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Tom Nalen
11-02-2011, 02:57 PM
Yeah I know Tebow did play horrible and the Offensive Playcalling was a joke, but what about the Defensive playcalling. There were MANY instances that just in the pre-snap read of offense and defense, you could exactly see who was going to be open yet we failed to adjust, time and time again. One alarming play was putting Harris on Johnson and MANNING him up. Johnson completed the 5-yard in route for a first down. The Defense just stood around and accepted their faith.

Our playcalling on the Defensive side of the ball has been equally as horrendous as the offensive side of the ball. The blitz schemes seem easy to read by almost any QB, seems like we as a Bronocs Organization love the 10 yard cushion on 3rd and 3, and our zones are easily picked apart.

Next year, I do not give a crap about Luck or any QB. Every pick needs o be Defense and more Defense.

chazoe60
11-02-2011, 03:03 PM
We have to pick a QB in the first round bud. After that we can go ahead and pick defense. But we can't let the talent at QB in this draft slip by.

Like it or not in today's NFL you do not win without a franchise QB.

BroncoNut
11-02-2011, 03:03 PM
Aren't you glad you're no longer playing for the team? IIRC, you were fortunate to leave before McDummy era.

BeefStew25
11-02-2011, 03:05 PM
I liked his head shot that one year.

BeefStew25
11-02-2011, 03:06 PM
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/football/nfl/players/2799.jpg

MasterShake
11-02-2011, 04:31 PM
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/football/nfl/players/2799.jpg

NEEEERRRRDDDSSS!!! :mad:

BroncoNut
11-02-2011, 04:33 PM
NEEEERRRRDDDSSS!!! :mad:

:lol: exactly. awesome

Ravage!!!
11-02-2011, 04:49 PM
Wut? Obvious and just standing around awaiting out fate?

rcsodak
11-02-2011, 05:03 PM
What perplexed me, was saying they were going to play champ in the slot on 3rd downs and then when megatron is put there, champ is still out on the edge. Wtf?!

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Northman
11-02-2011, 05:09 PM
Yeah I know Tebow did play horrible and the Offensive Playcalling was a joke, but what about the Defensive playcalling. There were MANY instances that just in the pre-snap read of offense and defense, you could exactly see who was going to be open yet we failed to adjust, time and time again. One alarming play was putting Harris on Johnson and MANNING him up. Johnson completed the 5-yard in route for a first down. The Defense just stood around and accepted their faith.

Our playcalling on the Defensive side of the ball has been equally as horrendous as the offensive side of the ball. The blitz schemes seem easy to read by almost any QB, seems like we as a Bronocs Organization love the 10 yard cushion on 3rd and 3, and our zones are easily picked apart.

Next year, I do not give a crap about Luck or any QB. Every pick needs o be Defense and more Defense.

You could do that sure. But then what? Even as great as the Ravens defense of 2000 and the Bucs defense of 2002 they only have one SB to show for it. Even now the Ravens are still trying to get a QB who can elevate their offense to another level. Meanwhile, Pitt, Indy, and NE have average to good defenses but have HOF QB's who get them to multiple SB's.

The added problem for Denver is they dont seem to care much about drafting a DT in the draft, at least one worthwhile. They had a shot at Dareus and passed on him.

Nah, for Denver its still important to get that FQB. Had we stayed the course with our 2008 offense and drafted defense mainly in 09',10', and 11' we would be competing for SB's by now. Im sure of that.

rcsodak
11-02-2011, 05:14 PM
I've said a couple times that Vick is the best run stopper and i have been proven correct. Since he was hurt, the run D has sucked ass.

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slim
11-02-2011, 05:46 PM
You could do that sure. But then what? Even as great as the Ravens defense of 2000 and the Bucs defense of 2002 they only have one SB to show for it. Even now the Ravens are still trying to get a QB who can elevate their offense to another level. Meanwhile, Pitt, Indy, and NE have average to good defenses but have HOF QB's who get them to multiple SB's.

The added problem for Denver is they dont seem to care much about drafting a DT in the draft, at least one worthwhile. They had a shot at Dareus and passed on him.

Nah, for Denver its still important to get that FQB. Had we stayed the course with our 2008 offense and drafted defense mainly in 09',10', and 11' we would be competing for SB's by now. Im sure of that.

Pitt and NE both had really good defenses when they won their rings.

I Eat Staples
11-02-2011, 05:52 PM
Pitt and NE both had really good defenses when they won their rings.

Pitt yes, but NE's defense has been average for as long as I can remember.

Northman
11-02-2011, 05:56 PM
Pitt and NE both had really good defenses when they won their rings.

