Baltimore Sports report on Tebow

[Superchop 7]

Tebow May Not be “Great,” But There’s Room for More than One Type of QB
By Weston Bruner, on November 18th, 2011
I have avoided talking about Tim Tebow on this column or any other because I don’t really fall into one of the partisan camps on the kid. There seems to be about 40% of the country that thinks he is an awful, horrible excuse for a quarterback who should have been moved to H-back or TE the moment he left college. These people also think that he would make a poor H-back at that. There is another 40% that thinks he is a brilliant quarterback who, if given the opportunity, could become one of the top quarterbacks in the NFL. They also want him to baptize their child or future child, just in case. I have always found myself in a quiet 20%. I think he has the potential to be a solid (that is, average) quarterback by the statistical measures we use to track their performance. He will never be considered among the upper echelon, but that shouldn’t be something to be ashamed of, considering the 4th rounders many people would have picked over Tebow won’t be starting either. What the controversy highlights however is the changing definition of what makes a quarterback “good.”

It used to be that it was easy to determine what was a good quarterback. He threw a lot of touchdowns, few picks, and had a high completion percentage. Add in a nice deep ball and you have it. The people who can’t stand Tebow look at his flawed mechanics, low completion percentage and wobbly passes that make him look like he should be back in high school learning how to throw a pass. They see him running around like a bruising running back rather than taking a neat slide after a three yard gain. Simply put, he doesn’t look like that prototypical quarterback and he doesn’t match what we envision in our minds to be a true quarterback.

But there is a funny thing about this sport. Positions change over time, and it could be that there is room for more than one type of quarterback. A quarterback’s job is to lead the offense and win games. If he can keep the defense honest enough with his arm and find ways to move the football, then what exactly is the problem?


www.baltimoresportsreport.com for rest of article.

[BroncoJoe]

Nice article. I've said it before - sure defenses are bigger, stronger and faster in the NFL.

Everyone on all sides of the ball are.

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[Slick]

I think he over estimates the two tebow factions. Most of us are in the middle, it's just the extremists on both sides are the loudest. I'd say 80 percent of us are just enjoying the ride, seeing what happens.

Good read. Thanks chop.

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[Simple Jaded]

Among other reasons, NFL coaches don't make these so-called innovative adaptations that they make at the college level because they don't have to. The spread has spread like a shit disease through the college ranks because it masks the lack of talent a team has.

In the pro's, if you have a QB that can't hit the broad side of a barn you go get one who can. Unless, of course, you have Tim Tebow.......

[Simple Jaded]

Nice article. I've said it before - sure defenses are bigger, stronger and faster in the NFL.

Everyone on all sides of the ball are.

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This isn't exactly true, what seperates Oregon from Stanford is the Ducks speed on offense. That's why those coaches go to the spread. It comes from the same principle as the run-and-shoot, putting smaller, faster and quicker players than they have on defense.

In the NFL every team is as fast as Oregon. This is also why the Oregon's struggle against teams like LSU.......

[hamrob]

Excellent article. Personally, I think Tebow can be a better than average passer...in the Ben Roethlesberger mold. But, I think this article hits the nail on the head. If you can manage the game and win football games...you are doing well.

Do, I think Tebow has to be a better passer. Yes. Do I think he's as bad a passer as many want to make him out to be. No.

But, I'll take 4-1 or 12-4 any season!

[Northman]

Excellent article. Personally, I think Tebow can be a better than average passer...in the Ben Roethlesberger mold. But, I think this article hits the nail on the head. If you can manage the game and win football games...you are doing well.

Do, I think Tebow has to be a better passer. Yes. Do I think he's as bad a passer as many want to make him out to be. No.

But, I'll take 4-1 or 12-4 any season!

When has Tebow been 12-4?

[SR]

I'm enjoying the wins for now but I have reservations. I respect Tebow as an athlete and as a person but I absolutely hate the way he plays quarterback. I'm sure I'll receive death threats now, but **** it.

[Nomad]

. I'm sure I'll receive death threats now, but **** it.

That's funny!:lol:

[catfish]

When has Tebow been 12-4?

I think he was extending the wins so far this year over a full year, as past success does not guarantee future success I don't think it is a wise assumption, but thats just me. Tebow could win the next 6 or lose the next 6 or any combo thereof, just because he has won 4 of the last 5 doesn't mean it will continue

edit: doesn't mean it wont either ;)

[BroncoStud]

I keep hearing a lot about this Tebow guy... He any good?

