Miller Adds More to Sack Count

[FlyByU]

Credited with 1 1/2 sacks Thursday night against the New York Jets (http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_19362970)

Miller close to taking rookie Sack record.

[chazoe60]

People thought I was crazy because I predicted 12 sacks for him. I guess, my prediction was too low. :laugh:

[CoachChaz]

I think I predicted around 7, but I'm happy to be wrong.

I dont know if another 5.5 sacks to get the record is realistic, but it will be fun watching

[smith49]

F R E A K!!!!!


Not only is he threatening the rookie sack record, but he is everywhere else on the field as well. Do we have more than one #58 out there? It sure seems like it. Kid is a monster freak!!

[vhatever]

I think I predicted around 7, but I'm happy to be wrong.

I dont know if another 5.5 sacks to get the record is realistic, but it will be fun watching

It's actually fairly realistic. He's averaging about a sack a game. So as long as he stays healthy and on pace he's got a good shot at it. Too bad the bear oline has been doing so much better this year. That would have been a game miller probably might have pulled out a multiple sack game.

[BigDaddyBronco]

He has just been a beast since Doom came back to full speed. The Raiders and jets both have a decent OLine. I see no reason why they can't continue to put up decent numbers.

[camdisco24]

Von has quickly become one of the favorite Broncos.

[Northman]

Miller is da man.

[GEM]

I loved the play on the Jets last drive when Miller just shoved that tackle out of the way and went after Sanchez. That was fan-*******-tastic!!! :D

[FlyByU]

Hey it says he had 10 tackles also in the Jets game. That is amazing... I am very happy with the Miller pick and ecstatic with Miller the Player.

[Locnar]

I think he can average a sack a game. We haven't seen nothin yet. He's on the verge of having a breakout game where he has 3 or 4 sacks a game with a forced fumble or two. He's friggin good..

[sneakers]

What is the rookie sack record?

[chazoe60]

What is the rookie sack record?

14.5


Or 345627892664529


It's one of those two. Now guess which

[broncofaninfla]

Miller has improved our pass defense in a big way by putting fear in opposing QB's. With Doom starting to come on as well I feel good about this defense getting even better down the stretch. The team is playing with fire and spunk, Tebow gets a lof of cedit for the renewed passion with the players and deservedly so but Miller is playing a big part of this too. I'd say he is arguably already our best player and getting even better. It's looking like EFX made the right pick and this coming from a fan who wanted Darius.

[Joel]

I hope that articles citation of NFL stats is more accurate than its citation of CMH stats, 'cos even the Wikipedia article on Salvatore Guinta says he's the first living CMH recipient SINCE VIETNAM (i.e. not the first EVER.) Maybe sports writers should stick to writing sports (and some of them shouldn't even do that. :tongue:)

Miller's a great all around player I'm more inclined than ever to think will end up as our Pro Bowl MLB for years to come. I'd love to see him win DROY and take the rookie sack record, both of which seem very plausible at present. I would hate to see him fined 3+ times for spearing along the way, which seems equally plausible, unfortunately. I kinda hope he dispenses with the helmet-leading and extra steps AND gets the rookie sack record, just so I don't have to hear people complaining that playing by the rules cost him a meaningless record.

[Agent of Orange]

I hope that articles citation of NFL stats is more accurate than its citation of CMH stats, 'cos even the Wikipedia article on Salvatore Guinta says he's the first living CMH recipient SINCE VIETNAM (i.e. not the first EVER.) Maybe sports writers should stick to writing sports (and some of them shouldn't even do that. :tongue:)

Miller's a great all around player I'm more inclined than ever to think will end up as our Pro Bowl MLB for years to come. I'd love to see him win DROY and take the rookie sack record, both of which seem very plausible at present. I would hate to see him fined 3+ times for spearing along the way, which seems equally plausible, unfortunately. I kinda hope he dispenses with the helmet-leading and extra steps AND gets the rookie sack record, just so I don't have to hear people complaining that playing by the rules cost him a meaningless record.

He's not a mike.

