Broncos in talks with Marshalls agent.

[DenBronx]

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/clubhouse_news.aspx?sport=NFL&majteam=DEN

The Broncos plan to speak with the agent for Brandon Marshall about extending his client's contract at this week's Combine.

Marshall, entering a contract year, is slated to make $2.2 million in 2009. Despite a shaky off-field history, Marshall will at least command Lee Evans money. Evans got roughly $40 million over five years from Buffalo in October.
Source: Denver Post

[Magnificent Seven]

oh crap!

[Shazam!]

I second that 7.

[JKcatch724]

Oh crap?! More like it's about damn time...

[Italianmobstr7]

He's a top 10 WR, maybe top 5. He needs to be paid like it. Keep him in Denver as long as we can! Glad to hear that we're talking about going long term with him.

[LordTrychon]

He sucks! You will be disappointed in season '09. Believe it or not. I look forward to seeing more of "Cutler to Royal" scenes on the field. Marshall CAN'T catch any ball!

Yeah... I won't have any faith in the guy unless he has a 100 catch season or something.

[JKcatch724]

For anybody to think we shouldn't be paying Brandon the money he wants and deserves is ridiculous, IMO. I love the excuses that come out as to why we shouldn't. If we pay him like a top 5 WR, it's because if he's not now, he will be very soon. Good news.

[Magnificent Seven]

He sucks! You will be disappointed in season '09. Believe it or not. I look forward to seeing more of "Cutler to Royal" scenes on the field. Marshall CANNOT catch any ball! He kept dropping many balls in the regular games and pro bowl game. Manning to Marshall at the TD zone---- Oh My God! What an embarrassment day for Broncos fans and me!

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

hope we lock him up for atleast 5 yrs.

[JKcatch724]

He sucks! You will be disappointed in season '09. Believe it or not. I look forward to seeing more of "Cutler to Royal" scenes on the field. Marshall CAN'T catch any ball!

There are so many things wrong with this statement.

1.) He sucks? Flat out? Don't bother explaining why or anything like that...

2.) "Season '09" is just funny :laugh:

3.) "Marshall CAN'T catch any ball"??? Looks to me like he's getting used to catching 100+ of them year in and year out...

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

He sucks! You will be disappointed in season '09. Believe it or not. I look forward to seeing more of "Cutler to Royal" scenes on the field. Marshall CANNOT catch any ball! He kept dropping many balls in the regular games and pro bowl game. Manning to Marshall at the TD zone---- Oh My God! What an embarrassment day for Broncos fans and me!

yes hopefully his drops are taken into consideration when the contract is made out...he is not a top 5 receiver...i would say maybe not even a top 10 receiver yet.

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

There are so many things wrong with this statement.

1.) He sucks? Flat out? Don't bother explaining why or anything like that...

2.) "Season '09" is just funny :laugh:

3.) "Marshall CAN'T catch any ball"??? Looks to me like he's getting used to catching 100+ of them year in and year out...

Hold up dont get it twisted he has had 2 100 catch seasons, and when you are the only one that can catch over those two yrs its pretty easy looking almost great..lol

[JKcatch724]

Hold up dont get it twisted he has had 2 100 catch seasons, and when you are the only one that can catch over those two yrs its pretty easy looking almost great..lol

Two 100 catch years in his first three years in the league... And last time I checked Royal had what, 90 something catches last year?

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

Two 100 catch years in his first three years in the league... And last time I checked Royal had what, 90 something catches last year?

In 15 starts he had 12 receptions in the redzone..so excuse me for not being on the bandwagon. and a majority of his catches were NOT in the opponents side of the 50.

[Magnificent Seven]

I wish that we have new three amigos on offense. I miss those awesome three amigos that Elway had.

[dogfish]

:whoo: :whoo:


getting rid of shanahan's favorite stiffs like nate jackson and john engelberger, and now moving to lock up one of our most important pieces in advance. . . as opposed to, say, the time when shenanigans drafted terry useless pierce because he was afraid al wilson would leave in free agency-- even though al practically begged the team to re-sign him the year before, and we could have easily restricted his movement with the franchise tag. . . :coffee:

yea. . . i wanted spagnuolo, and i'm still disappointed about the goodmans, but i have to give credit where it's due-- mcdaniels and xanders are pushing all the right buttons so far! and damn is it nice to have a FO combo that wants to do things the RIGHT way instead of stubbornly insisting on doing everything backasswards, and overpaying a bunch of useless zeroes and employing halfwit chodes like slowick out of misguided loyalty. . . what a novel concept. . .

the actions the new guys have taken in their first month just illustrate how BAAAAAAD we needed this transfusion of new blood, guys that could come in and do some objective re-assesment and do what needed to be done. . . welcome to the modern era, denver!







In 15 starts he had 12 receptions in the redzone.

and i'm sure he'll have more just as soon as they let him start callig the plays. . . .

[Benetto]

Lock him up...He will be a top 5 receiver in the next year or so...

Pros:

Aggressive, plays with passion.
Powerful, Big, hard to tackle.
Could take it to the house on any play.
Plays like a LB.
Blocks like a brick wall.
Racks up stats like he's playing a video game.
Demands attention from defenses.
Bats down potential INT's when Jay makes a bad throw.

Cons:

Recent string of dropped passes.
Recent behavior issues. (solved?)
No Ball protection.
Runs side to side way too often, resulting in loss of yards.
Let's the Joey Porters of the world get into his head.
TD celebrations in crucial situations.
Runs half assed routes when bumped at the LOS.





If he works on improving both Pros and Cons, he will be a top 5 WR...With Eddie on the other side and Jay throwing them the ball...Sky's the limit...

Lock him up.

[Northman]

100 catches with a bad hand all season? Yea, let him go now so he can burn us later. Where's Marcus Nash when we need him?

[Dirk]

Most definately sign him up. He will hopefully be at 100% next year and with each year comes another level of maturity.

I think that his little suspension opened his eyes because he has been on the straight and narrow since. These types of players you need. I don't see him becoming an issue like Pacman who is always getting in trouble. I think he learned his lesson.

Not only that....he IS a top 10 reciever without a doubt and if he is 100% healthy, will be a top 5 next year with the new McD scheme.

[SR]

He sucks! You will be disappointed in season '09. Believe it or not. I look forward to seeing more of "Cutler to Royal" scenes on the field. Marshall CANNOT catch any ball! He kept dropping many balls in the regular games and pro bowl game. Manning to Marshall at the TD zone---- Oh My God! What an embarrassment day for Broncos fans and me!

You're smart.

[SR]

I wish that we have new three amigos on offense. I miss those awesome three amigos that Elway had.

You weren't even out of diapers when the Three Amigos were around. I'll bet without googling it, you couldn't even tell me their names.

