Josh McDaniels - HC and Dom Capers - DC

[vtroper]

Apoligies if this has already been posted in another thread but Mike Lombardi of the National Football Post (and former Bronco employee) mentioned this in his column:

From what I’m hearing, the Broncos loved New England offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels, who seems to be formulating his staff, including Dom Capers as his defensive coordinator. The Broncos will not take much more time and will make a decision in the next week.

Decision in the next week huh? Guess that doesn't give us much of a chance with Spags assuming the Giants win this weekend. So does Bates stay on as OC even if we're going after a big time offensive Head Coach? I hope so.

Not sure what I think about McDaniels. Pats offense was impressive this year without Brady, but then again offense isn't exactally our issue...

[LRtagger]

It was posted in another thread, but for those that missed it, it probably deserves its own thread for discussion.

I think I would find myself very much looking forward to the future under this scenario. My #1 choice is Spags as I think most people's is, but Capers is an excellent DC and McDaniels would ensure our offense would remain potent for years.

HC - McDaniels, DC - Capers, OC - Bates. Pretty good staff if you ask me.

[Slick]

It was posted in another thread, but for those that missed it, it probably deserves its own thread for discussion.

I think I would find myself very much looking forward to the future under this scenario. My #1 choice is Spags as I think most people's is, but Capers is an excellent DC and McDaniels would ensure our offense would remain potent for years.

HC - McDaniels, DC - Capers, OC - Bates. Pretty good staff if you ask me.

It'd be tough to complain about that. I'd be on board.

[CoachChaz]

I dont think you could ask for much more. A proven offensive guy to run the bread and butter of our current roster...a proven DC with experience in teaching youngsters...a current coach that knows our QB and has a good rapport with him and a GM that has shown he can spot talent.

I guess my question is...what does Spag bring to the table that is so much better than this?

[Superchop 7]

This is a brilliant move.

Dom Capers is a "great" 3-4 coach.

If I can't get Jim Johnson, this is a helluva consolation prize.

[Traveler]

If true, Shefter was right again.

[G_Money]

If this happens, it's as good a staff as I could have hoped Cowher could have brought in.

Then I'd just have to see if McDaniel can be the Head Man. Some guys can't, they get all conservative and weird. See Capers, Dom.

But in theory the pieces are brilliant.

~G

[broncofaninfla]

I was hoping for Spags but I like this scenario as well.

[CoachChaz]

I'm curious what everyone thinks Spag would bring that would be better than a McDaniels-Caper duo.

[Traveler]

As long as whomever gets the job teaches our defense how to properly tackle, count me a supporter.

[vtroper]

My concern is that I've seen over and over again that Bates would be retained if Denver hired a defensive based HC. I think assuming that he'd be back if McDaniels or any other offensive guy is brought in is not necessarily a done deal.

I think losing Cutler's guy Bates in all this would make this less then an ideal situation.

[Traveler]

Then Cutler needs to grow up, ya think?

[CoachChaz]

My concern is that I've seen over and over again that Bates would be retained if Denver hired a defensive based HC. I think assuming that he'd be back if McDaniels or any other offensive guy is brought in is not necessarily a done deal.

I think losing Cutler's guy Bates in all this would make this less then an ideal situation.

Cutler is under contract for a few more years. So, he has 2 choices. he can grow up and adapt to the FACT that coaches and systems change...or he can play like a stud and make his FA value alot more before he hunts down Bates and tries to work with him again.

[Ziggy]

Capers is one of my all time favorite DC's. I'd love this move if it were to happen.

[Slick]

Cutler is under contract for a few more years. So, he has 2 choices. he can grow up and adapt to the FACT that coaches and systems change...or he can play like a stud and make his FA value alot more before he hunts down Bates and tries to work with him again.

Exactly, and I would think he would be of the mindset that if Cassell can do so well with this guy, then I should be even better in his offense. If I were him, I'd love this hire. He'd get a great offensive mind, a very respectable defensive coordinator. What more could he ask for?

[claymore]

If true, I will do cheetah Flips.

[BroncoWave]

I could settle for that.

[LRtagger]

I'm curious what everyone thinks Spag would bring that would be better than a McDaniels-Caper duo.

I think everyone was dead-set on getting in a defensive minded guy...not to mention guys who have come out of the Bellicheat camp have not fared too well...and today was the first anyone had heard the name Capers.

Before it was kinda Spags vs. McD in which case most people would go with Spags. I think to fairly evaulate McD/Capers vs. Spags you would need to know what Spags plans on doing with his staff. Once we hear who Spags would like to bring in as DC and if Bates will stick around or who the new OC would be then it would be easier to evaulate.


I think people's biggest worry with the team is defense and to bring in a defense-first kinda guy would sit better in the minds of fans...to know that Bowlen is putting the most emphasis on fixing the D. But with either staff I think we will be better off than we would have been in 2009 under Shanny/Slowik.

[BroncoWave]

I was just reading a Pats forum and they all seem pretty upset over the chance of losing McDaniels so maybe he won't be too bad. I'd still rather have Spags but we could do alot worse that McDaniels/Capers.

[claymore]

I think everyone was dead-set on getting in a defensive minded guy...not to mention guys who have come out of the Bellicheat camp have not fared too well...and today was the first anyone had heard the name Capers.

Before it was kinda Spags vs. McD in which case most people would go with Spags. I think to fairly evaulate McD/Capers vs. Spags you would need to know what Spags plans on doing with his staff. Once we hear who Spags would like to bring in as DC and if Bates will stick around or who the new OC would be then it would be easier to evaulate.


I think people's biggest worry with the team is defense and to bring in a defense-first kinda guy would sit better in the minds of fans...to know that Bowlen is putting the most emphasis on fixing the D. But with either staff I think we will be better off than we would have been in 2009 under Shanny/Slowik.

Bowlen would have to have complete faith in Bates to Bring in Spags and DC. Spags and a Capers might not mesh as well as a McDaniels and Capers.

This makes allot more sense to me. Bates can continue to be evaluated, and tutored etc... and we get a Kick ass DC.

[Slick]

I wonder if Pat will allow the new staff to do a little more gambling in free agency. I know we've not had much luck in the past, but that doesn't mean we have to stop all together. IMO a successful team can be built both with the draft and free agency.

[LRtagger]

Schefter reported on NFL Network that Morris and McDaniels are at the top of the list. He sais Morris had a great interview on Monday.

[CoachChaz]

I think everyone was dead-set on getting in a defensive minded guy...not to mention guys who have come out of the Bellicheat camp have not fared too well...and today was the first anyone had heard the name Capers.

Before it was kinda Spags vs. McD in which case most people would go with Spags. I think to fairly evaulate McD/Capers vs. Spags you would need to know what Spags plans on doing with his staff. Once we hear who Spags would like to bring in as DC and if Bates will stick around or who the new OC would be then it would be easier to evaulate.


I think people's biggest worry with the team is defense and to bring in a defense-first kinda guy would sit better in the minds of fans...to know that Bowlen is putting the most emphasis on fixing the D. But with either staff I think we will be better off than we would have been in 2009 under Shanny/Slowik.

I guess my thinking is Capers has a much more diverse history and more accounts of success than Spag does. If I had to choose between the two, I can completely say I'd put Spag ahead of Capers...especially if only as a DC. Add McDaniels to the mix as the hot, young rising coaching prodigy and it's a pretty nice match.

[bcbronc]

I think everyone was dead-set on getting in a defensive minded guy...not to mention guys who have come out of the Bellicheat camp have not fared too well...and today was the first anyone had heard the name Capers.

Before it was kinda Spags vs. McD in which case most people would go with Spags. I think to fairly evaulate McD/Capers vs. Spags you would need to know what Spags plans on doing with his staff. Once we hear who Spags would like to bring in as DC and if Bates will stick around or who the new OC would be then it would be easier to evaulate.


I think people's biggest worry with the team is defense and to bring in a defense-first kinda guy would sit better in the minds of fans...to know that Bowlen is putting the most emphasis on fixing the D. But with either staff I think we will be better off than we would have been in 2009 under Shanny/Slowik.


just speculation, but I'd think Spags would bring in a position coach from either NYG or Philly to be his DC. someone he has worked with in the past who would run a system inspired by Spags. no idea who though.

McDaniels/Capers feels right. I don't think Bowlen has any interest in a defense first team which means a OC is more likely. and Capers has some HC experience, so McD will have someone to lean on. I guess the biggest question on Capers is if he'd want to switch to a 3-4. if so, we're likely looking at at least a couple of years to re-stock the front 7 (I don't see many of our players fitting that scheme). but if we're going to do it, a year when we have as many picks as this year is the right year to start it.

we'd need a true powerhouse NT, at least one 3-4 end, and 2 OLBs. maybe DJ and WW could play inside (WW = Donnie Edwards possibly). still a lot of important pieces would be needed (and that isn't even touching CB or S), which means we'd probably see another couple years of craptastic defense.

[LRtagger]

I guess my thinking is Capers has a much more diverse history and more accounts of success than Spag does. If I had to choose between the two, I can completely say I'd put Spag ahead of Capers...especially if only as a DC. Add McDaniels to the mix as the hot, young rising coaching prodigy and it's a pretty nice match.

I agree I like the McDaniels/Capers idea...just giving some insight on why I think people were/are deadset on Spags.

[CoachChaz]

I agree I like the McDaniels/Capers idea...just giving some insight on why I think people were/are deadset on Spags.

Yeah...I just elaborated on it with a personal touch.

[NameUsedBefore]

Morris must've blown Pat's freakin' socks off because he seemed more like a formality until that interview rolled around.

[Lonestar]

I wonder if Pat will allow the new staff to do a little more gambling in free agency. I know we've not had much luck in the past, but that doesn't mean we have to stop all together. IMO a successful team can be built both with the draft and free agency.

it is not the gambling so much as the PRICE of them..

Pat said last year he wanted to build this team with Young players from the draft.. the cost is so much less and if done correctly players can be drafted for the further not having to start the next season..

Since the Superbowl years with all the bad choices we made from 1999 or so through 2006 we got WAY behind on getting good talent..

[Superchop 7]

Absolutely, correct, it will take time on defense.

(Spags, Jim Johnson, Rivera, Frazier would have been quicker)

But, I have no doubt we can have a nice 3-4 in a couple of drafts.

As for McDaniels, he can improve Jay, at the end of the day Jay will be a better QB. (So, suck it up Jay, work hard, and while I'm at it.......get a haircut)

[CoachChaz]

it is not the gambling so much as the PRICE of them..

