So, if Denver wants a new QB

[Northman]

This is basically for down the road either next year or the one after. But if Fox and Elway arent sold on Tebow for any reason and want to deal him to gain more draft picks or supporting players (if the CBA is done in time) how many of you will miss him?

This isnt to start arguements or get people riled up because i have no idea what Fox and company have in store for Timmy.

And let me state that i think they should allow Tebow to play for at least a year to see where he is at and if he is the future before discarding him.

However, if for any reason Denver does trade Tebow how will you all feel about that? Personally, as much as i would like to see what he has to offer im not really emotionally attached to him. And not just him but Moreno, Demaryius, and Ayers are included.

To me so far none have stood out that much to warrant me to get uptight or upset if they are traded away. So, are you guys attached to these players that much and would be pissed or does it matter if they get traded by chance?

I pretty much know what the diehard Tebow/Gator fans would say but then again they may just follow him to the other team anyway.

[Ravage!!!]

I'm personally not attached to any of them. Tebow is a great guy, but I jsut have never felt he was going to be a good NFL QB. If he stays a bronco, I'll cheer every play he's involved in. But if he's traded, then I'll simply look forward to what we get in exchange, and not have any "what if" curiosities with Tebow.. or Moreno... or Ayers.

But, not sure there has been enough time to establish that kind of connection with these guys, yet. I think most of what you have asked all depends on how they play this coming season. I personallly don't think it takes 2 years on the bench to step in and play.

[arapaho2]

it depends on the outcome of tebow...elways legacy as a VP could hinge on it

lets say we trade him without a shot..he goes to another team...and never really lives up to the hype...meanwhile the broncos get a franchise qb and start to win.....all is forgiven

if elway trades tebow without giving him a shot....he then becomes a superstar in this league, while we still search for the next qb...

:mad:

[BroncoBJ]

I'll miss him and be sad for a lil while. Since I'm hoping hes our Franchise QB and having a great person like him repping our franchise would be great. But if we did trade him, I'll just get over it and support our next QB and hope that he can be the franchise QB. Would like to give Tebow a full year though at least.

[Nomad]

What arapaho said!

Tebow will be under, imo, an unfair microscope this season (where other QBs get years to prove themselves) especially from Elway. I would like to see what he can do with a solid defense and solid run game which Denver has neither. I guess if Elway and Fox feel they don't want him then so be it, but I hope they are right because Tebow has proven to win wherever he goes!!

[atwater27]

I say we give him a chance for a few seasons while we rebuild. If he pans out, it will be perfect timing with his development, if he doesn't, we'll at least be a decent QB away from a great team if we rebuild right.

[GEM]

I just want to give Tebow a shot and see what he has. I would feel like crap if we let him go (even with good return, because we have seen that even bad can come out of good draft picks) and he turns out to be something good. I just want him to have a shot before we pull the trigger. Besides, there is no one in this draft as far as QB's that does a damn thing for me. I want all DEFENSE, all DAY!

[atwater27]

And if he sucks bad enough this year we may get a chance at Mr. Luck. The scary thing is, I can hear Elway's wheels turning all the way over here in Oregon... I wonder what picks/players he is putting together to jockey for the #1 overall pick.

[Superchop 7]

It would bug me for this reason....we need stability. We have enough of a project on the defensive side of the ball. At the end of the season evaluate where your at......if you need to go all in to get Andrew Luck.....then....so be it.
The kid was a rookie, they usually look pretty bad out of the gate. We know for an absolute that we need defense.....we don't know for an absolute if we need a QB.

And from a PR standpoint.....backlash.

The only way I see us getting a QB is if Elway is pissed that we can't trade out of the spot.

[TXBRONC]

I just want to give Tebow a shot and see what he has. I would feel like crap if we let him go (even with good return, because we have seen that even bad can come out of good draft picks) and he turns out to be something good. I just want him to have a shot before we pull the trigger. Besides, there is no one in this draft as far as QB's that does a damn thing for me. I want all DEFENSE, all DAY!

I agree. Denver spent a number one pick on him they should at find out if McDaniels got it right.

[BeefStew25]

Man I have a boner for Dalton.

[jhildebrand]

To each their own. Just as McDaniels was allowed to shape the roster and Shanahan before him, as they saw fit, so should Elway and Fox!

I personally would be a bit sad and disappointed to see Tebow go, especially if it means enduring another season of Ortonary QB play.

Furthermore, it isn't in Elway nor Fox's best interest to move Tebow right now. Tebow is McDaniels' pick and they shouldn't and probably wouldn't be judged for his play/assessing what he is especially considering the fans demand to see Tebow! Moving Tebow now only speeds up the time table under which the two have to work. A FO or Coach generally gets to pick one QB maybe two. Moving Tebow now in favor of someone else only speeds up the expectancy for results. I said the same thing when McDaniels insited on moving Cutler. I didn't want to say I told you so but I told you so. This would be no different for Fox and Elway.

The smart move is build/assess the D in this year's draft and see what you got in Tebow for the reasons I listed. Either he pans out, and they look good; or, he doesn't and this team is in position for Luck next draft. They should Ride out McDaniels mistake at no cost to themselves.

[Dzone]

Strictly based on how many Bronco fans are NowTim Tebow fans, trading Tebow would be a slap in the face to Bronco fans who have just suffered through the worst season in history. Trading Tebow would NOT be taken lightly around here.

[Northman]

Strictly based on how many Bronco fans are NowTim Tebow fans, trading Tebow would be a slap in the face to Bronco fans who have just suffered through the worst season in history. Trading Tebow would NOT be taken lightly around here.

Maybe. Although so far in this thread most people would like to see what the kid has too offer im not entirely sure there would be a massive meltdown about it (aside of course from the diehards who followed him from FL).

[jhildebrand]

Maybe. Although so far in this thread most people would like to see what the kid has too offer im not entirely sure there would be a massive meltdown about it (aside of course from the diehards who followed him from FL).

I don't think we would have board civil war like we did with Cutler and Plummer before him.

[Northman]

I don't think we would have board civil war like we did with Cutler and Plummer before him.

Yea, pretty much my thinking as well.

Someone else mentioned it in this thread that the players just havent been here long enough to really form a bond with. I think the fans have high hopes for a lot of these guys but if they were traded tomorrow i dont think most Bronco fans would lose sleep over it.

