PDA

View Full Version : How much patience does Bowlen have left for Shanny?



East Coast Fan
10-07-2007, 06:53 PM
Well, this was the first game of the season that was televised for me to see here in PA. and we all know what happened and we all feel the same way right now. I'm asking you guys that are closer to the team, mainly you Colorado boys-how much more patience do you think that Pat Bowlen has for his long time good buddy Mike Shanahan? How many "new starts" is he going to allow him to make with this team? Do you think that he's even close to considering making a change at head coach, or will he give Shanny some more time to develop this team? I ask this as an honest question-not putting the blame on Shanny or the players or whatever-but I think that MOST teams would be looking at this and saying "Mike, you got us two Super Bowl rings with teams that were stacked with talent 8-9 years ago, but where are we going with this team"? It was a very disturbing sight to have seen that a LOT of fans left in the 3rd quarter-and they took the game off to switch to another more competitive game. I just don't know how much more gas Shanny has left in his tank. Your thoughts, please...

SR
10-07-2007, 06:55 PM
Shannahan is not the person to blame here.

East Coast Fan
10-07-2007, 06:59 PM
Shannahan is not the person to blame here.

I said that in my post. How much more time do you think that Bowlen is going to give him as the head coach to change things is what I'm after.

SR
10-07-2007, 07:01 PM
He can only do so much. It isn't his fault that the players aren't playing.

So I guess what I'm getting at is that I don't think Bowlen is frustrated or anything when it comes to Shanny because what our team is doing is not Shanny's fault.

Simple Jaded
10-07-2007, 07:08 PM
This just isn't a good time to fire the Head Coach....He's put a competetive team out there every year, with very few exceptions.

And those that would like to see Bill Cowher brought in...Please consider the amount of patience the Stealers gave him before winning the SB...The only difference being that Shanahan won 2 SB's before needed such patience from the owner (And fans)...

East Coast Fan
10-07-2007, 07:14 PM
He can only do so much. It isn't his fault that the players aren't playing.

So I guess what I'm getting at is that I don't think Bowlen is frustrated or anything when it comes to Shanny because what our team is doing is not Shanny's fault.

He can only do so much is right, and you can see it on his face that this all is driving him crazy, and he doesn't know what to do to fix it. I guess that some of the fans have less patience than Bowlen does, but I really would like to know if it ever crosses Pat's mind of making a "coaching regime" change. I know that there are many, many factors responsible for this situation, but it usually ultimately comes down on the coach and his staff. This is definitely one of the lowest points that I've had since following this team since 1972; we had nothing today...

broncosfanscott
10-07-2007, 07:18 PM
He can only do so much. It isn't his fault that the players aren't playing.

So I guess what I'm getting at is that I don't think Bowlen is frustrated or anything when it comes to Shanny because what our team is doing is not Shanny's fault.

So true. Our defense is PATHETIC and we won't win another game unless they get of their :censored:

SR
10-07-2007, 07:18 PM
There's still 11 games left...lots can happen.

BroncoWave
10-07-2007, 08:01 PM
I haven't been impressed with Shanny at all this season. He seemed like much more of a "mastermind" back when he had Elway, Davis, Sharpe, etc. I'm not saying we should fire him right now but it wouldn't hurt for Bowlen to start tightening that leash.

silkamilkamonico
10-07-2007, 08:12 PM
Shanhan's the problem, Shanahan isn't the problem.

Lets put that aside for the sake of pondering, and let me ask....

If for whatever reason Shanahan didn't coach Denver next year, how attractive would the head coach position be in the DEnver organization?

There is a lot of young talent, and it's an organization that is a proven winner in terms of overall production and a great owner that would do whatever it takes to be competitive and not give a damn about profit as a substitute for winning.

It's been so long and I'm glad we haven't had that revolving carousal, but I would be curious to see what the replacement candidates would look like.