[Ziggy]

While I certainly don't think Marshall "sucks", I hope that we don't give him top 5 money. One more bout with the law and he is suspended for at least 3 games to a year. He also has a case of the dropsies, which may be an effect of a lingering hand injury that might never get better. His immaturity still shows on the field at times, when he lets players get into his head, and plans prop-assisted TD celebrations with no regard to the effect it will have on the outcome of the game.

When I look at the last couple of great receivers here in Denver, I think Marshall has the most pure talent of any of them. Eddie Mac and Rod Smith stayed in the game mentally though, and made the big catches on important downs without dropping the ball and killing drives, as Marshall has been prone to do at times. I hope that he gets better and more mature as a receiver with time, but giving him top 5 money right now is a huge risk. Hopefully the new wife will be a good influence and help keep him out of trouble. I won't be disappointed with a big extension for him, but I will be cautiously optimistic that it works out over time.

[Thnikkaman]

In 15 starts he had 12 receptions in the redzone..so excuse me for not being on the bandwagon. and a majority of his catches were NOT in the opponents side of the 50.

That may be true, but the whole offense was stagnant in the red zone last year, not just Marshall.

[dogfish]

okay, i think everyone throwing around that phrase "top five" is still stuck in the thread we had a few weeks ago, because neither the broncos nor this little piece said anything about top five money-- nor has marshall's agent ever mentioned the phrase publicly, to the best of my knowledge. . . what the snippet from the post said was:


Marshall will at least command Lee Evans money. Evans got roughly $40 million over five years from Buffalo in October.


please, somebody tell me marshall isn't a better player and more valuable asset than lee evans, so i can laugh myself silly! anyone think lee evans is a top five receiver?

we aren't going to get marshall for less than he's worth, though. . . steve smith, reggie wayne and bernard berrian are all in the six years, $46 million range, while larry fitzgerald is getting forty million for four years-- anyone who thinks marshall will get less than about 8 or 9 mil a year in toal value is just kidding themselves IMO. . .

[broncosinindy]

He sucks! You will be disappointed in season '09. Believe it or not. I look forward to seeing more of "Cutler to Royal" scenes on the field. Marshall CANNOT catch any ball! He kept dropping many balls in the regular games and pro bowl game. Manning to Marshall at the TD zone---- Oh My God! What an embarrassment day for Broncos fans and me!

Lame.

[broncosinindy]

You weren't even out of diapers when the Three Amigos were around. I'll bet without googling it, you couldn't even tell me their names.

Rod Smith Ed Mccaffery Shannon Sharpe.. no no that isnt right. oh i know Chevy Chase.... LOL I KNOWWWWWW

[broncosinindy]

I wish that we have new three amigos on offense. I miss those awesome three amigos that Elway had.

The Three amigos were Decent but elway had a better combo then that. ...Seriously you have to be the biggest Marshall hater ever.. you sound like a scourned woman

No offense to the other ladies out there!

[GEM]

I wish that we have new three amigos on offense. I miss those awesome three amigos that Elway had.

Earth to MSeven....the 3 amigos weren't all that good. Just Sayin. They had a schtick, the name. They had a great passer throwing to them. Take Elway out of the equation and they would have been very ordinary.

While Brandon has his own issues (catch the damn ball) some of that could be the injury from off season last year. He had a down year, but we all know what his capabilities are. If we don't lock him up, when the arm is fully healed and he's back to himself, he'll be gone and we will be banging our heads against the wall for not locking him up for the long term.

[underrated29]

Exactly. Dogfish hit on it people...

Brandon is going to get something like lee evans got. Lee evans (even though i love the guy and think he is way underrated) is not breaking the bank. If lee were on a decent team or had a qb like we do he would be stellar, but thats another subjuct.

Brandon is getting a bigger contract but less than what he should be getting. He is only going to get better and better and better. We lock him up long term now with a slightly higher than average contract and watchi him blossom into a top WR who is getting 2nd tier pay...


Extremely smart. Especially since his year this year was not overly impressive stats wise we should be able to negotiate nicely.

Anyone who thinks this is the wrong move is a fool.

[jrelway]

I wish that we have new three amigos on offense. I miss those awesome three amigos that Elway had.

those guys werent all that. they had elway with no run game.

[jrelway]

He sucks! You will be disappointed in season '09. Believe it or not. I look forward to seeing more of "Cutler to Royal" scenes on the field. Marshall CANNOT catch any ball! He kept dropping many balls in the regular games and pro bowl game. Manning to Marshall at the TD zone---- Oh My God! What an embarrassment day for Broncos fans and me!

teams doubling up on marshall is the reason royal got so many looks buddy.

[honz]

Hold up dont get it twisted he has had 2 100 catch seasons, and when you are the only one that can catch over those two yrs its pretty easy looking almost great..lol
The only one that can catch? Do Eddie Royal, Brandon Stokely, Tony Scheffler, or Daniel Graham ring a bell?

[Lonestar]

Stopped reading after a but post 10 I can see this is s Marshall love fest ..

I have no issues paying him top 12-08 money with lots of incentives built in and he should not have any issues with that considering his past.. Injury and character issues..

If he thinks he can straighten all of that out then Should ask for great incentives...

I hope they will do a complete check out of the hand nerves as I'd guess that alot of his drops were because of that situation..

Let me just say I'd hate to give him the bank only to find out those nerves are not going to heal.. and have another Watts in dead cap space..

[underrated29]

JR- thats why it is soo smart for us to do this now. Because he wont demand and obviously wont get top dollar. But if we had waited like normal and mCD passing attack is all that its cracked up to be then we probably would be shelling out top dollar.


This is such a smart move on our part, i cant tell you enough.

[Buff]

Guy's had his off-field problems, but aside from the suspension, he hasn't let them affect his play on the field.

It's not everyday you come across a freak of nature than can run routes and catch like Marshall can. If anything, we should be lucky that he's due to be underpaid next season-- it gives us some leverage to get a new deal done this year. We'd be hurting if he had another 100+ catch season and was due to be a UFA.

[Slick]

Lock him up. We've made a lot of holes in the roster, finding another WR is something we don't need to do.

[BigDaddyBronco]

Earth to MSeven....the 3 amigos weren't all that good. Just Sayin. They had a schtick, the name. They had a great passer throwing to them. Take Elway out of the equation and they would have been very ordinary.

While Brandon has his own issues (catch the damn ball) some of that could be the injury from off season last year. He had a down year, but we all know what his capabilities are. If we don't lock him up, when the arm is fully healed and he's back to himself, he'll be gone and we will be banging our heads against the wall for not locking him up for the long term.
C'mon Vance Johnson was twice the player B'Marsh is. :tsk:

[topscribe]

Marshall CANNOT catch any ball!

Would you do us all a favor and tell us who caught those 104 passes for BMarsh?


Manning to Marshall at the TD zone---- Oh My God! What an embarrassment day for Broncos fans and me!

If anybody were personally embarrassed, then I question their sense of security.

I guess that is why Manning told BMarsh that he expected him to be in many more Pro Bowl games in the future? :coffee:

-----

[topscribe]

Stopped reading after a but post 10 I can see this is s Marshall love fest ..

