch with our schedule though.


"The Broncos will need all the defensive help they can muster, because seven of their games are against playoff opponents."

While last years performance is not alway indicative of what they will do next year all of those teams are pretty solid teams.. and all but SAN ore on the east coast somewhere that the Broncos have not been particularly strong.. So you must almost consider 3 or 4 of the four we most likely will play out east as losses..

With all the changes all over in Dove Valley this coming year it could very well be another year with out a play off win.. But I do not see blow outs like we have had the past couple of years..

drewloc
02-19-2009, 01:16 PM
Thing is, even though they are completely overhauling the defense, at least they are trying to get better. Yes things may be down, but like Jr said, I expect to see an improvement. I just didn't feel like Shanny had a good feel for the defensive side of the ball, and to cap it all off, Slowick was woefully inept. I will be happy for just a step in the right direction.

nevcraw
02-19-2009, 01:30 PM
I have no issue with any moves so far, You've got rip the band aid off.. I was looking forward to the complete overhaul on defense and by god we are going to get it..

frauschieze
02-19-2009, 02:17 PM
Bailey might not be back. Can't get rid of him because if injury settlement clauses according to a few on the Mane since he ain't full speed. It'd actually cost us more to cut him than keep him by a million dollars. He's probably insurance right now. I guarantee we draft an OLB (SOLB) at some point in time.

I guess V. Lombardi was on the Fan the other day and he expects the Broncos to clear more cap room as well and get up to the fifty million mark. Good God.

He STILL isn't healed? Jeebus man. I guess it makes sense that we don't want to pay an injury settlement. I hadn't thought of that. Of course, I didn't realize he was still hurt. :tsk:

Thanks for clearing that up!

honz
02-19-2009, 02:29 PM
I think he had microfracture surgery. That's usually a 9-12 month recovery time.

TXBRONC
02-19-2009, 02:40 PM
I don't see why everyone thinks we will be worse next season because we are blowing up the defense. Our D allowed the most points last season and we were 29th in yards allowed. I don't think it can really get much worse than that. Our offense will still be in tact and we should be able to keep putting up points in '09.I don't really see why we would do worse than we did last season unless the players simply don't buy into the new system. I'd guess that we end up somewhere between 6-10 and 10-6 next season...10-6 may be a bit of a stretch with our schedule though.

Regardless of what the base is we were going to see an overhall on the defensive side of the ball.

Ziggy
02-19-2009, 02:50 PM
It's not just that we need better players in Dove Valley on the defensive side of the ball. We also need a new mentality and a new attitude. Part of the reason that the defense was so bad was because we didn't have the players to demand and enforce better play. Teams like Pittsburgh and Baltimore don't ask for respect as a defense, they go out and earn it. We just don't have those type of players for the most part on the defense. We may not have any, other than Champ.

DJ Williams was quoted as saying that the defense was treated like second-hand citizens last year. Guess what DJ? The new FO has just put a high priority on turning this D around. Now every player will be acountable for maintaing a high level of play, proffessionalism, toughness, and intelligence. Though who are deemed to be lacking in those areas have been and will continue to be kicked to the curb regardless of salary cap implications.

I love what's going on with this D. There will be a price to pay, no doubt, but the long term effects of waht Coach McD and Xman are doing will pay dividends later down the road. We are going to have team players. We are going to have tough, smart players, and we are going to have a 'shut up and get it done' attitude.

At the moment, we are sorely lacking leaders on this D. We are going to have to invest in FA and the draft to get at least one or 2 in here. We need an Al Wilson or Ray Lewis type. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Broncos go after Ray himself, just to help change the culture on this D. While he is nearing the end of his career, he brings fire and demands accountability from himself and his teammates on the field. We need that. If the FO thinks Maualuga is that type of guy, I think that they do whatever it takes to get him.

I expect this draft to be quite a bit different. Don't be surprised to see the Broncos take players in higher rounds that most of the draft experts have them rated for. They want players with intangibles and heart. This may be one of those drafts for us that leaves us scratching our heads on draft day. Bring it on.

underrated29
02-19-2009, 02:50 PM
I read somewhere that boss will indeed be back. Cant remember where though, sorry for you linkers. Just have to take my word for it or wait until someone posts it.

topscribe
02-19-2009, 03:05 PM
Uh....that article says the lesser Bailey will be back. :(

How many games you think he'll last next year before he gets put on IR? 3?

Boss is a damn good player, IMO. We can't go entirely by what we saw last
year. He played, never having recovered from a high ankle sprain, before his
ACL injury. We need to keep that in mind.