[TXBRONC]

Strictly based on how many Bronco fans are NowTim Tebow fans, trading Tebow would be a slap in the face to Bronco fans who have just suffered through the worst season in history. Trading Tebow would NOT be taken lightly around here.

I personally wouldn't take it that way. I would I be disappointed? Certainly but I would not take it as a slap in face because it's the same situation as we had with Cutler.

That aside I don't think they could get much for Tebow in trade because everyone knows he still very a project.

[Bullgator]

Maybe. Although so far in this thread most people would like to see what the kid has too offer im not entirely sure there would be a massive meltdown about it (aside of course from the diehards who followed him from FL).

Actually as long as Tebow starts somewhere the diehards will be just fine with it.

But for the record I really hope he stays and starts in mile high.

[nevcraw]

I'd like to see what the kid has to show.. As we all know his immeasurables are off the charts -- you do not see that very often and as athtletic as he is as well.
the issue is time.. How long til he puts it together?? he will need IMO time on the field and a good team around him to make it happen. I'd rather them focus on the other spokes in the wheel as he matures into a passer.

To answer the question -- I will not fold up my tent, but if Elway get's rid of him quickly and he goes on to succeed or his replacement doesnt pan out I will not be pleased with the FO. The great Elway or not..
as far as the others I am not sold on any of the new guys but like the early showing by Decker and Thomas when healthy.. Moreno meh.. Ayers has shown some promise and hoepfully a switch back to 4-3 DE he will flourish.

[bcbronc]

I'd be fine with trading any of the guys mentioned...but why stop with those four? If the front office feels moving ANY player makes us better in the long run, I'm on board...and willing to give at least 3 years to see how the FO's vision pans out.

If Tebow is our starting QB, I hope his play puts him into the conversation for GOAT. if Tebow is moved, I hope whoever replaces him ends up a HOFer. Same with every other player at every other position. It's about orange and blue, not the name on the back.

:coffee:

[Montana Battlin Bear]

Maybe. Although so far in this thread most people would like to see what the kid has too offer im not entirely sure there would be a massive meltdown about it (aside of course from the diehards who followed him from FL).

I see your point.. But honestly people that post here and other broncos websites are among the top ten to fifteen percent smartest fans. I would be very disappointed if they got rid of tebow but I would back the organization. I personally know many bronco fans for life that have said they will stop being a fan if he is traded. And this is simply because they are not as in touch with the organization as posters here.

If tebow is traded the broncos will lose thousands of fans. Book it

[claymore]

As long if the decision on Tebow comes on practice, and actual evaluation, I am fine with whatever.

I dont want to trade him just because McD drafted him, nor do I want Elway to be scared to keep him because of his homo followers.

[Northman]

As long if the decision on Tebow comes on practice, and actual evaluation, I am fine with whatever.

I dont want to trade him just because McD drafted him, nor do I want Elway to be scared to keep him because of his homo followers.

Yea, i dont really see Elway keeping him just for that fact. However, i dont want Elway to be pressured into not playing the kid either. It kind of bothers me that he is hesitant to let the kid play more (some of that is probably due to Fox). At this point im not sure what their plan is, are they planning on a quick turnaround to try and get back into the playoff race (which i think is far gone now) or are they going to rebuild. If they are going to rebuild than playing a vet QB is pretty meaningless especially if your trying to decide on whether or not Tebow is your future. I know i personally dont want to wait 2 more years before i see Tebow take the field. I would like to get an idea now as too whether or not he has the ability to be our future. But i get what your saying and thanks for the response. :D

[claymore]

Yea, i dont really see Elway keeping him just for that fact. However, i dont want Elway to be pressured into not playing the kid either. It kind of bothers me that he is hesitant to let the kid play more (some of that is probably due to Fox). At this point im not sure what their plan is, are they planning on a quick turnaround to try and get back into the playoff race (which i think is far gone now) or are they going to rebuild. If they are going to rebuild than playing a vet QB is pretty meaningless especially if your trying to decide on whether or not Tebow is your future. I know i personally dont want to wait 2 more years before i see Tebow take the field. I would like to get an idea now as too whether or not he has the ability to be our future. But i get what your saying and thanks for the response. :D

Hell yeah. I think Elway really doesnt like Tebow as a QB. I am fine with that. I just want all Tebow evaluation to be on actual football stuff. Not feelings, or heresay or whatever.

If Tebow cannot take a snap from center right now, then we need to focus on our next QB.

Tebow might be better than Orton, but I dont want to settle for that. I want greatness. Or damn good.

Your welcome for the response. :D

[TXBRONC]

I'd like to see what the kid has to show.. As we all know his immeasurables are off the charts -- you do not see that very often and as athtletic as he is as well.
the issue is time.. How long til he puts it together?? he will need IMO time on the field and a good team around him to make it happen. I'd rather them focus on the other spokes in the wheel as he matures into a passer.

To answer the question -- I will not fold up my tent, but if Elway get's rid of him quickly and he goes on to succeed or his replacement doesnt pan out I will not be pleased with the FO. The great Elway or not..
as far as the others I am not sold on any of the new guys but like the early showing by Decker and Thomas when healthy.. Moreno meh.. Ayers has shown some promise and hoepfully a switch back to 4-3 DE he will flourish.

At the same time what if they keep him and he just can't become a more accurate passer? At that point then Denver has missed out a potentially better prospect.

Don't get me wrong guys I like Tebow and I hope we give him a chance but I'm saying it's two edged sword. Since it's a risk either way I think iwe should give Tebow a chance. Denver has already invested time and money into the kid so why not see if he can be developed into a starting quarterback.

[BroncoNut]

I think Tim's an exciting player with the surrounding controversy. Curious to see what he can do while he's here. But I wouldn't be that bent out of shape if he was traded away. I'd look ahead. I guess I'm not emotionally attached to any of the players, although, I'd hate to see a few go moreso than others.

[BroncoNut]

Hell yeah. I think Elway really doesnt like Tebow as a QB. I am fine with that. I just want all Tebow evaluation to be on actual football stuff. Not feelings, or heresay or whatever.

If Tebow cannot take a snap from center right now, then we need to focus on our next QB.

