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View Full Version : Elway's transparency - is he going too far?



PAINTERDAVE
02-04-2011, 11:25 AM
Apparantly on 87.7 The Ticket...
John has acknowledged that Orton and Tebow don't like each other...
and that they are not getting along well.
He said that players getting along is a priority. :beer:

Is there some information that should be withheld? :tsk:

Should the rift between T and O simply be handled within the team? :coffee:

Does this "news" help the team in any way? :confused:

Is Elway becoming gossippy? :listen:

Should Elway learn to just keep his yap shut?
.
.

BroncoJoe
02-04-2011, 11:34 AM
No to the Elway question.

Knowing what we know about the two - which granted is limited - any rift between Tebow and Orton is on Orton.

honz
02-04-2011, 11:35 AM
He said he had heard talk about them not getting along, but hadn't talked to either of them about it personally.

Denver Native (Carol)
02-04-2011, 11:51 AM
He said he had heard talk about them not getting along, but hadn't talked to either of them about it personally.

That is EXACTLY what he said.

From 1st post in this thread:

Is Elway becoming gossippy?

Should Elway learn to just keep his yap shut?

When he is ask a question - obviously he is expected to answer it. So, if he says something like - I would rather not go there, or I would rather not comment on that - would that not open up a bag of worms - would everyone not be trying to interpret exactly what the reason was for him not wanting to address the question??????

People have complained that in previous years, the fans were told little or nothing. And now, with John stating that there would be open communication, there is criticism there :tsk::tsk:

Denver Native (Carol)
02-04-2011, 11:56 AM
They now have up on the ticket some of what John said this morning. At the bottom, you can listen to all of it - Parts 1 and 2

http://www.877theticket.com/page.php?page_id=59#vmix_media_id=20776951

PAINTERDAVE
02-04-2011, 11:56 AM
Sorry if I brought up a subject that is prickly.

I think it is a fair question , however...

is there a line that should not be crossed?

Or maybe I should simply delete the thread and move away from the keyboard.

Not trying to be a troublemaker.... just wondering if the pendulum is swinging too far the other way?

BroncoJoe
02-04-2011, 11:57 AM
They say that no question is stupid, however...

:)

OrangeHoof
02-04-2011, 12:00 PM
This is a football team, not the State Department. If Elway wants to talk, let him. If he hasn't learned yet when he needs to shut up, it won't take much to find out.

PAINTERDAVE
02-04-2011, 12:01 PM
They say that no question is stupid, however...

:)

Thanks, Joe... I appreciate that.... :D

lgenf
02-04-2011, 12:11 PM
well this regime has stated they will be OPEN, and there will be OPEN communication to the fans, so aside from giving out the playbook I think it's OK

any rift between TT and KO shouldn' be news, QB1 and QB2 are rarely friends, and with that little tid bit about the Vegas trip leaking out, it really comes as no surprise.

KO just continues to look like to DB (fill in your own version) more and more and TT will continue to work hard and get better, and surplant him as the clear no 1 QB for the Broncos and their future.

Since John is in the Front Office and not the locker room I am sure there will be dust ups that happen that he knows nothing about, or only hears something about it, and that will be all, but it's not like in this case that he was airing out dirty laundry, just a questioned asked and answered.

And as for the Original Poster, backing away from the keyboard is never a good thing in the off season, we need something to talk about and since it is our off season, the CBA is going in the crapper, there won't be anything ANYTHING to talk about (no trade rumors, no FA pick ups, nothing) only thing we got left to look forward to is the draft, then silence until this new CBA gets done.

so type away and ask provacative questions, stirr the pot a little

PS. did you hear that Tebow invited KO to join him at church last weekend?












just kidding

PAINTERDAVE
02-04-2011, 12:14 PM
Lol ....................



Dang this CBA deal... I read a big article in USA TODAY...
it looks like we are headed to a lockout..
they are not even close to any agreement...

vandammage13
02-04-2011, 12:46 PM
I think it's a fair question to ask...I prefer the FO to be a little more open about things.

I think that this apparent rift between Orton and TT is just another reason that we need to dump Orton as soon as the CBA gets done. The last thing we need is a malcontent on the bench. Orton has shown in those last 3 games that he is not interested in helping Tim while on the sidelines. So if he's not even going to lend his experience to help out the young QB, then exactly what value does Orton bring to the team if he's not the starter? We need a Chad Pennington/Jake Delhomme type vet who would relish the opportunity to mentor a young QB like Tebow while also being a solid option in case of an injury for a game or two.

