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Italianmobstr7
01-09-2009, 10:55 PM
From PFT.

Attention, Boston Herald. Here’s how you go about advancing the ball regarding the status of Pats offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels as the potential head coach of the Broncos without resorting to pretending that speculation is news.

Mike Klis of the Denver Post reports that the Broncos plan to extend an offer to one of the finalist for the job over the weekend.

Klis also reports that the Broncos have trimmed the list of seven finalists to five.

The final five are Vikings defensive coordinator Leslie Frazier, Cowboys offensive coordinator Jason Garrett, Patriots offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels, Giants defensive coordinator Steve Spagnuolo, and Buccaneers defensive coordinator Raheem Morris.

Out of the running (unless each of the other five say “no”) are Broncos offensive coordinator Rick Dennison and Dolphins assistant head coach/secondary Todd Bowles.

The Broncos’ search committee, per Klis, started work today on developing a consensus as to the final one or two guys.

Meanwhile, we were under the impression that the Broncos weren’t going to be hiring a new G.M. We were wrong. And so we’ll be embarking soon on ripping the Broncos, as we’ve ripped the Browns, for doing it backwards.

If the first choice for head coach is Giants defensive coordinator Steve Spagnuolo and if the Giants hold serve at home against the Eagles, Spagnuolo will be off limits for at least another week.

So if nothing happens within the next seven days, it’s fairly safe to assume that Spagnuolo will get an offer whenever his current team’s season is done.

From Denver Post:

If all goes well for the Broncos' five-man search committee, there will be no more formal interviews.

The committee of owner Pat Bowlen and his lieutenants Joe Ellis, Jim Goodman, Brian Xanders and Jeff Goodman has met with the seven candidates to succeed Mike Shanahan as

the Broncos' head coach.


According to an NFL source, the Broncos' search committee began working today on trying to reach a consensus on their top one or two choices.

Bowlen is hoping to extend an offer over the weekend.

Minnesota Vikings defensive coordinator Leslie Frazier is under serious consideration by the committee, according to two NFL sources.

Other Broncos' candidates are Dallas offensive coordinator Jason Garrett, New England offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels, New York Giants' defensive coordinator Steve

Spagnuolo and Tampa Bay defensive coordinator Raheem Morris.

Broncos offensive coordinator Rick Dennison was impressive during his interview Wednesday and has a good chance to keep his job as an assistant, but he and Miami Dolphins

secondary/assistant head coach Todd Bowles are considered longshots.

Final word on Stoops

Bowlen wasn't the only link between Bob Stoops and the Broncos. Stephen Alexander, a Broncos tight end from 2005-07, is a former University of Oklahoma standout who has

moved his family to Norman, Okla.

About once a week during the past season, Alexander would get his football fix by watching the Sooners practice. Once, he sat in while Stoops addressed the full team at a meeting.

Alexander spent 10 years in the NFL, and played for five head coaches. He believes there is an exception to the theory that successful college coaches can't make it in the NFL.

"First of all, Stoops can't leave here," Alexander said. "He owns Oklahoma. But there's no doubt Stoops could do it. He definitely could be a great head coach in the NFL. He can

coach every position on the field. One time at practice, I watched him work with a kicker. He wanted the kicker to kick it a certain way. He had him do it over and over again and

finally about the eighth time, he said, 'That's what I'm looking for.' And then he went over and started working with the receivers.' "

Despite initial interest from Bowlen, an Oklahoma grad, Stoops is not under consideration for the Broncos' job.

People have spoken

Bronco fans may be spoiled. They may be tough. But above all else, Bronco fans are smart.

In a Denver Post online poll of the Broncos' head coaching candidates, Spagnuolo has received 66.7 percent of the vote. The runner-up is the ever-pessimistic "None of the Above" at

6.7 percent.

I'm not saying Spagnuolo is the correct choice. Personally, buyer remorse would strike the moment I passed on the one chance to land Jason Garrett. But given how Broncos games

have played out the past two seasons, Spagnuolo is the most logical choice.

The Broncos are a top-12 defense (and a steadier kicker) away from becoming Super Bowl-caliber. And Spagnuolo is the top defensive coach out there. He makes the most sense.

Of course, it's easy for me and two-thirds of Broncoland to say because it's not our money. Bowlen may believe other candidates can provide greater win-per-dollar value than

Spagnuolo, who currently makes $2 million as a coordinator. Just so long as Bowlen understands that such thinking would be considered a minority opinion.

The people have spoken.

No sign of Shanny

For the past 14 years, Mike Shanahan parked in the King Spot at Dove Valley. His parking space, located just off the walkway between the weight-room facility and the cafeteria,

was labeled "Shanahan" on the curb.

This week, as the Broncos brought in five head coaching candidates to the team's headquarters, "Shanahan" was erased with white paint. Talk about getting kicked off the curb.

"And if you become our coach, Mr. Frazier, this will be your parking spot."

SmilinAssasSin27
01-09-2009, 11:28 PM
I'd be happy w/ Spags, but I'm rooting for Morris.

Ziggy
01-09-2009, 11:36 PM
I'd be happy w/ Spags, but I'm rooting for Morris.

Why? He seems to be the rising in popularity on the boards, but I haven't seen much on why.

slim
01-09-2009, 11:36 PM
I'd be happy w/ Spags, but I'm rooting for Morris.

Why (just curious)

When Shany was fired the first person that came to my mind was McDaniels. But after giving it some thought, I think I would prefer Spags (if he was agreeable to keeping most of the offense staff intact).

Anyway, just curious why you like Morris.

slim
01-09-2009, 11:37 PM
Is there an echo in here :D

Tned
01-09-2009, 11:50 PM
Why? He seems to be the rising in popularity on the boards, but I haven't seen much on why.