Tebow might be better than Orton, but I dont want to settle for that. I want greatness. Or damn good.

Your welcome for the response. :D

you need more patience. And enough with this hell yeah crap. it's irritating

[MileHighCrew]

To me it isn't a matter of time as a Bronco, those three players haven't really done anything as Broncos. Ayers was a space filler and Knowshon has been so far from what people hoped he would be that people went crazy when he had his first 100 yard game. We want them to be good so bad we celebrate acheivements that were common place with the Broncos.
Tebow's case is very different because he really hasn't got a shot yet. In the little action he had he was very raw but there was excitement, but part of that is because we wanted it to be great after 2 years of Orton putting the Broncos into a mile high sleep.
I guess the answer to the question for me is it depends on who replaces them and if they bring the excitement we have been missing with them.

[TXBRONC]

Q&A: Which player will the Broncos draft No. 2 overall? Depends on which mock draft you read
By Jeff Legwold
The Denver Post
Posted: 04/13/2011 01:00:00 AM MDT


But teams believe they won't win an NFL championship without a franchise passer, so everyone wants a quarterback — no matter what their needs are.


http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_17828986

This is precisely why I think it's important to find out if Tebow is the guy. If it's not him then we need to find that guy a.s.a.p.

[arapaho2]

Strictly based on how many Bronco fans are NowTim Tebow fans, trading Tebow would be a slap in the face to Bronco fans who have just suffered through the worst season in history. Trading Tebow would NOT be taken lightly around here.


it depends....if he's traded and is like scheffler, struggling to contribute...the tebow crowd may whine for months, but the ones that just wanted to see him get a shot would be ok

if he is traded and becomes elways hillis...and we all watch him blow up and become a force in the nfl....:tsk:

[LordTrychon]

I'm quite honestly a little desensitized to the idea of shipping out players now.

I really hope Tebow stays and does great... but I won't be as affected this time around if the management shifts around pieces I don't think they should.

I do think he should get his chance and has a shot to be really good to great. As long as he's given some chance to show what he can do... even if it's only in practice mainly for a year or two but can't beat out the competition for the starting spot... that wouldn't suck as bad as if he were shipped out this year before having his chance to learn the new system and see what he can do.

[topscribe]

I don't understand their tinkering with the QB position if that is what they
indeed are doing. It should be obvious the Broncos lost their games primarily
on defense. What's wrong with the QB position that they shouldn't be focusing
almost entirely on defense? If they would have had just a middle-of-the-road
defense last year, they likely would have been contending for the Division. Let
the QBs they have compete, as they said they were going to do, and fix that
pathetic defense!

-----

[TXBRONC]

I'm quite honestly a little desensitized to the idea of shipping out players now.

I really hope Tebow stays and does great... but I won't be as affected this time around if the management shifts around pieces I don't think they should.

I do think he should get his chance and has a shot to be really good to great. As long as he's given some chance to show what he can do... even if it's only in practice mainly for a year or two but can't beat out the competition for the starting spot... that wouldn't suck as bad as if he were shipped out this year before having his chance to learn the new system and see what he can do.

It's sad that your Jedi training has left desensitized to the world around you. :tsk: :D

[TXBRONC]

I don't understand their tinkering with the QB position if that is what they
indeed are doing. It should be obvious the Broncos lost their games primarily
on defense. What's wrong with the QB position that they shouldn't be focusing
almost entirely on defense? If they would have had just a middle-of-the-road
defense last year, they likely would have been contending for the Division. Let
the QBs they have compete, as they said they were going to do, and fix that
pathetic defense!

-----


Q&A: Which player will the Broncos draft No. 2 overall? Depends on which mock draft you read
By Jeff Legwold
The Denver Post
Posted: 04/13/2011 01:00:00 AM MDT
Updated: 04/13/2011 08:01:21 AM MDT

But teams believe they won't win an NFL championship without a franchise passer, so everyone wants a quarterback — no matter what their needs are.

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_17828986

I think Legwold is correct and this could very be how Elway and company see it.

I agree with you we should focus the draft primarily on defense.

[Lonestar]

Just hoping they decide not ro Purge players just because Josh brought them.

I'd they have A good reason like they do not fit into the new scheme like Jamal then I'm ok with that.

Unless they are devoid of talent which I hardly believe they are all good football kids IMO.
Let's make sure we have someone better before they are let go.

Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

[underrated29]

Before the draft I had never heard of Tebow. Still before his draft, I was told about him and watched as much of his play as I could. I came away thinking he would/could change the QB position it is today. I still happen to think that. I was not a nut hugger, as you know I do not even watch college football. I just do my own little scouting. I came away very impressed.


I would be pretty pissed if we just shipped him out. The guy is not perfect but I think his game is going to totally 100% completely mess NFL defenses up. And if we were to trade him after such a brief stint imo would be monumentally stupid. Just like I thought it was when we traded cutler.

[topscribe]

Okay, here's a possibility: If the Broncos are considering a QB, it won't be in
the first round. I believe they are locked in on defense there.

I would not be surprised for them to wait until the 2nd round and see if
Locker -- yes, Locker -- is available (which he probably will be), and if he is,
they may snatch him up. Locker is the closest thing to Elway in this draft:
howitzer arm, very mobile, great ball handler and decision-maker.

Locker was slotted for the #1 all around choice by many pundits last year.
That he opted to stay for his senior year, plus his team's rough year, just
might turn out to be the best thing to happen for the Broncos.

Not saying that's the way it is . . . just throwing out another scenario . . .

-----

[TXBRONC]

Just hoping they decide not ro Purge players just because Josh brought them.

I'd they have A good reason like they do not fit into the new scheme like Jamal then I'm ok with that.

Unless they are devoid of talent which I hardly believe they are all good football kids IMO.
Let's make sure we have someone better before they are let go.

Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

McDaniels purged more good talent than he left behind.

[topscribe]

Just hoping they decide not ro Purge players just because Josh brought them.

I'd they have A good reason like they do not fit into the new scheme like Jamal then I'm ok with that.

Unless they are devoid of talent which I hardly believe they are all good football kids IMO.
Let's make sure we have someone better before they are let go.

Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

A little bit off the topic, but that seems the case with Bannan, for instance,
unless they intend to get back together with him, as they hinted.