Lonestar
10-07-2007, 08:22 PM
There's still 11 games left...lots can happen.

yep 1-10:rolleyes:

BroncoWave
10-07-2007, 08:31 PM
yep 1-10:rolleyes:

Works for me. Then we can draft Glen Dorsey and finally have a good DT!

DenBronx
10-07-2007, 08:31 PM
Shanhan's the problem, Shanahan isn't the problem.

Lets put that aside for the sake of pondering, and let me ask....

If for whatever reason Shanahan didn't coach Denver next year, how attractive would the head coach position be in the DEnver organization?

There is a lot of young talent, and it's an organization that is a proven winner in terms of overall production and a great owner that would do whatever it takes to be competitive and not give a damn about profit as a substitute for winning.

It's been so long and I'm glad we haven't had that revolving carousal, but I would be curious to see what the replacement candidates would look like.


they would go after cower

SR
10-07-2007, 09:43 PM
How friggin hilarious would it be if for some reason Belichek (sp?) ended up as Denver's coach?

Lonestar
10-07-2007, 09:46 PM
How friggin hilarious would it be if for some reason Belichek (sp?) ended up as Denver's coach?
We could not afford the 15 first round draft choices we would have to pay for him.

topscribe
10-07-2007, 10:07 PM
We could not afford the 15 first round draft choices we would have to pay for him.

He would have to sign an agreement that he will not own a camera during his employment here. :laugh:

-----

jlarsiii
10-07-2007, 10:38 PM
Let's face the facts. Shanny is a good coach. He is a lousy GM to say the least.

His job is secure, but if he has sole control of the draft process then everyone should anticipate more free agents being brought in cause we have not drafted the necessary talent to restock the cupboards.

Watchthemiddle
10-07-2007, 10:40 PM
Works for me. Then we can draft Glen Dorsey and finally have a good DT!

Not sure if you saw that game last night, but against a good team he didn't do much. He was held in check for most of the night.

Not saying he isn't good, but most of the times he was shown, he only had single man blocking him and couldn't get any pressure.

arapaho2
10-07-2007, 10:43 PM
He can only do so much. It isn't his fault that the players aren't playing.

So I guess what I'm getting at is that I don't think Bowlen is frustrated or anything when it comes to Shanny because what our team is doing is not Shanny's fault.


sorry but it is his fault, he is the head coach, he is the general manger, he not only hires the assistant coaches but approves game plans, and the players that are not playing are in fact choosen by shanny to this team, if we have players incapable of playing this game, remember who chooses them to be on this team. and as the head coach it is his responsibility to see that his team is ready...i think we have way too much talent on both sides of the ball to believe it is merely the players at fault

but im not saying fire him, but our dismal play is ultimately the coaches fault, he either has to make some coaching changes or get someones heads screwed on right

Krugan
10-07-2007, 11:02 PM
He can only do so much. It isn't his fault that the players aren't playing.

So I guess what I'm getting at is that I don't think Bowlen is frustrated or anything when it comes to Shanny because what our team is doing is not Shanny's fault.

In turn it is his fault the players arent playing. He is in charge here.

He is ultimately responsible for the team and the players on the team. To say he cant be blamed for the crap thats being put forth is absolutely incorrect.

He is also responsible for the coaches under him, and he better start kicking some butts, or it will be his that gets the final bite.

Arap beat me to this, sorry, didnt finsih the thread before I posted:)

BroncoWave
10-07-2007, 11:12 PM
Not sure if you saw that game last night, but against a good team he didn't do much. He was held in check for most of the night.

Not saying he isn't good, but most of the times he was shown, he only had single man blocking him and couldn't get any pressure.

He would still be ten times better than any of the current DT's on our roster.

sneakers
10-07-2007, 11:19 PM
Shanny isn't playing the game...how could it be his fault?

lex
10-07-2007, 11:22 PM
He would still be ten times better than any of the current DT's on our roster.


