Klis: Bad deals come back to haunt Broncos in draft

[Denver Native (Carol)]

You never know..McD might do well in SL since he did well in NE...He just wasn't cut out to handle the job in Denver which goes w/o saying.

He was not/is not HC material yet, but may be later on.

[KCL]

He was not/is not HC material yet, but may be later on.

Yep...he may be best suited to be an OC...I'm not sold on Haley at all as a HC...Him and McD remind me of one another..what saved Haley is having Pioli there...to a point anyway.

[I Eat Staples]

Btw there are already forums that do not hate Josh or every move he made.
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Go there.

[Lonestar]

Btw, there are forums where thread derailers don't bring up their hate for shanahan in every thread.

You keep spreading the lies about me hating mikey.

I keep stating that I like mikey the head coach, loathed mikey the GM.

Not sure when your going to get that.
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[claymore]

Its Just the cool club thinks they can't be wrong. That Josh is totally responsible for the state of the broncos. That their believed mikey had zero sum in how we got to be choosing #2.

Just do not understand how they can see it only that way.
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How in the hell Is Shanahan to blame?????? :laugh::laugh::laugh: Holy moly. Youve lost it dude.

All the folks youve argued with the past few years about the state of the Broncos.... Thats why we were pissed Jr. Cause we knew we would become this shitty team.

You bought into McD hook line and sinker. He was the issue. You are overly focusing on Shanahan because you are emotionally invested in hating him.

[TXBRONC]

I think it applied to the final Shanny years and the entire Josh era

I thought everything that Klis wrote about was post Shanahan. That doesn't mean he bares no responsibility for his past mistakes. It just means Klis focused on the last two years.

[TXBRONC]

One other thing I would like to add is that bring up the last ten years is irrelevant because the fact is McDaniels replaced over 80% of the roster that he inherited. What did he replace that 80% with? More of the same.

[atwater27]

How in the hell Is Shanahan to blame?????? :laugh::laugh::laugh: Holy moly. Youve lost it dude.

All the folks youve argued with the past few years about the state of the Broncos.... Thats why we were pissed Jr. Cause we knew we would become this shitty team.

You bought into McD hook line and sinker. He was the issue. You are overly focusing on Shanahan because you are emotionally invested in hating him.

Lonestar should pay you for that grade of counseling. Pay the man, JR.

[Northman]

Jr you're large volume of posts say otherwise.

It wasn't but two years ago Carol provided a link to a Charger message board (it just before we faced them in San Diego '09) and you THANKED them for beating us because it brought about the firing of Shanahan which you said at that time wanted for the last 10 years.

Really? Wow. Thats pretty low.

[Lonestar]

Got a link. I suspect that was taken out of context.

Or Maybe even those that read it heard what they wanted to hear.

It is no secert that some on here dislike me for unknown reasons.


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[claymore]

Oh my...

[TXBRONC]

Got a link. I suspect that was taken out of context.

Or Maybe even those that read it heard what they wanted to hear.

It is no secert that some on here dislike me for unknown reasons.


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As I said before you're usually pretty blunt especially when it comes to Shanahan.

It's also no secret that it's not dislike for you personally it has to do with something of things that are said.

[Lonestar]

Would be interesting to do a poll to see (if folks would be honest) just how many thought that mike should have been fired. When he was or knowing what they know now when it wS time to make the change.

I suspect that most know in their hearts he has done nothing for this franchise lather than fade on the latter parts of every season and in lots of cases the team struck first got a lead and then coasted or in alot of cases hung on for wins in games.

Sure there were wins but we always got our asses kicked in the playoffs smoke and mirrors rarely work there. Good solid football which was played in the second of the three early superbowl runs.

If y'all were happy with that then your expectations ar much lower than mine.

Yes I know that Joshes teams where not contenders, but IMO we were heads in the correct direction with players nothing that a couple more solid drafts and team cohesiveness would not have cured.
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[Lonestar]

Let me add I was surprised mike got fired. Shocked actually did not think Pat had it in him. Was I happy that he was gone yes IMO it was time to move on he took us as far as he could with the players he choose.


It took an utter melt down in those last three games to make pat see that something needed to be changed.

Time to move on. As has been said to me perhaps it is time to spend some time following this whom you idolize.

Does not mean you can't spend time here and post your ideas.
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[Northman]

Would be interesting to do a poll to see (if folks would be honest) just how many thought that mike should have been fired.

Considering that with the Goodman's in place and a true rebuild was already underway i thought the firing was a surprise. But, i understood Pat's thought process and that Mike had waited to long to do that while at the same time his continued carousel at DC was becoming futile.


Sure there were wins but we always got our asses kicked in the playoffs smoke and mirrors rarely work there.

Its all about perspective when it comes to the playoff blowouts. Against the Ravens, NO TEAM played them close including the Giants in the SB. So Denver was hardly alone when it came to getting their arses kicked that year. The Colts had our number twice and Manning has had out number for a number of years now even with Josh at the helm. Likewise, we had the Pats number. Denver just doesnt fair well against Manning but does well against NE. The Steeler game? Yea, we got our asses kicked. But, the Steelers remind me a lot of that team we had in 98' going on that run. It was just their year plain and simple.


If y'all were happy with that then your expectations ar much lower than mine.

Am i happy if we make the playoffs? You betcha. I dont care how or when we make it. Just getting there with a chance to do something makes me happy as a Bronco fan.