[camdisco24]

I keep hearing a lot about this Tebow guy... He any good?

nah, he couldn't even beat the Lions!

[SR]

nah, he couldn't even beat the Lions!

And he can't throw a spiral.

[broncobryce]

And he can't throw a spiral.
Orton can.

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[SR]

Orton can.

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So can Brady Quinn.

[hamrob]

When has Tebow been 12-4?Any season that he keeps up the pace of 4-1.

[nflfan]

Excellent article. Personally, I think Tebow can be a better than average passer...in the Ben Roethlesberger mold. But, I think this article hits the nail on the head. If you can manage the game and win football games...you are doing well.

Do, I think Tebow has to be a better passer. Yes. Do I think he's as bad a passer as many want to make him out to be. No.

But, I'll take 4-1 or 12-4 any season!

Just a side note: Ben Roethlisberger is not just a better than average passer. The guy can make every throw with precision, power, and touch. He can also do this while running or getting tackled.

If Tebow can make the throws Roethlisberger can make, then he'd be an excellent passer.

[chazoe60]

Just a side note: Ben Roethlisberger is not just a better than average passer. The guy can make every throw with precision, power, and touch. He can also do this while running or getting tackled.

If Tebow can make the throws Roethlisberger can make, then he'd be an excellent passer.

And he's awesome at raping.

[nflfan]

And he's awesome at raping.

Whatever really happened on those incidents has nothing to do with his passing abilities, just like Tebow having great character has nothing to do with his passing deficiencies.

[chazoe60]

Whatever really happened on those incidents has nothing to do with his passing abilities, just like Tebow having great character has nothing to do with his passing deficiencies.

You have a wicked awesome sense of humor.

[claymore]

I think he over estimates the two tebow factions. Most of us are in the middle, it's just the extremists on both sides are the loudest. I'd say 80 percent of us are just enjoying the ride, seeing what happens.

Good read. Thanks chop.

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We have already crossed my threshold of comfort. I was scared he would play well enough to win some games and take us out of the Luck race.

The real fear is that he is nothing more than a mediocre/bad QB, and we wasted another year.

I havent crossed that yet. Jury is still out. 50% of Tebow is off the charts fantastic/awesome. The other 50% (Throwing skillz) is terrible. If he can be mediocre-good at throwing the ball, I think he will be great.

In short, I have no choice but to root for Tebow. Despite his biggest drawback (Gator fans).

[Skacorica]

I suspect, after having watched a fair amount of his games at Florida, that his throwing skills are not as bad as we have seen so far. He is certainly capable of being accurate, look at his college passing stats:
Year School Conf Class Pos Cmp Att Pct Yds Y/A AY/A TD Int Rate
2006 Florida SEC FR QB 22 33 66.7 358 10.8 12.5 5 1 201.7
2007 Florida SEC SO QB 234 350 66.9 3286 9.4 10.4 32 6 172.5
2008 Florida SEC JR QB 192 298 64.4 2746 9.2 10.6 30 4 172.4
2009 Florida SEC SR QB 213 314 67.8 2895 9.2 9.8 21 5 164.2
Career Florida 661 995 66.4 9285 9.3 10.4 88 16 170.8

He was not as inaccurate as he has been so far.

Im more concerned about his ability to make reads, quickly.

[catfish]

I suspect, after having watched a fair amount of his games at Florida, that his throwing skills are not as bad as we have seen so far. He is certainly capable of being accurate, look at his college passing stats:
Year School Conf Class Pos Cmp Att Pct Yds Y/A AY/A TD Int Rate
2006 Florida SEC FR QB 22 33 66.7 358 10.8 12.5 5 1 201.7
2007 Florida SEC SO QB 234 350 66.9 3286 9.4 10.4 32 6 172.5
2008 Florida SEC JR QB 192 298 64.4 2746 9.2 10.6 30 4 172.4
2009 Florida SEC SR QB 213 314 67.8 2895 9.2 9.8 21 5 164.2
Career Florida 661 995 66.4 9285 9.3 10.4 88 16 170.8

He was not as inaccurate as he has been so far.

Im more concerned about his ability to make reads, quickly.