Id rather take McFadden and then take Okam/Bryant/Moore with our high 2nd Rd pick. And then take Shirley later. BTW, that was a freshman holding Dorsey in check a lot of last night.

silkamilkamonico
10-07-2007, 11:23 PM
Shanny isn't playing the game...how could it be his fault?

In the world of professional sports, especially in the NFL where everything is equal, on the field success and coaching go hand in hand, whether it's motivating the players, or working with schemes.

How the players play the game as a team is a direct correlation to coaching.

BroncoWave
10-07-2007, 11:35 PM
Id rather take McFadden and then take Okam/Bryant/Moore with our high 2nd Rd pick. And then take Shirley later. BTW, that was a freshman holding Dorsey in check a lot of last night.

I don't see why everyone wants us to take McFadden. We have much more pressing needs, like every position on defense minus CB and DE. I realize McFadden is the best player in the draft but I believe in the philosophy of filling a need more than I do drafting the best player available.

Simple Jaded
10-07-2007, 11:41 PM
I don't see why everyone wants us to take McFadden. We have much more pressing needs, like every position on defense minus CB and DE. I realize McFadden is the best player in the draft but I believe in the philosophy of filling a need more than I do drafting the best player available.


RB will be a need....No doubt about it!

But I agree with you if your contention is that Denver needs DT's way more than they need a RB.....

lex
10-07-2007, 11:42 PM
I don't see why everyone wants us to take McFadden. We have much more pressing needs, like every position on defense minus CB and DE. I realize McFadden is the best player in the draft but I believe in the philosophy of filling a need more than I do drafting the best player available.

Because while our strength is running the ball. We get by with it too much on scheme and not always on talent so much. McFadden will be someone that defenses always have to account for. And if we're selecting high enough to take McFadden, well also be able to take someone like Okam/Moore/Bryant with a high second. I think with McFadden we would see more long runs that go for TDs. Sometimes the best way to improve your team is by identifying your strengths and making them that much better. Our strength is running the football. It makes sense to have someone like McFadden doing it.

Simple Jaded
10-07-2007, 11:45 PM
Because while our strength is running the ball. We get by with it too much on scheme and not always on talent so much. McFadden will be someone that defenses always have to account for. And if we're selecting high enough to take McFadden, well also be able to take someone like Okam/Moore/Bryant with a high second. I think with McFadden we would see more long runs that go for TDs. Sometimes the best way to improve your team is by identifying your strengths and making them that much better. Our strength is running the football. It makes sense to have someone like McFadden doing it.


McFadden is a complete player....He's got more power than Henry and he's got Poorti$'s speed....And he's a hell of a receiver, though they don't use him much as a blocker.

McFadden is a player you can't pass up if you have the chance to get him....

lex
10-07-2007, 11:47 PM
RB will be a need....No doubt about it!

But I agree with you if your contention is that Denver needs DT's way more than they need a RB.....

Frank Okam and Red Bryant both are good, massive run stuffers that are slotted to go RD 1-2. Dre Moore, though not as massive, is probably strong enough to compensate for being 10 lbs lighter. He is also slotted to go 1-2. We could get any of these guys to be run stuffers plus Jason Shirley later on. We have a one dimensional need from our DTs and thats run defense. We dont especially need a DT who does both. Our DEs are really focused on getting pressure from the edge. We need DTs more specialized in anchoring the DLine on run defense. But if youre drafting that high and someone like McFadden is there, its silly not to take him.

lex
10-07-2007, 11:49 PM
McFadden is a complete player....He's got more power than Henry and he's got Poorti$'s speed....And he's a hell of a receiver, though they don't use him much as a blocker.

McFadden is a player you can't pass up if you have the chance to get him....

Youre preaching to the choir buddy. I havent seen someone his size that can do the things he can do against SEC competition since Bo Jackson.