Yes I know that Joshes teams where not contenders, but IMO we were heads in the correct direction with players nothing that a couple more solid drafts and team cohesiveness would not have cured.
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And your in the minority. Nothing that Josh did showed ANY progress and the poorous 4-12 record was a reflection of that. I feel much better with Fox in place that much is for certain.

[TXBRONC]

Let me add I was surprised mike got fired. Shocked actually did not think Pat had it in him. Was I happy that he was gone yes IMO it was time to move on he took us as far as he could with the players he choose.


It took an utter melt down in those last three games to make pat see that something needed to be changed.

Time to move on. As has been said to me perhaps it is time to spend some time following this whom you idolize.

Does not mean you can't spend time here and post your ideas.
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No one is idolizing Shanahan Jr just facts. Besides that it has also been said many times over that people should be able with discuss McDaniels on its own merits. As it was mentioned earlier everything that Klis brought up were McDaniels piss poor decisions not Shanahan's.

[TXBRONC]

If y'all were happy with that then your expectations ar much lower than mine.

Yes I know that Joshes teams where not contenders, but IMO we were heads in the correct direction with players nothing that a couple more solid drafts and team cohesiveness would not have cured.
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I think most people here have just as high of expectations as you do.

I expect the head able to manage his players and staff without getting into pissing contests at every turn.

I expect the head coach to take reponsibilty for his own actions and failing of his team rather taking his staff in front of the owner just to embarrass them.

As far as being headed in the right direction apparently Bowlen didn't think so.

I expect the coach to act ethically. I expect him not lie to the public and most the owner about their roll in spygate. I also expect them not to hire a buddy knowing he was heavily invovled spygate and then try hide it.

I expect them to win. So at the very my standards and most everyone else are every bit as high as your standards.

As far as being headed in the right direction apparently Bowlen didn't think so and his opinion counts the most.

[Lonestar]

North I've been in the minority all my life so nothing new there at all. I saw signs improvement in the running game once the OL was stabilized. Passing game well nonsuch to improve there other than red zone.
Defense sucked but has for years DBs are ok with Bailey coming back ayers and doom just need some studs in the middle something we have not had for along time. MLB de and safety have been semi weak spots for awhile.
Did he need to purge so many Players I thought so considering how bad the defense has been for years.
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[BroncoNut]

good Lord. Jr, is this true?

[KCL]

North I've been in the minority all my life so nothing new there at all. I saw signs improvement in the running game once the OL was stabilized. Passing game well nonsuch to improve there other than red zone.
Defense sucked but has for years DBs are ok with Bailey coming back ayers and doom just need some studs in the middle something we have not had for along time. MLB de and safety have been semi weak spots for awhile.
Did he need to purge so many Players I thought so considering how bad the defense has been for years.
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Damn JR Switch some names and I could have sworn this was about the
Chiefs...:lol: well before last season I guess.

[Lonestar]

good Lord. Jr, is this true?

Are you telling me you were ok with mikes record the last decade and thought he could win more rings.
Or was he tired and run his race need time off to recharge.

Do you ever think that he would have allowed a qualified GM or DC to do their job.

I know I don't. We needed to get our ass kicked for Pat to make up his mind.
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[GEM]

:yawn: Still talking about Shanahan?

That's so 2000 and late.

[KCL]

We needed to get our ass kicked for Pat to make up his mind.
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Well Jr...I think this statement could go for McD as well..because honestly he didn't do the Broncos organization any good and if KC had the same record last season like they did with Haley's first season..I wouldn't have wanted Hunt to keep him around...to be honest I don't care for Todd Haley but that's besides the point.

[GEM]

Let's just hope that Fox can make us forget about Shanahan and McDaniels. :prays:

[TXBRONC]

Let's just hope that Fox can make us forget about Shanahan and McDaniels. :prays:

It will probably be easier to forget McDaniels than it will Shanahan because of past accomplishment. Maybe somewhere in the future mention Fox as Superbowl winning coach.

[KCL]

I think maybe McD may have gotten more respect had he went ahead and started Tebow when it was obvious the Broncos were struggling..at least just to see what he could do.I am glad that KC started their young rookies from the git go.I don't follow the college players but dog told me from the beginning I would love Berry and he was right.He adapted well from the college level to the Pros.

[TXBRONC]

I think maybe McD may have gotten more respect had he went ahead and started Tebow when it was obvious the Broncos were struggling..at least just to see what he could do.I am glad that KC started their young rookies from the git go.I don't follow the college players but dog told me from the beginning I would love Berry and he was right.He adapted well from the college level to the Pros.

I don't if it would have helped very much. By that time his creditability was shot.

[WARHORSE]

Has ANYONE here seen Lonie Paxtons tatoos??????


You people need to take the time to check them out, and get GRATEFUL for what you have.



PERSPECTIVE is everything.................said Bill Belichick to Josh McD.......you NEED Laurence Maroney........I dont.






:coffee:

[Lonestar]

Well Jr...I think this statement could go for McD as well..because honestly he didn't do the Broncos organization any good and if KC had the same record last season like they did with Haley's first season..I wouldn't have wanted Hunt to keep him around...to be honest I don't care for Todd Haley but that's besides the point.

Unlike anyone else Here I saw light at the end of the tunnel.

I understand where he was trying to take us. so I do not see the disaster that everyone else does.
I saw the imporvement in play from the beginning of his regime to the end. Except from the defense. And who knows what it qould have been like with doom there allmyear and less injuries in the db area.

Got to have the players on the field consistently to meld as a team.

