Q&A: Broncos will have some juggling to do to get under NFL's new salary cap

[Denver Native (Carol)]

Today's questions about the Broncos come from Brian Knox in Ireland.

Q: With a new NFL collective bargaining agreement apparently on the horizon, what is the Broncos' salary cap situation? Will they have to cut anybody to create cap room?

A: It appears the salary cap for the 2011 season will be about $120 million per team. That's for player salaries and doesn't include $20 million per team for player benefits. If the salary cap is $120 million, the Broncos would have to make adjustments to their roster to sign their draft picks and some free agents.

The Broncos have 72 players on their roster and nearly $129 million in salary commitments. That's after releasing tight end Daniel Graham and defensive linemen Justin Bannan and Jamal Williams .

rest of article - http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_18501898

[BroncoJoe]

We'll save $9MM out of the gate...

:D

[SOCALORADO.]

Fix that link for us Carol..

[Denver Native (Carol)]

Fix that link for us Carol..

sorry - fixed - guess I need to wake up :D

[Traveler]

We'll save $9MM out of the gate...

:D

:confused: Huh?

[underrated29]

:confused: Huh?

I think he means 7 mil for Orton..


I expect we will be cutting Bucky, White if not healthy, daniels, half the OL who are no names, and a LB potentially like Hagan. That would clear up about 10 mil right there

[NightTerror218]

I think he means 7 mil for Orton..


I expect we will be cutting Bucky, White if not healthy, daniels, half the OL who are no names, and a LB potentially like Hagan. That would clear up about 10 mil right there


Dont forget some of our DB like Goodman, Hill or Jones. i think Dawkins will stay for remainder of contract because of his locker room presence.

[DenBronx]

The reports I have been reading doesnt add up to who's on the current roster.

Here is a breakdown of everyones current salary.

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/denver-broncos/yearly/


Elvis Dumervil at 14,000,000
Champ Bailey at 11,000,000
Kyle Orton at 8,979,000
Chris Kuper at 7,000,000
Brian Dawkins at 6,000,000
D.J. Williams at 4,900,000
Andre' Goodman at 3,880,000
Tim Tebow at 3,618,750
Ryan Clady at 3,105,000
Renaldo Hill at 2,400,000
Jabar Gaffney at 2,400,000
Kevin Vickerson at 2,000,000
Knowshon Moreno at 2,000,000
Mario Haggan at 1,930,000
Correll Buckhalter at 1,920,000
Demaryius Thomas at 1,637,500
Brandon Lloyd at 1,495,000
Robert Ayers at 880,000
Russ Hochstein at 865,000
Lonie Paxton at 865,000
Nathan Jones at 800,000
Jason Hunter at 715,000
Brady Quinn at 700,000
Daniel Coats at 640,000
Eddie Royal at 555,000
Chevis Jackson at 555,000
Spencer Larsen at 555,000
Steven Hauschka at 555,000
Joe Mays at 555,000
Richard Quinn at 480,000
David Veikune at 480,000
David Bruton at 480,000
Lendale White at 480,000
Darcel McBath at 480,000
Matt Willis at 480,000
Dan Gronkowski at 480,000
Eric Olsen at 409,000
Stanley Daniels at 405,000
Britt Davis at 405,000
Chris Clark at 405,000
Syd'Quan Thompson at 405,000
Cassius Vaughn at 405,000
Eric Decker at 405,000
Zane Beadles at 405,000
J.D. Walton at 405,000
Britton Colquitt at 405,000
Ben Garland at 405,000
Perrish Cox at 405,000
Jeff Byers at 330,000
Braxton Kelley at 330,000


Total 95,389,250

[MOtorboat]

Cap hits can be more than salary. Some of those players have signing bonuses that have some cap hit for this season.

I'd imagine there are some players Denver is still paying for years later.

Does Denver still have cap hits for Travis Henry? Any other long-term contracts that had guaranteed money deferred over the course of the contract?

[underrated29]

Dont forget some of our DB like Goodman, Hill or Jones. i think Dawkins will stay for remainder of contract because of his locker room presence.


hill, jones- yes

goody, dawk-nope

[NightTerror218]

hill, jones- yes

goody, dawk-nope

I am wondering if there is going to be some major house cleaning or not going to happen. New coach could mean a lot of changes. Since he has not had time to make very many roster changes, I fear of what could happen and yet excited.