[sneakers]

14.5


Or 345627892664529


It's one of those two. Now guess which

Is that in one game? or for an entire season? :shocked:

[TXBRONC]

I think I predicted around 7, but I'm happy to be wrong.

I dont know if another 5.5 sacks to get the record is realistic, but it will be fun watching

We have six games to go and he averaging nearly a sack a game I think 5.5 is very doable.

[Joel]

He's not a mike.
Agreed; he could, however, become one. As a 4-3 Will whose primary duty is covering TEs and RBs in the flat he'd be wasted, and almost as much so as a 4-3 Sam whose main responsibility is run stuffing. Miller doesn't have the pro experience or coverage ability to be a pro Mike (and he's 5-10 pounds lighter than Mikes I like,) but, in much the same way Tebow has the smarts and physical ability to learn how to be a pro passer, Miller has the mental and physical skills to learn how to be the 4-3 QB. I've been pleasantly surprised by Mays to this point, but he is not a star, nor do I expect him to be, and a great 4-3 needs a star at Mike and DE just as a great 3-4 needs one at OLB and NT: In both cases, the rest of the front seven is just a supporting cast; they need to be good enough to start, but the D will stand or fall on other players.

If we were a 3-4 team, Miller would be a stellar OLB (though I'd still want him to be >250,) but putting him there in a 4-3 would be like putting Tebow at TE or RB: A tragic waste of great talent. In many ways it would be worse, because Miller would have a much shallower learning curve as a Mike; basically, he needs to learn how to read offensive formations to call audibles, and get better in pass coverage. If he does that (and he'll have to do the latter even if he stays at Sam) 5 or 10 pounds of mass won't be such a big deal, though it would certainly be welcome if it didn't slow him down too much.

Going into this season, one of my biggest questions was "where is out standout Mike?" and Miller looked like the only one with the ability and skill set to answer that question. He still does, so unless we draft or trade for someone I still see no other long term choice. One of the many ways a 4-3 MLB is analogous to the QB is it's one of the few positions where the backup has to be near starter quality to prevent a complete collapse when the starter is hurt. Once Miller has the savvy, him backed by Mays would be a LB corps with which I was completely satisfied, which I've not been able to say for a long time, not even when I was screaming for a quality backup to Al Wilson (I think we can all now agree that would've been a good investment.)

[dogfish]

dude! von miller is not a MIKE, and he's never going to be a MIKE. . . could he be? maybe. . . who cares? he's an edge rusher, and he's already settled in at SAM-- and they're hardly wasting him. . . when most SAMs come off the field in the nickel, von just drops down to end. . . they're also effectively dropping him on the end on the line in the under front we've been playing so much. . . he's NOT changing position, there's no point even talking about it. . .

[chazoe60]

I love the way they're using him. No need to change something if it's working. Let Von do his thing. He's playing the run very well also, he's not just a pass rusher, he's a defensive monster on multiple fronts.

[Slick]

I liked it when Von ran down Plaxico on that pass play in the second half.

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[dogfish]

I liked it when Von ran down Plaxico on that pass play in the second half.

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kind of like a cheetah taking down an old, slow antelope. . .

[Agent of Orange]

dude! von miller is not a MIKE, and he's never going to be a MIKE. . . could he be? maybe. . . who cares? he's an edge rusher, and he's already settled in at SAM-- and they're hardly wasting him. . . when most SAMs come off the field in the nickel, von just drops down to end. . . they're also effectively dropping him on the end on the line in the under front we've been playing so much. . . he's NOT changing position, there's no point even talking about it. . .

Exactly. 10 tackles, 3 tackles for loss, 1.5 sacks, 1 pass deflection, and 1 forced fumble is hardly being wasted.

