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View Full Version : Denver open to trading Orton to Oakland



Lancane
10-18-2011, 05:38 AM
According to Mike Klis of the Denver Post, the Broncos are open to trading Orton to their division rivals–as long as they receive what they want in return.

http://www.yardbarker.com/nfl/articles/msn/report_broncos_willing_to_trade_kyle_orton_to_raid ers/7471438

TXBRONC
10-18-2011, 06:11 AM
http://www.yardbarker.com/nfl/articles/msn/report_broncos_willing_to_trade_kyle_orton_to_raid ers/7471438

I have no problem with it but I think they should not give any ground on what they want for him.

Lancane
10-18-2011, 06:29 AM
I have no problem with it but I think they should not give any ground on what they want for him.

That would be monumentally stupid IMHO TX, they might be the only suitors and Denver can ill afford to play hardball. Oakland already gave up their 3rd round pick for Terrelle Pryor in the Supplemental Draft, they traded away their 2nd, 4th and 7th round picks as well; all they have is their 1st, 5th and 6th round picks remaining. They're not in the best position to bargain, that's why I said Michael Bush would be an entertaining prospect in regards to a trade.

We'll not get a compensatory pick with the loss of Orton cause he was benched so early in the season, he'll not be regarded as a starter. So we might as well unload him for whatever they can get, not to mention it saves the team about 5 million dollars.

BFI
10-18-2011, 06:52 AM
I know Orton has been discussed as a possible trade option...but there is one QB that no one seems to even think about-Brady Quinn. He also leaves as a free agent at the end of the season.

Of course, there may be a reason no one is thinking about Quinn :heh:

HORSEPOWER 56
10-18-2011, 06:57 AM
I know Orton has been discussed as a possible trade option...but there is one QB that no one seems to even think about-Brady Quinn. He also leaves as a free agent at the end of the season.

Of course, there may be a reason no one is thinking about Quinn :heh:

We have a 3rd round pick going to Cleveland riding on Brady Quinn if he gets X amount of snaps. I wonder if we traded him to someone else if he gets the snaps there if we still owe Cleveland a 3rd or if they do or just the 6th we already owe them? I have no idea how that will work. Perhaps that's why nobody is inquiring about Quinn? If that is the case, Quinn would be even harder to trade than Orton and his ridiculous contract...

:whoknows:

Lancane
10-18-2011, 06:57 AM
I know Orton has been discussed as a possible trade option...but there is one QB that no one seems to even think about-Brady Quinn. He also leaves as a free agent at the end of the season.

Of course, there may be a reason no one is thinking about Quinn :heh:

Quinn hasn't started a game in a long while which has diminished his trade value to almost nothing. Orton on the other hand is a game removed from being the starter and quite frankly I think Denver would like to unload him, not just his contract but away from the locker room as well.

Oakland has supposedly been in talks with the Lions about backup Shaun Hill, but Orton is without question a better option. And I don't see Denver being stodgy about the price tag either, Oakland would be stupid to not even inquire about him over Hill.

Krugan
10-18-2011, 07:12 AM
Think Oakland has cap issues and Orton wont fit, I have no link there, but think that is what I heard on ESPN last night.

Juriga72
10-18-2011, 07:16 AM
How bad is it that Oakland who has beat Orton 3 straight games.... wants him.
LOL

Agent of Orange
10-18-2011, 07:29 AM
That would be monumentally stupid IMHO TX, they might be the only suitors and Denver can ill afford to play hardball. Oakland already gave up their 3rd round pick for Terrelle Pryor in the Supplemental Draft, they traded away their 2nd, 4th and 7th round picks as well; all they have is their 1st, 5th and 6th round picks remaining. They're not in the best position to bargain, that's why I said Michael Bush would be an entertaining prospect in regards to a trade.

We'll not get a compensatory pick with the loss of Orton cause he was benched so early in the season, he'll not be regarded as a starter. So we might as well unload him for whatever they can get, not to mention it saves the team about 5 million dollars.

