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View Full Version : This is what happens when you hitch your wagon to Kyle Orton



vandammage13
12-07-2010, 11:03 AM
McD's biggest failing was sticking with Kyle Orton and his hollow stats. McD hitched his wagon on the noodle arm of Orton and it cost him his job. That's on McD.

We got rid of one of the problems, now get rid of the other-Orton. I'm tired of seeing him stink it up when we are still in close games and only start moving the ball when we are down 2+ scores and the opposing defense starts playing prevent.

I'm not saying Tebow is a sure thing, but we know for sure that Kyle isn't the answer. Put the rookie in and lets turn the page already on this dark segment of Bronco History led by the right arm of Kyle Orton.

BeefStew25
12-07-2010, 11:05 AM
Sit Tebow for a couple years. Read: Rivers, Phillip and Rodgers, Aaron.

BroncoNut
12-07-2010, 11:05 AM
yeah, I'm all for it at this point. thanks for thinking out of the box

slim
12-07-2010, 11:07 AM
Greatness cannot be rushed.

BroncoWave
12-07-2010, 11:08 AM
Sit Tebow for a couple years. Read: Rivers, Phillip and Rodgers, Aaron.

Wow, that's 6% of the starting QBs in the NFL. You have me convinced!

tomjonesrocks
12-07-2010, 11:08 AM
I don't mind Orton personally, but I hope we won't see him as QB of the Broncos again.

Denver needs picks to make up for those that were pissed away and misspent. Orton must be worth a 3rd to someone. Unsure if anyone wants his contract, though.

BeefStew25
12-07-2010, 11:09 AM
Wow, that's 6% of the QBs in the NFL. You have me convinced!

Make a list of every single QB that played too soon. Endless, Pube, endless.

BroncoNut
12-07-2010, 11:12 AM
Wow, that's 6% of the starting QBs in the NFL. You have me convinced!

He's got a reall good point there actually Bailey the Best. those are just a couple examples

Dirk
12-07-2010, 11:12 AM
Kyle has played pretty damn good for the Broncos.

But with that said, I say give Tebow the rest of the year to get some game speed experience. The rest of the year should be used to evaluate and prepare for next year.

vandammage13
12-07-2010, 11:14 AM
Sit Tebow for a couple years. Read: Rivers, Phillip and Rodgers, Aaron.

Start Tebow now. Read: Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco, Ben Roethlisberger, Josh Freeman, Sam Bradford, and Mark Sanchez. All QBs started right away and all are winning.

BroncoWave
12-07-2010, 11:14 AM
So what? John Elway, Peyton Manning, and Dan Marino all started right away. Worked out pretty well for them.

slim
12-07-2010, 11:15 AM
Oh good, another discussion about whether a QB should sit or start.

We haven't had one of those in at least 2 days.

slim
12-07-2010, 11:17 AM
Tim Couch.

Ravage!!!
12-07-2010, 11:17 AM
No..

THIS is what happens when you draft Tim Tebow. This is what happens when you spend EXTREMELY valuable picks for a guy that can't throw. This is what happens when you waste THREE picks on a guy that can't see the field, and isn't even close to being there.

Tim Tebow was the BIGGEST and DUMBEST mistake made by the last regime.

BeefStew25
12-07-2010, 11:18 AM
So what? John Elway, Peyton Manning, and Dan Marino all started right away. Worked out pretty well for them.

Probably some bad examples Pube.

BeefStew25
12-07-2010, 11:18 AM
Tim Couch.

David Carr.

TXBRONC
12-07-2010, 11:19 AM
Greatness cannot be rushed.

nor can it be hindered. :nod:

As the great Broncos Forum philosopher Master Socrate Plato Shake once said:

Release the Tebow!

vandammage13
12-07-2010, 11:20 AM
Kyle has played pretty damn good for the Broncos....

I strongly disagree. If you just look at his stats, yeah he looks like he's having a good year. If you actually watch the games it is easy to see that (with the exception of a couple of games) he is routinely sub-par until the game is so far out of reach that the opposing D starts playing soft on defense and then Orton starts putting up his numbers (reference the Rams game). When the game is close, Orton is not even average, he's bad.