I have no issues paying him top 12-08 money with lots of incentives built in and he should not have any issues with that considering his past.. Injury and character issues..

If he thinks he can straighten all of that out then Should ask for great incentives...

I hope they will do a complete check out of the hand nerves as I'd guess that alot of his drops were because of that situation..

Let me just say I'd hate to give him the bank only to find out those nerves are not going to heal.. and have another Watts in dead cap space..

104 receptions - 1,200 yards - Pro Bowl. Does that sound like Watts to you?

If Marshall's hand does not heal any further, we will still have a good WR.

-----

[dogfish]

Stopped reading after a but post 10 I can see this is s Marshall love fest ..

I have no issues paying him top 12-08 money with lots of incentives built in and he should not have any issues with that considering his past.. Injury and character issues..

If he thinks he can straighten all of that out then Should ask for great incentives...

I hope they will do a complete check out of the hand nerves as I'd guess that alot of his drops were because of that situation..

Let me just say I'd hate to give him the bank only to find out those nerves are not going to heal.. and have another Watts in dead cap space..



an incentive-laden contract? sorry, that's nothing but a fan's pipe dream. . . . he's a rising young star just about to come into his prime-- he's loaded with physical talent, and he has the numbers to back it up, two years in a row now. . . there's about zero percent chance he's going to take less than his market value with a bunch of incentives, quite simply because he doesn't have to. . . . if we don't give him a fair deal this year, either somebody else will next year or he'll get a ten million salary for the year through the franchise tag. . .

he's not a talented backup looking for a chance to start somewhere, he's not an aging vet, and he's not coming off an injury-- if his agent even let him sign an incentive-heavy deal with less guaranteed money than other players of his caliber, that agent would probably never work again. . .

we're going to have three choices-- pay him fair market value, let him walk at the end of his deal or try to trade him now, or franchise him next year. . . luckily, it looks like the FO wants to make the right choice. . .

also, the watts comparison holds no water at all with me-- the guy caught over 100 passes last year, how many was watts able to grab in his career?


edit: or did i mis-read your post?

what's top 12-08 money? like the top 12 receivers from '08? do you mean that kind of money PLUS incentives? if that's the case, then yea, that might be about the right range and he may accept a deal like that. . .

or, did you mean a smaller contract with a bunch of incentives that COULD add up to that money? 'cause that i see having no chance. . .

[TXBRONC]

an incentive-laden contract? sorry, that's nothing but a fan's pipe dream. . . . he's a rising young star just about to come into his prime-- he's loaded with physical talent, and he has the numbers to back it up, two years in a row now. . . there's about zero percent chance he's going to take less than his market value with a bunch of incentives, quite simply because he doesn't have to. . . . if we don't give him a fair deal this year, either somebody else will next year or he'll get a ten million salary for the year through the franchise tag. . .

he's not a talented backup looking for a chance to start somewhere, he's not an aging vet, and he's not coming off an injury-- if his agent even let him sign an incentive-heavy deal with less guaranteed money than other players of his caliber, that agent would probably never work again. . .

we're going to have three choices-- pay him fair market value, let him walk at the end of his deal or try to trade him now, or franchise him next year. . . luckily, it looks like the FO wants to make the right choice. . .

also, the watts comparison holds no water at all with me-- the guy caught over 100 passes last year, how many was watts able to grab in his career?


edit: or did i mis-read your post?

what's top 12-08 money? like the top 12 receivers from '08? do you mean that kind of money PLUS incentives? if that's the case, then yea, that might be about the right range and he may accept a deal like that. . .

or, did you mean a smaller contract with a bunch of incentives that COULD add up to that money? 'cause that i see having no chance. . .

I compared Marshall's first three years to that Anquan Boldin's first three years and they damn near identical. I also compared Mashall's first three years to that of Larry Fritzgerald accept for touchdowns.

So I would hope that Denver wouldn't do something as stupid as offering Marshall an incentive laden contract.

[TXBRONC]

104 receptions - 1,200 yards - Pro Bowl. Does that sound like Watts to you?

If Marshall's hand does not heal any further, we will still have a good WR.

-----

It doesn't sound anything like Watts to me. He did say somethig about experiencing some numbness but nothing about a lack of r.o.m.

[honz]

If we don't pay him somebody will, and then Bronco fans will be pissed that we let him get away as he continues to catch 100 balls every season. Pay the man.

[TXBRONC]

If we don't pay him somebody will, and then Bronco fans will be pissed that we let him get away as he continues to catch 100 balls every season. Pay the man.

Absolutely. :nod:

[Magnificent Seven]

You weren't even out of diapers when the Three Amigos were around. I'll bet without googling it, you couldn't even tell me their names.

Vance Johnson, Mark Jackson, and Ricky Nattiel. They were a trio of Wide Receivers who played from 1987 to 1992.

[DenBronx]

since when do pro bowlers not deserve to get paid? :tsk:

we finally have that 1-2 threat at wr since eddie and rod and guys are bitching about keeping him. doesnt make sense.

[DenBronx]

I compared Marshall's first three years to that Anquan Boldin's first three years and they damn near identical. I also compared Mashall's first three years to that of Larry Fritzgerald accept for touchdowns.

So I would hope that Denver wouldn't do something as stupid as offering Marshall an incentive laden contract.

an incentive contract would be dumb in marshalls case. point is he is going to put up the numbers anyway, so might as well pay him.

[broncobryce]

They were so great, they played 5 years

[TXBRONC]

since when do pro bowlers not deserve to get paid? :tsk:

we finally have that 1-2 threat at wr since eddie and rod and guys are bitching about keeping him. doesnt make sense.

I know its a rhetorical question but I'll answer it anyway. Hell no it makes no sense. It would make even less sense to offer an incentive laden contract to him.

[TXBRONC]

an incentive contract would be dumb in marshalls case. point is he is going to put up the numbers anyway, so might as well pay him.

The terms dumb and stupid don't even come close to describing how assine it would be off a receiver of his caliber an incentive laden contract.

If Xanders did that and Marshall left the team Xanders might as well pack up because he would be fired.

That being said, I think he's a lot smarter than that.

[Lonestar]

an incentive-laden contract? sorry, that's nothing but a fan's pipe dream. . . . he's a rising young star just about to come into his prime-- he's loaded with physical talent, and he has the numbers to back it up, two years in a row now. . . there's about zero percent chance he's going to take less than his market value with a bunch of incentives, quite simply because he doesn't have to. . . . if we don't give him a fair deal this year, either somebody else will next year or he'll get a ten million salary for the year through the franchise tag. . .

he's not a talented backup looking for a chance to start somewhere, he's not an aging vet, and he's not coming off an injury-- if his agent even let him sign an incentive-heavy deal with less guaranteed money than other players of his caliber, that agent would probably never work again. . .

we're going to have three choices-- pay him fair market value, let him walk at the end of his deal or try to trade him now, or franchise him next year. . . luckily, it looks like the FO wants to make the right choice. . .

also, the watts comparison holds no water at all with me-- the guy caught over 100 passes last year, how many was watts able to grab in his career?


edit: or did i mis-read your post?

what's top 12-08 money? like the top 12 receivers from '08? do you mean that kind of money PLUS incentives? if that's the case, then yea, that might be about the right range and he may accept a deal like that. . .

or, did you mean a smaller contract with a bunch of incentives that COULD add up to that money? 'cause that i see having no chance. . .

top 8 to 12 money with incentives to earn top 5 money..

