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View Full Version : Is Slowik the worst coordinator we've ever had?



lex
12-27-2008, 05:43 PM
I dont remember a coordinator thats ever been picked apart to this degree. I also dont remember a unit being this bad for the duration of any coordinators stint in Denver. Can anyone think of a coordinator, offense or defense that has been worse than Slowik? I dont really remember the bar being lowered this much.

Requiem / The Dagda
12-27-2008, 06:44 PM
Can we just call this guy a loser turd and it be done with?

Tned
12-27-2008, 06:47 PM
Have you forgotten Bates already? Let's not forget that Slowick inherited some of his mess.

Requiem / The Dagda
12-27-2008, 06:52 PM
Bates wasn't exactly dealt a steady hand of talent either, not for what he wanted to do. Slowik has been a turd his whole career. A-Class Turd.

lex
12-27-2008, 07:24 PM
Have you forgotten Bates already? Let's not forget that Slowick inherited some of his mess.

The explanation from Shanahan was that the talent on the team lined up more with Slowiks philosophy. Shanahan wanted Bates to adapt but refused to deviate from his system. Thats what Ive heard. I would say thats more a reflection of Shanahans impatience than Bates' incompetence. Plus lets not forget, the offense wasnt as good the first half of last year. There were a lot of yards but not a lot of TDs to show for it. Bates didnt have the benefit of being helped by this years offense. But getting back to what youre saying, what Slowik inherited was a team whose attributes fit his own...plus he has had the support of the players.

lex
12-27-2008, 07:25 PM
Can we just call this guy a loser turd and it be done with?

I have...along with several other things.

WARHORSE
12-27-2008, 07:37 PM
I think Slowick was a cost cutting move.............lol

Den21vsBal19
12-27-2008, 07:41 PM
The explanation from Shanahan was that the talent on the team lined up more with Slowiks philosophy. Shanahan wanted Bates to adapt but refused to deviate from his system. Thats what Ive heard. I would say thats more a reflection of Shanahans impatience than Bates' incompetence. Plus lets not forget, the offense wasnt as good the first half of last year. There were a lot of yards but not a lot of TDs to show for it. Bates didnt have the benefit of being helped by this years offense. But getting back to what youre saying, what Slowik inherited was a team whose attributes fit his own...plus he has had the support of the players.
You mean he has a philosophy?!?!?!!? :eek:

Other than rolling out the red carpet, and a one-man mission to make every QB look like Joe Cool, and every RB the reincarnation of Sweetness?

OK, we've never be known for our D, but seriously, have we ever been this bad before? :mad:

lex
12-27-2008, 07:46 PM
You mean he has a philosophy?!?!?!!? :eek:

Other than rolling out the red carpet, and a one-man mission to make every QB look like Joe Cool, and every RB the reincarnation of Sweetness?

OK, we've never be known for our D, but seriously, have we ever been this bad before? :mad:

http://www.dack.com/archive/bob-slowik-must-be-fired.html



Bob Slowik Must Be Fired

On January 16, 2004 Green Bay Packers coach Mike Sherman fired defensive coordinator Ed Donatell, making him the official scapegoat for his team's 4th-and-26 meltdown against the Philadelphia Eagles in the Packers' 20-17 loss of last year's NFC divisional playoff game.

To replace Donatell, Sherman promoted defensive backs coach Bob Slowik.

Slowik, who previously coordinated middling defenses in Chicago and Cleveland, drew up a high-pressure, high-risk, blitz-heavy scheme that was to be the identity of the 2004 Packers defense. After giving up 5 TD passes in the first half vs. Indianapolis in Week 3, his scheme was abandoned. Still, his defense gave up 5 TD passes in the first half in Week 13 against Philadelphia.
But twice giving up 5 TD passes in the first half is not why Bob Slowik must be fired. Nor is it his glaring lack of takeaways, or the insanely high opponents' passer rating. No. Bob Slowik must be fired because he schemed a defense that set many records -- in a bad way -- in the history of the Packer franchise.

Bob Slowik All-Time Records
Bob Slowik's defense is one for the history books. In a really, really bad way.