I was willing to give him another year to develop the kiddies he had on the team.
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[MileHighCrew]

Unlike anyone else Here I saw light at the end of the tunnel.

I understand where he was trying to take us. so I do not see the disaster that everyone else does.
I saw the imporvement in play from the beginning of his regime to the end. Except from the defense. And who knows what it qould have been like with doom there allmyear and less injuries in the db area.

Got to have the players on the field consistently to meld as a team.

I was willing to give him another year to develop the kiddies he had on the team.
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8-8 to 4-12 is improvement?????:confused: Do you own and business and are you hiring?:D

[Northman]

Unlike anyone else Here I saw light at the end of the tunnel.

I understand where he was trying to take us. so I do not see the disaster that everyone else does.
I saw the imporvement in play from the beginning of his regime to the end. Except from the defense. And who knows what it qould have been like with doom there allmyear and less injuries in the db area.



Well, first off homie you cant blame injuries. Especially if your not going to give Shanahan a pass when he had hurt players at key positions. I mean, fair is fair. Secondly, you mentioned an improvement in the run game but failed to mention the worse play in the passing game when that happened. Thats not improvement no matter how you try and spin it. As you said, maybe McD had some "good" ideas but none of it came to light and with his constant attitude problem with players/asst coaches he did himself no favors. At the end of the day all you have is blind faith in terms of this "light at the end of the tunnel" statement. But in real life and real time he did nothing but only make the team worse than it was when he got it.

[Lonestar]

8-8 to 4-12 is improvement?????:confused: Do you own and business and are you hiring?:D

Yes and no.
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[Lonestar]

Well, first off homie you cant blame injuries. Especially if your not going to give Shanahan a pass when he had hurt players at key positions. I mean, fair is fair. Secondly, you mentioned an improvement in the run game but failed to mention the worse play in the passing game when that happened. Thats not improvement no matter how you try and spin it. As you said, maybe McD had some "good" ideas but none of it came to light and with his constant attitude problem with players/asst coaches he did himself no favors. At the end of the day all you have is blind faith in terms of this "light at the end of the tunnel" statement. But in real life and real time he did nothing but only make the team worse than it was when he got it.

You can't be serious and tell me that mike did not have issues with players or coaches are you.

I guess that I saw improvement in the quality of players he brought in few if any scum bags. Lots of potential just needed time to develope.

North I know you love the donkeys just as much as I do so how about we agree to disagree. I wil not change your mind and vice Versa.

Perhaps me being in another state that has almost zero coverage of them makes it easier not to see the daily tv and radio coverage that just might have been slanted.
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[KCL]

8-8 to 4-12 is improvement?????:confused: Do you own and business and are you hiring?:D

No it wasn't an improvement but hell it didn't bother me...:lol:

[BeefStew25]

You can't be serious and tell me that mike did not have issues with players or coaches are you.

I guess that I saw improvement in the quality of players he brought in few if any scum bags. Lots of potential just needed time to develope.

North I know you love the donkeys just as much as I do so how about we agree to disagree. I wil not change your mind and vice Versa.

Perhaps me being in another state that has almost zero coverage of them makes it easier not to see the daily tv and radio coverage that just might have been slanted.
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Analbus lives in another state also Einstein.

[KCL]

Yes and no.
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:faint:

As Johnny Mac use to say.........

http://image.spreadshirt.com/image-server/image/composition/4166495/view/1/producttypecolor/2/type/png/width/378/height/378/black-mcenroe-you-can-not-be-serious-by-wam-bags_design.png

Come on JR...Chiefs under Haley in 2 years went from 4-12 to 10-6...that was
an improvement..and I still wasn't that thrilled since they got their asses handed to them in the playoffs...you can honestly say they improved or am I misunderstanding you? Not trying to slam you..I just don't get that..and again maybe I misunderstood.

[KCL]

You can't be serious and tell me that mike did not have issues with players or coaches are you.

I guess that I saw improvement in the quality of players he brought in few if any scum bags. Lots of potential just needed time to develope.

North I know you love the donkeys just as much as I do so how about we agree to disagree. I wil not change your mind and vice Versa.

Perhaps me being in another state that has almost zero coverage of them makes it easier not to see the daily tv and radio coverage that just might have been slanted.
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donkeys...lmao.

[Tned]

You can't be serious and tell me that mike did not have issues with players or coaches are you.

I guess that I saw improvement in the quality of players he brought in few if any scum bags. Lots of potential just needed time to develope.

North I know you love the donkeys just as much as I do so how about we agree to disagree. I wil not change your mind and vice Versa.

Perhaps me being in another state that has almost zero coverage of them makes it easier not to see the daily tv and radio coverage that just might have been slanted.
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Wasn't North talking about McDaniels? :confused: What does Shanahan have to do with the train wreck that was the Broncos two year McExperiment?

Just a question, you do realize that the Broncos front office canned McDaniels and not the fans, right? You can blame the fans or media all you want, but the front office couldn't stand by with the combination of questionable player moves, 5-17 run (I believe worse 22 game stretch in club history) and the spygate II embarrassment.


Yes and no.
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:thud:

[dogfish]

Just a question, you do realize that the Broncos front office canned McDaniels and not the fans, right? You can blame the fans or media all you want, but the front office couldn't stand by with the combination of questionable player moves, 5-17 run (I believe worse 22 game stretch in club history) and the spygate II embarrassment.



:thud:

you forgot 59-14 to the faders, at home. . .