It doesnt have to be a pick from 2012. It could be a pick from 2013.

Tned
10-18-2011, 08:02 AM
That would be monumentally stupid IMHO TX, they might be the only suitors and Denver can ill afford to play hardball. Oakland already gave up their 3rd round pick for Terrelle Pryor in the Supplemental Draft, they traded away their 2nd, 4th and 7th round picks as well; all they have is their 1st, 5th and 6th round picks remaining. They're not in the best position to bargain, that's why I said Michael Bush would be an entertaining prospect in regards to a trade.

We'll not get a compensatory pick with the loss of Orton cause he was benched so early in the season, he'll not be regarded as a starter. So we might as well unload him for whatever they can get, not to mention it saves the team about 5 million dollars.

5th or 6th is likely all you would get unless a team was both in the hunt and desperate. Before the season, it was said the Broncos were asking too much in a 2nd or 3rd, and reportedly Miami was willing to give a third. We are no six games into the season and Orton played himself out of a job.

Tned
10-18-2011, 09:07 AM
Jay Glazer reporting.


RT @JayGlazer: The Raiders & Bengals are close to a trade that would send Carson Palmer to OAK for a first-rounder in 2012 and a conditional pick in future. The trade is expected to be completed by deadline. Hue Jackson has a close relationship w Mike Brown and really worked to get Brown to budge

Buff
10-18-2011, 09:08 AM
Orton is untradeable. The speculation is silly.

Tned
10-18-2011, 09:10 AM
Orton is untradeable. The speculation is silly.

Isn't speculation silly by definition?

Yep, in the new age, Internet pseudo dictionary, definition seven is:

7. Silly and wasteful use of time.

vandammage13
10-18-2011, 09:11 AM
When are people going to get it through their heads that nobody wants Orton?

5 Veteran QB's were chosen over him in the last offseason, not to mention a team that felt they were better off going with a rookie redhead.

Now Oakland would rather spend a 1st rounder on a 30+ old QB who hasn't played this year than to spend a 5th or 6th rounder on Orton.

Buff
10-18-2011, 09:12 AM
Isn't speculation silly by definition?

Yep, in the new age, Internet pseudo dictionary, definition seven is:

7. Silly and wasteful use of time.

Fair enough. But seriously, fans are delusional sometimes. What GM in their right mind would take on Orton's salary after his performance this year AND give up a draft pick for him? I wouldn't even trade a long snapper for Orton if I were an opposing GM. Not at his current salary (Thanks, McD).

vandammage13
10-18-2011, 09:19 AM
Fair enough. But seriously, fans are delusional sometimes. What GM in their right mind would take on Orton's salary after his performance this year AND give up a draft pick for him? I wouldn't even trade a long snapper for Orton if I were an opposing GM. Not at his current salary (Thanks, McD).

Orton's 1 year extension is the gift from McD that keeps on giving.

MileHighCrew
10-18-2011, 09:21 AM
Orton's 1 year extension is the gift from McD that keeps on giving.

by this time next year he will be forgotten and the Broncos will have moved on. :beer:

Tned
10-18-2011, 09:26 AM
Fair enough. But seriously, fans are delusional sometimes. What GM in their right mind would take on Orton's salary after his performance this year AND give up a draft pick for him? I wouldn't even trade a long snapper for Orton if I were an opposing GM. Not at his current salary (Thanks, McD).

Sometimes? There was some talk in the offseason that we could/should get a first for Orton? Delusional doesn't come close to covering it up.

TXBRONC
10-18-2011, 09:42 AM
That would be monumentally stupid IMHO TX, they might be the only suitors and Denver can ill afford to play hardball. Oakland already gave up their 3rd round pick for Terrelle Pryor in the Supplemental Draft, they traded away their 2nd, 4th and 7th round picks as well; all they have is their 1st, 5th and 6th round picks remaining. They're not in the best position to bargain, that's why I said Michael Bush would be an entertaining prospect in regards to a trade.