Pat said last year he wanted to build this team with Young players from the draft.. the cost is so much less and if done correctly players can be drafted for the further not having to start the next season..

Since the Superbowl years with all the bad choices we made from 1999 or so through 2006 we got WAY behind on getting good talent..

But some positions demand veteran talent. I think the key to the whole thing is getting QUALITY FA's. No more retreads and stopgaps. If you can't sign Haynesworth or Suggs or Dansby...don't settle for Babineaux, Carter or McGinest

[JONtheBRONCO]

Capers = 3-4?

Boss Bailey, Rey Maualuga. DJ Williams, Wesley Woodyard?

[PatricktheDookie]

For the record, Capers' defense was pretty bad when he was here in Houston.

I'm definitely not excited.

[vtroper]

Not to mention our history with bringing in former Dolphins DC's isn't so good.

[BroncoWave]

For the record, Capers' defense was pretty bad when he was here in Houston.

I'm definitely not excited.

He was running a freaking expansion team. You can be the best coach in the world but you still have to have talent. You have to look at his whole resume instead of one job on a team with no talent. And he was the HC of that team, not the DC. Those 2 jobs come with totally different responsibilites. If you want a more accurate record of his talent as a DC, look at just that: his jobs as a DC. How he did as a HC has nothing to do with that.

[Slick]

it is not the gambling so much as the PRICE of them..

Pat said last year he wanted to build this team with Young players from the draft.. the cost is so much less and if done correctly players can be drafted for the further not having to start the next season..

Since the Superbowl years with all the bad choices we made from 1999 or so through 2006 we got WAY behind on getting good talent..

I see your point, and I agree to some degree, but just because we over paid for some guys and got burnt, doesn't mean finding a guy is impossible. If we want top talent, we'll have to pay for it. When you try to be cheap, you wind up with guys like Boss, Niko, Manuel, Mcree etc. I'd rather us spend for a proven guy, than underspend and hope it works out. I didn't mean to take this off topic, I was just thinking aloud.

[PatricktheDookie]

He was running a freaking expansion team. You can be the best coach in the world but you still have to have talent. You have to look at his whole resume instead of one job on a team with no talent. And he was the HC of that team, not the DC. Those 2 jobs come with totally different responsibilites. If you want a more accurate record of his talent as a DC, look at just that: his jobs as a DC. How he did as a HC has nothing to do with that.

He was still in charge of the defense when he was here. He invested his draft picks into defensive players, yet the defense did not improve. The defense didn't become decent until Kubiak showed up, even.

You put up with 5 years of Capers running a team into the ground, and you'd be skeptical of having him involved with your favorite team, in any capacity.

=(

[MOtorboat]

He was still in charge of the defense when he was here. He invested his draft picks into defensive players, yet the defense did not improve. The defense didn't become decent until Kubiak showed up, even.

You put up with 5 years of Capers running a team into the ground, and you'd be skeptical of having him involved with your favorite team, in any capacity.

=(

The only difference would be he would be the DC here, and not the head coach. There are lots of guys who can come in and change a defense, and make it good (or offense), but when they take over the head coaching job it goes to crap.

As a DC, I say sure, but if he was a HC candidate, I'd say hell no.

[Slick]

I moved to Charlotte right after Carolina got their team. Capers showed the ability to build a defense, and he did it from scratch. Anyone who doubts he can coach a defense, or find defensive talent, is missing a screw or two.

[nevcraw]

I was just reading a Pats forum and they all seem pretty upset over the chance of losing McDaniels so maybe he won't be too bad. I'd still rather have Spags but we could do alot worse that McDaniels/Capers.

what do people in forums know, anyway?

[BroncoWave]

The only difference would be he would be the DC here, and not the head coach. There are lots of guys who can come in and change a defense, and make it good (or offense), but when they take over the head coaching job it goes to crap.

As a DC, I say sure, but if he was a HC candidate, I'd say hell no.

Exactly. There is a laundry list of great coordinators who stunk as head coaches. I'm not going to blast Capers over what he did with an expansion team as a head coach. Besides, if you really want to go that route, look at what he did with the Panthers as an expansion team. He led them to the NFC championship in his second year. The man can coach football, and IMO would make a fine DC here.

[Tned]

My concern is that I've seen over and over again that Bates would be retained if Denver hired a defensive based HC. I think assuming that he'd be back if McDaniels or any other offensive guy is brought in is not necessarily a done deal.

I think losing Cutler's guy Bates in all this would make this less then an ideal situation.

If McDaniels is head coach material, he will be able to heal any wounds left by Bates' departure.

[Broncos Mtnman]

Then Cutler needs to grow up, ya think?

It's not a matter of "growing up."

How many good QBs have struggled in their careers because of changes to the offensive coaching staff? New plays, new schemes, new terminologies. It can ruin a good thing in a heartbeat.

How many marginal Cutler supporters will ask for his head if he struggles a little bit under these conditions?

The Cutler/Bates situation isn't broke, so why fix it?

[Slick]

Exactly. There is a laundry list of great coordinators who stunk as head coaches. I'm not going to blast Capers over what he did with an expansion team as a head coach. Besides, if you really want to go that route, look at what he did with the Panthers as an expansion team. He led them to the NFC championship in his second year. The man can coach football, and IMO would make a fine DC here.

He put that defense together quickly too. It's 12 years later, but I think he could still do it.

[Medford Bronco]

The only difference would be he would be the DC here, and not the head coach. There are lots of guys who can come in and change a defense, and make it good (or offense), but when they take over the head coaching job it goes to crap.

As a DC, I say sure, but if he was a HC candidate, I'd say hell no.

We cant discount his time in Pitt as well. He was a good D coordinator there too in the 90s

[Broncos Mtnman]

If McDaniels is head coach material, he will be able to heal any wounds left by Bates' departure.

And what if he can't? Are we willing to risk that when it isn't necessary?

I say the Bates situation is big.

[Tned]

It's not a matter of "growing up."

How many good QBs have struggled in their careers because of changes to the offensive coaching staff? New plays, new schemes, new terminologies. It can ruin a good thing in a heartbeat.

How many marginal Cutler supporters will ask for his head if he struggles a little bit under these conditions?

The Cutler/Bates situation isn't broke, so why fix it?

Because you can't expect a head coach to come and not be allowed to choose his staff/coordinators. It's part of the deal with firing your coach. How can you hold the new head coach responsible, if you force coaches on him?

[underrated29]

all these foods.

Mcdonalds, capers-- No free lunch with us anymore.



seriously, though i agree with most ofwhat you say tned.

except my preaching to the choir about turner. We must keep TURNER!

I kinda think they will.

[Medford Bronco]

Because you can't expect a head coach to come and not be allowed to choose his staff/coordinators. It's part of the deal with firing your coach. How can you hold the new head coach responsible, if you force coaches on him?

I agree and I am not as enamored with Bates as some are.

If Cutler is as good as we hope/Think he is then he should
be able to adjust to what McDaniels and his new OC are going to do.

and one big thing would be to preach not turning the ball over so much. yes the D sucked but we hope that gets fixed.

Jay can do it. I just hope he starts next season.

[Broncos Mtnman]

Because you can't expect a head coach to come and not be allowed to choose his staff/coordinators. It's part of the deal with firing your coach. How can you hold the new head coach responsible, if you force coaches on him?

Worked pretty well for Harbaugh in Baltimore to keep Rex Ryan as the leader of a "not broken" defense.

I have NO problem with coaching changes. I have big problems with unecessary changes.

Just like the Ravens defense was for Harbaugh, our offense isn't broken, so why look to fix it?

[Broncos Mtnman]

I agree and I am not as enamored with Bates as some are.

If Cutler is as good as we hope/Think he is then he should
be able to adjust to what McDaniels and his new OC are going to do.

and one big thing would be to preach not turning the ball over so much. yes the D sucked but we hope that gets fixed.

Jay can do it. I just hope he starts next season.

Get a defense and a running back.

[Slick]

Why couldn't McDaniels and Bates work together Mtn? I think that's what most of us are hoping for.

[Medford Bronco]

Get a defense and a running back.

I think we will get a RB.

Hillis was not too shabby when he played either. He must be healthy this year.

The defense willl ge better by default one would think?

Still Jay can do better I believe and hope that he does.
Next season I would expect him to win the game vs Buffalo regardles of the predicment the D put us in. I would see him getting a TD on the 2nd to last drive and not force a ball that he should not make.

Just saying that the whole team needs improvement. The Defense the most but the offense needs to score more on its opportunities. All the yardage in the world does not mean anything if pts are not scored.

I am hopeful that we will get there :salute:

[Medford Bronco]

Why couldn't McDaniels and Bates work together Mtn? I think that's what most of us are hoping for.

It is what McDaniels would want. He would be the coach.

Maybe he would keep him but he might not.

It would be like you getting a new company but this company comes
with some employees, you might want them or you have all the right in the world to bring your own crew in

[broncohead]

If McDaniels comes in then that would be a tough situation. Bates deserves to stay as the OC. And it wouldn't be the HC decition to bring in a replacement OC it's Pat's he's the owner and he runs the show if you couldn't tell from the last couple weeks. If Pat says you can be head coach but Bates stays as OC take it or leave it he'll have to make a choice.

[topscribe]

It's not a matter of "growing up."

How many good QBs have struggled in their careers because of changes to the offensive coaching staff? New plays, new schemes, new terminologies. It can ruin a good thing in a heartbeat.

How many marginal Cutler supporters will ask for his head if he struggles a little bit under these conditions?

The Cutler/Bates situation isn't broke, so why fix it?

Well, the difference is that Cutler isn't just a good QB. He's an immensely
talented QB, a phenom. I believe he will excel, no matter what the scheme is.
What will take down a QB such as he is a pathetic supporting cast around him,
such as those that effectively ruined the likes of Archie Manning and Steve
Bartkowski. But Cutler doesn't have to worry about that. He has one of the
best receiving corps in the league, and the best O-line, IMO.

Moreover, he has displayed a Peyton-esque work ethic, so if the schemes,
terminologies, and plays are changed, he will know then by the OTAs. I'm
assured of that.

But I'm still with Cutler on Bates because he has grown extremely close to
him. I hope he can keep him. But he'll excel even if he doesn't.

-----

[spikerman]

So let me get this straight. If McDaniels is the guy, Bowlen fired a guy who is considered to be one of the best offensive minds in football history - A guy whose offense was #2 in the league last year - A guy who has a proven record over the years all in favor of a young, "up and coming" offensive coach? :confused:

This team needs a coach who will emphasize defense and instill some toughness into it. If McDaniels is that guy, so be it. I'm a little concerned that this could lead to a few more years of finesse Broncos' football.