:FML:

[Tned]

you forgot 59-14 to the faders, at home. . .


:FML:

To be honest, I actually have forgotten most of that game. By the third TD in the first quarter, or just into the second, I was pretty much shit faced (double black russians), while watching it on my laptop in a German bar. I think it might be the only Broncos game in a couple decades that I didn't watch to the end. My battery died somewhere in the third quarter or early fourth, but everything after the early second is pretty much a blur.

So, I have pretty much forgotten that one. lol

[KCL]

you forgot 59-14 to the faders, at home. . .


:FML:

:lol:

The fade swept the division..who would have thought?

[KCL]

To be honest, I actually have forgotten most of that game. By the third TD in the first quarter, or just into the second, I was pretty much shit faced (double black russians), while watching it on my laptop in a German bar. I think it might be the only Broncos game in a couple decades that I didn't watch to the end. My battery died somewhere in the third quarter or early fourth, but everything after the early second is pretty much a blur.

So, I have pretty much forgotten that one. lol

Are you sure your battery died? Or did you in a drunken rage smash your
laptop?

:couch:

[TXBRONC]

Well, first off homie you cant blame injuries. Especially if your not going to give Shanahan a pass when he had hurt players at key positions. I mean, fair is fair. Secondly, you mentioned an improvement in the run game but failed to mention the worse play in the passing game when that happened. Thats not improvement no matter how you try and spin it. As you said, maybe McD had some "good" ideas but none of it came to light and with his constant attitude problem with players/asst coaches he did himself no favors. At the end of the day all you have is blind faith in terms of this "light at the end of the tunnel" statement. But in real life and real time he did nothing but only make the team worse than it was when he got it.

There is really no way to spin this positively in McDaniels favor and be taken seriously. Bowlen in time as owner has fired four coaches. All but McDaniels of got to coach out the string of their final season. That speaks volumes about the problems being much, much deeper than the wins ans loses. Also doesn't matter one iota if anyone here thinks there was "light at the end of the tunnel" because it's obvious the guy who signs the checks didn't see this proverbial light.

[Tned]

Are you sure your battery died? Or did you in a drunken rage smash your
laptop?

:couch:

Now that you mention it, I had to replace my laptop a month later, because it kept shutting down. Definately didn't smash it, might have spilled some of my russians in it, or banged it a bit. That was a bad night (game started around 10:00 German time I think).

[dogfish]

To be honest, I actually have forgotten most of that game. By the third TD in the first quarter, or just into the second, I was pretty much shit faced (double black russians), while watching it on my laptop in a German bar. I think it might be the only Broncos game in a couple decades that I didn't watch to the end. My battery died somewhere in the third quarter or early fourth, but everything after the early second is pretty much a blur.

So, I have pretty much forgotten that one. lol

lucky bastage!

[Tned]

lucky bastage!

Didn't feel lucky the next morning... :sad:

[rcsodak]

Let me go find some wood you can fashion into a cross so you can be a real martyr.... ;)

Yeah....we'd hate for any diversity in opinions on your forum. :coffee:
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[KCL]

Didn't feel lucky the next morning... :sad:

That's why I don't drink..the last time I can say I was even half way
drunk was a year ago on April 2nd...I have my reasons.

[Lonestar]

Originally Posted by MileHighCrew
8-8 to 4-12 is improvement????? Do you own and business and are you hiring?

which I responded to with


Yes and no.
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sorry y'all were confused


:faint:

As Johnny Mac use to say.........



Come on JR...Chiefs under Haley in 2 years went from 4-12 to 10-6...that was an improvement..and I still wasn't that thrilled since they got their asses handed to them in the playoffs...you can honestly say they improved or am I misunderstanding you? Not trying to slam you..I just don't get that..and again maybe I misunderstood.

Yep you improved but y'all have been sucking up talent the past few years while being a bottom feeder also.

Unlike DEN dafting middle rounds since the super bowl years and sucking at that save one year 06 but then some feel that was not so hot either. none of the day one picks are still in DEN.. therefore can't produce for us like your guys can.

I'm happy for Y'all because I know how painful it is to have a train wreck for a HC.


donkeys...lmao.

Been donkeys for decades lots of us old timers affectionally call them that as in the early years there was not much to be proud of..


Wasn't North talking about McDaniels? :confused: What does Shanahan have to do with the train wreck that was the Broncos two year McExperiment?

Just a question, you do realize that the Broncos front office canned McDaniels and not the fans, right? You can blame the fans or media all you want, but the front office couldn't stand by with the combination of questionable player moves, 5-17 run (I believe worse 22 game stretch in club history) and the spygate II embarrassment.




I suspect the fans had a lot to do with him being canned just as the media did.. Had they not raised such a ruckus I suspect that Pat would have kept him another year. to see how things progressed.

[Tned]

Yeah....we'd hate for any diversity in opinions on your forum. :coffee:
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Hogwash, there is all kinds of diversity, and I certainly don't control what people think, which is evidence that I was in the small minority in being critical of many of McDaniels moves during the first year or so of his tenure (or destruction, depending on how you want to label it), before so many others jumped on board.

As I have said many times, a message board is lame if it doesn't have a large diversity of opinions. Where it becomes a problem is when posters feel they have to belittle others, or bait others by bringing up off topic stuff, in order to win their arguments.

On "my forum" as YOU put it, no opinion has ever been censored or stopped, so lets not try and insinuate otherwise, because that would be below you.