That also happened in Hamilton's case last year, it would seem. I was not a
Hamilton fan, but the hole that remained after his departure haunted the
Broncos the entire rest of the year.

So if they ship Orton off, they are left with a guy who has played all of
three games and another who is a bust. If they ship Tebow off, what
happens if Orton goes down? Now they have Quinn the rest of the year, or
they have to shove a raw, just drafted rookie into service?

Eviscerating the QB position could turn out disastrous, IMO . . .

-----

[GEM]

If they want to move Tebow....my only thought would be to use him this year, see what you have while finding a way to lose every game and earn the #1 spot for next year and grab Luck. :shrugs:

[Nomad]

Again, give this team a solid all around DEFENSE, ST (BRONCOS seem to never have good field position unless a gift from a penalty), and a pass catchin route runnin TE along with a solid run game then we'll talk QBs next season!!

I heard on NFL Live that Peterson and Dareus visited the BRONCOS yesterday!

[Nomad]

If they want to move Tebow....my only thought would be to use him this year, see what you have while finding a way to lose every game and earn the #1 spot for next year and grab Luck. :shrugs:

If that's the case trade Tebow and Orton then just let Quinn play!:D j/k

BRONCOS would have to have the #1 pick because as of now, I don't see any team that's going to give up their chance at Luck regardless if he blows this college season!!

[MileHighCrew]

McDaniels purged more good talent than he left behind.
That isn't a reason to get rid of the little talent left on the team

[claymore]

you need more patience. And enough with this hell yeah crap. it's irritating

Hell yeah. :heh:

[Lonestar]

A little bit off the topic, but that seems the case with Bannan, for instance,
unless they intend to get back together with him, as they hinted.

That also happened in Hamilton's case last year, it would seem. I was not a
Hamilton fan, but the hole that remained after his departure haunted the
Broncos the entire rest of the year.

So if they ship Orton off, they are left with a guy who has played all of
three games and another who is a bust. If they ship Tebow off, what
happens if Orton goes down? Now they have Quinn the rest of the year, or
they have to shove a raw, just drafted rookie into service?

Eviscerating the QB position could turn out disastrous, IMO . . .

-----

HAMILTON as been a liability since 06 when they switched to a drop back passing style to make use of jays talents. he was on roller skates for most of his career in pass blocking and when that happened his man was pushing into teh pocket all the time. it is not like he could get help from a TE maybe the center if he is not tied up with a massive NT.

He was great in the ZBS for run blocking but flat to light in the ass to effectively and consistently block guys 30 to 60 pounds more than he weighed.

Something had to give and it was usually getting pushed back into the pocket, simple matter of physics.

[Lonestar]

Originally Posted by TXBRONC View Post
McDaniels purged more good talent than he left behind.


That isn't a reason to get rid of the little talent left on the team


what talent did he purge head cases jay, tony and bm.. that is very debatable.

Hillis I might agree with but then he was never intended to be a RB when he was drafted. FB blocking back catching passes out of the back field.

The 9 defensive stars (starters) left over from you know who. replaced all but the DL folks with better players. his hand picked and beloved by Y'all DC Nolan chose his boy from SFO to be our NT. Huge mistake IMHO..

WR core is much better overall than when BM was here.
TS now that was a superstar just where is he on the DET depth chart.

jay I will not win that debate, but we all know He wanted out the day Josh was announced..

Not sure where TX comes up with his comparison.

[dogfish]

i'm not emotionally invested in tebow, but IMO it just doesn't make sense to trade him off this year and draft a replacement. . .

for one thing, i don't think any QBs in this draft are head and shoulders above tebow. . . gabbert's very unproven, newton is a tebow clone with tons of red flags instead of off the charts intangibles, and locker has accuracy issues that concern me even more than tebow's mechanical issues. . . if there was a sam bradford type of prospect and we could get him, i'd be all for moving tim. . . however, that's not the case. . .

and since it's not the case, i don't see how one of those guys stepping in is a better situation than tim with a year already under his belt. . .

more so, i understand that the guy is an unconventional prospect, but we paid a high price to get him. . . he's a high-dollar risk/reward proposition-- given that we've already taken the risk, it's seems kinda stupid to deprive ourselves of any possibility of reaping the reward. . . whether he's the guy elway and fox would have chosen, he's here now-- it doesn't cost us much to see what we have with him, but unless someone offers a strong trade, we lose a ton of value if we let him go. . . that's bad math for the organization. . . just more of what mcdaniels did-- "these talented players aren't perfect scheme or team fits, so we'll just throw them away and start over from scratch". . .

yea, **** that. . . i would be cripplingly disappointed in the new FO if they took valuable high picks away from the defensive rebuild to take a QB without generating replacements (ie, trading orton for a second or third and using that pick to get their quarterback). . . with no true blue chip QB available, they really need to focus on the D, play this year out with tebow or orton, and see where we are next year. . .

but really, even if tim doesn't flourish as a fulltime starting QB, he's already proven to be a very effective red zone weapon. . . and in this era of specialized positions, i think that alone makes him worth as much as or more than a mid-round pick. . . the guy is a bust-ass hard worker and a quality athlete-- i will be highly unimpressed with our FO/coaching staff if they can't figure out ways to use him. . . the only way i would support trading him is if we get something of pretty significant value in return. . .

[TXBRONC]

i'm not emotionally invested in tebow, but IMO it just doesn't make sense to trade him off this year and draft a replacement. . .

for one thing, i don't think any QBs in this draft are head and shoulders above tebow. . . gabbert's very unproven, newton is a tebow clone with tons of red flags instead of off the charts intangibles, and locker has accuracy issues that concern me even more than tebow's mechanical issues. . . if there was a sam bradford type of prospect and we could get him, i'd be all for moving tim. . . however, that's not the case. . .

and since it's not the case, i don't see how one of those guys stepping in is a better situation than tim with a year already under his belt. . .

more so, i understand that the guy is an unconventional prospect, but we paid a high price to get him. . . he's a high-dollar risk/reward proposition-- given that we've already taken the risk, it's seems kinda stupid to deprive ourselves of any possibility of reaping the reward. . . whether he's the guy elway and fox would have chosen, he's here now-- it doesn't cost us much to see what we have with him, but unless someone offers a strong trade, we lose a ton of value if we let him go. . . that's bad math for the organization. . . just more of what mcdaniels did-- "these talented players aren't perfect scheme or team fits, so we'll just throw them away and start over from scratch". . .

yea, **** that. . . i would be cripplingly disappointed in the new FO if they took valuable high picks away from the defensive rebuild to take a QB without generating replacements (ie, trading orton for a second or third and using that pick to get their quarterback). . . with no true blue chip QB available, they really need to focus on the D, play this year out with tebow or orton, and see where we are next year. . .

but really, even if tim doesn't flourish as a fulltime starting QB, he's already proven to be a very effective red zone weapon. . . and in this era of specialized positions, i think that alone makes him worth as much as or more than a mid-round pick. . . the guy is a bust-ass hard worker and a quality athlete-- i will be highly unimpressed with our FO/coaching staff if they can't figure out ways to use him. . . the only way i would support trading him is if we get something of pretty significant value in return. . .