Because the media is touting him as the next coming of a great HC. He might very well be, but I also keep seeing Vermeil back in the 70s or whenever it was as the last successful non-coordinator to jump straight to HC and be successful. I'm sure there are some others in between, but that's what the reporters keep using as the 'proof' that a guy can bypass the normal steps to head coach and still be successful.

I don't know enough about him one way or another. I have read the Bucs defense struggled when he left the team for a year or two, and got good again when he came back to the team.

Scarface
01-09-2009, 11:51 PM
I'd be happy w/ Spags, but I'm rooting for Morris.

Me too man. Morris is a leader of men. This guy carries himself well and vets in this league respect him and follow him. :defense:

Italianmobstr7
01-10-2009, 12:03 AM
I'll honestly be happy with any of the 3. At first I was wanting Spags, then Mcdaniel, now I'm curious about Morris. I'll honestly be happy if we get one of them. I think ANY of those 3 will help us fix our defense.

TXBRONC
01-10-2009, 12:08 AM
I'd be happy w/ Spags, but I'm rooting for Morris.

If its Spagnuolo the chances we wont know by end of this weekend.

Ziggy
01-10-2009, 12:13 AM
Since Morris is a Tampa 2 guy, I wonder if that is the D he would install and hire his D coaches for. Not my favorite style of D, but it might actually compliment this offense well.

Watchthemiddle
01-10-2009, 12:14 AM
Because the media is touting him as the next coming of a great HC. He might very well be, but I also keep seeing Vermeil back in the 70s or whenever it was as the last successful non-coordinator to jump straight to HC and be successful. I'm sure there are some others in between, but that's what the reporters keep using as the 'proof' that a guy can bypass the normal steps to head coach and still be successful.

I don't know enough about him one way or another. I have read the Bucs defense struggled when he left the team for a year or two, and got good again when he came back to the team.

Uh oh, if the media is touting him as the next great HC, then I will pass...:laugh:

Tned
01-10-2009, 12:16 AM
I'll honestly be happy with any of the 3. At first I was wanting Spags, then Mcdaniel, now I'm curious about Morris. I'll honestly be happy if we get one of them. I think ANY of those 3 will help us fix our defense.

I'll only be 'happy' with any of the candidates once I see if the Broncos don't enter a long period of futility. The 'odds' are whoever the coach is that is hired, he will be a failure. That is the hard truth of the NFL. More new head coaches fail than succeed.

I am one of the 'spoiled' Broncos' fans that is used to virtually no losing seasons. Someone that is disspointed by a one and out in the playoffs and devestated by a .500 season. I am one of the spoiled fans that isn't used to life as the fan of the other 31 NFL franchises.

History tells us that whoever is picked will more than likely be a dissapointment and fired within three to four years.

I 'hope' that we get a coach that defies history and the odds, but the reason that casinos and bookmakers make so much money is that those that bet against the odds, usually lose.

SR
01-10-2009, 12:20 AM
I'd love a Tampa 2 defense if we could acquire the personnel to run it. I like Spags, Morris, or Frazier. Anyone else, IMO, is a waste. We need a defensive minded coach who will focus on the defense and let the offensive coaches keep the offense the way we have it.

Tned
01-10-2009, 12:28 AM
I'd love a Tampa 2 defense if we could acquire the personnel to run it. I like Spags, Morris, or Frazier. Anyone else, IMO, is a waste. We need a defensive minded coach who will focus on the defense and let the offensive coaches keep the offense the way we have it.

I agree with this. While it is 'possible' that McDaniels could enhance the offense, that isn't where the teams needs are. What the team needs is a defensive head coach that takes ownership and focuses on the defense, while retaining Bates and Turner at minimum, and possibly Dennison (he was the guy that trained under Alex Gibbs and while he is the OC in name, the O-line is still his area of focus).

BroncoWave
01-10-2009, 01:08 AM
Why do people act like if McDaniels comes in, nothing will be done to fix our defense? Shouldn't we wait until we see who he names as his DC (assuming McD gets the job) before we go spouting off about how he would be a mistake and do nothing to fix the defense? It only seems fair.

Watchthemiddle
01-10-2009, 01:12 AM
We just got rid of one of the best offensive minded coaches in the NFL. Why not try a defensive minded coach as HC and see where that gets us?

BroncoWave
01-10-2009, 01:35 AM
We just got rid of one of the best offensive minded coaches in the NFL. Why not try a defensive minded coach as HC and see where that gets us?

What's wrong with possibly bringing in an offensive minded HC and a kickass DC? Just because we get a defensive oriented HC doesn't mean our defense will magically be fixed. I'd be more concerned with getting a great DC than I would a HC who has a background in defense. (Which McDaniels actually does BTW)

PatricktheDookie
01-10-2009, 02:14 AM
If it's Frazier, I walk.

Lonestar
01-10-2009, 02:28 AM
morris has not even been a coordinator merely a coach. I Can't see how him being away from the buc's and coming back would make a hill of beans worth of difference..

Sorry to young to in experienced IMHO to hand over a billion dollar operation..

omac
01-10-2009, 02:37 AM
I was really set on Spags, but after reading the arguments for McDaniels-Capers, I'd be good with either hire.

dogfish
01-10-2009, 03:10 AM
I'll only be 'happy' with any of the candidates once I see if the Broncos don't enter a long period of futility. The 'odds' are whoever the coach is that is hired, he will be a failure. That is the hard truth of the NFL. More new head coaches fail than succeed.

I am one of the 'spoiled' Broncos' fans that is used to virtually no losing seasons. Someone that is disspointed by a one and out in the playoffs and devestated by a .500 season. I am one of the spoiled fans that isn't used to life as the fan of the other 31 NFL franchises.