[Traveler]

I am wondering if there is going to be some major house cleaning or not going to happen. New coach could mean a lot of changes. Since he has not had time to make very many roster changes, I fear of what could happen and yet excited.

Not so much this year IMO . Alot has to do with the labor agreement issues. Most teams with new head coaches and staffs are already behind the curve.

Unless someone's salary is just totally unreasonable, I don't see a major purge this year.

[slim]

Kyle Orton at 8,979,000
Brian Dawkins at 6,000,000




I think the solution is pretty clear.

[NightTerror218]

I think the solution is pretty clear.

I would have to say right now Dawkins is one of the biggest leaders on the team and the biggest in the locker room. I think it would be devastating to get rid of him. I think his presence would make a difference on the sideline. Hell i wish he would retire and become an assistant coach for us at some point :D

[slim]

I would have to say right now Dawkins is one of the biggest leaders on the team and the biggest in the locker room. I think it would be devastating to get rid of him. I think his presence would make a difference on the sideline. Hell i wish he would retire and become an assistant coach for us at some point :D

Don't get me wrong, I love the way he plays the game....but $6M for a 39 year old safety? No thanks.

[NightTerror218]

Don't get me wrong, I love the way he plays the game....but $6M for a 39 year old safety? No thanks.


It is not always about finances. It is about what is best for the team. I think the team needs the leadership. His energy is needed in a hurting defense.

[Lonestar]

Hmmmm 129mil before rookies and udfa. Folks their is going be a lot of blood letting.

[Lonestar]

Not to mention any #1 priority RB and #5 priority DTs.

[Shananahan]

Don't get me wrong, I love the way he plays the game....but $6M for a 39 year old safety? No thanks.
I agree with this if it really comes down to pinching pennies. The guy almost died of old age on the field last year and looked horrible at times, but it's also true that what he really provides to the team is difficult to put a dollar amount on. I think they'll keep him, and I think he'll restructure his contract in order to make that happen.

[Denver Native (Carol)]

Hmmmm 129mil before rookies and udfa. Folks their is going be a lot of blood letting.

Totally agree - sign drafted players, sign some free agents and udfa - not good. There may be some existing players that will have to do what Elway and a few other previous players did, renegotiate their contracts downward.

[hamrob]

Legold or whatever his lame writer name is....doesn't know his head from a hole in the ground!

The top 51 salaries are all that is counted against the Cap...until right before the season kickoff, where teams have to get all 53 under the Cap. Furthermore, part of the new CBA is supposedly that all dead salaries will be written off and not count against the new Cap. Remember, 2010 had no Cap.

Denver will have plenty of money to spend. No worries!

"Between the start of a league year (around March 1) and opening day only the 51 highest paid players count against the Salary Cap, even though the team could have up to 80 players on the roster at times. Prorated bonus amounts from players not on the top 51 salaries and any dead cap money also counts during this period. This is called the “Rule of 51”. From opening day until the end of the season all players on the roster (including injured reserve) and practice squad count against the cap."

"There is one other note I forgot to mention but which has to be taken into consideration. Only the TOP 51 CONTRACTS (that’s base salary plus prorated bonuses) count against the salary cap. This is why teams are able to sign as many as 80 guys to fill out their training camp rosters and why you see many “futures” contracts that are contingent on a player making the final 53-man roster."

http://www.cpnd.us/pcinoz/Salary_Cap_FAQ.htm

http://insidefootball.com/blog/archives/1360

[Canmore]

Legold or whatever his lame writer name is....doesn't know his head from a hole in the ground!

The top 45 salaries are all that is count against the Cap...until right be the season kickoff, where teams have to get all 53 under the Cap. Furthermore, part of the new CBA is supposedly that all dead salaries will be written off and not count against the new Cap.

Denver will have plenty of money to spend. No worries!

I guess we will now soon enough. :defense:

[Lonestar]

I guess that 120 mil is not really 120 mil must be inflation.

Hey hamrob. It is still money spent. You know that stuff that you think grows on trees.

But iirc over the past couple of years we were in the mid 90 mil area. Not even close to the cap.

So how we got above ut so fast I'm not sure.

[hamrob]

We are $95m...the numbers posted in a previous post are correct. It's only the top 51 players that count against the cap.

So, right now, before we sign our draft picks and free agents....or make trades or cuts. We, are:

$25,000,000

UNDER THE CAP!