MadMax
02-04-2011, 12:50 PM
Sorry if I brought up a subject that is prickly.

I think it is a fair question , however...

is there a line that should not be crossed?

Or maybe I should simply delete the thread and move away from the keyboard.

Not trying to be a troublemaker.... just wondering if the pendulum is swinging too far the other way?

I don't think it's a prickly subject, it's just that you took his comments slightly out of context(although from how you worded it, probably not intentionally).

If Elway does interviews and on his own brings up that Tebow and KO hate eachother, or in answering a question goes into way to much depth about it, that is too transparent because it hurts our trade value for either of them.

But in this case Elway was asked about it and it, and his answer is basically acknowledging the same reports everyone has heard, and him saying but I haven't talked to either of them about it so I can't confirm. That's not being too transparent, that's just being honest, and about as honest as you can get without hurting their trade value(any more than it already has been by the rumors).

MadMax
02-04-2011, 12:53 PM
So anyways as to the fine line, I want to hear an executive be honest, there is no need for him to pretend like things that are already in the press aren't out there. The other teams won't believe him, and the fans will slowly lose trust over issues like that. If Elway start tweeting our draftboard, or puts a webcam of our trade offers up, then I will think he's being too transparent.

silkamilkamonico
02-04-2011, 12:54 PM
Sorry if I brought up a subject that is prickly.

I think it is a fair question , however...

is there a line that should not be crossed?

Or maybe I should simply delete the thread and move away from the keyboard.

Not trying to be a troublemaker.... just wondering if the pendulum is swinging too far the other way?

This is your 3rd Orton vs Tebow thread in the past week.

What gives?

MadMax
02-04-2011, 12:57 PM
well this regime has stated they will be OPEN, and there will be OPEN communication to the fans, so aside from giving out the playbook I think it's OK

any rift between TT and KO shouldn' be news, QB1 and QB2 are rarely friends, and with that little tid bit about the Vegas trip leaking out, it really comes as no surprise.

KO just continues to look like to DB (fill in your own version) more and more and TT will continue to work hard and get better, and surplant him as the clear no 1 QB for the Broncos and their future.

Since John is in the Front Office and not the locker room I am sure there will be dust ups that happen that he knows nothing about, or only hears something about it, and that will be all, but it's not like in this case that he was airing out dirty laundry, just a questioned asked and answered.

And as for the Original Poster, backing away from the keyboard is never a good thing in the off season, we need something to talk about and since it is our off season, the CBA is going in the crapper, there won't be anything ANYTHING to talk about (no trade rumors, no FA pick ups, nothing) only thing we got left to look forward to is the draft, then silence until this new CBA gets done.

so type away and ask provacative questions, stirr the pot a little

PS. did you hear that Tebow invited KO to join him at church last weekend?


I heard Tebow only invited his linemen and Brady Quinn to church.




;)

The Glue Factory
02-04-2011, 12:59 PM
Apparantly on 87.7 The Ticket...
John has acknowledged that Orton and Tebow don't like each other...
and that they are not getting along well.


And this is news we didn't already know? :coffee:

/sarcasm



My first thought was that this wasn't really news at all given the whole Vegas trip thing. I guess Orton doesn't like playing second fiddle when there's someone able to play first chair. Can't say I'd feel any different in his situation; losing the starting position to a rookie for a second time. At some point you'd think he would get the hint that there's better talent out there.

vandammage13
02-04-2011, 01:05 PM
Perhaps I'm overanalyzing here, but after listening to the interview, I thought it was interesting some of the language Elway used.

Earlier this week, Elway said that if the season started tomorrow, Orton would be the starter....But in this interview when Elway was talking about Orton it was almost like he slipped up when he said "If Kyle does come back...."

Seemed like a slip of the tongue to me, and he also went on to say that he hasn't even spoken to Orton and almost seemed annoyed when he mentioned that Kyle had been out of town the whole time.

Again, I may be over-analyzing here, but it did seem to me that there were some subtle things you could pick out with the language that he used.

BroncoStud
02-04-2011, 01:10 PM
Elway is more than allowed to talk about whatever he wants. I like it, personally.

G_Money
02-04-2011, 01:21 PM
I think John's been very skilled about the whole thing, honestly.