Ravage!!!
12-07-2010, 11:21 AM
So what? John Elway, Peyton Manning, and Dan Marino all started right away. Worked out pretty well for them.

Sanchez, Matt Ryan, Rothlesburger, Drew Brees, Matt Stafford, Bradford, Joe Flacco

BroncoWave
12-07-2010, 11:21 AM
David Carr.

Jim Druckenmiller

BroncoWave
12-07-2010, 11:23 AM
Sanchez, Matt Ryan, Rothlesburger, Drew Brees, Matt Stafford, Bradford, Joe Flacco

Are you trying to prove my point or refute it?

Krugan
12-07-2010, 11:23 AM
There are alot of ifs ands and whys for those stats.

regardless of empty or not, they are big numbers, and he still had to make the passes to get there.

Kinda like the whole steroid thing in baseball, you still ahve to be able to hit the ball. Big shots or not, there is a talent to be able to make contact.

Not saying im a huge Orton fan, but this TEAM is a mess, not just the QB.

LordTrychon
12-07-2010, 11:24 AM
So what? John Elway, Peyton Manning, and Dan Marino all started right away. Worked out pretty well for them.

Tom Brady, Phillip Rivers, and Aaron Rodgers did not. That's arguably 3 out of the top 5 in the game NOW.

If you want to go with legends though, Montana, Young, Favre all did not start right away.

vandammage13
12-07-2010, 11:26 AM
Tom Brady, Phillip Rivers, and Aaron Rodgers did not. That's arguably 3 out of the top 5 in the game NOW.

I think the point is that there is no sure fire way to bring a QB along. There are plenty examples of successes and failures whether a QB starts right away or sits for a while.

I tend to think that just becuase a guy like Aaron Rodgers had success after he sat for a few years doesn't necessarily mean he couldn't have come in right away and had success.

slim
12-07-2010, 11:26 AM
Tom Brady, Phillip Rivers, and Aaron Rodgers did not. That's arguably 3 out of the top 5 in the game NOW.

If you want to go with legends though, Montana, Young, Favre all did not start right away.

Hey guys, maybe we should take this on a case-by-case basis.

Like maybe it depends on the player?

BroncoWave
12-07-2010, 11:28 AM
Hey guys, maybe we should take this on a case-by-case basis.

Like maybe it depends on the player?

Or maybe a good player is going to be a good player regardless of when he starts.

Juriga72
12-07-2010, 11:29 AM
How do Carr and Couch compare to Tebow?

BOTH #1 overall picks for brand new teams.

Tebow- Has 2x Pro bowl lt, and a O-line that can protect a statue qb for 5-7 seconds as a deep route plays out....

Carr/Couch- WR's that sucked, AND no running game

Tebow- Wr's that can catch balls thrown into the ground, and a rb who seems to be running better.

slim
12-07-2010, 11:30 AM
Or maybe a good player is going to be a good player regardless of when he starts.

Exactly.

Ravage!!!
12-07-2010, 11:31 AM
Are you trying to prove my point or refute it?

Prove it, I agree with you. Those are the QBs that are playing righ tnow that were starting from their rookie year, and succeeding. I think its absurd to say that sitting the QB is the best solution.

That part we'll agree on.

But what I know we'll disagree on, is that I don't think Tebow will ever be a good NFL QB. I'm all in favor of putting him in as starter for the rest of this year, but I personally believe there is a reason we haven't seen more, and I believe its because Tebow isn't even close.

Ravage!!!
12-07-2010, 11:33 AM
Tom Brady, Phillip Rivers, and Aaron Rodgers did not. That's arguably 3 out of the top 5 in the game NOW.

If you want to go with legends though, Montana, Young, Favre all did not start right away.

But each and EVERY one of them said that their most experience, and most learning, came from actually starting and not sitting.

So how can you say that these guys wouldn't have been just as successful had they started their rookie seasons?

vandammage13
12-07-2010, 11:34 AM
Hey guys, maybe we should take this on a case-by-case basis.