[DenBronx]

I keep seeing reports on NFLN that dead money/cap from the previous years will NOT be counted in the new CBA. Whatever current roster salary will be counted. That would put us around 95 and we still can trade/cut/rework contracts. I think we will be primed and ready to go once FA starts right out of the gate.

The guy from ESPN didn't do his homework.

[MOtorboat]

We are $95m...the numbers posted in a previous post are correct. It's only the top 51 players that count against the cap.

So, right now, before we sign our draft picks and free agents....or make trades or cuts. We, are:

$25,000,000

UNDER THE CAP!

I haven't looked at the USA Today database, does that $95 mil include signing bonuses that have been pro-rated? I would imagine Tebow, Demaryius Thomas, Dawkins, Orton, and such have prorated bonuses.

Not that I'm all that worried about it. X is a very good capologist.

[Denver Native (Carol)]

The article states:

The Broncos have 72 players on their roster and nearly $129 million in salary commitments. That's after releasing tight end Daniel Graham and defensive linemen Justin Bannan and Jamal Williams .

[horsepig]

$129,000,000 for a 4 win team with the worst defense I can recall ever watching.

[MOtorboat]

The article states:

The Broncos have 72 players on their roster and nearly $129 million in salary commitments. That's after releasing tight end Daniel Graham and defensive linemen Justin Bannan and Jamal Williams .

According to Hamrob, a number of those doln't count towards the salary cap.

[MOtorboat]

$129,000,000 for a 4 win team with the worst defense I can recall ever watching.

The damned thing about it, is that some teams have to lose. Oh snap, you mean Denver can't have an above average every year?

[Davii]

72 players for the 129 mil? I'm sure they'll get it figured out. I'm also nearly certain that Dawk will restructure, Orton will probably be gone as I doubt he will restructure, and we'll find savings elsewhere. Xanders managed to bring our dead money total down a lot, if nothing else he is good at working with the cap.

[Lonestar]

$129,000,000 for a 4 win team with the worst defense I can recall ever watching.

Guess that means you just can't throw money at something and hoPe

[Lonestar]

Can anyone imagine where we would be cap wise if we would have given the class of 06 all the money they wanted.

[Tned]

Can anyone imagine where we would be cap wise if we would have given the class of 06 all the money they wanted.

I know, the horror, we wouldn't have had the 2nd pick in this draft, wouldn't have had Von Miller, might have had a playoff appearance or two the last couple years.

I try not to imagine what might have been.

[Lonestar]

I know, the horror, we wouldn't have had the 2nd pick in this draft, wouldn't have had Von Miller, might have had a playoff appearance or two the last couple years.

I try not to imagine what might have been.

In your fondest dreams.

It is time to let go mentally of all the head case millionaires as a group they were not getting us anywhere, but cap hell.

[broncobryce]

I know, the horror, we wouldn't have had the 2nd pick in this draft, wouldn't have had Von Miller, might have had a playoff appearance or two the last couple years.

I try not to imagine what might have been.

Not if we didn't fix the defense. Most of the 06 class were offense

[broncobryce]

In your fondest dreams.

It is time to let go mentally of all the head case millionaires as a group they were not getting us anywhere, but cap hell.

Haven't you heard. Lots of yards but no points gets you to the playoffs

[Lonestar]

Not if we didn't fix the defense. Most of the 06 class were offense

They seem to forget that minor detail and who was HC and DC.

[Lonestar]

Haven't you heard. Lots of yards but no points gets you to the playoffs

Only if you have man love for jay. His stronger than Elway arm can even play safety. Well that was what college coaches wanted him to play.

[Lonestar]

Haven't you heard. Lots of yards but no points gets you to the playoffs

If they get you there it is With a very quick exit after getting your ass kicked in the playoffs.

[GEM]

Haven't you heard. Lots of yards but no points gets you to the playoffs

That hasn't changed in the last 5 years. Even when the "head cases" left.

[MileHighCrew]

If they get you there it is With a very quick exit after getting your ass kicked in the playoffs.

Normally I try to avoid it when this comes up again and again, but, honestly READ YOUR COMMENT. It is better to have a 4 win team then to lose and get your ass kicked in the playoffs??????:confused: Isn't the goal to make the playoffs and win a championship.
Ok I know YOU don't think Cutler and the 06 draft class was ever going to win a championship in Denver, but it sucks to make the playoffs and lose? Do you even read this crap before you submit your reply? We are on 2 different sides of the fence when it comes to Shanny, Josh, Cutler and a few other things but I can tolerate a different opinion as long as it has basis, but making the playoffs sucks compared to a 4 win team?
I am afraid your goal is to BAIT people into these arguements and I fell for it, but honestly.

