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View Full Version : So who is to blame!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Bronco Bible
10-07-2007, 06:11 PM
I would like to know everyones opinion of our lackluster Broncos starting with the qb, I have heard how Cutler is the greatest thing since sliced bread,I don't see it , tell me what I am missing:confused:

silkamilkamonico
10-07-2007, 06:12 PM
Well, apparently not the coaches.

They're perfect.

:rolleyes:

Watchthemiddle
10-07-2007, 06:14 PM
EVERYONE!!

Offense 3 points. :mad:

Defense got ran over and scored on at will.

The special teams were actually the best out of the 3 today.

Denver Native (Carol)
10-07-2007, 06:16 PM
I will stick up for the defense today - pretty tough on them when they are on the field for most of the game - NOTHING today from the offense!!!!!!

TXBRONC
10-07-2007, 06:17 PM
I guess it was Jay's fault that Clark fumbled a kick off and Marshall put the ball fumbled as well. I don't think so.

BaiLeY324
10-07-2007, 06:18 PM
We're just not a good team. Get your reservations for New York City, because Darren McFadden is going to be renamed Denver McFadden. And I can't wait

Bronco Bible
10-07-2007, 06:20 PM
I for one am tired of 1 int. per game.what happened to the promise of the AZ.
game from last year :tsk:

silkamilkamonico
10-07-2007, 06:21 PM
We're just not a good team. Get your reservations for New York City, because Darren McFadden is going to be renamed Denver McFadden. And I can't wait

Don't tease me like that.

Bronco Bible
10-07-2007, 06:22 PM
I guess it was Jay's fault that Clark fumbled a kick off and Marshall put the ball fumbled as well. I don't think so.

Not Cutlers fault ,ints & crappy passes are his fault though.

TXBRONC
10-07-2007, 06:26 PM
Not Cutlers fault ,ints & crappy passes are his fault though.

Think about what you're one minute. Cutler didn't throw the int until we were behind by a bunch so get over yourself. Crappy pass? My gosh most of the day receivers were dropping the damn ball. Again get over yourself.

Den21vsBal19
10-07-2007, 06:29 PM
I for one am tired of 1 int. per game.what happened to the promise of the AZ.
game from last year :tsk:
Same thing that happened to our 13-3, 200 & some passes without a pick QB of two years ago, Hermdinger :mad:

Hate on me all you want, all of last season I was saying that he was the cause of most of our problems, not Jake............

Speaking of which, all the haters last season were saying that the playbook had been 'dumbed' down for Jake, and it would be opened back up for Jay.........not seeing a lot of evidence of that with the play calling

TXBRONC
10-07-2007, 06:32 PM
Same thing that happened to our 13-3, 200 & some passes without a pick QB of two years ago, Hermdinger :mad:

Hate on me all you want, all of last season I was saying that he was the cause of most of our problems, not Jake............

Speaking of which, all the haters last season were saying that the playbook had been 'dumbed' down for Jake, and it would be opened back up for Jay.........not seeing a lot of evidence of that with the play calling


I don't ever recall us using spead formations all that much with Jake as our quarterback.

Bronco Bible
10-07-2007, 06:33 PM
Think about what you're one minute. Cutler didn't throw the int until we were behind by a bunch so get over yourself. Crappy pass? My gosh most of the day receivers were dropping the damn ball. Again get over yourself.

What about the eight straight ints before that?:confused:

Bronco Bible
10-07-2007, 06:36 PM
Same thing that happened to our 13-3, 200 & some passes without a pick QB of two years ago, Hermdinger :mad:

Hate on me all you want, all of last season I was saying that he was the cause of most of our problems, not Jake............

Speaking of which, all the haters last season were saying that the playbook had been 'dumbed' down for Jake, and it would be opened back up for Jay.........not seeing a lot of evidence of that with the play calling

Looks like the only part of the playbook they opened was the int. part.

TXBRONC
10-07-2007, 06:36 PM
What about the eight straight ints before that?:confused:

What about it? Putting all the blame on Cutler is stupid.

SR
10-07-2007, 06:40 PM
The thing that stands out most to me is the lack of emotion by the team. Today, Dre Bly was the only one on the field that I saw fire from. He played great today, along with Nick Ferguson.

Secondly, the play calling is still weak.

I didn't get mad at Cutler's INT because at that point we were already WAY out of the game.


Wookie, if you read this, you were right.

Den21vsBal19
10-07-2007, 06:41 PM
I don't ever recall us using spead formations all that much with Jake as our quarterback.

The formations may have changed, but the philosophy doesn't have appeared to :sad:

TXBRONC
10-07-2007, 06:41 PM
The thing that stands out most to me is the lack of emotion by the team. Today, Dre Bly was the only one on the field that I saw fire from. He played great today, along with Nick Ferguson.

Secondly, the play calling is still weak.