[KCL]

Yep I was confused :crazy:

[atwater27]

Yes and no.
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Post of the month!

[KCL]

Post of the month!

You're late to the party...see my post above!

[Tned]

I suspect the fans had a lot to do with him being canned just as the media did.. Had they not raised such a ruckus I suspect that Pat would have kept him another year. to see how things progressed.

I have it on pretty good authority that isn't the case.

What got him fired was primarily the embarrassment of the spygate II stuff, which combined with the 5-17 record (after the 6-0 start), questionable personal moves/drafting and refusal to play Tebow, was too much. Especially when the front office clearly didn't see a light at the end of the tunnel with McDaniels.

If Bowlen and company made the decisions based on the fans, then Shanahan would never have been fired, because you claim that most fans (other than you) think he walks on water. Why would Bowlen risk upsetting the fan base by firing the only man besides Jesus ever to be capable of walking on water?

[TXBRONC]

I suspect the fans had a lot to do with him being canned just as the media did.. Had they not raised such a ruckus I suspect that Pat would have kept him another year. to see how things progressed.

You suspect Bowlen would have kept joshy around another year based on what? The facts as we have them goes completely contrary to your guessing.

[KCL]

Yep you improved but y'all have been sucking up talent the past few years while being a bottom feeder also.

Unlike DEN dafting middle rounds since the super bowl years and sucking at that save one year 06 but then some feel that was not so hot either. none of the day one picks are still in DEN.. therefore can't produce for us like your guys can.

I'm happy for Y'all because I know how painful it is to have a train wreck for a HC.



You talking about Haley or Herm?

[TXBRONC]

You talking about Haley or Herm?

Nah he's talking about McDaniels. :heh:

[KCL]

I have it on pretty good authority that isn't the case.

What got him fired was primarily the embarrassment of the spygate II stuff, which combined with the 5-17 record (after the 6-0 start), questionable personal moves/drafting and refusal to play Tebow, was too much. Especially when the front office clearly didn't see a light at the end of the tunnel with McDaniels.

If Bowlen and company made the decisions based on the fans, then Shanahan would never have been fired, because you claim that most fans (other than you) think he walks on water. Why would Bowlen risk upsetting the fan base by firing the only man besides Jesus ever to be capable of walking on water?

I have to agree with Tned here...I don't think the fans made a difference in the choice...I think owners do what they feel is best for the team.For years Chiefs fans wanted Peterson gone but it was only after Lamar died that his son got rid of him...Clark Hunt only kept him on for one more year before he hired Pioli.

[GEM]

I thought he liked the HC, not the GM? Shanny was a train wreck, what exactly does that make joshy?

[KCL]

Nah he's talking about McDaniels. :heh:

He couldn't have been..he was talking about the Chiefs.

[KCL]

I thought he liked the HC, not the GM? Shanny was a train wreck, what exactly does that make joshy?

The caboose? :whoknows:

:lol:

[rcsodak]

Btw, there are forums where thread derailers don't bring up their hate for shanahan in every thread.
funny.
neither I nor lonestar have ever used the word hate, when referring to shanny. And yet, some of y'all have unabashedly called mcd every name in the book. And that was the day he got hired.
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[Tned]

I have to agree with Tned here...I don't think the fans made a difference in the choice...I think owners do what they feel is best for the team.For years Chiefs fans wanted Peterson gone but it was only after Lamar died that his son got rid of him...Clark Hunt only kept him on for one more year before he hired Pioli.

Yep. I'm not going to say that when Invesco starts having the smallest crowds that Denver has seen in decades that it isn't a factor, but there is no indication that it was among the primary factors.

[atwater27]

And yet, some of y'all have unabashedly called mcd every name in the book. And that was the day he got hired.
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Further proof of our football acumen. Don't be jealous.

[KCL]

funny.
neither I nor lonestar have ever used the word hate, when referring to shanny. And yet, some of y'all have unabashedly called mcd every name in the book. And that was the day he got hired.
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I guess they could see into the future....:lol:

just messing with you rc.

[TXBRONC]

I thought he liked the HC, not the GM? Shanny was a train wreck, what exactly does that make joshy?

A nuclear holocaust.

[Tned]

funny.
neither I nor lonestar have ever used the word hate, when referring to shanny. And yet, some of y'all have unabashedly called mcd every name in the book. And that was the day he got hired.
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I'm not sure which ya'lls that you are talking about, but I always posted with respect about McDaniels than Jr did about 'mikey'. I have on a handful of occaissions posted the word joshy, just to point out the sillyness of those posters that call Shanahan mikey and refuse to even capitalize it, but beyond that, I have discussed McDaniels in a respectful manner, even when stating my opinion about the job he did here.

I stated my opinion about his moves, and stated pretty early on that my guess was that he would be fired after two, maybe three years, and then very likely get another head coaching gig a few years later and be a successful head coach.

[Tned]

I thought he liked the HC, not the GM? Shanny was a train wreck, what exactly does that make joshy?

Yea, that's what I was wondering when I read that.

[rcsodak]

You keep spreading the lies about me hating mikey.

I keep stating that I like mikey the head coach, loathed mikey the GM.

Not sure when your going to get that.
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Ditto.
Guess some can't differentiate between hating the man vs hating the man's actions (or inactions).
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[Tned]

Ditto.
Guess some can't differentiate between hating the man vs hating the man's actions (or inactions).
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Right back atcha in terms of not liking McDaniels moves and player/personnel skills. Yet, you and your bud keep throwing out 'hate' all the time towards those that disagree with you about McDaniels.

