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DenBronx
09-25-2008, 12:48 AM
I didnt see this posted yet. Sorry if it is...Mods please merge or delete if needed.

What are the chances of Woodyard playing MLB? People complain about his size but he is the same size as Vilma who has been very succesfull in this league. If not MLB then we have to fit him somewhere. I'm not sure because Winborn actually might get the nod before him but couldnt he rotate in and out to help keep them all fresh??? This kid needs to play and frankly I want to see Larsen lay someone out.

And why is Paymah on the field and JMFW not???


http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_10547611

Two relatively young teams will meet Sunday at Kansas City's Arrowhead Stadium. Broncos coach Mike Shanahan said the difference between his 3-0 team and the 0-3 Chiefs could be the play of his youngsters.

"I'm not exactly sure the way (Kansas City) went about it," Shanahan said of the Chiefs' youth movement. "I just know we've been very fortunate to see our young players and step up and play at the level they've played, and hopefully they can keep it up."

Shanahan pointed to rookie tackle Ryan Clady second-year tackle Ryan Harris as players that have solidified the offensive line, and rookie fullbacks Peyton Hillis and Spencer Larsen, plus rookie cornerback Jack Williams and rookie linebacker Wesley Woodyard, as difference makers on special teams and solid backups with long careers in front of them.

Shanahan also noted rookie receiver Eddie Royal, a no-brainer. Royal is a starter who is second on the team with 18 catches, and a star in the making.

"You look at Ryan Clady, he's playing like a vet, and Ryan Harris, even though he's a second-year player, he had back surgery last year and has come back played the way he has," Shanahan. "And a guy like Eddie Royal, who is playing good on offense and special teams.

"Peyton Hillis and Spencer Larson, both at the fullback position and a couple guys that have played extremely on special teams. And you get a guy like Jack Williams that comes in and proves he can play in the preseason, not only at the corner position but also on special teams.

"Wesley Woodyard comes in and is probably one of our top special teams players that we have and will eventually be a starter at linebacker."

Shanahan wasn't done. He also spoke highly of rookie punter Brett Kern and rookie tackle Tyler Polumbus. "A couple free agents that we had at draftable grades and were able to get them as free agents," Shanahan said.

The bottom line, Shanahan said, is that "we feel very good that these guys are not only part of your 53 (man roster) but part of your 45 that dress on game day."

G_Money
09-25-2008, 02:43 AM
My ultimate pie-in-the-sky dream of the way the 08 draft plays out, and the player the Broncos addition turns into (have to pick a player, right?):

Clady = Walter Jones
Royal = Lav Coles
Lichtensteiger = Nalen
Williams = our former Williams if he'd had time to find his path
Torain = slower Ahman Green
Larsen = Keith Burns
Hillis = Griffith (duh) though the popular comp is Alstott if we let him run it.
Barrett = Lawyer Milloy, if he was a physical freak?

Anthony Alridge = Dante Hall
Polumbus = Mark Tauscher
Woodyard = John Mobley

Yeah, total pie in the sky, but wouldn't it be nice?

Except Clady already looks like the class of his draft at OT, certainly in pass protection, through the first 3 weeks.

And Royal is already the starting #2.

And Larsen and Woodyard keep showing up on special teams, and Woodyard is gonna make somebody uncomfortable next Spring while trying to get a starting gig.

And Hillis is our starting FB - when we use one.

No word on Lick, though apparently they like him because they cut vets to keep him on the team instead of trying to squeeze him onto the PS.

Shanny thinks the world of Torain, so maybe we'll get to see that in a few weeks too. And we traded Foxy without even thinking of trying to re-sign him, which might speak to Shanny's feelings about Jack.

It was a draft long on potential and on good-character teammates.

It looked like a project draft. Maybe Woodyard would convert to safety. Barrett had so much to learn to be able to start. Nobody does well on the OL their first year, so Clady would obviously struggle some. Ditto WR, so Royal would be a ST guy for a season. And Torain would spend some time recovering from the foot injury.

But there was some talent there if it would just blossom for us in 2-3 years. All the picks had talent.

And now it looks like a significant portion of them might be able to tap into that talent at the pro level.

