Pat Bowlen....What Happened??

[Npba900]

So where or when do we start the discussion of Bowlen's responsibility! Does Bowlen get a free pass! After all it was Bowlen who hired Josh McD...you know the 32 year old Prima Donna not ready to be a HC in the NFL to replace a HC who won you two Super Bowls!

Its was Bowlen who sat on his hands for almost 2 weeks as the McD--Cutler trade fiasco came to a bitter end with demands for trade. Face it, Bowlen committed a cardinal sin for NFL owners and that is you NEVER trade/allow your Franchise QB to leave town.

Simple put, Bowlen is a piss poor leader! Had Bowlen had the balls, he would have first called McD into his office and said "What the F*ck is going on here?" I hired you as HC...but I did not give you the power to shop my franchise QB around the NFL for a possible TRADE. I want you to call a face-to-face meeting with Cutler and tell him he will not be traded. You call me once that's done. I will personally go over to Cutler's house and tell him as the owner of the Denver Broncos....you are my franchise QB for the next 12-15 years and trading you is un-fathomable!!! Now, thats leadership and thats how you prevent yourself from having 3 QB's on your roster of the likes of Orton, Quinn, and Tebow!!!

When you have a hands off owner such as Bowlen call crucial shots on the decision to fire a Super winning coach-3 years too early and you sit idly by and allow your Franchise QB to leave town, and as an owner you hire 32 year old not ready for prime time HC; its the perfect recipe for turning your once winning & proud franchise into the possible door matt of the NFL.

Right now the state of the Denver Broncos franchise is all Bowlen's FAULT.

[Northman]

Um, okay.

[SR]

Pat Bowlen is not Jerry Jones.

[BeefStew25]

Added appropriate tag.

[chazoe60]

I'll give this the Orton excuse treatment


Does Bowlen play Defense?

Did Bowlen drop the ball?

Did Bowlen throw an INT right before half setting Oak up for a FG?

He's injured, his wallet was flatened.

He's the best owner we have.

[Npba900]

Did Pat set the wheels in motion on where this franchise currently finds itself in with firing of Shanny, the hiring of McD, and trading Cutler........I say yes he did!

[cardoso]

I'll give this the Orton excuse treatment


Does Bowlen play Defense?

Did Bowlen drop the ball?

Did Bowlen throw an INT right before half setting Oak up for a FG?

He's injured, his wallet was flatened.

He's the best owner we have.

usually if a billion dollar company sinks they way we have in only two years its the ceo who gets the blame. it starts up top and bowlen is every bit responsible for this mess.

[Montana Battlin Bear]

Everything that made me love Denver's fans and keeping us from Detroit, Kansas City, Cleveland, Oakland have all been thrown out the window for the last two years. I can honestly say there are about 5 level headed beings on this forum the rest act more immature than Kindergarteners. Remember this is a game. Our football team has been bad recently but our fanbase has turned into a joke.

[jhildebrand]

Pat Bowlen didn't hire McDaniels Joe Ellis did. Just sayin....

[jhildebrand]

Everything that made me love Denver's fans and keeping us from Detroit, Kansas City, Cleveland, Oakland have all been thrown out the window for the last two years. I can honestly say there are about 5 level headed beings on this forum the rest act more immature than Kindergarteners. Remember this is a game. Our football team has been bad recently but our fanbase has turned into a joke.

So apparently this is only a good fan base if the Broncos are winning. Gotcha. :salute:

[Npba900]

Pat Bowlen didn't hire McDaniels Joe Ellis did. Just sayin....

So what exactly does Bowlen do.....just blindly write checks?

[Tned]

Pat Bowlen didn't hire McDaniels Joe Ellis did. Just sayin....

That is 100% inaccurate. I believe I have pointed this out before, so either you are intentionally stating something that isn't true, or you have missed it the myriad of times it's been corrected and reported on.

[Lancane]

Pat Bowlen didn't hire McDaniels Joe Ellis did. Just sayin....

Actually that's a falsehood, Joe Ellis was the driving force behind the hire...but Bowlen met McDaniels and really liked him as well...so Bowlen holds some blame.