[MOtorboat]

So let me get this straight. If McDaniels is the guy, Bowlen fired a guy who is considered to be one of the best offensive minds in football history - A guy whose offense was #2 in the league last year - A guy who has a proven record over the years all in favor of a young, "up and coming" offensive coach? :confused:

This team needs a coach who will emphasize defense and instill some toughness into it. If McDaniels is that guy, so be it. I'm a little concerned that this could lead to a few more years of finesse Broncos' football.

No.

Bowlen fired a GM, who wouldn't hire a competent defensive coordinator, and just happened to be the head coach.

[spikerman]

No.

Bowlen fired a GM, who wouldn't hire a competent defensive coordinator, and just happened to be the head coach.
He lost both.

[MOtorboat]

He lost both.

Yes, he did. But that's what happens when you give too many duties to one guy.

[MOtorboat]

One thing I think many of us are missing, and I was too, until I started thinking about this today, is that it doesn't matter what side of the ball a coaching assistant that is hired for a head coaching job worked on when he was an assistant. Head Coaching in the NFL, and probably even more in college, is about management. The coordinators are responsible for the "coaching." If Bowlen feels that McDaniels is the best manager, and that he would bring in Capers and keep Bates (or whatever direction Bowlen/new coach wants to head), then that's the way he should go.

Look at Baltimore. Do you know why they hired Brian Billick? Because he was the offensive "genius" behind the Duante Culpeper/Randy Moss/Cris Carter year in 1999. What did the Ravens become known for? Defense. Billick was a great manager who hired great coordinators to "coach."

[spikerman]

Yes, he did. But that's what happens when you give too many duties to one guy.If Bowlen didn't like the job he was doing as the head of football ops, he should have removed that title and put somebody else in there. I've been very critical of the personnel decisions too, but you don't trade in an offensive mastermind for a guy whose specialty is also offense.

If Shanahan didn't like having some of his power reigned in he had two choices, accept it or resign (which would have saved $20 million).

[MOtorboat]

If Bowlen didn't like the job he was doing as the head of football ops, he should have removed that title and put somebody else in there. I've been very critical of the personnel decisions too, but you don't trade in an offensive mastermind for a guy whose specialty is also offense.

If Shanahan didn't like having some of his power reigned in he had two choices, accept it or resign (which would have saved $20 million).

It wasn't that simple. It really wasn't that simple. And it proves that it wasn't about money. It was that this had run its course. This venture with one of the great offensive minds in football had run its course. Maybe Bowlen gave him too much autonomy to run the football operations, maybe Shanahan made bad decisions. But, whatever it was, this had run its course. Regardless of whether Shanahan was an offensive genius or not. Shanahan was NOT going to be just the head coach here, and work under a GM. That wasn't happening, and Bowlen didn't care about the money.

[spikerman]

It wasn't that simple. It really wasn't that simple. And it proves that it wasn't about money. It was that this had run its course. This venture with one of the great offensive minds in football had run its course. Maybe Bowlen gave him too much autonomy to run the football operations, maybe Shanahan made bad decisions. But, whatever it was, this had run its course. Regardless of whether Shanahan was an offensive genius or not. Shanahan was NOT going to be just the head coach here, and work under a GM. That wasn't happening, and Bowlen didn't care about the money.
But it was still working from an offensive perspective. Yes, changes had to be made and Bowlen could have forced Shanahan to make them or Shanahan could have resigned. If he didn't want to "just be the head coach" he would have walked away. I'm just saying that if the team has a defined weakness (like this one does) then bring in the guy that's going to fix it - not a replica from the guy you just fired without the resume.

[MOtorboat]

But it was still working from an offensive perspective. Yes, changes had to be made and Bowlen could have forced Shanahan to make them or Shanahan could have resigned. If he didn't want to "just be the head coach" he would have walked away. I'm just saying that if the team has a defined weakness (like this one does) then bring in the guy that's going to fix it - not a replica from the guy you just fired without the resume.

But if you bring a solid defensive coordinator, it doesn't matter.

The emphasis a coach has really isn't that important. It isn't. Shanahan almost relied too much on that emphasis in his career, after Bowlen gave him total autonomy.

[Slick]

Shanahan's message wasn't being heard by the players. It's not that he lost his offensive mind, I think he lost the team to some extent. When that happens, there's only one way to go.

[spikerman]

Shanahan's message wasn't being heard by the players. It's not that he lost his offensive mind, I think he lost the team to some extent. When that happens, there's only one way to go.
I believe his message was still being heard by the offense. I don't agree with the firing, but what's done is done. I'm more discouraged by the fact that to me the only thing that justified the firing was a change in direction. If McDaniels is the choice, the team gave up a proven coach for a less proven guy whose specialty is the same. I don't see the point.

[MOtorboat]

I believe his message was still being heard by the offense. I don't agree with the firing, but what's done is done. I'm more discouraged by the fact that to me the only thing that justified the firing was a change in direction. If McDaniels is the choice, the team gave up a proven coach for a less proven guy whose specialty is the same. I don't see the point.

The head coach's job isn't the offensive coordinator's job. So, if Josh McDaniel is the coach, he should manage the coordinators. And bringing in Dom Capers, which is what is suspected, is one good move, imo.

People get too mixed up in the "specialty" of the head coach. I think it's because Shanahan was considered such a "genius."

[pnbronco]

Shanahan's message wasn't being heard by the players. It's not that he lost his offensive mind, I think he lost the team to some extent. When that happens, there's only one way to go.

The more I have read since the fact the more I believe this is what happened. I read somewhere that past player had stated that they could repeat work for word his speeches. The term I have heard over and over is he got "stale" here.

[Slick]

The more I have read since the fact the more I believe this is what happened. I read somewhere that past player had stated that they could repeat work for word his speeches. The term I have heard over and over is he got "stale" here.

I agree, and I see Spikerman's point here. I do. It makes sense, but it's out of our control. We must move on. I'm just glad the parting went well, with no hard feelings it seems. It was a respectful departure.

[spikerman]

The head coach's job isn't the offensive coordinator's job. So, if Josh McDaniel is the coach, he should manage the coordinators. And bringing in Dom Capers, which is what is suspected, is one good move, imo.

People get too mixed up in the "specialty" of the head coach. I think it's because Shanahan was considered such a "genius."True, the HC is should manage the coordinators, but is there any doubt that Denver has been running Shanahan's offense? The coach will make his mark on the team in his area of specialty. I think it would be naive to think that McDaniels would come in and leave the coordinators to design the offense. There are parts of the offense that need tweaking - the redzone for instance, but since Denver made the change they should really address their weakest areas with their coaching decision.
I don't think Capers would be a good fit because he's a 3-4 coach and Denver would basically have to blow up the entire defense (on second thought, maybe it IS a good idea).

Of course, all of this is just my opinion and I could be wrong. :cool:

[MOtorboat]

True, the HC is should manage the coordinators, but is there any doubt that Denver has been running Shanahan's offense? The coach will make his mark on the team in his area of specialty. I think it would be naive to think that McDaniels would come in and leave the coordinators to design the offense. There are parts of the offense that need tweaking - the redzone for instance, but since Denver made the change they should really address their weakest areas with their coaching decision.
I don't think Capers would be a good fit because he's a 3-4 coach and Denver would basically have to blow up the entire defense (on second thought, maybe it IS a good idea).

Of course, all of this is just my opinion and I could be wrong. :cool:

Blowing up the defense. Good. Pieces for a 3-4. Sure. Dumervil and Moss could be 3-4 defensive ends. We might have to find a guy in the middle, but I think Crowder could hold his own in the 3-4. Williams can play in anything.Bly and Champ would probably be better with a pressure 3-4.

[Lancane]

Apoligies if this has already been posted in another thread but Mike Lombardi of the National Football Post (and former Bronco employee) mentioned this in his column:

From what I’m hearing, the Broncos loved New England offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels, who seems to be formulating his staff, including Dom Capers as his defensive coordinator. The Broncos will not take much more time and will make a decision in the next week.

Decision in the next week huh? Guess that doesn't give us much of a chance with Spags assuming the Giants win this weekend. So does Bates stay on as OC even if we're going after a big time offensive Head Coach? I hope so.

Not sure what I think about McDaniels. Pats offense was impressive this year without Brady, but then again offense isn't exactally our issue...

Though there are some other candidates that I like more, but have not received interviews...McDaniels is my favorite thus far. I hope he gets the position, unless Heimerdinger or Blache are interviewed and either of the two would get my endorsement over him. But I think McDaniels will do fine in Denver, he will be no Shanahan, but I think he would have an impressive career here.

[topscribe]

Though there are some other candidates that I like more, but have not received interviews...McDaniels is my favorite thus far. I hope he gets the position, unless Heimerdinger or Blache are interviewed and either of the two would get my endorsement over him. But I think McDaniels will do fine in Denver, he will be no Shanahan, but I think he would have an impressive career here.

Hey Cane!! Supp?? :wave:

It's been a while! Going to hang around?

-----

[Tned]

Though there are some other candidates that I like more, but have not received interviews...McDaniels is my favorite thus far. I hope he gets the position, unless Heimerdinger or Blache are interviewed and either of the two would get my endorsement over him. But I think McDaniels will do fine in Denver, he will be no Shanahan, but I think he would have an impressive career here.

Good to see you around.

Interesting side note to this thread. Rotoworld is reporting that the "National Football Post" (I have no idea who or what that is) states that GARRETT wants Capers if he gets the Broncos HC job.

Someone has gotten the story wrong, as I doubt both candidates have said they want Capers as DC.

[MOtorboat]

Good to see you around.

Interesting side note to this thread. Rotoworld is reporting that the "National Football Post" (I have no idea who or what that is) states that GARRETT wants Capers if he gets the Broncos HC job.

Someone has gotten the story wrong, as I doubt both candidates have said they want Capers as DC.

I noticed that earlier. National Football Post is also the same people reporting that McDaniels is the frontrunner and Capers is coming with him too...

[Lancane]

Hey Cane!! Supp?? :wave:

It's been a while! Going to hang around?

-----

Yes...I am back for good! Good to see ya Top! ;)

[TXBRONC]

That certainly has the potential to be a very good combination.

[Lancane]

Good to see you around.

Interesting side note to this thread. Rotoworld is reporting that the "National Football Post" (I have no idea who or what that is) states that GARRETT wants Capers if he gets the Broncos HC job.

Someone has gotten the story wrong, as I doubt both candidates have said they want Capers as DC.

Hey Tned, good to see you man...