[T.K.O.]

i think Dawk is a great help to the team and totally agree that it's hard to put a $ value on what he brings to the table.
that being said i just don't know if it makes sense to shell out 6mil for what could be a motivational speaker by mid season ?
love the guy's heart and passion for the game,BUT...if it means settling for a lesser DT etc... in free agency.............thanx for the memories X:salute:

P.S. thread back on track....brought to you by T.K.O.

[LordTrychon]

That hasn't changed in the last 5 years. Even when the "head cases" left.

GEM, Play nice. That's not true and you know it.

Points and yards went down. :P

(well... except the defense. Points and yards allowed increased there, at least)

[NightTerror218]

i think Dawk is a great help to the team and totally agrre that it's hard to put a $ value on what he brings to the table.
that being said i just don't know if it makes sense to shell out 6mil for what could be a motivational speaker by mid season ?
love the guy's heart and passion for the game,BUT...if it means settling for a lessor DT etc... in free agency.............thanx for the memories X:salute:

Do we need an assistance coach in the secondary? Or an assistant conditioning coach?

[MileHighCrew]

i think Dawk is a great help to the team and totally agrre that it's hard to put a $ value on what he brings to the table.
that being said i just don't know if it makes sense to shell out 6mil for what could be a motivational speaker by mid season ?
love the guy's heart and passion for the game,BUT...if it means settling for a lessor DT etc... in free agency.............thanx for the memories X:salute:

I can't imagine Dawk isn't going to redo his contract. He knows they can't pay him that money and I think he wants to be here and will take a pay cut for the team, from what I have read about it.

[Tned]

Haven't you heard. Lots of yards but no points gets you to the playoffs

True, '08 was MUCH worse than '09 and '10. Fact is we won more games in '09 and '10 combined than '08, so that proves it...

[GEM]

I can't imagine Dawk isn't going to redo his contract. He knows they can't pay him that money and I think he wants to be here and will take a pay cut for the team, from what I have read about it.

Dawk could go the way of Lynch. Thinking he still has the ability to play and knows this is the last payday. Go elsewhere to get it and is shown the door before the start of the season.

It all just depends on where Dawk's head is at.

[MileHighCrew]

True, '08 was MUCH worse than '09 and '10. Fact is we won more games in '09 and '10 combined than '08, so that proves it...

Didn't you know, in this crazy new NFL wins and talent don't matter.

[T.K.O.]

Do we need an assistance coach in the secondary? Or an assistant conditioning coach?

we NEED a "how to kick ass and take names" coach !:D;)
and dawk would be a great one:salute:

[MileHighCrew]

Dawk could go the way of Lynch. Thinking he still has the ability to play and knows this is the last payday. Go elsewhere to get it and is shown the door before the start of the season.

It all just depends on where Dawk's head is at.

That is true, and if that is the case, then the Broncos have to let him go. You cannot pay Dawk $6 Mil a year. He just isn't that good. Considering the teams record, the VERY last start to the season and the youth movement, I am not sure hanging on to Dawk this season is in the Broncos best interest at all, unless he takes the role of mentor.
We drafted 2 young talented safeties, it might be painful this year, but to play them like Beadles and Walton last year might be a huge benefit going forward.

[NightTerror218]

we NEED a "how to kick ass and take names" coach !:D;)
and dawk would be a great one:salute:


When he decides to hang up the pads, I think he would be a great assistant coach and would love to keep him around for something. After his camps he held I think conditioning coach would be a good fit for him.

[Lonestar]

Normally I try to avoid it when this comes up again and again, but, honestly READ YOUR COMMENT. It is better to have a 4 win team then to lose and get your ass kicked in the playoffs??????:confused: Isn't the goal to make the playoffs and win a championship.
Ok I know YOU don't think Cutler and the 06 draft class was ever going to win a championship in Denver, but it sucks to make the playoffs and lose? Do you even read this crap before you submit your reply? We are on 2 different sides of the fence when it comes to Shanny, Josh, Cutler and a few other things but I can tolerate a different opinion as long as it has basis, but making the playoffs sucks compared to a 4 win team?
I am afraid your goal is to BAIT people into these arguements and I fell for it, but honestly.


