Suggestions for defensive improvements

[broncofaninfla]

As good as our offense is now, I say we pull the trigger and trade some draft picks to get some hepp on defense. Mainly a MLB, Safety and CB to replace Paymah. If we get this defense fixed we are a legitimate super bowl contender this year, no doubt about it. I don't want to wait for the draft next year, I say we pull the trigger now.
What do you guys think?

[NightTrainLayne]

Sounds too much like panic.

The best way to build a team is with a reasoned, patient approach. This season is practice. This off-season we can shore up the defense, and build something that will last for more than just this season.

[Traveler]

Let's say they did decide to make a couple of trades. Exactly who is available?

No one worth trading for IMO. No choice but to hope the offense can keep outscoring the other team until we can draft the necessary players on defense.

As I said in another thread, the 2009 draft should focus soley on defense.

[honz]

Remember that we are on of the youngest teams in the NFL now. No need to make a panic trade. We just need to keep bulding through the draft and letting our young players develop a bit more.

[Beantown Bronco]

Look at the improvement DJ made last year at MLB from the first half of the year to the second. He went from completely clueless to 2nd in the league in tackles.

All it would take is one or two other guys (hopefully at least one of the young guys on the DLine) to undergo a similar level of improvement over the course of this year to take this unit to "respectable" or "average" status. Do that, and this team rolls.

No sense in giving up high picks next year, especially when we've now shown that we can actually do something good with those picks.

[broncofaninfla]

Sounds too much like panic.

The best way to build a team is with a reasoned, patient approach. This season is practice. This off-season we can shore up the defense, and build something that will last for more than just this season.

I agree with that BUT who's to say we are the same team offensivly next year. We have the talent NOW to make waves. I'm not suggesting trading our future away. I'm suggesting we have some moves to improve on our obvious weak points. We are better on defense that wew were last year but by no means are we were we need to be. The is the N-ot F-or L-ong league, I really think we make some moves now to make this team better.

[Mike]

I agree with that BUT who's to say we are the same team offensivly next year. We have the talent NOW to make waves. I'm not suggesting trading our future away. I'm suggesting we have some moves to improve on our obvious weak points. We are better on defense that wew were last year but by no means are we were we need to be. The is the N-ot F-or L-ong league, I really think we make some moves now to make this team better.

We are extremely young on offense. Young O-line, young QB, young RBs, young WRs, young TE. The only offensive weapon Denver might lose is Stokely.

Our offense has just been built. It is fresh out of the wrapper. Now Shanahan is playing with it. Don't worry about the offense. It is set for years...baring injuries.

[broncofaninfla]

We are extremely young on offense. Young O-line, young QB, young RBs, young WRs, young TE. The only offensive weapon Denver might lose is Stokely.

Our offense has just been built. It is fresh out of the wrapper. Now Shanahan is playing with it. Don't worry about the offense. It is set for years...baring injuries.

If our defense doesn't get any better, the load will be on our offense and that WILL result in wear and tear and injuries.

[Mike]

If our defense doesn't get any better, the load will be on our offense and that WILL result in wear and tear and injuries.

And they will fix the defense. No need to get hasty and throw away the future to get it. Been there, done that. Note: This offense CAN and will carry the load.

People are overreacting a bit. SD has one of the leagues most potent offenses in the league. Denver's defense will not face offenses like that every week. They will buckle down and make enough plays at the end of the day.

[Beantown Bronco]

If our defense doesn't get any better, the load will be on our offense and that WILL result in wear and tear and injuries.

The defense has little to no influence on "wear and tear" suffered by the offense. Unless of course the defense (or special teams) gives up TDs on the first play every time, the offense is going to run more or less the same number of plays on average each game whether the defense is ranked 10th or 30th.

[hamrob]

I'll be the first to admit...that this defense had me pulling a Vince Young yesterday. Yeah...it's pretty bad.

But seriously, I think we have to be honest about something...that is that Phillip Rivers is pretty good. In fact he's probably right there with Cutler right now...I'd say just on the crusp of "top-5" in the game:

1. Brady
2. P. Manning
3. Brees
4. Romo
5. McNabb
6. Rothlesberger
7. E. Manning
8. Cutler
9. Rivers
10. Rogers
11. Palmer
12. Favre
13. Hasselbeck
14. Anderson
15. Warner

Now, having said that...the main reason that San Diego was so successful...wasn't the time he was getting (IMO)...but the fact that he is so accurate and can make all of the throws and has 3 very good receivers and a very good backfiled, offensive line etc.