As to you two hating Shanahan. At least in your buddies case, it is because of the vast, vast, vast number of threads where he brought up and bashed Shanahan when Shanahan wasn't the topic. A thread about Orton, and he brings up and bashes Shanahan. A thread about the running game, and he brings up and bashes Shanahan. Etc. Etc. Throw in his 'mikey' tag and using the prevailing legal doctrine of the 'reasonable man' and it would be fair to say that a 'reasonable man' reviewing the evidence (posting history if you will) would conclude there is some major hatage going on.

[TXBRONC]

I have to agree with Tned here...I don't think the fans made a difference in the choice...I think owners do what they feel is best for the team.For years Chiefs fans wanted Peterson gone but it was only after Lamar died that his son got rid of him...Clark Hunt only kept him on for one more year before he hired Pioli.

There is way to much information out there to claim that it's because of the fans that Bowlen shit canned McDaniels.

[KCL]

Remember this old thread???? :lol: If only it had been true...:D
Some funny post in it.

http://www.broncosforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31959&highlight=shanahan+chiefs

[KCL]

There is way to much information out there to claim that it's because of the fans that Bowlen shit canned McDaniels.

I know

[rcsodak]

To be honest, I was shit faced (double black russians), in a German bar. lol
Veeeeeery iiiinteresting.....
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[rcsodak]

Hogwash, there is all kinds of diversity, and I certainly don't control what people think, which is evidence that I was in the small minority in being critical of many of McDaniels moves during the first year or so of his tenure (or destruction, depending on how you want to label it), before so many others jumped on board.

As I have said many times, a message board is lame if it doesn't have a large diversity of opinions. Where it becomes a problem is when posters feel they have to belittle others, or bait others by bringing up off topic stuff, in order to win their arguments.

On "my forum" as YOU put it, no opinion has ever been censored or stopped, so lets not try and insinuate otherwise, because that would be below you.

Fine, T. But you're also allowing posters and mods to" insinuate" differing ideas need to bugger off.
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[Bullgator]

For the life of me I cant understand how a DB fan could possibly have any hate towards Shanahan... IMO hating on the coach who brought mile high the ONLY 2 championships in franchise history is retardulous™

[rcsodak]

I have it on pretty good authority that isn't the case.

What got him fired was primarily the embarrassment of the spygate II stuff, which combined with the 5-17 record (after the 6-0 start), questionable personal moves/drafting and refusal to play Tebow, was too much. Especially when the front office clearly didn't see a light at the end of the tunnel with McDaniels.

If Bowlen and company made the decisions based on the fans, then Shanahan would never have been fired, because you claim that most fans (other than you) think he walks on water. Why would Bowlen risk upsetting the fan base by firing the only man besides Jesus ever to be capable of walking on water?

I disagree. Fans weren't coming to the games. Mr Bowlen, iirc, cited that and 'hearing' from the fans as contributing to his decision.
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[rcsodak]

I'm not sure which ya'lls that you are talking about, but I always posted with respect about McDaniels than Jr did about 'mikey'. I have on a handful of occaissions posted the word joshy, just to point out the sillyness of those posters that call Shanahan mikey and refuse to even capitalize it, but beyond that, I have discussed McDaniels in a respectful manner, even when stating my opinion about the job he did here.

I stated my opinion about his moves, and stated pretty early on that my guess was that he would be fired after two, maybe three years, and then very likely get another head coaching gig a few years later and be a successful head coach.
I know you did.
And I said" some of y'all". Not All of y'all. ;)
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[rcsodak]

Right back atcha in terms of not liking McDaniels moves and player/personnel skills. Yet, you and your bud keep throwing out 'hate' all the time towards those that disagree with you about McDaniels.

As to you two hating Shanahan. At least in your buddies case, it is because of the vast, vast, vast number of threads where he brought up and bashed Shanahan when Shanahan wasn't the topic. A thread about Orton, and he brings up and bashes Shanahan. A thread about the running game, and he brings up and bashes Shanahan. Etc. Etc. Throw in his 'mikey' tag and using the prevailing legal doctrine of the 'reasonable man' and it would be fair to say that a 'reasonable man' reviewing the evidence (posting history if you will) would conclude there is some major hatage going on.
Well, for one, I only capitalize on occasion, especially on my phone. Can't tell you how many times I get done typing a couple sentences, look up, and realize I"d hit the 'alt' key instead and have to delete and start over. Personally, I only make it a point of cap'ing one name, otherwise, its just not worth the pain.
And I use shanny as its shorter.
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[dogfish]

Veeeeeery iiiinteresting.....
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yea. . . "man gets drunk in german bar"


real news flash there, eh?



:rolleyes:

[rcsodak]

yea. . . "man with sweatered french poodle gets drunk in german bar"


real news flash there, eh?



:rolleyes:

Even eeeerierrrrr
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[Lonestar]

I suspect the fans had a lot to do with him being canned just as the media did.. Had they not raised such a ruckus I suspect that Pat would have kept him another year. to see how things progressed.



I have it on pretty good authority that isn't the case.

What got him fired was primarily the embarrassment of the spygate II stuff, which combined with the 5-17 record (after the 6-0 start), questionable personal moves/drafting and refusal to play Tebow, was too much. Especially when the front office clearly didn't see a light at the end of the tunnel with McDaniels.