I didn't get mad at Cutler's INT because at that point we were already WAY out of the game.


Wookie, if you read this, you were right.


Did you miss Jay chewing Brian Clark out?

Bronco Bible
10-07-2007, 06:45 PM
What about it? Putting all the blame on Cutler is stupid.

Don't recollect putting all the blame on Cutler , but just a wild thought should he not be held accountable for something ,people have given him a pass ( no pun intended) he does by the way wear a "C" on his chest every week.

topscribe
10-07-2007, 06:45 PM
Not Cutlers fault ,ints & crappy passes are his fault though.

1983 John Elway 17 TDs, 22 INTs, 66.4 passer rating.

Cutler doesn't even have a full season under his belt.

Give him a break.

-----

Bronco Bible
10-07-2007, 06:48 PM
Did you miss Jay chewing Brian Clark out?

For slipping,if he needed to be chewed out it should have been on his fumble

SR
10-07-2007, 06:49 PM
Did you miss Jay chewing Brian Clark out?

Yes.:ohwell:

Simple Jaded
10-07-2007, 06:49 PM
At this point I'm just looking for signs of improvement and encouragement, not at who I can project my frustrations onto.

Because it's obvious to me that blame can be spread around pretty liberally.

Maybe you should start a list of people that aren't to blame...

Simple Jaded
10-07-2007, 06:52 PM
1983 John Elway 17 TDs, 22 INTs, 66.4 passer rating.

Cutler doesn't even have a full season under his belt.

Give him a break.

-----


I wish you luck, Top, this is what Broncos fans do.

Cutler is the only QB in the history of the game that is throwing bad passes and INT's....

TXBRONC
10-07-2007, 06:53 PM
At this point I'm just looking for signs of improvement and encouragement, not at who I can project my frustrations onto.

Because it's obvious to me that blame can be spread around pretty liberally.

Maybe you should start a list of people that aren't to blame...


Well said Link.

Bronco Bible
10-07-2007, 06:53 PM
At this point I'm just looking for signs of improvement and encouragement, not at who I can project my frustrations onto.

Because it's obvious to me that blame can be spread around pretty liberally.

Maybe you should start a list of people that aren't to blame...

Would be a very short list indeed

East Coast Fan
10-07-2007, 07:20 PM
Many, many factors responsible for this situation. Like I said in my other post, this was the first game that I saw this season that was televised here in PA., and we had nothing-nothing on either side of the ball. Very disheartening to watch, and to see most of the fans had left in the third quarter. Just gotta go back and keep working until something (hopefully) turns around.

Denver Native (Carol)
10-07-2007, 07:22 PM
For slipping,if he needed to be chewed out it should have been on his fumble

Yeah, I did not understand that either. I can't see chewing someone out for slipping on a wet field. Probably just frustration coming out.

TXBRONC
10-07-2007, 07:26 PM
Yeah, I did not understand that either. I can't see chewing someone out for slipping on a wet field. Probably just frustration coming out.

Did you hear Simms' comments about it?

topscribe
10-07-2007, 07:28 PM
Did you hear Simms' comments about it?

I didn't. What did he say?

-----

Denver Native (Carol)
10-07-2007, 07:31 PM
Did you hear Simms' comments about it?

I remember them showing the replay, and one of the announcers commented about how he really did slip.

TXBRONC
10-07-2007, 07:36 PM
I remember them showing the replay, and one of the announcers commented about how he really did slip.

Simms was saying that receiver still needed to be aware of how he was making his cut. That's not a direct quote but think its close.

topscribe
10-07-2007, 07:39 PM
Simms was saying that receiver still needed to be aware of how he was making his cut. That's not a direct quote but think its close.

Well, that certainly was disastrous and would have made Cutler look like a
totally different QB. But that by no means was the turning point of the game.

The turning point was when the Broncos took the field . . . :coffee:

-----

East Coast Fan
10-07-2007, 07:42 PM
Well, that certainly was disastrous and would have made Cutler look like a
totally different QB. But that by no means was the turning point of the game.

The turning point was when the Broncos took the field . . . :coffee:

-----


It was a close game until the kickoff.

TXBRONC
10-07-2007, 07:42 PM
Well, that certainly was disastrous and would have made Cutler look like a
totally different QB. But that by no means was the turning point of the game.

The turning point was when the Broncos took the field . . . :coffee:

-----

I know that was the turning point, by that time we were behind by a bunch.

Day1BroncoFan
10-07-2007, 07:44 PM
I don't blame any one for this loss. This was a complete, utter melt down of the entire team starting from the coaching.

The only bright spot was Martinez. I thought Jay did good until the third quarter.

That being said, we still can't score points. We can't stop any one else from scoring points. It's going to be a long year unless it turns around.

East Coast Fan
10-07-2007, 07:48 PM
The only bright spot was Martinez.