I think he understands that the Broncos stood by him SEVERAL times and if there is any doubt in his mind about ever getting FULL feeling back in his hand I'd guess he might take a deal like that considering his past here and his potential..

facto in were is he going to walk into a more WR friendly area with Eddie on one side him on the other Hillis catching out of the back field, Stokely in the slot and two stud TE's all taking pressure off of him Not to mention his buddy Jay tossing him the ball..

Do you think Bronco loyalty will not have something to his decision? I do.. after all what is the difference in 40 mil with 5-15 in incentives and 55 mil some where else..

If you do not ask you never get to hear the answer..

BTW it is a long time before he is a FA so it is not like this deal has to be done tonight or tomorrow..

[broncohead]

top 8 to 12 money with incentives to earn top 5 money..

I think he understands that the Broncos stood by him SEVERAL times and if there is any doubt in his mind about ever getting FULL feeling back in his hand I'd guess he might take a deal like that considering his past here and his potential..

facto in were is he going to walk into a more WR friendly area with Eddie on one side him on the other Hillis catching out of the back field, Stokely in the slot and two stud TE's all taking pressure off of him Not to mention his buddy Jay tossing him the ball..

Do you think Bronco loyalty will not have something to his decision? I do.. after all what is the difference in 40 mil with 5-15 in incentives and 55 mil some where else..

If you do not ask you never get to hear the answer..

BTW it is a long time before he is a FA so it is not like this deal has to be done tonight or tomorrow..

I think this would be the best way. He has the ability to make some big plays but missed out on a lot due to dropped passed. Plus players always play harder if they are playing for something they don't already have.

[Lonestar]

I think this would be the best way. He has the ability to make some big plays but missed out on a lot due to dropped passed. Plus players always play harder if they are playing for something they don't already have.

I agree and frankly most of of the forum members seem to have to have absolutes on this if he does not get top money he will walk..

{Perhaps he will next year this time. Perhaps he has a great year 120 catches 40 TD no drops.. but in the last game he tears up a knee.. what is he going to get then..

A bird(15 million dollar check) in hand Today is drawing interest a 15 Million dollar check next year is not drawing interest for a year.. that is a lot of shekels he is flushing down the toilet.. For a maybe next year..

Sorry unless he is stupid he take a lesser amount today or over the next few months than waiting/hoping nothing happens this coming year..

[dogfish]

top 8 to 12 money with incentives to earn top 5 money..


without looking at exact figures, i would think something in the top eight to top ten with plenty of escalators might get it done, you really never know for sure until they do the deal. . . and as i've pointed out before, it's tough to compare contracts because each one is structured a little differently. . .

now, i don't think he's going to accept a deal where a huge chunk of it is incentive-based with little guaranteed money, but if we're talking a solid base amount plus performance bonuses, most players end up with something like that. . . i'm sure even manning and brady probably get an extra 500,000 for pro bowl apprearances, MVP, leading the league in TD passes, stuff like that. . . but it's not like a large portion of their contract is in those bonuses. . .


Do you think Bronco loyalty will not have something to his decision? I do.. after all what is the difference in 40 mil with 5-15 in incentives and 55 mil some where else..

i do think it'll make a difference, but only if the money is fair-- i don't think he'd go somewhere else if we're making a comparable offer, but i think ANYONE would go somewhere else if they're offering fifteen million more in guaranteed money, and rightfully so. . . who wouldn't?



If you do not ask you never get to hear the answer..

true, but agents aren't stupid-- they have a pretty good idea what a guy's market value should be, and if you just drastically lowball him it's not going to get you anywhere. . . no one wants to be treated like they're stupid, and it's not professional to offer a deal way below market value-- they're not going to take it, and it might make them more likely to look elsewhere if you don't deal with them on the level. . .


BTW it is a long time before he is a FA so it is not like this deal has to be done tonight or tomorrow..

not that long-- this is the last year of his contract. . . you're right that it doesn't have to be done immediately, but it's better if we can get it done now and have it done with rather than letting it go until the offseason. . .

yea, there's ALWAYS some risk involved, but the risk of losing your top talent is worse than the risk of paying a little too much. . . for example, if we pay him like a "top five" receiver and he only produces like a "top eight" receiver, we're still getting something pretty substantial for our money-- 110+ catches, 1,300 yards and 6 or 7 TDs per year isn't anything to scoff at. . . but if we let him play this year without an extension, once guys get that close to free agency they more often than not want to see what the market will be for them, and then you end up having to use the tag. . . there are worse things, but it wastes cap space and doesn't generally create goodwill between team and player. . . and if he goes out and has an ever better year than his past two, which is pretty possible given that he and jay are both young players with a lot of growth potential, then the cost just goes up further. . .

it'll be interesting to see how it plays out, but i'm expecting that if a deal gets done it's going to average between eight and nine million per year in total worth. . . that's pretty much the going rate for WRs of his caliber, and i can't see him signing for less. . . this will be the first big test for xanders and mcdaniels as a front office tandem, and should give us some idea of what their M.O. is going to be. . . .

[MOtorboat]

Uncapped season. Do it now.

That is all I have to say about that.

[TXBRONC]

Uncapped season. Do it now.

That is all I have to say about that.

There is only one way to put it. No shit.

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

That may be true, but the whole offense was stagnant in the red zone last year, not just Marshall.

There is no doubt he will get big money, I hope we lock him up for 5. As for a top 10 receiver now...no he is close but not quite there. As for his lack of production in the red zone, that is one of the reasons we were stagnant in the red zone and only proves my point.

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

And please don't get me wrong, I have nothing but love for Marshall just keeping it real.

[MOtorboat]

There is no doubt he will get big money, I hope we lock him up for 5. As for a top 10 receiver now...no he is close but not quite there. As for his lack of production in the red zone, that is one of the reasons we were stagnant in the red zone and only proves my point.

Not top 10?

What more does he have to do?

3rd in receptions, 7th in yard, 6th is yards per game, 8th in 20+ catches, 4th in first down catches...

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

Not top 10?

What more does he have to do?

3rd in receptions, 7th in yard, 6th is yards per game, 8th in 20+ catches, 4th in first down catches...

he must produce when he is most relied upon...in the redzone. all the stats are there except the ONE that really matters...TD's.

[Randomtask]

And please don't get me wrong, I have nothing but love for Marshall just keeping it real.