And he proved that he will play through pain.

The biggest concern now is whether he can come back with the same speed
and explosion from his more serious injury. If he can, he's very much worth
keeping. Maybe that is what they are waiting to see?

-----

Requiem / The Dagda
02-19-2009, 03:08 PM
Boss Bailey sucks. He has had injury problems from High School, through Georgia and in the NFL. He makes Nate Jackson look like an Iron Man in regards to injuries. Boss isn't a big playa.

Magnificent Seven
02-19-2009, 03:16 PM
I would love for them to keep Marcus Thomas. I like him.

TXBRONC
02-19-2009, 03:25 PM
Boss is a damn good player, IMO. We can't go entirely by what we saw last
year. He played, never having recovered from a high ankle sprain, before his
ACL injury. We need to keep that in mind.

And he proved that he will play through pain.

The biggest concern now is whether he can come back with the same speed
and explosion from his more serious injury. If he can, he's very much worth
keeping. Maybe that is what they are waiting to see?

-----

When he was healthy enough to play he was productive.

Ziggy
02-19-2009, 03:36 PM
Boss is a damn good player, IMO. We can't go entirely by what we saw last
year. He played, never having recovered from a high ankle sprain, before his
ACL injury. We need to keep that in mind.

And he proved that he will play through pain.

The biggest concern now is whether he can come back with the same speed
and explosion from his more serious injury. If he can, he's very much worth
keeping. Maybe that is what they are waiting to see?

-----

Top, we are definitely in the minority when it comes to Boss Bailey. I think he is a solid tackler and the best cover LB we have. Yes, he has the injury problems, but the talent is there. I suppose that all the talent in the world doesn't help the team from the training room on game day though. Let's hope he can come back and actually have a healthy season. :beer:

dogfish
02-19-2009, 03:42 PM
okay, who gave JR the keys to dread's account:questionmark:



:laugh:





seriously, "we could be the next rams?" dread, please go home and knock back a couple manhattans before posting any more today if that's what you're coming up with. . . .

Dreadnought
02-19-2009, 04:51 PM
okay, who gave JR the keys to dread's account:questionmark:



:laugh:





seriously, "we could be the next rams?" dread, please go home and knock back a couple manhattans before posting any more today if that's what you're coming up with. . . .


Note my use of qualifiers and weasel words (which I usually try to avoid) , and my promise in advance to post an 'I eat crow" thread if we are even as good as 8-8 next season. My gut says we jumped the tracks though. I liked the McD hiring, though I hated the Shanahan firing, but since then we have made almost no moves (firing Slowick excepted), from letting Jeremy Bates go to canning the Goodmans, that I like even a little bit. There may have been solid reasons for all of these moves individually, but taken together I think we are headed towards suckitude.

I renewed my Sunday Ticket, and will dutifully watch the product in '09. I'm not expecting to enjoy this though. Maybe I'll be pleasatly surprised.

bcbronc
02-19-2009, 06:22 PM
I'd say we could take our remaining 7-8 defensive players into next season without adding anyone else via draft or free agency, and we'd see the same results as last season.

absolutely anyone we add will be an upgrade. our defense is better already.

Cugel
02-19-2009, 06:23 PM
Note my use of qualifiers and weasel words (which I usually try to avoid) , and my promise in advance to post an 'I eat crow" thread if we are even as good as 8-8 next season. My gut says we jumped the tracks though. I liked the McD hiring, though I hated the Shanahan firing, but since then we have made almost no moves (firing Slowick excepted), from letting Jeremy Bates go to canning the Goodmans, that I like even a little bit. There may have been solid reasons for all of these moves individually, but taken together I think we are headed towards suckitude.

I renewed my Sunday Ticket, and will dutifully watch the product in '09. I'm not expecting to enjoy this though. Maybe I'll be pleasatly surprised.

If you look at the Broncos schedule, they could have a much BETTER defense than last year and still only win 6 or 7 games!


Home: Kansas City, Oakland, San Diego, Cleveland, Pittsburgh, New England, Dallas, N.Y. Giants
Away: Kansas City, Oakland, San Diego, Baltimore, Cincinnati, Indianapolis, Philadelphia, Washington

Of the home games, the Broncos will be favored to win 3: KC, Oakland and Cleveland. They could win 4.

Of the road games, they'll be lucky to win 3. (Maybe Cincinatti, Oakland, and Washington).

That adds up to six games. If they steal a couple, 8 wins. TOPS. :coffee:

Look on the bright side though. They're likely to have a top 10 pick in 2010!