I have also heard from three sources that both candidates have mentioned Capers as a possibility, though one source has mentioned that Crennel may come with McDaniels to Denver. At this point it is all speculation... I just do not want Morris, Dennison or even Bowles as the HC of this team, too untested and they really have not proven enough for the job. You know?

[Tned]

Hey Tned, good to see you man...

I have also heard from three sources that both candidates have mentioned Capers as a possibility, though one source has mentioned that Crennel may come with McDaniels to Denver. At this point it is all speculation... I just do not want Morris, Dennison or even Bowles as the HC of this team, too untested and they really have not proven enough for the job. You know?

Yea, Morris wouldn't be my favorite. I don't like the idea of getting someone who hasn't even been a coordinator.

At this point, Spanuolio (however it's spelled) and McDaniels would be my favorites. I think Garrett is too much of an unkown, and this years Cowboys have added a little tarnish to the luster of last year.

[Lancane]

Yea, Morris wouldn't be my favorite. I don't like the idea of getting someone who hasn't even been a coordinator.

At this point, Spanuolio (however it's spelled) and McDaniels would be my favorites. I think Garrett is too much of an unkown, and this years Cowboys have added a little tarnish to the luster of last year.

I can understand that...I believe that Denver is testing many ideas, one of them being the possibility to find an Assistant Head Coach / Defensive Coordinator from some of the candidates...I know it sounds far fetched, but it has been done before! Not in the pros' maybe, but it has been common at the Collegiate level. I am of the opinion that McDaniels has received an offer from Bowlen, but he will not announce it till he finds a Defensive Coordinator because they want to create a diverse staff of their choice. Again this is just my opinion, but I believe that Spagnuolo is out of the race, and Morris was offered a Assistant Head Coach / Defensive Coordinator position, but he turned it down with the other teams looking at him, enter Bowles!!!

And I could be off my rocker as well...lmfao. I never said I was the sane-type...lol. But I find it funny that Bowlen is interviewing so many untested candidates compared to the likes of Heimerdinger, Morninwheg, Blache and several others...

[Requiem / The Dagda]

The more I hear about McDaniels, I'm sort of warming up to him. As long as he brings in Capers or someone capable of fixing this defense. I guess it wouldn't be a bad thing. McDaniels is a guy who Cutler would love to have around and could help our offense (hopefully Bates would still stay) and Capers has a track record of being able to run a defense. Best of both worlds I suppose. I'm just glad we're getting a lot of options in here. Speaks loads about the effort and commitment Bowlen has to winning, and that it truly is a franchise people want to be a part of.

Oh, and welcome Lancane. Sorry about your buddy Mendenhall.

[Lancane]

The more I hear about McDaniels, I'm sort of warming up to him. As long as he brings in Capers or someone capable of fixing this defense. I guess it wouldn't be a bad thing. McDaniels is a guy who Cutler would love to have around and could help our offense (hopefully Bates would still stay) and Capers has a track record of being able to run a defense. Best of both worlds I suppose. I'm just glad we're getting a lot of options in here. Speaks loads about the effort and commitment Bowlen has to winning, and that it truly is a franchise people want to be a part of.

Oh, and welcome Lancane. Sorry about your buddy Mendenhall.

That is life, but I think he will have a good career...it was a bad year for running back injuries....obviously! Maybe that meant he should have been on the roster, bad kharma and all...lol.

;)

[tomjonesrocks]

Hmmm....Albert Breer (whoever that is) of the Sporting News is also predicting McDaniels--but he has him bringing in Romeo Crennel for DC...perhaps on pure speculation...

Filling the NFL head coach openings
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=fillingthenflheadcoachop&prov=tsn&type=lgns

DENVER BRONCOS

The Cast: Rick Dennison, Frazier, Jason Garrett, McDaniels, Morris, Spagnuolo

The Plot: This job is the brass ring of this winter’s market. Strong ownership. Local support. A franchise quarterback, cornerstone left tackle, and two playmaking receivers, all 25 or younger. A rabid fan base. One thing that might be worth noting here, while Pat Bowlen conducts a rather exhaustive search, is that the owner isn’t likely looking for a mercenary. As his history with Dan Reeves (12 years in Denver) and Mike Shanahan (14 years) would indicate, he’ll probably look for someone who wants to stay a while.

The Final Act: I’ll say it here, and be very clear: McDaniels and the Broncos are a match made in heaven. He could bring Romeo Crennel in to run the defense, which needs a major rebuilding job, and maximize the considerable potential of Cutler and the offense. At 32, he’s the type of guy Bowlen would love to put in place and allow to run the show. McDaniels has been patient as his name has come up over the last few years, waiting for the right shot. This would be it.

[MOtorboat]

Interesting, because Crennel is also a 3-4 guy...as is Capers. It seems that McDaniels will insist that we go to the 3-4 if he's hired.

[TXBRONC]

Apoligies if this has already been posted in another thread but Mike Lombardi of the National Football Post (and former Bronco employee) mentioned this in his column:

From what I’m hearing, the Broncos loved New England offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels, who seems to be formulating his staff, including Dom Capers as his defensive coordinator. The Broncos will not take much more time and will make a decision in the next week.

Decision in the next week huh? Guess that doesn't give us much of a chance with Spags assuming the Giants win this weekend. So does Bates stay on as OC even if we're going after a big time offensive Head Coach? I hope so.

Not sure what I think about McDaniels. Pats offense was impressive this year without Brady, but then again offense isn't exactally our issue...

This is interesting because I just heard Mortensen on ESPN radio say that Bowlen is in no rush to find a new head coach and that it could take several more weeks. But of coarse he then added unless the right person just happens to fall into his lap sooner.

[Lancane]

This is interesting because I just heard Mortensen on ESPN radio say that Bowlen is in no rush to find a new head coach and that it could take several more weeks. But of coarse he then added unless the right person just happens to fall into his lap sooner.

Mortensen two days ago said that he believed Denver had found their guy...so personally he is the last man anyone should listen to. Hell, he is on the hot seat with ESPN right now and they may fire him...why? For going ahead with a report in which he did not verify with sources before running with it!

[Ziggy]

Interesting, because Crennel is also a 3-4 guy...as is Capers. It seems that McDaniels will insist that we go to the 3-4 if he's hired.

I don't care if we go to a 3-4, 4-3, or 10-1, as long as we build a decent D.

[MOtorboat]

I don't care if we go to a 3-4, 4-3, or 10-1, as long as we build a decent D.

2-8-1.

Perfect defense with the right speed.

:coffee:

[Tned]

This is interesting because I just heard Mortensen on ESPN radio say that Bowlen is in no rush to find a new head coach and that it could take several more weeks. But of coarse he then added unless the right person just happens to fall into his lap sooner.

Could mean a number of things.

Could be that Bowlen, who fired only 3 coaches in 26 years, wants to take the time and try and find someone he thinks will be a long term solution.

Could be that he has decided on Spaguoloniooo, who can't be announced until after the Giants are out of the playoffs, which 'could be several more weeks'.

[Rick]

I still want Spags better but Capers would be a good defensive cord. And I personally like the 3-4 and would like us to go to it.

I just still though don't understand firing a offensive guru just to hire a offensive guru.

I know the part of limiting the coaches power but still, offensive for offensive?

It could still work out though because atleast Capers(assuming he does come in) is a hell of an upgrade over Slowik.

[Lonestar]

I see your point, and I agree to some degree, but just because we over paid for some guys and got burnt, doesn't mean finding a guy is impossible. If we want top talent, we'll have to pay for it. When you try to be cheap, you wind up with guys like Boss, Niko, Manuel, Mcree etc. I'd rather us spend for a proven guy, than underspend and hope it works out. I didn't mean to take this off topic, I was just thinking aloud.

I agree you have to spend big bucks for the top talent.. You get what you pay for (most of the time although mikey rarley did..)


But Pat said he wanted to build the team from the draft and UDFA that do not cost much.. therefore high priced talent is not going to happen unless he reverses himself..

[MOtorboat]

I agree you have to spend big bucks for the top talent.. You get what you pay for (most of the time although mikey rarley did..)


But Pat said he wanted to build the team from the draft and UDFA that do not cost much.. therefore high priced talent is not going to happen unless he reverses himself..

Really?

Proof?

[Lonestar]

Worked pretty well for Harbaugh in Baltimore to keep Rex Ryan as the leader of a "not broken" defense.

I have NO problem with coaching changes. I have big problems with unecessary changes.

Just like the Ravens defense was for Harbaugh, our offense isn't broken, so why look to fix it?

I could agree with you if we brought in a Defensive wizard as a HC but any good OC coming in as HC is going to want to run his own system.. IMO

[Tned]

I still want Spags better but Capers would be a good defensive cord. And I personally like the 3-4 and would like us to go to it.

I just still though don't understand firing a offensive guru just to hire a offensive guru.

I know the part of limiting the coaches power but still, offensive for offensive?

It could still work out though because atleast Capers(assuming he does come in) is a hell of an upgrade over Slowik.

Firing an offensive guru for a 'potential' offensive guru. So, it adds even more question to the move.

I tend to read Bowlen at face value about it being time to make a change. Prior to the real rough last three years, the Broncos had a stretch of 4 years or so (don't have time to go look at schedules) where the team shot out to 4 or 5 and 1 type records, and then collapsed at the end, either missing or barely making the playoffs.

It is possible that Shanahan's message has gotten old (even though he says with 1/3 of the roster turning annually, that is unlikely), or his methods (practice without pads) has created 'soft' players, etc.

I think when Bowlen said he thought it would be good for both the team and Mike, he meant it. Not necessarily because "Mike the GM" sucked and "Mike the coach" was still great, but because "Mike" wasn't getting the job done.

So, it is very possible, with the offensive side of the ball so loaded in talent, that Bowlen is going to want to get an offensive guru, because he wants to maximize the strong point of his team.

I know I am in the minority here, but if you have to split Shanahan in half, and have "Mike the coach" and "Mike the GM", then I think it was "Mike the coach" that cost himself his job, possibly along with the "head coach's" decision in coordinators.

[TXBRONC]

Mortensen two days ago said that he believed Denver had found their guy...so personally he is the last man anyone should listen to. Hell, he is on the hot seat with ESPN right now and they may fire him...why? For going ahead with a report in which he did not verify with sources before running with it!

There is only one time that I can recall that Mortensen was on target with anything concerning the Broncos and that was his reporting that Jay was going to replace Jake after we lost to K.C. I certainly didn't believe him when I heard it because Bowlen has never impressed me as the kind owner who procrastinates. He likes get things thoroughly but also as quickly as he can.