This is the way I feel. I'm not emotionally involved in keeping Tebow but the investment has already been made we might as well see if he can develop into a starting quarterback. What exactly can we get for a former 1st round draft pick that came into the League as high risk/high reward player?

Even if John and Co. are not convinced that Tebow can be the guy is this draft to look for a replacement? From what I've read this isn't year to do it especially with a high pick.

[TXBRONC]

That isn't a reason to get rid of the little talent left on the team

I didn't say we should. I'm saying McDaniels didn't do jack to make it better and we need build on what we got. That said I can see a player like being moved depending on the circumstances.

[I Eat Staples]

I wouldn't miss any of those players. Despite my concerns, I still have hope for Moreno, but I hate the DT pick and the guy can't even get on the field. Ayers just looks bad. I doubt Tebow will ever be a good NFL QB. Moreno is the only borderline keeper and I wouldn't lose sleep if he was gone either.

[Slick]

Well said dog.

Do you think Elway and Co. have already made up their minds about Tebow?

[bcbronc]

I didn't say we should. I'm saying McDaniels didn't do jack to make it better and we need build on what we got. That said I can see a player like being moved depending on the circumstances.

what does McDaniels have to do with this thread? He has zero influence on whether Tebow, Moreno, Ayers or anyone else become long-time Broncos or one-time Broncos. Bringing up the former regime is just baiting.

[topscribe]

HAMILTON as been a liability since 06 when they switched to a drop back passing style to make use of jays talents. he was on roller skates for most of his career in pass blocking and when that happened his man was pushing into teh pocket all the time. it is not like he could get help from a TE maybe the center if he is not tied up with a massive NT.

He was great in the ZBS for run blocking but flat to light in the ass to effectively and consistently block guys 30 to 60 pounds more than he weighed.

Something had to give and it was usually getting pushed back into the pocket, simple matter of physics.

I understand this, which is why I said I wasn't a fan of Hamilton's. However,
when they jettisoned him, everyone was wondering whom they were going
to get to replace him. Well, in effect, they had nobody. And it showed the
entire season.

But Hamilton is not the point. You said you hoped the Broncos would have
replacements before they did any serious purging, and I agreed, giving
Hamilton as only one example.

-----

[dogfish]

Well said dog.

Do you think Elway and Co. have already made up their minds about Tebow?

there's no way to really tell at this point, but if i had to guess i'd say they like him but aren't totally sold on him yet. . . i really think their ultimate draft plan would be to trade orton and hedge their bets on tebow by drafting one of the second-tier guys like locker, dalton, ponder, kaepernick or whoever. . .

but since i don't expect veterans to be tradeable on draft day, i think we ultimately resist the temptation, take a DT off the board with our first pick, and play this year out with teebs and norton competing for the job. . .

i do get the feeling they'd be happier with a true pocket passer type, but the ability to work with what's available is crucial to turning around failing teams-- you can use those assets for trade or salary cap relief as well as playing them, but however you approach it you have to maximize all your assets. . . i'm hopefully that foxy and elway understand that and will act accordingly. . .

[arapaho2]

HAMILTON as been a liability since 06 when they switched to a drop back passing style to make use of jays talents. he was on roller skates for most of his career in pass blocking and when that happened his man was pushing into teh pocket all the time. it is not like he could get help from a TE maybe the center if he is not tied up with a massive NT.

He was great in the ZBS for run blocking but flat to light in the ass to effectively and consistently block guys 30 to 60 pounds more than he weighed.

Something had to give and it was usually getting pushed back into the pocket, simple matter of physics.

that would be a good theory if it were true...hamilton was part of the oline in 08 that gave up a mere 12 sacks on the season

our offense didnt go to a pure drop back offense like the colts offense...jay was just as good as plummer rolling out and we put him in movement just as much if not more that plummer

[dogfish]

that would be a good theory if it were true...hamilton was part of the oline in 08 that gave up a mere 12 sacks on the season

our offense didnt go to a pure drop back offense like the colts offense...jay was just as good as plummer rolling out and we put him in movement just as much if not more that plummer

http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/2530/cmonman.jpg (http://img508.imageshack.us/i/cmonman.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)


the thread is, "So, if Denver wants a new QB"-- how the **** can you POSSIBLY find a way to fit in jake freaking plummer??!


:noidea:


anybody? anybody?

buehler??


some day we're gonna have to put you, JR, WTM and mtnman in a damn nursing home together, so you guys can sit around in your rocking chairs and really dig in and finish this debate once and for all. . .

:rolleyes:


i mean, damn-- let it go! not only are plummer and shanahan gone, now mcdaniels and cutler are gone as well. . . it's over, let it frickin' die already and join the rest of us in 2011. . .


okay, sorry-- rant over. . . i just wish you guys could do a steel cage match or something, get it settled and move on. . .

[TXBRONC]

http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/2530/cmonman.jpg (http://img508.imageshack.us/i/cmonman.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)


the thread is, "So, if Denver wants a new QB"-- how the **** can you POSSIBLY find a way to fit in jake freaking plummer??!


:noidea:


anybody? anybody?

buehler??


some day we're gonna have to put you, JR, WTM and mtnman in a damn nursing home together, so you guys can sit around in your rocking chairs and really dig in and finish this debate once and for all. . .