Simple Jaded
10-07-2007, 11:53 PM
Frank Okam and Red Bryant both are good, massive run stuffers that are slotted to go RD 1-2. Dre Moore, though not as massive, is probably strong enough to compensate for being 10 lbs lighter. He is also slotted to go 1-2. We could get any of these guys to be run stuffers plus Jason Shirley later on. We have a one dimensional need from our DTs and thats run defense. We dont especially need a DT who does both. Our DEs are really focused on getting pressure from the edge. We need DTs more specialized in anchoring the DLine on run defense. But if youre drafting that high and someone like McFadden is there, its silly not to take him.

Yep, the DT's are what is killing this defense right now, imo....If the DT's Denver needs can be had in round 2 and beyond you have to take McFadden if you're in position.

Aside from Dorsey, I'm not sure there is a DT worth taking as high as it's starting to look like Denver will be picking....And I'm not so sure Dorsey is the right fit....

lex
10-08-2007, 12:00 AM
Yep, the DT's are what is killing this defense right now, imo....If the DT's Denver needs can be had in round 2 and beyond you have to take McFadden if you're in position.

Aside from Dorsey, I'm not sure there is a DT worth taking as high as it's starting to look like Denver will be picking....And I'm not so sure Dorsey is the right fit....

Yeah, I agree. Im not so sure you wont see Marcus Thomas doing the same things Dorsey is doing next year. Since our DTs are one dimensional needs, Id rather have depth for lane cloggers.

Uncle Buck
10-08-2007, 12:22 AM
Well, this was the first game of the season that was televised for me to see here in PA. and we all know what happened and we all feel the same way right now. I'm asking you guys that are closer to the team, mainly you Colorado boys-how much more patience do you think that Pat Bowlen has for his long time good buddy Mike Shanahan? How many "new starts" is he going to allow him to make with this team? Do you think that he's even close to considering making a change at head coach, or will he give Shanny some more time to develop this team? I ask this as an honest question-not putting the blame on Shanny or the players or whatever-but I think that MOST teams would be looking at this and saying "Mike, you got us two Super Bowl rings with teams that were stacked with talent 8-9 years ago, but where are we going with this team"? It was a very disturbing sight to have seen that a LOT of fans left in the 3rd quarter-and they took the game off to switch to another more competitive game. I just don't know how much more gas Shanny has left in his tank. Your thoughts, please...

You raise a good question here, ECF. Today, I saw more fire in Cutler's eyes than I did in the Shanny of old. Following every loss, every losing season (I mean where we only made it to the post season), there were those who called for Shanny's head. I have always supported Shanny, however, always believing that we would build that eternal "best team" again.

But, the NFL, such as it is, demands fire! What worked in the past does not always work in the present.

Perhaps Shanny is no longer the same coach as he was with the Elway and company regime. Perhaps the Cutler era will demand/usher in a new coach.

At this point in time, you can't go by Bowlen. Shanny has delivered winning (regular) seaons. Not that shabby. All things being equal, the odds of winning the Super Bowl are one out of 32. And under, Shanny, we've won two.

I'm not one who would cry for Shanny's head. I just wish I could see that old fire in his eyes again.

TXBRONC
10-08-2007, 04:37 AM
Works for me. Then we can draft Glen Dorsey and finally have a good DT!

If we're 3-13 like Jr thinks we'll be then we would more than likely have the number one overall pick. If we are and seriously doubt we will be, then our pick would more than likely be McFadden. As unpredictable as Shanahan is I have no doubt he would take guy who more than likely will be the consensus number one pick.

BroncoWave
10-08-2007, 08:38 AM
McFadden is a complete player....He's got more power than Henry and he's got Poorti$'s speed....And he's a hell of a receiver, though they don't use him much as a blocker.

McFadden is a player you can't pass up if you have the chance to get him....

That's what everyone said about Reggie Bush, but the Texans seem to be doing okay, and look at the Saints! There is no such thing as a can't miss player. I guess McFadden would look nice in a Denver uni though.

omac
10-08-2007, 09:06 AM
Sorry, but I think talk about losing patience with Shanny is ridiculous. No other coach can demand so much from his players and still have their utmost respect. Denver is a good TEAM that's going through some serious problems, mostly caused by a bad run defense that affects all other aspects of it's game.