Like maybe it depends on the player?

This is a moot point for us to debate, because its not relevant to Tebow. The season is 3/4 of the way over, so he's not starting right away. If he plays the rest of the year, he doesn't have the pressures of having playoff expectations because we are already well out of contention. All he has to do is go out there and play, and its not going to make a difference if we win or lose...All he will have to focus on is getting experience and getting better. A great situation to learn in IMO.

Juriga72
12-07-2010, 11:35 AM
This is a moot point for us to debate, because its not relevant to Tebow. The season is 3/4 of the way over, so he's not starting right away. If he plays the rest of the year, he doesn't have the pressures of having playoff expectations because we are already well out of contention. All he has to do is go out there and play, and its not going to make a difference if we win or lose...All he will have to focus on is getting experience and getting better. A great situation to learn in IMO.

EVEN Arizona is going to start a "Brand New QB" this week... because "the season is over"..

MadMax
12-07-2010, 11:37 AM
Meh, he didn't hitch his wagon to Orton, he soured his relationship with Jay Cutler and after the trade he had no choice but to be "hitched" to Orton.

HORSEPOWER 56
12-07-2010, 11:40 AM
I love the way that Kyle has personally handled all the BS he's had to deal with the past 2 years. He's a consummate professional and a damned fine human being.

I just don't have the confidence that he can lead this team to victory in close games and really RUN the offense (spoken: make plays when it matters). KO staying as a backup would be a dream come true. KO as the future of the franchise is a bleak, mediocre future if you ask me. Love Kyle the person, not so much the player.

slim
12-07-2010, 11:42 AM
This is a moot point for us to debate, because its not relevant to Tebow. The season is 3/4 of the way over, so he's not starting right away. If he plays the rest of the year, he doesn't have the pressures of having playoff expectations because we are already well out of contention. All he has to do is go out there and play, and its not going to make a difference if we win or lose...All he will have to focus on is getting experience and getting better. A great situation to learn in IMO.

Yes, that is what I am saying.

The whole argument is pointless.

vandammage13
12-07-2010, 11:43 AM
I love the way that Kyle has personally handled all the BS he's had to deal with the past 2 years. He's a consummate professional and a damned fine human being.

I just don't have the confidence that he can lead this team to victory in close games and really RUN the offense (spoken: make plays when it matters). KO staying as a backup would be a dream come true. KO as the future of the franchise is a bleak, mediocre futre if you ask me. Love Kyle the person, not so much the player.

I agree. KO is the type of guy you might want to have a beer with, but not the guy you want as the QB of your team if you have any hopes of going to the Super Bowl.

LordTrychon
12-07-2010, 11:44 AM
But each and EVERY one of them said that their most experience, and most learning, came from actually starting and not sitting.

So how can you say that these guys wouldn't have been just as successful had they started their rookie seasons?

How can you say that they would have?

How is your argument less speculative than mine?

It's not.

How can you argue that David Carr wouldn't have benefited from NOT sitting a year? Perhaps Rodgers becomes just like all the other flops if he's not given the time on the bench. I don't know, you don't know... HE doesn't know.

I'm not on either side of this particular one... I think now's a good time to throw Tebow out there and see what we have. 4 games left in the season, w/l doesn't matter... I'm ok with it.

I just think it's a ridiculous argument.

'You're just speculating! How do you know they wouldn't be better off my way?!'

'What you said, only directed back at you from my perspective!'

BroncoStud
12-07-2010, 11:45 AM
Sit Tebow for a couple years. Read: Rivers, Phillip and Rodgers, Aaron.

The Chargers had a guy named DREW BREES already playing when they drafted Rivers...

The Packers had a guy named BRETT FAVRE already playing when they drafted Aaron Rodgers...

We have a guy named KYLE ORTON playing... BIG, BIG difference.

Start Tebow and see if we do or don't need to draft a QB this offseason.

MadMax
12-07-2010, 11:49 AM
Meh, he didn't hitch his wagon to Orton, he soured his relationship with Jay Cutler and after the trade he had no choice but to be "hitched" to Orton.