[Joel]

Exactly. 10 tackles, 3 tackles for loss, 1.5 sacks, 1 pass deflection, and 1 forced fumble is hardly being wasted.
I think he could be more at Mike, not yet, but ultimately. That and RDE is where you need your playmaker in a 4-3. If you have a guy with that kind of potential but who lacks the experience for pro pass coverage and defensive reads, the obvious place to put him is Sam; the Will has to cover at least as well as the Mike, so that's pretty much the only option for a straight up blitzer too small to play DE. There's a reason we moved our best Will to Mike a few years ago even though he was really undersized for the position and it left us with MAJOR matchup problems against the Dallas Clarks and Tony Gonzales: Mike is THAT much more important in a 4-3, because it has to do everything well and call defensive plays on top of that.

Give Miller a few years of experience and I'd much rather have him at Mike and Mays at Sam than the other way around, but that's just me. I can't argue with the production we're getting out of him now, but if he stays at Sam (which I still think would be a mistake down the road) I'm back wondering who's going to be our elite Mike. We will still need one and, while I also like what we've seen from Mays, I don't think he's it (though he would be my first choice for backup, and he could start at Sam the rest of the time.)

[bcbronc]

I think he could be more at Mike, not yet, but ultimately. That and RDE is where you need your playmaker in a 4-3. If you have a guy with that kind of potential but who lacks the experience for pro pass coverage and defensive reads, the obvious place to put him is Sam; the Will has to cover at least as well as the Mike, so that's pretty much the only option for a straight up blitzer too small to play DE. There's a reason we moved our best Will to Mike a few years ago even though he was really undersized for the position and it left us with MAJOR matchup problems against the Dallas Clarks and Tony Gonzales: Mike is THAT much more important in a 4-3, because it has to do everything well and call defensive plays on top of that.

Give Miller a few years of experience and I'd much rather have him at Mike and Mays at Sam than the other way around, but that's just me. I can't argue with the production we're getting out of him now, but if he stays at Sam (which I still think would be a mistake down the road) I'm back wondering who's going to be our elite Mike. We will still need one and, while I also like what we've seen from Mays, I don't think he's it (though he would be my first choice for backup, and he could start at Sam the rest of the time.)

sorry Joel, I have to agree with dog on this one. Miller doesn't have a Mike physique. He's not built to be stuffing RBs in the B-gap, never mind taking on guards and fullbacks in the process. He's built for coming off the edge. Like dog said, he's a cheetah...a mike should be more like a warthog or something imo.

Being 5-5 at this point is great, but it's the defense that's really giving me a chubby so far. I love how mean Von his when he gets a shot at the QB. No little push or chest bump from Miller, he leaves bruises. I completely disagree with anyone wanting Miller to tone it down in fear of fines...lol next time we play Cassel or Sanchez they're going to have a rough sleep Saturday night.

Two things I absolutely love about what Fox has done in such a short period:

-we're holding our own in the trenches on both sides of the ball.
-our defense brings pain to QBs. Von's a big part of that.

[Joel]

sorry Joel, I have to agree with dog on this one. Miller doesn't have a Mike physique. He's not built to be stuffing RBs in the B-gap, never mind taking on guards and fullbacks in the process. He's built for coming off the edge. Like dog said, he's a cheetah...a mike should be more like a warthog or something imo.

Being 5-5 at this point is great, but it's the defense that's really giving me a chubby so far. I love how mean Von his when he gets a shot at the QB. No little push or chest bump from Miller, he leaves bruises. I completely disagree with anyone wanting Miller to tone it down in fear of fines...lol next time we play Cassel or Sanchez they're going to have a rough sleep Saturday night.

Two things I absolutely love about what Fox has done in such a short period:

-we're holding our own in the trenches on both sides of the ball.
-our defense brings pain to QBs. Von's a big part of that.
Fair enough; I seem to be a minority of one on this one, and I do agree he's a bit small for Mike (though that should also make him a bit small for a Sam, and yet.... ;)) Like I say though, that leaves me back at "do you think Mays is our long term solution at Mike, and if not, who IS the solution at the most important position in a 4-3 D?"

I don't want Miller to tone it down for fear of fines; I do want him to stop taking extra steps and spearing guys for fear of seriously injuring them, not to mention giving beaten teams drive extending first downs or an extra play at the end of regulation, or getting himself suspended for a few games we can't afford to lose.