I thought that Tony Scheffler looked good on a couple catches-hopefully he and Cutler can start to click again like they did last year.

Watchthemiddle
10-07-2007, 07:53 PM
As long as we are all still giving our QB a "break" or a "pass" then we might as well all concede that this in fact is a re-building year and look forward to next season. Once we stop doing that, then we are no longer rebuilding.

I haven't seen ONE person put all of the blame on Jay, but he has to take some responsibility for some of his actions and poor choices.

He is the leader or supposed to be the leader of the offense. We scored 3 points today and have lost 3 in a row now because of our lack of run defense and lack of offensive scoring.

9 straight games with an INT and starting your career as a starter with a 4-6 record doesn't cut it when we were all told he gave us the best chance to win and win now and has a TON of weapons around him. Well, so far that hasn't worked so therefore he does not get a free pass for missing wide open WR's, underthrowing covered WR's that turn into INT's, bounce passing the ball to WR's, and throwing into quadruple coverage.

I still think Jay will be good someday, but to say he has NO fault at all is not right. Last year everyone complained that our offense was boring. Well that boring offense started off the year 7-2 and we were 4-1 at this point only losing to the COlts by a last second FG. I would take that boring offense today over our .....whatever you want to call it offense today.

Vent over.

:coffee:

KCL
10-07-2007, 07:59 PM
I will stick up for the defense today - pretty tough on them when they are on the field for most of the game - NOTHING today from the offense!!!!!!

I agree Carol....you cannot leave your defense on the field and not
expect them to wear down and turning the ball over sure isnt a help...

altho the Titans turned the ball over 5 times and still won today!

silkamilkamonico
10-07-2007, 08:07 PM
Simms was saying that receiver still needed to be aware of how he was making his cut. That's not a direct quote but think its close.

Yea I heard that and he did make a point.

Considering how so many patterns are timing patterns, and one mistake in timing can result in a huge mistake, the WR needs to be aware of the situation and find a way to keep his feet regardless of the circumstance.

He did slip and it sucks, but the QB is relying on the WR to be there according to the timing of the route, and under the circumstance, the WR needs to find a way to run his route in any condition and not slip.

It's just the way it is.

Lonestar
10-07-2007, 08:11 PM
Think about what you're one minute. Cutler didn't throw the int until we were behind by a bunch so get over yourself. Crappy pass? My gosh most of the day receivers were dropping the damn ball. Again get over yourself.

Sounds like shades of St Jay speaking to borrow a metaphor.

Lonestar
10-07-2007, 08:15 PM
At this point I'm just looking for signs of improvement and encouragement, not at who I can project my frustrations onto.

Because it's obvious to me that blame can be spread around pretty liberally.

Maybe you should start a list of people that aren't to blame...


Javon
Ah that is all I can think of.

Carol adds Rod..

Denver Native (Carol)
10-07-2007, 08:27 PM
Javon
Ah that is all I can think of.

Hey - don't forget Rod

TXBRONC
10-07-2007, 08:29 PM
Sounds like shades of St Jay speaking to borrow a metaphor.


Nah its sounds more like know the difference between a 2nd year pro (Which by the way you have insisted on saying is a rookie) and a 10 year vet.

Lonestar
10-07-2007, 08:37 PM
Nah its sounds more like know the difference between a 2nd year pro (Which by the way you have insisted on saying is a rookie) and a 10 year vet.

Well TX he played more like a rookie today than I care to believe.

Just as last years offense was not all Jake this years is not all Jay.

Even you have to admit that they are not getting it done on the scoreboard.

DenBronx
10-07-2007, 08:38 PM
ive said it a few times before. we are stacked with talent on both sides of the ball and even our coaches have an impressive resume. the problem is we have a huge lack of chemistry on this team. for that reason alone i think its time to start looking at the coaches and not the players. we blame the players year after year after year.

sneakers
10-07-2007, 08:42 PM
I don't ever recall us using spead formations all that much with Jake as our quarterback.

No Bootlegs with Jay either. :Cry:

Lonestar
10-07-2007, 08:42 PM
ive said it a few times before. we are stacked with talent on both sides of the ball and even our coaches have an impressive resume. the problem is we have a huge lack of chemistry on this team. for that reason alone i think its time to start looking at the coaches and not the players. we blame the players year after year after year.

It is controlling the LOS we can't do that especially on defense or inside the red zone.