But nowhere near Ravens 2000 or Bucs 2002 good. That was my point.

dogfish
11-02-2011, 05:56 PM
Pitt and NE both had really good defenses when they won their rings.

in fairness, new england also had the other team's gameplan. . .

chazoe60
11-02-2011, 05:59 PM
North makes a good point though, Slim. Even the teams built with great defenses don't have staying power unless they also have a franchise QB.

We have to figure out both problems obviously, but a defense will need several picks and FAs to build while we can possibly solve our franchise QB problem with one draft pick. And the strength of the QB crop in this upcoming draft combined with our likely high draft position means we have to make that move this time.

People think I'm crazy but I still believe we have an outside shot at Luck.

slim
11-02-2011, 05:59 PM
Pitt yes, but NE's defense has been average for as long as I can remember.

In '03 they were 7th in yards allowed and 1st in points allowed.

In '04 they were 9th in yards and second in points.

They also had good offensive teams those years, but they had really good defenses.

slim
11-02-2011, 06:00 PM
North makes a good point though, Slim. Even the teams built with great defenses don't have staying power unless they also have a franchise QB.

We have to figure out both problems obviously, but a defense will need several picks and FAs to build while we can possibly solve our franchise QB problem with one draft pick. And the strength of the QB crop in this upcoming draft combined with our likely high draft position means we have to make that move this time.

People think I'm crazy but I still believe we have an outside shot at Luck.

Yeah, I agree with his main point.

The teams that compete consistently have really good QBs.

smith49
11-02-2011, 07:27 PM
I'm nit sure of the stats, but as I recall our own broncos didn't have great D's when they won SB's. We did however have a HOF qb and a stellar O altogether. I think our D was good, but not great. Just sayin.

chazoe60
11-02-2011, 07:42 PM
I'm nit sure of the stats, but as I recall our own broncos didn't have great D's when they won SB's. We did however have a HOF qb and a stellar O altogether. I think our D was good, but not great. Just sayin.

I don't think the stats or rankings were necessarily representative of how good those defenses actually were. Remember, our offense was so good that we were usually blowing teams out by the fourth quarter and it's just the nature of the game for a defense in that situation to breathe a little and let up a bit.

Those defenses were actually very good. They were opportunistic and aggressive as Hell.

Nick
11-02-2011, 07:54 PM
It's funny that out of all these years we needed to address the D-line and now that we need to address QB... We will address D-line. :laugh:

I Eat Staples
11-02-2011, 08:11 PM
In '03 they were 7th in yards allowed and 1st in points allowed.

In '04 they were 9th in yards and second in points.

They also had good offensive teams those years, but they had really good defenses.

Hm, I stand corrected. I just don't remember their defenses ever being dominant, but I guess that's because their offense stole the spotlight.

Ravage!!!
11-02-2011, 10:45 PM
Good Offenses help defenses. Scoring first, pressuring the other team to try to keep up with you... sustaining long drives.... putting points on the board......

Give me a stud offense over trying to build a defense that can make up for an average offense, ANYTIME...and I'll win more trophies.

BroncoStud
11-02-2011, 11:22 PM
We have to pick a QB in the first round bud. After that we can go ahead and pick defense. But we can't let the talent at QB in this draft slip by.

Like it or not in today's NFL you do not win without a franchise QB.

If we don't get Luck then why would we pick a QB in round 1? The rest are marginal NFL starters...

Why not grab a QB in the later rounds and build the offensive and defensive lines with those early picks?

I'm all onboard with selling the farm for Luck though, he's head and shoulders better than any other QB in college football.

Ravage!!!
11-02-2011, 11:25 PM
If we don't get Luck then why would we pick a QB in round 1? The rest are marginal NFL starters...

Why not grab a QB in the later rounds and build the offensive and defensive lines with those early picks?

I'm all onboard with selling the farm for Luck though, he's head and shoulders better than any other QB in college football.

Because its a pretty good QB class.... but it all depends on the BPA.

Generally speaking, you don't build your franchise around a QB taken OUT of the first round. It happens, but its much more rare. If we TRULY are looking to get our future QB in the draft... then our first pick should be the QB position.

BroncoStud
11-02-2011, 11:31 PM
Because its a pretty good QB class.... but it all depends on the BPA.

Generally speaking, you don't build your franchise around a QB taken OUT of the first round. It happens, but its much more rare. If we TRULY are looking to get our future QB in the draft... then our first pick should be the QB position.

Only if it's the right guy. Barkley isn't close to a sure thing. Jones is a spread QB who folds in big games. Lindley isn't much more accurate than Tebow and less athletic. Foles isn't that good.

My point is that you can probably get guys like Ryan T. from A&M and RG III in the 2nd - 4th rounds... There is not much of a drop off from Barkley/Jones to those guys - IF ANY.

