Swinging For the Fences- It Has To be Fairley or Miller

[Ziggy]

The Broncos can't miss with the 2nd pick in the draft. It's been reiterated by John Fox, X-man, and Elway himself. The question is.....does can't miss mean that the Broncos can't take a player that can bust, or that they can't miss taking the next hall of famer. I say it's the latter.

What we do know for sure is that some things are certain:
1. John Elway goes for broke. He did it throughout his career, and he's did it during his time as an owner in the AFL. He threw more interceptions than touchdowns 2 of his first 3 years in the league. In 2003, he fired the entire coaching staff of his arena league team and started over.
2. John Fox knows defense, and he knows what kind of an impact a great defensive player can have on a team. During his first year as head coach of the Carolina Panthers, the team took a rookie defensive end with the 2nd pick in the draft and coach Fox turned the last ranked defense into the 2 ranked D in one season.
3. The vast majority of draft experts agree that this is the best draft for defensive lineman in the modern era.

The Denver Broncos need to rebuild this defense. This pick has to not only be solid, it has to be a game changer. It has to be a player that can take over a game. It has to be a player that opposing teams have to game plan around. That's why I think that Denver has to pass on Patrick Peterson and Marcell Dareus.

Dareus is a monster against the run, and may very well turn out to be a good pass rusher. Then again, he may not. Patrick Peterson? We've spent the last decade watching how much an elite corner cannot turn around a defense without a great pass rush.

That's why I think that there are only 2 players that the Broncos are targeting. Both can take over a game, and instill fear into opposing offenses.

1. Von Miller. This guy is a pure football player and a great pass rusher. His production is unquestioned. He can turn the corner better than anyone coming out of the draft since Derrick Thomas, and he can drop into coverage when asked to. He's a leader with high football IQ, and freakish balance and speed in pads. The only question is, can he make enough of an impact in a 4-3 defense. I believe that Fox can tailor the D to fit his strengths, and get the most out of his skills.

2. Nick Fairley- Pure beast on the field. Folks can talk about the one year wonder facet all they want to. He played this last season against the best competition in college football, and he dominated. When everything was on the line in the national championship game, he stepped up and dominated. He may not have the high floor that Dareus does, but his ceiling is much higher. This guy has the talent to be hall of fame material. He's a natural pass rusher, and is solid against the run. Finding tackles in the NFL that can stop the run and provide a great pass rush is nearly impossible. There's a reason that Albert Haynesworth was the most sought after commodity in free agency 2 years ago.


Can the Broncos trade down and still get one of these guys? It's possible, but not guaranteed. If they take either one with the 2nd pick in the draft, I'll be happy boom or bust. It's time for the Broncos to knock it out of the park.

[topscribe]

Zig, you provided the reason I'm not thrilled at the prospect of Von Miller in the
Broncos' case. He is a beast and will provide an unstoppable presence in a 3-4
defense, IMO.

But the Broncos have already said they are going primarily 4-3, which gives rise
to your question as to whether Fox can mold the player to his defense. There
should not be any question to a prospect to be taken at #2. To me, that pretty
much leaves Miller out for what they want to do, and it's between Fairley and
Dareus.

So I agree with you regarding Fairley. Doc Bear's excellent piece in "It's All Over,
Fat Man!" (http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/denvers-2-pick-dilemma-prime-or-choice) is a primary reason I have swung toward Fairley. As you said, Dareus
might be a bit ahead of Fairley at this point, but Fairley has a superstar ceiling,
IMO.

-----

[TXBRONC]

I would be happy with taking Fairley but that is assuming that the Panther take Dareus. If Dareus is available I think Denver shouldn't hesistate to take him. Maybe Fairley will end up being better than Dareus but I wouldn't want to bet the farm on it.

[LTC Pain]

I would be happy with taking Fairley but that is assuming that the Panther take Dareus. If Dareus is available I think Denver shouldn't hesistate to take him. Maybe Fairley will end up being better than Dareus but I wouldn't want to bet the farm on it.

Yes, this! :beer: :defense: :salute:

[arapaho2]

The Broncos can't miss with the 2nd pick in the draft. It's been reiterated by John Fox, X-man, and Elway himself. The question is.....does can't miss mean that the Broncos can't take a player that can bust, or that they can't miss taking the next hall of famer. I say it's the latter.