Nomad
10-07-2007, 08:47 PM
I blame my wife for taking my little girl to the rodeo today instead of dressing her out in her BRONCOS cheerleading uni and shopping the last two weekends! :D

DenBronx
10-07-2007, 08:49 PM
i blame my mustache trimmer...the blades are getting dull

Nomad
10-07-2007, 08:52 PM
i blame my mustache trimmer...the blades are getting dull

I bet that hurts!

arapaho2
10-07-2007, 10:33 PM
Not Cutlers fault ,ints & crappy passes are his fault though.


really?...lets see hes thrown six picks in his sixth - tenth proffsional games..one i know was from lepsis getting pushed into the throwing lane allowing the pass to be tipped (raiders?) another in the indy game was on marshell, if you watched it close you could see marshell half assed make his break on the slant and allow the defender to run through him ..todays again maybe underthrown but more then likely a matter of wind, but did you happen to notice what marshell was doing as the defender caught the ball, thats right he was still running, he never looked back for the ball once, if the pass had been five yards further it would have hit him in the back of the head, now had he done WHAT he is paid to do he would have looked for the ball, seen it was comeing down short and either used his height to outjump the defender or at least knock it down...these are cutlers ints, but they are not entirely his fault

Watchthemiddle
10-07-2007, 10:34 PM
really?...lets see hes thrown six picks in his sixth - tenth proffsional games..one i know was from lepsis getting pushed into the throwing lane allowing the pass to be tipped (raiders?) another in the indy game was on marshell, if you watched it close you could see marshell half assed make his break on the slant and allow the defender to run through him ..todays again maybe underthrown but more then likely a matter of wind, but did you happen to notice what marshell was doing as the defender caught the ball, thats right he was still running, he never looked back for the ball once, if the pass had been five yards further it would have hit him in the back of the head, now had he done WHAT he is paid to do he would have looked for the ball, seen it was comeing down short and either used his height to outjump the defender or at least knock it down...these are cutlers ints, but they are not entirely his fault

Excuses will be made, others will be blamed.

:coffee:

arapaho2
10-07-2007, 10:47 PM
Excuses will be made, others will be blamed.

:coffee:

bull those were not excuses..i did say they were cutlers ints did i not..i am merely saying it isnt as if the guy isnt playing at a high level, i am more then happy with his play...and facts are not an excuse

and we heard many more of those type of EXCUSES from you and the other plummer camp members...after virtually every game

Krugan
10-07-2007, 10:57 PM
Not to stir the pot, but I have this spoon.

Its somewhat amusing to see the tipped ball, poor blocking exscuses being used for the 2nd QB.

Anyway, we all have to remember, this was Cutlers 10th game as a NFL QB. As ugly as it has been, we shouldnt really expect alot moe than what he is giving us.

Now for the other 52 players, head coach, assistant head coaches, co-ords, water people, towel boys, broom handlers, bus drivers, pilots, meat grinders, shoe polishers, they need to pick it up abit.

Mike
10-07-2007, 10:58 PM
Excuses will be made, others will be blamed.

:coffee:

Just want to say that the INT was a dumb decision. He was throwing against the wind...which was why it hung up and allowed for the easy INT. I was a little irritated that Marshall made no effort to adjust to the pass though.

Nevertheless, this is the stupid mistake that can be expected and, somewhat, tolerated out of a second year QB.

What we were getting from Plummer last year was not what we should have been expecting and tolerating from a 10+ year QB.

Cutler will continue to make mistakes. It won't bother me. It is to be expected. He will learn and grow from it and will eventually become a better QB.

wandlc
10-08-2007, 12:48 AM
After watching the offense for the last 1 1/2 years, I will blame Heimerdinger or whoever puts the gameplan together and calls the plays. Whoever is calling the plays is not putting the offense in a rhythm and calling plays to take advantage of anticipated defensive calls. I really believe that the offense is suffering from the departure of Gary.

On a side note, statistically and on the scoreboard the defense didn't look good today, but from what I saw the front seven played with more discipline against the run, the pass rush though seemed to take a slide back. Also, I think having Champ out and Dre hurting really affected the pass coverage and the run support to a certain extent.

Watchthemiddle
10-08-2007, 01:11 AM
Like I said before....if we are too expect this type of play out of Cutler as the leader of the offense, then we can't be too upset over only getting 3 points today and 9 consecutive games with an INT.

If we should just accept it as a 2nd year player making bad choices, then lets start the rebuilding process now.

I am not ready for that. If we have to dumb down the playbook so he has easy reads and just manages the game and we WIN then I am all for it.

rcsodak
10-08-2007, 02:30 AM
I guess it was Jay's fault that Clark fumbled a kick off and Marshall put the ball fumbled as well. I don't think so.

Make sure you don't mention his consecutive string of int's.......:rolleyes:


And until he shows some fire out there....


I swear. This offense is taking on his lackluster persona. Mope onto the field. Mope up to the line.

Even BMarsh was trying to light a fire, with his first reception and war-call.

But even THAT couldn't ignite the fumes.

I see a few people retiring at the end of the year. They didn't bargain for this.

rcsodak
10-08-2007, 02:33 AM
Think about what you're one minute. Cutler didn't throw the int until we were behind by a bunch so get over yourself. Crappy pass? My gosh most of the day receivers were dropping the damn ball. Again get over yourself.

haha....WHO should get over themself?