I understand that fans are loyal to Bowlen, but to say he is not responsible for some of this mess is completely idiotic. As for me, I respect the man, but I also realize that he is not the most football savvy of the owners in the league, so he tries to be more hands off then some prefer, that in itself places some blame on his shoulders, Bowlen exceeds at the business side of things involved, the same as Ellis and possibly as some suspect Xanders.

[Tned]

Actually that's a falsehood, Joe Ellis was the driving force behind the hire...but Bowlen met McDaniels and really liked him as well...so Bowlen holds some blame.

I understand that fans are loyal to Bowlen, but to say he is not responsible for some of this mess is completely idiotic. As for me, I respect the man, but I also realize that he is not the most football savvy of the owners in the league, so he tries to be more hands off then some prefer, that in itself places some blame on his shoulders, Bowlen exceeds at the business side of things involved, the same as Ellis and possibly as some suspect Xanders.

It's been well reported that Bowlen fell in love with McDaniels after their interview outside of Boston (I believe is where it was), and basically thought he had the next young, Mike Shanahan.

He sent Ellis out for a second interview to wrap up loose ends, discuss the details that needed to be discussed and close the deal.

[jhildebrand]

That is 100% inaccurate. I believe I have pointed this out before, so either you are intentionally stating something that isn't true, or you have missed it the myriad of times it's been corrected and reported on.

It is 100% accurate despite your protest, TNED. Bowlen was in the first interview with McDaniels. He liked what he saw enough to not need more.

The second interview was left to Ellis. Ellis offered the position and thus made did the HIRING (knowing Bowlen was on board of course).

[Tned]

It is 100% accurate despite your protest, TNED. Bowlen was in the first interview with McDaniels. He liked what he saw enough to not need more.

The second interview was left to Ellis. Ellis offered the position and thus made did the HIRING (knowing Bowlen was on board of course).

Sorry, that's BS. Again, it's been well reported that Bowlen made the decision following the first interview, and that the second interview was little more than a formality.

If you want to hold to the "Ellis said the words, 'it is your job if you want it,' so therefore he hired him" story, then I don't know what to say, because we are now playing outside the realm of reasonable thought and I don't tread there.

[CrazyHorse]

Like I said we should have hired Rex Ryan all along...

[dogfish]

Pat Bowlen didn't hire McDaniels Joe Ellis did. Just sayin....


It is 100% accurate despite your protest, TNED. Bowlen was in the first interview with McDaniels. He liked what he saw enough to not need more.

The second interview was left to Ellis. Ellis offered the position and thus made did the HIRING (knowing Bowlen was on board of course).


who hired joe elli$?


just sayin'. . .

[Tned]

who hired joe elli$?


just sayin'. . .

Probably the same guy that hired McDaniels. Keep forgetting his name, but I think it sounds like bowling or something.

[Npba900]

Like I said we should have hired Rex Ryan all along...

And his brother as Defensive Coordinator!!!:laugh:

[jhildebrand]

Like I said we should have hired Rex Ryan all along...

I wanted Leslie Frazier who was runner up. That would have been a far better hire. Cutler and Marshall along with Hillis would in all likelihood would still be here. The defense would have been addressed for three years straight now. It was easy to see then and 20/20 in hindsight.

[jhildebrand]

Sorry, that's BS. Again, it's been well reported that Bowlen made the decision following the first interview, and that the second interview was little more than a formality.

If you want to hold to the "Ellis said the words, 'it is your job if you want it,' so therefore he hired him" story, then I don't know what to say, because we are now playing outside the realm of reasonable thought and I don't tread there.

So that little title of Chief Operating Officer was all for show right? :confused: Despite all the reports at the time, and some since, that Ellis was all but running the entire show-Business and Football operations. ;)

[Tned]

So that little title of Chief Operating Officer was all for show right? :confused: Despite all the reports at the time, and some since, that Ellis was all but running the entire show-Business and Football operations. ;)

Let's reverse that. Bowlen made the trip to Boston just for 'show'? He just sat in the car so people would think he was involved? Bowlen lied to the press when he told them how impressed he was after the first interview and knew he was the guy, just for show?

[Tned]

So that little title of Chief Operating Officer was all for show right? :confused: Despite all the reports at the time, and some since, that Ellis was all but running the entire show-Business and Football operations. ;)

I can't believe I wasted my time for the xth time to refute this bull shit that some people keep spewing about the McDaniels hire.