History tells us that whoever is picked will more than likely be a dissapointment and fired within three to four years.

I 'hope' that we get a coach that defies history and the odds, but the reason that casinos and bookmakers make so much money is that those that bet against the odds, usually lose.



odds schmods. . . . :D


tomlin walked into the exact same situation in pitt, and he hasn't exactly crashed the ship. . . . oh, i know it's inevitable that we'll stink at some point (we haven't been what i'd call odor-free the past few years), but if you've got a quality quarterback and an established coaching staff and system, you can buck the odds for a long time. . . hell, look at the opposite side of the coin-- the math should work the same there, but arizona just won their second playoff game in, what? like the last forty years? how about detroit? somebody has to be consistently good to balance out that kind of abominable suckiness, and IMO no one better than us. . . .

honz
01-10-2009, 04:00 AM
Really, none of us know jack about how any of these guys will do as a head coach since they will all be first timers. My preference would be to bring in a defensive minded coach and keep our offensive coaches in place, but we'll see what happens.

As far as Morris never being a DC, Jim or John Harbaugh (whichever one coaches the Ravens) was only a special teams coach or something before he took over for the Ravens and turned them around this year.

fcspikeit
01-10-2009, 04:37 AM
Really, none of us know jack about how any of these guys will do as a head coach since they will all be first timers. My preference would be to bring in a defensive minded coach and keep our offensive coaches in place, but we'll see what happens.

As far as Morris never being a DC, Jim or John Harbaugh (whichever one coaches the Ravens) was only a special teams coach or something before he took over for the Ravens and turned them around this year.

John Harbaugh has done a good job but the main reason they've been so good is their D. The O has come around a bit but it's the D that kept them in games..

Even then there has been some luck involved. Flacco was the 3rd QB coming into the season. He got the start because the other 2 went down. Who knows what would have happened had that not happened...

I once got change for a 100 when I had only gave a 20 at the show house.. Do you suppose I could get rich if I went to the movies more often?


It's hard enough to get a good coach, the odds are not good. The more you know about the guy the better..


By the way, I gave the money back.. I had to argue with the guy who insisted I gave him a 100. After looking in the bottom of his tray and seeing the 20 where they put the 100's, He informed me I had only gave him a 20... Yeah, he was a real punk. Then he charged me full price for an empty cup...

DenBronx
01-10-2009, 05:34 AM
why not mcdaniels as HC and morris as DC???

fcspikeit
01-10-2009, 05:39 AM
why not mcdaniels as HC and morris as DC???

Why would he take the DC job here with a worse defense when he could be the DC at Tampa?

broncophan
01-10-2009, 07:30 AM
I think I am stating the obvious here.........but is any of the coaching candidates better than Shanahan?.........

No........

They have not proven anything......other than the fact that they are good coordinators etc........

We have had to wait 2-3 years so far.....as our young qb tries to learn the Shanahan way.......

and now we will have to wait as the new head coach comes on in......and figures out how to be a head coach in the nfl

and yes, I know there has been a couple rookie head coaches do well this season......but that is rare....

UnderArmour
01-10-2009, 08:54 AM
morris has not even been a coordinator merely a coach. I Can't see how him being away from the buc's and coming back would make a hill of beans worth of difference..

Sorry to young to in experienced IMHO to hand over a billion dollar operation..

By that logic we should have never fired Shanahan and/or our interviewing list should've been Mike Holmgren, Bill Cowher, Eric Mangini, Romeo Crennell, Jim Haslett, Mike Martz, and Mike Nolan. No thanks. If Morris met the qualifications at the interview and Pat honestly believes this guy can win us a Super Bowl, I want him on our sidelines. None of this "he's inexperienced" crap. Mike Singleterry is doing pretty well and he never coordinated a defense.

Ziggy
01-10-2009, 09:16 AM
If it's Frazier, I walk.

If you quit on your team because they didn't hire the HC you want, then don't let the door hit ya where the Good Lord split ya! ;)

Ziggy
01-10-2009, 09:21 AM
Let's face it. You don't win many games with the 28th ranked defense in the NFL. It doesn't matter how good your offense is. We had the best coach in the NFL and only finished 8-8. Even JR, who seems to hate Shanahan with every fiber of his being, will admit that Shanahan the coach is one of the best in the NFL, if not the best. The odds are against any new head coach until we get some talent on that side of the ball. A good DC will help, but it's not going to fix the problems we have in one season.

lex
01-10-2009, 09:27 AM
What's wrong with possibly bringing in an offensive minded HC and a kickass DC? Just because we get a defensive oriented HC doesn't mean our defense will magically be fixed. I'd be more concerned with getting a great DC than I would a HC who has a background in defense. (Which McDaniels actually does BTW)


Because the problem was defense. If you go the route youre saying, you have to make two significant hires to fix the defense. If you hire a defensive minded head coach, you see the vision with the initial hire, provided he has something on his resume as a DC.

lex
01-10-2009, 09:30 AM
odds schmods. . . . :D


tomlin walked into the exact same situation in pitt, and he hasn't exactly crashed the ship. . . . oh, i know it's inevitable that we'll stink at some point (we haven't been what i'd call odor-free the past few years), but if you've got a quality quarterback and an established coaching staff and system, you can buck the odds for a long time. . . hell, look at the opposite side of the coin-- the math should work the same there, but arizona just won their second playoff game in, what? like the last forty years? how about detroit? somebody has to be consistently good to balance out that kind of abominable suckiness, and IMO no one better than us. . . .


Totally different. Tomlin didnt have to fix anyting. In fact, he was a 4-3 coach and Pittsburgh had been so successful with the 3-4 that Tomlin left it alone. We're not in that situation...nowhere close.

