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Ravage!!!
12-17-2011, 11:58 AM
Is it true? I've heard they are trying to get the Christmas celebration date to Augest 14th?

chazoe60
12-17-2011, 11:59 AM
What? Aug is way too hot for a fat guy in a thick red coat.

Ravage!!!
12-17-2011, 12:04 PM
What? Aug is way too hot for a fat guy in a thick red coat.

Yeah, not to mention Santa Clause.

Nomad
12-17-2011, 12:08 PM
Never heard of it......what numbnuts what it changed?!?

Ravage!!!
12-17-2011, 12:09 PM
Never heard of it......what numbnuts what it changed?!?

Well, its Tebow's birthday. So I guess it just follows reason that the date is changed.

chazoe60
12-17-2011, 12:10 PM
Oh I get it now. Rav, you smartass.

Nomad
12-17-2011, 12:11 PM
Well, its Tebow's birthday. So I guess it just follows reason that the date is changed.

:lol:i see where you're going....didn't know it was Tebow's birthday

Nomad
12-17-2011, 12:12 PM
Oh I get it now. Rav, you smartass.

Yeah,he got me!:lol:

jhildebrand
12-17-2011, 12:38 PM
Well if you want to change the date, you should change it to 4/22/2010. That was the date this franchise was reborn :lol:

sneakers
12-18-2011, 12:51 AM
Best thread ever!

:congrats:

Dapper Dan
12-18-2011, 01:38 AM
I remember a discussion once. Christ wasnt born anywhere near December. But there was already a pagan holiday then and thats why they made the celebration in December. I can't remember the speculated date. I keep thinking August or April. When I found that out it kinda ruined Christmas for me.

sneakers
12-18-2011, 01:40 AM
I remember a discussion once. Christ wasnt born anywhere near December. But there was already a pagan holiday then and thats why they made the celebration in December. I can't remember the speculated date. I keep thinking August or April. When I found that out it kinda ruined Christmas for me.

I have heard that due circumstances described in the 4 gospels, the best guess is early summer...so June or so.

Dapper Dan
12-18-2011, 02:34 AM
I have heard that due circumstances described in the 4 gospels, the best guess is early summer...so June or so.

I looked it up after my post and I got a few different dates. I just finished up with my World Religion class. I think I'll email my professor. I can't believe I didn't ask during the semester.

sneakers
12-18-2011, 02:36 AM
I looked it up after my post and I got a few different dates. I just finished up with my World Religion class. I think I'll email my professor. I can't believe I didn't ask during the semester.

Hmmmm, if only there was someone on the forum who was old enough to have been there???

:confused:

Anyone think of such a person??

bcbronc
12-18-2011, 04:00 AM
I remember a discussion once. Christ wasnt born anywhere near December. But there was already a pagan holiday then and thats why they made the celebration in December. I can't remember the speculated date. I keep thinking August or April. When I found that out it kinda ruined Christmas for me.

Saturnalia.

Lots of pagan elements absorbed into Christmas: yule logs, mistletoe, drunk uncles to name a few.

sneakers
12-18-2011, 05:53 AM
Saturnalia.


Is that the chocolate spread that is popular in Europe?

edit: nevermind, it is nutella

artie_dale
12-18-2011, 06:35 AM
Saturnalia was actually the most recent celebration during the birth of Chirstianity. Saturnalia was a Roman festival and it was directly changed to "Christ's Mass", a.k.a., Jesus' birth to wheen the Pagan's (who celebrated Saturnaila) to Christianity. Prior to Saturnalia, there were many other Dec 25th celebrations. The oldest is the Celebration of the Winter Solstice. That was celebrated by many and THE OLDEST civilizations who lived in the Northern hemisphere. The Winter Solstices was the recognition/tracking of the Sun. From the Northern Hemisphere, the Sun was tracked throughout the year so famers knew when to plant and harvest crops. The Fall equinox was the indicator that winter (death) was coming because the cold and snow would kill all plant life... except the Evergreens (a.k.a. Christmas tree). They would track the Sun as it rose lower and lower on the eastern horizon (which made days shorter and nights longer) and on Dec 22nd through Dec 24th, the Sun seemed rise from the same spot for 3 consecutive days (or die), and on Dec 25th, the Sun would rise one degree North and it was celebrated because the Sun would bring warmth, light, and life to the world.

sneakers
12-18-2011, 06:43 AM
Saturnalia was actually the most recent celebration during the birth of Chirstianity. Saturnalia was a Roman festival and it was directly changed to "Christ's Mass", a.k.a., Jesus' birth to wheen the Pagan's (who celebrated Saturnaila) to Christianity. Prior to Saturnalia, there were many other Dec 25th celebrations. The oldest is the Celebration of the Winter Solstice. That was celebrated by many and THE OLDEST civilizations who lived in the Northern hemisphere. The Winter Solstices was the recognition/tracking of the Sun. From the Northern Hemisphere, the Sun was tracked throughout the year so famers knew when to plant and harvest crops. The Fall equinox was the indicator that winter (death) was coming because the cold and snow would kill all plant life... except the Evergreens (a.k.a. Christmas tree). They would track the Sun as it rose lower and lower on the eastern horizon (which made days shorter and nights longer) and on Dec 22nd through Dec 24th, the Sun seemed rise from the same spot for 3 consecutive days (or die), and on Dec 25th, the Sun would rise one degree North and it was celebrated because the Sun would bring warmth, light, and life to the world.

