Q&A: At last, Broncos admit they have problems

[Denver Native (Carol)]

Today's question about the Broncos comes from Paul. Send your questions via e-mail to jlegwold@denverpost.com.

Q: For more than a decade, the Broncos have played the same old offseason record, that they aren't that bad or far away. Then, the next offseason, come the same excuses. When will the Broncos and a lot of fans get over the denial that they are miles away from being good?

For Legwold's answer, and full article -

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_16932545

[Northman]

The article is right and wrong.

He's right that now we are in shambles and at an alltime low. But he's wrong when he says it started in 06'. In 06' is when the team decided it was going to start rebuilding and start getting young players in to create a dynasty again. Getting Cutler, Marshall, Hillis, Royal, etc was the start of rebuilding. But because Shanny had waited so long to do it that way Bowlen fired him. Then, when McD came in he stripped it all down setting the franchise farther back than it was or needed to be. Had he had the patience to start building up the defense like it should of been and had he had the social skill to deal with players and cordinators alike he would of already had this franchise back on course. Now, whoever comes in is going to have to work on all of it again to right the ship.

[dogfish]

"Mr. Bowlen recognizes, I recognize and everybody in our organization recognizes that we have a lot of work to do to restore the integrity of our organization and the trust that the fans have in this organization. And me, standing up here and delivering those words, won't do that. What will do that is action, and that is what we intend to take, and that starts today."

- Joe Ellis

and if that "action" isn't hiring a real GM, you've just lied to us again and done exactly nothing. . . don't bullshit us, wormtongue!

[Tned]

and if that "action" isn't hiring a real GM, you've just lied to us again and done exactly nothing. . . don't bullshit us, wormtongue!

FWIW, I think they said they will have a different structure. So, that could be Xanders and Elway working together in a GM role, with full control over player moves.

[silkamilkamonico]

The article is right and wrong.

He's right that now we are in shambles and at an alltime low. But he's wrong when he says it started in 06'. In 06' is when the team decided it was going to start rebuilding and start getting young players in to create a dynasty again. Getting Cutler, Marshall, Hillis, Royal, etc was the start of rebuilding. But because Shanny had waited so long to do it that way Bowlen fired him. Then, when McD came in he stripped it all down setting the franchise farther back than it was or needed to be. Had he had the patience to start building up the defense like it should of been and had he had the social skill to deal with players and cordinators alike he would of already had this franchise back on course. Now, whoever comes in is going to have to work on all of it again to right the ship.

IMHO the organization was a lost cause under Shanahan. He was building something great on offense, but we would have never been great because Shanahan insists on trying to win one dimensionally. He continued to ignore the defense, and the special teams was just as bad under him.

IMO Shanahan created a system where offense flourished, regardless who was playing, and defense sucked, regardless of who was playing.

We had the games best CB at the time, and a very potent secondary, and we continued to be among the league's worst. That really says something, IMHO.

[dogfish]

FWIW, I think they said they will have a different structure. So, that could be Xanders and Elway working together in a GM role, with full control over player moves.

that is precisely what i'm afraid of!

[Northman]

IMHO the organization was a lost cause under Shanahan. He was building something great on offense, but we would have never been great because Shanahan insists on trying to win one dimensionally. He continued to ignore the defense, and the special teams was just as bad under him.

IMO Shanahan created a system where offense flourished, regardless who was playing, and defense sucked, regardless of who was playing.

We had the games best CB at the time, and a very potent secondary, and we continued to be among the league's worst. That really says something, IMHO.

Without a doubt Shanny was having problems not only getting quality defensive lineman but getting and sticking with the DC as well. But, it wasnt hard to see that he was indeed trying to at least rebuild the team by going to a youth movement. We may never know if he and the Goodmans could of fixed the defense throught the draft because he was eventually fired.

But, there was no way the offense needed to be stripped down when McD came in. That just catapulted and magnified the problems that this team now has.

[spikerman]

FWIW, I think they said they will have a different structure. So, that could be Xanders and Elway working together in a GM role, with full control over player moves.

That would leave me with about as much confidence in the front office as I have now. Even Elway admitted that he isn't qualified to be a GM. I would assume that he wouldn't want a job like that without a strong personnel guy.

[Dean]

IMHO the organization was a lost cause under Shanahan. He was building something great on offense, but we would have never been great because Shanahan insists on trying to win one dimensionally. He continued to ignore the defense, and the special teams was just as bad under him.

IMO Shanahan created a system where offense flourished, regardless who was playing, and defense sucked, regardless of who was playing.

We had the games best CB at the time, and a very potent secondary, and we continued to be among the league's worst. That really says something, IMHO.

If I remember correctly 2008, Bailey was injured and only played in about 8 games. The murdered starter opposit him was replaced by an over-the-hill Bly. Our Pro bowl safety was in his last year or retired the year before (I don't remember which and am not interested enough to look it up. How potent is that? :rolleyes:

Shanahan allowed the D-line to decay and he deserves the blame for that. IMO Mike had rebuilt the offense and was ready to begin the rebuild of the defense. Of course, that is just my opinion but is what it looked like from here.

[silkamilkamonico]

If I remember correctly 2008, Bailey was injured and only played in about 8 games. The murdered starter opposit him was replaced by an over-the-hill Bly. Our Pro bowl safety was in his last year or retired the year before (I don't remember which and am not interested enough to look it up. How potent is that? :rolleyes:

Shanahan allowed the D-line to decay and he deserves the blame for that. IMO Mike had rebuilt the offense and was ready to begin the rebuild of the defense. Of course, that is just my opinion but is what it looked like from here.