Tx, tx, tx.....

I think you're suffering from "jake syndrome".

Sorry to hear that.;)

TXBRONC
10-08-2007, 03:47 AM
Well TX he played more like a rookie today than I care to believe.

Just as last years offense was not all Jake this years is not all Jay.

Even you have to admit that they are not getting it done on the scoreboard.

If you been reading my post in other threads you would know that I have.

Skinny
10-08-2007, 05:38 AM
ive said it a few times before. we are stacked with talent on both sides of the ball and even our coaches have an impressive resume. the problem is we have a huge lack of chemistry on this team. for that reason alone i think its time to start looking at the coaches and not the players. we blame the players year after year after year.Remember last year they blamed Larry Coyer and Andre Patterson.

How many people wanted them fired??

I agree though, the chemistry particularly on defense is'nt there.

TXBRONC
10-08-2007, 07:09 AM
Remember last year they blamed Larry Coyer and Andre Patterson.

How many people wanted them fired??

I agree though, the chemistry particularly on defense is'nt there.

That's a great point Skinny.

Denver Native (Carol)
10-08-2007, 08:15 AM
Remember last year they blamed Larry Coyer and Andre Patterson.

How many people wanted them fired??

I agree though, the chemistry particularly on defense is'nt there.

If you want to establish the chemistry on defense, WHY are players like Sam Adams, and Simeon Rice getting benched - which both were yesterday? Don't you need to play them consistently so the chemistry can be established? Chemistry will never be established if different players are constantly starting.

OB
10-08-2007, 12:10 PM
I think we are rebuilding and we are gonna be not that good for a year or two - we need some patience as fans

Medford Bronco
10-08-2007, 12:16 PM
I think we are rebuilding and we are gonna be not that good for a year or two - we need some patience as fans

Agreed,

the talent is not there on BOTH sides of the ball,

I am so sick of hearing this team has talent :laugh:

it clearly has some nice players but is lacking in almost all phases

Cutler is still so raw. His pick today was horrid.

I like his talent but he needs to stop the turnovers.
Until then this team will never win.

Didn 't #16 get killed for turning it over. Cutler has been no better and I do not even like Plummer. So lets be honest here.

we love this team but a 5-11 season is not out of the question, which I hate but can accept if it gets us better next year.
Even if the Broncos fluked out and when 9-7

Indy, Pitt or NE would kill us.

and I do not want to hear how we own NE. That is irrelevant now.
They would kill us. Brady would go 22 for 26 with 4 tds and Maroney/Morris would go for 200 in a 35-10 type loss.

If you cant stop the run and play a turnover free game. you aint beatin anyone

arapaho2
10-08-2007, 12:55 PM
Like I said before....if we are too expect this type of play out of Cutler as the leader of the offense, then we can't be too upset over only getting 3 points today and 9 consecutive games with an INT.

If we should just accept it as a 2nd year player making bad choices, then lets start the rebuilding process now.

I am not ready for that. If we have to dumb down the playbook so he has easy reads and just manages the game and we WIN then I am all for it.


expect what type of play from cutler...he is ranked 9th of all starting qbs in passing right now, he still threw for 230+ yards yesterday...in his second year in his tenth game he is doing heads above what plummer did.....where was the great plummer ranked at his benching?...thats right 30th out of 32 starting qbs

and i also see where you all keep mentioning that he has nine straight games with a pick...you fail to also mention his streak of nine straight games with a TD pass came to an end...which is pretty good

your so hypocriticle ...of all the multiple TO games plummer had you defended him...now we have a virtual rookie starting and you wanna look for faults

cutler is doing his job....we expected growing pains out of him...we all knew picks would happen , but there is no denieing his play is nothing other then very good for what he is dealing with a special teams and defensive diasasters

Skinny
10-08-2007, 01:13 PM
If you want to establish the chemistry on defense, WHY are players like Sam Adams, and Simeon Rice getting benched - which both were yesterday? Don't you need to play them consistently so the chemistry can be established? Chemistry will never be established if different players are constantly starting.Good point DN and your right IMO. But Bates is doing what he can do in setting his starting line-up with the personel he has to work with to gameplan/scheme against our opponents.

I remember seeing Adams play yesterday but as indicated by the coaching staff last week, Bates wanted to go with speed and mobility against Indy along the D-line. Reason for de-activating Adams, who is clogger and nothing more.

As for Rice i have no clue why he was out and was suprised to see that. 'Dramatic Irony' is what Andrew Mason called it. :noidea:

'Versatility' is a big plus with Bates and what he likes in his defensive players. But until he's able to get those type of guys all across the board, his hands are tied as far as what he can do to do that on a consistant basis week in and week out.

Lonestar
10-08-2007, 02:01 PM
Good point DN and your right IMO. But Bates is doing what he can do in setting his starting line-up with the personel he has to work with to gameplan/scheme against our opponents.