Record Slowik
Record Broken
Record
Fewest Opponent Turnovers, Season 15 16 (1995)
Fewest Passes Intercepted By, Season 8 13 (1980, 1995, 1998)
Fewest Forced Fumbles, Season 11 12 (1995)
Most First Downs Allowed, Passing, Season 228 188 (1995)
Most Yards Allowed, Net Passing, Season 3,943 3,762 (1983)
Most Yards Allowed, Passing, Game 464 448 (2004)
Most TD Allowed Passing, Season 33 31 (1986)
Highest Opponents' Passer Rating, Season 99.1 86.1 (1958)



Close-But-No-Cigar Bob Slowik All-Time Records
Thanks to Rich Wingo, Ezra Johnson, Estes Hood, and Ken Stills, Slowik finished second all-time in these categories:

Record Slowik
Record All-Time
Record
Most First Downs Allowed, Season 354 366 (1983)
Most First Downs Allowed, Penalty, Season 28 29 (2002)
Highest Completion Percentage Allowed, Season 60.6 63.45 (1989)



Likely Bob Slowik All-Time Records
Here are a few other likely records that I could not verify. Please send me an email if you have source info.

Fewest fumbles recovered, season
7. 2nd-lowest in NFL.
Opponents' 3rd down conversion percentage, season
47.3. 2nd-worst in NFL.
Opponents' passing yards/attempt, season
7.61. 4th-worst in NFL.
Opponents' passing yards/completion, season
12.6. 3rd-worst in NFL.
Most passing TDs allowed, first half
5. But you knew that.
Most passing TDs, first half
5. Indianapolis franchise record.
Most passing TDs, first half
5. Philadelphia franchise record.
Most completions, start a game
14. Philadelphia franchise record. Confirmed.
Most passing yards, game
464. Philadelphia franchise record. Confirmed.


Ironically, Shanahan was talking of getting back to an aggressive attacking defense. So much for that. LOL.

LRtagger
12-27-2008, 09:28 PM
This might be the easiest poll I have ever participated in.

Max Power
12-27-2008, 09:38 PM
I believe part of the reason why Slowik calls soft, cookie-cutter schemes is to cover up for our safeties who can't cover and can't be relied on to tackle. Because our safeties are so bad, he has the CB's give the other team's WR's the dreaded 10 yard cushions as a measure to keep the play in front of them as much as possible. That's also why he's so conservative on blitzing, because our safeties cannot be trusted to tackle in the open field nor can they be trusted to help the corners over the top in coverage. Barrett is the only safety that has (and should have) any kind of long-term future with this team, but he's still somewhat raw and untested, which is part of the reason why he hasn't played much. I like his potential going forward but I hope we get someone good to compete with him for a starting spot. As for Slowik, I'm willing to give him a pass for this season simply because of our godawful safeties, but next year, with a legit safety starter or two as well as better overall personnel, there will be no excuses. If our defense is not significantly improved, get him out of here.

LRtagger
12-27-2008, 09:51 PM
I believe part of the reason why Slowik calls soft, cookie-cutter schemes is to cover up for our safeties who can't cover and can't be relied on to tackle. Because our safeties are so bad, he has the CB's give the other team's WR's the dreaded 10 yard cushions as a measure to keep the play in front of them as much as possible. That's also why he's so conservative on blitzing, because our safeties cannot be trusted to tackle in the open field nor can they be trusted to help the corners over the top in coverage. Barrett is the only safety that has (and should have) any kind of long-term future with this team, but he's still somewhat raw and untested, which is part of the reason why he hasn't played much. I like his potential going forward but I hope we get someone good to compete with him for a starting spot. As for Slowik, I'm willing to give him a pass for this season simply because of our godawful safeties, but next year, with a legit safety starter or two as well as better overall personnel, there will be no excuses. If our defense is not significantly improved, get him out of here.

That might be sound in theory, but it doesnt explain the complete collapse in the Buffalo game (or several of the other games this year). We had incredible success in the first quarter. We blitzed like crazy, changed up coverages, and held Buffalo to -2 yards for the entire quarter.