Ziggy
01-10-2009, 09:31 AM
Because the problem was defense. If you go the route youre saying, you have to make two significant hires to fix the defense. If you hire a defensive minded head coach, you see the vision with the initial hire, provided he has something on his resume as a DC.

And how well did that work for Cincinatti, Cleveland, and Detroit?

lex
01-10-2009, 09:35 AM
And how well did that work for Cincinatti, Cleveland, and Detroit?


Its kind of dumb to cherry pick instances like you are. I could just as easily go down a list of defensive minded coaches that have done well. And Cincy and Detroit arent even analagous anyway. Bowlen is allegedly a much better owner to work for than the two of those teams you mentioned. Nice try though. I cant wait to see what youre going to throw against the wall next.

Ziggy
01-10-2009, 09:42 AM
Its kind of dumb to cherry pick instances like you are. I could just as easily go down a list of defensive minded coaches that have done well. And Cincy and Detroit arent even analagous anyway. Bowlen is allegedly a much better owner to work for than the two of those teams you mentioned. Nice try though. I cant wait to see what youre going to throw against the wall next.

Those are recent examples Lex. I could even add San Fran to that list. Why don't you give me more recent examples of defensive minded coaches who have done well taking over a team that didn't already have a good defense in place.

Dumb? No dumb would be starting a thread entitled, "Can anyone tell me why we wasted a 3rd round pick on Ryan Harris", or "Disown a Bronco."

SmilinAssasSin27
01-10-2009, 09:48 AM
Why? He seems to be the rising in popularity on the boards, but I haven't seen much on why.

2-The more I hear about Morris, the moe interested I am in him. Many here say a guy must climb the ladder and be a DC before he should be a coach. Yet those same fiolks say that being a great DC doesn't make you a good HC. Somtimes you simply need an inspirational leader of men. A guy who is smart, has his shit together, a guy the players like AND RESPECT, althewhile showing well to the media. Look no further than Tomlin of Pittsburgh. He didn't have decades of exprience, but hehad the intangibles and wowed the Rooneys. From what I'm reading and hearing, Morris may have that "it" factor. Why can't he just be IT and still hire very good coorinators to enhance his apparent natural leadership abilities?

Ziggy
01-10-2009, 09:54 AM
2-The more I hear about Morris, the moe interested I am in him. Many here say a guy must climb the ladder and be a DC before he should be a coach. Yet those same fiolks say that being a great DC doesn't make you a good HC. Somtimes you simply need an inspirational leader of men. A guy who is smart, has his shit together, a guy the players like AND RESPECT, althewhile showing well to the media. Look no further than Tomlin of Pittsburgh. He didn't have decades of exprience, but hehad the intangibles and wowed the Rooneys. From what I'm reading and hearing, Morris may have that "it" factor. Why can't he just be IT and still hire very good coorinators to enhance his apparent natural leadership abilities?

I'm not arguing the possible signing of Morris. I'm just curious about why he's gaining popularity so fast. I really don't know much about the guy. I would love to see this team hire someone who will change the mentality on this team right now. I'll back whoever Bowlen hires. I'm a Broncos fan. :beer:

dogfish
01-10-2009, 09:59 AM
Totally different. Tomlin didnt have to fix anyting. In fact, he was a 4-3 coach and Pittsburgh had been so successful with the 3-4 that Tomlin left it alone. We're not in that situation...nowhere close.


i didn't mean that the teams were the same, i meant that his situation coming in and replacing a very successful head coach was the same. . . .

Nomad
01-10-2009, 10:24 AM
Totally different. Tomlin didnt have to fix anyting. In fact, he was a 4-3 coach and Pittsburgh had been so successful with the 3-4 that Tomlin left it alone. We're not in that situation...nowhere close.

i agree lex! Cowher built the team Tomlin has and now Tomlin benefits adding a few pieces here and there. Sorry to say, Shanahan leaves with poor defense and very young offense, next coach will have their work cut out for them.

lex
01-10-2009, 10:55 AM
Those are recent examples Lex. I could even add San Fran to that list. Why don't you give me more recent examples of defensive minded coaches who have done well taking over a team that didn't already have a good defense in place.

Dumb? No dumb would be starting a thread entitled, "Can anyone tell me why we wasted a 3rd round pick on Ryan Harris", or "Disown a Bronco."

That doesnt really do anything to what I said in the post you are responding to.

gobroncsnv
01-10-2009, 11:00 AM
If we do get a defense-minded coach, he's gonna want SOME impact on the offense, because he's not going to put up with as many turnovers as we've dished up this year. Puts WAY too much pressure on any defense. We HAVE to get back to some sort of a running game to give our D a chance. Talking about future defense here, because, currently, our defense has NO chance.

BroncoWave
01-10-2009, 11:14 AM
Because the problem was defense. If you go the route youre saying, you have to make two significant hires to fix the defense. If you hire a defensive minded head coach, you see the vision with the initial hire, provided he has something on his resume as a DC.

So you'd rather only hire one good coach than two? That doesn't make much sense! Besides, even if we get one of those "defensive minded head coaches" he's still going to have to being a good DC with him or our D won't get any better.

Tned
01-10-2009, 11:18 AM
odds schmods. . . . :D


tomlin walked into the exact same situation in pitt, and he hasn't exactly crashed the ship. . . . oh, i know it's inevitable that we'll stink at some point (we haven't been what i'd call odor-free the past few years), but if you've got a quality quarterback and an established coaching staff and system, you can buck the odds for a long time. . . hell, look at the opposite side of the coin-- the math should work the same there, but arizona just won their second playoff game in, what? like the last forty years? how about detroit? somebody has to be consistently good to balance out that kind of abominable suckiness, and IMO no one better than us. . . .