I remember seeing Adams play yesterday but as indicated by the coaching staff last week, Bates wanted to go with speed and mobility against Indy along the D-line. Reason for de-activating Adams, who is clogger and nothing more.

As for Rice i have no clue why he was out and was suprised to see that. 'Dramatic Irony' is what Andrew Mason called it. :noidea:

'Versatility' is a big plus with Bates and what he likes in his defensive players. But until he's able to get those type of guys all across the board, his hands are tied as far as what he can do to do that on a consistant basis week in and week out.

Rice is out form the RMN today
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/nfl/article/0,2777,DRMN_23918_5717247,00.html

No Rice

Broncos defensive end Simeon Rice was one of the Broncos game-day inactives.

Rice played in only eight games for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers in the 2006 season because of shoulder surgery and the Broncos are saying he's still not fully recovered. But Rice had played in a situational role during the previous four games.

He has six tackles this season to go with one pass batted down. He does not have a sack.

"He's just not 100 percent yet," Broncos coach Mike Shanahan said. "You watch him play, watch him practice and that shoulder is probably about 80 percent, we thought it was in the best interest to go another direction. When he is healed, he brings a lot to the table. When he is healthy, I'm sorry, he bring a lot to the table."
Asked if he was surprised to be out of uniform Rice said, "Of course, my off week is ill."

Rice signed a one-year, $3 million contract with the Broncos just before the regular season began, a deal that also includes bonuses for his sack totals.

Rice would earn $250,000 for 10 or 11 sacks; $500,000 for 12 or 13 sacks; $750,000 for 14 or 15 sacks and $1 million for 16 or more. "

This teams problem IMHO is DT can't clog the middle and hold up blockers, that let the DEs roam for sacks and forcing the RB into the LBs realm.

If you do not do that it frees up OG and OT to go out and hunt down LB and safeties to block.

arapaho2
10-08-2007, 02:05 PM
Remember last year they blamed Larry Coyer and Andre Patterson.

How many people wanted them fired??

I agree though, the chemistry particularly on defense is'nt there.


the big thing i see is there isnt any chemistry or cohesiveness....but we cannot blame the new scheme any longer, and if its a fact that we dont have the personal to run bates scheme then we should be running a scheme based on our personal, and quit blaming or benching players who are not ideal for what bates wants...play to our players strongpoints

arapaho2
10-08-2007, 02:14 PM
Rice is out form the RMN today
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/nfl/article/0,2777,DRMN_23918_5717247,00.html

No Rice

Broncos defensive end Simeon Rice was one of the Broncos game-day inactives.

Rice played in only eight games for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers in the 2006 season because of shoulder surgery and the Broncos are saying he's still not fully recovered. But Rice had played in a situational role during the previous four games.

He has six tackles this season to go with one pass batted down. He does not have a sack.

"He's just not 100 percent yet," Broncos coach Mike Shanahan said. "You watch him play, watch him practice and that shoulder is probably about 80 percent, we thought it was in the best interest to go another direction. When he is healed, he brings a lot to the table. When he is healthy, I'm sorry, he bring a lot to the table."
Asked if he was surprised to be out of uniform Rice said, "Of course, my off week is ill."

Rice signed a one-year, $3 million contract with the Broncos just before the regular season began, a deal that also includes bonuses for his sack totals.

Rice would earn $250,000 for 10 or 11 sacks; $500,000 for 12 or 13 sacks; $750,000 for 14 or 15 sacks and $1 million for 16 or more. "

This teams problem IMHO is DT can't clog the middle and hold up blockers, that let the DEs roam for sacks and forcing the RB into the LBs realm.

If you do not do that it frees up OG and OT to go out and hunt down LB and safeties to block.


in my humblest opinion it isnt that that they cannot hold up blockers...its that they shouldnt be asked to if thats not thier strong point, warren was very good at holding up and clogging the line and we got rid of him...adams and burton are penatraters that is what they do best, and coincedently that is what they are not allowed to do...if we let them push the play into the offenses side of the line then that disrupts the running game in the middle and doesnt allow the OT or OG to reach the lbrs, which also would prevent the qb from stepping away from the pass rush...but for some odd reason we cut the guys who could stack up the line, keep the guys who are penetraters and then ask them to just take up space

play to the players abilities...this scheme isnt not working so instead of looking for players that are not starting caliber to fit bates scheme ..we should trash this system and design a scheme that fits what we have

TXBRONC
10-08-2007, 03:37 PM
If you want to establish the chemistry on defense, WHY are players like Sam Adams, and Simeon Rice getting benched - which both were yesterday? Don't you need to play them consistently so the chemistry can be established? Chemistry will never be established if different players are constantly starting.