Requiem / The Dagda
02-19-2009, 06:32 PM
Sky is falling already, huh Cugle?

DenBronx
02-19-2009, 06:35 PM
I guess V. Lombardi was on the Fan the other day and he expects the Broncos to clear more cap room as well and get up to the fifty million mark. Good God.


were already well past the 50 million mark. we cleared at least 26 mill in cap over the past few days. we were at 34 mill before all of those transitions.

SmilinAssasSin27
02-19-2009, 06:47 PM
I've got to say that at this point I think we've taken the meat axe to the roster too liberally. Not that most of those guys were any great shakes, but we did too much too fast. I don't think this will end well. And I hope you can all laugh at this post a Year from now, too.

I kinda disagree. We will sign a few FAs and draft to fill the holes. If we can't get what we want, we can now at least sign stopgap guys very cheap to 1 or 2 year deals. Then when we try to finish the rebuild NEXT offseason, we can drop these guys at no hit to the cap. At some point, the dead weight and the dead money had to be washed away. It's a fresh start financially and I still believe we are left w/ some potential w/ Doom, Moss, Woody, Barrett, Thomas, Larsen and of course Champ and DJ. Not sure things, but maybe the 3-4 switch is what Doom and Moss needed. I still say they don't project any worse than a rookie tweener who played DE in college trying to make the switch. They are basically that tweener 2-3 years ago.

SmilinAssasSin27
02-19-2009, 06:51 PM
If you look at the Broncos schedule, they could have a much BETTER defense than last year and still only win 6 or 7 games!


Of the home games, the Broncos will be favored to win 3: KC, Oakland and Cleveland. They could win 4.

Of the road games, they'll be lucky to win 3. (Maybe Cincinatti, Oakland, and Washington).

That adds up to six games. If they steal a couple, 8 wins. TOPS. :coffee:

Look on the bright side though. They're likely to have a top 10 pick in 2010!

And ya know what...that's OK with me. Any given season any team can rise up and hopefully the offense continues to improve while the young D at least makes enough plays to get us in the top 20 defensively. That being said, I personally believe we'll be lucky to win 7 next year, but that will just leave us in better draft position. Now I'm not rooting for a bad season just for draft position, BUT if this new regime shows a clear plan and focus towards the future, then I'm just gonna take 2009 on the chin and stay excited about what may be in 2010.

TXBRONC
02-19-2009, 07:38 PM
I kinda disagree. We will sign a few FAs and draft to fill the holes. If we can't get what we want, we can now at least sign stopgap guys very cheap to 1 or 2 year deals. Then when we try to finish the rebuild NEXT offseason, we can drop these guys at no hit to the cap. At some point, the dead weight and the dead money had to be washed away. It's a fresh start financially and I still believe we are left w/ some potential w/ Doom, Moss, Woody, Barrett, Thomas, Larsen and of course Champ and DJ. Not sure things, but maybe the 3-4 switch is what Doom and Moss needed. I still say they don't project any worse than a rookie tweener who played DE in college trying to make the switch. They are basically that tweener 2-3 years ago.

I don't think there is much of choice. We have to sign some free agents, one draft with nine picks isn't going to cover it.

dogfish
02-19-2009, 07:40 PM
Note my use of qualifiers and weasel words (which I usually try to avoid) , and my promise in advance to post an 'I eat crow" thread if we are even as good as 8-8 next season. My gut says we jumped the tracks though. I liked the McD hiring, though I hated the Shanahan firing, but since then we have made almost no moves (firing Slowick excepted), from letting Jeremy Bates go to canning the Goodmans, that I like even a little bit. There may have been solid reasons for all of these moves individually, but taken together I think we are headed towards suckitude.

I renewed my Sunday Ticket, and will dutifully watch the product in '09. I'm not expecting to enjoy this though. Maybe I'll be pleasatly surprised.


we've made no moves you like even a little bit?


you didn't like replacing slowick with nolan?? i sure as hell did! how about replacing jacob burney and bill johnson with nunnely? i loved that one too. . . i loved seeing guys like jackson, engelberger, and most especially marquand manuel getting the axe. . . and cutting robertson was ABSOLUETLY crucial-- the day we pay a guy $16 million (inflation adjusted :D ) for his feeble production is the day pat needs to sell the team. . . nor do i see dre bly as irreplaceable, by any stretch of the imagination-- not at the salary he was making! we'll get somebody just as good for far cheaper, or somebody younger, faster, bigger, tougher and BETTER if we're willling to keep doling out as much for the position. . .