It has been brought up that the accuracy may be a mental issue...trying too hard not to turn the ball over, if that is that case it may be that it never gets fixed, or that one day a switch flips and his completion % spikes. I would invest in a good sports psychologist if I were Tim

[catfish]

We have already crossed my threshold of comfort. I was scared he would play well enough to win some games and take us out of the Luck race.

The real fear is that he is nothing more than a mediocre/bad QB, and we wasted another year.

I havent crossed that yet. Jury is still out. 50% of Tebow is off the charts fantastic/awesome. The other 50% (Throwing skillz) is terrible. If he can be mediocre-good at throwing the ball, I think he will be great.

In short, I have no choice but to root for Tebow. Despite his biggest drawback (Gator fans).

love you too buddy ;) (I don't blame you for hating some of us)

[HORSEPOWER 56]

Just a side note: Ben Roethlisberger is not just a better than average passer. The guy can make every throw with precision, power, and touch. He can also do this while running or getting tackled.

If Tebow can make the throws Roethlisberger can make, then he'd be an excellent passer.

But he wasn't his first few seasons. He was shielded by a great defense and running game and only asked to throw when necessary (like we're doing with Tebow). Roethlisberger still holds the record for worst passing performance by a Superbowl winning QB, but because he was forced into action as a rookie and didn't make a ton of mistakes (and most importantly, the Steelers won games) he developed the reputation as a "winner".

Ben has developed into a much better passer over the years as the Steelers' offensive scheme has developed from a run first, to a balanced scheme, to more of a pass-first scheme. Once again, to expect someone like Tebow to be an all-pro passer, sling the ball all over the yard, and not turn it over his first year (yes, it's still his first year) is unrealistic and is only an expectation for Tebow.

Once again, why is it so important for Tebow to throw the ball 30 times a game if we're winning running the ball and playing good defense? If it's just so people can say he's developing as a passer, then it's the wrong reason. His development will come with reps and game-time experience. Right now, he's doing more than most young QBs: winning more games than he's losing and not turning the ball over. If it was any other QB, that would be enough.

[Northman]

I suspect, after having watched a fair amount of his games at Florida, that his throwing skills are not as bad as we have seen so far. He is certainly capable of being accurate, look at his college passing stats:
Year School Conf Class Pos Cmp Att Pct Yds Y/A AY/A TD Int Rate
2006 Florida SEC FR QB 22 33 66.7 358 10.8 12.5 5 1 201.7
2007 Florida SEC SO QB 234 350 66.9 3286 9.4 10.4 32 6 172.5
2008 Florida SEC JR QB 192 298 64.4 2746 9.2 10.6 30 4 172.4
2009 Florida SEC SR QB 213 314 67.8 2895 9.2 9.8 21 5 164.2
Career Florida 661 995 66.4 9285 9.3 10.4 88 16 170.8

He was not as inaccurate as he has been so far.

Im more concerned about his ability to make reads, quickly.


Again, you cant compare his college stats to what he does in the NFL. The level of talent in both leagues is vastly different. 85% of the players that Tebow played against in college dont even make it in the NFL.

[SR]

I suspect, after having watched a fair amount of his games at Florida, that his throwing skills are not as bad as we have seen so far. He is certainly capable of being accurate, look at his college passing stats:
Year School Conf Class Pos Cmp Att Pct Yds Y/A AY/A TD Int Rate
2006 Florida SEC FR QB 22 33 66.7 358 10.8 12.5 5 1 201.7
2007 Florida SEC SO QB 234 350 66.9 3286 9.4 10.4 32 6 172.5
2008 Florida SEC JR QB 192 298 64.4 2746 9.2 10.6 30 4 172.4
2009 Florida SEC SR QB 213 314 67.8 2895 9.2 9.8 21 5 164.2
Career Florida 661 995 66.4 9285 9.3 10.4 88 16 170.8

He was not as inaccurate as he has been so far.

Im more concerned about his ability to make reads, quickly.

He also had a lot more time to throw the ball in college. If you watch games he played, not just highlight reels, any time he felt pressure he pulled the ball down and ran.

[SR]

Once again, why is it so important for Tebow to throw the ball 30 times a game if we're winning running the ball and playing good defense?

It's not. But it is important that for the 8-20 attempts he does get per game that he does throw accurately. If he can't accurately throw the ball, the defense has no reason to play double coverage or keep safeties in a zone. They can bring eight guys every time he drops back because they know he can't throw it on the money.

[T.K.O.]

Catfish is the coooooolest new poster on the Forums......
level headed with a nice mix of optimism.