:rolleyes:


i mean, damn-- let it go! not only are plummer and shanahan gone, now mcdaniels and cutler are gone as well. . . it's over, let it frickin' die already and join the rest of us in 2011. . .


okay, sorry-- rant over. . . i just wish you guys could do a steel cage match or something, get it settled and move on. . .

I would pay to see that. I wonder if Jr has some submission hold like a figure four leg lock?

[jhildebrand]

what talent did he purge head cases jay, tony and bm.. that is very debatable.

Whether they were headcases or not may be debatable (at best) but their talent is without question.

In this NFL, many GM's and FO types have referenced the need to placate and work with today's NFL stars. It's a different time JR.



Hillis I might agree with but then he was never intended to be a RB when he was drafted.

That may be but things change and things fall apart. Things changed when our RB corps fell apart. From then on it was clear as day that Hillis was not only capable as a starting NFL RB but was to be our RB.



WR core is much better overall than when BM was here.
TS now that was a superstar just where is he on the DET depth chart.

Funny thay you have the wherewithall to mention TS but can't understand the need to see what these WR's do without McDaniels and garbage time stats.

[TXBRONC]

what does McDaniels have to do with this thread? He has zero influence on whether Tebow, Moreno, Ayers or anyone else become long-time Broncos or one-time Broncos. Bringing up the former regime is just baiting.

Who drafted them?

Second Jr made the inference.

Third not by a long shot what I posted is baiting.

[ydave77]

I just want to give Tebow a shot and see what he has. I would feel like crap if we let him go (even with good return, because we have seen that even bad can come out of good draft picks) and he turns out to be something good. I just want him to have a shot before we pull the trigger. Besides, there is no one in this draft as far as QB's that does a damn thing for me. I want all DEFENSE, all DAY!

I agree, this lockout makes for bad timing though. Considering he got extremely limited reps last year, and will not get a full camp this year, it will make for a tough adjustment.
I hope we have a long-ish leash with him in the beginning. Give him the whole year regardless.
If by end of the year you don't see improvement, and/or potential to be a franchise QB, then we will likely be drafting in the top 10 again, so grab a QB at that point.

[TXBRONC]

Well said dog.

Do you think Elway and Co. have already made up their minds about Tebow?

I know you're asking Dog this question but hope you don't mind if I take a crack at it.

From what Elway and Co. have said and what they have done I don't think they are completely convinced about Tebow. I think that is why they have done their due diligence on evaluating the available quarterbacks in this draft.

I think it also bares repeating that Elway and Co. are not convinced that Orton is long term solution. In many respects it's actually a worse position for Orton to be in because they do have a pretty good idea of what kind of quarterback Orton is. If they were they could settle this right now and declare Orton the starter right and end all speculation if they were convinced he can lead this team to championships.

[tomjonesrocks]

It's too bad if Tebow doesn't pan out at QB the only option seems to be to trade him away. I still think he has the skillset to be an *elite* TE in this league -- and that's something this team needs. I know Tebow has a dream to play QB, etc., though...

[arapaho2]

http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/2530/cmonman.jpg (http://img508.imageshack.us/i/cmonman.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)


the thread is, "So, if Denver wants a new QB"-- how the **** can you POSSIBLY find a way to fit in jake freaking plummer??!


:noidea:


anybody? anybody?

buehler??


some day we're gonna have to put you, JR, WTM and mtnman in a damn nursing home together, so you guys can sit around in your rocking chairs and really dig in and finish this debate once and for all. . .

:rolleyes:


i mean, damn-- let it go! not only are plummer and shanahan gone, now mcdaniels and cutler are gone as well. . . it's over, let it frickin' die already and join the rest of us in 2011. . .


okay, sorry-- rant over. . . i just wish you guys could do a steel cage match or something, get it settled and move on. . .


you its your right to be a ******* richard...doenst mean you have to be one every day

notice i wasnt getting in a plummer debate, a shanny debate, a cutlers better debate...I WAS TALKING ABOUT BEN FREAKING HAMILTON

I SAID: jay was just as good as plummer rolling out and we put him in movement just as much if not more that plummer

I WAS TALKING ABOUT OUR FN OFFENSE FROM PLUMMER TO CUTLER AND THE STATMENT THAT WE WENT TO A DROP BACK PASSING OFFENSE...WE DIDNT

now **** off

[Slick]

LOL! Get some dogfish.
Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

[LordTrychon]

Psh... it was Brister that really got the shaft anyway.

[TXBRONC]

Psh... it was Brister that really got the shaft anyway.

Camaraderieship. :nod:

[topscribe]

Psh... it was Brister that really got the shaft anyway.

I remember not liking Brister at all as a full-time QB and seeing the night-and- day
difference when Griese was put in there. Brister fumed, to be sure (from a recent
interview, he's still fuming), but I thought it was the right call. Griese played at a
Pro Bowl level until he tripped over his doggie :heh: and hurt that shoulder.

Oh well, we had Jake/Cutler, Cutler/Orton, and Orton/Tebow wars, why not start
a Brister/Griese war? :D

-----

[LordTrychon]

I remember not liking Brister at all as a full-time QB and seeing the night-and- day
difference when Griese was put in there. Brister fumed, to be sure (from a recent
interview, he's still fuming), but I thought it was the right call. Griese played at a
Pro Bowl level until he tripped over his doggie :heh: and hurt that shoulder.

Oh well, we had Jake/Cutler, Cutler/Orton, and Orton/Tebow wars, why not start
a Brister/Griese war? :D

-----

!@)(*# @)(@#)(@ !)(!@#()@*#!)~~!!!!!!:mad:

[Ravage!!!]

Brister? He was just another Orton. A veteran guy, that was nothing more than a stop-gap. Griese proved to be AS good as Brister early, and thats why he got the job. Young and unproven, and already as good, and certainly.. CERTAINLY.... smarter. Cerebral, studious, QBs are more highly valued. Which again, circles back as to why Plummer was shipped out to begin with, why we drafted Cutler, and why we are now in a curious position as to what we need to do with our QB position.

[Northman]

Brister? He was just another Orton. A veteran guy, that was nothing more than a stop-gap. Griese proved to be AS good as Brister early, and thats why he got the job. Young and unproven, and already as good, and certainly.. CERTAINLY.... smarter. Cerebral, studious, QBs are more highly valued. Which again, circles back as to why Plummer was shipped out to begin with, why we drafted Cutler, and why we are now in a curious position as to what we need to do with our QB position.