They're not playing very well DN that's why you're not seeing them on the field more. Adams is only good for about 20 to 30 snaps a game that why we weren't seeing him that much anyway.

Watchthemiddle
10-08-2007, 03:53 PM
Its time to put the blame on the players. Forget the coaches. The scheme's and playbook is in place. They have had 5 games now and all offseason to learn it and perfect it. Its not happening.

The execution on both sides of the ball is horrid. On defense, players ARE NOT staying in their assigned gaps. They are getting to curious as to where the play is and not doing their assignment. Not too mention not tackling if they are where they are supposed to be. THe DE's are not getting rid of their man and staying outside. Turner killed us yesterday because of that.

There is only SO much a coach can coach and teach. The rest is up to the players to properly execute what they have been taught.

Medford Bronco
10-08-2007, 03:57 PM
Its time to put the blame on the players. Forget the coaches. The scheme's and playbook is in place. They have had 5 games now and all offseason to learn it and perfect it. Its not happening.

The execution on both sides of the ball is horrid. On defense, players ARE NOT staying in their assigned gaps. They are getting to curious as to where the play is and not doing their assignment. Not too mention not tackling if they are where they are supposed to be. THe DE's are not getting rid of their man and staying outside. Turner killed us yesterday because of that.

There is only SO much a coach can coach and teach. The rest is up to the players to properly execute what they have been taught.

I think the GM, coach and players all need part of the blame

the players clearly do not fit this scheme.
Shanny has not done a good job on speacial teams where this game got out of hand yesterday.. as someone else said, like special ed not special teams

GM -- hey draft a LB as they were needed as well witout the heart and soul Al Wilson gone, boy do I miss him :tsk:

Medford Bronco
10-08-2007, 06:04 PM
We're just not a good team. Get your reservations for New York City, because Darren McFadden is going to be renamed Denver McFadden. And I can't wait

aint gonna happen

the Rams, Dolphins, Falcons are all worse than Denver I think

and we need defense, not another running back.

heck shanny made Ruben Drounghs look good.

He has not made the defense look good for a long time.

TXBRONC
10-08-2007, 06:33 PM
aint gonna happen

the Rams, Dolphins, Falcons are all worse than Denver I think

and we need defense, not another running back.

heck shanny made Ruben Drounghs look good.

He has not made the defense look good for a long time.

If we end up 3-13 like Jr suggests we could easily end up with number one overall pick.

Watchthemiddle
10-08-2007, 06:56 PM
If we end up 3-13 like Jr suggests we could easily end up with number one overall pick.

If that were the case, we would trade out of it in a heartbeat IMO and stockpile tons of picks. Thats what we seem to do. I would trade out but not out of the top 10. We need to draft an impact defensive player that can step in immediately and perform.

Medford Bronco
10-08-2007, 06:58 PM
If we end up 3-13 like Jr suggests we could easily end up with number one overall pick.

I still think that the Rams and Dolphins are worse

and Atlanta is not much better.

I say top 10 with a 6-10 type of record.

hate being pessimistic but this team gives me no reason to hope

If we lost say 34-28ish then I would say okay our offense is clicking and we might be okay. but that was as pathetic of a performance at HOME as I have ever seen

TXBRONC
10-08-2007, 07:07 PM
If that were the case, we would trade out of it in a heartbeat IMO and stockpile tons of picks. Thats what we seem to do. I would trade out but not out of the top 10. We need to draft an impact defensive player that can step in immediately and perform.

We have in some draft but not all of them and I don't think even a majority of them. If we ended with number one pick I could Shanahan taking McFadden in heart beat. But given our draft situation it wouldn't surprise if traded down. However, I don't think he would trade out of the first round entirely.

BigBroncLove
10-08-2007, 07:16 PM
We have in some draft but not all of them and I don't think even a majority of them. If we ended with number one pick I could Shanahan taking McFadden in heart beat. But given our draft situation it wouldn't surprise if traded down. However, I don't think he would trade out of the first round entirely.

I think it's actually impossible to trade out of the first round altogether given the draft point value system of the first round, so I agree with you tx. I'll give a link to the chart, but for someone who is outside of the first five picks to trade to the #1 position with picks alone, they'd have to give up almost every pick that year or tons of pick for that year and the next, something I think few teams would ever do IMO.

I doubt the Broncos land the #1 overall. However if by some infantisimal chance it happens the only way the Broncos could trade down out of it is if the trade included a big name player in which value points become a lesser issue since a players worth is often not translatable to the chart, and even when it is, it depends on whos looking at that chart.

If the Broncos had such a high pick and wanted to trade down I would be t on them trying to grab a big name player from another team and trade down then collect picks. My :2cents:

TXBRONC
10-08-2007, 07:26 PM
I think it's actually impossible to trade out of the first round altogether given the draft point value system of the first round, so I agree with you tx. I'll give a link to the chart, but for someone who is outside of the first five picks to trade to the #1 position with picks alone, they'd have to give up almost every pick that year or tons of pick for that year and the next, something I think few teams would ever do IMO.