Just for curiosity's sake, who would you say are the top 10 wide recievers in the NFL today?

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

an incentive contract would be dumb in marshalls case. point is he is going to put up the numbers anyway, so might as well pay him.

Incentive would be wise..He will want to catch that pass over the middle or lay out for that catch in the endzone. He will want to catch as many balls as possible. Why not say hey million for your 10th TD. A million for your 100th catch pay him a base of 2 or 3 million. he is going to want about 5 mil anyway. its a win win situation for us all.

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

Just for curiosity's sake, who would you say are the top 10 wide recievers in the NFL today?

in no particular order except fitz..lol: Fitzgerald, moss, houshman, anquan boldin, reggie wayne, hines ward,roddy white, steve smith, andre johnson, and wow thats 11...there are many others...again i am not knocking him but these guys have the ability to hit 100 catches any given yr. and HAVE been in the top 10 in many stats for year in year out.

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

in no particular order except fitz..lol: Fitzgerald, moss, houshman, anquan boldin, reggie wayne, hines ward,roddy white, steve smith, andre johnson, and wow thats 11...there are many others...again i am not knocking him but these guys have the ability to hit 100 catches any given yr. and HAVE been in the top 10 in many stats for year in year out.

wow didnt even say welker and he would be in there also...the way i see it marshall is somewhere between 11-13,

[dogfish]

in no particular order except fitz..lol:
1. Fitzgerald,
2. moss,
3. houshman,
4. anquan boldin,
5. reggie wayne,
6. hines ward,
7. roddy white,
8. steve smith,
9. andre johnson,

and wow thats 11. . .

nine actually. . . and if TDs are all that counts, most of 'em AREN'T any better than brandon. . . brandon had 6-- so did steve smith, and reggie wayne. . . and houshmandzadeh? LMFAO!! come on man, he had 4 TDs and didn't even break 1,000 yards-- tell me again how he's better than marshall!

:lol: :rofl:

hines ward had 7 TDs, and barely broke 1,000 yards-- no way in hell his old ass is better than brandon. . . .


but, if TD production is the main thing, then greg jennings and lance moore are better than most of your top nine list. . . .

oh, and wes welker? 3 TDs, barely 1,000 yards, and that's with moss drawing double coverage probably just about every snap. . .



there are many others...again i am not knocking him but these guys have the ability to hit 100 catches any given yr. and HAVE been in the top 10 in many stats for year in year out.

well, given that marshall's only been in the league for three years and only started two of them, i guess it's tough for him to be there "year in and year out"-- but being there both years he's been a starter is pretty good i guess. . .


the receivers i would take over marshall, right now, are larry fitzgerald, andre johnson, calvin johnson, and probably anquan boldin. . . and i'd take steve smith if he was a year or two younger. . . .

[LordTrychon]

in no particular order except fitz..lol: Fitzgerald, moss, houshman, anquan boldin, reggie wayne, hines ward,roddy white, steve smith, andre johnson, and wow thats 11...there are many others...again i am not knocking him but these guys have the ability to hit 100 catches any given yr. and HAVE been in the top 10 in many stats for year in year out.

Ok... I won't take 'have the ability to hit 100 catches any given year' as better than 'has actually hit 100 catches in two successive seasons' when only one on that list hit 100 this year.

The only other one that hit it was the one you forgot originally.

He's also the only other one to do it two successive years.

They may have the ability... but obviously so does Brandon, since he actually DID.

There is no other receiver who can do it year in year out so well as to have done it 2/3 of their active seasons.

Edit: Also note... Welker, for all his ability to do it year in and year out? had 29 catches in his first three seasons in the NFL.

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

nine actually. . . and if TDs are all that counts, most of 'em AREN'T any better than brandon. . . brandon had 6-- so did steve smith, and reggie wayne. . . and houshmandzadeh? LMFAO!! come on man, he had 4 TDs and didn't even break 1,000 yards-- tell me again how he's better than marshall!

:lol: :rofl:

hines ward had 7 TDs, and barely broke 1,000 yards-- no way in hell his old ass is better than brandon. . . .


but, if TD production is the main thing, then greg jennings and lance moore are better than most of your top nine list. . . .

oh, and wes welker? 3 TDs, barely 1,000 yards, and that's with moss drawing double coverage probably just about every snap. . .




well, given that marshall's only been in the league for three years and only started two of them, i guess it's tough for him to be there "year in and year out"-- but being there both years he's been a starter is pretty good i guess. . .


the receivers i would take over marshall, right now, are larry fitzgerald, andre johnson, calvin johnson, and probably anquan boldin. . . and i'd take steve smith if he was a year or two younger. . . .

Yeah I edited it a bit and forgot to change the numbers...but anyway you asked who I thought were the top 10 and those are my guys.. as for ward he has proved himself in the league and i would take his dirty playing ass any day over marshall at this point in time....and he doesnt play like he is old.

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

nine actually. . . and if TDs are all that counts, most of 'em AREN'T any better than brandon. . . brandon had 6-- so did steve smith, and reggie wayne. . . and houshmandzadeh? LMFAO!! come on man, he had 4 TDs and didn't even break 1,000 yards-- tell me again how he's better than marshall!

:lol: :rofl:

hines ward had 7 TDs, and barely broke 1,000 yards-- no way in hell his old ass is better than brandon. . . .


but, if TD production is the main thing, then greg jennings and lance moore are better than most of your top nine list. . . .

oh, and wes welker? 3 TDs, barely 1,000 yards, and that's with moss drawing double coverage probably just about every snap. . .




well, given that marshall's only been in the league for three years and only started two of them, i guess it's tough for him to be there "year in and year out"-- but being there both years he's been a starter is pretty good i guess. . .


the receivers i would take over marshall, right now, are larry fitzgerald, andre johnson, calvin johnson, and probably anquan boldin. . . and i'd take steve smith if he was a year or two younger. . . .

and as for moss commanding double teams no 2 yrs ago yes, but this past year welker was getting the dump off passes as cassell didnt have time to get it to moss.

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

Ok... I won't take 'have the ability to hit 100 catches any given year' as better than 'has actually hit 100 catches in two successive seasons' when only one on that list hit 100 this year.

The only other one that hit it was the one you forgot originally.

He's also the only other one to do it two successive years.

They may have the ability... but obviously so does Brandon, since he actually DID.

There is no other receiver who can do it year in year out so well as to have done it 2/3 of their active seasons.

Edit: Also note... Welker, for all his ability to do it year in and year out? had 29 catches in his first three seasons in the NFL.

again i say marshall is not in the top 10 but close...I wouldnt say he is better or worse than most of them. He is a beast and will without a doubt become a great player..but he is not moss in his prime or an irvin or rice as of right now.

[BRONCOSFREAK765]

again i say marshall is not in the top 10 but close...I wouldnt say he is better or worse than most of them. He is a beast and will without a doubt become a great player..but he is not moss in his prime or an irvin or rice as of right now.

IF he stays healthy.