Maybe, but Brister had some WHEELS. His rollout on Monday Night vs KC was EPIC. I mean DIRTY DOG EPICNESS! :D

[JaxBroncoGirl]

Here is my thinking, I am not sure if Elway is sold on Tebow and I am not sure if I am sold on Elway or Fox, but I am giving them a chance. It would be a very bad bad move not to give Tebow a chance. I think egos need to be checked at the door and let the guy play.

[GEM]

you its your right to be a ******* richard...doenst mean you have to be one every day

notice i wasnt getting in a plummer debate, a shanny debate, a cutlers better debate...I WAS TALKING ABOUT BEN FREAKING HAMILTON

I SAID: jay was just as good as plummer rolling out and we put him in movement just as much if not more that plummer

I WAS TALKING ABOUT OUR FN OFFENSE FROM PLUMMER TO CUTLER AND THE STATMENT THAT WE WENT TO A DROP BACK PASSING OFFENSE...WE DIDNT

now **** off


http://images2.memegenerator.net/ImageMacro/6855607/Oh-He-Mad-Alright.jpg?imageSize=Medium&generatorName=Oh-he-mad-alright

[dogfish]

http://images2.memegenerator.net/ImageMacro/6855607/Oh-He-Mad-Alright.jpg?imageSize=Medium&generatorName=Oh-he-mad-alright

you think?

:lol:



something musta hit home. . .

[topscribe]

Here is my thinking, I am not sure if Elway is sold on Tebow and I am not sure if I am sold on Elway or Fox, but I am giving them a chance. It would be a very bad bad move not to give Tebow a chance. I think egos need to be checked at the door and let the guy play.

I agree that they should let the guy compete.

Whether or not he plays, depends on what becomes of that competition . . .

-----

[TXBRONC]

Here is my thinking, I am not sure if Elway is sold on Tebow and I am not sure if I am sold on Elway or Fox, but I am giving them a chance. It would be a very bad bad move not to give Tebow a chance. I think egos need to be checked at the door and let the guy play.

I trust that Elway and Co. will do there best to act in the best interests of the team. I really don't think they will just toss Tebow to the side. Right or wrong a number one pick was invested in Tebow so waste that pick without finding out if he was really worth it. I think Elway and Fox are smart enough not make rash decisions.
Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

[KCL]

Maybe, but Brister had some WHEELS. His rollout on Monday Night vs KC was EPIC. I mean DIRTY DOG EPICNESS! :D

:lol:

As soon as I read Brister..I thought of that game.

[JaxBroncoGirl]

I trust that Elway and Co. will do there best to act in the best interests of the team. I really don't think they will just toss Tebow to the side. Right or wrong a number one pick was invested in Tebow so waste that pick without finding out if he was really worth it. I think Elway and Fox are smart enough not make rash decisions.
Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

I want to think your way, I just have a feeling that Elway is not sold on Tebow nor is Fox, which both are from different eras of the football game, I would venture to say that they will give him a short rope unlike Orton. I mean come on here, just how bad can Tebow be considering Orton's play. Give Tebow a chance a real chance...I think he will bring in more wins.

Former JaxGatorGirl, noticed I changed my name for Top!!!

[topscribe]

I want to think your way, I just have a feeling that Elway is not sold on Tebow nor is Fox, which both are from different eras of the football game, I would venture to say that they will give him a short rope unlike Orton. I mean come on here, just how bad can Tebow be considering Orton's play. Give Tebow a chance a real chance...I think he will bring in more wins.

Former JaxGatorGirl, noticed I changed my name for Top!!!

Awww . . . you didn't have to do that . . . although your name is more appealing now. :D

I just hope Tebow doesn't get busted up ribs or high ankle sprains or inherits a last-place defense.

We then may have people on his case. Big time.

-----

[dogfish]

I want to think your way, I just have a feeling that Elway is not sold on Tebow nor is Fox, which both are from different eras of the football game, I would venture to say that they will give him a short rope unlike Orton. I mean come on here, just how bad can Tebow be considering Orton's play. Give Tebow a chance a real chance...I think he will bring in more wins.

Former JaxGatorGirl, noticed I changed my name for Top!!!

why don't you quit imagining that tim's being persecuted, and give elway a chance?


:huh:

[bcbronc]

why don't you quit imagining that tim's being persecuted, and give elway a chance?


:huh:

Elway has had his chance and he's yet to confirm his undying faith in all things Tebow. How many chances you willing to give that loser, dog?

[topscribe]

Maybe, but Brister had some WHEELS. His rollout on Monday Night vs KC was EPIC. I mean DIRTY DOG EPICNESS! :D

BVP had some great wheels, too. :whoknows:

-----

[dogfish]

Elway has had his chance and he's yet to confirm his undying faith in all things Tebow. How many chances you willing to give that loser, dog?

dude, i like elway. . .

[topscribe]

dude, i like elway. . .

I guess his fame didn't spread all the way to Canada?

-----

[LordTrychon]

BVP had some great wheels, too. :whoknows:

-----

One of my favorite plays of all time was when BVP came in...

And Plummer split out wide left.

I think that was the Chiefs as well.

That was EPIC.

[topscribe]

One of my favorite plays of all time was when BVP came in...

And Plummer split out wide left.

I think that was the Chiefs as well.

That was EPIC.

If you remember, BVP had his own 35-40 yard run. It was in preseason, IIRC.

-----

[chazoe60]

If we do draft a QB this year I hope it's Ponder. I have a feeling he will be the best of this class by a good amount.

[TXBRONC]

I want to think your way, I just have a feeling that Elway is not sold on Tebow nor is Fox, which both are from different eras of the football game, I would venture to say that they will give him a short rope unlike Orton. I mean come on here, just how bad can Tebow be considering Orton's play. Give Tebow a chance a real chance...I think he will bring in more wins.

Former JaxGatorGirl, noticed I changed my name for Top!!!

I agree Elway and Fox are not quite sold on Tebow as our franchise quarterback but honestly don't think they will jump to conclusions. As far as eras are concerned the era that Elway played is that much different than it is today as far how the game is played. From what I've read it sounds like Elway and Co. want to give Tebow a chance because they know no one will out work him but needs to be working with McCoy and Gase to improve his skills as quarterback. They like him as football player but they want to love him as quarterback.