Fix the defense and the problem's solved. We weren't content with what Coyer brought here, so now we'll see just how good a coach Bates is when his back's against the wall. We'll also see which defensive players will rise up to the challenge.

BroncoWave
10-08-2007, 09:12 AM
Sorry, but I think talk about losing patience with Shanny is ridiculous. No other coach can demand so much from his players and still have their utmost respect. Denver is a good TEAM that's going through some serious problems, mostly caused by a bad run defense that affects all other aspects of it's game.

Fix the defense and the problem's solved. We weren't content with what Coyer brought here, so now we'll see just how good a coach Bates is when his back's against the wall. We'll also see which defensive players will rise up to the challenge.

I don't think it's ridiculous at all. Since Elway retired his playoff record is 1-4. I wouldn't blame Bowlen if he is becoming impatient. I'm not saying to fire Shanahan right now but if he can't improve on that playoff win # within 2-3 years we should start looking for someone else. Also, you are blaming the players for our struggles but guess who chooses our personnel. That's right, Shanahan!

lex
10-08-2007, 09:23 AM
That's what everyone said about Reggie Bush, but the Texans seem to be doing okay, and look at the Saints! There is no such thing as a can't miss player. I guess McFadden would look nice in a Denver uni though.

Nah, not even the same. I had misgivings about Bush. The guy rarely carried 20 times in college plus he played on a team that 90% of the times was more talented than the other teams at every position. Not the case with Arkansas.

Requiem / The Dagda
10-08-2007, 09:38 AM
There is responsibility that lies both on the coaches and the players, but I think that Shanahan will always get the short end of the stick on a lot of things. He's playing with a young, inexperienced, injured roster with many new starters in it. If Nalen goes out, that just adds another young man who will have to step up whose never started in the NFL before in Chris Kuper.

With Bly, Bailey and several other players going out there with nagging injuries, we should just count our lucky stars we're going into the BYE this week.

This team is awful, but I really think that we're putting a little too much on the coaches and not enough on the execution. Especially when it comes to Bates on defense, I'm just curious how much input Slowik has on calling the plays, or who actually does what. Slowik actually has the defensive coordinator title.

We'll see though.

Shanahan has a ticket here for life, it'll never expire.

BroncoWave
10-08-2007, 10:15 AM
There is responsibility that lies both on the coaches and the players, but I think that Shanahan will always get the short end of the stick on a lot of things. He's playing with a young, inexperienced, injured roster with many new starters in it. If Nalen goes out, that just adds another young man who will have to step up whose never started in the NFL before in Chris Kuper.

With Bly, Bailey and several other players going out there with nagging injuries, we should just count our lucky stars we're going into the BYE this week.

This team is awful, but I really think that we're putting a little too much on the coaches and not enough on the execution. Especially when it comes to Bates on defense, I'm just curious how much input Slowik has on calling the plays, or who actually does what. Slowik actually has the defensive coordinator title.

We'll see though.

Shanahan has a ticket here for life, it'll never expire.

Do you really think that? Do you think if we go another 2, 3, 4 years without winning a playoff game Bowlen will continue to give Shanny a free pass? I don't. I'm not sure what he's done to earn a "lifetime pass" other that win 2 super bowls with teams LOADED with talent.

broncos9697
10-08-2007, 12:11 PM
Works for me. Then we can draft Glen Dorsey and finally have a good DT!

no!!!
were going to need that #1 RB...
lets just not have him and henry as room-mates or the mary-jane will be flying...gonja....smoke&toke

silkamilkamonico
10-08-2007, 12:22 PM
Fix the defense and the problem's solved. We weren't content with what Coyer brought here, so now we'll see just how good a coach Bates is when his back's against the wall. We'll also see which defensive players will rise up to the challenge.