[LordTrychon]

again i say marshall is not in the top 10 but close...I wouldnt say he is better or worse than most of them. He is a beast and will without a doubt become a great player..but he is not moss in his prime or an irvin or rice as of right now.

Actually, if you list 10 that you consider to be top 10... and you say Marshall isn't top 10... you are indeed saying that he is worse than they are.

[Italianmobstr7]

This is a stupid argument to even have. Marshall is top 10. If you don't agree, then you're flat out wrong. The stats show it, his play shows it, everything shows it. He's had 2 100 catch seasons in 2 of his first 3 years. Even in his rookie year he showed flashes of brilliance (Seahawks game!) Not only is he becoming a great player, but he's young! If I had a top 10 it would be these 10 guys, and in no particular order:

Larry Fitzgerald
Steve Smith
Brandon Marshall
Anquan Boldin
Randy Moss
Andre Johnson
Reggie Wayne
Terrell Owens
Chad Johnson
Calvin Johnson

Housh is also very good, but he's in his decline. You'll see once he goes to a team that's not as pass happy as the Bengals this offseason. Roddy White also gets honorable mention here. Brandon definitely deserves to be included in the elite players. If you took a poll amongst NFL coaches, he would be in the top 10, I guarantee it. Marshall dropped some passes this year, it happens. He had a bad pro bowl...but it's the pro bowl. It doesn't mean a thing. I'm sure he'll be back there many times from here on out too. He's the hardest receiver to bring down after he has the ball in his hands, and he constantly makes big plays (remember the 3rd and long catch against Atlanta to keep our game winning drive alive?). I'm glad that Marshall will be a Bronco for years to come. If he wants top 5 money, give it to him. He's that good.

[Italianmobstr7]

he must produce when he is most relied upon...in the redzone. all the stats are there except the ONE that really matters...TD's.

Our entire team struggled in the red zone. When Marshall wasn't catching TD's, he was being double teamed and opening the TD's for Royal, Scheffler, Nate Jackson, etc... The bottom line is this team is better with Marshall on it. Marshall needs to get paid what he deserves, or what he wants. He needs to stay in Denver.

[fcspikeit]

I agree and frankly most of of the forum members seem to have to have absolutes on this if he does not get top money he will walk..

{Perhaps he will next year this time. Perhaps he has a great year 120 catches 40 TD no drops.. but in the last game he tears up a knee.. what is he going to get then..

A bird(15 million dollar check) in hand Today is drawing interest a 15 Million dollar check next year is not drawing interest for a year.. that is a lot of shekels he is flushing down the toilet.. For a maybe next year..

Sorry unless he is stupid he take a lesser amount today or over the next few months than waiting/hoping nothing happens this coming year..

Not just that Jr but he stands to make more money if he takes a new deal this year. If he took a deal this year where he was making around 7 Mill a year, with the incentives to make 10, he would make an extra 5 Mill right off the top. If he doesn't get a new deal, he will be playing for only 2 mill next year. Sure in the long run he might make more per year by holding out until his contract runs out but he will have to make a lot more then the 7 mill per year just to make up for the money he will be losing while playing out his currant contract.

IMO, its in the best interest's of everyone involved to get a fair long term deal done sooner, rather then later.

[TXBRONC]

and as for moss commanding double teams no 2 yrs ago yes, but this past year welker was getting the dump off passes as cassell didnt have time to get it to moss.

From what I remember Cassell had the time get the ball deep. The problem is that he just doesn't throw a good deep ball.

[TXBRONC]

Incentive would be wise..He will want to catch that pass over the middle or lay out for that catch in the endzone. He will want to catch as many balls as possible. Why not say hey million for your 10th TD. A million for your 100th catch pay him a base of 2 or 3 million. he is going to want about 5 mil anyway. its a win win situation for us all.

If you're trying to say he basically he doesn't want work hard, I think you're mistaken. You don't get put up back to back 100 catches season by loafing.

[Poet]

Someone is going to pay him. You have him now, he is important to your team.

You guys need to be the one who pay him.

You are stuck in limbo though. You have to bank on him not getting in trouble off the field.

[TXBRONC]

again i say marshall is not in the top 10 but close...I wouldnt say he is better or worse than most of them. He is a beast and will without a doubt become a great player..but he is not moss in his prime or an irvin or rice as of right now.

So you're taking the entirety of two hall of famers careers and one guy who has been in the League 11 years and saying Marshall is not them? I don't see that as fair comparison.

That being said Marshall career at this point is most comparable to Irvin's career at the same juncture statistics wise. Irvin's breakout year didn't come until his 4th season in the League. He had 93 receptions, 1523 yards, and 8 tds.

Just for kicks here is Irvin's first four season totals verses Marshall's first three.

Irvin: 171 receptions, 2968 yards receiving, and 20 tds.

Marshall: 226 receptions, 2899 yards receiving, and 15 tds.

By the way only once in Irvin's career did he have 100 or more catches and only once did he have double digit touchdown receptions and both of those happened in the same year.

[Kaylore]

Yeah... I won't have any faith in the guy unless he has a 100 catch season or something.

Or at least a 15+ catches in one game. Then maybe I'd consider it.

[Cugel]

an incentive-laden contract? sorry, that's nothing but a fan's pipe dream. . . . he's a rising young star just about to come into his prime-- he's loaded with physical talent, and he has the numbers to back it up, two years in a row now. . . there's about zero percent chance he's going to take less than his market value with a bunch of incentives, quite simply because he doesn't have to. . . . if we don't give him a fair deal this year, either somebody else will next year or he'll get a ten million salary for the year through the franchise tag. . .

he's not a talented backup looking for a chance to start somewhere, he's not an aging vet, and he's not coming off an injury-- if his agent even let him sign an incentive-heavy deal with less guaranteed money than other players of his caliber, that agent would probably never work again. . .

we're going to have three choices-- pay him fair market value, let him walk at the end of his deal or try to trade him now, or franchise him next year. . . luckily, it looks like the FO wants to make the right choice. . .

also, the watts comparison holds no water at all with me-- the guy caught over 100 passes last year, how many was watts able to grab in his career?


edit: or did i mis-read your post?

what's top 12-08 money? like the top 12 receivers from '08? do you mean that kind of money PLUS incentives? if that's the case, then yea, that might be about the right range and he may accept a deal like that. . .

or, did you mean a smaller contract with a bunch of incentives that COULD add up to that money? 'cause that i see having no chance. . .

You're right! There are a LOT of fans who can't deal with reality!

It's simple. Either the Broncos pay Brandon Marshall what he's worth and lock him up for the majority of his career, or else he walks, gets a HUGE FA contract and we get to watch him going to the pro-bowl for some other team.

Right now, there's NO reason to let a rising star like Marshall get away. If they don't sign him, that would be the first indication that the Broncos are NOT serious about building a championship team. That would mean they are simply trying to save money and don't care about the fans.

At that point I would start to question McDaniels & Xanders.