Take a look at our schedule. Out of the top 15 above (my quick list), we have to play Drew Brees this coming week, then Favre & Anderson towards the end of the year and then Rivers again.

That means we have 10 games with teams that have average at best QB's. With our offense...does anyone truly believe someone will beat us with their running game?

My point: This defense is good enough to win a high majority of our games. Teams like San Diego, Pittsburgh and Indianapolis are our competition.

I, realistically could see us going 12-4 or 13-3...provided Cutler stays healthy.

Whose going to beat us? (N.O., Jax, N.E., Cleveland, Jets, Car, Buff, S.D.)...That's our toughest 8 games right there. Who thinks we do worse then to win 4 of those?? N.O., Jax, Buff, are all at home.

Then take a sneak peak at San Diego's schedule. It's tougher than ours with games against Indy and Pitt in addition to the the tough games we have.

We can overcome this defense...and once in the playoffs...everyone raises their game!

[WARHORSE]

I'll be the first to admit...that this defense had me pulling a Vince Young yesterday. Yeah...it's pretty bad.

But seriously, I think we have to be honest about something...that is that Phillip Rivers is pretty good. In fact he's probably right there with Cutler right now...I'd say just on the crusp of "top-5" in the game:

1. Brady
2. P. Manning
2.CUTLER
3. Brees
4. Romo
5. McNabb
6. Rothlesberger
7. E. Manning
8. Cutler
9. Rivers
10. Rogers
11. Palmer
12. Favre
13. Hasselbeck
14. Anderson
15. Warner

Now, having said that...the main reason that San Diego was so successful...wasn't the time he was getting (IMO)...but the fact that he is so accurate and can make all of the throws and has 3 very good receivers and a very good backfiled, offensive line etc.

Take a look at our schedule. Out of the top 15 above (my quick list), we have to play Drew Brees this coming week, then Favre & Anderson towards the end of the year and then Rivers again.

That means we have 10 games with teams that have average at best QB's. With our offense...does anyone truly believe someone will beat us with their running game?

My point: This defense is good enough to win a high majority of our games. Teams like San Diego, Pittsburgh and Indianapolis are our competition.

I, realistically could see us going 12-4 or 13-3...provided Cutler stays healthy.

Whose going to beat us? (N.O., Jax, N.E., Cleveland, Jets, Car, Buff, S.D.)...That's our toughest 8 games right there. Who thinks we do worse then to win 4 of those?? N.O., Jax, Buff, are all at home.

Then take a sneak peak at San Diego's schedule. It's tougher than ours with games against Indy and Pitt in addition to the the tough games we have.

We can overcome this defense...and once in the playoffs...everyone raises their game!

Id say since Brady is out, Cutler belongs right about there at this point and time........:coffee:SA-lurp.

[WARHORSE]

As for making a trade, Im for it only if its worth what we give.

If it helps win the superbowl, then Im all for it.

We have some nice olinemen on the bench.

Next draft, there are some killer LBs and Safeties coming out, and we can get one. Id hate to give up too much.

Lets let these kids watch tape of themselves play, and keep learning.


I honestly think Lynch would help in the run game, cause our safeties dont react to the run quick enough.

[Skinny]

Focusing on improving the defense this year, we need to cook up a pass rush. During much of the pre-season we seemed to do better getting pressure on the QB when we stunted. It was'nt much but it was at the least some pressure, definitely more than we're getting now.

I would like to see us blitz more. I know if you live by the blitz you die by the blitz, but we're dieing now in the pass rush department without it so why not try to create some form of pressure. :noidea:

[hamrob]

I think we will get some pressure on QB's this year...just not guys like Rivers, Manning etc. It's hard to pressure the QB...when the ball is out in 3 seconds. If someone told me before the game that Chambers would toast Champ...I'd say my monies on Champ. We go out and pay 30+ million on a nickle back? Does anyone think we should get rid of bly and pay for a stud in the front 7?

[broncofaninfla]

The defense has little to no influence on "wear and tear" suffered by the offense. Unless of course the defense (or special teams) gives up TDs on the first play every time, the offense is going to run more or less the same number of plays on average each game whether the defense is ranked 10th or 30th.