and you didn't like retaining dennison and bobby turner? the brains behind our OL since gibbs left (the guy that produced last year's exceptional O-line performance), and the brains behind our running game since TD's heyday? come on, how could you possibly not like that move? :confused:

i would've liked seeing bates retained as well, but sometimes there isn't room for everybody in a new regime, and he was pretty much redundant given that his area of specialty is the same as mcdaniels'. . . maybe bates didn't want to take that inevitable step back and stand in the new guys' shadow-- especially when he had a chance to go call plays for a serious championship contender in socal, which may well advance his career a lot faster than holding josh's clipboard. . .

i'm on record for not agreeing with the firing of the goodmans, but i'm trying to reserve judgement until i see how the draft goes. . .


besides, and here's my main point-- we really haven't had the chance yet to make many moves that people will really like, because free agency hasn't opened yet-- if we start bringing in hardnosed, competent vets on defense to replace the SCRUBS we've gotten rid of, don't tell me you won't like that!

all i'm saying is, give the new regime a fair chance before throwing us in the garbage with the rams. . . :lol:

in all honesty, given what looks like an utterly brutal schedule next year, i won't be shocked if we win less than eight games. . . but what i want more than anything is to build for the long term, to use talents like cutler, clady, marshall and royal to lay the foundation for a perennial contender-- if it takes a year or two of overhauling the abortion of a _efense we've fielded the past two seasons, i'm completely on board. . .

in fact, IMO the approach they're taking now is convincing me that they ARE serious about winning, and that even more importantly they're ready to do what it takes, and do it NOW rather than stringing it out for the next five years, replacing one useless chode at a time. . . shanahan wasn't willing to face harsh reality and give up on stiffs like engelberger and webster, and it cost him his job and the team two lost seasons. . . i for one was sick to death of spinning our wheels doing the same dumb shit over and over-- i'm more than ready to let somebody else try a different approach! and i'm quite excited to see what we do in the draft and free agency. . .

Lonestar
02-19-2009, 11:08 PM
If you look at the Broncos schedule, they could have a much BETTER defense than last year and still only win 6 or 7 games!


Of the home games, the Broncos will be favored to win 3: KC, Oakland and Cleveland. They could win 4.

Of the road games, they'll be lucky to win 3. (Maybe Cincinatti, Oakland, and Washington).

That adds up to six games. If they steal a couple, 8 wins. TOPS. :coffee:

Look on the bright side though. They're likely to have a top 10 pick in 2010!

Hey we might even beat OAK and CIN at their houses and WASHINGTON is still an east coast team.. never count your chickens before they hatch..

While I think the team will be better I do not see them dominating any one and just hope they will not be dominated by others unlike last year..

if that happens we are better team.. regardless of the Win Loss record..

If I had season tickets I'd not be saving my money for Play off tickets for 2009 but 2010-12 might be worth putting a bunch of money away for..

SmilinAssasSin27
02-19-2009, 11:13 PM
yeah...I may just geta new 50 inch LCD and the Sunday Ticket and save the travel money and time in 2009. I was gonna do trips to Cincy, Bmore, Wash and Indy, but I may just do the 1 in Cincy (or Indy) now...if it coincides w/ a Vols home weekend.

Lonestar
02-19-2009, 11:20 PM
yeah...I may just geta new 50 inch LCD and the Sunday Ticket and save the travel money and time in 2009. I was gonna do trips to Cincy, Cmore, Wash and Indy, but I may just do the 1 in Cincy (or Indy) now...if it coincides w/ a Vols home weekend.

hell you have to be in Hog heaven this year.. You could probably not even buy Sunday ticket as most of the NFC East and AFC north away games will be on TV..

SmilinAssasSin27
02-19-2009, 11:26 PM
I just wish I still lived in Harrisburg. Philly, DC and Bmore were all under 2 hours away.

tomjonesrocks
02-20-2009, 09:51 AM
Uh....that article says the lesser Bailey will be back. :(

How many games you think he'll last next year before he gets put on IR? 3?

I noticed that as well and was just about to comment on that. How does he know Boss will be back?

Kaylore
02-20-2009, 10:46 AM
The good news is we got rid of a lot of the starters for our terrible defense.

The bad news is what we have left is the guys who were behind them.

The good news is that some of them played better than the guys in front of them.

The bad news is many of the others did not.

The good news is that we won't be paying guys who should be back ups starting money.

The bad news is we don't have many alternatives.

The good news is our schedule is so brutal that it might not matter too much what we do this year.

The bad news it's going to suck watching our team get their trash kicked around.