PDA

View Full Version : Do we have the best....



ogplife
08-13-2011, 08:51 PM
secondary in the league? We have veterans playing at a high level (Champ,Goodman), Past his prime vet, but a leader and still average skillwise (dawk), two good young corners (cox, sydquan, not really impressed with Vaughn), and three potentially good young safeties (mcbath, who I believe could be the best in the secondary if he could ever stay healthy, carter and moore). Yes, I know it may be a mute point if our we get no pressure, but we know what Doom can do and if Von can live up to the hype, we may not be a great defense, but we can be one of those New Orlean Saints type defenses that creates a lot of turnovers.

Clipworthy
08-13-2011, 09:17 PM
Broncos are already like the Saints defense, you know, giving up 60 yard runs 10 broken tackles....yeah, sounds familiar

I Eat Staples
08-13-2011, 09:32 PM
Not even close. Goodman is below average, Cox is going to be in jail, Dawkins is horrible at his age, and our rookie safeties are unproven. Even Champ is getting up there in age and is past his prime.

Slick
08-13-2011, 09:38 PM
I'd have to say the eagles do no matter who plays safety for them.

Jets a close second.

Mobile Post via http://Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

BroncoStud
08-13-2011, 10:19 PM
We'd be lucky to be top 10. We have Champ, that's it and that's all.

Canmore
08-13-2011, 10:22 PM
We'd be lucky to be top 10. We have Champ, that's it and that's all.

We've got Champ and then...Goodman is probably under rated when he is healthy. Dawkins I have hope for that he is healthy this season and has one year left. The rookies are nothing more than potential. A pass rush would do wonders.

BroncoStud
08-13-2011, 10:24 PM
We've got Champ and then...Goodman is probably under rated when he is healthy. Dawkins I have hope for that he is healthy this season and has one year left. The rookies are nothing more than potential. A pass rush would wonders.

Dawkins can still hit but that's ALL, Goodman can't get or stay healthy, he's a nonfactor, the rapist is going to prison, and the rookies haven't proven anything yet. From my perspective, the only KNOWN asset we have in the secondary is Champ, and he's getting up there in years.

Agreed, we need a pass rush badly.

SoCalImport
08-13-2011, 10:33 PM
fact is a good passrush can make any pro secondary look great. Who the hell was playing DB for the Giants when they won in 08? Kenny Philips and a bunch of scrubs?

DenBronx
08-14-2011, 12:46 AM
No we don't.

We would be lucky to even be a top 20 defense next year and our secondary is old. Champ is the only sure thing in our secondary.


Not sure why you asked this? :confused:

VandalismZ
08-14-2011, 02:53 AM
how can you guys talk down like this to your favorite team. i see our secondary doing great this year because of our improvements on the D Line and getting Elvis back will make things alot easier for them. I love my team and in my mind they are the BEST. But i guess its just me and the topic creator (ogplife) who think like this.

Canmore
08-14-2011, 03:00 AM
how can you guys talk down like this to your favorite team. i see our secondary doing great this year because of our improvements on the D Line and getting Elvis back will make things alot easier for them. I love my team and in my mind they are the BEST. But i guess its just me and the topic creator (ogplife) who think like this.

I'm not talking down. I think we have a secondary with potential, but alot of that potential is just that. I still feel, at 32, Bailey is one of the premiere corners in the game. Goodman is above average when healthy, but that has not been lately. Cox is going to prison, what a waste. Thompson doesn't quite have it. What an athlete though. The two rookies are just that, rookies with potential and McBath can't stay healthy either.

DenBronx
08-14-2011, 03:06 AM
how can you guys talk down like this to your favorite team. i see our secondary doing great this year because of our improvements on the D Line and getting Elvis back will make things alot easier for them. I love my team and in my mind they are the BEST. But i guess its just me and the topic creator (ogplife) who think like this.

Most fans here on the boards are long term fans and are realist.

Does 2-14 impress you enough to think we would win a Superbowl this year? If not, how many games do you honestly think we will win?

It's great Elvis is back but will he alone put us over the top? Add the fact that we have new coaches, going to a 4-3 from a 3-4, didnt really go gun ho on DL, have a QB controversy, old secondary, OL needs to be addressed, a DB that drugged a girl and is going to prison, a kicker who recently got a DUI, owner doesnt want to spend and our new HC won 2 games last year and you have a HELL of alot of questions marks in many areas.