With the exception of the Broncos consistently winning over a couple decades (until a few years ago, the Dolphins were up there) and a couple teams like the Cards, pretty much all other teams are like the Cowboy, Pakers, Niners, etc. These are considered great franchises with SB wins and have all had great runs, but have had very hard times (not three years of .500 ball) in between their runs.

One difference with Tomlin is that he walked into a position on an established team on both sides of the ball. They already had Big Ben and Palker. They were just a few years from a SB win, and still going strong. They already had a crushing defense with some incredible talent on it. I'm not sure which assistants, if any, were kept in Pitt, but their offense and defense appeared to stay mostly the same, so I am guessing a lot of assistant coaches remained.

The Denver situation is different, because we aren't a few years from winning the SB, we are few years from being embarrassed by Pitt in the AFCCG and then trying to remake our team, and it was just stopped midway through the remaking.

Anyway, the longwinded post here is that the situation is much different. In Pitt, they handed the keys to the Ferrari to Tomlin and said, drive it to the SB, try not to wreck it.

In Denver, they are going to be handing someone the keys to a Ferrari that was wrapped around a light pole, and asking the head coach to get it fixed and back on the road as soon as possible.

SmilinAssasSin27
01-10-2009, 11:22 AM
I'm not arguing the possible signing of Morris. I'm just curious about why he's gaining popularity so fast. I really don't know much about the guy. I would love to see this team hire someone who will change the mentality on this team right now. I'll back whoever Bowlen hires. I'm a Broncos fan. :beer:

To me, if we have a DC and an OC who are competent, the HC's main responsibilities are elsewhere. Of course he has the final say on everything, but it's more than just calling plays. A LOT of great coordinators have been lousy coaches. But they can still call a hell of a game on their side of the ball. The head coach transcend playcalling. He motivates, inspires, directs, HOLD FOLKS ACCOUNTABLE and so on...

None of us have any first hand experience w/ any of these guys. We make our opinions/assumptions bsed on what we hear and what think we see, althewhile deciding whether or not to accept or discount the many variables present in each candidate's situation. Based on what I've read on Morris, I like what I'm hearing. I have no issue w/ Spags, but I dunno if I expect him to b the sparkplug for an organization that maybe Morris will be.

Nomad
01-10-2009, 11:32 AM
With the exception of the Broncos consistently winning over a couple decades (until a few years ago, the Dolphins were up there) and a couple teams like the Cards, pretty much all other teams are like the Cowboy, Pakers, Niners, etc. These are considered great franchises with SB wins and have all had great runs, but have had very hard times (not three years of .500 ball) in between their runs.

One difference with Tomlin is that he walked into a position on an established team on both sides of the ball. They already had Big Ben and Palker. They were just a few years from a SB win, and still going strong. They already had a crushing defense with some incredible talent on it. I'm not sure which assistants, if any, were kept in Pitt, but their offense and defense appeared to stay mostly the same, so I am guessing a lot of assistant coaches remained.

The Denver situation is different, because we aren't a few years from winning the SB, we are few years from being embarrassed by Pitt in the AFCCG and then trying to remake our team, and it was just stopped midway through the remaking.

Anyway, the longwinded post here is that the situation is much different. In Pitt, they handed the keys to the Ferrari to Tomlin and said, drive it to the SB, try not to wreck it.

In Denver, they are going to be handing someone the keys to a Ferrari that was wrapped around a light pole, and asking the head coach to get it fixed and back on the road as soon as possible.

So you're saying just because one can drive doesn't mean they can handle a Ferrari! As I said before this is going to be a challenge for any of these young coaches, hopefully who ever is chosen brings in some veteran coaches as well.

Tned
01-10-2009, 11:42 AM
So you're saying just because one can drive doesn't mean they can handle a Ferrari! As I said before this is going to be a challenge for any of these young coaches, hopefully who ever is chosen brings in some veteran coaches as well.

Well, it is true that most drivers can't handle driving a Ferrari at race speeds. They would destroy it and kill themselves before reaching the finish lines.

Anyway, as to cars, I was only using it as an illustration about Pitt/Denver. Tomlin taking over in Pitt is nothing like the situation we have here. So, the fact that Pitt didn't have a severe downturn after Tomlin took over is no indication of what will happen in Denver when the new coach comes in. The franchises (Denver now and Pitt when Tomlin took over) are at two very different places.

Nomad
01-10-2009, 11:45 AM
Well, it is true that most drivers can't handle driving a Ferrari at race speeds. They would destroy it and kill themselves before reaching the finish lines.

Anyway, as to cars, I was only using it as an illustration about Pitt/Denver. Tomlin taking over in Pitt is nothing like the situation we have here. So, the fact that Pitt didn't have a severe downturn after Tomlin took over is no indication of what will happen in Denver when the new coach comes in. The franchises (Denver now and Pitt when Tomlin took over) are at two very different places.

I know what you meant and Tomlin was very lucky!

Nomad
01-10-2009, 12:06 PM
On mania, they're saying Mortensen is saying down to 2 coaches, more tnan likely, McDaniels and Frazier!:noidea:

Tned
01-10-2009, 12:12 PM
I know what you meant and Tomlin was very lucky!

And to a 'degree' whoever comes to Denver is going to be lucky. Not to the same degree, but lucky none the less.

With the exception of RB and center, the Broncos are loaded with young talent for at least the next two years (depending on who is resigned and who gets away as FA's).

While I'm in the minority, I don't think the defense needs to be 'blown up', but instead needs a small number of key replacements, and then the players properly executing whatever scheme is laid out. That has the potential to be 'fixed' by week 1 of '09.

However, I am also mindful of how good Cincy's offense looked just a few years ago. How they looked like they were finally ready to be serious contenders.

There is a lot of certainty in the NFL, from player injuries, to finding out that great coordinators often make mediocre head coaches.