Ok (Socal) I realize after reading that again it sounds a little retarded. The only point I was trying to make is that in hindsight the mistake McD made was running off Jay Cutler, not choosing Kyle Orton. Kyle Orton was and remains the best choice available at QB, but that's not because KO is so good, it's because teams don't usually let go of a good QB.

frauschieze
12-07-2010, 11:51 AM
Hey guys, maybe we should take this on a case-by-case basis.

Like maybe it depends on the player?

Quit being so damn reasonable. Message boards are for emotional overreactions. And trolls.

vandammage13
12-07-2010, 11:51 AM
The Chargers had a guy named DREW BREES already playing when they drafted Rivers...

The Packers had a guy named BRETT FAVRE already playing when they drafted Aaron Rodgers...

We have a guy named KYLE ORTON playing... BIG, BIG difference.

Start Tebow and see if we do or don't need to draft a QB this offseason.

I know...I don't understand how people don't see it. I think most are coming around though and are no longer being blinded by Orton's fantasy numbers. He's just not that good, and I think more and more people are finally beginning to see it.

Ravage!!!
12-07-2010, 11:52 AM
How can you say that they would have?

How is your argument less speculative than mine?

It's not.

How can you argue that David Carr wouldn't have benefited from NOT sitting a year? Perhaps Rodgers becomes just like all the other flops if he's not given the time on the bench. I don't know, you don't know... HE doesn't know.

I'm not on either side of this particular one... I think now's a good time to throw Tebow out there and see what we have. 4 games left in the season, w/l doesn't matter... I'm ok with it.

I just think it's a ridiculous argument.

'You're just speculating! How do you know they wouldn't be better off my way?!'

'What you said, only directed back at you from my perspective!'

Of course its speculative. But we can see QBs that have started, and will never know any different about the ones that sat without speculating.

However, we've seen a LOT of rookies succeed when starting as rookies, and that goes from no matter what quality of team they were drafted too.

If you think that these guys you mentioned are lesser QBs coming out of college, and needed an extra year over the Matt Ryan's, Staffords, and Bradfords.. fine. I don't. I don't think these guys GAINED more by sitting than they do by playing, and THAT statement is based on what THEY SAY. THey have ALLLLL said that they learned a LOT more from playing, than they did sitting.

I just don't think the guys you listed are lesser QBs, and thus "needed" to sit. I think they would have succeeded whether they sat or played, because of the players they are.

I think the "sitting and learning" is something someone says to justify a guy sitting.

SOCALORADO.
12-07-2010, 12:00 PM
Ok (Socal) I realize after reading that again it sounds a little retarded. The only point I was trying to make is that in hindsight the mistake McD made was running off Jay Cutler, not choosing Kyle Orton. Kyle Orton was and remains the best choice available at QB, but that's not because KO is so good, it's because teams don't usually let go of a good QB.

So your sayin,
By running off Cutler he was forcing himself to hitch his wagon to Orton, even though he really didnt see it that way cause Josh McDaniels only sees things the way he wants to see them in his fantasy world. And then he pretends that world is reality.....even though everyone who is in reality has already realized that he is in a nintendo fantasy world and cant deal with his mistakes and bad choices because he has an inferiorty complex which blinds him from reality where i live.
Got it.

JaxBroncoGirl
12-07-2010, 12:01 PM
No..

THIS is what happens when you draft Tim Tebow. This is what happens when you spend EXTREMELY valuable picks for a guy that can't throw. This is what happens when you waste THREE picks on a guy that can't see the field, and isn't even close to being there.

Tim Tebow was the BIGGEST and DUMBEST mistake made by the last regime.

Dearest Ravage
You are still a hater as you have yet to see him play. Give him the chance. Tebow will surprise you and at least keep the play going. I hope one day you will wake up. You will be surprised when you get Tebowed!

Sincerely,
Gator Girl Go Broncos!:beer:

TXBRONC
12-07-2010, 12:01 PM
I love the way that Kyle has personally handled all the BS he's had to deal with the past 2 years. He's a consummate professional and a damned fine human being.