I look at that pie-in-the-sky list and think there's no way we get anywhere close to that, but it's nice that a couple of the guys might make it work out by getting in the neighborhood.

And then I think about the Cutler-as-Elway and Baby-TO-as-actual-TO and Scheff-as-Watson and Kuper-as-Hutchinson transformations already taking place from the '06 draft and think..."Nah....again? Really?"

Maybe, yeah.

At least it looks like it'll be a helluva lot of fun to watch. :D

~G

topscribe
09-25-2008, 03:41 AM
But G, why Ahman Green? Why wouldn't you want Torain to become our own TD?

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gobroncsnv
09-25-2008, 06:55 AM
My ultimate pie-in-the-sky dream of the way the 08 draft plays out, and the player the Broncos addition turns into (have to pick a player, right?):

Clady = Walter Jones
Royal = Lav Coles
Lichtensteiger = Nalen
Williams = our former Williams if he'd had time to find his path
Torain = slower Ahman Green
Larsen = Keith Burns
Hillis = Griffith (duh) though the popular comp is Alstott if we let him run it.
Barrett = Lawyer Milloy, if he was a physical freak?

Anthony Alridge = Dante Hall
Polumbus = Mark Tauscher
Woodyard = John Mobley

Yeah, total pie in the sky, but wouldn't it be nice?

Except Clady already looks like the class of his draft at OT, certainly in pass protection, through the first 3 weeks.

And Royal is already the starting #2.

And Larsen and Woodyard keep showing up on special teams, and Woodyard is gonna make somebody uncomfortable next Spring while trying to get a starting gig.

And Hillis is our starting FB - when we use one.

No word on Lick, though apparently they like him because they cut vets to keep him on the team instead of trying to squeeze him onto the PS.

Shanny thinks the world of Torain, so maybe we'll get to see that in a few weeks too. And we traded Foxy without even thinking of trying to re-sign him, which might speak to Shanny's feelings about Jack.

It was a draft long on potential and on good-character teammates.

It looked like a project draft. Maybe Woodyard would convert to safety. Barrett had so much to learn to be able to start. Nobody does well on the OL their first year, so Clady would obviously struggle some. Ditto WR, so Royal would be a ST guy for a season. And Torain would spend some time recovering from the foot injury.

But there was some talent there if it would just blossom for us in 2-3 years. All the picks had talent.

And now it looks like a significant portion of them might be able to tap into that talent at the pro level.

I look at that pie-in-the-sky list and think there's no way we get anywhere close to that, but it's nice that a couple of the guys might make it work out by getting in the neighborhood.

And then I think about the Cutler-as-Elway and Baby-TO-as-actual-TO and Scheff-as-Watson and Kuper-as-Hutchinson transformations already taking place from the '06 draft and think..."Nah....again? Really?"

Maybe, yeah.

At least it looks like it'll be a helluva lot of fun to watch. :D

~G

Cool... now bring me a Mecklenburg, Fletch, and Jones... Need some mortar and brick on the front 4, or 3, or whatever we'll play this week. (I know, likely it's 4) Then get me an Atwater and a Smith.

But overall, we have an obviously good/great crop of youthfulness happening. I think it's apparent that the FO has really turned around draft day in the past few years, compared to how few players we got from 99 - 05. (makes you wish for what could have been with DWill...) When you look at how little cap money we have tied up in FA's who aren't here anymore, we're looking to be really good the next several seasons, especially if we can crank that energy into making a righteous dline. Our last draft year has to be as good as any in Broncos history, and could arguably last a long time into discussions about the best one year drafts ever. Good days ahead, folks.

omac
09-25-2008, 07:14 PM
"I'm not exactly sure the way (Kansas City) went about it," Shanahan said of the Chiefs' youth movement. "I just know we've been very fortunate to see our young players and step up and play at the level they've played, and hopefully they can keep it up."

You noticed, Shanny gave a subtle dig at Carl and Herm? The days during and after the draft, all you could hear from most analysts was how great KC's draft was ... how they're loaded with youthful talent. Well, at least in the early going, our draft class this season is giving much earlier ROI. I won't blame the KC rookies, though; they're just part of the ongoing 5-year plan. :D

G_Money
09-25-2008, 07:43 PM
But G, why Ahman Green? Why wouldn't you want Torain to become our own TD?