The Broncos will always be the best now matter how bad we are.

VandalismZ
08-14-2011, 03:09 AM
my apologies to you. you were one of the only people on this thread not talking down. I was talking about I Eat Staples, who made the comment "Dawkins is horrible at his age" that just really pissed me off that a fan can disrespect a player who is giving us so much on and off the field, and who just gave up so much (meaning the huge cut in his salary)

DenBronx
08-14-2011, 03:15 AM
my apologies to you. you were one of the only people on this thread not talking down. I was talking about I Eat Staples, who made the comment "Dawkins is horrible at his age" that just really pissed me off that a fan can disrespect a player who is giving us so much on and off the field, and who just gave up so much (meaning the huge cut in his salary)

No need to apologize. Just speak your mind. That's what keeps the discussion interesting. :beer:

VandalismZ
08-14-2011, 03:15 AM
DenBronx, your a wonderful fan. Do you remember the first year when Josh Mcdaniels took the head coach job. Im pretty sure we started out 6-0. yea we ended 8-8 but ill take that 6-0 start any season. and how many question marks were in our team then? im sure before that season you were a "realist" had no faith just like now. posting on these forums about how bad we are

Canmore
08-14-2011, 03:16 AM
No need to apologize. Just speak your mind. That's what keeps the discussion interesting. :beer:

Amen.

VandalismZ
08-14-2011, 03:17 AM
my apologies were to Canmore...

Canmore
08-14-2011, 03:18 AM
my apologies were to Canmore...

It's all good. :welcome:

DenBronx
08-14-2011, 03:22 AM
DenBronx, your a wonderful fan. Do you remember the first year when Josh Mcdaniels took the head coach job. Im pretty sure we started out 6-0. yea we ended 8-8 but ill take that 6-0 start any season. and how many question marks were in our team then? im sure before that season you were a "realist" had no faith just like now. posting on these forums about how bad we are

Anything could happen. Expect the best but prepare for the worst.

I have no doubts that we will be better than last year. This team could really suprise us. Our defense is the most intruiging to me. With Doom and Von Miller we could be nasty! Add that to a run stopping mentality of Fox with a turnover brain for a DC and we could easily be a good defense again.

I have seen many times a team be absolutely horrid one year and come back and win the division the next year. *cough* KC *cough* Chiefs.

Hopefully that will be us this year. :salute:

VandalismZ
08-14-2011, 03:22 AM
im just trying to say, dont count us out because the odds are against us.

Canmore
08-14-2011, 03:24 AM
Anything could happen. Expect the best but prepare for the worst.

I have no doubts that we will be better than last year. This team could really suprise us. Our defense is the most intruiging to me. With Doom and Von Miller we could be nasty! Add that to a run stopping mentality of Fox with a turnover brain for a DC and we could easily be a good defense again.

I have seen many times a team be absolutely horrid one year and come back and win the division the next year. *cough* KC *cough* Chiefs.

Hopefully that will be us this year. :salute:

Wouldn't that be a nice surprise.

FanInAZ
08-14-2011, 03:31 AM
No we don't.

We would be lucky to even be a top 20 defense next year and our secondary is old. Champ is the only sure thing in our secondary.


Not sure why you asked this? :confused:

Actually, he wasn't asking about our entire D, only our DBs. Anyone that knows anything about football wouldn’t even consider our D as possibly #1. However, the question is with Champ headlining our DBs, is that group of 4 players (and their subs) the best group of DBs in the league?

DenBronx
08-14-2011, 03:41 AM
Actually, he wasn't asking about our entire D, only our DBs. Anyone that knows anything about football wouldn’t even consider our D as possibly #1. However, the question is with Champ headlining our DBs, is that group of 4 players (and their subs) the best group of DBs in the league?

And my answer still stands concerning specifically our DB's. "No we don't"


No doubt Dawkins is an incredible mentor at this stage in his career. But he isn't the Dawkins from the Philly days. His age as well as some others are starting to show. Champ imo, is still a top 3 DB in the NFL but to compare our secondary as a whole to other teams then we are not a top 5 secondary.