The defensive turnaround has been phenomenal (though, to be fair, the only really good offensive team they've beaten is the Raiders.) In every single one of Tebows four wins the D played lights out all game long so all Tebow had to do was have one good drive at the end. Heck, he even managed that against the Lions--after we gave up 45 points and it didn't matter. What a difference a D makes, and Miller has been a huge part of that. He can remain every bit as much so, punish and intimidate QBs, without taking extra steps or spearing, but he shouldn't be making illegal hits even if he couldn't.

[TXBRONC]

Agreed; he could, however, become one. As a 4-3 Will whose primary duty is covering TEs and RBs in the flat he'd be wasted, and almost as much so as a 4-3 Sam whose main responsibility is run stuffing. Miller doesn't have the pro experience or coverage ability to be a pro Mike (and he's 5-10 pounds lighter than Mikes I like,) but, in much the same way Tebow has the smarts and physical ability to learn how to be a pro passer, Miller has the mental and physical skills to learn how to be the 4-3 QB. I've been pleasantly surprised by Mays to this point, but he is not a star, nor do I expect him to be, and a great 4-3 needs a star at Mike and DE just as a great 3-4 needs one at OLB and NT: In both cases, the rest of the front seven is just a supporting cast; they need to be good enough to start, but the D will stand or fall on other players.

If we were a 3-4 team, Miller would be a stellar OLB (though I'd still want him to be >250,) but putting him there in a 4-3 would be like putting Tebow at TE or RB: A tragic waste of great talent. In many ways it would be worse, because Miller would have a much shallower learning curve as a Mike; basically, he needs to learn how to read offensive formations to call audibles, and get better in pass coverage. If he does that (and he'll have to do the latter even if he stays at Sam) 5 or 10 pounds of mass won't be such a big deal, though it would certainly be welcome if it didn't slow him down too much.

Going into this season, one of my biggest questions was "where is out standout Mike?" and Miller looked like the only one with the ability and skill set to answer that question. He still does, so unless we draft or trade for someone I still see no other long term choice. One of the many ways a 4-3 MLB is analogous to the QB is it's one of the few positions where the backup has to be near starter quality to prevent a complete collapse when the starter is hurt. Once Miller has the savvy, him backed by Mays would be a LB corps with which I was completely satisfied, which I've not been able to say for a long time, not even when I was screaming for a quality backup to Al Wilson (I think we can all now agree that would've been a good investment.)

Joel, I don't think it would be a good use of Miller's talents to put him at the mike position.

[TXBRONC]

Fair enough; I seem to be a minority of one on this one, and I do agree he's a bit small for Mike (though that should also make him a bit small for a Sam, and yet.... ;)) Like I say though, that leaves me back at "do you think Mays is our long term solution at Mike, and if not, who IS the solution at the most important position in a 4-3 D?"

I don't want Miller to tone it down for fear of fines; I do want him to stop taking extra steps and spearing guys for fear of seriously injuring them, not to mention giving beaten teams drive extending first downs or an extra play at the end of regulation, or getting himself suspended for a few games we can't afford to lose.

The defensive turnaround has been phenomenal (though, to be fair, the only really good offensive team they've beaten is the Raiders.) In every single one of Tebows four wins the D played lights out all game long so all Tebow had to do was have one good drive at the end. Heck, he even managed that against the Lions--after we gave up 45 points and it didn't matter. What a difference a D makes, and Miller has been a huge part of that. He can remain every bit as much so, punish and intimidate QBs, without taking extra steps or spearing, but he shouldn't be making illegal hits even if he couldn't.

In a 4-3 defense the linebackers are generally smaller than 3-4 linebackers. I looked at several teams that run a 4-3 and generally the linebackers ran about 230lbs to 240lbs range across the board (even the sam line backers) and unlike our defense those teams don't look to their linebackers to get sacks. So our 4-3 defense isn't like other 4-3 defense.

[FlyByU]

Let the count down begin...

Miller needs 5 and 1/2 sacks to make a new record. Let us keep track of this right here and watch him break it.