This is with the same safeties, same CBs, same LBs, and same DL that we have had all season long. Then, all of a sudden....for no reason other than the fact that Slowik is a puss and didnt want to give up a big play, we dropped back into soft zones, stopped attacking, rushed only 3 or 4, and let our back 7 stand and wait for the play to get to them...what happened from there on out? Our defense got their tails kicked.

It doesn't take a genius DC with a great track record to figure out what we need to do to win....it doesn't even take a very knowledgable football fan to figure it out...and yet, Slowik can't seem to do anything to fix what is broken...because, HE is what is broken. He is the worst DC this team has ever seen. We could have two cans of refried beans playing safety and half the other DCs in the league could put a better defense on the field than Slowik has the last two years.

Look at the numbers he put up in Green Bay (see Lex's link). He is about to shatter those numbers here in Denver. Neither Denver this year, nor Green Bay in 2004 have bottom of the league talent on D. But there is one thing those two teams do have in common.......

Max Power
12-27-2008, 10:00 PM
That might be sound in theory, but it doesnt explain the complete collapse in the Buffalo game (or several of the other games this year). We had incredible success in the first quarter. We blitzed like crazy, changed up coverages, and held Buffalo to -2 yards for the entire quarter.

This is with the same safeties, same CBs, same LBs, and same DL that we have had all season long. Then, all of a sudden....for no reason other than the fact that Slowik is a puss and didnt want to give up a big play, we dropped back into soft zones, stopped attacking, rushed only 3 or 4, and let our back 7 stand and wait for the play to get to them...what happened from there on out? Our defense got their tails kicked.

It doesn't take a genius DC with a great track record to figure out what we need to do to win....it doesn't even take a very knowledgable football fan to figure it out...and yet, Slowik can't seem to do anything to fix what is broken...because, HE is what is broken. He is the worst DC this team has ever seen. We could have two cans of refried beans playing safety and half the other DCs in the league could put a better defense on the field than Slowik has the last two years.

Look at the numbers he put up in Green Bay (see Lex's link). He is about to shatter those numbers here in Denver. Neither Denver this year, nor Green Bay in 2004 have bottom of the league talent on D. But there is one thing those two teams do have in common.......

I can't argue with any of that. I must admit that pissed me off when we sat back and played soft prevent D from the 2nd quarter on in the Bills game.

I'm all for an upgrade over Slowik, I just don't believe all the problems on defense are his fault (not implying that you or anyone else does, don't get me wrong). There are plenty of candidates out there to replace him and I wouldn't mind at all if he is replaced this offseason. But I'm also fine with giving him another year and better personnel and seeing if that results in a change for the better with his defensive scheming. If it doesn't, then can his ass. Either way is fine with me - I'm easy.

Though I would trade Marquand Manuel for two cans of refried beans...

lex
12-27-2008, 10:15 PM
I believe part of the reason why Slowik calls soft, cookie-cutter schemes is to cover up for our safeties who can't cover and can't be relied on to tackle. Because our safeties are so bad, he has the CB's give the other team's WR's the dreaded 10 yard cushions as a measure to keep the play in front of them as much as possible. That's also why he's so conservative on blitzing, because our safeties cannot be trusted to tackle in the open field nor can they be trusted to help the corners over the top in coverage. Barrett is the only safety that has (and should have) any kind of long-term future with this team, but he's still somewhat raw and untested, which is part of the reason why he hasn't played much. I like his potential going forward but I hope we get someone good to compete with him for a starting spot. As for Slowik, I'm willing to give him a pass for this season simply because of our godawful safeties, but next year, with a legit safety starter or two as well as better overall personnel, there will be no excuses. If our defense is not significantly improved, get him out of here.

That was actually the explanation given in one of the papers. But it doesnt work. Too many 10 yard cushions on 3rd and 5 for that to hold water. Also, if safeties are your weakness, you expose yourself to more risk by setting back,... unless your DC is incapable of scheming pressure if he needs to. If your safeties are awful, the best way to make them look better is by bringing pressure and forcing the QB into bad decisions. By making it easy on the QB, you expose your safeties more...you let the QB dictate terms.