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They run differently. TD held the ball closer, bounced off defenders differently...he had different instincts as a runner than Torain. Lemme see if Youtube has anything that might show what I mean.

Torain runs like a slower Ahman Green, at least IMO, and might get injured like Ahman too - which is not a huge slight, since Ahman Green is one of the better runners in the league over the last decade.

TD didn't fumble, he carried a HUGE load of carries, he was unstoppable in the playoffs, and if not for Lepsis destroying his career on that stupid turnover I don't know what else could have come between him and the HOF.

It's not that I wouldn't want Torain to be TD - I just don't think that's his best comp.

~G

G_Money
09-25-2008, 07:59 PM
Torain:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_bdlrXQczU&NR=1

Green (in college):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k543UYkYqz0

They both wave the ball around even when it's well-gripped, lots of arm and shoulder motion, same rolling stride, same hip-shift/body lean when slipping defenders... Green's faster, but they're the same TYPE of RB.

TD:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTza50UcbGo

Straighter upper body, different angle to attackers, arm tucked in traffic and more open in space, better awareness of ball placement re: sidelines, smooth stride acceleration instead of that limping giddy-up motion that comes from hard-planting cleates...

TD ran differently. He saw things differently on the field and moved his body differently in response to those things. Ahman and Torain go into contact like they're hockey players trying to juke a hip-check at the last minute, but have a great rolling, ground-eating stride in the open field . Terrell either goes right through you or he slides by you at an angle that deceives the eye - his acceleration is faster than you think it is and defenders wound up sliding off him like oil down a smooth sheet of glass.

Again, just personal opinion, but Torain is in the Ahman Green type of RB. Beanie Wells is the same sort of style. I just group guys in my head based on style, I suppose.

I would have considered Matt Forte to be more of a TD-style of runner - which is one reason I was so keen to get him in here. :D He's not making me look too bad in my desire to add him, either.

But if Torain can be Slow Ahman Green, I'd sure take it. Hopefully he won't have the same initial trouble adjusting to the league that Ahman had - Shanny isn't known for his patience.

~G

topscribe
09-25-2008, 08:37 PM
Torain:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_bdlrXQczU&NR=1

Green (in college):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k543UYkYqz0

They both wave the ball around even when it's well-gripped, lots of arm and shoulder motion, same rolling stride, same hip-shift/body lean when slipping defenders... Green's faster, but they're the same TYPE of RB.

TD:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTza50UcbGo

Straighter upper body, different angle to attackers, arm tucked in traffic and more open in space, better awareness of ball placement re: sidelines, smooth stride acceleration instead of that limping giddy-up motion that comes from hard-planting cleates...

TD ran differently. He saw things differently on the field and moved his body differently in response to those things. Ahman and Torain go into contact like they're hockey players trying to juke a hip-check at the last minute, but have a great rolling, ground-eating stride in the open field . Terrell either goes right through you or he slides by you at an angle that deceives the eye - his acceleration is faster than you think it is and defenders wound up sliding off him like oil down a smooth sheet of glass.

Again, just personal opinion, but Torain is in the Ahman Green type of RB. Beanie Wells is the same sort of style. I just group guys in my head based on style, I suppose.

I would have considered Matt Forte to be more of a TD-style of runner - which is one reason I was so keen to get him in here. :D He's not making me look too bad in my desire to add him, either.

But if Torain can be Slow Ahman Green, I'd sure take it. Hopefully he won't have the same initial trouble adjusting to the league that Ahman had - Shanny isn't known for his patience.

~G

I see. I understand now.

I did notice a couple things. It seemed to me that Green was not quite as
fast on the field as his 4.3 would indicate . . . he was still fast, just not 4.3
fast. Torain, meanwhile, a 4.5 back when healthy, seems like he might have
some impressive football speed, much as TD did.

I also noticed that Torain tended to carry football players with him when they
were trying to bring him down.

Of course, maybe I'm seeing some things I want to see, for obvious reasons.
But I was encouraged.

BTW, I enjoyed the clips, once I muted the sound. :D

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