With all due respect, Shanahan has been trying to fix the defense since somewhere around 2003, and everytime he has taken 2 steps forward, he has taken 3, 4, and sometimes 5 steps backward.

We're arguably at an all time low as far as where were at defensively.

People want to argue a new coach, a new scheme? Not even Larry Coyer was this bad his first season.

silkamilkamonico
10-08-2007, 12:24 PM
no!!!
were going to need that #1 RB...
lets just not have him and henry as room-mates or the mary-jane will be flying...gonja....smoke&toke

We have that #1 RB playing right now, and it's catapulted us to a 2-3 record along with questions and emarassment.

I'll take the DT thank you....

Medford Bronco
10-08-2007, 12:28 PM
He can only do so much. It isn't his fault that the players aren't playing.

So I guess what I'm getting at is that I don't think Bowlen is frustrated or anything when it comes to Shanny because what our team is doing is not Shanny's fault.

the players are not playing but the talent is not there especially on defense

this team is not good.

Shanny has not done a good job of drafting with Sundquist.

also why no Lbs from last draft. There clearly was a huge hole with no Al Wilson who they clearly miss

Medford Bronco
10-08-2007, 12:29 PM
We have that #1 RB playing right now, and it's catapulted us to a 2-3 record along with questions and emarassment.

I'll take the DT thank you....

I would make a play for the free agent to be who ran for 150 on us in Michael Turner. The defense is bad bad bad.

Offense at least I see some parts that might improve on defense I see none.

Mike
10-08-2007, 12:35 PM
I would make a play for the free agent to be who ran for 150 on us in Michael Turner. The defense is bad bad bad.

Offense at least I see some parts that might improve on defense I see none.

Having a good RB won't help or matter as long as the offensive line sucks. The two lines are the hearts of the team. Denver does not need anymore players at the glamour positions.

They need to address the guys in the trenches. If they don't do that then the Broncos will continue to struggle.

lex
10-08-2007, 12:42 PM
Having a good RB won't help or matter as long as the offensive line sucks. The two lines are the hearts of the team. Denver does not need anymore players at the glamour positions.

They need to address the guys in the trenches. If they don't do that then the Broncos will continue to struggle.

They need to address that by doing what they did in the old days and thats targeting NFL vets that they feel can fit into their system from watching film. Tying draft picks up in these guys who take a couple of years to develop might not be as good as getting a guy you know can help you right away by looking at film of him vs other NFL players...plus because of the kind of OLine we have, we dont necessarily compete with every team in the league for the Olinemen that we find value in since not everyone uses our scheme and that would keep the payroll down as well as free up roster spots to draft positions where we might have to over pay guys on the FA market.

Requiem / The Dagda
10-08-2007, 12:51 PM
Do you really think that? Do you think if we go another 2, 3, 4 years without winning a playoff game Bowlen will continue to give Shanny a free pass? I don't. I'm not sure what he's done to earn a "lifetime pass" other that win 2 super bowls with teams LOADED with talent.

I do think that, and I don't think the Broncos will go that long without winning a game. Broncos fans can be critical of Shanahan all they want, but who out there (a prospective coach, not an old head coach aging right now) could replace him and have more success? I'm not sure. Mike Tomlin has surprised a great deal with the Steelers, and there aren't that many young bucks out there who are ready to take the reigns.

I'm not always a fan of what Shanahan does, and he deserves to take some blame down the line (they call him Teflon for a reason) - but Shanahan is always damned if you does or doesn't. The expectations for Broncos fans are ridiculously high, even though he and the team expects to win a Super Bowl every year. . . that's every teams goal.

Denver has a bunch of young, inexperienced players at key positions - and we have injuries to many of our key contributors from last year. On top of that, we're adjusting to new schemes and coordinators on both sides of the ball. Did I mention that over half of our team has new starters?