We can't expect to win shoot outs week in and week out. That is asking too much of any offense and that WILL add some wear and tear to our offense. I want these to be around for years to come. I know it was San Diego and I expected a shoot out. But there were some plays yetserady that showed we CLEARLY need to upgrade some of the postions on defense. I would say we have the worst MLB's in football for one. Also piss poor tackling on special teams. We can upgrade now with some creative trades/signings without sacrficing too many draft picks for next years draft.

[MOtorboat]

We can't expect to win shoot outs week in and week out. That is asking too much of any offense and that WILL add some wear and tear to our offense. I want these to be around for years to come. I know it was San Diego and I expected a shoot out. But there were some plays yetserady that showed we CLEARLY need to upgrade some of the postions on defense. I would say we have the worst MLB's in football for one. Also piss poor tackling on special teams. We can upgrade now with some creative trades/signings without sacrficing too many draft picks for next years draft.

And in Week 1 they dominated the Raiders for much of the game. Its not time to panic because of one shoot out.

[hamrob]

Breaking the game down: Here is what killed us

1. ST's - 103 yd kick return...where's Prator's leg? (7 pts)
2. Chambers beats Champ straight up for a 49 yd TD. (7 pts)
3. Sproles scores on a 60+ yd swing pass...LB's?? (7 pts)
4. Cutler throw an INT in the red-zone (3-7 pts)

So, before we start thinking the sky is falling. Let's first take a peak at why they scored 38 pts. 3 plays (1 on ST's) resulted in 21 pts...and we gave them another 3 pts with Cutler's one real poor decision.

Fact is...when they break down the film...they're going to harp on containment...and not playing in position. Sproles is who made this a game. We shut him down...it's not even close.

[broncofaninfla]

As for making a trade, Im for it only if its worth what we give.

If it helps win the superbowl, then Im all for it.

We have some nice olinemen on the bench.

Next draft, there are some killer LBs and Safeties coming out, and we can get one. Id hate to give up too much.

Lets let these kids watch tape of themselves play, and keep learning.


I honestly think Lynch would help in the run game, cause our safeties dont react to the run quick enough.

Exactly, Jax needs some O linemen badly and they have depth at the LB position. Even though he is a rookie, T. Williams at Jax would be an upgarde over any MLB we currently have.

[Hawgdriver]

Our safeties are a liability. This would be a much different team with a playmaking safety. I hope the light bulb goes off during the season for our guys. If anything, I think we should trade for more picks rather than the opposite; we are young enough to build a team that will dominate for years to come through the draft.

[Gimpygod]

We can't expect to win shoot outs week in and week out. That is asking too much of any offense and that WILL add some wear and tear to our offense. I want these to be around for years to come. I know it was San Diego and I expected a shoot out. But there were some plays yetserady that showed we CLEARLY need to upgrade some of the postions on defense. I would say we have the worst MLB's in football for one. Also piss poor tackling on special teams. We can upgrade now with some creative trades/signings without sacrficing too many draft picks for next years draft.


Technically the worse your defense the less your offense is on the field and hence less wear and tear. I'm with some of the other guys and think we need to sell out to kill a quarterback. The big play is happening anyway so we might as well go the "big risk, big reward" type of defense instead of "play it safe and still Give opposing offense big reward".

[silkamilkamonico]

PLay an absolute perfect game on offense. Then defense might not matter so much.

[Northman]

The answer is simple. Trade away Brandon, Eddie, and Jay for a grade A DE, LB, and S. Then sign Trent Dilfer. Championship!

[deacon]

As good as our offense is now, I say we pull the trigger and trade some draft picks to get some hepp on defense. Mainly a MLB, Safety and CB to replace Paymah. If we get this defense fixed we are a legitimate super bowl contender this year, no doubt about it. I don't want to wait for the draft next year, I say we pull the trigger now.
What do you guys think?

The quickest way to head downhill is to pull off a bunch of trades. Let's look at your suggestions.

Paymah doesn't have a whole lot of experience and is the 3rd best cb on the team. There's no one you can trade for who's gonna be any better right now. You can't afford to pay a quality cb to be the 3rd guy.

Middle lb is a problem but, again, who can you pick up who's better? I was disappointed with Webster's efforts (giving up on that long run by Sproles) but I suspect we've already got a better mlb (Koutavides) on the roster than we can get in a trade. I wouldn't be a bit surprised to see K starting next week in place of Webster.