[Lancane]

There is only one time that I can recall that Mortensen was on target with anything concerning the Broncos and that was his reporting that Jay was going to replace Jake after we lost to K.C. I certainly didn't believe him when I heard it because Bowlen has never impressed me as the kind owner who procrastinates. He likes get things thoroughly but also as quickly as he can.

Yeah, and sadly that is after Schefter broke the story! So much for having the inside track...lol.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Blowing up the defense. Good. Pieces for a 3-4. Sure. Dumervil and Moss could be 3-4 defensive ends. We might have to find a guy in the middle, but I think Crowder could hold his own in the 3-4. Williams can play in anything.Bly and Champ would probably be better with a pressure 3-4.

I hope you mean 3-4 OLBs when referrin to Moss and Elvis. Those to are undesized for a 4-3 and would be destroyed in a 3-4. 3-4 DEs are guys like the hogs in Cleveland, Chris Canty, Tyson Jackson, etc. Gota have some bef to keep the LBs free to run around and make plays. I could see Elvis and Moss standig up at OLB spots, but it would take some time to get em acclimated.

To be honest, blowing up the D is inevitable. Whether is a 3-4 or a 4-3, many parts will be added/changed.

[Lancane]

Firing an offensive guru for a 'potential' offensive guru. So, it adds even more question to the move.

I tend to read Bowlen at face value about it being time to make a change. Prior to the real rough last three years, the Broncos had a stretch of 4 years or so (don't have time to go look at schedules) where the team shot out to 4 or 5 and 1 type records, and then collapsed at the end, either missing or barely making the playoffs.

It is possible that Shanahan's message has gotten old (even though he says with 1/3 of the roster turning annually, that is unlikely), or his methods (practice without pads) has created 'soft' players, etc.

I think when Bowlen said he thought it would be good for both the team and Mike, he meant it. Not necessarily because "Mike the GM" sucked and "Mike the coach" was still great, but because "Mike" wasn't getting the job done.

So, it is very possible, with the offensive side of the ball so loaded in talent, that Bowlen is going to want to get an offensive guru, because he wants to maximize the strong point of his team.

I know I am in the minority here, but if you have to split Shanahan in half, and have "Mike the coach" and "Mike the GM", then I think it was "Mike the coach" that cost himself his job, possibly along with the "head coach's" decision in coordinators.

Change does not mean a heavy emphisis on philosophy. In the lustrious history of the Denver Broncos Organization the two most winningest coaches were Dan Reeves and Mike Shanahan, both offensive minded individuals. Denver has not had many coaches in the past three decades but overall?; Filchok, Faulkner, Speedie, Malovassi, *Saban, Smith, Ralston, *Miller, *Reeves, Phillips and *Shanahan. Those with the asteriks were the longest tenured, but none matched the time of either Reeves or Shanahan nor their winning ways. Miller was close and he was dismissed unfairly. Reeves and Shanahan being the most succesful of the bunch may play a factor, being that behind those two we have been to the Super Bowl more often and in contention longer then most teams in the league.

McDaniels is very similar to both, that could entice Bowlen as long as he does not have the power of Shanahan and that they pick the coordinators. McDaniels may allow that, not guaranteeing he will, but there is a chance being that he is so young. Defensive coaches have found very little success in Denver, it could change...but Bowlen may look at it differently overall compared to a lot of fans.

[MOtorboat]

I hope you mean 3-4 OLBs when referrin to Moss and Elvis. Those to are undesized for a 4-3 and would be destroyed in a 3-4. 3-4 DEs are guys like the hogs in Cleveland, Chris Canty, Tyson Jackson, etc. Gota have some bef to keep the LBs free to run around and make plays. I could see Elvis and Moss standig up at OLB spots, but it would take some time to get em acclimated.

To be honest, blowing up the D is inevitable. Whether is a 3-4 or a 4-3, many parts will be added/changed.

Exactly...I would NEVER say they were 3-4 DEs...

[SmilinAssasSin27]

My 2 cents after reading the previous 7 pages:


1-McDaniels, although the HC, would still want HIS offense run. Otherwise, why bother bringing him in? He'll run his O with HIS guy as OC. Bates will have to go. I don't like the Harbaugh/Ryan analogy, cuz Harbaugh wasn't brought in as a defensive guru. he was brought in to run the team. McDaniels will be brought in as an offensive guru, thus...no Bates unless Bates truly buys in to the system or runs sumthin similar.

2-The more I hear about Morris, the moe interested I am in him. Many here say a guy must climb the ladder and be a DC before he should be a coach. Yet those same fiolks say that being a great DC doesn't make you a good HC. Somtimes you simply need an inspirational leader of men. A guy who is smart, has his shit together, a guy the players like AND RESPECT, althewhile showing well to the media. Look no further than Tomlin of Pittsburgh. He didn't have decades of exprience, but hehad the intangibles and wowed the Rooneys. From what I'm reading and hearing, Morris may have that "it" factor. Why can't he just be IT and still hire very good coorinators to enhance his apparent natural leadership abilities?

[Tned]

Change does not mean a heavy emphisis on philosophy. In the lustrious history of the Denver Broncos Organization the two most winningest coaches were Dan Reeves and Mike Shanahan, both offensive minded individuals. Denver has not had many coaches in the past three decades but overall?; Filchok, Faulkner, Speedie, Malovassi, *Saban, Smith, Ralston, *Miller, *Reeves, Phillips and *Shanahan. Those with the asteriks were the longest tenured, but none matched the time of either Reeves or Shanahan nor their winning ways. Miller was close and he was dismissed unfairly. Reeves and Shanahan being the most succesful of the bunch may play a factor, being that behind those two we have been to the Super Bowl more often and in contention longer then most teams in the league.

McDaniels is very similar to both, that could entice Bowlen as long as he does not have the power of Shanahan and that they pick the coordinators. McDaniels may allow that, not guaranteeing he will, but there is a chance being that he is so young. Defensive coaches have found very little success in Denver, it could change...but Bowlen may look at it differently overall compared to a lot of fans.

If McDaniels doesn't care whether or not he picks his own coordinators, then chances are he is too young and not ready or confident enough to be a head coach.

[TXBRONC]

If McDaniels doesn't care whether or not he picks his own coordinators, then chances are he is too young and not ready or confident enough to be a head coach.

I think it's very possible that in the interviewing process McDaniels could have been asked who he would like a defensive coordinator.

[Broncos Mtnman]

Could mean a number of things.

Could be that Shanahan, who fired only 3 coaches in 26 years, wants to take the time and try and find someone he thinks will be a long term solution.

Could be that he has decided on Spaguoloniooo, who can't be announced until after the Giants are out of the playoffs, which 'could be several more weeks'.

Didn't you mean Bowlen?

[Tned]

Didn't you mean Bowlen?

Yea, I've made that slip several times. I usually catch it. :lol:

[Tned]

I think it's very possible that in the interviewing process McDaniels could have been asked who he would like a defensive coordinator.

It is very possible, even likely that the conversation went there, but that is a long way from Bowlen and company interviewing defensive candidates without the head coach.

[Lancane]

If McDaniels doesn't care whether or not he picks his own coordinators, then chances are he is too young and not ready or confident enough to be a head coach.

No, he might be willing to accept something regarding a staff placed together under a group effort involving him and management. Morris and others are the same, there is a higher possibility though that he will bring in his own staff entirely...

[TXBRONC]

I could agree with you if we brought in a Defensive wizard as a HC but any good OC coming in as HC is going to want to run his own system.. IMO

I don't think that's necessarily true because it's not the offense that is broken. That would be like saying that if had good defense but it offense that broken and we hired defensive guru he would want to change to the defense. I don't think that would necessarily happen.

[Shazam!]

This sounds too good to be true. I hope all the dominoes fall in line.

[BeefStew25]

I once picked up Capers from the airport. He is kinda old man stinky. I like it. Defensive coaches are supposed to smell bad.

[JKcatch724]

My 2 cents after reading the previous 7 pages:

2-The more I hear about Morris, the moe interested I am in him. Many here say a guy must climb the ladder and be a DC before he should be a coach. Yet those same fiolks say that being a great DC doesn't make you a good HC. Somtimes you simply need an inspirational leader of men. A guy who is smart, has his shit together, a guy the players like AND RESPECT, althewhile showing well to the media. Look no further than Tomlin of Pittsburgh. He didn't have decades of exprience, but hehad the intangibles and wowed the Rooneys. From what I'm reading and hearing, Morris may have that "it" factor. Why can't he just be IT and still hire very good coorinators to enhance his apparent natural leadership abilities?

Couldn't agree more. I just don't know if McDaniels has that "IT" factor. I don't know much about McDaniels, I admit, but from what I read, Morris has the intangibles to be a good if not great leader.

So the issue then becomes: If we're hiring McDaniels to bring in two coordinators that will do the coaching, why don't we just do the same with Morris and keep the offense we have in place??

Or Spags for that matter? I'm not sold on McDaniels yet.

[Fan in Exile]

I tend to read Bowlen at face value about it being time to make a change. Prior to the real rough last three years, the Broncos had a stretch of 4 years or so (don't have time to go look at schedules) where the team shot out to 4 or 5 and 1 type records, and then collapsed at the end, either missing or barely making the playoffs.

This is not true we made the play-offs in 03, 04, and 05.

[Scarface]

2-The more I hear about Morris, the moe interested I am in him. Many here say a guy must climb the ladder and be a DC before he should be a coach. Yet those same fiolks say that being a great DC doesn't make you a good HC. Somtimes you simply need an inspirational leader of men. A guy who is smart, has his shit together, a guy the players like AND RESPECT, althewhile showing well to the media. Look no further than Tomlin of Pittsburgh. He didn't have decades of exprience, but hehad the intangibles and wowed the Rooneys. From what I'm reading and hearing, Morris may have that "it" factor. Why can't he just be IT and still hire very good coorinators to enhance his apparent natural leadership abilities?

That's why I'm pulling for Morris. I want a guy with energy that commands respect and inspires his players to play hard. Morris would be that guy.:beer:

[TXBRONC]

If McDaniels doesn't care whether or not he picks his own coordinators, then chances are he is too young and not ready or confident enough to be a head coach.

From what the opening post to this thread said, Capers seems to be the guy that McDaniel would want for running the defense assuming he's the guy Bowlen wants.

[omac]

Because you can't expect a head coach to come and not be allowed to choose his staff/coordinators. It's part of the deal with firing your coach. How can you hold the new head coach responsible, if you force coaches on him?