After saying he was "ecstatic" and "excited" and "ready" to introduce Josh McDaniels as his team's new coach, Bowlen took a seat, never to be heard from again during the official portion of Monday's news conference.

Later, it was quite clear that having given the keys to the franchise to the young prodigy, Bowlen saw no need to hover.

"The chance to get this young man was very intriguing to me. He's going to be a great, great coach," said Bowlen, who admitted that describing the process of hiring McDaniels as "enjoyable" would be "stretching it a little bit."

Not that he isn't enthralled with McDaniels. During McDaniels' initial interview, Bowlen said he spent about an hour and a half with the man who would become his new hire and was so impressed that he didn't feel it necessary to be part of the second interview. McDaniels instead met with Broncos chief operating officer Joe Ellis on Thursday as the only candidate to get a second interview.

"I think it was better that I wasn't there," Bowlen said. "If I'm not in the room, and Joe's there by himself, it's just a better situation."

http://www.denverpost.com/ci_11439184?source=pkg

[Nomad]

The only thing I blame Bowlen for was he made the mistake of telling that young QB that he'd have a voice in the choosing of the HC and org. Both Bowlen and Ellis lost the trust of that young QB when they didn't do what they said and from there with an immature QB pissed at the organization and not giving the HC the time of day when first hired and it went downhill from there.....mind you that HC was just as immature and in over his head as we found out .

I disagree brand, I don't believe Marshall would be here regardless of the HC hired.

[Bosco]

Every struggle this team has had over the decade or so has been a direct failing of Pat Bowlen's philosophy on running a franchise.

[Lancane]

Every struggle this team has had over the decade or so has been a direct failing of Pat Bowlen's philosophy on running a franchise.

I have to agree, but as I stated earlier he's not football savvy owner, he's business orientated and that's why he preferred to be hands off. But it doesn't lessen the blame that should be placed on him.

People need to realize the 'He Could' scenarios in all of this; he could have stopped Shanahan earlier from having a merry-go-round of defensive coordinators; he could have hired someone other then Joe Ellis to be his right hand man; he could have gone with a different coach rather then McDaniels; he could have kept the Goodmans over Xanders; he could have stopped Cutler from being traded; he could have stopped the trade of Brandon Marshall; he could have gone with a better general manager this last time; he could of, he could of, he could of...that's what people need to realize, he's had the options to do it differently because he is the controlling owner of this organization, those hired by him, what they do in the name of the organization itself reflects on him just as much on them, that's the nature of such a business.

[Bosco]

I have to agree, but as I stated earlier he's not football savvy owner, he's business orientated and that's why he preferred to be hands off. But it doesn't lessen the blame that should be placed on him.

People need to realize the 'He Could' scenarios in all of this; he could have stopped Shanahan earlier from having a merry-go-round of defensive coordinators; he could have hired someone other then Joe Ellis to be his right hand man; he could have gone with a different coach rather then McDaniels; he could have kept the Goodmans over Xanders; he could have stopped Cutler from being traded; he could have stopped the trade of Brandon Marshall; he could have gone with a better general manager this last time; he could of, he could of, he could of...that's what people need to realize, he's had the options to do it differently because he is the controlling owner of this organization, those hired by him, what they do in the name of the organization itself reflects on him just as much on them, that's the nature of such a business.

Yep, pretty much.

[atwater27]

Who knows... Maybe if Josh's power was checked and checked HARD at the door, he could have been a decent coach for us. Therein lies the responsibility of Bowlen. You don't fire a proven, experienced power monger only to give the exact same power to a young, reckless and brash version.

[Bosco]

Who knows... Maybe if Josh's power was checked and checked HARD at the door, he could have been a decent coach for us. Therein lies the responsibility of Bowlen. You don't fire a proven, experienced power monger only to give the exact same power to a young, reckless and brash version.

I'm absolutely sure that the situation would have turned out much different had Bowlen stuck to his word and got us a real GM. I'm not sure how he watched a veteran like Shanahan botch the GM job for the better part of a decade and decided that letting a guy getting his first head coaching job have the same power was a good idea, but he did, and the results were predictable.