We'll not get a compensatory pick with the loss of Orton cause he was benched so early in the season, he'll not be regarded as a starter. So we might as well unload him for whatever they can get, not to mention it saves the team about 5 million dollars.

I didn't say it should be a first round pick Orton isn't worth a first round pick. I knew they didn't have many picks coming up in 2012. I wouldn't let them get away give us picks for 2013 that's just to far away imo. If Michael Bush was in the conversation that changes the dynamics but I'm not so sure they would be willing to part with him. Also I think Denver wants picks not players.

That aside it looks like Oakland is going to get done with Cincinnati.

Juriga72
10-18-2011, 10:27 AM
Too late for Orton....LOL

Cugel
10-18-2011, 12:31 PM
The details of the Raiders/Bengals trade. Wow. Just wow. The ghost of Al Davis lives on. Broncos fans should be happy about this as it screws the Raiders. They just gave up potentially TWO #1 picks for a 31 year old QB with diminishing skills and questionable arm strength. :eek:


Raiders acquired QB Carson Palmer from the Bengals in exchange for a first-round pick in 2012 and a conditional first-round pick in 2013.
For once, owner Mike Brown's stubbornness paid off. The Bengals land a king's ransom for a player that was essentially no longer part of their organization. (http://www.rotoworld.com/teams/nfl/oak/oakland-raiders?pos=)Palmer is now reunited with Hue Jackson, who was an assistant in Cincy from 2004-06. Although Palmer's arm strength and mobility declined sharply in his final days with the Bengals, he'll be an immediate and significant upgrade on Kyle Boller. It also means that Jason Campbell, set to become a free agent after this season, is likely gone. Palmer's name is worth more than his game. . . .Expect the offense to remain decidedly run-heavy.


If the Raiders don't get a playoff win, the 2013 pick will be a second-rounder. They get the 2012 first-round pick regardless. Either way, it's an exceedingly high pricetag for a quarterback that was a shell of the Pro Bowl player he once was when last seen on the field. In 2010, Palmer threw 26 touchdowns against 20 interceptions and his arm strength was a major liability.

I don't see how this is a good move for the Raiders. They would have been better off giving up a 5th or 6th rounder for Kyle Orton, and then re-signing Jason Campbell back in 2012. Apparently the prospect of 2 #1s swayed the Bengals owner who was inclined to let Palmer sit out the season and trade him next year (when he would certainly not have gotten 2 #1's!

I'm amazed at the Raiders stupidity on this one.

Even if Palmer comes in and helps them immediately, he's an aging veteran -- definitely NOT worth 2 1st round draft picks! On the other hand, the way the Raiders waste their draft picks perhaps he is. But, this leaves them almost totally without any top picks for the next two years. They'd better hope they have a SB team already assembled because they won't be able to improve themselves much via the draft over the next 3 years!

Of course if the Raiders don't make the playoffs the Bengals only get a SECOND rounder in 2013. Still a very bad trade. Unless Palmer has found an anti-aging pill and can get back to the form of 2005 it just ain't worth it!

vandammage13
10-18-2011, 12:35 PM
The details of the Raiders/Bengals trade. Wow. Just wow. The ghost of Al Davis lives on. Broncos fans should be happy about this as it screws the Raiders. They just gave up potentially TWO #1 picks for a 31 year old QB with diminishing skills and questionable arm strength. :eek:





I don't see how this is a good move for the Raiders. Apparently the prospect of 2 #1s swayed the Bengals owner who was inclined to let Palmer sit out the season and trade him next year. I'm amazed at the Raiders stupidity on this one.

Even if Palmer comes in and helps them immediately, he's an aging veteran -- definitely NOT worth 2 1st round draft picks! On the other hand, the way the Raiders waste their draft picks perhaps he is. But, this leaves them almost totally without any top picks for the next two years. They'd better hope they have a SB team already assembled because they won't be able to improve themselves much via the draft over the next 3 years!

Good post...

I can see the Raiders making a short-lived run with their current squad, similar to what they did in the early 2000's with Rich Gannon and then slip back into years of ineptitude since they have no draft picks to keep building their team.

jhildebrand
10-18-2011, 12:37 PM
Orton's NFL value is close to flat lining.