Not going against what you're saying, but there is some providence in keeping what works. When Dungy took over the Colts, he kept their OC (Tom Moore), their OL coach (Howard Mudd), and their RB coach (Gene Huey), and why not? The potential of the offense was obvious, as that young Peyton led team had 5,955 yards, 27 TDs versus 23 INTs. Even now, the Colts still have those same 3 offensive coaches heading those same positions.

What concerns me when getting an offensive coach to replace our offensive coach is that we might be messing with something that doesn't necessarily need fixing, only balance. When we've had Pittman, Torain, or Hillis score a rushing TD, we've usually scored 30+ points or close.

We weren't content with our defense with Coyer, even though we were pretty solid statistically. Our situation worsened first with Bates, then with Slowik.

The Chargers used to have a strong offensive identity with Marty; run the ball hard to set up the pass. They went 14-2 and had an opportunity to beat the Pats in the playoffs. They over-reacted, switched to Norv, lost their identity on offense (as even their players admitted to), become more of a finesse team, and have made the playoffs despite Norv's incompetence as a HC.

Our defense now has only one way to go, and that's up. Our offense might get better, but like with the Coyer-to-Bates and the Marty-to-Norv situation, it could get much worse.

I was hoping for a Dungy-type situation, but ofcourse, there's no guarantee that a defensive minded coach won't mess with the offense either.

[Tned]

This is not true we made the play-offs in 03, 04, and 05.

Hence the reason I stated either missing or barely making the playoffs. We barely missed in '06 and then in '02 we shot out to a 4-1 and then 6-2 start, only to collapse down the stretch.

'03 and '04 and '05 the team jumped out to 5-1 starts. While in '05 we kept on the role, in '03 and '04 after the hot starts, we finished the season 5-5.

Even in the bad '06 year, we jumped out to a 5-1 lead (much due to Elam's leg), and again collapsed down the stretch to miss the playoffs.

So, in the last seven years, only last year did the Broncos not jump out to 4-1 or 5-1 starts, and in all but the '05 AFCCG season, the team collapsed, going around .500 from that point on, either missing the playoffs or barely squeaking in.

[NightTrainLayne]

1-McDaniels, although the HC, would still want HIS offense run. Otherwise, why bother bringing him in? He'll run his O with HIS guy as OC. Bates will have to go. I don't like the Harbaugh/Ryan analogy, cuz Harbaugh wasn't brought in as a defensive guru. he was brought in to run the team. McDaniels will be brought in as an offensive guru, thus...no Bates unless Bates truly buys in to the system or runs sumthin similar.


:confused:

Bates was more or less just trying to copy McDaniel's offense from 2007 this year. I'd say knocking off McDaniel's O is a form of "buy-in".

[muse]

Not going against what you're saying, but there is some providence in keeping what works. When Dungy took over the Colts, he kept their OC (Tom Moore), their OL coach (Howard Mudd), and their RB coach (Gene Huey), and why not? The potential of the offense was obvious, as that young Peyton led team had 5,955 yards, 27 TDs versus 23 INTs. Even now, the Colts still have those same 3 offensive coaches heading those same positions.

What concerns me when getting an offensive coach to replace our offensive coach is that we might be messing with something that doesn't necessarily need fixing, only balance. When we've had Pittman, Torain, or Hillis score a rushing TD, we've usually scored 30+ points or close.

We weren't content with our defense with Coyer, even though we were pretty solid statistically. Our situation worsened first with Bates, then with Slowik.

The Chargers used to have a strong offensive identity with Marty; run the ball hard to set up the pass. They went 14-2 and had an opportunity to beat the Pats in the playoffs. They over-reacted, switched to Norv, lost their identity on offense (as even their players admitted to), become more of a finesse team, and have made the playoffs despite Norv's incompetence as a HC.

Our defense now has only one way to go, and that's up. Our offense might get better, but like with the Coyer-to-Bates and the Marty-to-Norv situation, it could get much worse.

I was hoping for a Dungy-type situation, but ofcourse, there's no guarantee that a defensive minded coach won't mess with the offense either.

That's exactly what I've been thinking. Whilst Bates/Dennison/Turner may not get us back to #2 in the offensive rankings, I still think they could do a good job, especially if we get some continuity at running back. It'd very much be a learning-on-the-job experience, but a lot of people agree that Bates has all the potential to be a good OC and I think the Atlanta game epitomised that - we had a balanced attack and dismantled them with smart playcalling. Of course, we faced the Raiders the next week and that went tits up. The O has a fair amount of tweaking to do - redzone, turnovers and running game - and two of those are eminently fixable (we did much better in the redzone when we had a suitable back such as Pittman or Hillis). Turnovers are more of a problem, but the INTs will come down as we start throwing the ball less. As far as fumbles go, we had many fewer in the second half of the season. I think Marshall's fumble against Buffalo can be excused because it was a perfect play by Donte Whitner.

Is Bates ready? Maybe, maybe not. But he has a season of playcalling under his belt, and it's obvious that the players like him (and the latter is true for guys like Dennison and Turner). Keeping the crew together is probably a sound long term solution.

[TXBRONC]

That's exactly what I've been thinking. Whilst Bates/Dennison/Turner may not get us back to #2 in the offensive rankings, I still think they could do a good job, especially if we get some continuity at running back. It'd very much be a learning-on-the-job experience, but a lot of people agree that Bates has all the potential to be a good OC and I think the Atlanta game epitomised that - we had a balanced attack and dismantled them with smart playcalling. Of course, we faced the Raiders the next week and that went tits up. The O has a fair amount of tweaking to do - redzone, turnovers and running game - and two of those are eminently fixable (we did much better in the redzone when we had a suitable back such as Pittman or Hillis). Turnovers are more of a problem, but the INTs will come down as we start throwing the ball less. As far as fumbles go, we had many fewer in the second half of the season. I think Marshall's fumble against Buffalo can be excused because it was a perfect play by Donte Whitner.

Is Bates ready? Maybe, maybe not. But he has a season of playcalling under his belt, and it's obvious that the players like him (and the latter is true for guys like Dennison and Turner). Keeping the crew together is probably a sound long term solution.

In my opinion if new coach will leave the offense as is the team will bounce back quicker. Changing the the scheme will more likely set the team back further.

[Fan in Exile]

Hence the reason I stated either missing or barely making the playoffs. We barely missed in '06 and then in '02 we shot out to a 4-1 and then 6-2 start, only to collapse down the stretch.

'03 and '04 and '05 the team jumped out to 5-1 starts. While in '05 we kept on the role, in '03 and '04 after the hot starts, we finished the season 5-5.

Even in the bad '06 year, we jumped out to a 5-1 lead (much due to Elam's leg), and again collapsed down the stretch to miss the playoffs.

So, in the last seven years, only last year did the Broncos not jump out to 4-1 or 5-1 starts, and in all but the '05 AFCCG season, the team collapsed, going around .500 from that point on, either missing the playoffs or barely squeaking in.

At first I thought you had just forgotten making the play-offs now I see it's that you've bought into the late season collapse theory.

In 06, 02 we did have a collapse at the end that's why Plummer was the QB in 2003, and Cutler took over part way through 06.

Other than that the Broncos had the same or better record in the second half of the season as they did in the first. They got better in 07,05 and had the exact same record in 08, 04, 03.

You only get a late season collapse when you cherry pick stats the way that you've done. When you look at first half compared to second half of the season our records come out the same. When you compare it by quarters then it looks like we struggle a little in the middle of the season and start and finish strongly.

[LRtagger]

My 2 cents after reading the previous 7 pages:


1-McDaniels, although the HC, would still want HIS offense run. Otherwise, why bother bringing him in? He'll run his O with HIS guy as OC. Bates will have to go. I don't like the Harbaugh/Ryan analogy, cuz Harbaugh wasn't brought in as a defensive guru. he was brought in to run the team. McDaniels will be brought in as an offensive guru, thus...no Bates unless Bates truly buys in to the system or runs sumthin similar.

2-The more I hear about Morris, the moe interested I am in him. Many here say a guy must climb the ladder and be a DC before he should be a coach. Yet those same fiolks say that being a great DC doesn't make you a good HC. Somtimes you simply need an inspirational leader of men. A guy who is smart, has his shit together, a guy the players like AND RESPECT, althewhile showing well to the media. Look no further than Tomlin of Pittsburgh. He didn't have decades of exprience, but hehad the intangibles and wowed the Rooneys. From what I'm reading and hearing, Morris may have that "it" factor. Why can't he just be IT and still hire very good coorinators to enhance his apparent natural leadership abilities?


I totally agree on Morris...thought I was the only one here that wouldn't mind him in Denver.

[Traveler]

I totally agree on Morris...thought I was the only one here that wouldn't mind him in Denver.

You're not the only one. Spagnuolo would be my first choice, but I've got this gut feeling about Morris. Just some intangible I can't put my finger on.

[Hawgdriver]

And what if he can't? Are we willing to risk that when it isn't necessary?

I say the Bates situation is big.

I hope that Bates stays and he and Josh become real good buddies, but not in the complacent sense. Having two 32 year old offensive play-calling prodigies has the potential to get contentious. If Bates leaves now that will cripple the offense for at least a year. It's all about the playbook and the quarterback's mastery thereof.

[Poet]

I dont think you could ask for much more. A proven offensive guy to run the bread and butter of our current roster...a proven DC with experience in teaching youngsters...a current coach that knows our QB and has a good rapport with him and a GM that has shown he can spot talent.

I guess my question is...what does Spag bring to the table that is so much better than this?

Working well in chaos. The shift from Kiwanuka to DE has worked great, and while many think it was an obvious move you have to remember that it looked like Straham would come back after Osi went down.

The nice Giant fan made mention of him doing very well with young secondary players, and from the looks of your safeties and half your CBs you could do with some youth in that area.

His scheme is fantastic, the Giants don't do too much moving around like the Steelers and Ravens do, but he can mix it up as well and is more proven in my eyes.

That's why I think Spag is better.

[OrangeHoof]

Having watched Capers with the Texans, he's a better DC than a HC but he seems almost completely married to the 3-4 defense which means some of our personnel aren't going to fit under the new system - especially Dumervil. The 3-4 ends are expected to be the size of a 4-3 undertackle and hold up blockers while the LBs make most of the plays. Only the LBs are expected to drop in coverage like real linebackers so undersized speed rushers like Dumervil will either have to learn pass coverage or be used only in blitz situations. The NTs are supposed to be fat tubs of goo you can't push off the line, like Sam Adams when we had him.

In fact, DJ and Robertson are the only two guys on the front seven who I think would make the transition to a pure 3-4. That may be a good thing but it probably couldn't be fixed in just one year. The secondary's duties are pretty much the same except you can expect more corner blitzes.