Personally, I'm finding it hard to be optimistic as long as the same failed business model is used in Denver.

[nflfan]

Bowlen messed up. At the time, I couldn't believe Bowlen was just handing McDaniels the keys to the kingdom, and putting his trust in him over everyone else in the organization. Did McDaniels employ some cold war personality adjustment technique to make him believe everything he said? Then the funny part was when a large majority of fans believed them too.

I think John Fox is no the right coach for the Broncos ... it's another extreme emotinal reaction from Bowlen. I think keeping Xanders and not hiring a much better GM is a mistake. Bowlen should hand the reigns to someone else. Maybe that's why John Elway is here. Hopefully, he can see things clearly and make unemotional decisions.

[Npba900]

Bowlen messed up. At the time, I couldn't believe Bowlen was just handing McDaniels the keys to the kingdom, and putting his trust in him over everyone else in the organization. Did McDaniels employ some cold war personality adjustment technique to make him believe everything he said? Then the funny part was when a large majority of fans believed them too.

I think John Fox is no the right coach for the Broncos ... it's another extreme emotinal reaction from Bowlen. I think keeping Xanders and not hiring a much better GM is a mistake. Bowlen should hand the reigns to someone else. Maybe that's why John Elway is here. Hopefully, he can see things clearly and make unemotional decisions.

Bowlen hiring Elway is the only reason I believe this Franchise will not become an example once proud and winning franchise that has fallen on bad times such as the Bills and 49ers.

[claymore]

Who knows... Maybe if Josh's power was checked and checked HARD at the door, he could have been a decent coach for us. Therein lies the responsibility of Bowlen. You don't fire a proven, experienced power monger only to give the exact same power to a young, reckless and brash version.

I doubt it, that dude sucks at anything other than Power point.

[The Glue Factory]

Maybe that's why John Elway is here. Hopefully, he can see things clearly and make unemotional decisions.

Bowlen's family has absolutely no interest in owning the Broncos. He knows he's not long for this world and I think has been trying to find a future owner that will do right by the fans. After John retired he offered 10% of the biz to John. I think Bowlen hiring John is Bowlen's way of slowly transferring ownership to John without the legal hassles Kaiser is going to raise regarding the right of first refusal he has.

[Tned]

Bowlen's family has absolutely no interest in owning the Broncos. He knows he's not long for this world and I think has been trying to find a future owner that will do right by the fans. After John retired he offered 10% of the biz to John. I think Bowlen hiring John is Bowlen's way of slowly transferring ownership to John without the legal hassles Kaiser is going to raise regarding the right of first refusal he has.

Any idea how he could pull that off?

[The Glue Factory]

I'm no lawyer and don't have any info about the agreement with Kaiser. I hope there's some kind of loophole about employee's acquiring shares of the company. If Elway acquires shares in small lots slowly (3% would make John 12% owner in 4 yrs) each acquisition might be able to bypass the right of first refusal. I'd be surprised if at some point the right of 1st refusal would kick in no matter how small the acquisition just because of the amount of total ownership involved.

I see Bowlen's actions as more than just gratitude for Elway's loyalty and service as a player. Especially after Elway's experience with owning the Denver Crush. Consider that Bowlen was part owner of that team as well. Things that make you go...

[jhildebrand]

IIRC, Bowlen won the suit against Kaiser on the Firsst Right of Refusal and the appeal as well.

[jhildebrand]

I can't believe I wasted my time for the xth time to refute this bull shit that some people keep spewing about the McDaniels hire.

How is that different than what I posted? :confused: Read the post. Bowlen loved McDaniels enough the first time to let Ellis take over.

Also, your characterization of the second interview is off. It was well over 6 hours and wasnt just to tie up loose ends.

Finally there was this little piece from Woody Page: "Ellis, several sources say, was instrumental in getting Bowlen to agree to fire Shanahan, hire McDaniels (Ellis alone met with the new coach for a second interview) and trade Cutler."

At the end of the day I couldn't care less! I find the attack posts on Bowlen to be way off base. He has been one of the best owners in any sport. We praised, and loved, him for being a smart business man and letting the people he hired work as they saw fit when it turned into two Super Bowls. I don't see why we should stop because it didn't work with this most recent go round. I would rather have that then Jerry Jones or Dan Snyder.