If Bowlen and company made the decisions based on the fans, then Shanahan would never have been fired, because you claim that most fans (other than you) think he walks on water. Why would Bowlen risk upsetting the fan base by firing the only man besides Jesus ever to be capable of walking on water?


I guess I did not make myself clear, Pat had to respond to the fan base as well as the media that Josh dissed when he first came to town. They could not get to him prior tot eh "spygate" ordeal be cause he was Pats handpicked guy.

When that happened they had enough fuel for the fire to inflame the fans and they as well as the media got to Pat and more or less forced his hand.

The record did not help matters but I also suspect that Joshes instance that Tebow was not ready was the last straw. Pat had to make nice with the fans. or risk even more season ticket cancellations then they already had.

The fans where talking with their pocket books.

Now you can believe what you want (your good authority) and I'll believe what I wish. Logical thinking.

[Lonestar]

Well, for one, I only capitalize on occasion, especially on my phone. Can't tell you how many times I get done typing a couple sentences, look up, and realize I"d hit the 'alt' key instead and have to delete and start over. Personally, I only make it a point of cap'ing one name, otherwise, its just not worth the pain.
And I use shanny as its shorter.
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yes the iphone is a huge pain to cap.

and this was explained in detail, yet he continues to bring it up like it is a capitol offense no pun intended.

[dogfish]

Even eeeerierrrrr
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rc, have you been drinking?


:huh:

[dogfish]

yes the iphone is a huge pain to cap.

and this was explained in detail, yet he continues to bring it up like it is a capitol offense no pun intended.

hah. . . it's easy on my plain old dumb phone. . .

but if iphone sucks as hard as itunes, i'm not surprised. . . i'm going to get the sprint evo when i update. . . i'll let you know how the touchscreen works. . . ;)



of course, i obviously couldnt' care less if you capitalize. . . but i still laugh when i think about that post that looked like you dropped your phone in water. . .

:laugh:

[BeefStew25]

I guess I did not make myself clear

Every single effing day.

[Northman]

funny.
neither I nor lonestar have ever used the word hate, when referring to shanny. And yet, some of y'all have unabashedly called mcd every name in the book. And that was the day he got hired.
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Emmm, no incorrect. Here is a few guys who spoke on the day of the hiring. Although there are a couple of guys (Clay/Dogfish/Lex) who werent convinced there are a few "interesting" names who only turned on McD when shit went from bad to worse. Even Cutler had some really great things to say (contrary to LS's propraganda) about working with McD. But no one was calling the guy any names the day of the hire like you state.

http://www.broncosforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31109&highlight=Josh+McDaniels+hired

Dogfish

hmmm. . .


i kinda think the decision blows, but i'm going to try hard not to pass judgement until i have some results to base it on. . . i wanted spags badly, but what do i know? if we actually hire mcdermott it'll go an awfully long way towards pacifying me-- especially if we also bring in a badass DL coach like carl hairston. . .

i'm pretty leary of hiring a belichik assistant-- IMO the magic in new england comes from belly and brady, maybe scott P-- but he did do damn good work with cassel this year, so we'll see. . . worst case scenario, i suppose it turns out to be a mistake and life goes on-- best case scenario we've got another shanahan or gruden on our hands that can run the team for 14 more years or longer. . . i don't love hiring a guy whose age and experience level are roughly consummate with wally cleaver, but maybe it will work out for the best. . . bitching about it isn't going to change anything, so i guess all we can do is wait and see who else he brings in, and what direction we go in the draft and free agency-- i just hope he has the brains to run a balanced attack instead of a pass-happy "try to outscore everyone" approach. . . but i'm not particularly hopeful on that front-- cassel threw the ball 35-40 times almost every game this year. . . i'm also afraid that, given the way they did things in new england, we may be looking at a continued reliance on running back by scrub committee. . . . please god let him at least be committed to building an actual defense!



G-Money

The thing that impresses me about McDaniels is versatility.

2006, 2007 and 2008 were three TOTALLY different years for the Patriots offense. 2006 had ridiculously terrible receivers, 2007 was a juggernaut at WR and offense in general, 2008 had to ride on the shoulders of the backup from Game 1 all the way through the end.

He excelled with all 3 versions of the offense. The man is versatile, and not locked into one way of doing things. He put together great offenses out of backups or starters, blue-chippers or rejects.

Versatility's under-rated in this league. Lots of coaches can put together great gameplans with the perfect weapons. Far fewer can take what they are given - whatever its quality - and make it deliver.

Doesn't mean he'll be a great HC, but it is impressive.

If we were gonna take a 32 year old wunderkind, he's my pick. Now let's see who he brings with on his next McGuyver job.


Dreadnought

Agreed - these hires have given me the first glimmer of light in an otherwise bleak and hopeless offseason. Capers is a Pro, and actually knows a bit about building a real defense, so a good man to have on the payroll in some capacity. McDaniels won't screw up the offense by deciding to convert us to a ball control 3 yards and a cloud of dust outfit, notwithstanding the existing talent we have on hand. It might all work out OK

Lex

I cant wait until this is over with. This really sucks. Hopefully if he doesnt deliver right away the fan reaction will be so intense that he'll resign before the end of the season and then Pat can screw this up again. Wow, this suck. Thanks, Pat, you drunk.



This was a funny interaction with UnderArmour and Doggy:


UA: McDaniels has the power of the hoodie though!

Doggy: i hope he didn't bring any videocameras with him from new england. . . .


Lonestar

The coach calls the shots and everyone should have gotten that message from pop warner up..