PADDLES! PADDLES!

Juriga72
10-18-2011, 12:39 PM
Good post...

I can see the Raiders making a short-lived run with their current squad, similar to what they did in the early 2000's with Rich Gannon and then slip back into years of ineptitude since they have no draft picks to keep building their team.

The best part is that they had a chacne to pick up Orton for almost nothing and didn't want him...LMAO

Man.... We wont get even ONE Rocky Mountain Oyster for Kyle now....

T.K.O.
10-18-2011, 12:45 PM
the raiders will get compensetory picks next year for namdi...probably a 3rd and i think they may get a couple more for some other moves.
but WOW if it turns out to be 2 firsts.......combined with the Jmarshmellow deal...they seem to be digging a pretty deep "black" hole:laugh:

BroncoStud
10-18-2011, 12:53 PM
That's a seriously horrible trade for the Raiders and a great one for the Bengals. That's simply amazing... I wouldn't think that Palmer would fetch more than a 2nd rounder, but it's possible he brings 2 firsts????

Damn the Raiders are incompetent. All this while Jason Campbell is playing the best ball of his career for them.

HammeredOut
10-18-2011, 01:12 PM
That's a seriously horrible trade for the Raiders and a great one for the Bengals. That's simply amazing... I wouldn't think that Palmer would fetch more than a 2nd rounder, but it's possible he brings 2 firsts????

Damn the Raiders are incompetent. All this while Jason Campbell is playing the best ball of his career for them.


He was on pace to pass for 3000 yards, hardly the best ball in anybody's career at this stage of the NFL.

Cugel
10-18-2011, 01:15 PM
Good post...

I can see the Raiders making a short-lived run with their current squad, similar to what they did in the early 2000's with Rich Gannon and then slip back into years of ineptitude since they have no draft picks to keep building their team.


Oakland already gave up their 3rd round pick for Terrelle Pryor in the Supplemental Draft, they traded away their 2nd, 4th and 7th round picks as well; all they have is their 1st, 5th and 6th round picks remaining.

So now with their #1 pick gone, the Raiders have only a 3rd and 5th and 6th rounder in 2012, plus their 2nd and later round picks in 2013. When you do that it creates a giant hole in your team in a few years time when those 3rd and 4th year players should be coming in to replace aging veterans -- only they aren't there.

That's a big part of the reason why the Broncos went 4-12 last year and suck so bad this year. Mike Shanahan ignored defense for years, then went heavy on the D-line in 2007. But, his picks Jarvis Moss (for a 1st and 3rd), plus Tim Crowder were both total busts. Four years later they are both gone.

Here's a breakdown of the Broncos defensive picks in recent drafts. You can see from this why they suck. These players SHOULD be the backbone of the current team. All should be in their prime and starting and contributing (if you want to have a good team that is):

2005
DB Darrent Williams 2nd
DB Karl Paymah 3rd
DB Dominique Foxworth 3rd

None remains on the roster: Williams, killed, Paymah a bust and Foxworth traded. Meanwhile CB is a serious need in 2012.

2006
DE ELvis Dumervil 4th.

One bright spot on defense the last 5 years.

2007
DE Jarvis Moss (1st AND a 3rd)
DE Tim Crowder 2nd
DT Marcus Thomas (4th)

Considering that the Broncos gave up #21 and a 3rd rounder move up and get him at #17, Moss was (at present) the worst draft pick in Broncos history. Crowder was just a bust. Thomas has been mediocre but forced into the lineup due to injury.

SEVEN players drafted and only 2 are on the roster 6 years later. And only one is a starter.

2008
CB Jack Williams (4th)
DT Carlton Powell (5th)
DB Josh Barrett (7th)

Gone, gone, gone. This was the year Shanahan desperately needed to improve his defense, but instead he waited until the 4th round to take a DB who turned out to be a bust.

Beginning of the end of Shanahan.