[LRtagger]

You're not the only one. Spagnuolo would be my first choice, but I've got this gut feeling about Morris. Just some intangible I can't put my finger on.

Same here...

It may sound stupid, but when I just look at the guy, he just LOOKS like a coach. I don't really have a whole lot to go on besides "league sources" and the fact his interview with us ran 4 hours, but I have a good feeling about him. :confused:

[Hawgdriver]

My 2 cents after reading the previous 7 pages:


1-McDaniels, although the HC, would still want HIS offense run. Otherwise, why bother bringing him in? He'll run his O with HIS guy as OC. Bates will have to go. I don't like the Harbaugh/Ryan analogy, cuz Harbaugh wasn't brought in as a defensive guru. he was brought in to run the team. McDaniels will be brought in as an offensive guru, thus...no Bates unless Bates truly buys in to the system or runs sumthin similar.


Good point. Perhaps there is a happy medium. Bates has shown he can do decent when given the opportunity to run an offense. The Broncos offense was good this year, and there were injury issues at tailback and some receiver issues, too. The funny thing about an offensive scheme is that it takes a quarterback years to master it. Can we afford to start from scratch right now, while the clock is ticking and our young offensive weapons are just arriving at the peak of their powers? Why not continue with Bates and have McDaniels introduce a few wrinkles in year one, while he makes bolder strokes in year two, after gaining an understanding of how to best employ his weapons?

I'm concerned that canning Bates will keep us out of contention next year, which I believe should be a clear objective, and may prevent 2010 from being as strong as year as it could be. A good scheme is in the details and those take time to master--time I would hate to see wasted.

[Fan in Exile]

Having watched Capers with the Texans, he's a better DC than a HC but he seems almost completely married to the 3-4 defense which means some of our personnel aren't going to fit under the new system - especially Dumervil. The 3-4 ends are expected to be the size of a 4-3 undertackle and hold up blockers while the LBs make most of the plays. Only the LBs are expected to drop in coverage like real linebackers so undersized speed rushers like Dumervil will either have to learn pass coverage or be used only in blitz situations. The NTs are supposed to be fat tubs of goo you can't push off the line, like Sam Adams when we had him.

In fact, DJ and Robertson are the only two guys on the front seven who I think would make the transition to a pure 3-4. That may be a good thing but it probably couldn't be fixed in just one year. The secondary's duties are pretty much the same except you can expect more corner blitzes.

The thing about this is that Robertson left the Jets because he didn't do well in a 3-4, so I can't see him staying here if we switch. I do think that Thomas might make a good 3-4 DE, but I just think that we would have to overhaul too much of our D to make it worth while to switch.

I know that a lot of guys really like the 3-4 but at this point I don't want the offense to have to wait for the defense to install a 3-4, when with a good DC and some personnel changes we can get an okay D next year and a good D after that. A switch to the 3-4 would just make next year another year like this one with a great offense hamstrung by a bad D.

[Lonestar]

I don't think that's necessarily true because it's not the offense that is broken. That would be like saying that if had good defense but it offense that broken and we hired defensive guru he would want to change to the defense. I don't think that would necessarily happen.


While the Offense is not broken I suspect he know little if anything about the ZBS or mikeys play book.. He learned his system and with a great QB and decent RB's has run one of the most prolific Offenses in the NFL.

I think it reasonable to think that while parts of todays play book may stay in effect, it is mikeys and If I were the new guy coming in I would want to run it my way the system I totally understood..

I would not want to place my career or job on the line doing something I did not understand.. Just because Bates and Jay does, does not make me as a NEW HEAD CHEESE comfortable.. I think you can understand it..

I know of no new head coach coming in that did not bring there system in to play unless of course they were a disciple already of the "system" that was there.

[LRtagger]

While the Offense is not broken I suspect he know little if anything about the ZBS or mikeys play book.. He learned his system and with a great QB and decent RB's has run one of the most prolific Offenses in the NFL.

I think it reasonable to think that while parts of todays play book may stay in effect, it is mikeys and If I were the new guy coming in I would want to run it my way the system I totally understood..

I would not want to place my career or job on the line doing something I did not understand.. Just because Bates and Jay does, does not make me as a NEW HEAD CHEESE comfortable.. I think you can understand it..

I know of no new head coach coming in that did not bring there system in to play unless of course they were a disciple already of the "system" that was there.

From another perspective, though if McDaniels was open to making adjustments based on what Bates and Jay are comfortable with, we could have a New England/McD based offense with minor adjustments from Bates and co. It could potentially be lethal.

Just trying to look at the glass half full.

[MOtorboat]

While the Offense is not broken I suspect he know little if anything about the ZBS or mikeys play book.. He learned his system and with a great QB and decent RB's has run one of the most prolific Offenses in the NFL.

I think it reasonable to think that while parts of todays play book may stay in effect, it is mikeys and If I were the new guy coming in I would want to run it my way the system I totally understood..

I would not want to place my career or job on the line doing something I did not understand.. Just because Bates and Jay does, does not make me as a NEW HEAD CHEESE comfortable.. I think you can understand it..

I know of no new head coach coming in that did not bring there system in to play unless of course they were a disciple already of the "system" that was there.

Hasn't McDaniels been trying to implement some zone blocking scheme into the Patriots offense? I would imagine if Turner/Bates/Dennison were retained, or any combination of the three, with McDaniels coming in, the ZBS would probably stay. Of course the play book will look a little different, but I would imagine the reason McDaniels would take a job like this is because he doesn't have to re-write the book, like he might going to Detroit, or wherever else. He's got a lot to work with here, and that's what makes the job appealing.

[claymore]

You're not the only one. Spagnuolo would be my first choice, but I've got this gut feeling about Morris. Just some intangible I can't put my finger on.


Same here...

It may sound stupid, but when I just look at the guy, he just LOOKS like a coach. I don't really have a whole lot to go on besides "league sources" and the fact his interview with us ran 4 hours, but I have a good feeling about him. :confused:

I have a good feeling about him as well. But logically who in the hell could he bring in as a Defensive Coordinator? And.... If Bates turns out to be a turd without Shannahan here... Who do we throw in there?

I think Mcdaniels/Capers is the safest pick right now. Spags has yet to say if he would be a head Coach, and who his OC would be... So i cannot judge him yet.

I would love to bring in Morris if he would be a DC... which still could happen if and when Gruden is fired.

[Lonestar]

Hasn't McDaniels been trying to implement some zone blocking scheme into the Patriots offense? I would imagine if Turner/Bates/Dennison were retained, or any combination of the three, with McDaniels coming in, the ZBS would probably stay. Of course the play book will look a little different, but I would imagine the reason McDaniels would take a job like this is because he doesn't have to re-write the book, like he might going to Detroit, or wherever else. He's got a lot to work with here, and that's what makes the job appealing.

Could be he did I do not follow them much..

I just know that MOST of the time newbies bring in their own system something they are totally comfortable with..

Just like the transition from HS to college to the NFL the players adjust to what they are being taught..

Most of the transition from one level to the next is the intensity of that level and the length of the season..

While I'm not trying to totally down play a change in terms.. they learn it faster than one thinks..

Now Morris I have no desire to see him here for a multitude of reasons the biggest being he has not been a DC long enough to know where the door to the john is..

Much like slowick pretty good DB coach and then elevated to DC.. It pretty much proved he reached his peter principle level of incompetency at DB coach..

I want someone that MASTERED the coordinators jobs some where else under a great HC before they are considered for the HC job here..

Gut feel folks doth not make it.. the players have to believe you know what your doing.. Having someone that is 6 months older than you as your boss and you should believe everything he says IMHO is a huge stretch of imagination or for some a very large leap of faith..

Like hiring someone from the Lions to come in here to be the HC,, how many of Y'all would like to see that.. I want a proven winner from a proven program for my GUY..

[bcbronc]

The thing about this is that Robertson left the Jets because he didn't do well in a 3-4, so I can't see him staying here if we switch. I do think that Thomas might make a good 3-4 DE, but I just think that we would have to overhaul too much of our D to make it worth while to switch.

I know that a lot of guys really like the 3-4 but at this point I don't want the offense to have to wait for the defense to install a 3-4, when with a good DC and some personnel changes we can get an okay D next year and a good D after that. A switch to the 3-4 would just make next year another year like this one with a great offense hamstrung by a bad D.

I agree that Thomas might make a good 3-4 DE. Same with Crowder. Moss hopefully could handle a change to OLB, and possibly WW can move inside to play beside DJ. in a lot of ways, the 2nd ILB in a 3-4 is like the Will in a 4-3 anyway. but most of those are ??? and we'd definitely need to find a NT, which is the single most important player in a 3-4 scheme, and not easy to come by.

but we've got a ton of draft picks, so it's a good time to start making this change if we are going to do it. and even transitioning from 4-3 to 3-4 I doubt our defence is any worse than last season. especially if Barnett has a good offseason, we add another S that can make some plays, and Champ and DJ stay healthy. add a few less RBs on IR and we should at least tread water next season, if not add a win or two.

just to comment on "getting rid of an offensive guru to add an offensive guru". not to throw Shanny under the bus (I love the man) but his guru-ship needs to be reviewed. yes we can still move the ball between the 20s, but we've been pretty average, or worse, in the red zone the past few years. this is due to Shanny's system getting a little stale. the new-age 3-4 so many teams run now eats up Shanny's ZBS. I mean teams have OLBs nearly as big as Hamilton these days, and so much more athletic. it's always cyclical, but right now the speed/size/athleticism packaged in so many defenders is too much for our Oline to handle, especially in the tight confines of the redzone.

I think Shanny got a little too comfortable in running the "Broncos offense" and didn't recognize the change in defensive philosophy common around the league has negated the advantage of having quick, athletic, small oline men. If Bates can adapt an offense to be able to knock a team out with a punch to the gut, I'm all for keeping him. but I have no problems losing all our offensive coaches and letting a new "mastermind" redefine "Broncos offense".