- lets it drop that Tebow is a great football player but not a great QB, something most fans would admit but shows he's not blinded by Tebow's halo and work ethic.

- makes sure that everybody knows Orton is still in the mix when trades ARE allowed to happen by saying he'd probably start tomorrow if that was the season opener. This is for trade value purposes. It also makes sure that Tebow knows he's not gonna be given the job so he might need to prepare for more time on the bench.

- says the two don't get along really well to underscore that if Orton IS back then it's a one-season thing. This is for Orton's benefit.

- mentions Orton hasn't been around to prod Kyle into getting his ass back around Denver if he doesn't want to be the backup this year, as there's no guarantee he gets traded and it's hard to impress potential suitors from the bench.

He's keeping his options open and talking to both players as well as other front offices through the press. It's fine.

There are different styles of communication, and nothing John's done yet makes me think he's swan-diving over the boundaries of useful communication.

I don't expect Orton to start next year, especially with McCoy coming back. That should keep Tebow's familiarity quotient up and not allow Orton a leg up on him in that regard.

But I can absolutely see scenarios that have Orton here and starting over Tebow in 2011. John's getting information to the fans. Whatever distracts them from the abominable 2010 season and gets them excited and talking about 2011 is good. Taking pressure off of anti-press-conference Fox and potential-backup Tebow is also good.

John's gonna be the face and voice of the franchise until the new regime settles in and Tebow (or whomever) actually becomes good.

He's just doing his part, and I'd expect him to continue to do that as we go through the strike.

~G

cuzz4169
02-04-2011, 02:13 PM
Tebow loves everyone....Screw Orton...lol

PAINTERDAVE
02-04-2011, 06:40 PM
This is your 3rd Orton vs Tebow thread in the past week.

What gives?

I thought it was a thread about Elway, the new transparancy, and where is the line that should not be crossed.

Forgive me if I brought up a subject of discussion that falls outside of accepted parameters.

Bosco
02-04-2011, 07:21 PM
Without a doubt, it's gone too far.

It's absolutely shocking to me how Elway could be so blatantly stupid to air this publicly, especially without any first hand knowledge of the situation. Anyone who has even the slightest bit of PR experience would not have done something like this.

KCL
02-04-2011, 07:30 PM
Without a doubt, it's gone too far.

It's absolutely shocking to me how Elway could be so blatantly stupid to air this publicly, especially without any first hand knowledge of the situation. Anyone who has even the slightest bit of PR experience would not have done something like this.

How can you be sure that Elway doesn't have first hand knowledge of the situation? I'm sure Elway knows a lot more than the fans know.

Bosco
02-04-2011, 07:36 PM
How can you be sure that Elway doesn't have first hand knowledge of the situation? I'm sure Elway knows a lot more than the fans know.

Apparently by his own admission, he has not spoken to either of them about what it going on, so that leaves him with nothing but hearsay evidence.

topscribe
02-04-2011, 07:38 PM
All Elway acknowledged is that he had "heard something about it" and had not had the chance to look into it . . .

-----

Bosco
02-04-2011, 07:41 PM
All Elway acknowledged is that he had "heard something about it" and had not had the chance to look into it . . .

-----

Exactly. When the media asks you questions about things like this, you keep your mouth shut. That goes double for when it's essentially a rumor. You don't start controversy that you can avoid.

John should know better.

KCL
02-04-2011, 07:42 PM
Apparently by his own admission, he has not spoken to either of them about what it going on, so that leaves him with nothing but hearsay evidence.

Well I would be willing to bet he still knows more about it than you do plus I agree with what Carol posted.

Bosco
02-04-2011, 07:55 PM
Well I would be willing to bet he still knows more about it than you do plus I agree with what Carol posted.

Where does that come into play? In case you haven't noticed, I'm not questioning the validity of Elway's statements and personally it wouldn't surprise me if they were true. The problem is Elway's failure of what essentially Public Relations 101. True or not, this should have NEVER been aired out in the open. There are a handful of ways you can easily sidestep those questions.