I just don't have the confidence that he can lead this team to victory in close games and really RUN the offense (spoken: make plays when it matters). KO staying as a backup would be a dream come true. KO as the future of the franchise is a bleak, mediocre future if you ask me. Love Kyle the person, not so much the player.

Five of the twelve games we played so far this season we've either had the ball for the last meaningful possession or close and we didn't win even one of them.

Agreed Kyle has handled himself quite well with everything that has surrounded him. That being said he's still not a long term solution at quarterback.

TXBRONC
12-07-2010, 12:03 PM
Dearest Ravage
You are still a hater as you have yet to see him play. Give him the chance. Tebow will surprise you and at least keep the play going. I hope one day you will wake up. You will be surprised when you get Tebowed!

Sincerely,
Gator Girl Go Broncos!:beer:

Ravage isn't the top of thread Jax.

Italianmobstr7
12-07-2010, 12:05 PM
I love the way that Kyle has personally handled all the BS he's had to deal with the past 2 years. He's a consummate professional and a damned fine human being.

I just don't have the confidence that he can lead this team to victory in close games and really RUN the offense (spoken: make plays when it matters). KO staying as a backup would be a dream come true. KO as the future of the franchise is a bleak, mediocre future if you ask me. Love Kyle the person, not so much the player.

Could not agree more.

Jagsbch
12-07-2010, 12:11 PM
McD's biggest failing was sticking with Kyle Orton and his hollow stats. McD hitched his wagon on the noodle arm of Orton and it cost him his job. That's on McD...:salute:

Rex
12-07-2010, 12:11 PM
Could not agree more.

Go tweet some trash and call him names Shorty

LordTrychon
12-07-2010, 12:13 PM
Of course its speculative. But we can see QBs that have started, and will never know any different about the ones that sat without speculating.

However, we've seen a LOT of rookies succeed when starting as rookies, and that goes from no matter what quality of team they were drafted too.

If you think that these guys you mentioned are lesser QBs coming out of college, and needed an extra year over the Matt Ryan's, Staffords, and Bradfords.. fine. I don't. I don't think these guys GAINED more by sitting than they do by playing, and THAT statement is based on what THEY SAY. THey have ALLLLL said that they learned a LOT more from playing, than they did sitting.

I just don't think the guys you listed are lesser QBs, and thus "needed" to sit. I think they would have succeeded whether they sat or played, because of the players they are.

I think the "sitting and learning" is something someone says to justify a guy sitting.

And I see what you are saying. I was simply providing the other argument besides the number of quarterbacks who were supposed to be good coming out of college and failed horribly that started early. Perhaps they could have benefited from time sitting. Still speculation, and we don't know.

Saying that 'John Elway started right away and look what he did'... well... I simply don't expect every quarterback to be John Elway.

Again... I'm ok with starting Tebow now. I think he's had enough time to sit and learn if he needed it. He's had the better part of the season. Granted, in the middle of an interim coach coming in... it's hard to say what that's like. It'll be interesting to see what the coaches do from here on out.

JaxBroncoGirl
12-07-2010, 12:16 PM
Ravage isn't the top of thread Jax.

Sorry, I actually thought I was responding to Ravage's post in this thread. Well at least you know where I stand.

Ravage!!!
12-07-2010, 12:16 PM
And I see what you are saying. I was simply providing the other argument besides the number of quarterbacks who were supposed to be good coming out of college and failed horribly that started early. Perhaps they could have benefited from time sitting. Still speculation, and we don't know.

Saying that 'John Elway started right away and look what he did'... well... I simply don't expect every quarterback to be John Elway.

Again... I'm ok with starting Tebow now. I think he's had enough time to sit and learn if he needed it. He's had the better part of the season. Granted, in the middle of an interim coach coming in... it's hard to say what that's like. It'll be interesting to see what the coaches do from here on out.

I agree with everything you've said.