I am not surprised at all by the results thus far. This team is lucky to be where they are at right now. I think the fans that are really let down are the ones who have completely unrealistic outlooks and expectations from the team. The writing on the wall for an average season was there from the get go, I don't see why some people failed to see it.

No leaders (vocal) on this team, absolutely no football mentality, and most importantly - no chemistry. I don't even think I would call this 53 man group a team.

BroncoWave
10-08-2007, 01:03 PM
I do think that, and I don't think the Broncos will go that long without winning a game. Broncos fans can be critical of Shanahan all they want, but who out there (a prospective coach, not an old head coach aging right now) could replace him and have more success? I'm not sure. Mike Tomlin has surprised a great deal with the Steelers, and there aren't that many young bucks out there who are ready to take the reigns.

I'm not always a fan of what Shanahan does, and he deserves to take some blame down the line (they call him Teflon for a reason) - but Shanahan is always damned if you does or doesn't. The expectations for Broncos fans are ridiculously high, even though he and the team expects to win a Super Bowl every year. . . that's every teams goal.

Denver has a bunch of young, inexperienced players at key positions - and we have injuries to many of our key contributors from last year. On top of that, we're adjusting to new schemes and coordinators on both sides of the ball. Did I mention that over half of our team has new starters?

I am not surprised at all by the results thus far. This team is lucky to be where they are at right now. I think the fans that are really let down are the ones who have completely unrealistic outlooks and expectations from the team. The writing on the wall for an average season was there from the get go, I don't see why some people failed to see it.

No leaders (vocal) on this team, absolutely no football mentality, and most importantly - no chemistry. I don't even think I would call this 53 man group a team.

All I'm saying is that IF we go 2-4 more years without anymore playoff wins it wouldn't hurt to start looking for a new coach. There might not be that much available right now but who knows who will be out there in a few years. Like I said, for the people saying that the reason we are losing is because of the talent we have assembled...guess who assembled that talent!

Skinny
10-08-2007, 01:19 PM
Having a good RB won't help or matter as long as the offensive line sucks. The two lines are the hearts of the team. Denver does not need anymore players at the glamour positions.

They need to address the guys in the trenches. If they don't do that then the Broncos will continue to struggle.Agreed 100%.

Lonestar
10-08-2007, 01:34 PM
sorry but it is his fault, he is the head coach, he is the general manger, he not only hires the assistant coaches but approves game plans, and the players that are not playing are in fact choosen by shanny to this team, if we have players incapable of playing this game, remember who chooses them to be on this team. and as the head coach it is his responsibility to see that his team is ready...i think we have way too much talent on both sides of the ball to believe it is merely the players at fault

but im not saying fire him, but our dismal play is ultimately the coaches fault, he either has to make some coaching changes or get someones heads screwed on right3

On these point we agree completely, mikey is totally responsible for ALL football operations.

So far this year we got lucky on the two missed FGs or we just might be 0-5 this year.

broncos9697
10-08-2007, 03:21 PM
With all due respect, Shanahan has been trying to fix the defense since somewhere around 2003, and everytime he has taken 2 steps forward, he has taken 3, 4, and sometimes 5 steps backward.

We're arguably at an all time low as far as where were at defensively.

People want to argue a new coach, a new scheme? Not even Larry Coyer was this bad his first season.

well,
hey shanny lets go after the browns line....great plan...
yes i agree we need help on our def.but all we ever do is go after veterns why..lets draft a few and play them not sit them....we pay all this money for vets and they do not produce...year after year..

lex
10-08-2007, 07:55 PM
Having a good RB won't help or matter as long as the offensive line sucks. The two lines are the hearts of the team. Denver does not need anymore players at the glamour positions.

They need to address the guys in the trenches. If they don't do that then the Broncos will continue to struggle.