Skinny
12-27-2008, 10:45 PM
Larry Coyer. He put grey hairs on head for 4 years. I'll never forgive him for that.

Last years defense was the worst i've ever seen though.

Tned
12-27-2008, 11:01 PM
Larry Coyer. He put grey hairs on head for 4 years. I'll never forgive him for that.

Last years defense was the worst i've ever seen though.

I agree.

I know it is tradition to consider the 'current' D coordinator in Denver to be the worst of all time, but I think that at times people forget that it was a questionable defensive squad (talent wise) that started the year, with two sub-mediocre safeties, a career special teamer at MLB, and a line highly criticized by the fans leading up to the season opener.

Add to the pre-season talent questions, the many injuries, which at one point had our entire linebacking core on the sideline, no pressure from the D-line like usual, Elvis a no show, and a new safety being used nearly every week to try and get 'something' out of that position, and I think it is a pretty big reach to call Slowick the worst D coordinator Denver has had.

underrated29
12-27-2008, 11:41 PM
hard to say. Since the superbowl years, all of our defenses have BLOWN BALLS against the pass. It wasnt until last year and this year that we decided to give up the run too.

As much as i dont like slow his scheme fits us better than any 2 gap but really 1 gap scheme with out DE lined almost to the hash marks that bates gave us.

Still, i think slows compete inability to cover tight on 3rd and 5, or not even line up on Steve F'ing Smith gives him the medal of Dishonor. He honestly cannot adjust, or , or......Hell i dont know, but he is the worst by far.

I had high hopes for him too.

Lonestar
12-28-2008, 12:00 AM
Slowick has never had good defenses reagrdless of talent..

BTW did he have a hand in aquiring said talent this year VIA FAgency?? I'm guessing that mikey did not pull those safeties out of thin air that BOOB had a say in it being the "great DB" coach..

He needs to go ASAP

LoyalSoldier
12-28-2008, 12:14 AM
Larry Coyer. He put grey hairs on head for 4 years. I'll never forgive him for that.

Last years defense was the worst i've ever seen though.

While he did give us heart burn, at least his defenses could produce stops and turnovers every so often.

BroncoTech
12-28-2008, 01:38 AM
I'd say fire him Monday and let the new guy in early. A 28th ranked defense can't get much worse so there's very little risk in this. We are predictable and we have a total lack of defense generated turnovers. Last year and this year the defense has looked the worst I've ever seen it. Perhaps you've heard they line up 10 yards off the WR's. It's true and they never tighten up.

Foochacho
12-28-2008, 01:42 PM
I'd say fire him Monday and let the new guy in early. A 28th ranked defense can't get much worse so there's very little risk in this. We are predictable and we have a total lack of defense generated turnovers. Last year and this year the defense has looked the worst I've ever seen it. Perhaps you've heard they line up 10 yards off the WR's. It's true and they never tighten up.

Why would we fire a coach before our first playoff game? Wait till after we get our rings then fire him.:D

Bozo Jr.
12-28-2008, 04:16 PM
He's pretty bad, but we sure were awful on "D" last year under Bates as well. I call it a draw.:tsk:

elsid13
12-28-2008, 05:48 PM
Ray Rhodes and 20 completion by Gannon. Or the drop 10 and rush Ian Gold into the biggest linemen the other team has

Superchop 7
12-28-2008, 06:04 PM
Lack of talent is our biggest problem.

Champ is great.

Larsen, Woodyard, Williams, Dumerville are good.

The rest ????

Not so much.

Tned
12-28-2008, 06:08 PM
Lack of talent is our biggest problem.

Champ is great.

Larsen, Woodyard, Williams, Dumerville are good.

The rest ????

Not so much.

Yea, the old chicken salad/chicken shit problem.