Anyone that thinks he is got more power than the HC is nuts.. unless over course your a raider..

I suspect that Pat would not have chosen him if he were a shrinking violet he did that once with the guy that mikey replaced will not happen again..

HE learned what to do to win and whatnot to do and get caught doing it best of all worlds.. if cheating was his idea then perhaps I will have a different idea about him down the line.. but if it was some assistant that did it and he was not involved then more power to him for learning what NOT to do..


Topscribe

Red Miller was a good coach, having taken over a solid club that was built by
John Ralston, the coach he succeeded. But I don't see many similarities
between McDaniels and Miller. McDaniels is a nice guy, from what I see and
hear. Miller wasn't . . . which was to Miller's and the Broncos' advantage since
Ralston was "too" nice, and they got just what they needed at the time: a
foot planted in the middle of their butts.

Which is the only thing that worries me because the locker room is loaded
with young players who need direction, but it has a dearth of seasoned vets,
who are Broncos to the core, to guide them. They really need very strong
leadership from the coaches. I hope they get it.


http://www.broncosforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32443&highlight=Josh+McDaniels+hired

Jay Cutler

Cutler has spoken at length with new head coach Josh McDaniels on two separate occasions, the day after McDaniels was hired in Denver and Wednesday, just after Cutler arrived in Tampa. “It went really well,” Cutler said. “We talked about a lot of stuff, he’s very energetic, when I got off the phone I was excited, I really was ... just talked to him about the importance of our relationship.”

Cutler had been vocal in Shanahan’s departure initially offering, “I’m not happy at all,” but with a few weeks having passed and having spoken to Bowlen, Shanahan and McDaniels, Cutler said he understood why Bowlen made the change.

“I think it’s a good thing,” Cutler said. “Looking back on it, obviously everyone was shocked to see Mike go. But a month removed from it, I can kind of see the reasoning why he had to make the move. You’re at a place so long the stuff gets repetitive, you hear the same stories, the same talks. It’s time to move on.

“(I) talked to Mike after the whole thing went down. He sounded good. He’s disappointed; I think he understands kind of the reasoning. I think he was ready to go somewhere else and do something else.”

[TXBRONC]

I disagree. Fans weren't coming to the games. Mr Bowlen, iirc, cited that and 'hearing' from the fans as contributing to his decision.
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Actually no he didn't. In the letter to fans he said understood their concerns but by no stretch of the imagination is that the same thing as saying I fired him because your pisses off.

[Tned]

Fine, T. But you're also allowing posters and mods to" insinuate" differing ideas need to bugger off.
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No, they have "insinuated" that blanket insults of posters and bringing up the same OFF TOPIC crap in every thread is the issue.

You and Jr/Lonestar want to bash Shanahan, make a Shanahan thread, don't turn EVERY Broncos related thread into a rehash of the Shanahan hate. He's two coaches ago and he's not the topic of the vast majority of these threads.

Don't confuse people being sick of the rinse and repeat "you think mikey walks on water", "you don't think mikey did any wrong", "I can't help it if you were happy with mediocrity under mikey", "mikey drafted worse then McDaniels", "mikey's wife wasn't as hot as McDeniels", etc., etc, etc. in threads NOT related to Shnahan with a problem with diverse thoughts.

Criticize Shanahan all you want when it's on topic, just stop turning every thread into a Shanahan bash.

[atwater27]

I guess I did not make myself clear, Pat had to respond to the fan base as well as the media that Josh dissed when he first came to town. They could not get to him prior tot eh "spygate" ordeal be cause he was Pats handpicked guy.

When that happened they had enough fuel for the fire to inflame the fans and they as well as the media got to Pat and more or less forced his hand.

The record did not help matters but I also suspect that Joshes instance that Tebow was not ready was the last straw. Pat had to make nice with the fans. or risk even more season ticket cancellations then they already had.

The fans where talking with their pocket books.

Now you can believe what you want (your good authority) and I'll believe what I wish. Logical thinking.

Guess what? The fans are RIGHT!!! Deal with it.

[TXBRONC]

Guess what? The fans are RIGHT!!! Deal with it.

But the bottom line is that the fan didn't get him fired. His bad decision making did.

[atwater27]

Emmm, no incorrect. Here is a few guys who spoke on the day of the hiring. Although there are a couple of guys (Clay/Dogfish/Lex) who werent convinced there are a few "interesting" names who only turned on McD when shit went from bad to worse. Even Cutler had some really great things to say (contrary to LS's propraganda) about working with McD. But no one was calling the guy any names the day of the hire like you state.

http://www.broncosforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31109&highlight=Josh+McDaniels+hired



I looove this silkamilkamonico quote from that thread...

Congratulations coach McDaniels...

...now get to work on that defense!!

[MNPatsFan]

"mikey's wife wasn't as hot as McDeniels".hmmm so you are saying that McDaniels was hotter than Shanny's wife?:eek:

WOW and OUCH for Shanny's wife.:laugh:

[KCL]

hmmm so you are saying that McDaniels was hotter than Shanny's wife?:eek:

WOW and OUCH for Shanny's wife.:laugh:

And for Shanny himself...;)

[TXBRONC]

And for Shanny himself...;)

I have no idea what she even looks like.

[KCL]

I have no idea what she even looks like.

I don't either..I was trying to make a funny..I failed.

[TXBRONC]

I don't either..I was trying to make a funny..I failed.

Would it help if I laughed now? :D