I doubt the Broncos land the #1 overall. However if by some infinitesimal chance it happens the only way the Broncos could trade down out of it is if the trade included a big name player in which value points become a lesser issue since a players worth is often not translatable to the chart, and even when it is, it depends on whose looking at that chart.

If the Broncos had such a high pick and wanted to trade down I would be t on them trying to grab a big name player from another team and trade down then collect picks. My :2cents:

I don't think we'll be that bad. Right now with way things are going we could end up in the top ten, maybe the top five but more than likely we wont do that badly.

BigBroncLove
10-08-2007, 07:39 PM
I don't think we'll be that bad. Right now with way things are going we could end up in the top ten, maybe the top five but more than likely we wont do that badly.

Agreed 100%

Dean
10-08-2007, 08:59 PM
So this is what we have come to. Going into the sixth week of the season and we are discussing what to do if we get the number one pick. How far we have fallen! From 13 and 3 the year before last, to this and we did it with what most argued at the time to be "lesser" players. :tsk:

Lepsis looks to not be recovered from the knee injury. Hamilton on IR. Nalen hurt and who knows maybe done. Walker showing knee problems. Marshall not fighting for the football in traffic. Our RB likely to be suspended. With undrafted free agents as his back-ups and no real fullback.

It hurts too much to even mention the defense. I'm sorry we don't have a defense. I meant the front seven people who line up when the other team has the ball. :marchmellow:

Bronco Bible
10-09-2007, 08:44 AM
[QUOTE=Dean;29930]So this is what we have come to. Going into the sixth week of the season and we are discussing what to do if we get the number one pick. How far we have fallen! From 13 and 3 the year before last, to this and we did it with what most argued at the time to be "lesser" players. :tsk:

This is the very reason I was frustrated enough to start this thread.

GEM
10-10-2007, 11:34 AM
OMG...I figured it out....FINALLY!!

You wanna know what's wrong with the Broncos this season?


You really wanna know.....


05 & 06, the ONLY jersey I would wear on game day was my orange Bailey. Well, guess what I haven't broke out at all this season......the orange Bailey. I've been wearing the white Cutler and the blue Lynch......

Time to break out the ORANGE BABY!!!

:dance:

Mike
10-10-2007, 11:42 AM
OMG...I figured it out....FINALLY!!

You wanna know what's wrong with the Broncos this season?


You really wanna know.....


05 & 06, the ONLY jersey I would wear on game day was my orange Bailey. Well, guess what I haven't broke out at all this season......the orange Bailey. I've been wearing the white Cutler and the blue Lynch......

Time to break out the ORANGE BABY!!!

:dance:

Shame on you, GEM. You are henceforth an outcast from our society of Orange and Blue. Get thee to the land of Black and Silver. :laugh:

Bronco Bible
10-10-2007, 11:49 AM
GEM is to blame,the culprit ,change that jersey right now by gum!! lets get back to the winning;)

GEM
10-10-2007, 11:53 AM
Shame on you, GEM. You are henceforth an outcast from our society of Orange and Blue. Get thee to the land of Black and Silver. :laugh:

:eek: LDB!!! To the Silver & Black??? Seriously???OMG, just shoot me now! It's over!!

Anyone got a fork? Cause I'm done. :cry:

GEM
10-10-2007, 11:55 AM
GEM is to blame,the culprit ,change that jersey right now by gum!! lets get back to the winning;)

You best believe when I get home this evening I'm putting on the orange Bailey and I'm going to sleep in it until the next game....maybe I'll bring back the orange Bailey magic. :dance:

Medford Bronco
10-10-2007, 12:04 PM
:eek: LDB!!! To the Silver & Black??? Seriously???OMG, just shoot me now! It's over!!

Anyone got a fork? Cause I'm done. :cry:

better the silver and black than the dark blue and silver with a splash of red;)

Mike
10-10-2007, 12:18 PM
:eek: LDB!!! To the Silver & Black??? Seriously???OMG, just shoot me now! It's over!!

Anyone got a fork? Cause I'm done. :cry:

Ok..ok..perhaps I did over-react. Something we all know never happens in Broncoland. :laugh:

Consider yourself chastised. :viking:

GEM
10-10-2007, 02:31 PM
Ok..ok..perhaps I did over-react. Something we all know never happens in Broncoland. :laugh:

Consider yourself chastised. :viking:


PHEW!!!! I was really scared! Silver and Black......ooooweeeee.....Al Davis.....and I thought I still had a few weeks to prepare for Halloween spooks. :laugh:

Bronco Bible
10-10-2007, 05:45 PM
better the silver and black than the dark blue and silver with a splash of red;)

I don't think so, come to think of it,it might be a territorial thing;)