Jets, Eagles, Green Bay, Pitt, NE...possibly Ravens and Atl's secondary wasnt too shaby last year.

As much as I like Champ, he can't do it alone.

Canmore
08-14-2011, 03:48 AM
And my answer still stands concerning specifically our DB's. "No we don't"


No doubt Dawkins is an incredible mentor at this stage in his career. But he isn't the Dawkins from the Philly days. His age as well as some others are starting to show. Champ imo, is still a top 3 DB in the NFL but to compare our secondary as a whole to other teams then we are not a top 5 secondary.

Jets, Eagles, Green Bay, Pitt, NE...possibly Ravens and Atl's secondary wasnt too shaby last year.

As much as I like Champ, he can't do it alone.

I agree. Champ, in my opinion is a top two corner. Hard to believe. Even at 32he is a premiere corner in this league. How many touchdowns has he given up in the last two seasons?

Dawkins I hope finds the fountain of youth for just one more campaign. If Goodman could just stay out of the training room. Now we only need one of the two rookies to shine. I don't care which one it is, Moore or Carter.

If this could happen we could be looking at one of the better secondaries in the league. Now add in a pass rush with Dumervil and Miller and we just may have something.

DenBronx
08-14-2011, 03:52 AM
I agree. Champ, in my opinion is a top two corner. Hard to believe. Even at 32he is a premiere corner in this league. How many touchdowns has he given up in the last two seasons?

Dawkins I hope finds the fountain of youth for just one more campaign. If Goodman could just stay out of the training room. Now we only need one of the two rookies to shine. I don't care which one it is, Moore or Carter.

If this could happen we could be looking at one of the better secondaries in the league. Now add in a pass rush with Dumervil and Miller and we just may have something.


Rahim Moore is who I have high hopes for. Dawkins really seems to have taken him under his wing, very valuable if you ask me. But I keep hearing how hard a hitter Moore has been in camp. Can't wait to see more of him in preseason. I remember alot of fans complaining that we picked him in the 2nd round but I think it was a good pick for us. Hopefully he becomes our next Atwater or John Lynch.

At least Alphonso Smith isnt here anymore.

Canmore
08-14-2011, 03:57 AM
Rahim Moore is who I have high hopes for. Dawkins really seems to have taken him under his wing, very valuable if you ask me. But I keep hearing how hard a hitter Moore is too. I remember alot of fans complaining that we picked him in the 2nd round but I think it was a good pick for us. Hopefully he becomes our next Atwater or John Lynch.

At least Alphonso Smith isnt here anymore.

Moore is running with the ones. It sounds like he has range. Dawkins certainly seems to have taken an interest in his development, but I wouldn't expect anything less from him. I would love to see another Atwater. What a safety. Him and Smith, now that was a one two punch. Pun intended. :defense:

ogplife
08-14-2011, 06:43 AM
Not even close. Goodman is below average, Cox is going to be in jail, Dawkins is horrible at his age, and our rookie safeties are unproven. Even Champ is getting up there in age and is past his prime.

Guess we are worlds apart, I believe Goodman is one of the better pure cover corners in the league (not a playmaker by any stretch. Just staying with his man and knocking the ball away).

VandalismZ
08-14-2011, 07:07 AM
Guess we are worlds apart, I believe Goodman is one of the better pure cover corners in the league (not a playmaker by any stretch. Just staying with his man and knocking the ball away).

agreed

HORSEPOWER 56
08-14-2011, 07:35 AM
I all depends on the guys up front. Always does, always will. If the front 4 (or 5 if you count Miller in that) can get consistent pressure, then our secondary should be fine with the guys we currently have on the roster, with or without Squid.

If they don't we'll look a lot like we were last year where our secondary was left to make all the plays (covering the run and the pass) because our front seven couldn't get pressure and couldn't stop the run. If Doom is truly back, Ayers turns the corner, Miller becomes the guy we drafted him to be and the FA DTs we signed can truly pressure up the gut, then we're in good shape and it will trickle back to the secondary.

With 3 of our starting 4 DBs over 30, I'm hesitant to put our secondary in the top 10 as of now. Maybe if Moore and Carter pan out to be at least solid, then we can talk about being the "best secondary".