I'd rather hAve a few 4 win season knowing that I'm going to get some talent in the draft that can rebuild TE franchise than continually draft in the 20s and win lots of games and then get our asses kicked in the playoffs.

I know that is hard to comprehend but my goals have always. Been long term way to many folks think short term solutions are the best. But long term planning will always win out over the long haul.

That was what Mikey did when he picked up priyce and al Wilson we did not need those guys at the time but thy fit into a long term policy.

Then he got dsparate for wins and starters to reach in the draft and for pricey aged vet (FAs ). And it went down hill from there a slippery slope once uou start down it is hard not to slide all the way to the bottom. 4 wins.

YOur correct we would have never made the play off finals with TE class or I should say the unclAss of 06. they are ms players and as far as I can see still looking out for ME only. take Kuper out if that equation as he is a simple knuckle dragging OL guy.

If you feel I'm baiting then report the post. Pretty simple. I have my views and am told that stating ones views and ideas will not get you into trouble.

I did not like that DAFT class save Kuper and IIRC Doom who are solid players. The others are only out to get what they could for ME.

[Ravage!!!]

:lol: :lol:

[MileHighCrew]

I'd rather hAve a few 4 win season knowing that I'm going to get some talent in the draft that can rebuild TE franchise than continually draft in the 20s and win lots of games and then get our asses kicked in the playoffs.

I know that is hard to comprehend but my goals have always. Been long term way to many folks think short term solutions are the best. But long term planning will always win out over the long haul.

That was what Mikey did when he picked up priyce and al Wilson we did not need those guys at the time but thy fit into a long term policy.

Then he got dsparate for wins and starters to reach in the draft and for pricey aged vet (FAs ). And it went down hill from there a slippery slope once uou start down it is hard not to slide all the way to the bottom. 4 wins.

YOur correct we would have never made the play off finals with TE class or I should say the unclAss of 06. they are ms players and as far as I can see still looking out for ME only. take Kuper out if that equation as he is a simple knuckle dragging OL guy.

If you feel I'm baiting then report the post. Pretty simple. I have my views and am told that stating ones views and ideas will not get you into trouble.

I did not like that DAFT class save Kuper and IIRC Doom who are solid players. The others are only out to get what they could for ME.


So losing is better than winning. Got it thanks.

[silkamilkamonico]

People need to get over the Shanahan era already. Just don't even bring it up. Elway wasn't walking through that door to save him, and he's already sliding into the depths of coaching mediocrity in Washington, and the product he put on the field last year proves it.

[silkamilkamonico]

So losing is better than winning. Got it thanks.

Sometimes, it's about winning championships mover than regular season games. In his final 10 seasons, he had exactly 1 championship, and that was a Divisional one.

1.

[MileHighCrew]

People need to get over the Shanahan era already. Just don't even bring it up. Elway wasn't walking through that door to save him, and he's already sliding into the depths of coaching mediocrity in Washington, and the product he put on the field last year proves it.

You want people to forget about and not bring up the most successful era in the history of Broncos football on a Broncos message board?

[MileHighCrew]

Sometimes, it's about winning championships mover than regular season games. In his final 10 seasons, he had exactly 1 championship, and that was a Divisional one.

1.

That is true, but they were able to compete. Something they haven't been doing. I know be happy with the worst season in Broncos history. But I am not trying to live in teh past, you see I am VERY excited about the Elway led Broncos and I think the future is bright, sadly there has been this lockout that has delayed the change of the franchise and because of that the horrible taste of teh last 2 years remains. Because of that I have to look back to the Shanny era and smile at the Broncos successes, because under the last "leadership" there wasn't anything to be happy about

[LordTrychon]

People need to get over the Shanahan era already. Just don't even bring it up. Elway wasn't walking through that door to save him, and he's already sliding into the depths of coaching mediocrity in Washington, and the product he put on the field last year proves it.

It'll be easier to forget when you can't criticize the way things went in the last regime without hearing about how much better it was than under Shanahan.

Shanahan was two regimes ago now. I'm ready to bring him up less (I won't forget about it, though. That's silly).

It's not usually those that defend Shanahan that bring him up.

[HORSEPOWER 56]

I'd rather hAve a few 4 win season knowing that I'm going to get some talent in the draft that can rebuild TE franchise than continually draft in the 20s and win lots of games and then get our asses kicked in the playoffs.

I know that is hard to comprehend but my goals have always. Been long term way to many folks think short term solutions are the best. But long term planning will always win out over the long haul.