This is what Pro Football Weekly said about Darren McFadden in their Prospects Preview. Ive omitted a lot of minutia like his kick returns, for example. Here it is:

Darren McFadden: (6’1 ˝”, 210, 4.4) – One of only two freshmen to surpass 1,000 yards in a season in the SEC with the other being Herschel Walker. Became the first sophomore to win the Doak Walker Award and finished second in Heisman Trophy voting to Troy Smith of Ohio State. Similar in size and stature to Adrian Peterson, but McFadden appears to be slightly faster with more natural hands and better pure athletic ability and lateral quickness to sidestep tacklers. When he hits and open crease, he has the top-end speed to pull away and can take angles away from defenders. Naturally instinctive runner with good vision. Sees cut-back lanes before they unfold and can anticipate where defenders are coming from. Has a powerful stiff-arm that should be outlawed. Can dip his shoulder and run over tacklers. Comes from a rough area of Little Rock and has a warrior’s mentality. Does not back down from contact or go down easy. A special talent who has played vs. the best competition in the country in the SEC and has been very productive from the time he stepped on campus.


____


OK, this publication usually picks on at least one weakness when giving analysis but thats about as perfect as it gets. Youd be a fool to pass up this guy if he was available to you.

Mike
10-08-2007, 08:19 PM
This is what Pro Football Weekly said about Darren McFadden in their Prospects Preview. Ive omitted a lot of minutia like his kick returns, for example. Here it is:

Darren McFadden: (6’1 ˝”, 210, 4.4) – One of only two freshmen to surpass 1,000 yards in a season in the SEC with the other being Herschel Walker. Became the first sophomore to win the Doak Walker Award and finished second in Heisman Trophy voting to Troy Smith of Ohio State. Similar in size and stature to Adrian Peterson, but McFadden appears to be slightly faster with more natural hands and better pure athletic ability and lateral quickness to sidestep tacklers. When he hits and open crease, he has the top-end speed to pull away and can take angles away from defenders. Naturally instinctive runner with good vision. Sees cut-back lanes before they unfold and can anticipate where defenders are coming from. Has a powerful stiff-arm that should be outlawed. Can dip his shoulder and run over tacklers. Comes from a rough area of Little Rock and has a warrior’s mentality. Does not back down from contact or go down easy. A special talent who has played vs. the best competition in the country in the SEC and has been very productive from the time he stepped on campus.


____


OK, this publication usually picks on at least one weakness when giving analysis but thats about as perfect as it gets. Youd be a fool to pass up this guy if he was available to you.


Sounds swell. But very few RBs are good enough to succeed without a solid offensive line.

They may not be sexy, but the guys in the trenches are the heart of a football team. Whether through FA or the draft, Denver HAS to address it before any other position. It will cost a LOT more through FA.

It might help if the Broncos brought back their old offensive line coach too.

lex
10-08-2007, 08:25 PM
Sounds swell. But very few RBs are good enough to succeed without a solid offensive line.

They may not be sexy, but the guys in the trenches are the heart of a football team. Whether through FA or the draft, Denver HAS to address it before any other position. It will cost a LOT more through FA.

It might help if the Broncos brought back their old offensive line coach too.

I dont deny that our offensive line isnt what it once was but when you consider that Travis Henry has been near the top in rushing, you have to wonder what someone like McFadden might do. I agree we need to do something about the line but this is the single area where I would like to see us rely on the draft less. Thats actually more in line with how we did it in the beginning when we were winning SBs. We didnt exactly have a lot of young guys. He had a lot of guys that we let other teams break in and then we watched them against NFL competition on video and decided who could help us with our zone blocking schemes. And the guys we acquired werent horribly expensive and didnt take 2 or 3 years do develop like a lot of the guys we would draft.

I also think we need to get stronger linemen who can move well enough rather than lighter linemen who can run but are barely strong enough.

broncosfanscott
10-08-2007, 09:10 PM
Shanny isn't playing the game...how could it be his fault?

Yes the players need to make plays, yet it is the coach's job to make sure hi players are ready to play and we weren't.