2009
DE Robert Ayers 1st (instead of Clay Matthews)
DB Alphonso Smith (2nd)
DB Darcel McBath (2nd -- traded a 1st rounder in 2010 for him then dumped him for nothing in 2010)

Horrible. Just horrible drafting.

2010
DB Perish Cox (5th)
DB Syd'Quan Thompson (7th)
DE Jammie Kirlew (7th)

With the his defense last in the NFL McMoron waits until the 5th round to draft a bust of a DB. You can't blame the others for being wash-outs. You don't expect 7th rounders to make the roster let alone start.

That in a nutshell is how the Broncos fell to 4-12 and are 1-4 now.

Instead of building through the draft the Broncos threw away picks, ignored weaknesses, and generally screwed up their chances.

Expect the long-term decline of the Raiders to continue with this Palmer trade. You can't just give up that many picks.

Cugel
10-18-2011, 01:22 PM
He was on pace to pass for 3000 yards, hardly the best ball in anybody's career at this stage of the NFL.

Considering how much they run the ball, that's not too shabby. :coffee:

Everybody knows Campbell is a limited QB much like Orton. But, they didn't need him to be great, just hand the ball off to Darren McFadden and throw an occasional play-action pass. And he could do that well and did.

They were successful with him in there and you shouldn't underestimate him. That is one solid Raiders team.

And they should be better with Palmer, they just mortgaged their future to get him. He'd better win now because this Raiders team isn't going to be improving with the passage of time.

Lancane
10-18-2011, 01:45 PM
Think Oakland has cap issues and Orton wont fit, I have no link there, but think that is what I heard on ESPN last night.


NFL Network insider Jason La Canfora, citing multiple sources with knowledge of the situation, reports that the deal is not complete as Palmer still is working through contract issues with the Bengals. Palmer has four years and $50 million left on his current contract and stands to earn $11.5 million in 2011.

That's funny, they can't afford Orton...have you seen Palmer's price tag? Orton's a thrifty in comparison.

:lol:

hotcarl
10-18-2011, 01:59 PM
So now with their #1 pick gone, the Raiders have only a 3rd and 5th and 6th rounder in 2012, plus their 2nd and later round picks in 2013. When you do that it creates a giant hole in your team in a few years time when those 3rd and 4th year players should be coming in to replace aging veterans -- only they aren't there.

That's a big part of the reason why the Broncos went 4-12 last year and suck so bad this year. Mike Shanahan ignored defense for years, then went heavy on the D-line in 2007. But, his picks Jarvis Moss (for a 1st and 3rd), plus Tim Crowder were both total busts. Four years later they are both gone.

Here's a breakdown of the Broncos defensive picks in recent drafts. You can see from this why they suck. These players SHOULD be the backbone of the current team. All should be in their prime and starting and contributing (if you want to have a good team that is):

2005
DB Darrent Williams 2nd
DB Karl Paymah 3rd
DB Dominique Foxworth 3rd

None remains on the roster: Williams, killed, Paymah a bust and Foxworth traded. Meanwhile CB is a serious need in 2012.

2006
DE ELvis Dumervil 4th.

One bright spot on defense the last 5 years.

2007
DE Jarvis Moss (1st AND a 3rd)
DE Tim Crowder 2nd
DT Marcus Thomas (4th)

Considering that the Broncos gave up #21 and a 3rd rounder move up and get him at #17, Moss was (at present) the worst draft pick in Broncos history. Crowder was just a bust. Thomas has been mediocre but forced into the lineup due to injury.

SEVEN players drafted and only 2 are on the roster 6 years later. And only one is a starter.

2008
CB Jack Williams (4th)
DT Carlton Powell (5th)
DB Josh Barrett (7th)

Gone, gone, gone. This was the year Shanahan desperately needed to improve his defense, but instead he waited until the 4th round to take a DB who turned out to be a bust.

Beginning of the end of Shanahan.