That was what Mikey did when he picked up priyce and al Wilson we did not need those guys at the time but thy fit into a long term policy.

Then he got dsparate for wins and starters to reach in the draft and for pricey aged vet (FAs ). And it went down hill from there a slippery slope once uou start down it is hard not to slide all the way to the bottom. 4 wins.

YOur correct we would have never made the play off finals with TE class or I should say the unclAss of 06. they are ms players and as far as I can see still looking out for ME only. take Kuper out if that equation as he is a simple knuckle dragging OL guy.

If you feel I'm baiting then report the post. Pretty simple. I have my views and am told that stating ones views and ideas will not get you into trouble.

I did not like that DAFT class save Kuper and IIRC Doom who are solid players. The others are only out to get what they could for ME.

I think most of us know what you're trying to say but no matter how you slice it, McDaniels took an 8-8 team and made it 4-12 by the time he was fired. Almost none of the players he drafted have panned out or lived up to their draft status (meaning he's drafted just as many busts as your boy Mikey) and almost all of the FAs he brought in are overpaid at best and completely worthless and overpaid at worst. Keep beating that drum, maybe if you say it enough times someone besides just you will believe it... but I doubt it.

By the way, Dumervil and Kuper have both received handsome contracts from the Broncos in the past year. You keep saying that they are the only ones from '06 that aren't in it for "me" (them), yet do you think they give all that money away to charity and do what they are doing for free? Short of Brandon Marshall, nobody in that class had any contract problems or was a discipline issue.

If you sit back and take an unbiased view of that class, you'll see that it was extremely successful and if not for Marshall's off-filed problems could've been the best in Denver history. With the exception of Greg Eslinger, every player taken in that draft is still playing in the league in some capacity. That's almost unheard of.

Perhaps had we been able to keep that class together, they could've formed the "long term" nucleus that you build a "long term" team around?

[Tned]

GEM, Play nice. That's not true and you know it.

Points and yards went down. :P

(well... except the defense. Points and yards allowed increased there, at least)

I was wondering if somoene was going to point this gem out.

[broncobryce]

True, '08 was MUCH worse than '09 and '10. Fact is we won more games in '09 and '10 combined than '08, so that proves it...

We won just as many games in 09 as we did in 08. What does that prove? Our d was better for awhile then fell apart. Especially without elvis in 10

[Tned]

We won just as many games in 09 as we did in 08. What does that prove? Our d was better for awhile then fell apart. Especially without elvis in 10

I'm on your side, you and Jr have convinced me, the McDaniels era was an improvement over the Shanahan era (mikey vs. joshy, you might say). I'm on board.

I'm thinking about trying to get a grass roots movement going to bring back McDaniels.

1
2
3
4
Kick Fox to the floor
6
7
8
Get McDaniels back before it's too late...

[TXBRONC]

Normally I try to avoid it when this comes up again and again, but, honestly READ YOUR COMMENT. It is better to have a 4 win team then to lose and get your ass kicked in the playoffs??????:confused: Isn't the goal to make the playoffs and win a championship.
Ok I know YOU don't think Cutler and the 06 draft class was ever going to win a championship in Denver, but it sucks to make the playoffs and lose? Do you even read this crap before you submit your reply? We are on 2 different sides of the fence when it comes to Shanny, Josh, Cutler and a few other things but I can tolerate a different opinion as long as it has basis, but making the playoffs sucks compared to a 4 win team?
I am afraid your goal is to BAIT people into these arguements and I fell for it, but honestly.

I would rather get to the playoffs and lose than not go at all. That's like saying because we got our heads handed to us in four Super Bowls it would be better not to go back. That's crazy imho.

[NightTerror218]

I would rather get to the playoffs and lose than not go at all. That's like saying because we got our heads handed to us in four Super Bowls it would be better not to go back. That's crazy imho.

I would much rather own the Raiders, Chiefs and Chargers and lose in the playoffs then not at all.

[TXBRONC]

I would much rather own the Raiders, Chiefs and Chargers and lose in the playoffs then not at all.

The alternative to going to the playoffs and losing is a far worse proposition.

[Canmore]

The alternative to going to the playoffs and losing is a far worse proposition.

I do not want to suffer through another four win season. It was horrible. :tsk:

[NightTerror218]

So where did the $120 number come from, just the Q&A? I would not be surprised if the number that came out would be the $124 cap of the 09 season

[T.K.O.]