And I agree with Carol too. This is the problem with being "transparent". Personally, if I was running an NFL team I'd have shit so locked down it would make Belichick look like an open book and **** the fans if they don't like it. :cool:

Ravage!!!
02-04-2011, 08:01 PM
:lol: Talk about public relations inexperience and inability to forsee problems!! :lol:

KCL
02-04-2011, 08:01 PM
Where does that come into play? In case you haven't noticed, I'm not questioning the validity of Elway's statements and personally it wouldn't surprise me if they were true. The problem is Elway's failure of what essentially Public Relations 101. True or not, this should have NEVER been aired out in the open. There are a handful of ways you can easily sidestep those questions.

And I agree with Carol too. This is the problem with being "transparent". Personally, if I was running an NFL team I'd have shit so locked down it would make Belichick look like an open book and **** the fans if they don't like it. :cool:

Guess you'll just have to not like it then since you're not running the
show.

Northman
02-04-2011, 08:29 PM
I have no problem with Elway opening it up about the problems on this team.

KCL
02-04-2011, 08:30 PM
I have no problem with Elway opening it up about the problems on this team.

I don't either... :heh:

rationalfan
02-04-2011, 08:52 PM
i think anyone who spends more than an hour a week on a football message board should hope for all the transparency that's possible. it's information that keeps discussion alive.

BroncoJoe
02-04-2011, 08:55 PM
Where does that come into play? In case you haven't noticed, I'm not questioning the validity of Elway's statements and personally it wouldn't surprise me if they were true. The problem is Elway's failure of what essentially Public Relations 101. True or not, this should have NEVER been aired out in the open. There are a handful of ways you can easily sidestep those questions.

And I agree with Carol too. This is the problem with being "transparent". Personally, if I was running an NFL team I'd have shit so locked down it would make Belichick look like an open book and **** the fans if they don't like it. :cool:

What line of work are you in?

Denver Native (Carol)
02-04-2011, 11:02 PM
Exactly. When the media asks you questions about things like this, you keep your mouth shut. That goes double for when it's essentially a rumor. You don't start controversy that you can avoid.

John should know better.

So, John should have said - "I have no clue what you are talking about", and then fans would get up in arms, because he is now executive vice president of football operations, and it sounds like he has no clue if there was/is a problem.

Guess this is a situation where he is damned if he does/damned if he doesn't to some.

tomjonesrocks
02-04-2011, 11:07 PM
Am going to say Elway blew it by disclosing this. Don't think there will be much long-term harm with the gaffe--but there was just nothing gained whatsoever.

Fans already speculated it...no benefit confirming it.

Denver Native (Carol)
02-04-2011, 11:27 PM
Guess people need to listen to what John said. Vic stated something about Orton making fun of Tebow when Tebow was running sprints, so it is more than fan speculation.

For anyone interested in hearing EXACTLY what was said to John, and his response:

http://www.877theticket.com/page.php?page_id=59

nevcraw
02-04-2011, 11:40 PM
What line of work are you in?

cough:

sanitation

hotcarl
02-05-2011, 01:51 AM
i too, am able to use social media and read a newspaper, daps :congrats:

BeefStew25
02-05-2011, 11:11 AM
I have no problem with Elway opening it up about the problems on this team.

Stated the obvious harms no one. Watch:

Joe has a hot wife.

Ravage!!!
02-05-2011, 11:21 AM
So, John should have said - "I have no clue what you are talking about", and then fans would get up in arms, because he is now executive vice president of football operations, and it sounds like he has no clue if there was/is a problem.

Guess this is a situation where he is damned if he does/damned if he doesn't to some.

Yes. If he would have said "I have no comment on that".. that only would have fueled the fire with speculation since its not a denial. Had Elway said something that would have denied the talk, then he would have been a liar, and these guys would have said "you want to bash McDaniels for lying, but not Elway." Elway speaks of having knowledge of the situation, and these guys want to criticize him for it.

The truth is, I think the very person you are responding to, is MUCH more a patriots fan than a Broncos fan.

T.K.O.
02-05-2011, 03:24 PM
or he could have said...."i had'nt heard about any of that"
which then would have givin the impression that he is not paying attention to a potential problem.
so yes he did the right thing and just stated that he did'nt have the facts and only had the same rumor to go off of.
sounds logical and harmless to me !:salute:

silkamilkamonico
02-05-2011, 03:25 PM
I thought it was a thread about Elway, the new transparancy, and where is the line that should not be crossed.

Forgive me if I brought up a subject of discussion that falls outside of accepted parameters.

Please. Everyone knows where your going with these threads, and what you're trying to start. You think Tebow is a God, and Orton is absolute horseshit, and you're only starting these threads to get a rise out of people.