Safety is the same problem. The only quality guy out there is Lynch and he wouldn't have helped us a bit yesterday.

This is a young team and is going to undergo growing pains. We've got to learn how to play with a lead and also how to play with more intensity. Under the circumstances I think we're way ahead of where I would have predicted. I figured we had a chance to be 1-1 at best.

Hopefully the D will come on as they get more experience. But I really think the main problem, just as last year, is not getting pressure on the QB. Rivers had all day to throw and no defense will be able to stop the pass that way.

[G_Money]

As good as our offense is now, I say we pull the trigger and trade some draft picks to get some hepp on defense. Mainly a MLB, Safety and CB to replace Paymah. If we get this defense fixed we are a legitimate super bowl contender this year, no doubt about it. I don't want to wait for the draft next year, I say we pull the trigger now.
What do you guys think?

Things to consider:

1) We're theoretically now in a blitzing scheme, which is fine. Most people are trying to bring the pressure this year, after watching what the G-Men did to Brady in the Super Bowl. Some of them can do it with just the DL, while we can't do that, so blitzing is gonna be the key for us. EFFECTIVE blitzing, anyway, something that was completely absent from the first two games. So far Slowik's idea of QB pressure looks like Bates's run stopping - nice in theory, but horrible in execution.

2) Our safeties can't cut it. We've known that for at least a couple of years now, but haven't done enough about it. If we're gonna play 8 in the box to stop the run, or bring extra guys on the blitz, then everybody in coverage needs to be very good. We haven't shown that we have a handle on the zone blitz so corner and safety blitzes will require man skills by the rest of our DBs. We don't have a safety with good man skills. That's a problem.

3) If we're not going to blitz, then we need a front 4 that can bring pressure. Ours can't. And pretty much never has. I can't remember if Peppers, Haynesworth, Harris and Will Smith are all still FAs in the upcoming offseason, but we may need to look into the possibility of adding yet another high-priced FA to the defensive line.

4) NONE OF THIS means that we should be dumping draft picks to try to get free agents in here. It's the third scheme in 3 years for the defense, with the third different coordinator. Technically it might be the 4th scheme, since the 2nd half of last year was a Bates/Slowik hybrid frankenstein scheme. Let's let the kids adjust to the new scheme first before we have to add even more players that have to adjust.

5) Especially because we need to keep the team we have before we worry about adding to it. Two games with this offense might have us feeling like we should try for the SB this year and flush away draft picks and money, but we need that money to RE-SIGN Brandon Marshall, and Tony Scheffler, and Elvis Dumervil, and Chris Kuper, and in a couple of years Jay Cutler too.

I don't want one shot at the brass ring. I want to keep adding pieces to our core and see if we can get the right pieces and schemes to win our championship outright, not hope to luck into it.

There's a reason we were 7-9 last year, and it wasn't bad luck. We were outmatched and outclassed by any team resembling a contender.

We don't know how the offense will react when Cutler starts getting pressured - and yes that's the next step for opposing defenses. If he's dangerous with this much time then take away the time. We don't have our franchise back yet, or at least he hasn't revealed himself. I like Hall, but I don't think he's the guy. Our OL still needs to learn where to be on running plays.

Our issues are not solely personnel on defense. Slowik has been a terrible coordinator wherever he's been. Putting all our eggs in the "Slowik will be fine if we get him a MLB and safety and maybe an edge rusher" basket is very, verrrrry premature. He may or may not be the guy to hold down other teams so our offense can outscore them. Let's find that out first while we continue to build through the draft, shall we?

We're sort of the Colts of 2000, sans Edge. It took them a little while to work out all the kinks. Be patient.

Good things come to those who wait - and the way our offense looks now, with its throwback to 1995 feeling, they could be VERY good things.

Don't blow it now by reaching for the prize before our horses are even stretched out.

~G

[Kapaibro]

Anyone have one of those scary jewish/italian/chinese etc etc Grandmothers who terrify the crap out of them?

They don't even need to play, just stand on the sidelines beating Karl Paymah with their handbag!

[broncofaninfla]

I'm not in panic mode with our defense. Merely making a suggestion I think improve our skill level on defense for this season without affecting our draft picks for next year. WE have depth on the o line, we could trade one of those guys to Jax or Ind for a defensive player. Even one of their back ups could prove to be better than what we are fielding right now, especially at MLB, DL and Safety.