What we do know for sure is that some things are certain:
1. John Elway goes for broke. He did it throughout his career, and he's did it during his time as an owner in the AFL. He threw more interceptions than touchdowns 2 of his first 3 years in the league. In 2003, he fired the entire coaching staff of his arena league team and started over.
2. John Fox knows defense, and he knows what kind of an impact a great defensive player can have on a team. During his first year as head coach of the Carolina Panthers, the team took a rookie defensive end with the 2nd pick in the draft and coach Fox turned the last ranked defense into the 2 ranked D in one season.
3. The vast majority of draft experts agree that this is the best draft for defensive lineman in the modern era.

The Denver Broncos need to rebuild this defense. This pick has to not only be solid, it has to be a game changer. It has to be a player that can take over a game. It has to be a player that opposing teams have to game plan around. That's why I think that Denver has to pass on Patrick Peterson and Marcell Dareus.

Dareus is a monster against the run, and may very well turn out to be a good pass rusher. Then again, he may not. Patrick Peterson? We've spent the last decade watching how much an elite corner cannot turn around a defense without a great pass rush.

That's why I think that there are only 2 players that the Broncos are targeting. Both can take over a game, and instill fear into opposing offenses.

1. Von Miller. This guy is a pure football player and a great pass rusher. His production is unquestioned. He can turn the corner better than anyone coming out of the draft since Derrick Thomas, and he can drop into coverage when asked to. He's a leader with high football IQ, and freakish balance and speed in pads. The only question is, can he make enough of an impact in a 4-3 defense. I believe that Fox can tailor the D to fit his strengths, and get the most out of his skills.

2. Nick Fairley- Pure beast on the field. Folks can talk about the one year wonder facet all they want to. He played this last season against the best competition in college football, and he dominated. When everything was on the line in the national championship game, he stepped up and dominated. He may not have the high floor that Dareus does, but his ceiling is much higher. This guy has the talent to be hall of fame material. He's a natural pass rusher, and is solid against the run. Finding tackles in the NFL that can stop the run and provide a great pass rush is nearly impossible. There's a reason that Albert Haynesworth was the most sought after commodity in free agency 2 years ago.


Can the Broncos trade down and still get one of these guys? It's possible, but not guaranteed. If they take either one with the 2nd pick in the draft, I'll be happy boom or bust. It's time for the Broncos to knock it out of the park.


dareus, fairely or trade down a little

milller is doom....great outside 3-4 lbr, just a solid average de

while i like a dc to tailor a defense to fit the overall talent...i dont think a dc tailoring a defense to fit a single player is whats best...and so we have already stated we are a 4-3...miller is elite in the 3-4...one more speed rusher isnt going to fix the defense..only a strong interior presense will start the healing

[SR]

I don't want Von Miller on the Broncos. Well, I'd love to have him on the team, but not at the cost of passing up Dareus or Fairley (assuming Carolina takes Dareus at #1).

[rcsodak]

You build a D from the middle triangle out. Meaning dtx2/mlb...which are all positions of need, imo.
Indy is a good example of what happens when you start outside first.
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[arapaho2]

You build a D from the middle triangle out. Meaning dtx2/mlb...which are all positions of need, imo.
Indy is a good example of what happens when you start outside first.
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same page...for once

fairley or dareus...no exceptions

[Ziggy]

milller is doom....great outside 3-4 lbr, just a solid average de


Miller and Doom have 2 completely different styles. Miller is a pure linebacker. He's a speed guy, Doom is a leverage guy. They are nothing alike when it comes to playing style or skills. The only thing they have in common is that they both can get to the QB.

[Ziggy]

You build a D from the middle triangle out. Meaning dtx2/mlb...which are all positions of need, imo.
Indy is a good example of what happens when you start outside first.
Mobile Post via Mobile.BroncosForums.com/forums

I agree that a defense is built from the inside out, and that's what Denver needs to do. The 2nd pick in the draft has to be a game changer, regardless of position. The inside of the defense can be built throughout the draft and free agency. I hope the pick is Fairley, but Miller would be fine with me also.

[cuzz4169]

I was reading today that Carolina is in love with 3 players, Newton, AJ Green & Peterson. I see them taking Newton. What does that say for the 2 DT's? Carolina needs Dline just as bad as Denver and they have no interest in the top 2 DT's. I also read that Carolina is not sold on either DT. Neither am I.

Also If they take Newton teams are going to panic and will be calling Denver about that #2 pick. I think we are sitting pretty good.

[TXBRONC]

I was reading today that Carolina is in love with 3 players, Newton, AJ Green & Peterson. I see them taking Newton. What does that say for the 2 DT's? Carolina needs Dline just as bad as Denver and they have no interest in the top 2 DT's. I also read that Carolina is not sold on either DT. Neither am I.