Cap situations*
Team Status
Arizona $37.3 million under
Atlanta $13.9 million under
Baltimore $5.33 million under
Buffalo $35.9 million under
Carolina $30.6 million under
Chicago $37. million under
Cincinnati $35.9 million under
Cleveland $33.3 million under
Dallas $18.9 million over
Denver $1 million under
Detroit $16.6 million under
Green Bay $62,600 under
Houston $7.6 million under
Indianapolis $2.7 million over
Jacksonville $31.4 million under
Kansas City $34.3 million under
Miami $13.6 million under
Minnesota $5.1 million over
New England $7.57 million under
New Orleans $11.7 million under
N.Y. Giants $11.3 million over
N.Y. Jets $1.2 million over
Oakland $10 million over
Philadelphia $13 million under
Pittsburgh $10 million over
San Diego $19.4 million under
San Francisco $18.9 million under
Seattle $39 million under
St. Louis $35.6 million under
Tampa Bay $59.2 million under
Tennessee $10.3 million under
Washington $10.6 million under
*Does not include restricted free-agent tenders.

[NightTerror218]

well according to this we are $1 mill under the cap

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/6786350/reggie-bush-potential-cap-casualties

[spikerman]

Wow! What in the heck is Denver paying for? $1 million under for 4 freakin' wins? :confused: :mad:

[T.K.O.]

So where did the $120 number come from, just the Q&A? I would not be surprised if the number that came out would be the $124 cap of the 09 season


this is from espn....

"Once the collective bargaining agreement is signed and the league is up and operating, teams have to return to the days of getting under the cap. The 2011 cap is going to be at $120 million, and there figure to be several cap casualties, particularly because the 2009 cap was at $128 million. "

[NightTerror218]

well according to this we are $1 mill under the cap

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/6786350/reggie-bush-potential-cap-casualties


quote myself lol....but raiders are over by $10 mill and Chiefs/Charges are well under also.

[NightTerror218]

this is from espn....

"Once the collective bargaining agreement is signed and the league is up and operating, teams have to return to the days of getting under the cap. The 2011 cap is going to be at $120 million, and there figure to be several cap casualties, particularly because the 2009 cap was at $128 million. "

so.....?

[T.K.O.]

so.....?

it was in response to your "where did the 120 mil figure come from"...it's in the new cba

[broncobryce]

I'm on your side, you and Jr have convinced me, the McDaniels era was an improvement over the Shanahan era (mikey vs. joshy, you might say). I'm on board.

I'm thinking about trying to get a grass roots movement going to bring back McDaniels.

1
2
3
4
Kick Fox to the floor
6
7
8
Get McDaniels back before it's too late...

I never said one era was better than the other. Don't put words in my mouth. You said we might be in the playoffs and I said not unless they fixed the d. And that lots of yards means nothing if it doesn't equal points. That goes for both era's.

[NightTerror218]

it was in response to your "where did the 120 mil figure come from"...it's in the new cba


I was curious because it was stated in the Q&A and from what I have heard they were not letting out too many details about the CBA. But I also so the ESPN article that had the same number and it stated we were $1 million below the cap right now.

[Lonestar]

So losing is better than winning. Got it thanks.

no that is not what I said

RIF.

short term wins that get your ass kicked in the playoffs are worthless as far as I'm concerned..

Long term planning and goals are what we should be doing..

I'm not advocating losing to lose and get a better draft choice unless you are well out of the playoffs and can get newbies more experience.

Give me a couple of years of drafting WELL in the top ten and we should be well on our way with a solid foundation built on these players.. or multiple day one and two picks in the top 45 and that will help also.


Since there will be a rookie cap in the future there is less stigma of wasting money..

I will never want to draft top 3 but would settle for 4-9 a couple of times.

If the coaching staff is worth a crap and we get good players we will be well on our way to getting just more than ONE playoff win in over the past decade.

If all you are looking for is a playoff win from time to time go for it, but I'm looking long term..

[Lonestar]

People need to get over the Shanahan era already. Just don't even bring it up. Elway wasn't walking through that door to save him, and he's already sliding into the depths of coaching mediocrity in Washington, and the product he put on the field last year proves it.

YEt it is mikey that everyone compares Josh to like the guy walked on water 15 years ago. Which is true but has done squat since in the playoffs..

the guy should not be given a lifetime pass because of it. IMHO

I bring him up BECAUSE others make like Josh was so much worse.