2009
DE Robert Ayers 1st (instead of Clay Matthews)
DB Alphonso Smith (2nd)
DB Darcel McBath (2nd -- traded a 1st rounder in 2010 for him then dumped him for nothing in 2010)

Horrible. Just horrible drafting.

2010
DB Perish Cox (5th)
DB Syd'Quan Thompson (7th)
DE Jammie Kirlew (7th)

With the his defense last in the NFL McMoron waits until the 5th round to draft a bust of a DB. You can't blame the others for being wash-outs. You don't expect 7th rounders to make the roster let alone start.

That in a nutshell is how the Broncos fell to 4-12 and are 1-4 now.

Instead of building through the draft the Broncos threw away picks, ignored weaknesses, and generally screwed up their chances.

Expect the long-term decline of the Raiders to continue with this Palmer trade. You can't just give up that many picks.

didnt read a word

BroncoStud
10-18-2011, 02:01 PM
He was on pace to pass for 3000 yards, hardly the best ball in anybody's career at this stage of the NFL.

Ah, more stats. How about taking into consideration how much they run the football... :elefant:

BroncoStud
10-18-2011, 02:01 PM
didnt read a word

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

Me either.

NightTerror218
10-18-2011, 02:53 PM
I hope for a last minute deal since Palmer needs to take physical and all first and he needs to work out contract......please

Northman
10-18-2011, 02:56 PM
I hope for a last minute deal since Palmer needs to take physical and all first and he needs to work out contract......please

Dont hold your breathe. :lol:

Shazam!
10-18-2011, 02:58 PM
...Oakland briefly considered trading for Kyle Orton (notes), according to the source, but quickly concluded he wasn’t worth even a fourth-round pick.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AtQQ7gOOgyEchxeCYVYk6MRDubYF?slug=jc-cole_carson_palmer_trade_oakland_raiders_101811


LOL how sad.

chazoe60
10-18-2011, 03:04 PM
So Palmer is worth two firsts and Orton isn't even worth a fourth.

Yeah, and some Bronco fans actually were saying we shouldn't accept anything less than a second for the loser. :laugh:

The rest of the league knows exactly what Orton is. Unfortunately we get to be the last team dumb enough to start his pathetic ass, and we did it for 2+ years.

Ravage!!!
10-18-2011, 03:06 PM
I hope for a last minute deal since Palmer needs to take physical and all first and he needs to work out contract......please

The Raiders weren't willing to give up a fourth for Orton...yet spent 2 firsts on Palmer. I dont think anything will be worked out.

dogfish
10-18-2011, 03:07 PM
chaze, you should build an orton museum in your back yard so you can piss on it every morning. . . :laugh:


i think you're actually going to miss him more than any other bronco fan besides top. . .

chazoe60
10-18-2011, 03:08 PM
chaze, you should build an orton museum in your back yard so you can piss on it every morning. . . :laugh:


i think you're actually going to miss him more than any other bronco fan besides top. . .

I'm going to have to find another player to hate. You got any suggestions.

Magnificent Seven
10-18-2011, 03:11 PM
Trade Orton to the Vikings for McNabb.

McNabb is a good mobile-quarterback. He could be a great mentor for Tim Tebow.

dogfish
10-18-2011, 03:12 PM
I'm going to have to find another player to hate. You got any suggestions.

go big-- go for brian xanders or joe ellis, and quit wasting time on the symptoms. . . ;)

hotcarl
10-18-2011, 03:16 PM
I'm going to have to find another player to hate. You got any suggestions.

joe mays

Lancane
10-18-2011, 03:39 PM
I'm going to have to find another player to hate. You got any suggestions.

Won't have to worry about that, if Tebow starts looking like Michael Vick or worse Vincent Young, then I don't think this board will be able to contain your seething hatred, nor my own for that matter.

LTC Pain
10-18-2011, 04:24 PM
Trade Orton to the Vikings for McNabb.

McNabb is a good mobile-quarterback. He could be a great mentor for Tim Tebow.

Oh, hell no! :tsk:

NightTerror218
10-18-2011, 04:27 PM
Dont hold your breathe. :lol:

oops....passed out