I'm very optimistic, and will expect the Broncos to put a winning team on the field next year, because I am one of those spoiled fans that can't see Denver missing the playoffs for four years in a row. I'm anxious to see who the new coach is, and am excited about the idea of getting a defensive guru in here, and even to a lesser degree about what McDaniels might be able to do with all that talent on offense.

However, I am also enough of a realist to know that winning in Denver isn't a birthright (I think I posted about that :D), and that more head coaches are busts than are crowned masterminds.

Tned
01-10-2009, 12:20 PM
On mania, they're saying Mortensen is saying down to 2 coaches, more tnan likely, McDaniels and Frazier!:noidea:

Hmmm. If that's the case, then I think I am going to have to 'wish' for McDaniels and that he can bring in a decent DC.

The Vikings defense has been good, but also with some very talented people (especially that line). I don't know how much of that was him and how much of that was the front office. How much of the Viking's defensive success was left over from Tomlin who he replaced?

It's wierd. His name, somewhat like the Miami guy, almost seemed like a throw in "also going to interview....", and now he could be the guy.

One major factor here, could be the Broncos wanting to keep those offensive coaches, and Frazier might have been the defensive coach willing to keep the offensive coaches in place.

I hope Bowlen and company don't meddle too much and force any assistant coaches or coordinators on a new head coach, because more than likely that will end badly.

SmilinAssasSin27
01-10-2009, 12:29 PM
I'd be less than pleased.

TXBRONC
01-10-2009, 12:30 PM
And to a 'degree' whoever comes to Denver is going to be lucky. Not to the same degree, but lucky none the less.

With the exception of RB and center, the Broncos are loaded with young talent for at least the next two years (depending on who is resigned and who gets away as FA's).

While I'm in the minority, I don't think the defense needs to be 'blown up', but instead needs a small number of key replacements, and then the players properly executing whatever scheme is laid out. That has the potential to be 'fixed' by week 1 of '09.

However, I am also mindful of how good Cincy's offense looked just a few years ago. How they looked like they were finally ready to be serious contenders.

There is a lot of certainty in the NFL, from player injuries, to finding out that great coordinators often make mediocre head coaches.

I'm very optimistic, and will expect the Broncos to put a winning team on the field next year, because I am one of those spoiled fans that can't see Denver missing the playoffs for four years in a row. I'm anxious to see who the new coach is, and am excited about the idea of getting a defensive guru in here, and even to a lesser degree about what McDaniels might be able to do with all that talent on offense.

However, I am also enough of a realist to know that winning in Denver isn't a birthright (I think I posted about that :D), and that more head coaches are busts than are crowned masterminds.

I agree while it isn't absolute that we'll return to our winning ways nor (as you put it) a birthright I think there is enough young talent to do so. However, I'm little more leery that it could be completely fixed by week one of '09 but not discounting that you could be right.

Tned
01-10-2009, 12:33 PM
I'd be less than pleased.

With Frazier, or either one?

Frazier isn't a young gun and not old. Falls in between. He has jumped around a lot. Spent two years as Cincy's DC, but then essentially moved to Indy to be the DB's coach (special assistant to the HC, but brought in to work with DBs), then took over Tomlin's spot in Minn.

McDaniels, like all coordinators, is an unkown, because you don't know how much of a given success has been the coordinator and how much the HC.

Lots of unkowns, so it's hard to even know who to 'root' for as the next HC.

SmilinAssasSin27
01-10-2009, 12:42 PM
frazier

SmilinAssasSin27
01-10-2009, 12:46 PM
I just don't see what in Frazier's track record warrants real consideration. Cincy's D SUCKED when he was there. Indy's DBs are hardly spectacular, w/ the exception of 1 Safety from Erie, PA. Now his D finishes outside the top 10 w/ only 1 major injury and possible the most talented dline in football. Ryan in Bmore always has dudes hurt and their Ds stay incredible.

As I've said before, the HC has different duties, but I don't get what makes this particular dude an option. All reorts on him say he expects players to motivate themselves and is a very calm dude.

Tned
01-10-2009, 12:47 PM
frazier

Yea, of the seven candidates, based on what I know of them and my 'gut', I would put him in the bottom three along with Dennison and the Miami guy.

BroncoJoe
01-10-2009, 12:48 PM
I just don't see what in Frazier's track record warrants real consideration. Cincy's D SUCKED when he was there. Indy's DBs are hardly spectacular, w/ the exception of 1 Safety from Erie, PA. Now his D finishes outside the top 10 w/ only 1 major injury and possible the most talented dline in football. Ryan in Bmore always has dudes hurt and their Ds stay incredible.

As I've said before, the HC has different duties, but I don't get what makes this particular dude an option. All reorts on him say he expects players to motivate themselves and is a very calm dude.

That last sentence sounds a bit like Shanahan...

MOtorboat
01-10-2009, 12:56 PM
FWIW the Denver Post has removed anything about the coaching search from the Klis article quoted in the first post of this thread.

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_11418502

Ziggy
01-10-2009, 01:02 PM
On mania, they're saying Mortensen is saying down to 2 coaches, more tnan likely, McDaniels and Frazier!:noidea:

Now Mort is backtracking and saying that it is down to 2, but not sure which 2. Just that there is a lot of "buzz" about Josh McDaniels.

Lonestar
01-10-2009, 01:04 PM
Let's face it. You don't win many games with the 28th ranked defense in the NFL. It doesn't matter how good your offense is. We had the best coach in the NFL and only finished 8-8. Even JR, who seems to hate Shanahan with every fiber of his being, will admit that Shanahan the coach is one of the best in the NFL, if not the best. The odds are against any new head coach until we get some talent on that side of the ball. A good DC will help, but it's not going to fix the problems we have in one season.