I think its time we start Tebow and see what he has. I HOPE he turns out to be a lot better than I expect him to be, because we TRULY need him to be. We've spent so much on him, and this team is in dire need. But I just don't think he's going to wow us. But,t lets finally just let the kid get some experience, even if its FAILING experience. We we need to know if we should make arrangements now, to go after Andrew Luck!! (Please please please find a way to get Andrew lUck! :lol:)

jhildebrand
12-07-2010, 12:20 PM
If there is a chance you want to trade Tebow because a new GM or coach doesn't want to tie their hitch to him, then you don't play him. Let the league speculate based on what he has done thus far. If you play him and he tanks, you are stuck with him and his contract.

Ravage!!!
12-07-2010, 12:24 PM
Dearest Ravage
You are still a hater as you have yet to see him play. Give him the chance. Tebow will surprise you and at least keep the play going. I hope one day you will wake up. You will be surprised when you get Tebowed!

Sincerely,
Gator Girl Go Broncos!:beer:

I've seen from him enough to continue the opinion I've had out of college. I didn't believe he was worth the pick THEN, and I still don't. Now, I TRULY truly hope he's better than I expect him to be, but he needs to be a LOT better to justify such a stupid draft pick.

Understand. I don't "hate" Tebow. I don't have a singe thing against the guy. I know that our team needed much more than a QB that 90% of the NFL scouts said would never be a star in the NFL. We needed a LOT for this team, and we used PRIME picks! Teams try to move out of the first round, but EVERY team tries to get as many 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round draft choices...and we used on of EACH (and the first we acquired) to take this ONE player. SO he needs to EXCEED moreso than even a Peyton Manning to justify THAT kind of expense.

So if he comes out and actually is able to play at even a decent level, early on when coming in this year, then I will adjust my beliefs. Until then, I'm going to be skeptical. I jsut don't believe Tebow is going to be a good NFL QB.

Ravage!!!
12-07-2010, 12:25 PM
If there is a chance you want to trade Tebow because a new GM or coach doesn't want to tie their hitch to him, then you don't play him. Let the league speculate based on what he has done thus far. If you play him and he tanks, you are stuck with him and his contract.

I thought of this as well. At the same time, we will NEVER get in return what we spent for him.

JaxBroncoGirl
12-07-2010, 12:30 PM
I've seen from him enough to continue the opinion I've had out of college. I didn't believe he was worth the pick THEN, and I still don't. Now, I TRULY truly hope he's better than I expect him to be, but he needs to be a LOT better to justify such a stupid draft pick.

Understand. I don't "hate" Tebow. I don't have a singe thing against the guy. I know that our team needed much more than a QB that 90% of the NFL scouts said would never be a star in the NFL. We needed a LOT for this team, and we used PRIME picks! Teams try to move out of the first round, but EVERY team tries to get as many 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round draft choices...and we used on of EACH (and the first we acquired) to take this ONE player. SO he needs to EXCEED moreso than even a Peyton Manning to justify THAT kind of expense.

So if he comes out and actually is able to play at even a decent level, early on when coming in this year, then I will adjust my beliefs. Until then, I'm going to be skeptical. I jsut don't believe Tebow is going to be a good NFL QB.

Actually I do not think any QB at this rate is going to do very well. McD made some questionable moves that tore this team down. We need more than just good playing by Orton or Tebow. So, I am ok with the last 4 games being practice type play and allow Tebow time to play good, bad or indifferent.

jhildebrand
12-07-2010, 12:30 PM
I understand that a lot of people believe in the power of Tim Tebow. I am willing to keep an open mind on the guy. That isn't to say I don't have my reservations.

Alex Smith is an Urban Meyer QB. Smith was far more NFL ready as evidenced by being drafted #1 in this league. I haven't seen him do a thing to justify his pick. Chris Leak was more NFL ready and he didn't do anything with the little shot he was given.

My fear is Urban Meyer and his QB's coming to this league are the next Tedford's. Cam Newton will be a pretty good NFL QB. But he got away from FL and Meyer so who knows.

At this point this team has so much tied up in Tebow I would rather start him the rest of these games and see how he does. If he can keep us competitive i.e. Cutler in his start against SD the year he took over, I might be willing to remain open enough to see more.