[Lonestar]

I agree that Thomas might make a good 3-4 DE. Same with Crowder. Moss hopefully could handle a change to OLB, and possibly WW can move inside to play beside DJ. in a lot of ways, the 2nd ILB in a 3-4 is like the Will in a 4-3 anyway. but most of those are ??? and we'd definitely need to find a NT, which is the single most important player in a 3-4 scheme, and not easy to come by.

but we've got a ton of draft picks, so it's a good time to start making this change if we are going to do it. and even transitioning from 4-3 to 3-4 I doubt our defence is any worse than last season. especially if Barnett has a good offseason, we add another S that can make some plays, and Champ and DJ stay healthy. add a few less RBs on IR and we should at least tread water next season, if not add a win or two.

just to comment on "getting rid of an offensive guru to add an offensive guru". not to throw Shanny under the bus (I love the man) but his guru-ship needs to be reviewed. yes we can still move the ball between the 20s, but we've been pretty average, or worse, in the red zone the past few years. this is due to Shanny's system getting a little stale. the new-age 3-4 so many teams run now eats up Shanny's ZBS. I mean teams have OLBs nearly as big as Hamilton these days, and so much more athletic. it's always cyclical, but right now the speed/size/athleticism packaged in so many defenders is too much for our Oline to handle, especially in the tight confines of the redzone.

I think Shanny got a little too comfortable in running the "Broncos offense" and didn't recognize the change in defensive philosophy common around the league has negated the advantage of having quick, athletic, small oline men. If Bates can adapt an offense to be able to knock a team out with a punch to the gut, I'm all for keeping him. but I have no problems losing all our offensive coaches and letting a new "mastermind" redefine "Broncos offense".

I agree with much of your post but let me add..

This past year we got quite a few more TD's in the Red Zone than years past but IIRC only when we had either Hillis or Pitts still toting the rock.. We also had Prater instead of Elam so mikey knew he had to deal with it instead of being FG dependent..

[broncofaninfla]

I would assume that who ever comes in here at HC is going to leave the offense intact as much as possible because the defense is going to require a massive over haul.

[Dean]

Hasn't McDaniels been trying to implement some zone blocking scheme into the Patriots offense? I would imagine if Turner/Bates/Dennison were retained, or any combination of the three, with McDaniels coming in, the ZBS would probably stay. Of course the play book will look a little different, but I would imagine the reason McDaniels would take a job like this is because he doesn't have to re-write the book, like he might going to Detroit, or wherever else. He's got a lot to work with here, and that's what makes the job appealing.

Not only was New England implementing some zone blocking, but the Broncos did film studies of last year's Patriot passing game and were using some of it.

[broncofaninfla]

It's a copy cat league. If it works, you can bet somebody else will do it too. Our offense worked for the most part. I look for it to be kept intact and hopefully improved on.

[topscribe]

Not only was New England implementing some zone blocking, but the Broncos did film studies of last year's Patriot passing game and were using some of it.

In fact, the two successive receptions by Royal to win the game against the
Chargers were taken right out of the Patriots' playbook.

-----

[DenBronx]

Having watched Capers with the Texans, he's a better DC than a HC but he seems almost completely married to the 3-4 defense which means some of our personnel aren't going to fit under the new system - especially Dumervil. The 3-4 ends are expected to be the size of a 4-3 undertackle and hold up blockers while the LBs make most of the plays. Only the LBs are expected to drop in coverage like real linebackers so undersized speed rushers like Dumervil will either have to learn pass coverage or be used only in blitz situations. The NTs are supposed to be fat tubs of goo you can't push off the line, like Sam Adams when we had him.

In fact, DJ and Robertson are the only two guys on the front seven who I think would make the transition to a pure 3-4. That may be a good thing but it probably couldn't be fixed in just one year. The secondary's duties are pretty much the same except you can expect more corner blitzes.


I think Robertson has stated he doesn't want to play for a 3-4 defense. Not that he has a choice.

Who would be our NT???

[tomjonesrocks]

Does this Denver Post article make sense to anyone? Then there's Jim Miller questioning if McDaniels is ready to be a HC...
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/rumors/post/Veterans-would-have-say-in-hiring-of-McDaniels-i?urn=nfl,133274

Veterans would have say in hiring of McDaniels in Denver

Ultimately, it won't be Pat Bowlen who decides whether Josh McDaniels, at 32, is ready to become the Denver Broncos' next head coach, according to the Denver Post.

It would be Champ Bailey and Casey Wiegmann. The decisions would come from the hearts, souls and minds of D.J. Williams, Jay Cutler and Ebenezer Ekuban. It's the Broncos players who would determine whether a kid like McDaniels would be worthy of their respect, and trust, to follow his lead.

"If he were going to get the job, I would say without exception the players would be surprised when he walks through the door," said Kyle Brady, who was a starting tight end for the record-setting New England Patriots' 2007 offense that was coordinated by McDaniels. "Their first thought will be, 'Who is this kid?' Because everybody to some degree judges things by appearances. Even though we all do our best not to. And Josh, even for a 32-year-old, he looks 25. I remember I was taken aback when I first met him. I thought, 'This is the offensive coordinator for the New England Patriots?' "

Brady, who turns 37 next week and is moving into the financial investment business, and quarterback Jim Miller, who is 37 and now a talk-show host, were coached by the younger McDaniels for one season. Miller was Tom Brady's backup in 2004, when the Patriots won their third Super Bowl in four years.

"Josh soaks up everything that Bill Belichick has taught him," Miller said, referring to the Patriots' head coach. "I was very impressed with his thoroughness. But because he's so young, I don't know how he would go over from a leadership standpoint as far as commanding it from the team. I don't think he's enthusiastic like a John Harbaugh. I respect Josh. I think he's extremely bright, and works extremely hard. I don't know if he's ready to be a head coach, though."

Source: Denver Post

[CoachChaz]

The Kyle Brady of today and the Kyle Brady I knew in high school are so different. I always thought someone would kill him one day, but like most of us...I guess he grew up.

Just a random thought.

[claymore]

Does this Denver Post article make sense to anyone? Then there's Jim Miller questioning if McDaniels is ready to be a HC...
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/rumors/post/Veterans-would-have-say-in-hiring-of-McDaniels-i?urn=nfl,133274

Veterans would have say in hiring of McDaniels in Denver

Ultimately, it won't be Pat Bowlen who decides whether Josh McDaniels, at 32, is ready to become the Denver Broncos' next head coach, according to the Denver Post.

It would be Champ Bailey and Casey Wiegmann. The decisions would come from the hearts, souls and minds of D.J. Williams, Jay Cutler and Ebenezer Ekuban. It's the Broncos players who would determine whether a kid like McDaniels would be worthy of their respect, and trust, to follow his lead.

"If he were going to get the job, I would say without exception the players would be surprised when he walks through the door," said Kyle Brady, who was a starting tight end for the record-setting New England Patriots' 2007 offense that was coordinated by McDaniels. "Their first thought will be, 'Who is this kid?' Because everybody to some degree judges things by appearances. Even though we all do our best not to. And Josh, even for a 32-year-old, he looks 25. I remember I was taken aback when I first met him. I thought, 'This is the offensive coordinator for the New England Patriots?' "

Brady, who turns 37 next week and is moving into the financial investment business, and quarterback Jim Miller, who is 37 and now a talk-show host, were coached by the younger McDaniels for one season. Miller was Tom Brady's backup in 2004, when the Patriots won their third Super Bowl in four years.

"Josh soaks up everything that Bill Belichick has taught him," Miller said, referring to the Patriots' head coach. "I was very impressed with his thoroughness. But because he's so young, I don't know how he would go over from a leadership standpoint as far as commanding it from the team. I don't think he's enthusiastic like a John Harbaugh. I respect Josh. I think he's extremely bright, and works extremely hard. I don't know if he's ready to be a head coach, though."

Source: Denver Post

I thought it was an awesome article. And something to consider. Like it or not, no one wants to work for someone younger than them. He does look like a kid, and would be weird to see him calling the shots.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

The Kyle Brady of today and the Kyle Brady I knew in high school are so different. I always thought someone would kill him one day, but like most of us...I guess he grew up.

Just a random thought.

U from the Harrisburg area?

[CoachChaz]

U from the Harrisburg area?

Yep. Graduated from CD East.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

nice.

[LRtagger]

Does this Denver Post article make sense to anyone? Then there's Jim Miller questioning if McDaniels is ready to be a HC...
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/rumors/post/Veterans-would-have-say-in-hiring-of-McDaniels-i?urn=nfl,133274

Veterans would have say in hiring of McDaniels in Denver

Ultimately, it won't be Pat Bowlen who decides whether Josh McDaniels, at 32, is ready to become the Denver Broncos' next head coach, according to the Denver Post.

It would be Champ Bailey and Casey Wiegmann. The decisions would come from the hearts, souls and minds of D.J. Williams, Jay Cutler and Ebenezer Ekuban. It's the Broncos players who would determine whether a kid like McDaniels would be worthy of their respect, and trust, to follow his lead.

"If he were going to get the job, I would say without exception the players would be surprised when he walks through the door," said Kyle Brady, who was a starting tight end for the record-setting New England Patriots' 2007 offense that was coordinated by McDaniels. "Their first thought will be, 'Who is this kid?' Because everybody to some degree judges things by appearances. Even though we all do our best not to. And Josh, even for a 32-year-old, he looks 25. I remember I was taken aback when I first met him. I thought, 'This is the offensive coordinator for the New England Patriots?' "

Brady, who turns 37 next week and is moving into the financial investment business, and quarterback Jim Miller, who is 37 and now a talk-show host, were coached by the younger McDaniels for one season. Miller was Tom Brady's backup in 2004, when the Patriots won their third Super Bowl in four years.

"Josh soaks up everything that Bill Belichick has taught him," Miller said, referring to the Patriots' head coach. "I was very impressed with his thoroughness. But because he's so young, I don't know how he would go over from a leadership standpoint as far as commanding it from the team. I don't think he's enthusiastic like a John Harbaugh. I respect Josh. I think he's extremely bright, and works extremely hard. I don't know if he's ready to be a head coach, though."

Source: Denver Post

I trust Bowlen and co's opinion more than I do Josh Brady and Jim Miller...but interesting article I guess.

[underrated29]

why do they care how young he is.

Ask the pitts penguins, about the young crosby leading their team. Or ask the 9'ers about willis leading their team as a MLB.

Lebron James being a leader for the cavs.

Who freaking cares how young they are- if they can coach and lead your team what difference does it make. I dont think any of those teams have an issue with them being their leaders.

[CoachChaz]

nice.

Yep...another reason why I join you on the McCoy bandwagon.

[tomjonesrocks]

I thought it was an awesome article. And something to consider. Like it or not, no one wants to work for someone younger than them. He does look like a kid, and would be weird to see him calling the shots.

I was unsure what the article was trying to say. Is it suggesting Bowlen's going to call the vets on this team to see if they'd accept McDaniels before hiring him? Or merely speculating on how he'd be accepted in the locker room by the older vets if he's hired?

There's really no reason to care what Champ Bailey thinks, IMO. He was a big Slowik fan and look what that got us.