Let me clarify, while it seems I hate mikey I do not .. Just do not trust him to tell the truth.. as a GM he was a utter failure from 1999-2005 IMHO almost no value of those picks other than a few LBs and some mediocre OLINE and RB types.. oh and poorti$$$$.. but beyond that we coasted on the Superbowl players already on the team until they were gone..
Now we are in dire straights except for a core of players picked in 2006 and then 08.. If we would have been getting half of what we did in those two drafts all along the way we would be crapping in tall cotton right now..

Pat was ultimately art fault allowing his personal affection with mikey to cloud his business sense, by allowing mikey to run amuck making all of the decisions up till last year with him putting his foot down on FA acquisitions.. and maybe even the year before with the Bates fiasco.. I still believe that hiring Bates was not mikeys idea..

Mikey at one time was a brilliant offensive mind, showed that with making good players into more than that, but never IMHO believed that you had to have a great defense to go with his top flight O..

Am I glad he is gone not really, but am glad that we MAY get a good new regime in here to right the ship in the personnel area.. and finally get a respectable defense..

Lonestar
01-10-2009, 01:09 PM
2-The more I hear about Morris, the moe interested I am in him. Many here say a guy must climb the ladder and be a DC before he should be a coach. Yet those same fiolks say that being a great DC doesn't make you a good HC. Somtimes you simply need an inspirational leader of men. A guy who is smart, has his shit together, a guy the players like AND RESPECT, althewhile showing well to the media. Look no further than Tomlin of Pittsburgh. He didn't have decades of exprience, but hehad the intangibles and wowed the Rooneys. From what I'm reading and hearing, Morris may have that "it" factor. Why can't he just be IT and still hire very good coorinators to enhance his apparent natural leadership abilities?


hey if that is the case, look no further Pat, slowicks is our GUY..

Nomad
01-10-2009, 01:12 PM
Now Mort is backtracking and saying that it is down to 2, but not sure which 2. Just that there is a lot of "buzz" about Josh McDaniels.

I was going off what was given at Mania! The game of speculation is fun keeps the media and fan forums busy!

MOtorboat
01-10-2009, 01:12 PM
hey if that is the case, look no further Pat, slowicks is our GUY..

:confused:

He's been thrown under the bus by our two biggest names, Jay Cutler...and now Champ Bailey.

The two faces of the franchise.

BroncoWave
01-10-2009, 01:13 PM
I don't think Mort ever backtracked. He just said today on countdown that the Broncos are down to two guys and that those 2 guys are among McDaniels, Frazier, Spagnuolo, Garrett, or Morris. So pretty much, nothing we haven't already heard. He also said that they are having a second interview with McDaniels.

Ziggy
01-10-2009, 01:17 PM
I don't think Mort ever backtracked. He just said today on countdown that the Broncos are down to two guys and that those 2 guys are among McDaniels, Frazier, Spagnuolo, Garrett, or Morris. So pretty much, nothing we haven't already heard. He also said that they are having a second interview with McDaniels.

If it truly is down to 2, and they only interview Mcdaniels, then we know who the other one is.

Nomad
01-10-2009, 01:18 PM
I don't think Mort ever backtracked. He just said today on countdown that the Broncos are down to two guys and that those 2 guys are among McDaniels, Frazier, Spagnuolo, Garrett, or Morris. So pretty much, nothing we haven't already heard. He also said that they are having a second interview with McDaniels.


Thanks I haven't turned the tube on today! There was a thread on mania that said mcdaniels/fraziers the finalists! I know nothing's written in stone until Pat comes on the news and introduces the new HC!!

BroncoWave
01-10-2009, 01:21 PM
Thanks I haven't turned the tube on today! There was a thread on mania that said mcdaniels/fraziers the finalists! I know nothing's written in stone until Pat comes on the news and introduces the new HC!!

Yeah, he never said that. Those we just the first two names he mentioned in that list of 5 when he said that they were down to two candidates, and someone probably just took that and ran over at BM without listening to the rest of what Mort had to say.

Ziggy
01-10-2009, 01:22 PM
Mort is coming up on espn radio next. I'll post what he says.

TXBRONC
01-10-2009, 01:26 PM
Yeah, he never said that. Those we just the first two names he mentioned in that list of 5 when he said that they were down to two candidates, and someone probably just took that and ran over at BM without listening to the rest of what Mort had to say.

As far as the thread from Broncomania is concerned that is exactly what happened. A couple of people took it and made huge jumps with nothing remotely concrete.

Lonestar
01-10-2009, 01:28 PM
2-The more I hear about Morris, the moe interested I am in him. Many here say a guy must climb the ladder and be a DC before he should be a coach. Yet those same fiolks say that being a great DC doesn't make you a good HC. Somtimes you simply need an inspirational leader of men. A guy who is smart, has his shit together, a guy the players like AND RESPECT, althewhile showing well to the media. Look no further than Tomlin of Pittsburgh. He didn't have decades of exprience, but hehad the intangibles and wowed the Rooneys. From what I'm reading and hearing, Morris may have that "it" factor. Why can't he just be IT and still hire very good coorinators to enhance his apparent natural leadership abilities?


hey if that is the case, look no further Pat, slowicks is our GUY..


:confused:

He's been thrown under the bus by our two biggest names, Jay Cutler...and now Champ Bailey.

The two faces of the franchise.

I was responding to smilin's comment about morris not having experience and being liked by his players.

I repeat at the time slowick was promoted he had virtually no experience and was highly respected by our DB Champ in particular.. and we ALL KNOW now it was a huge mistake..

It was tongue in cheek, I know and have stated that Champ has since threw him under the bus..