The count down begins now...

[Joel]

In a 4-3 defense the linebackers are generally smaller than 3-4 linebackers. I looked at several teams that run a 4-3 and generally the linebackers ran about 230lbs to 240lbs range across the board (even the sam line backers) and unlike our defense those teams don't look to their linebackers to get sacks. So our 4-3 defense isn't like other 4-3 defense.
Maybe they're getting smaller as the game speeds up; from what I recall I've usually seen Mikes and Sams up around 250 (hence I was unsurprised DJ got run over a lot playing Sam and Mike at 240.) I'll take your word for it though, because NFL.com habitually locks up Chrome when I hit the site during and just after games, so it would be hard for me to double check at present even were I inclined to do so. Historically, 3-4 LBs have been bigger across the board anyway, because they've essentially got two Mikes playing OLB (except they do less pass coverage and can thus get away with not being great at it,) and because 4-3 Wills have to do a lot of pass coverage that prioritizes speed over size. Sam and Mike still want sacks in a 4-3 though; it's Will that often gets left out in the cold because he's busy covering TEs and backs in the flat and over the middle (which has resulted in a lot of criticism for DJ over the years from people who think a LB without sacks is worthless.) If Miller or anyone else can stuff the run and get sacks <240 though, that's fine by me, but I'd expect anyone who can to do it at Mike or Sam.

[dogfish]

joel, your view of the MIKE's value is a little antiquated. . . you may have been correct in the 80's, but today's game is a passing game, by and large-- like it or not. . . as long as i can remember, NFL talent evaluators have rated cornerback and edge rusher as the premiere positions on defense. . . having a good MIKE is still important, of course-- but you have to pick a guy with the right skill set, and putting von miller there would utterly waste his skill set, which is why you'll never see it happen. . .

you wouldn't move orlando pace to guard because your team is lacking in that area-- you'd go out and get a new guard. . . similarly, you don't move the nastiest edge rusher the league has seen in a decade to a position that doesn't rush the passer. . .

[chazoe60]

joel, your view of the MIKE's value is a little antiquated. . . you may have been correct in the 80's, but today's game is a passing game, by and large-- like it or not. . . as long as i can remember, NFL talent evaluators have rated cornerback and edge rusher as the premiere positions on defense. . . having a good MIKE is still important, of course-- but you have to pick a guy with the right skill set, and putting von miller there would utterly waste his skill set, which is why you'll never see it happen. . .

you wouldn't move orlando pace to guard because your team is lacking in that area-- you'd go out and get a new guard. . . similarly, you don't move the nastiest edge rusher the league has seen in a decade to a position that doesn't rush the passer. . .

I agree with this.

I think your main pass rusher (if he's at least decent in the run game) and /or your best DB have taken the place of the Mike in terms of being the cog in which your defense revolves around.

With us it's Von and Champ. Pitt is Harrison and Polomoluauaoaoaiaoaiiu
And I think with as good as Lewis is even in Baltimore it's Suggs and Reed.

[G_Money]

joel, your view of the MIKE's value is a little antiquated. . . you may have been correct in the 80's, but today's game is a passing game, by and large-- like it or not. . . as long as i can remember, NFL talent evaluators have rated cornerback and edge rusher as the premiere positions on defense. . . having a good MIKE is still important, of course-- but you have to pick a guy with the right skill set, and putting von miller there would utterly waste his skill set, which is why you'll never see it happen. . .

you wouldn't move orlando pace to guard because your team is lacking in that area-- you'd go out and get a new guard. . . similarly, you don't move the nastiest edge rusher the league has seen in a decade to a position that doesn't rush the passer. . .

This.

A Mike destroys the inside run and needs enough pursuit speed to make plays in the run game sideline to sideline.

In a pass-first league, a Mike isn't AS important as it was. Still very important, but there's a reason we pull Mays for Woodyard on passing downs. Since it's unlikely we have both Woodyard and DJ next season, I'm curious to see how they address the Mike issue and if they'll go get a new Mike who can stay on the field on third down.