The problem is we have a world class LT who will need to be paid soon and playing Tebow changes some of that.

vandammage13
12-07-2010, 12:44 PM
Actually I do not think any QB at this rate is going to do very well. McD made some questionable moves that tore this team down. We need more than just good playing by Orton or Tebow. So, I am ok with the last 4 games being practice type play and allow Tebow time to play good, bad or indifferent.

You are right by saying that this team has more holes than just QB. However, I believe that Tebow has the capability of converting many of these 3rd downs and keeping the drives alive that Orton could not.

I think Tebow just brings something else to the table that Orton lacks, and that's beyond his mobility. Where you would constantly see Orton taking sacks and throwing passes into the dirt on third down, I really think Tebow would just find a way to make it happen. Keeping drives alive on 3rd down is often the difference between winning and losing.

Converting 3rd downs is probably the most important thing you can do as a team other than scoring points and winning the turnover battle, and I'm not saying Tebow would convert at an astronomical rate, but I really think he would convert more than Orton has. 2 or three converted third downs last Sunday and there may have been a different outcome (and McD may have survived for 1 more week.)

Jon_Gruden 4 HC
12-07-2010, 12:45 PM
I think Orton has to go in the off-season. Yes he has had a good year with the Broncos but he is not the long term answer for us at QB. We must start building for the future and we already have a young starting QB in Tebow to play. Lets move on and thank Orton for keeping the seat warm..

Ravage!!!
12-07-2010, 12:46 PM
I don't think Cam Newton will be a good NFL QB in the long run. He won't be able to simply "tuck it and run" in the NFL when things break down like he does in college.

vandammage13
12-07-2010, 12:50 PM
I think Orton has to go in the off-season. Yes he has had a good year with the Broncos but he is not the long term answer for us at QB. We must start building for the future and we already have a young starting QB in Tebow to play. Lets move on and thank Orton for keeping the seat warm..

I'm not thanking Orton for anything. Our 5-18 record is almost as much on him as McD IMO....but more on McD especially since he's the one who brought him in.

On second thought, I guess you can't fault Orton for being what he is. McD is the one who picked him up.

Juriga72
12-07-2010, 01:16 PM
Well.... Since they do not have a "Most wins by a starting defensive lineman", I'd have to say that each and every loss is on Kyle.

When he came here it was "He just wins"... NOW its....."He needs a defense, a running game, better special teams.... and he'd be a Pro Bowl qb"

vandammage13
12-07-2010, 01:19 PM
Well.... Since they do not have a "Most wins by a starting defensive lineman", I'd have to say that each and every loss is on Kyle.

When he came here it was "He just wins"... NOW its....."He needs a defense, a running game, better special teams.... and he'd be a Pro Bowl qb"

Exactly...once he lost the "He just wins" moniker, what did he have left? I never really knew how he got that label in the first place considering he's never played in a playoff game.

LordTrychon
12-07-2010, 01:21 PM
Orton to start this weekend per the press conference.

Juriga72
12-07-2010, 01:23 PM
I was talking wiht my neighbor, and even he (who is HUGE bolts fan) said it best... "Orton only wins when they keep the other team under 20 only". I looked it up and 9 of his wins were "when they held the other team to 20 or less points"....

Wasn't THAT the knock on Cutler? "He can only win when they hold the other team to a few points".

jhildebrand
12-07-2010, 01:41 PM
I don't think Cam Newton will be a good NFL QB in the long run. He won't be able to simply "tuck it and run" in the NFL when things break down like he does in college.

Granted but he is big and strong a la Big Ben. The difference is Newton can make all the throws.

Juriga72
12-07-2010, 02:04 PM
Granted but he is big and strong a la Big Ben. The difference is Newton can make all the throws.

He'll have to take a pay cut to play in the NFL....

jhildebrand
12-07-2010, 02:07 PM
He'll have to take a pay cut to play in the NFL....

How much remains to be seen :D

Juriga72
12-07-2010, 02:17 PM
How much remains to be seen :D

Heck, He might not even BE the highest paid kid in College this year. That kid who went to Tennessee last year, HIS parents seemed to be able to move into quite the very nice house after HE signed.