Also If they take Newton teams are going to panic and will be calling Denver about that #2 pick. I think we are sitting pretty good.

So because Carolina isn't sold on Fairley or Dareus they have right?

Why the hell would I trust a team that sold on Cam Newton who has one good year under his belt at an elite program?

[rcsodak]

same page...for once

fairley or dareus...no exceptions

Oh shit.

PPeterson!



:lol:
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[WARHORSE]

You guys looking at Von Miller as a bad pick need to review.

The late great Derrick Thomas played NFL football from 243 lbs to 255 lbs.

A beast with a capitol B.

Von Miller has that same kind of explosiveness.

Just watch him get after the QB, and you'll see.

Add a little more muscle and this guy may be a HOFer.

This guy can sometimes get off the ball before the tackle. Amazing ability.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lG1bydpTzxg&feature=related

[GEM]

Inside on the line. Not another freaking DE/LB who will get changed positions and lose what really makes him special. Inside the freaking line with a body that will eat up Olineman and RB's alike. If we get a guy like that, it opens up guys like Ayers and Doom. We don't need another freaking end or LB who will be moved around AGAIN.

Can we ever get it right?

[WARHORSE]

Inside on the line. Not another freaking DE/LB who will get changed positions and lose what really makes him special. Inside the freaking line with a body that will eat up Olineman and RB's alike. If we get a guy like that, it opens up guys like Ayers and Doom. We don't need another freaking end or LB who will be moved around AGAIN.

Can we ever get it right?


Impact player...regardless of position.

Thing is, the draft pundits are saying this is the best draft for Dlinemen in the MODERN ERA. Thats a loooong time.

We take the BPA, and if thats a DT, then so be it. But if its Miller, then so be it. We have two other high picks in which we can spend BOTH on DTs, and get good players.

Not to mention there are a number of DLinemen who are going to be available once FAgency begins.

Im not saying draft Miller if you have other players above him. But if hes rated higher than Dareus and Fairley, then pull the trigger.

He is PLENTY big enough to play DE in the 43 now, and can add weight as well.

Fairley will have to add, and so will Dareus. The both are lacking upper body strength that they will need.

[TXBRONC]

You guys looking at Von Miller as a bad pick need to review.

The late great Derrick Thomas played NFL football from 243 lbs to 255 lbs.

A beast with a capitol B.

Von Miller has that same kind of explosiveness.

Just watch him get after the QB, and you'll see.

Add a little more muscle and this guy may be a HOFer.

This guy can sometimes get off the ball before the tackle. Amazing ability.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lG1bydpTzxg&feature=related

If the experts are he will be good pick for some team. But that Fairley or Dareus or both may end up being just as good at their respective positions.

From what I've seen and read of Miller is an explosive pass rusher but he also be overwhelmed a the point of attack. One scouting report says he's best suited to being a linebacker in 3-4 FWIW.

[rcsodak]

Impact player...regardless of position.

Thing is, the draft pundits are saying this is the best draft for Dlinemen in the MODERN ERA. Thats a loooong time.

We take the BPA, and if thats a DT, then so be it. But if its Miller, then so be it. We have two other high picks in which we can spend BOTH on DTs, and get good players.

Not to mention there are a number of DLinemen who are going to be available once FAgency begins.

Im not saying draft Miller if you have other players above him. But if hes rated higher than Dareus and Fairley, then pull the trigger.

He is PLENTY big enough to play DE in the 43 now, and can add weight as well.

Fairley will have to add, and so will Dareus. The both are lacking upper body strength that they will need.

Don't MOST rookies?

Even Suh, a man among boys in college, said he got owned, especially as the year progressed.

Miller needs a 34D.

[rcsodak]

If the experts are he will be good pick for some team. But that Fairley or Dareus or both may end up being just as good at their respective positions.

From what I've seen and read of Miller is an explosive pass rusher but he also be overwhelmed a the point of attack. One scouting report says he's best suited to being a linebacker in 3-4 FWIW.



You brought it up. It's up to you prove it. Besides that there have been countless occassions that you have asked others to provide links. What's good for the goose.....

Done playing your silly-assed games?
:coffee:

[TXBRONC]

[/B]



Done playing your silly-assed games?
:coffee:

I'm not playing any silly-assed games. I'm not the one going around asking for links everytime I don't agree with them. That aside it was still a serious question. If you have link or links I liked to see them. I think it's time we get back to topic thread.

Btw:

http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2011vmiller.php

[gobroncsnv]

I would rather see us get the best DT available first...