Requiem / The Dagda
12-28-2008, 07:00 PM
Yes, defensively Denver has some of the worst talent in the NFL. Especially at the starting level. It is very concerning.

slim
12-28-2008, 07:01 PM
Yes, defensively Denver has some of the worst talent in the NFL. Especially at the starting level. It is very concerning.

So is your avy.

Requiem / The Dagda
12-28-2008, 07:02 PM
Slim, you know yours makes up for it.

lex
12-28-2008, 08:02 PM
Lack of talent is our biggest problem.

Champ is great.

Larsen, Woodyard, Williams, Dumerville are good.

The rest ????

Not so much.

I made a thread about this earlier. I realize it doesnt tell the whole story. Guys drafted in Rd 1 sometimes are bust and, on the other hand, some guys overperform. So without further data thats a wash to an extent. But in looking at this, youll see that good DCs get more out of their talent. BTW, 8s are undrafted free agents.




Phil TB Denver Chicago Minnesota Indy Tenn NYG
DE 8 1 1 8 4 7 1 3
DE 5 1 4 4 4 1 2 1
DT 1 1 1 1 8 7 8 4
DT 1 6 4 2 1 8 1 2
OLB 8 6 2 8 1 4 4 7
OLB 3 1 1 3 3 3 1 8
MLB 3 2 3 1 1 8 4 8
CB 4 1 1 2 1 2 8 1
CB 2 3 2 5 2 2 7 2
S 8 2 6 5 2 2 3 8
S 2 4 7 2 2 6 1 7
45 28 32 41 29 50 40 51
4.09 2.55 2.91 3.73 2.64 4.55 3.64 4.64




Just to clarify, Philly has one DE who was undrafted (represented by 8) and one drafted in the 5th. Also notice that the Giants and Eagles each have 3 undrafted free agents. Philadelphia's starters were drafted in the 4th round. Tampa Bays starters were drafted in the 2nd round on average...same as Denver.

yardog
12-28-2008, 08:09 PM
I made a thread about this earlier. I realize it doesnt tell the whole story. Guys drafted in Rd 1 sometimes are bust and, on the other hand, some guys overperform. So without further data thats a wash to an extent. But in looking at this, youll see that good DCs get more out of their talent. BTW, 8s are undrafted free agents.




Phil TB Denver Chicago Minnesota Indy Tenn NYG
DE 8 1 1 8 4 7 1 3
DE 5 1 4 4 4 1 2 1
DT 1 1 1 1 8 7 8 4
DT 1 6 4 2 1 8 1 2
OLB 8 6 2 8 1 4 4 7
OLB 3 1 1 3 3 3 1 8
MLB 3 2 3 1 1 8 4 8
CB 4 1 1 2 1 2 8 1
CB 2 3 2 5 2 2 7 2
S 8 2 6 5 2 2 3 8
S 2 4 7 2 2 6 1 7
45 28 32 41 29 50 40 51
4.09 2.55 2.91 3.73 2.64 4.55 3.64 4.64




Just to clarify, Philly has one DE who was undrafted (represented by 8) and one drafted in the 5th. Also notice that the Giants and Eagles each have 3 undrafted free agents. Philadelphia's starters were drafted in the 4th round. Tampa Bays starters were drafted in the 2nd round on average...same as Denver.

The real question is did we get the proper talent for the draft position we used? I say no. I still don't think slowick could run a def at the high school level so talent or not he still sucks. :tsk:

lex
12-28-2008, 10:22 PM
Anymore votes? Has anyone been swayed either way tonight?

JONtheBRONCO
12-28-2008, 11:01 PM
Yes.

red98
12-28-2008, 11:05 PM
Yes.

Ditto.

LoyalSoldier
12-28-2008, 11:21 PM
It is bad when Madden even is saying you are giving way too much space. :coffee:

broncofaninfla
12-30-2008, 12:40 PM
Keeping Slowick would not only ensure that we will b eawful on defense again, it could also affect our ability to sign free agents. Who the heck would want to play on a team that has such a scrub DC?

silkamilkamonico
12-30-2008, 02:39 PM
Forget Slowik.

It's Shanahan.

For as "genius" as he is on offense, he's that stupid on defense.