"****4 stars raves T.K.O."

"A must read " ....the Denver Post

:salute::D

[catfish]

Catfish is the coooooolest new poster on the Forums......
level headed with a nice mix of optimism.

"****4 stars raves T.K.O."

"A must read " ....the Denver Post

:salute::D

my book tour starts soon "Overweight, drinking beer watching football...the Catfish story" hits shelves in time for christmas ;)

[Northman]

Reel Big Fish> Catfish








:)

[catfish]

Reel Big Fish> Catfish




:)

Tebows passing skill>Norths smack talking skill

;)

[Northman]

Tebows passing skill>Norths smack talking skill

;)

Ive got nothing... that was below the belt....... bible belt.... :D

[catfish]

Ive got nothing... that was below the belt....... bible belt.... :D

notches on tebows bedpost>North's comeback ability:D

[Northman]

notches on tebows bedpost>North's comeback ability:D


Oh shit.... does this include sock puppets? :lol:

[catfish]

Oh shit.... does this include sock puppets? :lol:

that last one of mine may have been over the line....funny though

[chazoe60]

I hope Tebow sticks around just so we can keep catfish. It's nice having someone around to put North in his place.

[Northman]

Wha?.......................

Damn......, let the rivers flow with North's blood all of a sudden. Whats the world coming too? lol

[catfish]

I hope Tebow sticks around just so we can keep catfish. It's nice having someone around to put North in his place.

Even if Tebow goes I most likely will stay, I have become pretty a pretty big fan of Champ and Von(us SEC guys love us some defense). Plus I enjoy debating in general(with the more rational people)

[catfish]

Wha?.......................

Damn......, let the rivers flow with North's blood all of a sudden. Whats the world coming too? lol

:violin:

its not your fault North, what are the odds of you running up against a Tebow supporter capable of original thought.:heh:

[claymore]

love you too buddy ;) (I don't blame you for hating some of us)

I think I like you. Jaxgator girl or whatever her name is seem to be normal good people. The other nut jobs... Geesh.

[catfish]

I think I like you. Jaxgator girl or whatever her name is seem to be normal good people. The other nut jobs... Geesh.

agreed I like Jax too, there are some others who state (IMO) valid points in the worst possible way, and other who are off their rockers

[claymore]

agreed I like Jax too, there are some others who state (IMO) valid points in the worst possible way, and other who are off their rockers

Have you and Jax exchanged digits?

[chazoe60]

Have you and Jax exchanged digits?

You mean these kind of digits?
http://24.media.tumblr.com/kLNun04UVmm0ko6se6hJpaaHo1_500.jpg

[catfish]

You mean these kind of digits?
http://24.media.tumblr.com/kLNun04UVmm0ko6se6hJpaaHo1_500.jpg

lol...stay classy ;)

[claymore]

You mean these kind of digits?
http://24.media.tumblr.com/kLNun04UVmm0ko6se6hJpaaHo1_500.jpg

I cant see the image at work. :(

[Dreadnought]

lol...stay classy ;)

Thats not Chazoe's style, that is, classy. Great poster though

I will say that you, Wayninja, Jaxgatorgirl have been positive additions here, without question. There has been a noob or two that, uh, don't bring so much to the table. We had a few dunces here before we drafted Tebow though, and we shouldn't pretend otherwise.

PS - I can't prove it, but its always possible a few of the worst Tebois are in fact actually previously unknown Hot Carl personas

[claymore]

You mean these kind of digits?
http://24.media.tumblr.com/kLNun04UVmm0ko6se6hJpaaHo1_500.jpg

I like it. I have often spit on the teaser just for a looksee down there.

[Northman]

They got the rocker all wrong.

http://files.myopera.com/rpsgc/albums/16337/DEVIL%20HORNS.png

[Medford Bronco]

Orton can.

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and it got returned for a TD by the defense :lol:

[FlyByU]

Nice article. I've said it before - sure defenses are bigger, stronger and faster in the NFL.

I disagree the NFL isn't any better today then they were in the 70's 80's 90's.

In fact they don't hit near as hard as they use to and a QB had to take punishment and still compete now days no one is allowed to hit anyone hard or its a fine and there are very few hard hits in today's NFL. I doubt today s QB's WR's etc. would not make a whole season in the 70's 80's or 90's. The NFL was much tougher then it is today in those past years when men were men and football was an American sport...