When IN fact we do not know for sure IF his Draft choices will pan out or not..

sure the team had a losing record BFD no worse IMO than winning a lot of games early each year and then fading down the stretch and IF we got to the playoffs getting our asses kicked..

to me that is worse than having losing record.

Guess it is just a matter of perspective..

I loved mikeys thought process "IF we got into the playoffs anything could happen"

Instead of believing that your team could MAKE things happen in the playoffs.

When John retired mikey lost his mojo..

[Lonestar]

I think most of us know what you're trying to say but no matter how you slice it, McDaniels took an 8-8 team and made it 4-12 by the time he was fired. Almost none of the players he drafted have panned out or lived up to their draft status (meaning he's drafted just as many busts as your boy Mikey) and almost all of the FAs he brought in are overpaid at best and completely worthless and overpaid at worst. Keep beating that drum, maybe if you say it enough times someone besides just you will believe it... but I doubt it.

By the way, Dumervil and Kuper have both received handsome contracts from the Broncos in the past year. You keep saying that they are the only ones from '06 that aren't in it for "me" (them), yet do you think they give all that money away to charity and do what they are doing for free? Short of Brandon Marshall, nobody in that class had any contract problems or was a discipline issue.

If you sit back and take an unbiased view of that class, you'll see that it was extremely successful and if not for Marshall's off-filed problems could've been the best in Denver history. With the exception of Greg Eslinger, every player taken in that draft is still playing in the league in some capacity. That's almost unheard of.

Perhaps had we been able to keep that class together, they could've formed the "long term" nucleus that you build a "long term" team around?

wait a minute mikey ain't my boy has not been since about 2004 or so..

As far as Joshes choices we will know after this year on most of them won;t we.

as far as FA that is a toss up on who was worse..

there was NO Way to keep that class together money wise and as far as being in the league in some capacity or another, how does that make up for the other 100 or so DAFT choices mikey blew in the past decade.. ONe year doth make him a guru..

We all know that jay wanted out the minute Josh was announced.

could he have been salvaged with a disciplinarian like Josh forcing him to play controlled offense?

I sincerely doubt he would have played that part.

HE has been reckless with the ball since high school, relying on his arm strength to get him a bye.

Schefler a non blocking TE ahahahahahahahaha is what third or fourth string in DET.

Hixon started two games last year ten games total in his 5 year career..

I was glad to see Kuper and Doom get new contracts as they are TEAM players and your crack about them donating money to charity was Crass.

getting paid for your job does not automatically qualify you as being a ME player..

[broncobryce]

no that is not what I said

RIF.

short term wins that get your ass kicked in the playoffs are worthless as far as I'm concerned..

Long term planning and goals are what we should be doing..

I'm not advocating losing to lose and get a better draft choice unless you are well out of the playoffs and can get newbies more experience.

Give me a couple of years of drafting WELL in the top ten and we should be well on our way with a solid foundation built on these players.. or multiple day one and two picks in the top 45 and that will help also.


Since there will be a rookie cap in the future there is less stigma of wasting money..

I will never want to draft top 3 but would settle for 4-9 a couple of times.

If the coaching staff is worth a crap and we get good players we will be well on our way to getting just more than ONE playoff win in over the past decade.

If all you are looking for is a playoff win from time to time go for it, but I'm looking long term..

I'm with ya. We played the patch game too long. So many bought in but eventually you have tear down and build.

[Canmore]

I'm with ya. We played the patch game too long. So many bought in but eventually you have tear down and build.

We have definitely accomplished the tear down portion. We are rebuilding. Building is the hard part. We have some young players in place. Will they pan out? That's why they play the games.

[broncobryce]

We have definitely accomplished the tear down portion. We are rebuilding. Building is the hard part. We have some young players in place. Will they pan out? That's why they play the games.

You got it. Takes a few years to see the busts from the players. There are plenty of both it appears so far. Time will tell. I believe elway and company know how to steer the ship from here. So far so good

[NightTerror218]

We have definitely accomplished the tear down portion. We are rebuilding. Building is the hard part. We have some young players in place. Will they pan out? That's why they play the games.

I think after this year we can tell where we will be at. We have revamped the entire secondary with youngsters in last 2 drafts, we revamped our LB in this draft. We also got WR last draft and TE this draft.

I am thinking that our O-Line is good and our D-Line is what is missing. Get us a couple DL in the draft next year and a later round RB and i think we will have a great team.