I wouldn't worry about the fact that Elway has looked at several of this year quarterback prospects. I really don't see them taking a quarterback early in this draft. Maybe they will late depending whose available but there is just way to much work to do on defense to just ignore it. On the off chance that they do I suggest you stay away from Dove Valley because if we take quarterback Dogfish is threatening to go on a shoot spree. :shocked:

[KCL]

Elway has had his chance and he's yet to confirm his undying faith in all things Tebow. How many chances you willing to give that loser, dog?

Well considering the season hasn't even started plus all the crap going on right now...how can anyone be sure that Tim won't get his chance?

[Northman]

BVP had some great wheels, too. :whoknows:

-----


Dont go there. :lol:

[Northman]

If we do draft a QB this year I hope it's Ponder. I have a feeling he will be the best of this class by a good amount.

Ponder sucks. No effing way i want him around my beloved team.

[TXBRONC]

I guess his fame didn't spread all the way to Canada?

-----

Yet another reason to blame Canada. :heh:
Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

[HORSEPOWER 56]

If we do draft a QB this year I hope it's Ponder. I have a feeling he will be the best of this class by a good amount.

My feelings exactly. He's the most polished and the one who played 4 years in a pro style offense at FSU.

Of all the guys in the draft this year, I honestly think he's the one who will end up as the best pro. He's this year's Drew Brees - not the biggest arm, but he's accurate, mobile enough to manipulate the pocket and smart enough to read and react well to defenses.

[topscribe]

If we do draft a QB this year I hope it's Ponder. I have a feeling he will be the best of this class by a good amount.

I'm thinking more like Locker. Insane mobility and a howitzer arm.

More "Ewlay-ish," perhaps?

-----

[TXBRONC]

I'm thinking more like Locker. Insane mobility and a howitzer arm.

More "Ewlay-ish," perhaps?

-----

True but he also has problems with his accuracy.

[topscribe]

True but he also has problems with his accuracy.

True that. He's going to have to work long and hard on that. If he does
improve on his accuracy, he's really going to be something, IMO . . .

-----

[chazoe60]

Ponder sucks. No effing way i want him around my beloved team.

Yeah, well, you suck. :elefant:

[JaxBroncoGirl]

why don't you quit imagining that tim's being persecuted, and give elway a chance?


:huh:

Persecuted is YOUR TERM, not mine. Again, I am not sold on Elway nor Fox BUT, I am giving them a chance like everyone else. Just think they should give the guy a real chance.

Elway was a great player I am not sold on the fact the being a GREAT PLAYER translates into the business end for any one.

[TXBRONC]

Persecuted is YOUR TERM, not mine. Again, I am not sold on Elway nor Fox BUT, I am giving them a chance like everyone else. Just think they should give the guy a real chance.

Elway was a great player I am not sold on the fact the being a GREAT PLAYER translates into the business end for any one.

He's been a very successful businessman so I don't his ability to run a business. He also understand what it takes to be a great quarterback in the NFL.

I guess I'm not understanding what Elway and Co have done that's got you spooked. Elway, Xanders, and Fox have looked at several of the quarterbacks in this draft that in and of itself mean whole lot of anything because they have also looked at bunch of other players and different positions. I haven't seen anything that gives me the impression that Elway and Fox wont give Tebow a chance.

[vandammage13]

I'm thinking more like Locker. Insane mobility and a howitzer arm.

More "Ewlay-ish," perhaps?

-----

Locker = 1/2 Tebow...(3/4 at best)

[GEM]

He's been a very successful businessman so I don't his ability to run a business. He also understand what it takes to be a great quarterback in the NFL.

I guess I'm not understanding what Elway and Co have done that's got you spooked. Elway, Xanders, and Fox have looked at several of the quarterbacks in this draft that in and of itself mean whole lot of anything because they have also looked at bunch of other players and different positions. I haven't seen anything that gives me the impression that Elway and Fox wont give Tebow a chance.

That article that Carol posted yesterday states that Elway confirmed that he has looked at 300+ players, some more closely than others. On another note, the guys on the Ticket were just saying that each time they have talked to Elway, he praises a different player. He's giving no hints to no one about who he really wants. I think the media ran with the QB stuff because it fills papers and people read. Right now, because no one is showing their true colors, reporters are no different than gossip columnists.

[Softskull]

That article that Carol posted yesterday states that Elway confirmed that he has looked at 300+ players, some more closely than others. On another note, the guys on the Ticket were just saying that each time they have talked to Elway, he praises a different player. He's giving no hints to no one about who he really wants. I think the media ran with the QB stuff because it fills papers and people read. Right now, because no one is showing their true colors, reporters are no different than gossip columnists.

Elway never bad mouths anyone. "Well, Jay's a great guy and should take this team far". "Well, Tim's a super competitor and I really love the kids heart". I'm going to have say something about me one of these days.

[GEM]

Elway never bad mouths anyone. "Well, Jay's a great guy and should take this team far". "Well, Tim's a super competitor and I really love the kids heart". I'm going to have say something about me one of these days.

He's transparent, but limitedly so. He wants the fans to know what is going on, without truly knowing the exacts of what is going on.

We have the #2 spot on the draft board. He wouldn't be doing his job if he weren't creating some smoke and mirrors and trying to maximize that pick.

Now if on that Thursday night they say the Broncos have picked a QB at #2....I will join Dogfish on a shooting spree of Dove Valley, but I really don't see that happening.

[dogfish]

thanks, i appreciate the support. . . .

[TXBRONC]

That article that Carol posted yesterday states that Elway confirmed that he has looked at 300+ players, some more closely than others. On another note, the guys on the Ticket were just saying that each time they have talked to Elway, he praises a different player. He's giving no hints to no one about who he really wants. I think the media ran with the QB stuff because it fills papers and people read. Right now, because no one is showing their true colors, reporters are no different than gossip columnists.

Darn that Elway he is such used car salesman. :tsk: :D

[GEM]

Darn that Elway he such used car salesman. :tsk: :D

Damn skippy....earned him $82.5 Mil when he sold. :shocked:

[TXBRONC]

Damn skippy....earned him $82.5 Mil when he sold. :shocked:

No poopola on that.