Fortunately, I don't think that will happen.

The fans here would stop b itching in a hurry if they saw every other team in the league excitedly trying to sign Marshall as a top FA! :coffee:

[Poet]

Brandon Marshall is probably not a top five WR. But, to say he is not top ten is a stretch to me.

However, when you look at WR's that you want on your team long term, he would have to be at the top of the list.

The old guard of WR is changing. Torry Holt is falling off. TO is old. Randy Moss is still a beast, still top five, but is also older. Chad Johnson was hurt last year and turned 30. Harrison is a former shell of himself and just got cut by Indy.

Out of the old guard remains Steve Smith and Randy Moss. Now, Holt and CJ are still capable of putting up big numbers, and WRs can do a lot of good things past 30, but I'm talking about as of this moment right now.

Brandon Marshall, Calvin Johnson, Andre Johnson , Anquan Boldin, Larry Fitzgerald, Santonio Holmes, Roddy White, and Braylon Edwards are pretty much, IMO, all the elite WR talent in the NFL.

Of those guys, Edwards and Roddy White have been inconsistent. Holmes exploded recently, but he has had worse production than you would think. Pittsburgh is no longer the "run first, always and forever, no questions asked" team that it used to be.

Andre Johnson killed it this year, but his production has never been great before. Yes, he played for a lot of awful teams. No one can deny that. However, at the end of the day it's results. One great year and a lot of average or good years does not make me jump for joy here. The man can play though, that's for sure.

As far as I can tell, Calvin Johnson is the most talented WR in the game today. Look at his stats in DETROIT! http://www.nfl.com/players/calvinjohnson/profile?id=JOH088640

IT'S DETROIT! THEIR QB WHO STARTED A GAME RAN OUT OF BOUNDS IN THE ENDZONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :lol:

Then you look at Fitzgerald and Anquan Boldin. Boldin is overrated. I've never seen a more overrated player that people fawned over. Anquan Boldin can play, but he really has some issues staying on the field. http://www.nfl.com/players/anquanboldin/profile?id=BOL283010

If you pay Marshall now you can probably save yourself money down the road.

I still think he's top ten. Top five, eh, I could see it.

[Lonestar]

Not just that Jr but he stands to make more money if he takes a new deal this year. If he took a deal this year where he was making around 7 Mill a year, with the incentives to make 10, he would make an extra 5 Mill right off the top. If he doesn't get a new deal, he will be playing for only 2 mill next year. Sure in the long run he might make more per year by holding out until his contract runs out but he will have to make a lot more then the 7 mill per year just to make up for the money he will be losing while playing out his currant contract.

IMO, its in the best interest's of everyone involved to get a fair long term deal done sooner, rather then later.

Exactly fair is the answer..

If he is going to have long term nerve damage and that is what it sounds to me.. but still able to get 90+ catches a year then indeed he deserves top ten money .. While he missed the first game last year he got 18 in the second game does anyone thing getting almost 20% of catches in one game might be a tad out of the ordinary.. and as the season progressed he was double and tripled more..

Now I av not done a break down game by game and I'm sure the broncos have but I'm guessing that there were games that he had less than 6 catches a game.. 100/16 equals 6.25 per game..

[Thnikkaman]

All arguments aside, I really hope we get some updated information about this today.

[Bronco4ever]

wow didnt even say welker and he would be in there also...the way i see it marshall is somewhere between 11-13,

You ragged on Marshall for his lack of TD's, but you claim a guy with a grand total of 2 TD catches last year is better?

[fcspikeit]

Exactly fair is the answer..

If he is going to have long term nerve damage and that is what it sounds to me.. but still able to get 90+ catches a year then indeed he deserves top ten money .. While he missed the first game last year he got 18 in the second game does anyone thing getting almost 20% of catches in one game might be a tad out of the ordinary.. and as the season progressed he was double and tripled more..

Now I av not done a break down game by game and I'm sure the broncos have but I'm guessing that there were games that he had less than 6 catches a game.. 100/16 equals 6.25 per game..

I'm not catching your point with the breakdown? Regardless all receivers go through the same thing, he still finished with 104 receptions.. Even if he only averaged 90 receptions a year from here on out, I still say he is worth 7-12 type money with the ability in incentives to earn top 5..

Also, wouldn't it be 104/15 ?

[CoachChaz]

If any receiver is doubled and tripled on a regular basis there is NO excuse for the QB to force the ball to that guy because someone somewhere WILL be open.

So...is BM being doubled and tripled all the time an exaggeration...or does Cutler have tunnel vision? One of the two has to be true

[JKcatch724]

If any receiver is doubled and tripled on a regular basis there is NO excuse for the QB to force the ball to that guy because someone somewhere WILL be open.

So...is BM being doubled and tripled all the time an exaggeration...or does Cutler have tunnel vision? One of the two has to be true

Tunnel vision.

[Poet]

If any receiver is doubled and tripled on a regular basis there is NO excuse for the QB to force the ball to that guy because someone somewhere WILL be open.

So...is BM being doubled and tripled all the time an exaggeration...or does Cutler have tunnel vision? One of the two has to be true

Not always Coach. Larry Fitzgerald, Randy Moss, Hines Ward, Steve Smith, and TO are all wideouts that I have seen being double and make a catch that their QB forced.

No WR gets doubled as much as his fans say he does. In 2004, 2005, 2006, and 2007 Bengal fans kept claiming that CJ was doubled at least 85 (oddly enough) % of the fricking time.

People also have different definitions of being doubled. Are you only doubled if it's two CBs? Or what if you had one CB on you, but then you run a deeper route and as you catch the ball a safety and CB are near you? Etc etc etc.

Just my take.

[Lonestar]

I'm not catching your point with the breakdown? Regardless all receivers go through the same thing, he still finished with 104 receptions.. Even if he only averaged 90 receptions a year from here on out, I still say he is worth 7-12 type money with the ability in incentives to earn top 5..

Also, wouldn't it be 104/15 ?


Well you put it better than I did.. IIRC I've been saying 8-12 money with incentives.. to allow him to be top 2-3..

I think anyone would jump at that starting this year tomorrow compared to waiting till the EOY and 360+ days from NOW and having that money in the bank working for him..

Opposed to hoping he has a great year and getting 8-10 mil more in total..

[EMB6903]

in no particular order except fitz..lol: Fitzgerald, moss, houshman, anquan boldin, reggie wayne, hines ward,roddy white, steve smith, andre johnson, and wow thats 11...there are many others...again i am not knocking him but these guys have the ability to hit 100 catches any given yr. and HAVE been in the top 10 in many stats for year in year out.

Roddy White? Hines Ward? Houshmandzadah? Anquan Boldin?

explain to me how these players are better then Brandon Marshall?