My guess would be that they'd either let Woodyard walk or trade DJ for a pick in the draft, then let Nate Irving play the pass with his speed on those third and longs while he figures out if he's gonna back up or try again to crack the starting roster.

I REALLY hope Irving is learning something useful this year.

They could stay away from the Mike position in the draft if they're happy with Mays and his run-stuffing capabilities (personally, I looooove the ways Mays hits people when he's in the right spot, I just want him to be able to get there more often) and feel like Irving can learn to cover.

But whatever they do with it, Von is not going to play there, even if he does have a lot of fun rushing from the inside at times.

~G

[rcsodak]

Get some meat on the Dline that keeps the lb's free to attack the runner, and Mays will be fine, imo.

Cant count how many times i've seen Olinemen in the faces of the lb's befofe they are able to do anything.

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[FlyByU]

I am looking for 2 sacks by miller today. We all know that if we can stop the run it will be a very long day for rivers.

[FlyByU]

Add one more for miller

[Dapper Dan]

What's the total?

[LTC Pain]

What's the total?

Should be at 10.5 sacks with five games to go. Go Von Monster!

[Edmonton Bronco Fan]

Time to get me a Von jersey... it's overdue.

[claymore]

Time to get me a Von jersey... it's overdue.

Its the kiss of death to Von's career if I get one. I will wait till he's a shoe in for the ROF! :laugh:

[underrated29]

Its the kiss of death to Von's career if I get one. I will wait till he's a shoe in for the ROF! :laugh:


Please get a carson palmer, phillip rivers and kyle orton jersey..

[Poet]

Claymore can have my Carson Palmer jersey.

[claymore]

Claymore can have my Carson Palmer jersey.

I could use it as a sheet or maybe a tarp. ???

[FlyByU]

4 and 1/2 more sacks and Von sets a new record for most sacks by a rookie...

Lets pray Orton starts for the Chiefs in week 17 because he could get 3-5 phantom sacks from him alone.

[Poet]

I could use it as a sheet or maybe a tarp. ???

Currently I'm using it to collect dust in my closet.

[dogfish]

I could use it as a sheet or maybe a tarp. ???

you could cover a boat with that bad boy. . .

[Poet]

you could cover a boat with that bad boy. . .

Custom Made 18XL jerseys are hard to come by.

[Bullgator]

Miller Time + Tebow Time = Great times....

58 is a Rabid BEAST... No really like Beast from X-Men... an animal on the feild but kinda a nerd off the feild, whats up with those pointexter glasses lol

That is all.

[dogfish]

Miller Time + Tebow Time = Great times....

58 is a Rabid BEAST... No rally like Beast from X-Men... an animal on the feild but kinda a nerd off the feild, whats up with those pointexter glasses lol

That is all.

you know clark kent wears dorky glasses, right?

just sayin'. . .

[FlyByU]

Von Miller = 45 Solo Tackles, 10.5 Sacks, 2 FF

[FlyByU]

Does anyone know if Von will be playing in the Bears game?

[BroncoJoe]

All signs are Pointing to yes.

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[Joel]

I'd be surprised if he didn't (he probably COULD have played last week if absolutely necessary) but this is the link to the team injury report at NFL.com:
http://www.nfl.com/teams/denverbroncos/injuries?team=DEN
Looks like McGahee and Royal are bigger concerns. If the latter is out (which to me seems likely) Demaryius Thomas and/or Matt Willis will really need to step up, because I don't think the Bears will give up much rushing.

[FlyByU]

1 more sack added to his count. 11.5 sacks total

[Dean]

IMHO it is because teams are so worried about Elvis and Vonn that has led to DJ and others getting sacks up the gut this year. Unless the opposition's offense stays in max protect their QB is exposed.

[Dzone]

Love Von Miller! Love this team! Bailey playing the best ball of his career.
DJ stepped up big today. Bunkley. Woodyard. Dumervil. Miller. edtc etc Broncos win 7 straight! My friends in Chicago are being very quiet tonight.