You're usually a pretty good poster, however Tim Tebow would be embarassed with your Orton vs. Tebow obsession.

PAINTERDAVE
02-05-2011, 04:30 PM
Please. Everyone knows where your going with these threads, and what you're trying to start. You think Tebow is a God, and Orton is absolute horseshit, and you're only starting these threads to get a rise out of people.

You're usually a pretty good poster, however Tim Tebow would be embarassed with your Orton vs. Tebow obsession.

LOL. Obsession....? Thats funny.

I have said over and over... I want to see Tebow get a shot.

I have high hopes fo him.

To say I think he is "God" ... could you be any more dramatic?

I have done my best to refrain from talking about Orton any longer..
his play, demeanor and actions speak loud enough for themsleves.

These threads? How about you take one thread at a time.

In this thread I sincerely was questioning wether there is a line
that should not be crossed in this new transparancy.

If you'd bother to read what I have written ...
many times over
you would see that your angry response here is unwarrented.

I, and many others have said many times... we just want to see the kid get a chance.

Do I think he will be great?
Yeah.. I have faith and I am backing him.
If he does not succeed.. if he does not lead the team to many victories?
I'll be surprised.

But I'll still be a broncos fan.

Sorry if I post too much.

Heck.. you should see the posts I've written..
then simply deleted the dang things...
becuase I dont want to piss people off.

You see I DO have a Social Governor inside my being.

I'll sincerely look at my postings..
and try to refrain from being too much a Tebowner.... :salute:

I think maybe it is time for Painter to ride off into the sunset for a while.

This place is full of anger lately. I dont want to contribute to it.

Time to start drawing more and posting less.

Chris90210
02-05-2011, 06:36 PM
I wish I could have my picture taken with john elway. Its a dream of mine:beer:

nevcraw
02-05-2011, 06:49 PM
Please. Everyone knows where your going with these threads, and what you're trying to start. You think Tebow is a God, and Orton is absolute horseshit, and you're only starting these threads to get a rise out of people.

You're usually a pretty good poster, however Tim Tebow would be embarassed with your Orton vs. Tebow obsession.

while you are at it -- ask him why does he always type his posts to make them look a *****ing Haiku?

JaxBroncoGirl
02-05-2011, 08:11 PM
Apparantly on 87.7 The Ticket...
John has acknowledged that Orton and Tebow don't like each other...
and that they are not getting along well.
He said that players getting along is a priority. :beer:

Is there some information that should be withheld? :tsk:

Should the rift between T and O simply be handled within the team? :coffee:

Does this "news" help the team in any way? :confused:

Is Elway becoming gossippy? :listen:

Should Elway learn to just keep his yap shut?
.
.

Not sure about Elway only saw him during his years of playing and can say for sure he is a Bronco. You bring up great points which lead me to ask more questions. I think the Team should handle the situation within the locker room or office. I am sure this is not the first time players do not like one another and have their squabbles. One would think this is not a good situation for either player. I do not like hearing this from Elway because I would think anyone in his position would know how much he can or cannot say. Maybe it is a rookie mistake on Elways part. I will try not to read too much into it.

Just hope things work out. If this is true then we all know how it will play out. One bad apple can ruin the entire pie.

Bosco
02-07-2011, 06:35 AM
So, John should have said - "I have no clue what you are talking about", and then fans would get up in arms, because he is now executive vice president of football operations, and it sounds like he has no clue if there was/is a problem.

There's several different ways he could have handled it. Had it been me, I would have simply said something along the lines of "I personally have not seen any friction between Tebow and Orton" and let it go at that. Quell the drama while protecting your flank in the case it turns out to be true.

Again, that's all Public Relations 101...sayings things without really saying anything. Everyone in the NFL does it. Elway better learn fast.

Dzone
02-07-2011, 10:03 AM
Elway needs to come clean and admit he is jealous of Tim Tebow.

KCL
02-07-2011, 11:29 AM
Elway needs to come clean and admit he is jealous of Tim Tebow.

You're joking...right?

Juriga72
02-07-2011, 11:32 AM
Elway needs to come clean and admit he is jealous of Tim Tebow.

He's already on record saying "I wish I had a career just like Kyle Orton... I mean really, not having to suffer thru all those playoff games. I would have been able to lay 4-5 years more IF I had never played a playoff game ... Like Kyle"