A guy that everyone overlooks who is an absolute stud is Brandon Weeden. He's a bit older but he is a great QB who can make all the throws. You can probably and him in the 3rd round and build your offensive line and defensive line in the 1st 2 rounds.

My ultimate point is that there is Andrew Luck, and then there are a bunch of QBs who can be forgotten. Luck is that much better than the rest. The other guys are not worth a high 1st. I hope that Elway agrees, I really do.

Ravage!!!
11-02-2011, 11:40 PM
Only if it's the right guy. Barkley isn't close to a sure thing. Jones is a spread QB who folds in big games. Lindley isn't much more accurate than Tebow and less athletic. Foles isn't that good.

My point is that you can probably get guys like Ryan T. from A&M and RG III in the 2nd - 4th rounds... There is not much of a drop off from Barkley/Jones to those guys - IF ANY.

A guy that everyone overlooks who is an absolute stud is Brandon Weeden. He's a bit older but he is a great QB who can make all the throws. You can probably and him in the 3rd round and build your offensive line and defensive line in the 1st 2 rounds.

My ultimate point is that there is Andrew Luck, and then there are a bunch of QBs who can be forgotten. Luck is that much better than the rest. The other guys are not worth a high 1st. I hope that Elway agrees, I really do.

Thats your opinion on them, but that doesn't make them facts.

The point is, if the Broncos feel that one of the top QBs is capable of being a frachise QB, then we absolutely take him in the first round. You just don't take QBs in the second round (generally) to be your franchise QB. If they are good enough to be your franchise QB, you take them in the first round. If they are NOT 1st round material, then they usually are not considered FQB material.

So the question is, why do you draft a guy in the second round that you don't feel is capable of being your FQB? A team that is as void as we are, it doesn't make sense to use a top pick on a QB you dont' feel is going to be your franchise for 10 years. Even if they are wrong with the particular player taken, the smart choice is taking a top QB in the first round.

BroncoStud
11-02-2011, 11:47 PM
You draft a guy in the 2nd round because he isn't much worse than the guys everyone else will be drafting in the 1st round.

Can you say with confidence that Landry Jones will be better than Case Keenum? Can you say with confidence that Matt Barkley will be better than RG III? There are plenty of other QBs who won't go in round 1 that have talent.

Andrew Luck is as close to a sure thing as it gets. He warrants the top pick. Everyone else has glaring weaknesses in their games.

Denver has too many holes to fill on this roster to waste in on a 1st round QB who doesn't pan out. If you're going to do that you might as well trade for Luck and give up some draft picks to do so, if possible.

jhildebrand
11-03-2011, 12:27 AM
We have to pick a QB in the first round bud. After that we can go ahead and pick defense. But we can't let the talent at QB in this draft slip by.

Like it or not in today's NFL you do not win without a franchise QB.

Ryan Fitzpatrick and Alex Smith say :hi:

dogfish
11-03-2011, 12:31 AM
Ryan Fitzpatrick and Alex Smith say :hi:

not sure how alex smith dis-proves his point, as he was a number one overall pick. . .

Lancane
11-03-2011, 01:10 AM
Next year, I do not give a crap about Luck or any QB. Every pick needs o be Defense and more Defense.

Yeah because defenses win championships right?

That ship set sail long ago, most of the teams who've won in the last decade or so had better offenses then defenses.

I'd rather they wasted the whole draft on offense, to waste it on defense with the shit we're seeing would be the dumbest F'n thing since hiring McDaniels...and that's pretty dumb!

rcsodak
11-03-2011, 07:01 AM
If we don't get Luck then why would we pick a QB in round 1? The rest are marginal NFL starters...

Why not grab a QB in the later rounds and build the offensive and defensive lines with those early picks?

I'm all onboard with selling the farm for Luck though, he's head and shoulders better than any other QB in college football.
Thats what they were saying about Leaf.

LOL

No player is a "can't miss".

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chazoe60
11-03-2011, 07:05 AM
Thats what they were saying about Leaf.


Link?

CrazyHorse
11-03-2011, 08:31 AM
in fairness, new england also had the other team's gameplan. . .

In fairness Pittsburgh had some questionable calls go there way.

BroncoStud
11-03-2011, 09:07 AM
Thats what they were saying about Leaf.

LOL

No player is a "can't miss".

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Leaf had major character flaws, Luck does not appear to. BIG difference. Besides, Leaf wasn't even the top pick in the draft. :elefant:

rcsodak
11-03-2011, 11:10 AM
Link?
Lol

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echobravo
11-03-2011, 03:45 PM
Seems that the gist of this thread is that we should put all our chips in the prayer of getting a "franchise" QB at the expense of the team. Might as well resurrect Don Coryell and have him coach the team.

DILLIGAF?