On second thought, Saturnalia sounds like a sex act between two planets.

artie_dale
12-18-2011, 06:46 AM
On second thought, Saturnalia sounds like a sex act between two planets.

Lol. Actually, Saturnalia had a lot of sexual activity, along with brutality, and other vicious acts that powerful Roman people made commoners & slaves do. We all know what the Collisium brought. Saturnalia was another excuse to have more of that kind of entertainment... along with praising nature and what not.

Watchthemiddle
12-18-2011, 06:54 AM
Fine by me...it's my birthday also. Tebow and Me with the same birthday. I knew he was something special, but not near as special as being born on the same day. :cool:

bcbronc
12-18-2011, 02:14 PM
Is that the chocolate spread that is popular in Europe?

edit: nevermind, it is nutella

it's a hazelnut (and chocolate) spread, and it's delicious!

camdisco24
12-18-2011, 03:26 PM
On second thought, Saturnalia sounds like a sex act between two planets.

Actually I think they're those candles that keep mosquitoes away in the summer time. I could be wrong though.

I Eat Staples
12-18-2011, 08:33 PM
Interesting, I have the same birthday as Tebow.

Broncos Mtnman
12-18-2011, 10:16 PM
Well, its Tebow's birthday. So I guess it just follows reason that the date is changed.

:rofl:

Of course, you know you'll burn in hell for making a joke at Timmy's expense, don't you?

BroncoNut
12-19-2011, 01:02 AM
I remember a discussion once. Christ wasnt born anywhere near December. But there was already a pagan holiday then and thats why they made the celebration in December. I can't remember the speculated date. I keep thinking August or April. When I found that out it kinda ruined Christmas for me.

It must have been cold because that's the way the story was told. But maybe that is not aligned with Scripture.

Joel
12-19-2011, 01:22 AM
It must have been cold because that's the way the story was told. But maybe that is not aligned with Scripture.
The scriptural point to which most people point is that the shepherds were with their flocks in the fields when an angel appeared with an additional annunciation. Typically, shepherds and their flocks are not in the fields in the dead of winter, since 1) the flocks are recently sheared and 2) none of them wants to freeze to death. However, I'm not sure how big an issue that is in the Holy Land.

In the grand scheme it doesn't really matter; the YEAR of Christs birth is only known to about 4-6 years, so any speculation about the day is just that: Speculation. The date is not the important issue, so any day will do for the celebration and, for those who actually care about celebrating it for that reason, every day is appropriate.

BroncoNut
12-19-2011, 02:07 PM
The scriptural point to which most people point is that the shepherds were with their flocks in the fields when an angel appeared with an additional annunciation. Typically, shepherds and their flocks are not in the fields in the dead of winter, since 1) the flocks are recently sheared and 2) none of them wants to freeze to death. However, I'm not sure how big an issue that is in the Holy Land.

In the grand scheme it doesn't really matter; the YEAR of Christs birth is only known to about 4-6 years, so any speculation about the day is just that: Speculation. The date is not the important issue, so any day will do for the celebration and, for those who actually care about celebrating it for that reason, every day is appropriate.

yeah, those are good points. it doesn't really matter to me, but the shepareds in the field is a good reference point. I do question if the sheep are recently sheared close to the 25th of December. Then again, maybe that is when the wool is in the best condition. And also, rain or shine, sheep need to be tended to/protected from predators,etc. .

artie_dale
12-19-2011, 05:44 PM
The scriptural point to which most people point is that the shepherds were with their flocks in the fields when an angel appeared with an additional annunciation. Typically, shepherds and their flocks are not in the fields in the dead of winter, since 1) the flocks are recently sheared and 2) none of them wants to freeze to death. However, I'm not sure how big an issue that is in the Holy Land.

In the grand scheme it doesn't really matter; the YEAR of Christs birth is only known to about 4-6 years, so any speculation about the day is just that: Speculation. The date is not the important issue, so any day will do for the celebration and, for those who actually care about celebrating it for that reason, every day is appropriate.

It still gets cold in Israel, but not enough to freeze constantly or snow. The climate in the spring and summer is damn near perfect. The place is beautiful.

The Glue Factory
12-19-2011, 05:55 PM
My dad's an amateur astronomer and has done some research regarding this and found interesting astronomical events circa 3-2 BC. One of which was a conjunction of Venus and Jupiter. If you had a telescope at that time the conjunction was so close that they would have appeared as almost overlapping. This would have caused an extremely bright "star" to appear. That conjunction is believed by some to be the "Star of Bethelehem." This conjunction happened in June of 2 BC heralding Christ's birth later that year in Sept.

The Star That Astonished the World: "Star of Bethlehem" is a very interesting read if you don't mind reading some Roman history to understand the author's case for the Jupiter/Venus conjunction of 2 BC as the star of Bethlehem.

artie_dale
12-19-2011, 05:59 PM
My dad's an amateur astronomer and has done some research regarding this and found interesting astronomical events circa 3-2 BC. One of which was a conjunction of Venus and Jupiter. If you had a telescope at that time the conjunction was so close that they would have appeared as almost overlapping. This would have caused an extremely bright "star" to appear. That conjunction is believed by some to be the "Star of Bethelehem." This conjunction happened in June of 2 BC heralding Christ's birth later that year in Sept.

The Star That Astonished the World: "Star of Bethlehem" is a very interesting read if you don't mind reading some Roman history to understand the author's case for the Jupiter/Venus conjunction of 2 BC as the star of Bethlehem.

Yes, I've heard that too.