We had arguably one of the best secondary's in the NFL, that was built for the sole purpose of beating the Indianapolis Colts, only to get utterly blown out of the playoffs by them.......2 years in a row.

LMAO at Mike "rebuilding" the defense. Shanahan didn't have a clue how to rebuild the defense. That's the entire point. If you can't see that this year, when he turned Washington's stout top 10 defense from a year ago into one of the league's worst in only a year, then I can't help you.

[Dean]

We had arguably one of the best secondary's in the NFL, that was built for the sole purpose of beating the Indianapolis Colts, only to get utterly blown out of the playoffs by them.......2 years in a row.

LMAO at Mike "rebuilding" the defense. Shanahan didn't have a clue how to rebuild the defense. That's the entire point. If you can't see that this year, when he turned Washington's stout top 10 defense from a year ago into one of the league's worst in only a year, then I can't help you.

Long before this post I was relatively sure that you couldn't help me. :D

[Superchop 7]

Called that one too.....Haslett ? Puhleeze....

[silkamilkamonico]

Long before this post I was relatively sure that you couldn't help me. :D

I figured. History says Shanahan's inability to field a defense should be common knowledge about now. That way we don't have to pretend he actually would have done it in Denver.

[BroncoAV06]

Its nice being positive and all but I always loved how people tried write paragraphs on how Denver is so close and will turn it around next year with a good offseason. If only it was that easy.

Here's looking at you top 5 dradt pick.
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[BroncoStud]

Hell even during the first Super Bowl win against Green Bay teams had gashed the Denver defense for like an average of 5.2 YPC or something...

The early teams were SO talented that they could overcome horrible defensive philosoply, the later teams were not. Once Elway, TD, Easy Ed, Rod, and Shannon left, the Broncos had to rely on the great offensive system and a patchwork defense.

Sometimes it would hold it's own, most of the time not. The 2008 and 2010 Denver defenses are absolute disgraces.

[DenBronx]

The article is right and wrong.

He's right that now we are in shambles and at an alltime low. But he's wrong when he says it started in 06'. In 06' is when the team decided it was going to start rebuilding and start getting young players in to create a dynasty again. Getting Cutler, Marshall, Hillis, Royal, etc was the start of rebuilding. But because Shanny had waited so long to do it that way Bowlen fired him. Then, when McD came in he stripped it all down setting the franchise farther back than it was or needed to be. Had he had the patience to start building up the defense like it should of been and had he had the social skill to deal with players and cordinators alike he would of already had this franchise back on course. Now, whoever comes in is going to have to work on all of it again to right the ship.


could have been a playoff team by now with that group and not a bottom feeder.

[Canmore]

could have been a playoff team by now with that group and not a bottom feeder.

I think you are right, but we will never know and who knows how long it is going to take to climb out of this hole McDaniels dug.

[Superchop 7]

Broncos admit breathing air is 76% nitrogen.

[Day1BroncoFan]

We will find out during the off season what is going to happen. If we are winning next year all will be good, if not then back to the drawing board again.

I hope it gets on the right track this year.

[Lonestar]

The article is right and wrong.

He's right that now we are in shambles and at an alltime low. But he's wrong when he says it started in 06'. In 06' is when the team decided it was going to start rebuilding and start getting young players in to create a dynasty again. Getting Cutler, Marshall, Hillis, Royal, etc was the start of rebuilding. But because Shanny had waited so long to do it that way Bowlen fired him. Then, when McD came in he stripped it all down setting the franchise farther back than it was or needed to be. Had he had the patience to start building up the defense like it should of been and had he had the social skill to deal with players and cordinators alike he would of already had this franchise back on course. Now, whoever comes in is going to have to work on all of it again to right the ship.

I take exception to your thinking. Other than losing jay and replacing hamilton mid stream the offense was the same as 08.

IIRC Josh took a top DE in the draft who converted to olb in the 3-4 Ayers seems to be a very bright spot. He also drafted to Renew an aging secondary jury still out o safeties.

As for losing bm,ts "the rest" of that talent bm had a record year but was a diva doing it and wanted a huge contract even with a Goodell 8 week suspension hanging over his head with his next police report. As for ts he can't/wouldn't block at LOS. Hillis no one knows for sure he would not have been in the plans in 10 had quinn not have been made available.

He made the same "shoring up" moves for the DLINE that mike had before to buy time in developing young talent already on the team. Baker was one of the last cuts and thomas seems to becoming a force on the Dline. So I'm not all that sure had Doom played and ayers/dawkins/goodman had not missed 5 or so games each I tend to believe that this would have been a different turn out this year.

So to sum it up.
Josh did not gut this team in 09 except for the rotten to the core defense he inheirted.

I believe it is debateable that jay had as much if not more to do with his departure as Josh did.

I believe everyone agrees that we could not have resigned Doom, jay, bm, kuper, clady,Champ and ts and remotely stayed under the cap. So one or more would have lost anyway. Does anyone have valid objections to that premise?

I know that everyone was pissed about how this year turned out.

Some have been since/because mikey was fired.

Some because Josh instead of spags.

Some because he came from hated NE.

Some because he scrapped the zbs.

Some because of jay
Bm
Ts
Hillis
He smacked his lips in pressers.
He is short
Yada yada yada.
I liked his fiery style. Sorry to see him gone. But understand why Pat did it.
Time to move on for all of us.
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