[Tned]

IIRC, Bowlen won the suit against Kaiser on the Firsst Right of Refusal and the appeal as well.

From what I remember, it wasn't a win in the sense that next time he doesn't have to offer it to Kaiser, but instead that Kaiser didn't have the right to buy what had been offered to Elway, even though that offer was pulled back. Kaiser was claiming that since Bowlen offered the 10% to Elway, that even though that deal never went through, that Kaiser should have the right to buy that same 10% ad a VERY low price.

[weazel]

usually if a billion dollar company sinks they way we have in only two years its the ceo who gets the blame. it starts up top and bowlen is every bit responsible for this mess.

except this is sports... teams do tail off and come back again. Its a cycle of getting the better talent when you suck.

Feel free to check out other teams in this and other leagues, its quite interesting how a team can not stay on top for decades. Unless you're talking baseball where they dont cap one team paying 500 million for a team and watch the others struggle to follow with what they can afford.

[dogfish]

How is that different than what I posted? :confused: Read the post. Bowlen loved McDaniels enough the first time to let Ellis take over.

Also, your characterization of the second interview is off. It was well over 6 hours and wasnt just to tie up loose ends.

Finally there was this little piece from Woody Page: "Ellis, several sources say, was instrumental in getting Bowlen to agree to fire Shanahan, hire McDaniels (Ellis alone met with the new coach for a second interview) and trade Cutler."

At the end of the day I couldn't care less! I find the attack posts on Bowlen to be way off base. He has been one of the best owners in any sport. We praised, and loved, him for being a smart business man and letting the people he hired work as they saw fit when it turned into two Super Bowls. I don't see why we should stop because it didn't work with this most recent go round. I would rather have that then Jerry Jones or Dan Snyder.

hey jhil, i'll ask again. . . who hired joe elli$?

who allows him to keep the job?

[jhildebrand]

hey jhil, i'll ask again. . . who hired joe elli$?

who allows him to keep the job?

Joe Ellis was hired in 1983 to be Director of Marketing. I will presume that Edgar Kaiser hired him seeing how he owned the team in 83. Pat Bowlen wasn't introduced as a majority owner until 1984.

Joe Ellis was brought back for a second stint in 1998. I wouldn't assume Bowlen hired him because he has shown, like any good business owner, the ability to let the people he hire do their job. For all I know John Beake brought him back.

Now if the issue is the fact that Bowlen allows him to remain, fine. I am with you! If I were running the show at Pidgeon Valley, I would have had the person holding the door open for McDaniels on his way out keep holding it so Xanders and Ellis could follow.

My guess is, after this season, I will get my wish and Xanders will be gone.

[G_Money]

Bowlen's family has absolutely no interest in owning the Broncos. He knows he's not long for this world and I think has been trying to find a future owner that will do right by the fans. After John retired he offered 10% of the biz to John. I think Bowlen hiring John is Bowlen's way of slowly transferring ownership to John without the legal hassles Kaiser is going to raise regarding the right of first refusal he has.


Any idea how he could pull that off?

He wills the team to his kids (no sale) with the stipulation that they cannot sell it for X amount of time or under Y stipulations (basically not until Kaiser dies and/or John is able to get a group together to buy it).

Then John is installed as permanent head honcho/VP of whatever until that time happens, and Bowlen's kids go cash checks while John runs the franchise and they wait for Kaiser, who's 70-ish, to kick it.

It should actually be a piece of cake. More pressing is making it an organization worth owning again.

~G

[G_Money]

IIRC, Bowlen won the suit against Kaiser on the Firsst Right of Refusal and the appeal as well.

lost the suit, won the appeal on the structure of the deal, but they haven't tried the deal again - John is not a 10% owner. I think after all that hassle they'll just back-door it and wait Kaiser out.

~G

[jhildebrand]

lost the suit, won the appeal on the structure of the deal, but they haven't tried the deal again - John is not a 10% owner. I think after all that hassle they'll just back-door it and wait Kaiser out.

~G

You're correct. I was just coming to post the same. I am not sure it was being re-tried.