Ill go

1.Larry Fitzgerald
2.Andre Johnson
3.Steve Smith
4.Randy Moss
5.Calvin Johnson
6.Brandon Marshall
7.Anquan Boldin
8.Greg Jennings
9.Roddy White
10.Santonio Holmes

[LordTrychon]

Roddy White? Hines Ward? Houshmandzadah? Anquan Boldin?

explain to me how these players are better then Brandon Marshall?

Ill go

1.Larry Fitzgerald
2.Andre Johnson
3.Steve Smith
4.Randy Moss
5.Calvin Johnson
6.Brandon Marshall
7.Anquan Boldin
8.Greg Jennings
9.Roddy White
10.Santonio Holmes

That seems fairly fair.

I'd still take Marshall over almost anyone at this moment... Except maybe Fitz or Calvin Johnson... when I'm not being a homer...

But I'm more attached to the Beast than the other two. So I'll keep him.

Thanks.

[nevcraw]

That seems fairly fair.

I'd still take Marshall over almost anyone at this moment... Except maybe Fitz or Calvin Johnson... when I'm not being a homer...

But I'm more attached to the Beast than the other two. So I'll keep him.

Thanks.

true! but it's time for him to put it up with a bit of shut up.

[xzn]

Things I've learned in this thread:

1. Brandon Marshall is, at worst, top ten WR in the NFL.

2. He has the potential to get even better

3. He made the Pro Bowl while recovering from a hand injury and missing the first game

What I concluded from this thread:

We need to sign him up. Now.

Correction. We need to sign him YESTERDAY!

[LordTrychon]

true! but it's time for him to put it up with a bit of shut up.

Would another 100 catch season be sufficient, or would he need to have two more to tie the alltime record in his 5th year?

[Den21vsBal19]

Would another 100 catch season be sufficient, or would he need to have two more to tie the alltime record in his 5th year?
Gotta be the two ;)

[nevcraw]

Would another 100 catch season be sufficient, or would he need to have two more to tie the alltime record in his 5th year?

Impressive sure but he can be even better. Imagine if he caught just half of the ones he dropped? Imagine he became a red zone machine? Imagine if he can beat double coverage??? I do. 100 catches are fine but he needs to become complete.

[Lonestar]

Impressive sure but he can be even better. Imagine if he caught just half of the ones he dropped? Imagine he became a red zone machine? Imagine if he can beat double coverage??? I do. 100 catches are fine but he needs to become complete.

If my Aunt Alvera had ball she would be Uncle Albert..

he has a ways to go before I'll proclaim him the football messiah..

[nevcraw]

If my Aunt Alvera had ball she would be Uncle Albert..

he has a ways to go before I'll proclaim him the football messiah..

or she would be Jaime Lee Curtis.. :laugh:

[Lonestar]

or she would be Jaime Lee Curtis.. :laugh:

From what I've seen of Jamie LEE no balls there..


ahh I get it James in Mexican..

[nevcraw]

From what I've seen of Jamie LEE no balls there..


ahh I get it James in Mexican..

there has been a long standing rumor that that she was born with both male and female genitalia..

http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/jamieleecurtis/a/jamieleecurtis.htm

[Lonestar]

there has been a long standing rumor that that she was born with both male and female genitalia..

http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/jamieleecurtis/a/jamieleecurtis.htm


Well After seeing her Daddy he seemed to have been a bit light in the loafers and perhaps that is were the penis came from.. IF it were true..

[TXBRONC]

Impressive sure but he can be even better. Imagine if he caught just half of the ones he dropped? Imagine he became a red zone machine? Imagine if he can beat double coverage??? I do. 100 catches are fine but he needs to become complete.

Guess what there are plenty of hall of famers who regularly didn't put up double digit touchdown receptions or for that matter had two 100 plus catch seasons within first three years.

[nevcraw]

Guess what there are plenty of hall of famers who regularly didn't put up double digit touchdown receptions or for that matter had two 100 plus catch seasons within first three years.

My bad.. He's as good as he can get. I should not hope for more. He's a first round HOF shoe in. Please.

He's got plenty of areas to grow.. settle if you'd like but I wish his play to improve in the areas i mentioned and become more impactful. Settle if you want and let him be Ocho Cinco part dux.. you think 85's a hall of famer?

[TXBRONC]

My bad.. He's as good as he can get. I should not hope for more. He's a first round HOF shoe in. Please.

He's got plenty of areas to grow.. settle if you'd like but I wish his play to improve in the areas i mentioned and become more impactful. Settle if you want and let him be Ocho Cinco part dux.. you think 85's a hall of famer?

I looked back at what I posted I sure hell didn't say anything about settling. What you missed is the fact that there are hall of famers who had similar stats. :coffee:

[nevcraw]

I looked back at what I posted I sure hell didn't say anything about settling. What you missed is the fact that there are hall of famers who had similar stats. :coffee:

I said he should and could get better and you compared his play now to HOF'ers.. if that was not a admission of settling what was it?
And if it wasn't, i am not sure your point.

[broncosinindy]

I really think you HAVE to throw wes welker in there somewhere.

[EMB6903]

Welker is Solid and very consistent, but nowhere near the talent of players I posted on my top 10 though..... the guy is a slot wide reciever playing with the most dangerous deep threat of all time... Great route runner who knows how to feel those soft spots in coverage.... is he a top 10 recieving threat though? a lot might disagree but I dont think so.

[LordTrychon]

Impressive sure but he can be even better. Imagine if he caught just half of the ones he dropped? Imagine he became a red zone machine? Imagine if he can beat double coverage??? I do. 100 catches are fine but he needs to become complete.

While I understand your point that he could do certain things better.... that doesn't make him not top 10.

Peyton Manning and Tom Brady could learn how to scramble better. Vick was better than them at this.

Does that make Manning and Brady outside top ten?

[broncosinindy]

Welker is Solid and very consistent, but nowhere near the talent of players I posted on my top 10 though..... the guy is a slot wide reciever playing with the most dangerous deep threat of all time... Great route runner who knows how to feel those soft spots in coverage.... is he a top 10 recieving threat though? a lot might disagree but I dont think so.

Scheme or not players besdie him or not. he has been extremely productive. Could he go to any team and be a number one, probably not. i think you can definelty say hes the best number two in the leauge.

[dogfish]

Scheme or not players besdie him or not. he has been extremely productive. Could he go to any team and be a number one, probably not. i think you can definelty say hes the best number two in the leauge.

welker the best #2 in the league? gimme anquan boldin any day. . . .

[TXBRONC]

welker the best #2 in the league? gimme anquan boldin any day. . . .

You could Boldin on a lot other teams and he would be their number one receiver.

[TXBRONC]

While I understand your point that he could do certain things better.... that doesn't make him not top 10.

Peyton Manning and Tom Brady could learn how to scramble better. Vick was better than them at this.

Does that make Manning and Brady outside top ten?

:nod:

[Poet]

welker the best #2 in the league? gimme anquan boldin any day. . . .

It's the HOUSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[EMB6903]

Eddie Royal?

I know hes played 1 year.... but if I had a choice between the two?? Ill take Royal any day.