I was trying with humor to draw and analogy between the two.. both unqualified to be HC materal..IMHO

broncobryce
01-10-2009, 01:29 PM
hey if that is the case, look no further Pat, slowicks is our GUY..

:lol::lol::lol: I thought it was funny.

hamrob
01-10-2009, 01:31 PM
I think Mcdaniel's would be a perfect fit for Jay and Bates. Considering that we were studying the Pats in the offseason to begin with...this makes alot of sense on offense.

As for defense...the only way you go with Mcdaniels is if you already have a guy in mind to take over your defense. Perhaps it's Capers as has been rumored or perhaps you bring in a guy like Morris and make him AHC and sell him on the fact that he will have both Free Agency and the Draft to fix our defense and shmooze him by telling him how great he'll look if he turns our defense around...that he'll have his choice of head coaching jobs. Personally, I like the idea of Mcdaniels and a strong assistant head coach to run the defense.

I was warm on Spags...until I heard he wants a ball control offense. Yeah, that would be just perfect, considering we invested in guys like Clady (ZBS - Pass blocking LT) and Jay Cutler (Best young gunslinger in the game). Say hello to Dan Reaves 2. Oh yeah, he took us to 3 SB's...where we got blown out of every one!

BroncoWave
01-10-2009, 01:32 PM
hey if that is the case, look no further Pat, slowicks is our GUY..



I was responding to smilin's comment about morris not having experience and being liked by his players.

I repeat at the time slowick was promoted he had virtually no experience and was highly respected by our DB Champ in particular.. and we ALL KNOW now it was a huge mistake..

It was tongue in cheek, I know and have stated that Champ has since threw him under the bus..

I was trying with humor to draw and analogy between the two.. both unqualified to be HC materal..IMHO

Well seeing as Bowlen and Co. have interviewd him and you haven't I'd say they are more qualified to determine if he's qualified to be the Broncos HC or not. And if he's the guy, he might not have been who I'd have chosen, but I'll still get behind him and support him...unlike many on here who would undoubtably crucify him before he even gets a chance to coach his first game.

tomjonesrocks
01-10-2009, 01:34 PM
Does anyone actually still expect the team to go with Spagnuolo?

I don't...

broncobryce
01-10-2009, 01:35 PM
The next coach will have big shoes to fill, that's for sure. I can hear it now- "shanny would have went for it on 4th and 1 there." etc. etc. That just comes with the territory.

Lonestar
01-10-2009, 01:37 PM
I could handle mc Daniel and crenell or capers as they are both proven DC guys.. neither HC material IMHO but were both great D gurus..

If spags wants to do ball control that is OK by me also.. I suspect once he gets here and has a good OC under him and he sees that Jay is not Eli, things will open up.. to a more passing attack type of play book..

HE is comfortable with Ball control because he knows Eli is a manager only.. It would be great for both Jay and Spags to learn from each other..

Ziggy
01-10-2009, 01:37 PM
Sorry guys. Right after Mort came on, I had a minor in-house emergency. Gotta love teenagers. I did hear that Denver has another interview with McDaniels. Mike Salk just said that Mort believes it is coming down to McDaniels and Frazier. It's the Mike Salk show on espn radio that Mort was just on.

TXBRONC
01-10-2009, 01:38 PM
Well seeing as Bowlen and Co. have interviewd him and you haven't I'd say they are more qualified to determine if he's qualified to be the Broncos HC or not. And if he's the guy, he might not have been who I'd have chosen, but I'll still get behind him and support him...unlike many on here who would undoubtably crucify him before he even gets a chance to coach his first game.

That would happen.

Nomad
01-10-2009, 02:41 PM
Adam Schefler updated his blog and is saying McDaniels is the front runner. Ellis had a 5 1/2 hr interview with him ( I assume today and was the 2nd) and Schefler believes Frazier and Morris are the others, so the Spag theory looks like it's becoming more distant as the day goes on!

Tned
01-10-2009, 02:42 PM
:confused:

He's been thrown under the bus by our two biggest names, Jay Cutler...and now Champ Bailey.

The two faces of the franchise.

I heard Jay inappropriately throw the defense under the bus after the game, not Slowick specifically.

underrated29
01-10-2009, 02:58 PM
wheres big blue now.


he must have a case of the blue balls and didnt want to show up.

SmilinAssasSin27
01-10-2009, 03:06 PM
well there is a green dot next to his name...

Lonestar
01-10-2009, 03:08 PM
well there is a green dot next to his name...


could be away from his computer.. taking care of his blue balls..

TXBRONC
01-10-2009, 04:28 PM
I heard Jay inappropriately throw the defense under the bus after the game, not Slowick specifically.

I didn't get watch the game what did Jay say just out of curiosity?

hamrob
01-10-2009, 07:10 PM
Jay just said that "We" couldn't stop anybody all year. He said it out of frustration no doubt, but probably should have held his tongue. Although that's not his style. He says what he feels. Now, I'm pretty confident that he'll have alot to say about his own play as well...in terms of having thrown 18 Int's. I remember him being interviewed before the season and he said that if the season ends and he threw 20 int's that he wouldn't have done his job. Well, he was close...I think he understands he needs to cut down on the TO's...he just needs some help from his defense!

gobroncsnv
01-11-2009, 12:48 PM
Jay needs to remember that the offense didn't do too much against Carolina nor the Chargers, and really seemed like they could have done more against the Bills. Little room to talk, but not much. Our opening drive scores don't seem to impress folks as much as they used to.

Lonestar
01-11-2009, 01:04 PM
Jay needs to remember that the offense didn't do too much against Carolina nor the Chargers, and really seemed like they could have done more against the Bills. Little room to talk, but not much. Our opening drive scores don't seem to impress folks as much as they used to.

actually I think it is more the defenses inability to stop the other team in their opening drive is more the issue..